agreed, been doing a lot of testing between CH, PB and rake myself and in the end CH overal is the best. It clears much faster and bosses still go down very fast. Sure PB may be better at bosses but it still ends up taking longer overall. CH spam also feels a bit more smooth to me. Sadly rake lags behind quite a bit as it feels so good to play. Been thinking about maybe trying a non kepeleke rake build bulding high crit through dodge and talents and try something like that. Also makes the paragon board for rake better as colossal and outmatch are great glyphs which dont function as well for rake. But there are no great alternatives for rake glyphs when running kepeleke and going for full resource spam all the time. What do you prefer btw or found to be better. Banished lord or non banished lord?
Banished lords. The max life it adds is unmatched sincew its a % instead of a flat # , the other stats are all fairly useful and a 60x affix is an insane amount of damage.
@@TheAssassin275 using the ranged aspect of payback on gloves, using the unique ring/amulet/ weapon, and the % crit damage on ring. so ya you gotta drop blood for it, might not work on Pits
Stonehands is the best build, fastest build for SB... you don't have to aim at anything like you do with Quillborn. Plus it's perfect for infernal hordes. I hit 6KB hits pretty often. I tried Quill and it's just slow comparatively.
I still think payback is superior. For vulnerability issues, you can get a ring for chance to make vulnerable or use the exploit glyph. To give you a perspective on dmg diff with only changing the skill tree, crushing hands gave me 50-60 billion damage. Sometimes, 100 b. My payback did 400 billion dmg consistently. 50 billion to 400 billion is an incredible damage increase. Another huge factor is that for me, crushing hands was often giving me motion sickness. However, payback doesn’t have that issue. Also, for nmd or infernal hordes, using the bristling vengeance helps with your clears so much. I admit crushing hands offers more tankiness but it’s not a deal breaker for me. If you haven’t tried payback, please see for yourself which one you prefer. You’ll see the difference clearly.
Using the glyph removes the use of another glyph that adds significantly more damage. Flat damage from the nodes that add additive damage don't really do much on this kind of scale of damage. And making an enemy vulnerable for 3 seconds once every 20 seconds isnt very good. Removing resource cost reduction from a ring (which adds tons of multiplicative damage) to get chance to make vulnerable isnt good either. You get zero effect on the hit that makes them vulnerable, and its for 2 seconds on a non lucky hit build. Youll make them vulnerable for 2 seconds (so around 4 hits) every so often, statistically unlikely to be in the window of time for your double dipped Jag spirit hall damage.
Like. Question: does the bug on the barrier unique node require to have 100% barrier? or does it also give you the insane extra damage when having 96% barrier? Is it a bug that only works at 100% barrier, or does it just always work, but obviously gives more at 100%????
@eerd2449 I'm not entirely sure . But I notice personally a huge drop off if I'm not at 100% . But I just know at 100% you get around 1% damage per 12 base hp you have. But as far as if 50% gives you .5 per 12 or something I'm unsure
Hey Habe the same probleme, Pit 130 max. Nice to play and fast clear. Btw. used Payback afix with "wave" which can easily damage opponents through walls. The barrier is missing in pvp. Switch back to the C- hands to be able to run the 150 pit. Thanks for posting 😉✌️
The payback video I watched did a wave like upheaval. Wouldn’t that be much better? They were also applying vulnerable with lucky hit on gloves if I remember correctly.
@MAXpaowers theres only so many slots for aspects is the issue. And it's every 3rd attack. Idk if that implies every 3rd attack or if it has to be an actual basic skill that has a third attack effect.
Great vid, I love theory crafting. I know you're not interested in Exploit, but for the utility, I'm giving it a try, plus 78% roll of making vul on my gloves. Can we see your build for the payback?
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67% to turn ennemy vulnerable, with 40% lucky hit or so is doing good job for me
agreed, been doing a lot of testing between CH, PB and rake myself and in the end CH overal is the best. It clears much faster and bosses still go down very fast. Sure PB may be better at bosses but it still ends up taking longer overall. CH spam also feels a bit more smooth to me. Sadly rake lags behind quite a bit as it feels so good to play. Been thinking about maybe trying a non kepeleke rake build bulding high crit through dodge and talents and try something like that. Also makes the paragon board for rake better as colossal and outmatch are great glyphs which dont function as well for rake. But there are no great alternatives for rake glyphs when running kepeleke and going for full resource spam all the time.
What do you prefer btw or found to be better. Banished lord or non banished lord?
Banished lords. The max life it adds is unmatched sincew its a % instead of a flat # , the other stats are all fairly useful and a 60x affix is an insane amount of damage.
@@KroovyGG thought so. Is what I am runnign as well.
btw i think Payback is just as fast as Crushing hands when clearing mobs, but you need the aspect for Payback that makes it a ranged attack
which aspect do you drop for it though? as all of them are quite hard to replace as they offer a lot.
@@TheAssassin275 using the ranged aspect of payback on gloves, using the unique ring/amulet/ weapon, and the % crit damage on ring. so ya you gotta drop blood for it, might not work on Pits
Stonehands is the best build, fastest build for SB... you don't have to aim at anything like you do with Quillborn. Plus it's perfect for infernal hordes. I hit 6KB hits pretty often. I tried Quill and it's just slow comparatively.
Moonrise is better than mystic circle because of higher ceiling of moonrise and also you can actually move around.
I still think payback is superior. For vulnerability issues, you can get a ring for chance to make vulnerable or use the exploit glyph. To give you a perspective on dmg diff with only changing the skill tree, crushing hands gave me 50-60 billion damage. Sometimes, 100 b. My payback did 400 billion dmg consistently. 50 billion to 400 billion is an incredible damage increase. Another huge factor is that for me, crushing hands was often giving me motion sickness. However, payback doesn’t have that issue. Also, for nmd or infernal hordes, using the bristling vengeance helps with your clears so much. I admit crushing hands offers more tankiness but it’s not a deal breaker for me. If you haven’t tried payback, please see for yourself which one you prefer. You’ll see the difference clearly.
Using the glyph removes the use of another glyph that adds significantly more damage. Flat damage from the nodes that add additive damage don't really do much on this kind of scale of damage. And making an enemy vulnerable for 3 seconds once every 20 seconds isnt very good. Removing resource cost reduction from a ring (which adds tons of multiplicative damage) to get chance to make vulnerable isnt good either. You get zero effect on the hit that makes them vulnerable, and its for 2 seconds on a non lucky hit build. Youll make them vulnerable for 2 seconds (so around 4 hits) every so often, statistically unlikely to be in the window of time for your double dipped Jag spirit hall damage.
Great explanation. Using the exploit glyph for vulnerability. Not really liking it. Any suggestions or do you agree with that glyph on the build.
@@hellsgate4066 Nah. It doesn't add multi. damage . It's really bad this season.
Flat damage doesn't do much .
Like. Question: does the bug on the barrier unique node require to have 100% barrier? or does it also give you the insane extra damage when having 96% barrier? Is it a bug that only works at 100% barrier, or does it just always work, but obviously gives more at 100%????
@eerd2449 I'm not entirely sure . But I notice personally a huge drop off if I'm not at 100% . But I just know at 100% you get around 1% damage per 12 base hp you have. But as far as if 50% gives you .5 per 12 or something I'm unsure
Hey
Habe the same probleme,
Pit 130 max.
Nice to play and fast clear.
Btw. used Payback afix with "wave" which can easily damage opponents through walls.
The barrier is missing in pvp. Switch back to the C- hands to be able to run the 150 pit. Thanks for posting 😉✌️
The payback video I watched did a wave like upheaval. Wouldn’t that be much better? They were also applying vulnerable with lucky hit on gloves if I remember correctly.
Funny to play just only for Dungens Rush. Cause dmg Lose.
Concussive stomp makes a barrier 🤔
stinger is solid too
Or there is glyph also for this
Use with aspect that gives you payback every 3rd hit😅 get the best of both.
@MAXpaowers theres only so many slots for aspects is the issue. And it's every 3rd attack. Idk if that implies every 3rd attack or if it has to be an actual basic skill that has a third attack effect.
@KroovyGG true that
great video!
somehow I felt like quill volley is doing more damage. not sure by how much though
Great vid, I love theory crafting. I know you're not interested in Exploit, but for the utility, I'm giving it a try, plus 78% roll of making vul on my gloves. Can we see your build for the payback?