4 Link Suspension Explained - Rock Rods Tech
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 พ.ค. 2024
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On this episode of Rock Rods Tech Jake Burkey teaches us about the dos and donts of building a double triangulated 4 link suspension. Whether it is for a Jeep, rock bouncer, rock crawler or even a race car the principles are the same. This video will help you on build so you can get the right setup
Check out our website for all of the parts you need for your build - www.bustedknuckleoffroad.com
Also see our video on Anti Squat and Anti Dive and how it affects the way your suspension works- • Anti Dive and Anti Squ...
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th-cam.com/channels/bOUUPmH1YoFXHRQuZarA5A.html
Jake you are the only one that makes people understand what is all about 4 link
You help me a lot to understand what and how to do it
These 3 videos about 4 link are more than treasure to me and for most of us that want to build a reliable 4 link suspension
Thank you .... i wish i could thank you in person but i am far away from there
Thank you we are glad it helps so many people enjoy their builds that much more.
I learned more in the 12 minutes I spent watching this video than I have in the 12 years I've spent in grade school/high school
Jake is a good teacher
This is by far one of the best 4 link videos. I've came back to it many times for reference
Jake knows his stuff
Great videos!!!! Keep it coming, it's now the first channel I check for new vids.
Really appreciate the actual useful info. Not many people on the internet genuinely just trying to give good info. Trying to build a prerunner and would love a 4 link rear.
glad we could help, check out anti squat and anti dive video as well th-cam.com/video/UzayUxQCWaY/w-d-xo.html
Great, informative video. I’m almost embarrassed to say that I’m using this information to build an RC crawler, but there it is.
nothing wrong with that, geometry always works
Haha, I'm here via search for the same 😎
Awesome! Extremely informative. I'm not even building a crawler, but the theories you explained here are very applicable to vehicle steering and suspension. This video was certainly worth the time.
The ONLY point I can pick at is the difference in volume in video segments haha. Thanks for taking the time.
glad to help!
Very timely instruction for me. Thanks for going to the trouble of putting these videos together. Very much appreciated!
Looking forward to the next one for sure.
+Tim Diebert thanks for watching
Thank you very much for this series!!! we have 3 jeeps all on leaves. im ready to take the link plunge and do this!! will be following!!!!
Its not too bad. well worth the end result for sure!
Good stuff. I've been out of 4 wheeling for awhile due to life. Before life happened I was in the parts acquisition stage of building my Jeep. Since then I landed a sheet metal apprenticeship and to finish it out we do a project of our own for our 5th year. I decided I was going throw out all my brackets, tabs, skids, misc sheetmetal parts, build all of it myself, and finish my suspension. This, along with your anti-squat video, are really good refreshers. I just wanted to say thanks for sharing all this good information.
Glad we could help. Hit us up if you need any parts www.bustedknuckleoffroad.com
Will do. I'm only doing the sheetmetal stuff. I'll still need all sorts of other stuff. lol
Keep these tec tip coming . Im planning on buildind a ford ranger into a rock crawler trail rig and this is the kind of stuff i need to know
We have more coming down the pipeline soon!
I watch all the videos and your amazing at explaining everything in detail
we appreciate that. thanks for watching!
Thanks for this very informative video!! I'm working on putting Dana 44 front and rear under an old D-21 Nissan extended cab. Also dropping in a Ford 351/automatic.
sounds like a fun project
Voice of gold....stay golden BURKEY.
More Tech vids coming soon!
Thank you. The video has helped me. Trying to triangulate the front. And remount track bar to match steering geometry. Using a wider axle. My triangulation degree needs more on wider axle. Thanks again.
glad it helped
Outstanding video. Very well made and presented. I have quite a bit of learning ahead of me before I built this!
stay tuned for more
Have you thought about doing a video on choosing ride height or picking the right shocks? I believe that would go really good with your other suspension videos.
+Aric Lewis possibly
awesome videos! this helped explain a lot of the questions ive had after many hours of reading on pirate where its not always easy to find actual answers!!
glad to help!
Dig the lesson. First attempt here for the consideration of the 1965 CJ5. Like the clarity in the education and simplified for us newbs
hope it helps
thx, using some of your tips with some past attempts and using to hopefully overcome some past challenges!
get that suspension right and let us know if you need parts www.bustedknuckleoffroad.com
Sounds like you know these things from experience. Best kind of knowledge. I'm building a project in my mind, before I start the actual work. This has really helped. I appreciate the video. Hope youtube pays you guys well.
glad it helps!
You're awesome man. Keep up the great teaching!
I appreciate that!
Amazing info mate ... really helpful to finally have somebody talk numbers instead of vague principles ;-) Definitively will be using this info in my coming buggy build !!!
Glad to help out, let us know if you need any parts for the build
Excellent crash course and a lot of excellent info!! Thank you!
Glad it helped
@@BustedKnuckleVideo
How do you determine/set ride height on a rock crawler/ bouncer? Obviously lower the COG is best but how do you balance COG with ground clearance and shock travel?
We try to find the best balance of all 3
Awesome Jake, Great idea making these video's. Keepum comin
+Shane B. more on the way
I work as a car chief on a nitro funny car and have no clue about this stuff but I have watched your vids for about 3 years and from them I have learned quite a bit. I also learned I live 1 mile away from Randy Slawson . He is letting me help race prep his rig , now I just wish KOH didn't conflict with NHRA so I could be out there to watch! Keeps it coming AWSOME job
Very cool! Randy will know a lot of information on how to tune a 4 link and even more about chromolly fabrication. My next videos will be aimed at the advanced fabricator looking to get more performance out of their link design.
+Jake Burkey Keep up the good work!
Going try apply this knowledge to my rc crawler / bouncer especially the link placement
should work the same
Great video! Excited for the rest to follow!
+Mike Moore we have a lot on tap to teach.
Thanks very informative. I always look forward to watching your videos.
+Eddie Rodriguez thanks we have a lot more in store
I learn a lot from you technically and theoretically. Endless thanks you are awesome
Awesome! Thank you!
I've just started getting into wheeling this year and have a long way to go in my 4wheel education. Although I'm in a rock crawler and not a bouncer, a lot of this information works for both setups and is very helpful. Thanks for taking the time to put these videos together. Would you be able to one discussing roll cages regarding design & fabrication and what are some "do's" and don'ts"? I'd like to build a new roll cage but not sure where to start from a design standpoint and where to take it from there.
+ctcutler Ill see what we can do
Great class teacher! Thanks for you're time and expertise
More to come!
Great video thanks... Look forward to the rest of the series
+Brett p thanks
+BustedKnuckleVideo to be honest i can only watch so many videos of trucks running... but give me facts and data and technical info... that stuff i can watch for hours if i am learning...
Thanks Jerry T for sharing. Good engineering knowledge right here!!!
Jake knows his stuff
I had a question for 35" tall tires or the metric equivalent would a factory Jeep Wrangler wheelbase need to be stretched out to 95"-100" or would the stock 93.5" or so wheelbase be fine to be for general offroad use? I do plan on using slightly wider (built Ford 8.8) axles if that makes any difference. Thanks
Really helped explain, putting a 4 link on my drag s10 here soon🤘🏾
awesome also see this video- th-cam.com/video/UzayUxQCWaY/w-d-xo.html
Amazing video exactly what i was looking for for four link info
Glad we could help! Check out the entire Rock Rods Tech Tip Series
Super informative, great video. Thanks.
Glad it was helpful!
Still a great video and explanation.
Thanks for taking the time to make this video👍👍🔥🔥
Glad it was helpful!
Wow what a great informed video with great videos. Keep that up.
Thanks, will do!
I'm designing my rig at the moment. When are the next videos coming out with roll centres and all that?!
Great info from a specialist, just what I needed!
+Philip Antoniou Anti Squat and Anti Dive video is uploading now!
+BustedKnuckleVideo are you sure? I can't find them on your feed!
+Philip Antoniou th-cam.com/video/UzayUxQCWaY/w-d-xo.html
Now that was a great vid. Alot of stuff I forgot and didn't know.
+prancstaman it turned out great.
Jus saw this video, Love BustedKnuckle and Jake Burkey:Knowledge and Fun🍻
Thanks Reagan!
damn....awesome data! Loved the broomstick / link angle comparison.
+Tony Bolton Jake knows his stuff
Fantastic video thanks for the info, Jake.
Thanks for tuning in!
Perfect! Thank you.
👍
Awesome clip, it would have been good to see before I built mine. I'm in line with everything you said except in the rear my top links are longer than the bottom ones. Its duel triangulation about 3" longer. What will be that affect. Thanks Again.
Using your knowledge for my RC build.
good call
This video was extremely helpful. 👍
glad it helped
Thanks for the great video... I'm starting a build using rockwells and noticed a lot of people use a single triangulated (lower) and parallel uppers due to the large chunk up top. The rear should not be a problem for double triangulated 4 link but the front is a challenge. Would you mind (if and when you time) doing a video like this one about doing single triangulated 4 link? Thanks again! Keep up the good work!
+Boris Morris a single triangulated 4 link is not recommended.
AWSOME vid!!! Very informative!!
+Nick Holm thanks
Thank you Jake .
he knows his stuff
Great informative vids!! Thanks for breaking it all down.☠️
Glad to help!
Do you have an IFS geometry video? I want to know if I can move my upper a-arm pivot point back and up. And lengthen my upper a-arms to get more wheel travel. On a 2014 ram1500.
Great video thanks for all the information. I can't wait for more videos explaining the technical stuff. I've been searching and searching online for a video about building a 4 link, there are almost none.
Do you want to try to triangulate the lower links as much as possible? I noticed some people make the "frame side" of lower links really close together, and mount them on a cross member. But some people only give the lower links a little bit of triangulation, and just mount them to the frame rails.
I know it has something to do with, and can change your roll axis/center. Maybe you will touch on that in a future video, and I'm just jumping the gun. But is there a preference?
+Jake McGibbon Lower links triangulated more will help protect the driveshaft from rocks but will not be as predictable at high speeds as lowers that are a little farther apart.
Great video.
Lots of knowledge
Best video on TH-cam I’ve seen in years! 🙌💪🔥
Thanks!
Awesome information!!!
Glad it was helpful!
Very good info!! Thanks
glad to help
Really helpful video thanks
Glad to help
great video! currently doing my own mini build, just a lightly offroaded TJ, was thinking about doing a three link with a track bar for the front, could you do a video like this but for three link setups?
+rampage577 we dont do those for bouncers
Great video - Very interesting!
+Scott Walsh jake knows his stuff
It would be awesome if you did a video on 3 link setup and design.
we don't really do 3 links
I have a question on the angle of arms you say around 60 degrees is what you shoot for is that between the two arms or each arm parrelel from the vehicle ? Thanks
Great video. Thanks!
You bet!
Great video
Thanks
Hi I'm looking for some advice if you don't mind...
OK I have a toyota hilux double cab and I'm wanting to use a triangulated 4 link on the rear, but I also want to extend the frame so I can fit an extended tub. Would it be better to:
Cut and put a piece inbetween
Or
just weld on a piece it at the rear?
can i take this class instead of physics
if only that was an option, hello class my name is Professor Burkey HAHA
If you watched it, you just took it... ; )
Hi Jake, Thank You so much for the high quality parts you sent! I completed the front four link with limited geometry due to obstructions, however in the rear I have more room and was wondering how the upper and lower link horizontal spread at the narrow ends effect travel and articulation characteristics? Should they be as close as possible? Or are there aspects I should be considering when choosing the link bracket mount locations? Thank You!
close as possible at the narrow end within reason.
thanks a ton for the info!
glad to help
thanks!
subscribed.
thanks we have more Rock Rods Tech on the way!
amazing thanks for making this video
thanks for watching
do you have any advice for a first time builder
watch all of these videos lol, and make sure you do it right the first time or it will cost way more in the long run
Great info . thank you
thanks for tuning in!
great information!!!! great videos!!!!
+jeff young thanks more on the way
Looking to 4 link an 05 ram, great info!
good idea
Very informative
Jake knows his stuff
So I’m building my first linked suspension system. Mine is having issues. I’ve tried adjusting castor with no results. All my links are right and my track bar is tight. All my brackets and components are new. The only difference I can see from what you’ve described is my lower control arm angles. They’re steep at about 14 degrees. Would this cause my jeep to wander? What reaction do you usually get out of a suspension with too steep of lower control arms?
Jake, in the TRIAGED program, when entering the link length, is it the actual heim to heim length?
good stuff
Thanks
Does keeping the upper and lower link bars the same length work for a single triangulated 4 link system or is it just for double triangulated system? My truck is offroad only and we set the rear up with shorter upper link bars than the bottom.
If you only run single u joints at each end of the front drive or rear drive shaft then the pinion angle should be the same angle as the transmission output and not pointing at the transmission. For example. My jk has a 4.0 swap and I intentionally mounted the engine and transmission level with the frame. So I can run lots of castor angle and single u joints each end. Great video.
Jake will have to answer that
very good!!!
+Brad Kovacs thanks!
hey great video! very informational! however i have a question. You say try and keep the upper links flat and the lower at around max 10 degrees. Is this at full bump or at ride height?
ride height
GREAT video!! Thanks! How much of a difference do you think the shorter upper front links make for on road use. I see lots of 3 link + panhard kits using combination brackets (combines upper & lower mounts) for the frame and I'm wondering if this means I should avoid them and get individual brackets so I can do a shorter upper. I'm building an Jeep LJ on 40s and expect 75% road/25% off road use.
I would go with individual brackets
awesome video lots and lots of information planning on 4 linking some 2003 f350 superduty axles under my 89 xj because i keep blowing apart the front dana 30... this is my first major fab project so i will be sure to watch this about 30 more times or so ... any tips out there would be appreciated !
Watch all of the Rock Rods Tech videos and you should be fine. Also if you need any parts to help your build along we can help you out at www.bustedknuckleoffroad.com
+BustedKnuckleVideo thanks for the support great channle keep it up !!
will do thanks for watching!
I love the video. So when running a cv driveshaft you want the pinion pointed at tcase throughout the suspension cycle correct? And to do that you make your links approx the same length?
you want it to point at the tcase that is correct, links are not the same length though, that also depends on link mounts
Mr. Jake great vid, Do you have a hiem joint recommendation?
we sell some quality ones over at www.bustedknuckleoffroad.com
I need your help on double triangulated. I have 48 degree on the bottom and 30 degree on the top I know it’s not right but I’ve seen straights on the top my issue is side to side movement shud there be zero movement
for the love all things that are holy thank you for this video after reading 22 pages on pirate and still scratching my head this just answered alot of questions for me. how do yall tap the 7075 AL tho @ a machine shop just know the pitch of te threads for the rod ends that you are using?
+Bobby Christiansen Machine shop can take care of it for ya.
Does the same geometry apply if you just link the front? I was thinking that keeping my rear leafs would keep me stable? Great videos!
Yes the geometry is the same
Hello, I want to improve my suspension, and I'm very happy with your videos, solving several problems! But I have a question, in 6:50 + -, you speak at least 40 angles, what reference, from what point? Does your picture on the board have the right angles? Big hug and thank you!
the ground or chassis, both being parallel are the point of reference for angles
Thank you! You deserve all success!
Thanks, let us know if we have any more questions.
Loved the video. But what about angling the links inward? You said 40* minimum 60* is best. It’s fuzzy on that part
awesome vid! do alot of these general rules carry over to 3 link suspensions as well?
many of them do, yes just make sure the panhard and drag link are parallel to each other
BustedKnuckleVideo I have 2 door jk 2013. If I want to offroading in high speed and jumping like king of hammers do. should I do stretch kit for longer wheel base?
It would help!
Hey Jake...Great information on 4-linking. I just have a quick question related to triangulation. In the rear of the vehicle, can the four links be setup with the upper arms straight (essentially running under the frame) and the lower arms be crossing with no track bar? Wouldn't this design setup (single triangulation in the absence of a track bar) lead to a rear steer issue and stability problem with the vehicle??? Would really appreciate your expertise on this question. Thanks - DMZ
It won't have near the control of a traditional double triangulated four link.
Thank you sir
glad to help
sir
four link suspension is helpful for electric tractor ( two wheel drive) for front wheels ?
Which it is having 44 inches wheel base and 32 inches track width
Thanks for these vids. Now I have to go see how bad I screwed my links up. Lol
+Alex Worobetz lol it makes a big difference
Is there any info on the buggy at 1:35? Would like to follow them and see more of that buggy/jeep! Thanks in advance
That is a samurai buggy
Not sure if the same rules apply here but im getting ready to start a mega mud truck build on my f350 superduty using 2.5 rockwell toploads. Alot of people tell me the upper and lower link bars need to be the same length and have the same link seperation at the axle as they do at the subframe. Along with a 15* link rise. And to keep the lower links parallel and only have the upper link triangulated.... any input would be greatly appreciated
That is a whole different ball game as you are wanting the suspension to do different things in a mud truck
Do I Understand you correct?
Identical length on the upper and lower links keeps your pinion pointing towards the transfer case. And shorter upper links keeps your caster even? I found it to be the other way arround when i designed my suspension?
Also, With the pinion pointing towars the transfer case all the time you would need a double cardan drive shaft to avoid phasing. And that would be a week link in Your driveline
Double cardan is far better than your other options, like a slip yoke driveshaft.
Equal length bars essentially acts like a radius arm you see on most cheap long arm kits. Your caster changes in relation to your single pivot point (the frame mount) but your differential will always be pointing at the transfer case keeping your double cardan in it's optimal position where everything is still spinning smooth. Radius arms are cheap and effective for weekend warriors, not the rockbouncers these guys usually see. That's where 3-link/4-link/double triangulated 4 link are king.
With unequal length (shorter upper) your primary pivot point is now the axle side lower control arm joint. As your flex your caster will stay the same (ideal for on road vehicles) but as your suspension cycles down the pinion will no longer point directly at the transfer case. This is where you start to get into issues with the double cardan driveshaft. It's not longer in it's happy place, the U-joints now want to bind being at such an angle.