VERSION VERSUS: Ms. Pac-Man (Arcade vs Genesis) - ahbeef
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ก.ค. 2024
- Welcome to the first episode of Version Versus, a brand new segment where I review and compare different versions of a game to see which one comes out on top! In the series debut, we're continuing the Pac-Man marathon by looking at the US developed arcade classic, Ms. Pac-Man, versus the home console Tengen port on the Genesis. Does Ms. Pac-Man hold up as well as the original? How does the Genesis version fare? Let's find out!
Special thanks to Chariot Rider for playing the Genesis version's multiplayer with me for footage and to ExoParadigmGamer for making the Version Versus logo and assets.
Chariot Rider's channel: / @chariot_rider
ExoParadigmGamer's channel: / exoparadigmgamer
Support me on Patreon: / ahbeef
#ahbeef #versionversus
0:00 Intro
1:50 Development
4:38 Story
8:17 Visuals
13:27 Sound
16:49 New Mechanics
17:29 Ghost AI
23:15 Maze Design
30:14 Multiplayer
32:28 Genesis Mazes
35:58 Conclusion
37:59 Patreon
38:32 Outro - เกม
Sorry for the poor audio quality in this video. Not sure why it came out so muffled but I didn't even really notice it until it was all recorded and edited down, so I decided to leave it to prevent any further delays on this video. Future videos will not have this issue.
Grown man talks about yellow dot for 40 minutes. Time well spent indeed.
Yellow dots
There are 2 yellow dots
Actually, Namco DID know about Ms. Pac-Man during its development. In fact, they made the sprites for Ms. Pac-Man herself.
thank you for the correction! seems like the story ive been told is a bit dramatized lol
@@ahbeef Yeah, there's a lot of misinformation regarding Ms. Pac-Man's history and ownership.
That said, I think the other Midway games were made without Namco's knowledge, and thus they (probably) don't own those games, though they do (seemingly) own those games' characters.
Ms Pac Man was created by Midway and GCC,Namco was involved in the development and made the sprites for Ms Pac Man,but now All the rights of Ms Pac Man are with that stupid AtGames.
@@adamhaitham3076 Not all rights. AtGames only has the royalty rights, previously owned by GCC. Bandai Namco owns the actual copyright, they just have to pay AtGames whenever they rerelease the game or use the character, with some exceptions.
@@jackiexkh So does that mean Bandai Namco owns Ms Pac Man but they have to pay royalties to AtGames whenever they use Ms Pac Man or whenever they release the game?if so, what are the exceptions?
Oh, also something I knew recently, the Sega Genesis has a Double Screen mode where It runs at 320x448, and there is no performance loss, this mode is used in Sonic 2's multiplayer mode, they could have used it
I have 3 words to say about the difficulty of the mazes and the increasing ubiquity of the danger zones in Ms. Pac-Man: *_That's the idea!_* 💥 I've been playing this game for _42 years,_ and I have had my ups and downs, even had problems getting to 100,000 points on the original; and I have never had a complaint about the movements of the monsters or the mazes. The design itself, along with the action, are why this is the greatest coin-op game of all time. 👍✨
I had the Genesis/Mega Drive version, and I can tell you that the monster movements are far more random when compared to the coin-op. But don't get caught with the red monster behind you, because it will run you down _twice_ as fast as the coin-op red monster. 😱
Since originally watching this video, I've played the Famicom/NES version of Tengen Ms. Pac-Man, and I think it's absolutely the definitive version of the game. It appears to have most, if not all of the features of the Genesis version, but it also retains the original graphics, which look much better than the weird "upgraded" graphics of the Genesis version. If anyone's interested in playing Tengen Ms. Pac-Man, I'd highly suggest trying out the NES version instead of the Genesis/SNES versions.
NES version is peak gaming
I think the Genesis version looks pretty but to each their own, I guess
To be fair, many Ms. Pac-Man machines in the United States tend to have speed chips installed (The reunion cabs from the early to mid 2000's even have it as a secret code that can be toggled much like how the original Pac-Man can be unlocked.) so I don't think a lot of players have made the same complaints about the maze designs you've pointed out in this review. Personally I have more fun with this game and Jr. Pac-Man with the speed hack and I feel it lends to them better than the original, especially Jr. with it's wider mazes. (Steve Golson doesn't actually seem to mind this iirc from an interview)
i would agree that speed chips do make ms. and jr. pac-man much more enjoyable, but in a similar way that playing with cheat codes does. it can be thrilling to overpower yourself and break the game's intended design in half, but that isn't the intended experience that the game was designed around, so i felt it was better to just ignore it, at least for the arcade version. with the 16 bit version though, it's a main option, and extra options like that are especially welcome in an enhanced port. that said, it still probably would've been fairer to consider the use of speedup chips for the original when compared to the 16 bit version's pac booster, but oh well
Kinda happy they didn't do custom mazes for the Ms. Pac-Man mobile port... The modern Pac-Man mobile game's Story Mode is a genuine MESS
Regarding your comment of the visual aesthetic of the 16-bit version of Ms. Pac-Man, I personally think the visuals don't look bad at all. I've always been a fan of the Genesis version of Ms. Pac-Man mainly because the game itself looked pretty with the extra detail added. I wouldn't be as fascinated if a port on a 16-bit console didn't take advantage of the expanded color palette, this making the game look generic. I recommend the NES Tengen version if you want the simplistic style in tact.
I know I already made a comment over a year ago now, but I wanted to make another one to say that if you're a big fan of ports that add more options and content, then you're *definitely* gonna like Bauske's "Pac-Man 37". It's only in version 0.37 right now and is missing some stuff like any multiplayer modes, but the stuff that's already there makes up for it imo, especially since it's a perfect recreation of the arcade games, (Pac-Man, Ms., Jr., and Plus) and you can mix many things to your own liking. There's even some cool Easter eggs if you look and mess around with things more closely. I don't want to spoil it, but even if you're a purist I think you'll still regard this version of these games as the best ones out there without a contest. The passion for this franchise and effort put into it is very clear. A link to it can be found on Old80s: Gaming's video(s) showing it off. You don't even need an emulator, just run the exe file and go. It's by far my favorite Pac-Man fan game right now, and it's not even in version 1.00 yet. It'll most likely take a very long time for more updates since it took a few years for the current version to come out, but drastic additions and changes are still being planned, so look forward to that. If this isn't a love letter to Pac-Man and its fans, then I don't know what is. I cannot praise it enough. Seriously, *go play it.*
ive heard about it and it looks really cool, i might even do a full review of it if it ever gets a full 1.0 release. i haven't played it myself, but it does look very fun
@@ahbeef Yeah I don't know when we'd even get a version 1.00, but what we currently have is good enough. It's still currently the best versions of those Pac-Man arcade games, that's for sure.
Finally a new beef review 🙌
I don’t agree with you saying that it’s “worse” than the original. If this game was just like the original then it wouldn’t have been no different than just playing something slightly different like Pac-Man Plus, which is already there and that you *also* say is worse. The point of having so many different Pac-Man games to begin with is *because* they are different. Nobody expects to play a game like Super Mario Bros. and understand all the mechanics of Super Mario Bros. 2. If we did then it would just end up being boring, and if I wanted to stick to Pac-Man, I’ll stick to Pac-Man.
That being said though, I don’t necessarily believe that it’s “better” either. Maybe in terms of visuals and presentation sure, but I think all three of the main games following the same formula (Original, Ms., and Jr.) are all good in their own ways. After all, none of these games are perfect, even the original. It’s also why I’m glad other Pac-Man arcade games like Super Pac-Man, Pac & Pal, Pac-Land, Pac-Mania, and Pac-Man Arrangement exist, they all have different ideas. Really the only one that doesn’t fit is Professor Pac-Man, and really the only one I genuinely think ruins the maze formula is Pac-Baby, but other than that the rest of the actual arcade games are anywhere from decent to great. I suppose it all comes down to personal preference, but after awhile I kinda gravitate towards Ms., Jr., Plus, Mania, and Arrangement over the original just sim,y because it’s literally everywhere. Granted Ms. used to be everywhere too, but unless Namco actually starts fighting for rights to two or three games they didn’t make, I highly doubt we’re gonna see more ports after the 2010’s ever again. (Which already had very few in that decade alone by the way) They seemed to have replaced Ms. herself with “Pac-Mom”, so she’s probably gonna stay gone for good this time just like Jr. Pac-Man and Yum-Yum, (Pac-Jr. doesn’t count) so that’s just another crime right there. Only Sue and Tim are still kinda sorta around since they’re such basic names, and I doubt Namco really cares about that either.
i don't think ms. pac-man is worse than the original because it's different, in fact i think its changes are mostly good ones, at least on paper, but i think it's a worse game because of the lower skill ceiling and worse maze design. changing the ghost ai wasn't the issue, they very well could've made changes that still make the game as fun and addictive as the original, it's the execution of these changes (i.e. making the ghosts move randomly in scatter mode) that i'm not a fan of. making new levels wasn't an issue, in fact, like i say in the video, fixing the repetition of the original was a necessary evolution for a pac-man sequel, but the design of the new mazes has some flaws that lead me to not like it as much as the original. despite all my complaints, i do still think ms. pac-man is a good game, i just prefer the original personally
@@ahbeef Eh, to each their own. I like both games and Jr. equally for all very different reasons, but I can easily see why it might not appeal to everyone since it’s not as “polished”. I think the skill ceiling in Ms. is more reliant on planning your next moves ahead of time while Pac-Man with its one maze layout is better for muscle memory. Both use timing with the ghost AI but they are done in a different manner thanks to the more unpredictable nature of scatter mode. It makes it feel less scripted and they expect you to make even *more* decisions on the fly for a bigger challenge, similar in basic concept to the original, so I don’t fault the developers too much on that.
I do agree that some maze designs could’ve been better though, some are a bit too long with few to no other routes even with this premise. I guess they just couldn’t test them all out properly in time before release perhaps. It’s a lot harder back then to make 4 or more mazes for a game than just 1 or 2. The first map at the very least shows that they at least knew what they were doing if nothing else.
But hey, I’m not saying that this opinion is a bad one or anything like that, it’s just an interesting observation that I like to point out for some discussions. I’m one of those types of people that likes to purely analyze things first, and have biases last. (Not saying you have any by the way) I like going into things with an open mind and, even if I don’t necessarily like something, can still try to look for qualities that makes me understand *why* people would like said thing.
But anyways, I appreciate that you read through my comments, thanks for the replies. You make good videos. :)
@@ZacharyDietze This game is fun, but I mostly agree with ahbeef. There's too much of those "straight lines" in the bottom of maze 3 & the top of maze 2. Maze 3 in general...I can't tell if it's genius or garbage. I gather most people on standard arcade settings can't get to the fourth maze.
@@kasperk.651 Fair enough. I'm not saying that the stages aren't that objectively worse, just that it really doesn't affect my overall experience in the end. There are more positives with Ms. and Jr. for me than there are negatives. Besides, it's clear that they are like that for the difficulty curve, it's an awkward one sure but it's still there.
Your complaint and reasoning is confusing to me as to why the first is better than the sequel
Interesting though I think at least
well, i tried to explain my points as accurately as i could, but if it didn't really get the point across then the best way i can really explain is that i just have more fun playing the original game than this one. at the end of the day, it's an arcade game, so fun is the most important factor in how well these games hold up over time, and while ms. pac-man is still a fun time, the original is just better in my opinion.
I love the new visual s! Minus menu rendering
So nostalgic reminded me of gba collection I had as a kid! From one where iso perspective and could hop walls as pac-ma. Baby I thiiiiink??
It has weird Galaga tetrid doctor morio type puzzle game ??? I think!?
sounds like you're thinking of Pac-Man Collection on GBA. the games included in that are Pac-Man, Pac-Man Arrangement, Pac-Mania (the isometric one), and Pac-Attack (the falling block puzzle one). despite the GBA's limitations it's one of the most solid pac-man collections out there!
How do the difficulty options work? I might have missed something and I'm confused.
I didn't really explain how they work in the video, that's my bad. It's easy to lose track of stuff with a script as long as this one was. As far as I can tell the difficulty options simply change the speed that the ghosts start at, with normal reflecting the arcade version, easy starting off slower, and the other two starting faster. Crazy might make other changes, but I didn't mess around with crazy and hard too much so I'm not entirely sure. Sorry I missed this one in the script!
@@ahbeef Thanks for the response.
no problem! hope that clears it up
I think ending with 8 kids is attempting to show mini vignettes depicting the couple doing numerous things in Artsy=unique way but due to low graphics capabilities it's botched
?
I don't think I've heard ANYONE describe Ms. Pac-Man as "not that great". Harsh. And all your complaints about maze issues were more or less fixed with they started adding the speed up chips in the machines.
i didnt really go into speedup in this marathon, since they don't seem quite vanilla enough to me to really matter in a review, but i will say i tend to prefer games like ms. and jr. with the speedup chips
19:53 how are you below 10'000 points here?
i was playing on the steam version, which lets you choose which level you start at, that way i could get footage of all of the late game levels. these days though, i can make it that far on one set of lives with a little practice
@@ahbeef oh!
suggestion: half life pc vs half life ps2 since there are plenty of differences in gameplay and graphics
i was here for this video
I love your videos but I always hated these games! They drain me of life and energy !
i hate the ms pac man tengen ports for 1 reason THOSE STUPID DUMB LINES ABOVE MS AND MR PAC-MAN'S HEAD THEY INFURIATE ME UNTIL THE END OF TIME
You do realize that's to indicate that you got the Pac-Booster, right?
yes, they still infuriate me