Scary Body Language & Telling on Yourself - Episode 164
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 ก.ย. 2024
- Links to things mentioned:
Our Patreon: / baremarriage
The study on Who Cheats More: ifstudies.org/...
The Dennis Prager Facebook Video: / 868111834352628
The Great Sex Rescue: baremarriage.c...
The podcast with Alyssa Wakefield baremarriage.c...
The podcast with Natalie Hoffman baremarriage.c...
Thank you so much for bringing awareness to this!! Like you said, there's no way to know for sure what's going on, but red flags like these are so important to be aware of.
Also, concern for Paul and Morgan has been a topic ever since they started creating videos, however it's only been amongst atheist creators, but the concern was valid. Some have even personally reached out to Morgan to help her. She simply responded with a video of her alone in a car saying she was safe ..which raises even more questions. However, for a Christian author and creator like you to acknowledge and bring awareness to this is a huge step in the right direction!! Thank you so much.
Something has always seemed off about their relationship. In their wedding video, Morgan literally throws up at the alter in the middle of the ceremony. Paul has said several things about physical boundaries in relationships that can be questionable. And the fact that they responded to this with a 40 min video defending themselves means they have a lot to grow through. Praying for them.
I just pray that she knows that there are people she can reach out to if she ever feels unsafe. So sad!
@@SheilaWrayGregoire horribly heartbreaking! However, so thankful for all you do in bringing awareness to this. You are a much needed voice in our Christian community where so many are not bold enough to speak up about this like you!! Thank you for being an example of fearlessness, boldness, and courage in fighting for God's design. 💕💕
@@SheilaWrayGregoire Praying for you, your family, and your ministry that God may continue to bless give you the words, wisdom, strength, and courage to help others know how true design for marriage. 💕💕💕
The way Paul's mouth was twitching was terrifying. Also, love how he is so mad that Morgan ignored HIS emotions but seems totally fine with ignoring hers.
Appreciate this critique on Paul and Morgan. As a counselor and Christian, I was very disturbed by much of their advice on sex and marriage.
I love them and they're awesome.
@@lucamackenzie9229 Not saying everything they say is wrong. They seem like genuine people. It's one thing to like what you hear from someone and then it's another thing to say if what they are saying it actually sound advice. Acting like having sex every other day is a realistic goal to keep up throughout all of marriage (saying, don't think it's bad if you are not doing it every day - well duh Morgan, everyday is not average or normal). Great for a couple that both equally are on board with every other day. The issue, the episode they said that as an answer to a question for how often is "normal" for couples, they gave no clarification or discussed any exceptions or anything. No research, no insights beyond what they do so they think that's normal and giving advice to new couples who may be facing challenges or just different drives and could be really causing some harm to couples because of their comments. Paul is so wrong also to think a spouse should just "humble themselves" during a fight to have sex just because that is what makes the other person feel less anxious and feel better. He clearly has connected sex to his emotional health way to much. That's just one example. But again, as a Christian and a counselor with a much broader view on life and people's challenges, I think they have good intentions but they are speaking on things they have very little true wisdom on. It could be damaging.
Did he just say "humble yourself...and have sex anyway" 🤔 😳 maybe the guys should humble themselves and leave the wives alone till the situation has been sorted out with maturity.
Right? Maybe HE should tend to HER needs before he asks her to be that vulnerable. Humble yourself, Paul.
Maybe people should step off and realize this is a young couple who are just starting out and you arent their Pastor. While I agree with you in principle they are just talking about their life as a married couple
EXACTLY!!! I mean I think that whole thing can be settled with a few questions:
1st ask the guy: how many times have you had to “humble” yourself, had sex but not really wanted it?
Answer: (um well......)
2nd question ask the woman: how many times have you had to “humble”yourself, had sex but didn’t really want it?
Answer: well there was that time......
I digress.
@@wjameswright They're not just talking about their life. They are giving advice and setting themselves up as experts. And they're not newlyweds. They've been married a few years. Not long enough to be giving advice, but long enough to have a lot of things sorted out.
Also the whipped cream, paired with his disregard towards her emotions when it comes to sex, wanting sex to the point of aggression, and his previous comments of disapproval towards Morgan having premarital sex...seems like they could be signs of some sort of sexual addiction. The whipped cream on a honeymoon doesn't seem like it could've come from anywhere good and I fear what he has been influenced by to have such a mindset and attitude towards his wife. Scariest part of all is their son was just born...
Thank you for covering this! I watched that episode of P&M and knew so much of it was off but didn't quite know how to process it.
Ie. It was clear in Paul's mouth movements that he was So mad and shocked by Morgan's 'confession' and was trying SO hard to maintain composure. I could see Morgan was deflecting with her laughing and breaking eye contact (which he ONLY made while showing her how displeased he was with her; avoiding it when she was expressing her feelings). However, having you talk through it helps me see that it wasn't just my own truma magnifying things, but there really was huge red flags!
What isn't always recognised it's that in abusive situations, the victim will often still express things that will displease the abuser; not because they aren't afraid of the response( punishment) but because they really do want to connect and be honest. However, the anxiety in doing so (because of past experiences proving it dangerous to do so) is still present. Eg. Morgan shares her thoughts and feelings, not because she necessarily feels safe to do so, but because she has a good desire to be known. The scary thing is that she is presenting that as a joke, nothing serious, nothing to feel rejected over if her turns her down... which he does oh so horrifically by making it all about HIS entitlement being 'taken' from him. Who cares if he'd be prostituting his own wife, she must be avaliable because he pre-booked her. Feelings and true intimacy don't matter when your version of intimacy is gimme what I'm 'owed'. 🙏🏼
I recently saw their video on post-birth update. I cringed when he praised her for how good she looks so soon after having a baby. Then her next comment was how much weight she needs to loose to get back to pre-pregnancy. It Might sound like praise but all I saw was covert pressure to be a trophy wife... not to mention the total disregard for the fact that a new mum's job (Morgan and subscribers alike) is NOT to look like they never even had a baby!!
Are you married? If so record a video of you and him talking about intimacy… let’s see both of your reactions. 🍿
Seriously everyone woman who says their husbands haven’t asked for something sexual “ASKED” and made you feel uncomfortable is definitely not being truthful, the only difference is they made a VIDEO!
“Oh my thank you for covering this topic- MY godly husband would neverrrrrr”….😱
@@cindybeltran992 Except they are not arrogant or prideful to be giving prescriptive advice to others in public under the guide of “Christianity”. Paul and Morgan however don’t have that humility.
Really disgusting, what Prager said. I literally can't believe it. I do thank God for a husband who doesn't think like this. Lord have mercy!
You pray for a husband that doesn't care what the bible wants of him and you? Oh.. okay.
Seeing the way Paul reacted, the seemingly barely veiled anger at the fact Morgan knew... was frankly scary. Thank you for speaking up about how wrong it is to treat someone like this.
Hahahahahaha. Everybody with a brain could see that it was playfully meant. 🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️
Thank you for doing what you do, Sheila!!!
Having sex does not repair the harm that a husband has caused his wife. A wife is not a receptacle. What in the world?!
Married to an abuser for 12 years, the child of abusers my whole life. He was terrifying. And she was terrified.
Sheila, I so appreciate you and Rebecca's insight on these issues! I used to watch Paul and Morgan as a teenager and for some reason, never felt peace about their messages and relational dynamics but did not understand why.
also, I LOVE your curls/waves--looks WONDERFUL on you!
I felt the same!!! It just never sat right with me and honestly left me feeling quite icky.
"He's not angry with me for not being able to put up with it. He's angry that I was mistreated for so long." Rebecca... 😭
Wow. So spot on. Women judge a good sex life on if her husband is having a good time and men also judge a good sex life if he's having a good time. It really upsets me that women have been pretty much IGNORED within sex and it's been made to be normal. 😢 This is NOT what God intended.
I now am married to a wonderful, healthy, Godly man and he _always_ sees to me first before himself in bed~ and he loves foreplay, kissing, and even getting riled up and waiting a few days to be together intimately! ❤💞 After 14 years of sexual neglect and coercive abuse, God has restored the years the locusts have eaten!!!!
Thank you for all you do! You’re right, I agree with everything but don’t comment ever haha. I just found this channel yesterday and just listening to you guys my heart heals a little bit more. Thank you so so much. You’re genuinely doing Gods work
Thanx so much for being so open and straight forward in a very respectful way. I thought this very helpful!!
This man is a child. He is purely a child. With a side of manipulative narcissist.
Whoa. What about HIM so brazenly ignoring HER emotions even though he could clearly see how she felt?? Ooooh my goodness.
Ikr?!
Something isn’t right with P & M.
Right. With all of us, and you as well, there is "something nit right". That's why we need Jesus.
Morgan's speech and mannerisms remind me so much of the Duggar girls.
They really do. I very much worry about all of them.
Thank you both so much for this wonderful video. I'm not heavily familiar with Paul and Morgan - the only thing I knew of them was from a response video several years where a friend of mine was critiquing their purity ideas. (She has since left Christianity. I get the feeling that from the way she talked, she may have been often demonized or treated too cynically for being too 'immodest'. She was often very vocal about the church's dubious teachings about sex and relationships, and "Joker smile" Paul didn't seem concerned for his wife's holistic well-being here at all.)
So wait a minute....morgan ignored his emotions??? What about when she was crying??? And didn’t feel connected? I used to follow them years ago but really felt the spirit telling me to silence a lot of the teachings I was hearing in my life. And it changed my life. Thank you for giving a name and voice to soooo many things over the years that just never sat right with me ❤️🤗
I stopped watching them a long time ago too. There was something off about them and I couldn't put my finger on it but I didn't like it so I stopped following them on all social media.
I stopped watching once I saw the video where Paul said something along the lines of not liking a woman that had previously kissed men before and that he wouldn’t feel good about it (it was a video of saving a kiss for marriage). That just screamed possessive to me.
I'm so glad you are addressing Paul and Morgan. I have thought for a while that they have at the very least an unhealthy relationship.
Well. They have not.
@lucamackenzie9229 and you know them intimately enough to speak up for them?
OMG I am a fawner. I was SA by someone recently and that person was very lewd leading up to it and I laughed it off. I didn't know why til now geez.
I’m so sorry for the trauma you’ve gone through. Please know it is not at all your fault and you’re not alone. ❤️
I'm so sorry this happened to you.
Trauma response.
I’m so sorry for the pushback you’ve gotten on this video.
I read the comments and listened and I thought you were very respectful and you did say multiple times that we don’t know for sure if there is abuse but there are some red flags and unhealthy patterns. I’ve never followed them but always felt something was off and wondered if Morgan was okay. I was also concerned that a lot of young people were watching their video and might think the things they say are okay or apply what they say when the teachings are harmful, particularly with purity culture.
I remember when Jaclyn Glenn made a video concerned for Morgan and Morgan responded, I did make a comment on being concerned and it seemed like a lot of people probably commented on there agreeing or disagreeing but I turned off notifications and have never gone back to read the comments.
And you are calling out theirs and others problematic teachings not attacking them as a person. Their platform is open for people to see so people can critique it. I hope Morgan is okay.
Never heard of them, but this is alarming!
They are a really great and inspirational Christian couple. I've been watching them for years and these red flags these people are talking about are exaggerated extremely. It's sad they as supposed Christians would tear down the characters of fellow brothers and sisters in Christ for some video likes.
Y’all are a blessing to me ❤
They are so brave for linking us this video. Shows again, they have nothing to hide.
Love them. I've never seen such a great couple that are so loving and have so much fun.
I feel concern for you that they are the best you’ve seen… 🫤
That says a lot about what you've been taught about women.
@@loosilu I don't need to be "taught" about women. 🤣 Since being a woman myself and watching my mom and many other very feminine women that I adored and still adore to this day, I hopefully become more of what I want to be. A real feminine woman.
And as a woman myself I know men's behavior and I know what good men are and what man I would never ever want in my life. Paul, I wouldn't want - because to me he isn't MASCULINE enough and not enough of a MACHO that I like, and many woman as well, even though they don't admit it.
@@lucamackenzie9229 I wonder if we have different definitions of "feminine" and "masculine"? My mother probably fit into what you consider a feminine woman. She was a miserable person and would NEVER want to emulate her life. There was no abuse, my father is a good man. She was dependent and miserable.
@@loosilu why would be? Just because your mother who was feminine was miserable, it doesn't mean, that all feminine women are miserable.
To me it was the opposite way. The women that are very feminine lead life that I desire. A happy life. The not so feminine women, that are most of the time feminist are "always" (I know one or two that arent) miserable, look unhappy and annoyed all the time.
you have to have a baseline for somebody’s personality before analyzing their body language… You didn’t do research on Morgons regular. She laughs about everything fyi
I think the concern isn’t so much that she’s laughing at everything (which is common for a lot of people, especially when discussing awkward or intimate subjects like sex) as it is that she’s laughing at something that most people would find alarming, and that she herself said was traumatizing at the time (in the case of the honeymoon-whipped cream incident). While it’s entirely possible that she genuinely finds those memories funny in hindsight, the fact that she laughs when there’s visible tension between her and Paul (after her “confession” that she knew he was upset about not having sex)-and yes, even the fact that “laughing at everything” IS her admitted baseline-suggests that she might be using laughter as a coping mechanism, to diffuse conflict or even downplay her discomfort.
Obviously, none of that proves that there’s anything nefarious going on in the relationship, but it does raise concerns when combined with other red flags in their videos.
@@EmmaAndEmmaAndEmma Well said.
That in itself is telling. Laughing at inappropriate times is about something.
I used to laugh all the time...still tend to but knowing where that comes from is disturbing. I faced a lot of verbal abuse and emotional neglect and I had to learn to laugh through my pain, because no one cared about it anyway.
No child is born laughing at pain and discomfort. It is a learned response and usually as a result of trauma
Depends on the circumstance. Some body language is personal baseline-specific. There is also a fair amount of body language that is general to the society or even the species. For example, we all “read” when someone is carrying themselves in a relaxed vs tense manner. We “read” when a smile doesn’t meet (or “crinkle”) someone’s eyes.
It’s definitely a complex issue with both general and personal factors.
As always, wonderful podcast ladies! And you both look amazing.
I so appreciate you both speaking out about this problematic and unhealthy behavior and teachings. I see these things spread and promoted far too much in the Christian community and it makes me very sad and infuriated at times. Paul and Morgan in particular bother me very much because they’re spreading their harmful and inaccurate messages and ideologies so recklessly, and sadly doing so in the name of Christ as well. I’m sad to say I was even roped into believing them for a short time a few years ago before I realized how bad and uneducated their teachings really are.
Thank you for being here and sharing your well researched knowledge and Christ-like love. It is people like you who make me feel comforted when I’ve been gaslit by people like them, and it is people like you who make me want to draw closer to God. I appreciate you very much. I hope to find more well educated Christians like you.
Both these women and Paul and Morgan are pretty off the mark tbh
@@bradleykimmons I highly disagree that Sheila and Rebecca are off the mark. They’re not perfect obviously because no one is, but they’re very on point and are spreading truth and healthy ways to deal with things. Paul and Morgan on the other hand are the farthest thing from Christ-like.
Paul & Morgan are another example why I have been (and still am as a single woman in her early 40s) so nervous about dating most Evangelical men. Honestly, I wish Evangelical Christian leaders understood why non-Christian men are sometimes more appealing than a lot of the men in their pews.
Also, Paul & Morgan have done videos on modesty that at a minimum are douchey and cringe inducing to watch.
This is sad to hear- Stop justifying why you aren’t married because this is a sad excuse and a big lie also. There is a lot of good men that are Christian. SMH- Pray to God to bring you a good husband.
So your blaming other people on TH-cam for the reason why you are single? Makes no sense. Pray for a husband.
@@Emilyredeemed No. She is saying many evangelical men have the same blind areas as Paul. That's a serious problem.
I knew nothing about abuse within the Christian community before I found this channel 😮
I’m surprised they left that in the video 😮 but I’m glad they did, so people could see the red flags. That was scary to watch.
I’m worried for Morgan. Especially, now that she has a baby. That makes it harder to reach out.
I really think your right about people having the mindset of “oh they’re a Christian, so they’re safe!” No, no, no!
Why would they left that out of the video? The are real human beings, stop thinking editing your life is good to make outside people see you “flawless” and “prefect” in Gods eyes! He SEES IT ALL no need to “hide” or “edit”.
Amen
They left it in the video, because they have nothing to hide. 🥰
@@lucamackenzie9229 no, they left it in the video because they believe their behavior is normal. Which is not 🥰
@@Stayyyonit it's not normal to have fun and make funny, pretend angry faces, no, you are so right!! Not in our world nowadays. I always thought I was the only one who still had fun, but then I found out, there is a couple that is married longer than 5 years and still dared to have fun! 😟😮 And they seemed to actually think that this was acceptable! I was sooo shocked! 😲
I think its time for the guillotine!!!
As a woman, my nature is to want a variety of men. I don't like how so many people make this out to be a man thing
Paul and Morgan are children. Absolute babies. Them giving marriage advice is like toddlers giving tax advice
Paul was homeschooled...we don't have the specifics of his story, but if I was to guess, this is inherited from what he saw and was taught growing up, backed by an arsenal of misapplied Scriptures, and as a result, he thinks he is right, he always has the last word, and yes - he has narcissistic tendencies. It's what comes with the territory of this brand of patriarchy. He is young, there is hope - but we need to pray for Morgan's eyes to be opened, so she can get help and know she CAN set good boundaries with him - and God doesn't want her to be abused or controlled...and yes - pray that his eyes will be opened as well, while he is still young. There is hope. He can change. But he first has to be able to separate ACTUAL Biblical marriage and Christianity from this crap he was raised with. For all we know, his parents' marriage is very much like this, maybe several marriages he grew up around, and it's all he's ever known. I'm married to a man who was once in these circles, and I've seen too much of these cases. Praying theirs is a different story...but I do really hate how influential they are becoming...like, can we just STOP passing down these generational lies and curses?! This generation needs better voices.
I also noticed Morgan stroking her hair a lot...another sign of discomfort or nervousness
that's the first thing I noticed too
Yes, most definitely!
yep. Self comforting.
She does that all the time in every video. Nothing to see here
And also putting her hand on his thigh. While usually is a sign of affection, can also be a placating response to diffuse the tension. What’s not said is also a telling. She really laughs when he’s saying, “ Man, it would have meant a lot to me if you had…” is one who is saying the right things and possibly meaning what he’s saying on one level, but his anger about it reveals he would have rejected her back. He’s admitted wanting to go for a drive , so mentally and emotionally he’s abandoned her already. And she’s well aware of it. So of course she’s just gonna wanna to go to sleep. They’re both relying on their coping mechanisms when feeling rejected.
I don't see how this video is helping P&M but ok, we're online, reaction is fair play and I understand you did reach out.
I hear a lot of body language talk - I hear little talking about what P&M actually discuss. And sometimes you pretty much agree with them on the topic.
The aim of the analysis is well meant, the delivery feels entitled, and even sprinkled with caveats.
And of course we can talk about this only because P&M shared their *emotions* and *experiences* in the first place.
Online community is a tricky tech business. Only we can make it more human.
Disclosure: I only watched a few P&M videos and I have my reservations too, even with the kiss.
You ladies are great! I wish I had found you years ago. Sheila, vacation did you great you look amazing.
Thank you!
My ex huaband was just like this guy paul. But he also had this whole conversation either calm and pleading or raging out. This dude is scary.
Thanks for this video!
I used to wach them but I never saw all this at the time until now.
And I tell you, there is nothing to see. 😇
Well, not what this woman is implying. There is love, there is laughter and yes, there is tears, because they are humans not robots.
Regarding Morgan’s laughing, I left a comment on one of their TH-cam videos several months ago pointing out the way that they laugh while reading comments (on live videos) that they disagree with. It comes across very disrespectful, almost like a type of mocking, as they laugh about people that disagree with them. Now that you mention it, I can see how they use laughter to disguise more intense emotions when others disagree with them. That’s interesting! Also, I never received a reply from them regarding this observation.
I think their laughter is trying to deflect addressing people's valid concerns.
I know I never understand they always say I welcome a different perspective or criticism, but then they laugh and mock when people actually do give criticism. Its odd to say the least.
The laughing is honestly one of the reasons that I found their response video unpersuasive. These were grave accusations, and normal behavior would have been to soberly and rationally go through Sheila's comments and explain why they thought she was wrong. Morgan laughing it off and scoffing without much legitimate response to a detailed critique came across as an immature coping mechanism at best.
@@jenem9618 also someone doesn't have to be a body language expert to interpret common body language.
@@openlybookish Yup, sometimes it's just common sense. I wish they would self-reflect on why people seem to constantly be concerned about their relationship dynamics just based on their interactions on TH-cam videos. Most people don't get constant DMs asking whether they need help.
Wow, I’ve been watching P&M for years and I never would’ve caught on to this. I’ve learned a lot through a situation and wish I could talk to you ladies about advice!
And there is nothing wrong with them.
I think Shelia is spot on with Paul and Morgan
The Dennis Prager video is hilarious-even if he did not intend it to be!
I tried watching this couple but it was so weird to me. I couldn't identify it but I felt that her laughing was "silly" and he was trying to play the mature man trying to rein her in. Clearly she does not feel safe, or in the least close to him. Every time she laughs sge turns away from him. Clearly her feelings don't mean much to him
I don't see the link for the course.
That man, Dennis, is so disgusting.
I’m learning so much from you guys.
1 corinthians 7:3-6 ~ “The husband should fulfill his wife’s sexual needs, and the wife should fulfill her husband’s needs. The wife gives authority over her body to her husband, and the husband gives authority over his body to his wife. Do not deprive each other of sexual relations, unless you both agree to refrain from sexual intimacy for a limited time so you can give yourselves more completely to prayer. Afterward, you should come together again so that Satan won’t be able to tempt you because of your lack of self-control. I say this as a concession, not as a command.” ~ Glad we have the Bible to teach us and the Holy Spirit to give us understanding in these situations.
She doesn’t care for scripture. On her Instagram, she changes the scripture to fit her feminist narrative.
As a new mom only 9 months postpartum, I am appalled by your decision to discuss Paul and Morgan’s marriage in that manner while Morgan is still in the first 6 weeks of postpartum and healing from a traumatic birth. If you really were concerned about Morgan you would have been more sensitive with your approach and focused on the advice you disagreed with and not airing your speculations out so blatantly and publicly while she is in such a vulnerable season.
Even if your speculations were true (which you have no way of knowing), your video does more harm than good for Morgan’s mental health and her physical well-being. You’re putting your agenda ahead of her well-being in the name of women’s empowerment and you’re not speaking this perceived truth in love.
You also talk about the disconnect between her laughter and the subject matter. Claiming that laughing while recounting a time of hurt is unhealthy. Yet you laugh and light-heartily discuss potential abuse. So while you claim her attitude indicates that something is off, then we can make our own assumption based on your inappropriate tone in laughter as well. And to me it indicates that you are not really concerned for Morgan or her marriage, but rather you enjoy tearing down men at the expense of other women to promote your own agenda.
And as someone who has suffered from sexual abuse I am personally offended by the weightlessness of this discussion. I understand the importance of talking about red flags as being educated in that helped me to realize the abusive nature of the relationship I was in at the time. However, red flags should not be used as a means to gossip about another couple.
Gossip is defined as, “casual or unconstrained conversation or reports about other people, typically involving details that are not confirmed as being true.” And that is exactly what you are doing here. It would be better to take a relationship where there has been proven abuse and analyze the red flags in that relationship to educate others. Otherwise you end up doing more harm than good.
I have no problem to you pointing out unhealthy patterns in a constructive manner as all relationships have unhealthy patterns due to our sinful natures. But I do not feel like your discussion was constructive nor was the timing appropriate as like I mentioned before she is less than 6 weeks postpartum.
Well said 💛
Thats exactly what I was thinking. Also the fact that they haven’t done enough research on them to know that Morgan is a person that laughs all the time regardless of the topic. I also feel like it was inappropriate to speculate they’re in an abusive relationship, based on body language, especially from only watching one video of theirs.
Thanks so much! Absolutely!!!
I mean, Paul and Morgan did put the video on a public platform, where other content creators are able to provide their feedback. Realistically, this is what comes with the job. Morgan also has the choice of whether or not she chooses to listen to this commentary. I’m glad that you care about the well-being of Morgan. How about all the THOUSANDS of vulnerable viewers that will be influenced by their reckless and DANGEROUS teachings. Mmmmm, oh okay.
I don’t agree with everything Paul and Morgan say in their videos… but what I will say is that this husband and wife love, cherish, respect and have a beautiful godly marriage. Maybe Paul didn’t word what he was trying to say in the most palatable way, this is live video after all, but they have great advice to give and should be a model of what a sacrificial marriage should look like. Like they said in their video, they aren’t experts, they’re Christian people sharing their perspective. And I know I have learned a lot from them. THIS is a healthy marriage- most of what we see online is NOT!
Nope.
I'm curious what your definition of godly is? Do you think that it is godly to for men to become angry when their wife won't have sex because they are in the middle of a fight, and then give advice to humble yourself and have sex anyway? Also, I'm not just sharing my opinion. I'm sharing data from the largest survey of evangelical women ever done--20,000. And what Paul said in this video does line up with decreased marital and sexual satisfaction for women! I do hope they listen, but I also hope that their listeners may learn what real godly marriages are--where sex is not a male entitlement and a female obligation, but rather something that is mutual, intimate, and pleasurable for both!
@@SheilaWrayGregoire my definition of a godly marriage is a marriage centered in Christ. They aren’t perfect but these 2 look to the Lord for answers and they will continue to be sanctified just like us all. To say their marriage is dangerous and unhealthy, and to reach out to the wife to see if she needs help, is completely out of line. Watch a few of their videos and really get to know them and their sense of humor, how they joke around with each other, and their personalities before forming opinions for all the world to see
@@SheilaWrayGregoire It's funny how you seem to target other Christians while calling yourself one. Are you truly redeemed by Jesus or just furthering and evil agenda to tear down healthy marriages as Satan loves to do. You should be ashamed of yourself.
I was physically abused by an ex girlfriend many years ago. I have also had girlfriends that were mentally abusive to me and a few that have cheated on me, and of course lied to me. I’m not the only guy by far that has had these experiences with girlfriends, and wives as well. One big difference is that very few men would ever even think of filing abuse charges against an abusive woman, whereas women often file abuse charges and even false charges. In court what happens is that the men are assumed guilty, until they can prove their innocence . This is real life in America.
Almost as if gender norms and rules was a mistake.
How is it different from a women having certain needs. I have expectations of my husband in different emotional areas, and if they weren’t done I would be really offended too. I would expect him to suck it up even if he was mad. Doesn’t seem that different to me. I watch a lot of there videos, Morgan laughs all the time regardless of the topic, I could make some things up about your body language too but I won’t because that’s really nasty.
Wow. So many people quick to judge. The host of this Chanel and the ones commenting against Paul and his wife are all shameful.
When did it become a rule that you have to have some sort of degree to talk about marriage?
You certainly don't! But if you don't have a degree, then you need to be looking at peer reviewed research and at evidence-based best practices, not just going on your own personal opinion. What we found, over and over again in our study of 20,000 women, is that those who took advice from people who were not qualified did not do well. And the vast majority of our Christian resources don't use evidence-based advice, and it's hurting people. We measured it in The Great Sex Rescue.
@@SheilaWrayGregoire It's shameful that use your platform to lie about and tear down someone's character that you don't know. You exaggerated Paul's character and made it seem as though Morgan is in and abusive relationship when she is not. The most alarming thing is the fact that you are a proclaimed Christian doing this to fellow Christians and you aren't even accurate on your assumptions. Truly shocking and sad to say the least.
@@SheilaWrayGregoire I’m sure you have some very helpful advice, especially for those who are in abusive relationships. However, my husband and I have had very similar discussions to what Paul and Morgan have in their video, and my marriage is in NO way abusive. Women are not always only victims. Marriage is a growing experience and nothing in a marriage is always going to be perfect. Even in their video, Paul and Morgan are working through their own thoughts, hurts, and experiences, and I happen to appreciate the fact that they’re not experts, they don’t read all the data, they’re just real people going through life in a marriage, trying to focus on the Lord and how they’re called to live in communion together with the Lord, rather than psychoanalyzing everything little thing. They’re not perfect, they don’t have everything figured out, but they love the Lord and they’re working on it. Your very negative commentary of “discernment” of their relationship is more damaging in my opinion than anything Paul and Morgan are doing or saying. It’s hyper critical of them without even knowing them. This video comes across to me as being no different than the left feminist movement - criminalizing men for every single little thing that you deem wrong or harmful, and victimizing women. Responsibility is on the side of both parties. Both men and women in relationships need to value each other, humble themselves, sacrifice for each other, etc. It actually shocks me that you don’t pick up on the deep hurt that Paul feels when he and Morgan have been in a fight and then Morgan just goes to sleep because she’s mad and Paul doesn’t have the emotional resolve in the relationship that night and is left feeling the rift in their relationship all night long. But his feelings don’t seem to matter to you both in this video because you’re too focused on how self-seeking you think he is. What a shame. I’m sick of men being beaten down by experts rather than encouraging them to be the best men they can be for the Lord to their families, and I wish more experts would call on men AND women to live Biblically toward one another rather than being one-sided. The Bible is our authority, over any expert, and I think Ephesians 5 does a pretty good job of stating how both men AND women should treat each other and live out their marriages.
@@mrstea1813you know them personally and closely?
@@mrstea1813Nah she didn’t. I’m glad to see better representations of Christianity online like Sheiba. I’m glad seeing healthy and more accountable Christianity online.
There is a reason Christianity is on a decline, and its from protecting harmful doctrine like Paul and Morgan.
Regarding your comments on Paul and Morgan, I would like to highlight that your so called ‘advice’ was in no way ‘healthy evidence based biblical advice’. It was completely incorrect and unfounded. I have watched so many of their videos and can inform you that you have completed read this couple wrong. It is sad that you attack them, the way you have, knowing that they have just had a baby. As if they didn’t have enough hatred, from the world, to deal with. Such negative, and incorrect, comments are unhelpful and outright unchristian. Please pray before you make such videos and ruin peoples days, lives and happiness. I pray that God will help you see your error. I implore you to and reach out to them and apologise.
Can you please tell me what I said that was unbiblical? And let me ask you this--if you had someone that you loved, say a sister, who was displaying signs of being abused, even if you didn't know it was happening, would you want to just give it the benefit of the doubt and assume she was fine? I am honestly very, very concerned for Morgan, and I hope she does contact me and respond to my overtures.
Is Morgan your sister? I mean if my sister was having an issue because she’s my sister I would know, known her all my life but you are based on “body language” lol
Also we all have those things where we don’t want our husbands to say something. In camera that is embarrassing… so I can see Morgan getting a little red that’s it.
@@SheilaWrayGregoire this is gossip for sure
She didn’t do her research. Morgan always laughs. She’s bubbly. It’s okay to look back at things and laugh. Geez. Morgan, a new mommy, doesn’t deserve this kind of attack. Paul has grown a lot over the years as well.
@@maylinrodriguez7661 Why are we pretending our husbands came with mature prefect attitude and with no past hurts or traumas etc etc? Come on… just because we are Jesus believers and followers of his word doesn’t now make us perfect human beings- ONLY HE IS PERFECT
Everyone knows everything about everyone it seems like. Oh gosh people... 🤷🏼♀️ It's just so disappointing to see this kind of content and read those comments. I guess it feels good to analyse someone and think that we know who they are or what they think. It gives you some power... But where is the love? Check your own heart people. Talk about yourself.
I'm also a little disturbed that as he was sharing his emotions, she was laughing! That's not good either....
This was me for YEARS!
Paul & Morgan are real people with real
Emotions, it only shows how real they are! I would love to see you both having these type of conversations with your spouse, give me a break!😂 Me & my husband for these conversations and issues sometimes and no he does not have me hostess or anything of that sort. Chismositas… Jesus please forgive them let them.
Yes, they are real people! I just want to say, though, that if you and your husband are having conversations like this, that may be a red flag. If your husband is saying that you owe him sex, or getting angry if you don't want to have sex after a fight, please understand that that can be a sign of marital coercion. I'm sorry that's happening to you.
@@SheilaWrayGregoire yes, please do a video with your husband.
@@SheilaWrayGregoire I’ve been married for 18 years & 4 kids and we have many disagreements that doesn’t mean he can make me do something. There is no violence or forceful sex. Is not happening to me at all.
@@SheilaWrayGregoire 😂ayyy Dios Mio ayudala!
@@cindybeltran992 Marital coercion is not just about physical force. Coercion is any time you feel you have to do something for fear of something bad happening if you don't. So if you have sex so that he won't be grumpy; so that he'll treat you better; so that he'll be kinder to the kids; so that he won't watch porn--all of that is a form of coercion.
The comment section is full of a group of haters that gang up against Paul and Morgan. That is not an accurate representation of what the majority of people who follow them think. The haters don’t even know their real personalities they just come over from forums to hate on them
Nobody hates, Ruby! In fact, we're very, very concerned and we're praying for them. I desperately want the best for them, and I am very worried about Morgan. I'm glad you're here, too. I hope that as you learn more about what healthy sex and marriage look like, you'll see that trying to educate about obvious unhealthy dynamics is not hateful; it's trying to rescue somebody.
They aren't haters they are genuinely concerned.
sounds like you are assuming way to much in the P&M, maybe those folks don't see things like you think they should, chill out
My first thought was that you were wrong about Paul and Morgan’s current content. They make culture videos on culture From a biblical perspective. They used to make videos on dating advice when they were younger
Completely agree, I think they have become so negative and critical about pretty much everyone. I use to watch their podcasts all the time but don’t agree with a lot of what they say now. Paul and Morgan are great a lovely Christian married couple that have just their first baby.
❤❤❤❤
Morgan laughs about everything all the time that’s just her personality. You’re wrong about this observation of her of her Being a sign she’s distressed. Do your research before making these videos
Her laughing about other things doesn’t mean she wasn’t distressed here. And Paul and Morgan have no credentials to back up their “advice”. They’re simply speaking from their single anecdotal, and very possibly unhealthy experience.
You should say stop idolizing "celebrities" period but what you shouldn't do is imply they are in an abusive relationship....that is projection, and it isn't cute.....I watch Paul and Morgan videos on occasion, and I don't agree with them about everything but if you watch more than 1 of their videos you can tell this is a nervous laughter of reflecting back on the past....but to imply abuse when you don't know them based on a video is super problematic
You must not have watched this podcast because they said MULTIPLE TIMES that they are not in a position to call this relationship abusive or not abusive. I believe they said that FOUR TIMES. What they did say was that this video is indicative of unhealthy beliefs. Which it is.
@@Soliloquy1972 I did watch the video and from what I got they were alluding to Paul and Morgan being in an abusive relationship...to me it would have been better not to use a real couple whose relationship dynamics they do not know as an example of "indicators of abuse" when they could have made the same point with a fictional portrayal (Law and Order etc) or they could have used couples people know without a doubt are in abuse situations their are actual public knowledge of there abuse track record and added the caveat that as society, or as Christians, or believers we should not idolise celebrities even if they profess religious beliefs 💯
@@danielleharris6668 the reason they addressed this video is because this is not just a personal TH-cam channel of an anonymous couple. This is a couple that is actively promoting themselves to young people and self-identifying as teachers and thought leaders. Sheila and Rebecca did not imply their relationship was abusive. They specifically stated they had no way of knowing that. So it's illogical to state that they were implying something they specially stated they were not doing. It was never implied they are in an abusive marriage.
@@Soliloquy1972 when you point to this couple and say...these are the signs to look out for (😉if you are in a abusive relationship 😉) you are implying that there is a probability of abuse....plus when you "reach out" specifically to the wife....that you are a "safe space" is implying abuse....to pretend water isn't wet is gas lighting
So I'm sorry, if you are really concerned about Paul and and especially Morgan, why are you posting this video about them instead of talking with them in private? You stated that they shouldn't give advice when they aren't experienced enough in these type of areas, so please explain to me what gives you both the right and qualifications to say everything you said about them? You even stated that you haven't watched any of their other videos so how in the world can you judge her reactions and emotions just based off of one video?
I honestly think you both need to pray and think about how you handled this issue because this is not the way God would like you both to have handled this.
In the New Testament, false teaching is always dealt with in public. Always. Their teaching hurts people, so it must be talked about in public. Matthew 18 is not talking about false teaching; it is talking about personal sins between two people. Jesus calls out false teachings loudly; Paul opposed Peter to his face in public, and then later wrote about it. In many of Paul's and Peter's letters they talk about who to avoid by name.
@@SheilaWrayGregoire yes you are correct about Matthew 18 and calling out false teaching. Before you make accusations of others though, you have to make sure you have facts that are correct and true. You have watched just this video and not any others (based on on the comment in this video you posted). More importantly, you didn't even reach out to them first to ask about the concerns you had and how the video came across to you. Maybe they truly don't realize how they come across and the "message" they are trying to convey to those listening isn't coming across correctly. Yes they do go about some things that I don't necessarily agree with, but I believe their intentions are legitimate and not trying to be just good on camera and get attention like you both accused them of. I have watched quite a few of their videos and they bring up things that most Christians are afraid to discuss and share what the Bible says we should do about those subjects which in most cases they have been spot on.
One of the main things you both did in this video was to dissect Morgan's responses, body language, etc. towards Paul and Paul's responses as well without even talking with them first to see if your accusations are correct. Yes Paul admitted he was expecting more than what Morgan was ready for when they first got married, but it seems like they worked it out later on in their marriage. They still have growing to do for sure, but again they aren't making statements that this is how every Christian couple should do things....they are trying to help give some advice and maybe somewhere to start for Christians who have no idea what to do based on what the Lord has shown them so far in their marriage as they continue to grow in Him. Even using these videos as examples of what Christian couples shouldn't do and the mistakes they made in their marriage too is something they covered I believe in one of their videos as well to help others avoid their mistakes.
There are some things yes I don't necessarily agree with them on when it comes to relationships, but to say they are giving false teachings in this area is not only very harsh but also incorrect. Are they saying that having sex before marriage is okay? That women have no say whatsoever in the marriage? No they are not. Yes maybe Paul comes across as a little "demanding" in things sometimes with Morgan, but it doesn't mean its out of control and that Morgan is being abused. I have known some Christian couples and the husbands have struggled with this mindset but with time and growing in marriage maturity in the Lord, it was worked out.
I am not trying to argue or be proven right in this, but am calling out what I see as unproductive and not telling the "potential" truth in love as the Apostle Paul taught in this video you both posted. You both brought up Paul and Morgan in this video to "warn" others of their "false teachings", so I am also bringing up an issue with how you both conducted yourself in this matter and how its a poor example of how Christians should handle situations like this.
This is so disappointing that 2 women who claim to be Christians who claim to care / worry about a fellow woman in Christ, Morgan, are making a hate video attacking them. Instead of reaching out directly to speak to Paul and Morgan. How dangerous of you to assume to that based on a 20 minute video and never meeting them in person or talking to them directly you assume it’s a DV/ SA relationship. They have a young, healthy, Christian marriage. I thought Christians were supposed to be on the same team? Instead you are attacking fellow believers in Christ like atheists would.
What a sad, scary world this is becoming. Where Christian’s are now attacking each other, not even just Atheists attacking Christians. Ask yourselves this, when you reach the end of your earthly life, will God say to you, well done my good and faithful servant? Based on making these videos. Or will he say get away from me I never knew you?
This is not a hate video. This is valid and important criticism. They are NOT accusing them of DV/SA.
No. A man’s sin nature wants a lot of women and desires to be unfaithful to his wife.
Sorry, you cannot trust your intuition about these to you are totally wrong about all of your misconceptions about Paul Morgan
It isn't actually intuition, Ruby! It's based on research that we made our observations. And, as I said over and over again, we don't know what is actually happening in their relationship. We can only talk about the behaviour on camera. And the behaviour on camera did demonstrate unhealthy dynamics. I would hate for young people to see a man treat his wife like this and then think this is normal! It may lead girls to stay in unhealthy relationships rather than get to safety.
This will be a long one
As someone probably a little older than both of you I have a few things to say to this re: Paul and Morgan.
You are not in their circle of influence nor are you their Pastor and do not know them. The fact that you reached out to her on Instagram is troubling. That isn't your place at all.
Why cant they give advice: 1 Timothy 4:12 Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity.
Your job should be to encourage NOT criticize. Lift them up. They are young but were sharing their personal journey.
He brought whipped cream on their honeymoon and she cried. He didn't make her cry nor I am sure was his intent to make her cry. Leave the flawed body language science out of it. If she laughs it is because it is funny to her now. Not then but now. If you watch any of their other videos she is always laughing because she is full of joy. Maybe you should take some notes (gratuitously gave a dig )
Moving on: What is the fawn response to trauma?
Fawning is a trauma response where a person develops people-pleasing behaviors to avoid conflict and to establish a sense of safety. In other words, the fawn trauma response is a type of coping mechanism that survivors of complex trauma adopt to "appease" their abusers.
This in no way is "fawn response." Thought I would put up that definition for your users.
You say this and then say "we don't know what is going on." Nope you don't.
Ahhhh you have an online course. Of course you do!
I agree both should want to have sex and if one party doesn't then you need to talk out whatever the issue is which is the bigger deal.
My wife and I follow this rule: Ephesians 4:26 “In your anger do not sin": Do not let the sun go down while you are still angry,
Talk it out before bed.
He said sometimes it would be good and she just rolled over and touched his arm....that would be body language of, its ok I dont want to leave you however right now I am mad at you. I still love you." My wife and i have had to do that several times and it isnt about sex.
Sheila - this is your bio
Sheila’s background includes two Master’s degrees from Queen’s University, with one in Sociology and the other in Public Administration. Her real education, though, has come as she has learned to be a wife to Keith, a busy pediatrician, and mother to Rebecca and Katie.
Sociology and Public Admin ok fair enough and yes Queens is an illustrious school. Spent much time in Kingston when I lived in Ottawa.
Rebecca's is a PhD in Clinical Psychology. 21 at the time I found this seriously, still a kid and life hasn't happened to her yet.
No where in this whole podcast did you talk about Scripture yet too focused on pseudo science in my opinion .
I think your heart is in the right place but you are bordering on meddling by putting up these kind of videos criticizing other TH-camrs..
Hope you take this in the spirit it is written in. I will be sharing with P and M as well
You should take the video down. Go watch the video response They just made regarding this video you made of them
It sucked and showed no intelligence. These women spoke with evidence based research and made clear they don’t know exactly what’s going on but that there are clear red flags in that video. This video of Sheila and Rebecca’s is very needed.
Do you guys believe in the Holy bible?
She doesn’t care for scripture. On her Instagram, she changes the scripture to fit her feminist narrative.
Clearly they do seeing as they regularly talk about their Christian faith, God, and said at the beginning of this and every video they give evidence based and biblical advice. Just because you don’t like them doesn’t mean you have to be condescending.
@@maylinrodriguez7661 False. They both clearly care greatly about the Bible. They talk about it regularly. And feminism isn’t against God. But thanks for giving them engagement on this video by commenting. It helps them in the algorithm. And then thankfully they can reach more people.
I don’t believe this is showing the wisdom of God, it’s personal victimization. Washing dishes every day is my job as the home maker of this house. My husband works 60 hours a week, he comes home and spends time with his daughter. I’m not resentful. I focus on reading the Bible and changing MYSELF into a better wife, and let my husband do the same; allow God to lead him in how to lead us. Instead of harping on victimhood as women, read the Bible on how to be a proverbs 31 wife. As husbands and wives we will never live up to the spouse God wants us to be, but the love of Christ Carries us through. This victimhood status is the very thing Jesus was addressing when he said pick up your cross, and follow him. Bear your suffering the way Christ did. Again we will never live up, but because of our savior, we are redeemed if we accept his redemption.
Amen! 👌🏻