Elders Oaks and Ballard at 1:34:17. They did the same thing at a YSA single adult Face-to-Face event at the University of Utah several years ago. Both claimed the church never concealed anything about multiple versions of the first vision. However they cited the Improvement Era article from the early 1970s. This mentions eight versions (there are nine). You cannot find a link to this magazine anywhere on the church website. It was also never taught in correlated church curriculum.
Thank you for your wisdom. I could return to the religion I left 30 years ago in Britain if we got back to the simple basics that I was taught in the 1960's, early 70's. Keep up the good work!
2 Nephi 25:23 states, "... for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do." When I was growing up Mormon and attending church every Sunday in the 80's and 90's, grace was rarely spoken of. The leaders of the Mormon church seem incapable of consistency over time.
It’s so frustrating. And somehow they turned that scripture into a stick to beat people with for not doing “literally all you can do“ before expecting any grace. Way to miss the point! 🙄
Brads story about the titanic was priceless. Only I was thinking about the titanic being the church and how we’ve always been told Gods church will never again be taken from the earth (unsinkable).
I'm an active church member in regional South Australia, I was visited by the saviour from the ages 6 to 36 (before and after joining the church). I love the good parts of the the church, but it does get some things wrong, I wait patiently for the changes. lift up, don't tear down, but do stand for what is true and not what you want to be true. BIBLE STORIES AS BLUEPRINTS FOR THE SOUL, is an good in-depth study of the scriptures we as latter-day saint sometimes miss when we get stuck. keep moving forward, love you neighbour. good luck everyone in your search.
@2:28:49 hours, talking about "As you have done to the least, you have done to me" - Absolutely brilliant! It is exactly this that the "most of these", like high religious leaders, desperately need to get in touch with. THAT is the best hope of saving the church. Focus on what Jesus himself focused on. PLEASE! Why is that so hard? It should be so simple.
It really should. And I think most Church members, particularly children, understand this. Somehow money and power corrupts these men as they ascend their pyramid scheme until they end up forgetting it all.
@@mormoncivilwar6189 True. Other things take priority over what Jesus himself focused on. Some of those other things are "the good name of the church" (perception management), religious rituals, obeying leaders, rules put in place that don't really make sense, obedience, obedience, obedience, what Pharisees emphasized, etc. Jesus was different.
I appreciate your perspective and your deep dives. I would love to live in your version of Mormonism. I hope that change can actually happen. It feels harder for me to stay as time goes on, but you give me hope that it can be different! Thanks for your hard work!
I always love how Americans think Brits should be excited about the historical connection. When the British Rescue happened last year, the GAs all repeatedly told the audience they either served a mission there or had ancestors born in the UK.
So let’s take the airport analogy a little further: in the LDS Airport for the Future, it’s organisation has priority passes for male/female married couples, and well behaved templed families who get special lounges where they can wait for the flight to the Celestial kingdom; certain people who don’t fit the perfect Mormon mold such single gays, trans kids, or even heterosexual unmarried women are told that they just have to have faith and wait, while they watch the elite disappear into the clouds. You can join them one day if you are faithful and pay your tithing and forget self realisation in all its biological demand. And anyone who asks awkward questions and won’t be silenced are obliged to undergo a customs and immigration detention from hell. They are out! Till they come back begging. When all’s said and done Brad this traveller is going to opt for the chaotic queues at LAX or Heathrow. They are real and I belong there!
Every time I think through in detail what their heaven would actually be like I have alarming flashbacks to Handmaid’s Tale! Maybe God will give them literally that afterlife they were hoping for as a punishment because it sounds like hell LOL
The greatest myth is that the church is growing. They still have new members, but many are also leaving. Membership numbers are not accurate. I don't think the average member has a clue about activity rates. I have had people tell me with a straight face their ward activity rate is over 50%. That rarely occurs even in Utah. The stats I have for Canada show about 15% activity rate (pre-Covid) in most wards. In Europe some church units have 6-8% activity rate, which means attending church at least once per month. The other forgotten issue is retention rates for new converts. Those are still a problem. It is nice to say you baptized 15 people in one year. However you may only retain one third of those people after one year in the church.
I understand that they recently started counting members from the time infants receive their first blessing rather than from baptism. I imagine they also continue counting them until they’re 110 years old unless they formally resign. 🙄
This hits so much harder with David Archuleta's recent announcement of stepping back. I wish the Church would stop exploiting celebrities for their own purposes. It's harmful to everyone involved, and seeks to advance the Church on the backs of these people and a bandwagoning logical fallacy.
Eyring is a good guy but geeze that was a really horrible answer about prayer. I don't think they're going to let him answer these questions anymore. Lower your expectations?
I know! I don’t actually think he’s a good guy. He’s turned out to be one of the most sinister of all with his teaching that it is a sin to speak or even think of any leaders having human weakness. Such a dangerous message.
The apostles “leave their nets” and serve the lord. James McConkie is a lawyer (surprise) and a general authority seventy. He’s gone back to his net to represent Gabby Petito’s family in a very lucrative suit ($50 million) against the Moab police department. His take could be ~$17 million. Man’s gotta make a living, right?
55 minutes in, let's just trash Jesus's new commandment as well as everyone with different beliefs. My goodness it's no wonder my tbm relatives are confused and "don't know what to believe" after dedicating their lives to it. If only us non believing family members got with the program and trampled all over people to further their selfish desires during the pandemic everything would be OK. How dare we challenge their beliefs like that by behaving with human decency 🙄
Brad… you make broad generalizations and judgments just like the Pharisees did in Christ’s time. Did you know that Hitler declared himself a Christian? When you make assumptions about people. You show your ignorance.
You’re one of my absolute favorites! Thank You for all your hard work!
Thankyou!
Elders Oaks and Ballard at 1:34:17. They did the same thing at a YSA single adult Face-to-Face event at the University of Utah several years ago. Both claimed the church never concealed anything about multiple versions of the first vision. However they cited the Improvement Era article from the early 1970s. This mentions eight versions (there are nine). You cannot find a link to this magazine anywhere on the church website. It was also never taught in correlated church curriculum.
Yup. I take a dive into that in 10C.
Thank you for your wisdom. I could return to the religion I left 30 years ago in Britain if we got back to the simple basics that I was taught in the 1960's, early 70's. Keep up the good work!
I shall try! Thankyou.
@@mormoncivilwar6189Thank you for your kind reply. I look forward to your next chapter.
2 Nephi 25:23 states, "... for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do." When I was growing up Mormon and attending church every Sunday in the 80's and 90's, grace was rarely spoken of. The leaders of the Mormon church seem incapable of consistency over time.
It’s so frustrating. And somehow they turned that scripture into a stick to beat people with for not doing “literally all you can do“ before expecting any grace. Way to miss the point! 🙄
Thank you for all your hard work in getting the actual truth out there. Keep up the good work!!
I will! Thankyou
Finally worked my way through this episode. Another masterpiece. Thanks Peter. Evidence all laid out so clearly. On to Episode 10C now.
Brads story about the titanic was priceless. Only I was thinking about the titanic being the church and how we’ve always been told Gods church will never again be taken from the earth (unsinkable).
Exactly!!
I'm an active church member in regional South Australia, I was visited by the saviour from the ages 6 to 36 (before and after joining the church). I love the good parts of the the church, but it does get some things wrong, I wait patiently for the changes. lift up, don't tear down, but do stand for what is true and not what you want to be true. BIBLE STORIES AS BLUEPRINTS FOR THE SOUL, is an good in-depth study of the scriptures we as latter-day saint sometimes miss when we get stuck. keep moving forward, love you neighbour. good luck everyone in your search.
@2:28:49 hours, talking about "As you have done to the least, you have done to me" - Absolutely brilliant! It is exactly this that the "most of these", like high religious leaders, desperately need to get in touch with. THAT is the best hope of saving the church. Focus on what Jesus himself focused on. PLEASE! Why is that so hard? It should be so simple.
It really should. And I think most Church members, particularly children, understand this.
Somehow money and power corrupts these men as they ascend their pyramid scheme until they end up forgetting it all.
@@mormoncivilwar6189 True. Other things take priority over what Jesus himself focused on. Some of those other things are "the good name of the church" (perception management), religious rituals, obeying leaders, rules put in place that don't really make sense, obedience, obedience, obedience, what Pharisees emphasized, etc. Jesus was different.
I appreciate your perspective and your deep dives. I would love to live in your version of Mormonism. I hope that change can actually happen. It feels harder for me to stay as time goes on, but you give me hope that it can be different! Thanks for your hard work!
Thankyou so much Robert. That really means a lot to me 🙂
When the crisis hit, like the pandemic, how did believers behave and treat each other?
Much more than the atheists they rebelled against compassionate measures to protect the vulnerable. So who really became dangerous in a crisis?
Bednar said the lockdowns to protect our lives were an invasion of "Religious Liberty." Yuk.
Keep on doing God's Work Peter!! Us normie muggle Christians love you and stand with you.
Thankyou!
I always love how Americans think Brits should be excited about the historical connection. When the British Rescue happened last year, the GAs all repeatedly told the audience they either served a mission there or had ancestors born in the UK.
It’s all they’ve got! Bask in the glow of our presence! We don’t actually have to teach you anything useful.
59:20 Wilcox is repeating the Bednar’s misstatement that the church’s assets are “millions” instead of billions. 😄
I have some fun with that in Episode 10C 🤓
So let’s take the airport analogy a little further: in the LDS Airport for the Future, it’s organisation has priority passes for male/female married couples, and well behaved templed families who get special lounges where they can wait for the flight to the Celestial kingdom; certain people who don’t fit the perfect Mormon mold such single gays, trans kids, or even heterosexual unmarried women are told that they just have to have faith and wait, while they watch the elite disappear into the clouds. You can join them one day if you are faithful and pay your tithing and forget self realisation in all its biological demand. And anyone who asks awkward questions and won’t be silenced are obliged to undergo a customs and immigration detention from hell. They are out! Till they come back begging. When all’s said and done Brad this traveller is going to opt for the chaotic queues at LAX or Heathrow. They are real and I belong there!
Every time I think through in detail what their heaven would actually be like I have alarming flashbacks to Handmaid’s Tale! Maybe God will give them literally that afterlife they were hoping for as a punishment because it sounds like hell LOL
My god(s)! He's insufferable to listen to. So condescendingly childish. Is this broadcast for Primary children?
He's a professional Elementary school teacher and seems brilliant at that and perfect for that job... just not the one he's got now! Bless.
Absolutely phenomenal. Please get the next episode out soon. Thanks
Working on it! Be careful what you wish for - the next one is going to be quite long. Stuff keeps happening!
"Approach the throne of the Lord" what a great way to relate with a 15 year old
Innit tho! It’s all about hierarchies of power to these guys at the top of their tiny Rameumptum.
The greatest myth is that the church is growing. They still have new members, but many are also leaving. Membership numbers are not accurate. I don't think the average member has a clue about activity rates. I have had people tell me with a straight face their ward activity rate is over 50%. That rarely occurs even in Utah. The stats I have for Canada show about 15% activity rate (pre-Covid) in most wards. In Europe some church units have 6-8% activity rate, which means attending church at least once per month. The other forgotten issue is retention rates for new converts. Those are still a problem. It is nice to say you baptized 15 people in one year. However you may only retain one third of those people after one year in the church.
Precisely! I’m fascinated by your Canada stats.
Where did you get them? They totally match the UK ones pre-Covid that we got from a data leak.
I understand that they recently started counting members from the time infants receive their first blessing rather than from baptism. I imagine they also continue counting them until they’re 110 years old unless they formally resign. 🙄
16:42 nice use of “ponderize” 😄
Full flow? Love it! Marmite? 2 funny! Thank u so much.
Brad Wilcox should be removed from Church Leadership!!!
Is he gay?
Indeed. But only when they have more sensible people lined up to replace people like him, which seems unlikely.
He’s a useful tool for them with his ridiculous made up exaggerated stories.
There is so much to say here, but I think you all get it!
Just started the episode... And I can't stand Brad's "spiritual voice". 🤢😒
Sorry, there'll be a lot of it LOL. He's 10 times more fun to listen to than most of the GA's though. It could be worse...
I was talking to a group of youths the other day.
I was playing the video at 1.5 and Brad and Eyring still couldn't stop talking fast enough. 😄
57:38 organized airports vs organized religion.
One is a profitable business model following government regulations which is not like the other.
This hits so much harder with David Archuleta's recent announcement of stepping back. I wish the Church would stop exploiting celebrities for their own purposes. It's harmful to everyone involved, and seeks to advance the Church on the backs of these people and a bandwagoning logical fallacy.
Millions???? It’s $150 BILLIONS !!! A huge difference, Brad.
Wow Brad the titanic disaster occurred because their was not enough life boats
What's with the 5 million number? What's the worldwide membership number again?
10B dropped, y’all! Yay!
If a seer stone contained a microchip, perhaps it could be compared to a smart phone. Perhaps .....
If you see words in a rock, you dont need a hat you need a doctor. That's not how rocks work.
Where I found the grass greener is Jesus in the synoptic gospels. Why isn't the teachings and example of Jesus not good enough? Too easy? Too hard?
It’s hard to do when your priority becomes robbing the poor and lying to people!
Pattern of the ages.... like we want to pattern our lives on the bronze age.
I know! Life was such fun without science and medicine trying to please angry gods….
Eyring is a good guy but geeze that was a really horrible answer about prayer. I don't think they're going to let him answer these questions anymore. Lower your expectations?
I know! I don’t actually think he’s a good guy.
He’s turned out to be one of the most sinister of all with his teaching that it is a sin to speak or even think of any leaders having human weakness. Such a dangerous message.
The apostles “leave their nets” and serve the lord. James McConkie is a lawyer (surprise) and a general authority seventy. He’s gone back to his net to represent Gabby Petito’s family in a very lucrative suit ($50 million) against the Moab police department. His take could be ~$17 million. Man’s gotta make a living, right?
55 minutes in, let's just trash Jesus's new commandment as well as everyone with different beliefs. My goodness it's no wonder my tbm relatives are confused and "don't know what to believe" after dedicating their lives to it. If only us non believing family members got with the program and trampled all over people to further their selfish desires during the pandemic everything would be OK. How dare we challenge their beliefs like that by behaving with human decency 🙄
Brad… you make broad generalizations and judgments just like the Pharisees did in Christ’s time. Did you know that Hitler declared himself a Christian? When you make assumptions about people. You show your ignorance.
Brad Wilcox = Marmite = Vegemite
Ok. I stand corrected. Dude is unhinged.
Really!!?? Over 3 hours!! Almost 3 1/2" FREAKIN hours??!?!?!?!? uggg......
For long form videos, I change the playback from Normal (1X) to 1.25x and 1.5x at time.
It’s all worth it! 😀🤪
Ideal listening at the gym.
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Have said before and will reiterate this man is a fool.
Brad Wilcox is cringy