Hi, i got the rpi 0 2w a few months ago , it actually performed way better than shown in this video (n64 was sitting at 60 fps stable), maybe it is a newer version?
Why does nobody benchmark the Pi Zero 2 W against the Pi 3a+ instead of the 3b+? Would be more similar in terms of hardware (512MB Ram) or the 3b without +, where the Zero2W CPU is originated from.
Hi. You're right that they are more alike but I guess the B+ is the more popular variant. Being able to get that sort of performance from the Zero 2 is a big step up.
@@BytesNBits The "3B+" is actually different silicon to the 3B. The 3B+ processor is flip chip and has better power routing than its wirebond counterpart. Comparing the 3B at 1GHz should give a very similar result to a Zero 2.
If you have a 3D printer available (even my little Mars2 Pro with its tiny print bed area was able to do it at a 40 degree tilt) there's a really nice SFC controller back plate you can use. It has mounting posts/holes for a Pi Zero and marked ports on the back, plus screws directly into the top half of a SNES/Super Famicom controller. You can then solder the wires from the SFC controller inside directly to the Pi Zero (or use pins/a pinheader) and it's good to go. This is my current favorite design, and I'm actually currently reworking it to add a qi charge circuit and lipo battery (probably only 1000mah or so to keep it tiny) as a way of making it fully portable, requiring only HDMI at that point. If one of you is a more skilled/experienced 3D designer, I'd welcome you to go for it too! Probably a lot of better looking ideas than what I'll come up with, heh. My plan ATM is a power switch on the back and charging via the Vin pin or Qi, so I only have to add a single external hole, which I can squeeze into the gap by the back ports, hopefully. Working on that now.) (edit: Oh, and I was even toying with the idea of putting some smaller rumble motors in there, as there IS indeed room in the controller on the side, where if I split the battery into 2 smaller packs, I could fit those... but that's a mkII step for me.) Edit 2: OH! And as a tip: If you do end up printing it on an SLA printer, make SURE you use way, way more supports on the upper (lower? The early part) end, as it's going to be supporting a lot of weight for a short period, and the usual supports just don't cut it. My first print failed that way, with a droopy front end.
@@BytesNBits Shall do, and thank you so much for the video! I'm currently waiting for roms to copy over from USB on the Pi Zero 2 W, and can start working on the controller modifications to test in 3 days when my shipment gets here from Amazon. I'll of course link the modified case design to the original on thingiverse as well, in case anyone else wants to add a battery/power switch setup. (And I'll leave Amazon links to the parts I use. Yes, AliExpress/DigiKey/etc. are cheaper, but for simplicity.)
@@BytesNBits Not at all! I had almost written off that idea a few months ago, but seeing your Pi Zero 2 video here was all the motivation I needed, heh. It's finally... powerful. I never used the Pi Zero/Zero W for anything more than basic data collection terminals and such, and it's hard throwing out a $70-80+ board for every small project/idea but seeing how smoothly you were running emulators on the cheap PiZero2 there... I had to try, and it's great! I "fell into a hole" last night while "just testing out" a few SegaCD games.... for about 10 hours. *cough* Yeah, just uh... doing a burn-in test, sure, that's it. Oh, and there's another thank-you due here, as your diy controller video definitely helped. (I'm using your code/wiring here, thank you!) and I uh... will admit there's a half-built project board in my drawer from when I first watched it, but the SFC buttons just... feel more "right" to me I guess. That slightly squishy yet tactile feeling... Between the improved SBC power and that... I've found my own "perfect" combo for convenience and quality.
@@ArtemisKitty Sounds great. I know what you mean about the costs. With the Pi Zero you can just make a project to try out ideas. Testing is an important part of any project. You can never do too much!
This is great and informative video but a bit unfair to the good old Raspberry Zero W... Let's not forget you can use non libretro emulators (pifba / pcsx-rearmed / mame4all etc) that allow better performance than the one shown in the video.
Looks great for your use, but the most important feature of the zero was for no interruptions to a time critical application. As long as you can turn the extra cores completely off and interrupt latency hasn't suffered, it sounds like a good replacement apart from the massive % but ok absolute price rise. If the zero is going to still be available, even better - horses for courses ;)
Hi. I'll admit I'd never thought of using a Linux machine for time critical applications. Does it work OK or do you have to use a different OS. As you say the new Zero is looking really good as an emulation machine and the cost increase is still less than moving to the 3B+, especially with the form factor.
@@BytesNBits I'm thinking bare metal, although the two applications that sprang to mind, the TUBE CoPro and the RGB2HDMI (both originating on the BBC Micro) now use the ARM core in the GPU for timing critical parts and then interrupt the main CPU at their leisure.
great idea! it would be awesome to get DK jr wide screen up - my first game & watch! it seems to be more demanding than DK II for some reason so I hope they both work.
I've heard that N64 emulation is more GPU heavy than CPU but looking at your video it seems the performance increase of more CPU's is showing improvement. Is the GPU the same in both the old Pi Zero and the Pi Zero 2 ?
Hi. I think it depends on the system you're running it on. If it's got a more powerful GPU it will use that, if not then the CPU might be used more. I guess in the Pi Zero the CPU has a more significant effect.
Hi Bob - Been catching up with your videos and had a question for you please. Having just watched the video on the game controller, do you think you can/have/will do a video on making a game controller that would mimic a keyboard without just using an old keyboard and adding buttons to replace the keys? I have been trying to find videos on that but not found any yet. For example MicrosSoft Train Simulator from 2001. I would like to control that making a controller that I could program rather than just a straight forward keyboard hack. All the best and thanks again for the excellent videos. Cheers for now. Jim.
Hi Jim. Oddly enough I am working on some game controller ideas based on using an ESP32 microcontroller to simulate a keyboard / mouse / gamepad, either over USB connection or hopefully bluetooth. So that would allow you to have buttons on the controller that you can map to keyboard button presses. I'm planning to get some of these projects out before Christmas allowing for work commitments. If you want to have a look for yourself a good starting point is this video... th-cam.com/video/4sIkW7wogrE/w-d-xo.html
@@BytesNBits Ha... talk about good timing ;) Really looking forward to seeing those videos when they come out mate. I am currently working through your Python Course on Udemy that I purchased in March and only now getting around to installing Visual Studio Code and Python. Also got the pro version of Tic80 and following through those courses as well - you are keeping me well busy. lol All the best for now. Cheers. Jim
Hi. There are so many to choose from so I just picked a couple that would push the frame rate. If you've got some tips on good games please share. Thanks.
@@andrepido747 Thanks for the recommendations. I did do a couple of other PS1 games in the Retropie installation video that came after this one - Gran Tourismo and Colony Wars - both 3D games. I have to admit I'm not really a fan of beat-em-ups. I tend to spend my time kicking and punching randomly and not hitting anything while the opponent beats the **** out of me.
@@BytesNBitslol id say Streets of Rage is a "beat em up" & sf2 + MK are "fighters" (but u can still have the same net effect of getting the sh*t kicked out of you ;) nice choice of PSX game - which shooter is that? looks awesome! EDIT: didn't realize @9:04 "Einhänder" is the name of the game!
Hi. You're absolutely right. But I wanted to run a straight comparison to show the actual performance gains with a straight out of the box setup - no tweaking! I think this gives a better view of the extra power.
Hi. I thought looking at me might be better than looking at a static screen. If you think not I won't be offended - I'll just cry quietly in a corner :(
As ever, practical, timely and concise information. Thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
Hi, i got the rpi 0 2w a few months ago , it actually performed way better than shown in this video (n64 was sitting at 60 fps stable), maybe it is a newer version?
You'll probably find the software has been optimised since I made this video to get better performance. I haven't tested it for a while.
this is great news! I'm about to get one!
Glad I got one.
Gonna make my own handheld...
Hard to get hold of these days but much more powerful than the orginal Pi Zero.
@@BytesNBitsglad they are back in supply! this is inspiring me to make my own handheld too!
Why does nobody benchmark the Pi Zero 2 W against the Pi 3a+ instead of the 3b+? Would be more similar in terms of hardware (512MB Ram) or the 3b without +, where the Zero2W CPU is originated from.
Hi. You're right that they are more alike but I guess the B+ is the more popular variant. Being able to get that sort of performance from the Zero 2 is a big step up.
@@BytesNBits The "3B+" is actually different silicon to the 3B. The 3B+ processor is flip chip and has better power routing than its wirebond counterpart. Comparing the 3B at 1GHz should give a very similar result to a Zero 2.
@@simonmartin4599 Hi. You're getting a bit deep here for me. I haven't had to think about IC architecture for a long, long time!
Very good and funny videos bring a great sense of entertainment!
If you have a 3D printer available (even my little Mars2 Pro with its tiny print bed area was able to do it at a 40 degree tilt) there's a really nice SFC controller back plate you can use. It has mounting posts/holes for a Pi Zero and marked ports on the back, plus screws directly into the top half of a SNES/Super Famicom controller. You can then solder the wires from the SFC controller inside directly to the Pi Zero (or use pins/a pinheader) and it's good to go. This is my current favorite design, and I'm actually currently reworking it to add a qi charge circuit and lipo battery (probably only 1000mah or so to keep it tiny) as a way of making it fully portable, requiring only HDMI at that point. If one of you is a more skilled/experienced 3D designer, I'd welcome you to go for it too! Probably a lot of better looking ideas than what I'll come up with, heh. My plan ATM is a power switch on the back and charging via the Vin pin or Qi, so I only have to add a single external hole, which I can squeeze into the gap by the back ports, hopefully. Working on that now.)
(edit: Oh, and I was even toying with the idea of putting some smaller rumble motors in there, as there IS indeed room in the controller on the side, where if I split the battery into 2 smaller packs, I could fit those... but that's a mkII step for me.)
Edit 2: OH! And as a tip: If you do end up printing it on an SLA printer, make SURE you use way, way more supports on the upper (lower? The early part) end, as it's going to be supporting a lot of weight for a short period, and the usual supports just don't cut it. My first print failed that way, with a droopy front end.
Hi. Thanks for the tips. Sounds like a great project. Let me know how you get on.
@@BytesNBits Shall do, and thank you so much for the video! I'm currently waiting for roms to copy over from USB on the Pi Zero 2 W, and can start working on the controller modifications to test in 3 days when my shipment gets here from Amazon.
I'll of course link the modified case design to the original on thingiverse as well, in case anyone else wants to add a battery/power switch setup.
(And I'll leave Amazon links to the parts I use. Yes, AliExpress/DigiKey/etc. are cheaper, but for simplicity.)
@@ArtemisKitty Great. Thanks for that.
@@BytesNBits Not at all! I had almost written off that idea a few months ago, but seeing your Pi Zero 2 video here was all the motivation I needed, heh.
It's finally... powerful. I never used the Pi Zero/Zero W for anything more than basic data collection terminals and such, and it's hard throwing out a $70-80+ board for every small project/idea but seeing how smoothly you were running emulators on the cheap PiZero2 there... I had to try, and it's great!
I "fell into a hole" last night while "just testing out" a few SegaCD games.... for about 10 hours. *cough* Yeah, just uh... doing a burn-in test, sure, that's it.
Oh, and there's another thank-you due here, as your diy controller video definitely helped. (I'm using your code/wiring here, thank you!) and I uh... will admit there's a half-built project board in my drawer from when I first watched it, but the SFC buttons just... feel more "right" to me I guess. That slightly squishy yet tactile feeling... Between the improved SBC power and that... I've found my own "perfect" combo for convenience and quality.
@@ArtemisKitty Sounds great. I know what you mean about the costs. With the Pi Zero you can just make a project to try out ideas.
Testing is an important part of any project. You can never do too much!
This is great and informative video but a bit unfair to the good old Raspberry Zero W...
Let's not forget you can use non libretro emulators (pifba / pcsx-rearmed / mame4all etc) that allow better performance than the one shown in the video.
Hi. Thanks for the tips on the standalone emulators.
Thanks!
No problem, thanks.
Looks great for your use, but the most important feature of the zero was for no interruptions to a time critical application. As long as you can turn the extra cores completely off and interrupt latency hasn't suffered, it sounds like a good replacement apart from the massive % but ok absolute price rise. If the zero is going to still be available, even better - horses for courses ;)
Hi. I'll admit I'd never thought of using a Linux machine for time critical applications. Does it work OK or do you have to use a different OS. As you say the new Zero is looking really good as an emulation machine and the cost increase is still less than moving to the 3B+, especially with the form factor.
@@BytesNBits I'm thinking bare metal, although the two applications that sprang to mind, the TUBE CoPro and the RGB2HDMI (both originating on the BBC Micro) now use the ARM core in the GPU for timing critical parts and then interrupt the main CPU at their leisure.
@@trickysoft That makes sense. I've not looked into coding the Raspberry Pi's outside of Linux. Sounds like it could get complicated!
Retiring the old zero w to octopie duties would be a good move
Yes. There's still loads of applications for the older boards.
Have anyone tried running the Mame LCD-games on the Pi Zero? Should be ideal for a handheld console, if possible :)
Hi. I've not tried any lcd games. Let me know if you get them working.
great idea! it would be awesome to get DK jr wide screen up - my first game & watch! it seems to be more demanding than DK II for some reason so I hope they both work.
I've heard that N64 emulation is more GPU heavy than CPU but looking at your video it seems the performance increase of more CPU's is showing improvement. Is the GPU the same in both the old Pi Zero and the Pi Zero 2 ?
Hi. I think it depends on the system you're running it on. If it's got a more powerful GPU it will use that, if not then the CPU might be used more. I guess in the Pi Zero the CPU has a more significant effect.
Hi Bob - Been catching up with your videos and had a question for you please. Having just watched the video on the game controller, do you think you can/have/will do a video on making a game controller that would mimic a keyboard without just using an old keyboard and adding buttons to replace the keys? I have been trying to find videos on that but not found any yet. For example MicrosSoft Train Simulator from 2001. I would like to control that making a controller that I could program rather than just a straight forward keyboard hack. All the best and thanks again for the excellent videos. Cheers for now.
Jim.
Hi Jim. Oddly enough I am working on some game controller ideas based on using an ESP32 microcontroller to simulate a keyboard / mouse / gamepad, either over USB connection or hopefully bluetooth. So that would allow you to have buttons on the controller that you can map to keyboard button presses. I'm planning to get some of these projects out before Christmas allowing for work commitments.
If you want to have a look for yourself a good starting point is this video...
th-cam.com/video/4sIkW7wogrE/w-d-xo.html
@@BytesNBits Ha... talk about good timing ;) Really looking forward to seeing those videos when they come out mate. I am currently working through your Python Course on Udemy that I purchased in March and only now getting around to installing Visual Studio Code and Python. Also got the pro version of Tic80 and following through those courses as well - you are keeping me well busy. lol All the best for now. Cheers.
Jim
@@SeamusMcNeil Great. I hope you're enjoying the courses.
Nice!
Thanks!
Will this Raspberry Pi Zero 2 W be able to run FlashRom to reflash a bios chip on a laptop or pc motherboard???
Sorry. I have no idea. I've never tried it. If the Pi Zero W did this one should as well.
Hello. What about snes emulaion?
Hi. SNES emulation is full speed, even without overclocking.
@@BytesNBits All games without frameskipping? ( doom, yoshi island or other games which use fx chip)
Ok, thank you for answer
You should've tested other psx games
Hi. There are so many to choose from so I just picked a couple that would push the frame rate. If you've got some tips on good games please share. Thanks.
@@BytesNBits at least one 2D and another 3D, say Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat 4
@@andrepido747 Thanks for the recommendations. I did do a couple of other PS1 games in the Retropie installation video that came after this one - Gran Tourismo and Colony Wars - both 3D games. I have to admit I'm not really a fan of beat-em-ups. I tend to spend my time kicking and punching randomly and not hitting anything while the opponent beats the **** out of me.
@@BytesNBitslol id say Streets of Rage is a "beat em up" & sf2 + MK are "fighters" (but u can still have the same net effect of getting the sh*t kicked out of you ;)
nice choice of PSX game - which shooter is that? looks awesome! EDIT: didn't realize @9:04 "Einhänder" is the name of the game!
You didn't try different emulators, the default emulators are really bad choices.
Hi. You're absolutely right. But I wanted to run a straight comparison to show the actual performance gains with a straight out of the box setup - no tweaking! I think this gives a better view of the extra power.
@@BytesNBits Just bought one of these. How does the commodore amiga emulation perform?
@@maxxdahl6062 Hi. I haven't tried Amiga emulation. I expect it should be OK. Only one way to find out!
@@BytesNBits Thanks, I appreciate it. :)
Why We have to look at that gentleman reading the script?
Hi. I thought looking at me might be better than looking at a static screen. If you think not I won't be offended - I'll just cry quietly in a corner :(