Good job as usual. He gives his honest impression in his reviews. In this world now a days that’s like finding a unicorn. I hope he keeps going. I watch every chance I get. The Spendor BC1 review was truly great. He says something about how modern speakers have been stripped of all the things that make them sound real. I agree 110% !
They should bring back old fashioned harmonic distortion tests like they used to. I remember articles written about this in the British Mag HiFi News and Record Review. It was found that small wide range cones in small ported enclosures produced more harmonic distortion than larger coned speakers especially in the bass. While a well made 5" cone can be made to be smooth in response with low stored energy, it will nearly always generate higher harmonic distortion than big cones at similar volume levels. The other issue is scale which you covered. This is why on average larger speakers despite their other flaws tend to satisfy more than small speakers.
I love vintage speaker i just brought a near mint pair of Mordaunt Short Pageant Series 2 for believe it or not only £15 from a local second hand shop and they sound lovely i have them running on a NAD 320BBE amp and they seem to work well together I my self would go for the Beovox 3800 over the KEF LS50 i don't like small speakers the smallest speaker i have is a pair of Yamaha NS-100 Great video as always look forward to the next vid
Hello Kelvin. Great video, I really enjoyed it. I am also a fan of vintages. You mentioned that these are not your favorite speakers, maybe you can name your top 5 favorites?
45 years ago I bought Kef Reference 104 speakers. After the third or fourth year I blew up both tweeters. Just outside the warranty. I contacted KEF and they told me it should be impossible to blow up their tweeters and they send me new ones for free! I only had to pay for the shipping costs. What a service! Now, 45 years later I still have the same KEF's. I have tried other speakers, but my dear KEF's remain my favorite.
@@jorgbornefeld1689 I was experimenting with a Revox Taperecorder. Probably it was because I was recording sound which was amplified, recorded again, amplified again and so on. A kind of "sound loop" It happened in a few seconds. My KEF's had no fuses then.
Great videos, I've watched heaps in the last week! I've just recapped my KEF Concerto crossovers with a set of Falcon caps, what wire and what gauge would you recommend I use to re-wire the speakers from the crossovers with? Cheers in advance from Australia!
Thanks Kelvin. I enjoyed this interesting and informative video. I have a friend who tends to overate vintage B&O gear sound-wise and while I generally like the sound of their systems, I think that their equipment designs rather than their sound, set them apart as very advanced and classy looking kit for their time. PS. I have only recently noticed that the KLH brand has been revived and is producing modern versions of their original acoustic suspension speakers. Check them out if you get a chance.
Yes Bee and O were super expensive brand-new and great looking but they compare well to say the best Japanese stuff of the 70s I will check out the KLH thanks K
Would have to agree with must of your review. Acquired a set locally ( posting no way) one was damaged. After repairing gave them to me son he loves them. Any planes for replacing upgrading cross overs in old speakers.Keep up the good work .
Thanks.This is interesting to me. I have mostly vintage equipment. I've often wondered how my New Large Advent speakers with the "fried egg" tweeters would do against newer speakers like the LS50's. Overall, I'd describe the Advent's characteristics like you did the B&O's - though often it seems very much dependent on the recording. I also have a pair of Advent Laureates. They are more cohesive and very pleasant and easy to listen to. I'd like to take a step up or two in quality. What speakers would you say are markedly better than the LS50's but around the same price, or a bit more (I'm in the u.s. btw)? I'm also curious how much difference the Bluesound streamer makes. This does beg a lot of questions, but I'll stop here. Thanks for making the video. It was helpful. - Cheers
the x factor you mention is what my father describe as what is impossible to overcome, namely the physical laws, a bigger speaker simply deliver a bigger sound due to the frame. We used to have garden or streetparties with my fathers 20 w speakers, homemade; It could be heard on the other streets. Less needed power, less distortion.
It would be great if both Kef and B&W would return to build speakers ( made of wood and with a classic beautiful aesthetics)that looks like REAL speakers and not like vacuum cleaners
I think that particular ship has sailed. Every decade or so, hifi goes through a lot of esthetic transformation as different materials and manufacturing techniques are discovered and utelised. Just look at gear by Metaxas and Sins, Avant Garde, Zingali, Steinway Lyngdorf, Devalier and Oracle to understand how far hifi design has really come.
@@andygee8716 klispch jbl Klh Wharfedale Magnat Elipse Tannoy are just a few names that are returning (tannoy and Klipsch have never stopped) to a real beautiful aesthetics , just check the incredible success in USA of the new Klh model 5 and you will undesrtand that ship is returning to the haven of reason.
@@margix1172 Reason for whom? Isn't hifi supposed to be subjective... One man's floor is another man's ceiling type thing? Retro will always be just that. Some will buy into it and others won't. In fact two of my most favourite loudspeakers ever are more than 30 years old: the Infinity IRS-V and Martin Logan CLS, (can't see the Infinity's ever being built again, though). What I'm saying is materials and manufacture have become better and some beautiful pieces have sprung from that.
Great review. Appreciate your work a lot. I really wonder what you think about Kef 104aB. Especially compared to LS50 or ls3/5a. Keep up the nice work. Thanks!!
Yes well basically I’m a big fan of that era of Cath speakers cadenza concerto original Coda even Correlli and Another two-way I can’t remember that whole era of care feel really good after that it went downhill quite badly generally speaking
Well yes I just change the volume you know but I tell you what was funny with these two speakers was I was never sure which ones were on because they were that similar
a friend just gave me a pair of B&O 3800, Not tested them yet but all looks good going to put them on my Eagle Amp.. , great review.. 👍🏼 Do you have a review on the Leak 600, I have a pair that I find very good.? (update: just tested sound brilliant..)
Hi Kelvin, interesting review.I got my hands on a pair of 3800s about a year ago, what attracted me was the goodmans bass and mid cones. I found the sound to be very scooped (decent triple and good bass and mids in the background) so not too fond of them but about 3 months ago I recapped the crossover which was very straightforward and it made a big difference (tighter bass and better sub bass and brought the mids more forward and highs a bit more crisp) wasn't expecting such a difference. I was surprised you said your 3800 are very efficient because mine are not when compared with Kef 104abs the 3800s need more volume.I usually play these 3800s through a Sansui au6500 or a Kenwood da-9010. Hope some day you might come across the wonderful Heybrook sextet speakers to review. Very much enjoy your reviews.
I guess I was comparing with the KEFS regarding efficiency Can you tell me how much you spent on capacitors please cheers K and thanks for the feedback
@@stereoreviewx don't know exactly how much because I also got caps for a pair of Goodmans Mezzo as well and a mate got some caps for a couple of pairs of Wharfedale E speakers but it wasn't a lot. Got Mundorf ecaps for some pairs and standard Jantien caps for 3800s. Were got in Hifi Collective.
I would love to run the formula for intermodulation distortion on the two base drivers. It's very easy. You just need to know the cone area, frequency range, and excursion if I remember correctly. It requires no test equipment and is linked to psychoacoustic studies of perception. I suspect this may be the cause for what you hear as the relaxed sounding of the Beo's. Thanks again for another wonderful presentation! We share a love for vintage equipment!
Nice review like always. I have a feeling that you might like speakers made by Finnish Pekka Tuomela. He made tons of different hifi speaker kits. Especially models Hifi 85/3, Hifi 85/B, Hifi 85/C and Hifi 85/D. Pretty much the same speakers, but 85/3 was the oldest and 85/D latest. They were DIY kits made in late 70's to late 90's. Hugely popular because you could get a lot speaker for the money. Also ready made speakers were made due to the huge popularity called BBX 485 so no need to build the box and crossover by yourself. They had 1" dome tweeter, 2" dome midrange and 10" bass in huge 85 liter reflex box tuned to 25Hz. I had one of those and sound was BIG. Bass extension straight down to 30Hz.
I have a of Goodmans 'The Havants' using the same midrange and tweeter drivers. Detail and imaging up the wazoo for its diminutive 15W rating. Reveals harsh electronics very easily. They sound absolutely stunning on my Sansui A-4900.
Have you considered that there might be something wrong with your Kef's? I have never listened to the ls50, but nearly every review i heard about this speakers was rather praiseful.
The LS50s vocals are great, but there are several caveats. You can't just plop down LS50s on a resonating bookshelf, cabinet, table.......and expect them to sound very good. The LS50 cabinets are inert, but they will resonate (muddy bass which ruins everything, because everything is coming from the same point), so they must be decoupled and also solid. For every action there is an equal reaction (it's physics) and boxy (resonating) speakers disperse that energy as muddy sound though the cabinet. The LS50 cabinet doesn't resonate, so all the energy will transfer to what ever they are coupled (touching) with. The LS30 can produce super tight and natural sounding bass, but not if your bookshelf or wooden floor system is acting like the worlds most muddy subwoofer. Also, the LS50s are 85dB sensitivity and they dip down into the low 3ohms. Only very competent amps can properly control the LS50s. My LS50s sound amazing on my Parasound JC1 mono blocks, on solid sand filled metal stands, at least 1 meter from the wall and will a very sweet DAC. I have a lot of decent 150 watt high current amps and the LS50s sound pretty good, but it's not enough to make them really shine. I think most people would be happy with that sound, but not many would like the LS50s if they are using a mass market current limited amp or receiver. The LS50s play what you give them and they will sound harsh in the highs and produce muddy bass if the front end can't keep up. The LS50s are actually way better than their price point and can keep playing up to at least a $20,000 front end. They are very finicky speakers, so they aren't for everyone not willing to give them what they need to sound great. As long as they aren't pushed to their limit (I fed them at least 150 watts from my mono blocks and they were rocking super tight bass in a big room and the entire range stayed very tight), I think people would be happy if they pair them with a decent quality high current amp and make sure they are decoupled from anything that will resonate. I totally understand why many people don't like the LS50s, because when I first got them I placed them on top of tower speakers and I wasn't very impressed. After a few years of testing and realizing what the LS50s need, they are now one of my favorite speakers and I have much more expensive speakers. There is also a lot of benefits (like sound staging) from having all the sound coming from a single source point. It's actually two drivers in the LS50s because the tweeter is independent from the mid base, but the midrange vocals disperse from the exact same trajectory as the highs from the tweeter. This gives the LS50s an airy sound. I have a pair of $2000 speakers from the 80s with 2 tweeter in each speaker, midrange and 12" woofers and the LS50s best them on everything, including max bass output when both driven to their max on a very good amp. I'm not saying that some older speaker can't come close. I have a pair of Polk LS70s from 1992 and they can give my Kef R900s a run, but only on my better amps (particularly my mono blocks) because the LS70s dip down to 3ohm and are very hard to drive properly. I thought the LS70s were crap because I only had weak ass receivers 10 years ago. When it comes to hard to drive speakers amps totally matter. It's literally night and day difference. I almost sold the LS70s for $100 (what I paid for them ) and now they are one of my top three speakers.
You are absolutely right Kelvin . The KEF LS50 are over hyped forward sounding speakers. Just like the Audiolab 6000A amplifier which i used to own which was very harsh in the midrange and had a forward sounding treble.
that the voices are a bit distant or background alike in the bang and olufsens, may that have to do with the kind of small midrange driver, that has a diameter kind of small compared to other similar made speakters? Can that be a cause and so help us to identify such problem in the future, us likeing buying older speakers? I got beovox 5000 mk III and M70, S45 and S25 amongs others....
Jbl 4312 monitor uses 12" unfiltered...so it goes to 1500 hz , and its nicely musical ....rogers had also a studio monitor with 12" polypro bass and audax dome tweeter....
I really enjoy your reaction to the general praise that the LS50 gets. It's not insulting or over the top. It's just a confident opposition the conventional impression about them. I'm not commenting on the LS50 at all because I haven't heard them, but it's nice to see someone be willing to express a bit of protest against a tidal wave of public opinion. I'm inclined to believe and trust your impressions, but in the end we all have to decide for ourselves, of course! I'm glad you gave your impressions. I always enjoy these videos, even in the rare times when I think I know what to expect.
It comes down to a small concentric point source vs large drivers on a large baffle. Which produces the size and scale of real instruments? This is where small speakers sound small despite their other virtues. Big speakers may lack image focus and pin sharp detailing of something like an LS50 but if you want a life sized sound that approximate the scale of real instruments you need big speakers. The ideal speaker would encompass the virtues of both design schools.
The Goodmans bass driver is a Type 112/1251/8 and was originaly used in a Goodmans 2-way speaker. And thats the reason why it has a coated membran,to extent the usable frequency range and dampen the cone breakup resonances to some extent and to uncomplicate a proper working low pass filter. I bet in the Beovox 3800 the cut off frequency of the bass driver is rather unusual high for a 3-way,with the nice consequence to need way cheaper (because smaller values) parts in the low pass filter. Anyway,the bass driver is a typical for its time high Qts/low Vas piece that can be easily fitted in smaller volumes although it will show a peak in the bass frequency response and than a quickly dropping curve towards lower frequencies. So its obvious why you said this is a bass first speaker. Well,the Beovox 3800 strikes me as a very economicly focused old school construction and it is miles behind from what the british were up to - qualitywise - back then.
I think it's a Philips AD 0140/T(4/8) tweeter. I had some in 70th when I built my own louspeakers (all Philips drivers). They are great. Later I use AD 0163. Even better.
Hi Kelvin. Thanks for the super informative and entertaining reviews. You've got me interested in the B&O 3800 speaker simply because of that 12" woofer. Beoworld state the woofer is 12" and the dimensions of the cabinet are 58cm high x 29cm wide x 29cms deep. However, unless B&O have created a TARDIS, a 12" (30.5cm) woofer should not be able to fit ! Either the dimensions are wrong, Goodmans has short changed them, or those Danes are really good engineers ! Cheers, Paul.
I haven’t but you just know they sound great because the mid range and the celestion super tweeter And interestingly I like that configuration of drive units I have a pair of Gail 401s in Repair with the same configuration can’t wait to hear them
If you want a really good vintage B&O speaker, try listening to the Beovox M-100's. It's got 5 drivers: 12" woofer, a "filler driver" (part of their Uni-Phase design), a dome midrange, a tweeter and a super-tweeter. Sold mine, and now I'm considering bying another pair, when I get myself a larger house (they sound best in a larger room). Remember to check the surroundings on the filler driver, they rot away after approx 15 years. Not fan of the tall thin ones.
I have Beolab Pentas as well as Beovox 100.2s - the latter are one of the largest passive speakers made by B&O and are great - I use them with a BM4401 but also have in the same room the Pentas. The Pentas are very good and give the M100s a good run for their money but the bass is not quite as detailed - probably due to the bass being provided by multiple small drive units. Although they are very tall, they have stainless steel covered boxes so actually are more house friendly than the big M100s - those these are probably the best wood finish of any B&O speaker. A friend and I did a comparison test with 3800s against M100s, MS150s, Pentas and a few others. I liked the M100s the best.
Those Philips tweeters on the Beo's are known to be NOT flat, but can still sound quite nice with the right C/O network. The reason he states "similar sound" (despite size) is because the Beo's don't go very low, and placed near corners will just boom. The KEF's, with newer tech. have better THD. And yes, with bigger boxes & high efficiency the BEO's WILL tend to have that 'impressive factor' - especially when it comes to 'filling the room' with sound.
The smaller sized KEF LS 50 may produce similar bass levels as the larger Beovox but the Beovox's bass sounds more musical than the smaller KEF. Very, very little progress in the past 40 years indeed. 🤔
Top revue, the cone from the ls50 is too small , thats why the mofi is a 10" unicue....the more the cone has to move , the higher the linear distortion...in pa pro they say all that is smaller then a 12" is a midspeaker....
Emblematic when somebody chooses a vintage speaker over the modern one which shows the progress has been very slow on this side of the isle. When that modern speaker happens to be a so much acclaimed KEF LS 50 then it turns puzzling to say the least.
If you like good design and ok sound B & O is for you. If you like exceptional sound and ok design then KEF, hands down (based on specs + reviews, I still have to audition it live). I have a vintage KEF C10 and it still sounds 6/10. My Beovox (idk the model) sounds 2/10, has left my house long, long, long time ago.
Well I don’t really agree with the sentiment they’re mostly because the KEF’s just don’t sound any good they look like something from Star Trek but they disappoint I got some serious problems
Hi there Kelvin, just a little update... I did manage to track down a pair of Celestion 332s from a man in Germany who'd collected a whole range of Dittons and swore that the 332 were one of his favs. I am very much taken with them, and certainly the best i've had so far, including since we last spoke, some klipsch tangent 10s (great bass, but slightly shouty tweeter) and quadral argent 80s (full big sound, strong bass, but not detailed like the 332s). The 332s have amazing mids and suit themselves to reproducing instruments of all kinds. I have upgraded also from the Quad 33 Pre, to a NAD 1240 preamp into my Quad 303 and this is a set-up which I've been enjoying. But the world turns... Now on the search for a reasonably priced subwoofer, front-firing , which won't piss off the neighbours too much, the 332s do lack a little bass. I also need to sell some of my growing collection. I am curious also about finding an amp which goes a little into the lower frequencies, I am tempted by your sansui recommendations, but also am very impressed by harman kardon. All the best, and thanks !
Interesting stuff thanks for the info Don’t know if you’ll get better base from the Sansui than a 303 Just to say make sure the base driver screws are snug you know and the mid don’t overtighten Cheers K
45 years old screaming for a recap! I'm going to do it to my 3702's (same mid an high) Maybe even replace the tweeters. I believe the successors the s-45 are valued more. They have plastic fronts with a bit of an angle to them.
Yes the S 45 seems to be quite well regarded Do you have any choices for changing that Twitter because the first thing I thought about with that speaker was I wish I could change the Twitter
@@stereoreviewx I have been thinking about those tweeters in the Beovox 3700 you reviewed or maybe the ones used in the S 45. I have to check impedance again though. I will first recap them to see how they sound and then decide about what tweeter would be a good alternative.
So the latest word in speaker technology produces BeoVox sound in a small package with less sensitivity. And the average TH-cam reviewer wants us to believe we have come a long way. That never made sense to me because speaker technology has not fundamentally changed at all. So my suspicions are confirmed (only) here with a direct comparison.
First, I couldnt agree more about the Kefs. I was excited when I first had a chance to listen to them but I was really baffled. I was very disappointed, boring, flat and compressed as he says, and just uninteresting, especially for their premium price. About older speakers, the industry really wants you to believe there's been a lot of progress the last 40-50 years. I have to really question that. I have about 25 pair of speakers, some mid range, but also higher end models. I've been a speaker constructor and builder since the early 80s so I think I got a fair amount of experience in the field. Now, there are many very good sounding vintage speakers that are as good or in many cases better than what you will find today. Especially when you consider value for money. There really has not been many major improvements in speaker technology for the last 4 decades in my experience. What I have been experiencing though is cost cutting in materials and construction, replacing metal with plastics and so on.
@@hugobloemers4425 Kelvin said it was a similar sound, not the same. He said that the B&O's midrange was a little reticent compared to the KEF. Even some very expensive speakers don't look all that with their grilles removed.
The 3800 is a good speaker - they came with beautiful trumpet stands. The European model was the 4700 but that only had 7.5" woofers though it had two of them or the 5700 which had a 10" woofer. 12" woofers avoided purchase tax. I wonder if you may need to change the capacitors in the cross over if the treble is a bit dull. B&O speakers were often tailored to go with the relevant Beomaster and this would use the BM3000. The 3800 was replaced by the S60 aND BM4000 which was replaced by the S75/M75 and BM4400.
That’s interesting tell me exactly what you mean please because I’m never sure what the sound is like on the other end and I change some settings from time to time
What those "rich people" do when they buy B&O (or Linn) is that they value their time extremely high, they don't have years to figure out what their "sound" is, what components have synergies or where the best deals are etc. To these people buying these "expensive" turn-key systems can actually be the cheapest option. You're paying a fair bit for the sound, and the build quality and the design. But perhaps what you're really paying for is the turn-key experience and ease of use, someone else has already figured out the overall system for you.
Was testing 5 hours of different speakers in an Audio shop, and after 15 minutes I personally had enough of the KEF LS50s. For their size they can be considered good, which is why they got their awards, but after test pressing Cambridge, Dynaudio, Klipsch RP-8000Fs. To me everything blew them out into the water. I hated the KEFs. - Just like Mr. Stereo review X said: A good amp forgives a lot as it presses more out of the Speakers. However, for me it was something about the LS50's nature that irked me. Ended up with a pair of Klipsch RP-8000F:s ultimately. I would get the vintage Beovox speakers as well from these two. "You need more clarity the older you get(from the speakers), better start now", that was my motto.
As a first time viewer I'm not impressed. Many LS50 reviewers have stated that you need a good Amp to bring out the 'good bits' of the LS50's, and I am guessing you used Naim Amps to drive them? I might have missed what you used, as I was laughing too much. Thanks for the comedic input. Naim Amps, like the LS50's, are highly rated, but when setting up a system you need to partner equipment to get synergy. In my experience of Naim and LS50's, they are both clean, and to me a little on the thin side. No synergy there. So as you experienced, not a good sound.
"A not so good amplifier, like Aiwa or a Pioneer." Man, that is bound to upset a good chunk of the vintage Hi-Fi community! Aiwa, sure, but the Pioneer receivers from the '70s are going for mad money on auction sites these days, just like Sansui.
Don’t care about small boxes. My homemade 17 driver hexagon speakers got a 200 l cabinet. Tweeter midrange closed, bass cabinet is ported. Listing to real highend speakers i must say mine is better. Many small drivers is mutch better than few big. Big speakers got a mutch bigger body and less compressien.Just making music sound more real.
It’s interesting that Kelvin reckons the sound of a biggish old one is similar to a small new one. What about comparing a biggish old one with a biggish new one, please? (I’m a floorstander nut!). I love the sound of my own Mission 774 speakers for classical music though I ‘d be the first to agree they don’t have thumping bass, thank God. I’ve owned and heard all sorts of B&O receivers, CD player, speakers and turntable over 50 years and the only thing I was disappointed with, ie thought it was poor quality for the money, was the cheaper of the famous parallel tracking turntables. Lovely looks but frankly no better sound than an early Pro-ject Debut turntable I also had at the time.
As someone who spent many years testing repairing and modifying Philips and associated companies products, speakers were often a pure accident, they should've been good and weren't, or the opposite, defying logic or explanations..
The ls50s sound great on a high end system as I heard at a show. I think you are being a bit unfair to them. You can get them cheap and have more money for a great amp and source
Ouch !!! .. the industry is going to get this channel taken down if you keep dropping the truth !! The industry darling £600 speaker sounds no better than a thing that could well be picked up at a car-boot for £ 20 !! In many ways these 2 are similar .. B&O were always disliked as they were classed as a " lifestyle" product that put form over function . I've always thought the LS 50 were the same , they no doubt sound good for the size and look the part but they must have a Huge profit margin as the actual material worth , production and transport cost must be minimal .
Try getting cartridges for their record players.....actually don't bother just buy equipment optimised for sound in the first place. It's not snobbery it's not being taken for a ride.
God I’ve received a lot of angry mail because I don’t like those speakers often I think it’s from people that haven’t even heard them but now they’ve been given five stars
Kelvin is almost part of my home. I’m allways waiting his video and hope he never gets tired of making reviews
Good job as usual. He gives his honest impression in his reviews. In this world now a days that’s like finding a unicorn. I hope he keeps going. I watch every chance I get. The Spendor BC1 review was truly great. He says something about how modern speakers have been stripped of all the things that make them sound real. I agree 110% !
Always enjoy your honesty and the fact that you review vintage gear! Keep on keeping on!
Very insightful video Kelvin! Your passion in hifi is just mesmerising.
starting loving seeing these reviews, great going man!
Your honesty and openness is refreshing.
Thank you.
I love your reviews. The way you describe things is just so detailed.
Entertaining and informative as usual 👍
They should bring back old fashioned harmonic distortion tests like they used to. I remember articles written about this in the British Mag HiFi News and Record Review. It was found that small wide range cones in small ported enclosures produced more harmonic distortion than larger coned speakers especially in the bass. While a well made 5" cone can be made to be smooth in response with low stored energy, it will nearly always generate higher harmonic distortion than big cones at similar volume levels. The other issue is scale which you covered. This is why on average larger speakers despite their other flaws tend to satisfy more than small speakers.
Good points my friend
When the LS50 came out back in 2012/13 and started getting awards, I went for an audition, and I didnt like them either! You're not alone...
good job bro!. been wi U since the beginning. thanx for sharing your qualified experience.
Hi Kelvin, can you get your hands on some Harbeths for review? Would love to see your take.
I love vintage speaker i just brought a near mint pair of Mordaunt Short Pageant Series 2 for believe it or not only £15 from a local second hand shop and they sound lovely i have them running on a NAD 320BBE amp and they seem to work well together
I my self would go for the Beovox 3800 over the KEF LS50 i don't like small speakers the smallest speaker i have is a pair of Yamaha NS-100
Great video as always look forward to the next vid
Great stuff as usual.
Hello Kelvin. Great video, I really enjoyed it. I am also a fan of vintages. You mentioned that these are not your favorite speakers, maybe you can name your top 5 favorites?
Thanks, Kelvin. I enjoy listening your channel. Please, can you include classic music tracks in your evaluations. Thanks
Thanks Kelvin another nice review, the Beovox not the prettiest speaker about, but nice to learn how they sound
Nice Ditton CS5 you managed to get hold of Michael, not seen many about
@@audiodimensions5255 only ever seen 2 pairs for sale in 3 years I have been looking on eBay
45 years ago I bought Kef Reference 104 speakers. After the third or fourth year I blew up both tweeters. Just outside the warranty. I contacted KEF and they told me it should be impossible to blow up their tweeters and they send me new ones for free! I only had to pay for the shipping costs. What a service!
Now, 45 years later I still have the same KEF's. I have tried other speakers, but my dear KEF's remain my favorite.
How did you blow up the tweeters? I never killed any speaker of mine.
@@jorgbornefeld1689 I was experimenting with a Revox Taperecorder. Probably it was because I was recording sound which was amplified, recorded again, amplified again and so on. A kind of "sound loop" It happened in a few seconds. My KEF's had no fuses then.
@@willemsterk5048 ah, okay. Yes, that's poison for tweeters, I see. Thank you.
Great videos, I've watched heaps in the last week! I've just recapped my KEF Concerto crossovers with a set of Falcon caps, what wire and what gauge would you recommend I use to re-wire the speakers from the crossovers with? Cheers in advance from Australia!
Honestly can’t seriously comment on that all I would say is screw it all up tight and that is a really speaker
Thanks Kelvin. I enjoyed this interesting and informative video. I have a friend who tends to overate vintage B&O gear sound-wise and while I generally like the sound of their systems, I think that their equipment designs rather than their sound, set them apart as very advanced and classy looking kit for their time. PS. I have only recently noticed that the KLH brand has been revived and is producing modern versions of their original acoustic suspension speakers. Check them out if you get a chance.
Yes Bee and O were super expensive brand-new and great looking but they compare well to say the best Japanese stuff of the 70s
I will check out the KLH thanks K
Would have to agree with must of your review. Acquired a set locally ( posting no way) one was damaged. After repairing gave them to me son he loves them. Any planes for replacing upgrading cross overs in old speakers.Keep up the good work .
Another great video Kelvin. Your lack of bullshit review style is a trait that a few other TH-cam reviewers could learn from. Keep up the good work!
Best speaker reviews
Thanks.This is interesting to me. I have mostly vintage equipment. I've often wondered how my New Large Advent speakers with the "fried egg" tweeters would do against newer speakers like the LS50's. Overall, I'd describe the Advent's characteristics like you did the B&O's - though often it seems very much dependent on the recording. I also have a pair of Advent Laureates. They are more cohesive and very pleasant and easy to listen to. I'd like to take a step up or two in quality. What speakers would you say are markedly better than the LS50's but around the same price, or a bit more (I'm in the u.s. btw)? I'm also curious how much difference the Bluesound streamer makes. This does beg a lot of questions, but I'll stop here. Thanks for making the video. It was helpful.
- Cheers
the x factor you mention is what my father describe as what is impossible to overcome, namely the physical laws, a bigger speaker simply deliver a bigger sound due to the frame. We used to have garden or streetparties with my fathers 20 w speakers, homemade; It could be heard on the other streets.
Less needed power, less distortion.
It would be great if both Kef and B&W would return to build speakers ( made of wood and with a classic beautiful aesthetics)that looks like REAL speakers and not like vacuum cleaners
I agree, (and you may add Dyson to that vacuum cleaner) as sexy as they may or may not look now, I doubt they will age well.
I think that particular ship has sailed. Every decade or so, hifi goes through a lot of esthetic transformation as different materials and manufacturing techniques are discovered and utelised. Just look at gear by Metaxas and Sins, Avant Garde, Zingali, Steinway Lyngdorf, Devalier and Oracle to understand how far hifi design has really come.
@@andygee8716 klispch jbl Klh Wharfedale Magnat Elipse Tannoy are just a few names that are returning (tannoy and Klipsch have never stopped) to a real beautiful aesthetics , just check the incredible success in USA of the new Klh model 5 and you will undesrtand that ship is returning to the haven of reason.
@@margix1172 Reason for whom? Isn't hifi supposed to be subjective... One man's floor is another man's ceiling type thing? Retro will always be just that. Some will buy into it and others won't. In fact two of my most favourite loudspeakers ever are more than 30 years old: the Infinity IRS-V and Martin Logan CLS, (can't see the Infinity's ever being built again, though). What I'm saying is materials and manufacture have become better and some beautiful pieces have sprung from that.
Wharfdale Lintons
Great review. Appreciate your work a lot. I really wonder what you think about Kef 104aB. Especially compared to LS50 or ls3/5a. Keep up the nice work. Thanks!!
Yes well basically I’m a big fan of that era of Cath speakers cadenza concerto original Coda even Correlli and Another two-way I can’t remember that whole era of care feel really good after that it went downhill quite badly generally speaking
At the end of the day, which speaker brings a smile? Is the ultimate test for me these days!
great stuff
A quick question. Do you match levels when comparing speakers and if so how? Thanks again for really solid analysis of fascinating stuff!
Well yes I just change the volume you know but I tell you what was funny with these two speakers was I was never sure which ones were on because they were that similar
@@stereoreviewx Not quite double-blind :) but still impressive. Thanks!
a friend just gave me a pair of B&O 3800, Not tested them yet but all looks good going to put them on my Eagle Amp.. , great review.. 👍🏼
Do you have a review on the Leak 600, I have a pair that I find very good.? (update: just tested sound brilliant..)
It looks like a newly renovated Beovox, so that may be needed to be taken into evaluation when comparing price on old speakers vs newer.
Hi Kelvin, have you ever heard the budget Sony TA-70 from '73? I'm almost finished restoring one, the tones in the bass guitar are really noticeable
I’ve heard things similar Yes you get a lot of base texture this can be missing in modern amps
Hi Kelvin, interesting review.I got my hands on a pair of 3800s about a year ago, what attracted me was the goodmans bass and mid cones. I found the sound to be very scooped (decent triple and good bass and mids in the background) so not too fond of them but about 3 months ago I recapped the crossover which was very straightforward and it made a big difference (tighter bass and better sub bass and brought the mids more forward and highs a bit more crisp) wasn't expecting such a difference.
I was surprised you said your 3800 are very efficient because mine are not when compared with Kef 104abs the 3800s need more volume.I usually play these 3800s through a Sansui au6500 or a Kenwood da-9010.
Hope some day you might come across the wonderful Heybrook sextet speakers to review.
Very much enjoy your reviews.
I guess I was comparing with the KEFS regarding efficiency
Can you tell me how much you spent on capacitors please cheers K and thanks for the feedback
@@stereoreviewx don't know exactly how much because I also got caps for a pair of Goodmans Mezzo as well and a mate got some caps for a couple of pairs of Wharfedale E speakers but it wasn't a lot.
Got Mundorf ecaps for some pairs and standard Jantien caps for 3800s.
Were got in Hifi Collective.
Also.. The crossover is on a piece of hardboard rather than a circuit board and very easy to remove and replace caps.
Similar speakers?
With a huge price difference!
Great advert for buying used.
I would love to run the formula for intermodulation distortion on the two base drivers. It's very easy. You just need to know the cone area, frequency range, and excursion if I remember correctly. It requires no test equipment and is linked to psychoacoustic studies of perception. I suspect this may be the cause for what you hear as the relaxed sounding of the Beo's. Thanks again for another wonderful presentation! We share a love for vintage equipment!
Psychoacoustic you say
I think I’m scared of this concept is it a whole Nother Pandora’s box
@@stereoreviewx LoL. In many ways, I couldn't agree more! Again, thanks for your channel!
What the difrents normal speaker and amp speaker ??
Tnx
Nice review like always. I have a feeling that you might like speakers made by Finnish Pekka Tuomela. He made tons of different hifi speaker kits. Especially models Hifi 85/3, Hifi 85/B, Hifi 85/C and Hifi 85/D. Pretty much the same speakers, but 85/3 was the oldest and 85/D latest. They were DIY kits made in late 70's to late 90's. Hugely popular because you could get a lot speaker for the money. Also ready made speakers were made due to the huge popularity called BBX 485 so no need to build the box and crossover by yourself. They had 1" dome tweeter, 2" dome midrange and 10" bass in huge 85 liter reflex box tuned to 25Hz. I had one of those and sound was BIG. Bass extension straight down to 30Hz.
Interesting must say I’ve never heard the name even before but I’ll try everything I can get my hands on that half good anyway thanks for the info
I have a of Goodmans 'The Havants' using the same midrange and tweeter drivers. Detail and imaging up the wazoo for its diminutive 15W rating. Reveals harsh electronics very easily. They sound absolutely stunning on my Sansui A-4900.
Great stuff
Have you considered that there might be something wrong with your Kef's? I have never listened to the ls50, but nearly every review i heard about this speakers was rather praiseful.
The LS50s vocals are great, but there are several caveats. You can't just plop down LS50s on a resonating bookshelf, cabinet, table.......and expect them to sound very good. The LS50 cabinets are inert, but they will resonate (muddy bass which ruins everything, because everything is coming from the same point), so they must be decoupled and also solid. For every action there is an equal reaction (it's physics) and boxy (resonating) speakers disperse that energy as muddy sound though the cabinet. The LS50 cabinet doesn't resonate, so all the energy will transfer to what ever they are coupled (touching) with. The LS30 can produce super tight and natural sounding bass, but not if your bookshelf or wooden floor system is acting like the worlds most muddy subwoofer. Also, the LS50s are 85dB sensitivity and they dip down into the low 3ohms. Only very competent amps can properly control the LS50s. My LS50s sound amazing on my Parasound JC1 mono blocks, on solid sand filled metal stands, at least 1 meter from the wall and will a very sweet DAC. I have a lot of decent 150 watt high current amps and the LS50s sound pretty good, but it's not enough to make them really shine. I think most people would be happy with that sound, but not many would like the LS50s if they are using a mass market current limited amp or receiver.
The LS50s play what you give them and they will sound harsh in the highs and produce muddy bass if the front end can't keep up. The LS50s are actually way better than their price point and can keep playing up to at least a $20,000 front end. They are very finicky speakers, so they aren't for everyone not willing to give them what they need to sound great. As long as they aren't pushed to their limit (I fed them at least 150 watts from my mono blocks and they were rocking super tight bass in a big room and the entire range stayed very tight), I think people would be happy if they pair them with a decent quality high current amp and make sure they are decoupled from anything that will resonate.
I totally understand why many people don't like the LS50s, because when I first got them I placed them on top of tower speakers and I wasn't very impressed. After a few years of testing and realizing what the LS50s need, they are now one of my favorite speakers and I have much more expensive speakers.
There is also a lot of benefits (like sound staging) from having all the sound coming from a single source point. It's actually two drivers in the LS50s because the tweeter is independent from the mid base, but the midrange vocals disperse from the exact same trajectory as the highs from the tweeter. This gives the LS50s an airy sound. I have a pair of $2000 speakers from the 80s with 2 tweeter in each speaker, midrange and 12" woofers and the LS50s best them on everything, including max bass output when both driven to their max on a very good amp.
I'm not saying that some older speaker can't come close. I have a pair of Polk LS70s from 1992 and they can give my Kef R900s a run, but only on my better amps (particularly my mono blocks) because the LS70s dip down to 3ohm and are very hard to drive properly. I thought the LS70s were crap because I only had weak ass receivers 10 years ago. When it comes to hard to drive speakers amps totally matter. It's literally night and day difference. I almost sold the LS70s for $100 (what I paid for them ) and now they are one of my top three speakers.
You are absolutely right Kelvin . The KEF LS50 are over hyped forward sounding speakers. Just like the Audiolab 6000A amplifier which i used to own which was very harsh in the midrange and had a forward sounding treble.
that the voices are a bit distant or background alike in the bang and olufsens, may that have to do with the kind of small midrange driver, that has a diameter kind of small compared to other similar made speakters? Can that be a cause and so help us to identify such problem in the future, us likeing buying older speakers?
I got beovox 5000 mk III and M70, S45 and S25 amongs others....
Jbl 4312 monitor uses 12" unfiltered...so it goes to 1500 hz , and its nicely musical ....rogers had also a studio monitor with 12" polypro bass and audax dome tweeter....
I really enjoy your reaction to the general praise that the LS50 gets. It's not insulting or over the top. It's just a confident opposition the conventional impression about them. I'm not commenting on the LS50 at all because I haven't heard them, but it's nice to see someone be willing to express a bit of protest against a tidal wave of public opinion. I'm inclined to believe and trust your impressions, but in the end we all have to decide for ourselves, of course! I'm glad you gave your impressions. I always enjoy these videos, even in the rare times when I think I know what to expect.
Yes thanks Andy I mean a lot of people tell me they are great and I don’t think they’ve heard them
Interesting. Do you think you could play some content-free music as demo? Would be nice to compare them using some good headphones.
Yes I did do it once I will try again it’s very tricky to get it right
Why would you need either one of those??? When polk makes the t15. I don't get it.
Good 1970s speakers kick arse!
Wonder if you ever listened to Pioneer HPM 100 speakers in the day and if so, your take on them? I bet u would really like them
Yes they look interesting for sure
@@stereoreviewx Listened?
It comes down to a small concentric point source vs large drivers on a large baffle. Which produces the size and scale of real instruments? This is where small speakers sound small despite their other virtues. Big speakers may lack image focus and pin sharp detailing of something like an LS50 but if you want a life sized sound that approximate the scale of real instruments you need big speakers. The ideal speaker would encompass the virtues of both design schools.
The Goodmans bass driver is a Type 112/1251/8 and was originaly used in a Goodmans 2-way speaker.
And thats the reason why it has a coated membran,to extent the usable frequency range and dampen the cone
breakup resonances to some extent and to uncomplicate a proper working low pass filter.
I bet in the Beovox 3800 the cut off frequency of the bass driver is rather unusual high for a 3-way,with the nice
consequence to need way cheaper (because smaller values) parts in the low pass filter. Anyway,the bass driver
is a typical for its time high Qts/low Vas piece that can be easily fitted in smaller volumes although it will show
a peak in the bass frequency response and than a quickly dropping curve towards lower frequencies. So its obvious
why you said this is a bass first speaker.
Well,the Beovox 3800 strikes me as a very economicly focused old school construction and it is miles behind from
what the british were up to - qualitywise - back then.
Great info thanks a lot
K
I think it's a Philips AD 0140/T(4/8) tweeter. I had some in 70th when I built my own louspeakers (all Philips drivers). They are great. Later I use AD 0163. Even better.
Hi Kelvin. Thanks for the super informative and entertaining reviews. You've got me interested in the B&O 3800 speaker simply because of that 12" woofer. Beoworld state the woofer is 12" and the dimensions of the cabinet are 58cm high x 29cm wide x 29cms deep. However, unless B&O have created a TARDIS, a 12" (30.5cm) woofer should not be able to fit ! Either the dimensions are wrong, Goodmans has short changed them, or those Danes are really good engineers ! Cheers, Paul.
Yes I might get the tape measure out now sometimes people measure from different points you know
It's a 10" woofer from goodmans, same frame as used in the original mezzo.
@@rossgardiner7166 And in some Radford speakers I believe.
wondering if you have listened to the beovox 5700 speakers?
I haven’t but you just know they sound great because the mid range and the celestion super tweeter
And interestingly I like that configuration of drive units I have a pair of Gail 401s in Repair with the same configuration can’t wait to hear them
Brilliant mate, can you do a Beovox Red Line review.? ..
Yes I am interested in them I think they go quite cheap because no one likes the big shape
@@stereoreviewx Thanks Kelvin. I have/am experimenting with a few of these at the moment. the 40.5's and the 140's are interesting..:) Bargains!
I am getting older, riher and deafer.
What to do to keep enjoying the HiFi sound?
Subwoofer you still feel it
The bass shortcomings is likely called dampening factor from what I remember
I think the damping factor is a property of an amplifier.
@@strannostrannovasrr No, speakers for sure
would an Arcam 8 amp be sufficient for the Beovoxes?
Sure
How about those tall and thin B&O speakers, do they sound any good?
no
If you want a really good vintage B&O speaker, try listening to the Beovox M-100's. It's got 5 drivers: 12" woofer, a "filler driver" (part of their Uni-Phase design), a dome midrange, a tweeter and a super-tweeter. Sold mine, and now I'm considering bying another pair, when I get myself a larger house (they sound best in a larger room). Remember to check the surroundings on the filler driver, they rot away after approx 15 years.
Not fan of the tall thin ones.
I have Beolab Pentas as well as Beovox 100.2s - the latter are one of the largest passive speakers made by B&O and are great - I use them with a BM4401 but also have in the same room the Pentas. The Pentas are very good and give the M100s a good run for their money but the bass is not quite as detailed - probably due to the bass being provided by multiple small drive units. Although they are very tall, they have stainless steel covered boxes so actually are more house friendly than the big M100s - those these are probably the best wood finish of any B&O speaker.
A friend and I did a comparison test with 3800s against M100s, MS150s, Pentas and a few others. I liked the M100s the best.
Wish you also reviewed some Japanese speakers.. Yamaha,
Those Philips tweeters on the Beo's are known to be NOT flat, but can still sound quite nice with the right C/O network. The reason he states "similar sound" (despite size) is because the Beo's don't go very low, and placed near
corners will just boom. The KEF's, with newer tech. have better THD. And yes, with bigger boxes & high efficiency
the BEO's WILL tend to have that 'impressive factor' - especially when it comes to 'filling the room' with sound.
Yes, love it. Bo sweat. I'd take a kef over a bo. Better forgotten? Nice video.
I'd love to compare my old original Mission 770 to those KEF.
Loved my Mission 770's. There's something about a 2 way speaker. They imaged great.
@@johnmann726 They were amazing. Unfortunately the foam surround deteriorated on the mid/bass drivers, a common fault with Missions of that era.
The smaller sized KEF LS 50 may produce similar bass levels as the larger Beovox but the Beovox's bass sounds more musical than the smaller KEF. Very, very little progress in the past 40 years indeed. 🤔
La electrónica japonesa se ha desplomado.
Try the Beolab 90 and your world will change.
Top revue, the cone from the ls50 is too small , thats why the mofi is a 10" unicue....the more the cone has to move , the higher the linear distortion...in pa pro they say all that is smaller then a 12" is a midspeaker....
Emblematic when somebody chooses a vintage speaker over the modern one which shows the progress has been very slow on this side of the isle. When that modern speaker happens to be a so much acclaimed KEF LS 50 then it turns puzzling to say the least.
Specially when the biggest fans are TH-cam reviewers that seem to be well respected. It makes you wonder....
One of the main reasons why I like vintage is that they are just about all Made in Japan...NOT CHINA!!!
Yes and other people have said this to
Hey Kelvin. If possible I`d give you three thumbs up 😎👍👍👍😎
If you like good design and ok sound B & O is for you. If you like exceptional sound and ok design then KEF, hands down (based on specs + reviews, I still have to audition it live). I have a vintage KEF C10 and it still sounds 6/10. My Beovox (idk the model) sounds 2/10, has left my house long, long, long time ago.
Well I don’t really agree with the sentiment they’re mostly because the KEF’s just don’t sound any good they look like something from Star Trek but they disappoint I got some serious problems
Hi there Kelvin, just a little update... I did manage to track down a pair of Celestion 332s from a man in Germany who'd collected a whole range of Dittons and swore that the 332 were one of his favs. I am very much taken with them, and certainly the best i've had so far, including since we last spoke, some klipsch tangent 10s (great bass, but slightly shouty tweeter) and quadral argent 80s (full big sound, strong bass, but not detailed like the 332s). The 332s have amazing mids and suit themselves to reproducing instruments of all kinds.
I have upgraded also from the Quad 33 Pre, to a NAD 1240 preamp into my Quad 303 and this is a set-up which I've been enjoying. But the world turns... Now on the search for a reasonably priced subwoofer, front-firing , which won't piss off the neighbours too much, the 332s do lack a little bass. I also need to sell some of my growing collection. I am curious also about finding an amp which goes a little into the lower frequencies, I am tempted by your sansui recommendations, but also am very impressed by harman kardon. All the best, and thanks !
Interesting stuff thanks for the info
Don’t know if you’ll get better base from the Sansui than a 303
Just to say make sure the base driver screws are snug you know and the mid don’t overtighten
Cheers K
a lot of bang olufsen speakers are active with self contained amps and active cross 0vers which goes some way to explaining expensive prices .
Come back, Kelvin ❤
45 years old screaming for a recap! I'm going to do it to my 3702's (same mid an high) Maybe even replace the tweeters. I believe the successors the s-45 are valued more. They have plastic fronts with a bit of an angle to them.
Yes the S 45 seems to be quite well regarded
Do you have any choices for changing that Twitter because the first thing I thought about with that speaker was I wish I could change the Twitter
@@stereoreviewx I have been thinking about those tweeters in the Beovox 3700 you reviewed or maybe the ones used in the S 45. I have to check impedance again though. I will first recap them to see how they sound and then decide about what tweeter would be a good alternative.
So the latest word in speaker technology produces BeoVox sound in a small package with less sensitivity. And the average TH-cam reviewer wants us to believe we have come a long way. That never made sense to me because speaker technology has not fundamentally changed at all. So my suspicions are confirmed (only) here with a direct comparison.
The modern trend is for smaller speakers but you'd think a bigger LS50 could be something great.
I really enjoy your videos. But now that we are talking audio, you should consider buying yourself a better microphone.
I'm not sure this is a good comparison, they are a different size, maybe compare the Beovox to a big pair of JBLs ?!
First, I couldnt agree more about the Kefs. I was excited when I first had a chance to listen to them but I was really baffled. I was very disappointed, boring, flat and compressed as he says, and just uninteresting, especially for their premium price.
About older speakers, the industry really wants you to believe there's been a lot of progress the last 40-50 years. I have to really question that. I have about 25 pair of speakers, some mid range, but also higher end models. I've been a speaker constructor and builder since the early 80s so I think I got a fair amount of experience in the field. Now, there are many very good sounding vintage speakers that are as good or in many cases better than what you will find today. Especially when you consider value for money. There really has not been many major improvements in speaker technology for the last 4 decades in my experience. What I have been experiencing though is cost cutting in materials and construction, replacing metal with plastics and so on.
Bang & Olufsen disproving the theory that you can't put a square in a round hole... Just clamp it, JBL style. Talk about cobbled together!!!
Yet they manage to produce the same sound as a modern KEF LS50 but with more sensitivity.
@@hugobloemers4425 Kelvin said it was a similar sound, not the same. He said that the B&O's midrange was a little reticent compared to the KEF. Even some very expensive speakers don't look all that with their grilles removed.
The 3800 is a good speaker - they came with beautiful trumpet stands. The European model was the 4700 but that only had 7.5" woofers though it had two of them or the 5700 which had a 10" woofer. 12" woofers avoided purchase tax. I wonder if you may need to change the capacitors in the cross over if the treble is a bit dull. B&O speakers were often tailored to go with the relevant Beomaster and this would use the BM3000. The 3800 was replaced by the S60 aND BM4000 which was replaced by the S75/M75 and BM4400.
Thanks for the info
A sound demo would be heaps more useful.
Really thru a phone or laptop
You sure spew irrational bs.
that midrange driver looks like it was bodged into place
The fronts were really never meant to be taken of I guess. Most 3700 and 3800 have these mids. (mine are slightly different. They are round).
A more vintage recording of your voice on this one I notice.....
That’s interesting tell me exactly what you mean please because I’m never sure what the sound is like on the other end and I change some settings from time to time
@@stereoreviewx it's almost like a radio interview voice.....you have lost depth.....thickness.....but I like it.....it's retro
What those "rich people" do when they buy B&O (or Linn) is that they value their time extremely high, they don't have years to figure out what their "sound" is, what components have synergies or where the best deals are etc. To these people buying these "expensive" turn-key systems can actually be the cheapest option. You're paying a fair bit for the sound, and the build quality and the design. But perhaps what you're really paying for is the turn-key experience and ease of use, someone else has already figured out the overall system for you.
I totally agree. I dislike KEF LS50 too 😀
Never heard them, but they look dreadful!
Was testing 5 hours of different speakers in an Audio shop, and after 15 minutes I personally had enough of the KEF LS50s. For their size they can be considered good, which is why they got their awards, but after test pressing Cambridge, Dynaudio, Klipsch RP-8000Fs. To me everything blew them out into the water. I hated the KEFs.
- Just like Mr. Stereo review X said: A good amp forgives a lot as it presses more out of the Speakers. However, for me it was something about the LS50's nature that irked me. Ended up with a pair of Klipsch RP-8000F:s ultimately. I would get the vintage Beovox speakers as well from these two. "You need more clarity the older you get(from the speakers), better start now", that was my motto.
As a first time viewer I'm not impressed. Many LS50 reviewers have stated that you need a good Amp to bring out the 'good bits' of the LS50's, and I am guessing you used Naim Amps to drive them? I might have missed what you used, as I was laughing too much. Thanks for the comedic input.
Naim Amps, like the LS50's, are highly rated, but when setting up a system you need to partner equipment to get synergy. In my experience of Naim and LS50's, they are both clean, and to me a little on the thin side. No synergy there. So as you experienced, not a good sound.
"A not so good amplifier, like Aiwa or a Pioneer." Man, that is bound to upset a good chunk of the vintage Hi-Fi community! Aiwa, sure, but the Pioneer receivers from the '70s are going for mad money on auction sites these days, just like Sansui.
The pioneer are but they don’t sound anywhere near as good I just look great
Don’t care about small boxes. My homemade 17 driver hexagon speakers got a 200 l cabinet. Tweeter midrange closed, bass cabinet is ported. Listing to real highend speakers i must say mine is better. Many small drivers is mutch better than few big. Big speakers got a mutch bigger body and less compressien.Just making music sound more real.
Yes I’m always a fan of big speakers the myth of the big sounding small speaker is exactly that it would seem
have you listened to Pioneer CS-53 speakers? I'm picking up a pair tomorrow...I'm so excited that I'll prob be jizzing in my pantz when I touch them!
Quem vai querer um dinossauro desses em casa?
It’s interesting that Kelvin reckons the sound of a biggish old one is similar to a small new one. What about comparing a biggish old one with a biggish new one, please? (I’m a floorstander nut!). I love the sound of my own Mission 774 speakers for classical music though I ‘d be the first to agree they don’t have thumping bass, thank God. I’ve owned and heard all sorts of B&O receivers, CD player, speakers and turntable over 50 years and the only thing I was disappointed with, ie thought it was poor quality for the money, was the cheaper of the famous parallel tracking turntables. Lovely looks but frankly no better sound than an early Pro-ject Debut turntable I also had at the time.
As someone who spent many years testing repairing and modifying Philips and associated companies products, speakers were often a pure accident, they should've been good and weren't, or the opposite, defying logic or explanations..
The ls50s sound great on a high end system as I heard at a show. I think you are being a bit unfair to them. You can get them cheap and have more money for a great amp and source
I also have listened at showroom and didn’t liked the sound at all.
those small speakers look like car speakers..not impressive
Ouch !!! .. the industry is going to get this channel taken down if you keep dropping the truth !!
The industry darling £600 speaker sounds no better than a thing that could well be picked up at a
car-boot for £ 20 !!
In many ways these 2 are similar .. B&O were always disliked as they were classed as a " lifestyle" product
that put form over function . I've always thought the LS 50 were the same , they no doubt sound good
for the size and look the part but they must have a Huge profit margin as the actual material worth ,
production and transport cost must be minimal .
Try getting cartridges for their record players.....actually don't bother just buy equipment optimised for sound in the first place. It's not snobbery it's not being taken for a ride.
Yes I know those parts are madly expensive
Soundsmith produce the cartridges on license.
I'm not a fan of the LS50 either.
Its strange how Tannoy make dual concentric drivers that sound good, and how KEF are so bad at it...
Yes how hard can it be a been at it for about 15 years
Nobody really loves LS50's:)
God I’ve received a lot of angry mail because I don’t like those speakers often I think it’s from people that haven’t even heard them but now they’ve been given five stars