Been drinking Bourbon for decades and what has happened to the Bourbon Community sickens me. There is no way you will ever get me to believe that Bourbon Outfitters was going to buy 500 cases of Blanton's from Denmark and NOT know something wasn't right.
Great episode Randy. I just find it a little difficult to believe that individuals like Justins would not be suspicious of someone selling that much blantons at once, who would have so many cases just sitting around?
Even though JHOB is not directly implicated in the possible counterfeiting of Blanton's, at the very best they were unconcerned if the product was counterfeit or not...they were still willing to sell it (at exorbitant prices I might add) and should have both, been aware of the possibility of counterfeits and questioned the legitimacy of such large quantities from a single source!
Who is your source for them being unconcerned? MustHaveMalts.com is a trusted source to many who buy from overseas online retailers. Do you have some information that the public needs to be aware of, or is this just conjecture?
@@BourbonRealTalk do you have any evidence that they were concerned enough to do anything about it, or be suspicious at all about the vast quantity available to them? Did they refuse to sell any if it before finding out more? How about having bottles without labels? Did they have labels without bottles, or vice versa?
@@greasyghost The 600 cases or 600 bottles (not sure if the report was accurate or not) was put in voluntary detention by the investigators. After investigation the inventory was released back to JHOB and they are now selling it as it was determined to be authentic. The conjecture that they would knowingly sell a fake is silly. They have a huge successful business with or without Blanton's. There is no logical business person who would think they could pass off 600-3600 fakes and not get caught. The public would know, and their business would be over and they would go to jail. I know people are skeptical and want to believe every successful business is out to get them, but logic dictates that self preservation would win out even if they were inclined to cheat (which there is no evidence of).
These outdated laws need to change desperately, especially here in TX. This isn't the 1930s. I want to be able to buy whiskey 7 days a week, through the mail, and in grocery stores, like most other states.
Appreciate the coverage and the honesty of your bias. I am relatively new to back into Bourbon about 3 months so I think you did a solid job of covering this. The specific portion of the video where your covered how guns (which i legally own) can be transferred between individuals but booze cannot was SPOT ON! Appreciate the content and your personal story to end every video has made me a follower. Had a friend who struggled with some suicidal thoughts for a while and it was just crazy. Kudos to you for bringing awareness to this issue.
Why is it your opinion that they had no idea the bottles were counterfeit? Don't you think someone so versed in liquor sales, like Justin's, wouldn't find it odd that an overseas operation would have that sheer volume of Blantons? Seems odd...
Because I know these guys and they are not dishonest. Plus, I know people who have imported cases from Europe for years, and there have been no indications that an outfit like the ones they were buying from would be involved with counterfeiting. IMO if you want to accuse an otherwise honest business of fraud there needs to have more than just conjecture.
@BourbonRealTalk Come on man, 500 CASES of Blantons! That's not the same as a case or two.. or even 50 cases of Jack Daniel's. Again, this is FUVE HUNDRED CASES of one of the hardest to find, most desirable, bourbons on the planet. You may want to consider a disassociation asap.
@@mozzie22 I understand your point, but I won't accuse someone on conjecture. If they had the foggiest idea that it was fraudulent why did they open tell the investigator about it? I just don't believe they had any idea.
@@BourbonRealTalk I believe the warehouse employee making maybe $20 an hour didn't have any idea...or maybe he did suspect something didn't smell right and was happy to spill the beans while he was surrounded by federal agents and being questioned about the goings on there!
Agree with everything you mentioned about the tier laws. If they did make individual to individual sales legal, I see a need for consultants to verify authenticity. That would be a great business to get into.
I think we as individuals can decide to take the risk in a private transaction, but when potentially altered bottles are going back into the 3 tier system the risk of a counterfeit being sold to an unsuspecting customer goes way up.
Great show Randy and yes there’s a double standard here. It seems to me…. to be about the $$$ and control. I wanted to get bottles of the PG shipped to Kansas as simple as the process should be it was more challenging than I imagined. Ended up shipping to an address in Texas to keep it legal. Yes inconvenience and still ended up getting the bottles. Thank you for your help on the matter it was easier to go to Texas and visit family. We all need to be aware of the counterfeit market. Always enjoy your input 👏🏼
I'm very reluctant to buy online and have it shipped. I always thought shipping of any whiskey/spirit is illegal; especially, across State lines. I'm in California and none of the majors will ship within the State such as Total Wine & More, but some smaller businesses will. It's very complicated understanding the rules for all this.
I personally have no moral objection whatsoever to a business or individual that is trying to skirt outdated and unreasonable laws, or avoid paying their taxes,... but that's just me. The Blanton's thing though, that sounds like it could be pretty shady, because that's screwing over the customer. If it turns out they knew or had reason to suspect that the Blanton's might not be legitimate, that is a problem, especially knowing that those bottles would almost certainly have been marked up well over the retail price. Seeing stuff like this makes me glad that I don't chase rare whiskies,..... give me some nice 5-6 year MGP or some Benchmark Full Proof, and I'm good.
Great discussion as always. I don't think Justins would knowingly buy fakes without checking them out first. With two locations a disgruntled purchaser of a fake could easily find them. Justins has too much to lose. I think that the RFID system Sazerac has in place for their high end products could be expanded for some other high demand products. Also serializing the bottles using the tags could make them very easy to trace. Just a thought.
I had the same thought. So many people in the comments saying with that volume they had to know they were fake. The reverse logic also applies...with that volume there is no why they could have known they were fake and thought they were not going to get caught.
It's 2023, far past the time when a standardized federal law regulating online alcohol sales need to be enacted. As you pointed out, we can ship medication food and even ammunition through the mail to every state... What a better way to level the secondary playing field then that everyone order from any company.
I read a lot of policy reports on shipping policies. I read one this morning that was hilarious. The rhetoric from those who benefit from our antiquated 90+ year old system is so comical that I stuns me they still feel comfortable making all their false arguments. Under age drinking is up...can't allow alcohol shipments. Is there a single person that grew up in the United States that didn't have nearly unlimited access to alcohol before they were of legal age, long before shipping existed? Just tell the public the truth! The monopoly likes the money they don't have to put in full effort to earn and the states likes not having to work hard to collect their taxes, screw what law abiding supposedly free citizens of the United States want. It is so frustrating.
Randy, Love the Castle & Key shirt you are rocking! I've been to Justin's, great selection but prices were mostly more than I'm willing to spend. Just my opinion but my hunting has been better at Total Wine in Lex, the distillery gift shops, and locally where I've established personal relationships. Keep up the great and relevant content.
This was a great episode (like all the others). Not an easy topic to cover, and this was very well thought out. If the allegations as you described them against JHOB and BO are true, they are in serious jeopardy and very clearly set up a system to circumvent the laws.
Maybe. We will see. The market wants it, and deserves to have it, and the powerful lobby in this country prevents it from happening. Hopefully this will be part of the narrative that begins the process of change.
@@BourbonRealTalk not at all. I thought it was a well articulated and clear segment, with great background info and context. Thanks for making this content!
“We are allowed to sell guns to each other people” Private firearm sale in your state, yes. Over state lines , firearms must be transferred legally through an FFL (federal law).
@@BourbonRealTalk is this a similar process the industry is willing to mirror? Or is there a BRT recommendation the community can get behind to start lobbying?
@@McCartyCFII The problem is the big producers are a set up and work to keep the system the same. Small producers who stand to gain the most from a change don't have the resources to fight the big lobby of the wholesale tier. When there are proposed rule changes the TTB generally puts them out for public comment. If something comes up, I will call the viewers to action.
@@Hdrunner647 Must Have Malts has been a trusted source of blanton's sent to europe for years. It is common for people in the US to buy blanton's overseas and ship it back to the states.
I like Dickel, the regular 8 year (black bottle) has a nice Carmel flavor to me, and dickel bourbon is smoother and a nice $30 bottle in my opinion. Both of those have a permanent spot on my shelf. Haven’t tried any others yet
The distilleries were not in DC, but the federal authorities at the time allowed 6 medicinal permits for distillers to sell alcohol for medical reasons.
I think we missed a detail here….how does the counterfeit Blantons taste? If it’s delicious should we tell the Netherlands to just call it something different and start selling it to us? We might have a silver lining here 😂😂
Such a mess of laws. The United States should allow any producer to sell to anyone who wants to buy a bottle anywhere. All stores that buy bottles should be allowed to sell and ship any bottle that someone wants to buy anywhere within the U.S. There shouldn't be any individual state laws that are different in each state. This is so stupid. It's all a money grab. If I was allowed to order any bottle I wanted from any store I found selling it online, I should be able to, because that isn't the case, you then have higher prices due to demand and where you can buy a bottle and how. I get so fed up with these stupid laws. Sorry guys, just an extremely frustrated consumer
@bourbonrealtalk Randy, You talk about disclaimers, but did you just say that there is an ongoing investigation into counterfeiting in the Netherlands. That could ruin the whole investigation.
I wish I was that powerful. I am not a journalist. I do not have "sources". All this information came from nationally published news articles. Also, if my report "ruined" the investigation that would mean my podcast shut down an internationally operated bootlegging operation, which is a good thing.
I was trying to explain that it remains to be seen if they actually did anything wrong. If so, they were just trying to find a solution to a market problem that should not exist, but the current laws have created it.
I don't know what to say to this. I guess I am a conspirator too now. Thank you for letting me know. I thought I was a person who cared about informing people so they could draw their own conclusions, but I guess now that you have come along I can truly understand my true nature.
Off topic, how many batches of the Prideful Goat 6 year are there? I recently grabbed one off Steelbach's (thanks for the suggestion!) and its from Batch 1. Its also frikkin amazing, great pick Randy!
In KY a vintage spirit, can be, anything not available any longer through your wholesaler. Like last years model, or SiB that are not normal products available. Just fyi this is my explanation of how I read the rules. Not legal definition or advice
As always, it simply comes down to the mighty $$$ and who gets it. Sounds like Justin's is trying to skirt the grey areas of multiple state and federal laws 'for the benefit of the consumer' and have gotten a little bit greedy in their pursuit of philanthropy by turning a blind eye to obviously 'suspicious' sources and engaging in highly suspect methods of transportation and acquisition. Again, it's always about the $$$ and who gets them. Agree 100% on the problems and challenges of the secondary market and the complexity of the multi-state and federal laws involved. Definitely not a simple situation
Pursuit of profit is the source of all human advancement. I won't condemn it simply because they were trying to make money, and I won't condemn a man on conjecture. That said, you are right. It is not a simple situation.
@@BourbonRealTalk 'Pusuit of profit is the source of all human advancement' Wow, that statement is extremely telling. It's also the source for pretty much every war, drug deal, crime, and murder in history. Pursuit of profit without any moral and / or legal constraints is not a tenet to promote or endorse. Innocent until proven guilty IS
Did Justin’s import that stuff through a customs broker with proper paperwork or did they just buy it and hope it made it through similar to people ordering Cuban cigars. That would be very telling. Also when I want to have some point of law clarified I consult my attorney or tax attorney not ask a local LEO or ring up the IRS office. Of course the law is printed there for me to read myself if I don’t want to pay. Still it’s on me.
The reports I read didn't give any details about how the whiskey was being brought in. I also have no idea who all they consulted about their business practices that let to these operating practices.
I do not think there is any evidence that any taxes were unpaid in this case.All there activities were reported according to their licenses, so I am pretty sure taxes were paid.
"They were doing it to help customers get access to rare bottles".......no they were doing it to make $$$$.....quick easy turnover and were probably getting those fake bottles at a deal that made a lot of sense to them. And it appears they did no due diligence to ensure the bottles were legit. They may not of known they were fake but an ounce of common sense should have you questioning it but its hard to see it if you're just look at the dollar signs!
Yes. The device you used to write this condemning message on was created by an evil SOB who wanted money. It also stopped a bunch of deaths and brought people together, but let's throw the baby out with the bathwater and immediately label anything that is the pursuit of profit as evil.
@@BourbonRealTalk I didnt say they're evil. I love capitalism as much as the next guy. And I was in no way accusing them of anything. But those bottles of Blantons probably had some of that bath water in them that you're talking about 🤣
You're dealing with a government entity (BATFE) with a long history of violating the law itself, and railroading or intimidating small holdings. They have the dubious distinction of being referred to as the "rogue agency" by other alphabet boys.
Oh no, guns! Freedom from overreaching regulations of firearms is far more important than any regulation of alcohol. Let's not act like a society with less guns and more alcohol would be better or safer 🙂 and for those who may wrongly assume that my comment is satire, it surely is not.
Could not agree more. It still does not make any sense to me that, for safety reasons, I can buy a gun from my neighbor but not a bottle that has alcohol in it.
Why is Sazerac sending so much product to Europe if there isn’t demand? I guess they want to keep the US supply artificially low so that retailers trip over themselves ordering Fireball and Wheatley to get better allocations. BT/Saz treats its customers like garabage. And customers keep saying thank you and give them all kinds of free FOMO marketing, posting crotch shots from liquor store parking lots. Bourbon drinkers with any self respect should stop with the free marketing and move on to other brands
My understanding is % distribution was set years ago and never updated, so if a market bought a lot of Blanton's when it was first introduced BT continues to ship that amount to them even if demand shifts. I hear what you are saying about the overhype of some BT products, but I don't blame that on BT. They did invest 1.2 billion to increase production, it just takes so much time to produce the whiskey everyone wants that it feels like they are doing nothing to fix the problem.
There's no way Justin did not have a idea that they fake lol 500 from out of country hahaha why would Justin not just aquire bourbon here in America or from buffalo trace distillery .
Blanton's ships a ton of product overseas where there is less demand for it than there is in the US. As a result, a lot of European retailers sell the product back into the US. Your comment about "why would Justin not just acquire bourbon here in American or from buffalo trace distillery" reveals a misunderstanding about how the system works in the US. It is illegal for JHOB to buy product from BT. They would only be able to buy for BTs wholesaler in KY. In DC Bourbon Outfitters would not be allowed to buy from BT because BT has a contract with a DC wholesaler. Also, BT has too much demand from US retailers who all would like more product. It isn't as simple as saying, I want more, and they comply. To get the product they need to satisfy the demand they have they needed to go to the European market where retailers have bottles they do not have demand for, and bring them back to the US. I know individuals who have done this for years, so a business operating what they thought was a legal operation bringing blanton's back into the US market where it was worth more that it is in Europe makes sense. We do not have to agree, but I do not want to condemn a person with nothing more than conjecture.
Sorry guns are NOT dangerous. I have a lot of them and they have NEVER done a damn thing on their own but just sit there. PEOPLE are dangerous. Ask Timothy Mcvay about that.
Neither guns or bottles of whiskey are dangerous. They are dangerous if you use them improperly. Alcohol delivery is vilified because of the risk of the bottles falling into the hands of a child. If you can wrap your mind around the risk of a loaded gun in the hands of a child, you can wrap your mind around the idea of the risk of a child with a bottle of whiskey. If can account for one risk, we can account for the other.
Been drinking Bourbon for decades and what has happened to the Bourbon Community sickens me. There is no way you will ever get me to believe that Bourbon Outfitters was going to buy 500 cases of Blanton's from Denmark and NOT know something wasn't right.
That is your choice. I will not condemn a person on conjecture.
Great episode Randy. I just find it a little difficult to believe that individuals like Justins would not be suspicious of someone selling that much blantons at once, who would have so many cases just sitting around?
Europe is a source for Blanton's because tons is shipped there, but the demand is not as high as it is in the US.
Even though JHOB is not directly implicated in the possible counterfeiting of Blanton's, at the very best they were unconcerned if the product was counterfeit or not...they were still willing to sell it (at exorbitant prices I might add) and should have both, been aware of the possibility of counterfeits and questioned the legitimacy of such large quantities from a single source!
Who is your source for them being unconcerned? MustHaveMalts.com is a trusted source to many who buy from overseas online retailers. Do you have some information that the public needs to be aware of, or is this just conjecture?
@@BourbonRealTalk do you have any evidence that they were concerned enough to do anything about it, or be suspicious at all about the vast quantity available to them? Did they refuse to sell any if it before finding out more? How about having bottles without labels? Did they have labels without bottles, or vice versa?
@@greasyghost The 600 cases or 600 bottles (not sure if the report was accurate or not) was put in voluntary detention by the investigators. After investigation the inventory was released back to JHOB and they are now selling it as it was determined to be authentic.
The conjecture that they would knowingly sell a fake is silly. They have a huge successful business with or without Blanton's. There is no logical business person who would think they could pass off 600-3600 fakes and not get caught. The public would know, and their business would be over and they would go to jail. I know people are skeptical and want to believe every successful business is out to get them, but logic dictates that self preservation would win out even if they were inclined to cheat (which there is no evidence of).
These outdated laws need to change desperately, especially here in TX.
This isn't the 1930s.
I want to be able to buy whiskey 7 days a week, through the mail, and in grocery stores, like most other states.
Agreed
Thanks for this. Junkies attempted to explain it... was a hot mess.
Shit! I thought I was first. I had to wait until Wes had time to record.
Appreciate the coverage and the honesty of your bias. I am relatively new to back into Bourbon about 3 months so I think you did a solid job of covering this. The specific portion of the video where your covered how guns (which i legally own) can be transferred between individuals but booze cannot was SPOT ON! Appreciate the content and your personal story to end every video has made me a follower. Had a friend who struggled with some suicidal thoughts for a while and it was just crazy. Kudos to you for bringing awareness to this issue.
I appreciate that! It is nice to get feedback that people appreciate the mission. Cheers!
Absolute truth and great clarity. Thanks for doing this Randy. Clears a lot of cobwebs for most people with outside takes.
Glad you enjoyed it
Why is it your opinion that they had no idea the bottles were counterfeit? Don't you think someone so versed in liquor sales, like Justin's, wouldn't find it odd that an overseas operation would have that sheer volume of Blantons? Seems odd...
Because I know these guys and they are not dishonest. Plus, I know people who have imported cases from Europe for years, and there have been no indications that an outfit like the ones they were buying from would be involved with counterfeiting. IMO if you want to accuse an otherwise honest business of fraud there needs to have more than just conjecture.
@BourbonRealTalk Come on man, 500 CASES of Blantons! That's not the same as a case or two.. or even 50 cases of Jack Daniel's. Again, this is FUVE HUNDRED CASES of one of the hardest to find, most desirable, bourbons on the planet. You may want to consider a disassociation asap.
@@mozzie22 I understand your point, but I won't accuse someone on conjecture. If they had the foggiest idea that it was fraudulent why did they open tell the investigator about it? I just don't believe they had any idea.
@@BourbonRealTalk I believe the warehouse employee making maybe $20 an hour didn't have any idea...or maybe he did suspect something didn't smell right and was happy to spill the beans while he was surrounded by federal agents and being questioned about the goings on there!
@@BourbonRealTalk When I worked in the financial markets, I had a couple of meetings with guys from Enron...they seemed honest also!
We love this bourbon news segments. They basically did what rich people do when hiding money.
I wouldn't say that. They tried to combine laws in different states to make a legal secondary market.
My overseas friends are laughing about this as they buy bottles on Amazon
😂
Great informative show. The commercial at the end had me rolling on the floor. You guys kill me with the Xtra Smedium!!! Keep it up!! Thanks 😅
I have watched it so many times. It is so funny.
Thank you, Randy. This was very informative and the best explanation of what happened with JHOB that I've seen.
Thank you!
Agree with everything you mentioned about the tier laws. If they did make individual to individual sales legal, I see a need for consultants to verify authenticity. That would be a great business to get into.
I think we as individuals can decide to take the risk in a private transaction, but when potentially altered bottles are going back into the 3 tier system the risk of a counterfeit being sold to an unsuspecting customer goes way up.
Great Job Randy, I really like how transparent you are! Well done my friend. Cheers
I appreciate that! Cheers!
Thanks Randy, the liquor laws are such a mess and you've highlighted very clearly.
Thank you!
@BourbonRealTalk_ Not sure how to text from here?
Great show Randy and yes there’s a double standard here. It seems to me…. to be about the $$$ and control. I wanted to get bottles of the PG shipped to Kansas as simple as the process should be it was more challenging than I imagined. Ended up shipping to an address in Texas to keep it legal. Yes inconvenience and still ended up getting the bottles. Thank you for your help on the matter it was easier to go to Texas and visit family. We all need to be aware of the counterfeit market. Always enjoy your input 👏🏼
Thank you!
The best update on this about this issue so far. Thanks.
Thank you
The most comprehensive explanation of what's going on with Justins' ...Thanks!
You're very welcome!
I'm very reluctant to buy online and have it shipped. I always thought shipping of any whiskey/spirit is illegal; especially, across State lines. I'm in California and none of the majors will ship within the State such as Total Wine & More, but some smaller businesses will. It's very complicated understanding the rules for all this.
For sure!
I personally have no moral objection whatsoever to a business or individual that is trying to skirt outdated and unreasonable laws, or avoid paying their taxes,... but that's just me.
The Blanton's thing though, that sounds like it could be pretty shady, because that's screwing over the customer. If it turns out they knew or had reason to suspect that the Blanton's might not be legitimate, that is a problem, especially knowing that those bottles would almost certainly have been marked up well over the retail price.
Seeing stuff like this makes me glad that I don't chase rare whiskies,..... give me some nice 5-6 year MGP or some Benchmark Full Proof, and I'm good.
Fair!
Great discussion as always. I don't think Justins would knowingly buy fakes without checking them out first. With two locations a disgruntled purchaser of a fake could easily find them. Justins has too much to lose.
I think that the RFID system Sazerac has in place for their high end products could be expanded for some other high demand products. Also serializing the bottles using the tags could make them very easy to trace. Just a thought.
I had the same thought. So many people in the comments saying with that volume they had to know they were fake. The reverse logic also applies...with that volume there is no why they could have known they were fake and thought they were not going to get caught.
It's 2023, far past the time when a standardized federal law regulating online alcohol sales need to be enacted. As you pointed out, we can ship medication food and even ammunition through the mail to every state... What a better way to level the secondary playing field then that everyone order from any company.
I read a lot of policy reports on shipping policies. I read one this morning that was hilarious. The rhetoric from those who benefit from our antiquated 90+ year old system is so comical that I stuns me they still feel comfortable making all their false arguments.
Under age drinking is up...can't allow alcohol shipments. Is there a single person that grew up in the United States that didn't have nearly unlimited access to alcohol before they were of legal age, long before shipping existed? Just tell the public the truth! The monopoly likes the money they don't have to put in full effort to earn and the states likes not having to work hard to collect their taxes, screw what law abiding supposedly free citizens of the United States want. It is so frustrating.
I guarantee the officials "trying to figure out where 600 bottles of WSR came from" figured that out in about 5 seconds.
I have heard from other commenters that this seller was a known quantity.
Very informative! Thank you, Randy!
Glad it was helpful!
10:30 the color of that bourbon is amazing
Cheers
Randy,
Love the Castle & Key shirt you are rocking! I've been to Justin's, great selection but prices were mostly more than I'm willing to spend. Just my opinion but my hunting has been better at Total Wine in Lex, the distillery gift shops, and locally where I've established personal relationships. Keep up the great and relevant content.
Thank you! I love Castle and Key.
I love your open and honest poi ts of view, not to mention the quality of your bourbon reviews. I love you guys!
Much appreciated!
This was a great episode (like all the others). Not an easy topic to cover, and this was very well thought out. If the allegations as you described them against JHOB and BO are true, they are in serious jeopardy and very clearly set up a system to circumvent the laws.
Maybe. We will see. The market wants it, and deserves to have it, and the powerful lobby in this country prevents it from happening. Hopefully this will be part of the narrative that begins the process of change.
Thank you for talking about shipping.
If we can ship dangerous meds, and even fireworks, why not bourbon? :)
One day I hope there will be some common sense applied to this situation.
Very well articulated, Thank You for all of your top shelf content ❤️ Love you Brother 👍🇺🇸
Thank you! Some other people said I misspoke so many times they could not follow my logic, so I appreciate this.
Your content is fantastic!
Don’t listen to the haters
@@BourbonRealTalk not at all. I thought it was a well articulated and clear segment, with great background info and context. Thanks for making this content!
“We are allowed to sell guns to each other people” Private firearm sale in your state, yes. Over state lines , firearms must be transferred legally through an FFL (federal law).
Yes, and an FFL can be set up online. There is not an equivalent system for alcohol.
@@BourbonRealTalk is this a similar process the industry is willing to mirror? Or is there a BRT recommendation the community can get behind to start lobbying?
@@McCartyCFII The problem is the big producers are a set up and work to keep the system the same. Small producers who stand to gain the most from a change don't have the resources to fight the big lobby of the wholesale tier. When there are proposed rule changes the TTB generally puts them out for public comment. If something comes up, I will call the viewers to action.
@@BourbonRealTalk Maybe a case study/episode on how the wine industry succeeded in this avenue? 🤷♂️
Given how hard Blanton's and Weller are hard to find. It strikes me as suspicious that 500 bottles of rare stuff just came from nowhere.
There are tons of blanton's sent to Europe where there is not as much demand as in the US. That is why bottles are being brought back into the US?
@@BourbonRealTalkDon’t you think that is suspicious in and of itself? 500 cases coming from The Netherlands, when the producer is in Kentucky?
@@Hdrunner647 Must Have Malts has been a trusted source of blanton's sent to europe for years. It is common for people in the US to buy blanton's overseas and ship it back to the states.
I like Dickel, the regular 8 year (black bottle) has a nice Carmel flavor to me, and dickel bourbon is smoother and a nice $30 bottle in my opinion. Both of those have a permanent spot on my shelf. Haven’t tried any others yet
Those are some solid value pours.
This explains DC law. During prohibition they allowed to the best of my recollection 6 distilleries to remain open for medical alcohol.
The distilleries were not in DC, but the federal authorities at the time allowed 6 medicinal permits for distillers to sell alcohol for medical reasons.
Preach Brother!! Love it Randy!!
Thank you
I think we missed a detail here….how does the counterfeit Blantons taste? If it’s delicious should we tell the Netherlands to just call it something different and start selling it to us? We might have a silver lining here 😂😂
😂
Such a mess of laws. The United States should allow any producer to sell to anyone who wants to buy a bottle anywhere. All stores that buy bottles should be allowed to sell and ship any bottle that someone wants to buy anywhere within the U.S. There shouldn't be any individual state laws that are different in each state. This is so stupid. It's all a money grab. If I was allowed to order any bottle I wanted from any store I found selling it online, I should be able to, because that isn't the case, you then have higher prices due to demand and where you can buy a bottle and how. I get so fed up with these stupid laws. Sorry guys, just an extremely frustrated consumer
Could not agree more.
This was explained very well! Thanks!
Thank you. Someone else said I misspoke so many times that he could not follow it. I guess you can't please everyone 😂
@@BourbonRealTalk
I’ve purchased items from bourbon outfitters before they got my support 👍🥃
Cheers!
@bourbonrealtalk Randy, You talk about disclaimers, but did you just say that there is an ongoing investigation into counterfeiting in the Netherlands. That could ruin the whole investigation.
I wish I was that powerful. I am not a journalist. I do not have "sources". All this information came from nationally published news articles. Also, if my report "ruined" the investigation that would mean my podcast shut down an internationally operated bootlegging operation, which is a good thing.
Sounds like they got caught red-handed.
I was trying to explain that it remains to be seen if they actually did anything wrong. If so, they were just trying to find a solution to a market problem that should not exist, but the current laws have created it.
Very informative. Thanks!
You're welcome!
Of course everyone thinks 500 bottles of Blantons at once isn’t a problem at lol protect your friends at least you said it in the beginning
I don't know what to say to this. I guess I am a conspirator too now. Thank you for letting me know. I thought I was a person who cared about informing people so they could draw their own conclusions, but I guess now that you have come along I can truly understand my true nature.
The timing of this. We had visited their Louisville location the 15th, or 16th of Jan
Wow! The raid was the 17th.
New commercial is great!
So funny! Wes is brilliant.
What news feeds do you subscribe to? I wouldn't have even heard about this if your video hadn't come up in my feed. I'd like to be more plugged in.
It is an industry newsletter.
Wow man, what a wealth of info. So much insight that you have to watch it a few times to catch everything.
Great job sir!!
Thank you!
DC now bootlegging highly allocated bourbon to the rest of the country, our govt is so shady.
Laws need to change.
@@BourbonRealTalk DC has the rare benefit, in this case, to not have state laws to comply with...federal law is all they have.
Off topic, how many batches of the Prideful Goat 6 year are there? I recently grabbed one off Steelbach's (thanks for the suggestion!) and its from Batch 1. Its also frikkin amazing, great pick Randy!
We have only done one large batch. I don't think there is a second batch yet.
So does this mean everything from Must Have Malts is now suspect?
That is for you to call. I could not say for sure.
Is there anymore information available about possible counterfeit bottles in NL? I regularly use MHM as I'm based in the same country.
With luck they are filling the bottles with something like Wild turkey and you're getting better whiskey than what they claim to be selling!
@@TangoSierra01 I've not been buying blanton's from them. Last thing I bought was a bunch WT. So, you're (hopefully) right about them sending me WT.
I have no additional information
What ever happened in Kentucky with law where distillery could ship to someone that had visited and purchased a bottle at distillery
I am unfamiliar with that law. Most large distilleries would not mess with that even if it were legal.
I really really enjoyed CS Still Austin
Same!
how do we find out more about the counterfeit blantons from the netherlands?
I have seen no other information about it. Just know, that shipment was never released to the public.
In KY a vintage spirit, can be, anything not available any longer through your wholesaler. Like last years model, or SiB that are not normal products available. Just fyi this is my explanation of how I read the rules. Not legal definition or advice
That is my understanding too.
It's not a useful practice to hit the hornet's nest when you have discovered a loophole.
Fair
Good video
Thank you
As always, it simply comes down to the mighty $$$ and who gets it. Sounds like Justin's is trying to skirt the grey areas of multiple state and federal laws 'for the benefit of the consumer'
and have gotten a little bit greedy in their pursuit of philanthropy by turning a blind eye to obviously 'suspicious' sources and engaging in highly suspect methods of transportation and acquisition. Again, it's always about the $$$ and who gets them.
Agree 100% on the problems and challenges of the secondary market and the complexity of the multi-state and federal laws involved.
Definitely not a simple situation
Pursuit of profit is the source of all human advancement. I won't condemn it simply because they were trying to make money, and I won't condemn a man on conjecture. That said, you are right. It is not a simple situation.
@@BourbonRealTalk 'Pusuit of profit is the source of all human advancement'
Wow, that statement is extremely telling.
It's also the source for pretty much every war, drug deal, crime, and murder in history.
Pursuit of profit without any moral and / or legal constraints is not a tenet to promote or endorse.
Innocent until proven guilty IS
Did Justin’s import that stuff through a customs broker with proper paperwork or did they just buy it and hope it made it through similar to people ordering Cuban cigars. That would be very telling. Also when I want to have some point of law clarified I consult my attorney or tax attorney not ask a local LEO or ring up the IRS office. Of course the law is printed there for me to read myself if I don’t want to pay. Still it’s on me.
The reports I read didn't give any details about how the whiskey was being brought in. I also have no idea who all they consulted about their business practices that let to these operating practices.
Thanks for the "Low Down" the "Skinny" the "Dope" the "Info" the "Real-Real" ............. O.K. I will stop!
😂
What ever happened to what I thought was the original charge that Justin's was purchasing stolen dusty's?
That accusation was not in any of the reports I read.
the liquor laws are so archaic in this country, especially in texas. Although I dont know how much hope to hold of them ever changing
It will be a difficult path, and a fear it won't be fast.
I hope they get shut down and anyone else selling at secondary gets prosecuted
The selling at secondary part is not what they are in trouble for.
Bottom line, government did not get its cut.
I do not think there is any evidence that any taxes were unpaid in this case.All there activities were reported according to their licenses, so I am pretty sure taxes were paid.
Blanton's is definitely not worth more then 80 90 a bottle
It is a solid pour at MSRP, but I hear you.
Wow, American booze laws are just weird.
Yep😂
"They were doing it to help customers get access to rare bottles".......no they were doing it to make $$$$.....quick easy turnover and were probably getting those fake bottles at a deal that made a lot of sense to them. And it appears they did no due diligence to ensure the bottles were legit. They may not of known they were fake but an ounce of common sense should have you questioning it but its hard to see it if you're just look at the dollar signs!
Yes. The device you used to write this condemning message on was created by an evil SOB who wanted money. It also stopped a bunch of deaths and brought people together, but let's throw the baby out with the bathwater and immediately label anything that is the pursuit of profit as evil.
@@BourbonRealTalk I didnt say they're evil. I love capitalism as much as the next guy. And I was in no way accusing them of anything. But those bottles of Blantons probably had some of that bath water in them that you're talking about 🤣
500 bottles or 500 cases…
Yes
The news report was a quote, and it said 500 cases.
You're dealing with a government entity (BATFE) with a long history of violating the law itself, and railroading or intimidating small holdings. They have the dubious distinction of being referred to as the "rogue agency" by other alphabet boys.
pretty sad when even the other alphabet agencies don't trust them!
There was no mention of BATFE being involved with this case.
Oh no, guns! Freedom from overreaching regulations of firearms is far more important than any regulation of alcohol. Let's not act like a society with less guns and more alcohol would be better or safer 🙂 and for those who may wrongly assume that my comment is satire, it surely is not.
Could not agree more. It still does not make any sense to me that, for safety reasons, I can buy a gun from my neighbor but not a bottle that has alcohol in it.
Check out Oregon's OLCC employees get busted for using their powers to get rare bottles.
I thought about doing a piece on it. But it would be 2 min long 😂
Why is Sazerac sending so much product to Europe if there isn’t demand? I guess they want to keep the US supply artificially low so that retailers trip over themselves ordering Fireball and Wheatley to get better allocations.
BT/Saz treats its customers like garabage. And customers keep saying thank you and give them all kinds of free FOMO marketing, posting crotch shots from liquor store parking lots. Bourbon drinkers with any self respect should stop with the free marketing and move on to other brands
My understanding is % distribution was set years ago and never updated, so if a market bought a lot of Blanton's when it was first introduced BT continues to ship that amount to them even if demand shifts.
I hear what you are saying about the overhype of some BT products, but I don't blame that on BT. They did invest 1.2 billion to increase production, it just takes so much time to produce the whiskey everyone wants that it feels like they are doing nothing to fix the problem.
Wow
Cheers!
That's exactly how the DEA trapped Tommy Chong.
Interesting
5👍
Cheers!
There's no way Justin did not have a idea that they fake lol 500 from out of country hahaha why would Justin not just aquire bourbon here in America or from buffalo trace distillery .
Blanton's ships a ton of product overseas where there is less demand for it than there is in the US. As a result, a lot of European retailers sell the product back into the US. Your comment about "why would Justin not just acquire bourbon here in American or from buffalo trace distillery" reveals a misunderstanding about how the system works in the US. It is illegal for JHOB to buy product from BT. They would only be able to buy for BTs wholesaler in KY. In DC Bourbon Outfitters would not be allowed to buy from BT because BT has a contract with a DC wholesaler. Also, BT has too much demand from US retailers who all would like more product. It isn't as simple as saying, I want more, and they comply. To get the product they need to satisfy the demand they have they needed to go to the European market where retailers have bottles they do not have demand for, and bring them back to the US. I know individuals who have done this for years, so a business operating what they thought was a legal operation bringing blanton's back into the US market where it was worth more that it is in Europe makes sense. We do not have to agree, but I do not want to condemn a person with nothing more than conjecture.
Sorry guns are NOT dangerous. I have a lot of them and they have NEVER done a damn thing on their own but just sit there. PEOPLE are dangerous. Ask Timothy Mcvay about that.
Neither guns or bottles of whiskey are dangerous. They are dangerous if you use them improperly. Alcohol delivery is vilified because of the risk of the bottles falling into the hands of a child. If you can wrap your mind around the risk of a loaded gun in the hands of a child, you can wrap your mind around the idea of the risk of a child with a bottle of whiskey. If can account for one risk, we can account for the other.
You misspoke several times. It makes it hard to follow.
Sorry about that.