From Sidecarbod further down the comments: 9 minutes ago (edited) The charging and lighting coil are basically one coil of wire but a 'tapping' is taken off it which is the yellow wire, it would have powered the lights or gone to the rectifier to charge the battery. Some of these old crappy systems did not regulate the voltage, they only rectified it. I guess in some ways you could say it consists of two coils connected in serial. One end of the coil was connected to ground which also means that you can only half-wave rectify it which is a bit wasteful. The modification basically uses the whole coil as the charging coil, also because the earth has been removed and connected to one of the regulator/rectifier AC inputs along with the original AC wire it means that both the positive and negative AC wave is rectified into DC. Finally, because the whole coil is now being used the AC input voltage will be over 14.7 volts which means that the reg/rec unit can convert it to DC and give and output of 14.7v"
Glad my little guide helped! been through the Engmod process on my own AR80 a few years ago, albeit as a road bike so a bit less extreme.. managed about 14hp..
Hi Martin - you little guide was invaluable to the conversion. I wouldn't have been able to do it without as I'm no electrician 🙄 so thank you very much. 14 hp sounds good! What Dyno did you measure it on? Also what speed would it do?
@@cliveswabs9365 I don't have any experience with these but Google this "suzuki 80 gamma tuning zylinder" there seems to be a few bits on German forums that Google translate should be able to translate for you.
Was contemplating converting my 76 Kawasaki 175ke to 12 volts. The 6 volt regulator blew, and with it, all the lights. I don't ride it on the road much, but it would be nice to have some lights back. Wasn't sure if I want to go to 12 or stay at 6 and fix it. I looked at an exploded view of my bikes magneto and it shows that there are 3 different stators (or whatever they are called inside of a magneto) not 2 like you had. So, I'm still at a loss. 🤔 Nice video though. Hope that it helps other people with your type of bike.
Hi Derek, thanks for the feedback :) Regarding converting from 6 to 12 volt I've noticed a big difference in the brightness of the lights, particularly the indicators. I wonder if this place could help you out with a conversion? www.rexs-speedshop.com/product-category/charging-system/12-volt-conversions/ Maybe you'r has a separate charging and lighting coil?
I viewed this with some considerable interest since the original electrics from the factory are pretty crude. Voltage regulation is essentially achieved via the rectifier and current dumping into the battery. If the rectifier goes open-circuit, or the battery fails in a manner which prevents it taking any current, and it does happen because it recently happened to me suddenly whilst riding - yes, just like that, the result is that all lamps get blown instantly - rather expensive and certainly bad at night!. So I was intrigued how this 12v conversion was achieved. In particular I was hoping to to know what happens to the 6v horn, 6v ignition coil and 6v CDI unit when they suddenly see 12Vd.c.. Won't they all get stressed and fail? Did they all have to get replaced? If so, with what? Did I miss something?
Hi BongbongA99, I've just had a re-run through the vid and can hopefully answer your questions. I did the conversion as per this guide: www.instructables.com/Kawasaki-AR-5080-12v-Conversion/ All it is doing is connecting the two parts of the 6 volt charging coil to the 6 volt lighting coil to give 12 volts. The original set up had one coil split in two to give 6 volts to charge the battery and 6 volts to power the headlight. After connecting the two sides of the coil together the windings are doubled and hence the voltage so 12 volts. In reality before the split the separate coils gave about 8 volts AC. Combining the two coils gave 16 volts AC that goes into the reg/rec to charge the battery at about 14-14.7 volts DC. The original headlight (which ran off 6 (8) volt AC was connected to the other lighting that was always run from the 6 volt battery. All bulbs were replaced with 12 volt bulbs so they wouldn't blow. The CDI and Ignition coil are powered from the Ignition coil (opposite the lighting/charging coil). So the battery being converted to 12 volts is only for the lights (and the horn that's happy with 12v). The ignition is totally separate so would work as designed. Note. I'm running a Ignitec ignition that wants 12 volts so I run it off the battery (charged from the lighting/charge coil) so the ignition could be removed completely. Just typed this on the phone so I hope makes sense? I'm no electrician but I'll try my best to answer questions. Regards Dave.
@@AutoBeta2T Hello Dave, thank you for taking the time and trouble to explain. I guess I really need to dig up the original circuit to see what's going on. Following the mod, I guess the other 6v item that will now see 12v will be the flasher relay. I don't know whether that's a problem or not. Of course originally, the only lights that would come on without the engine turning over were (1) the rear brake light, (2) the neutral lamp on the instrument cluster (if in neutral of course), (3) the 2 stroke level warning indicator on the instrument cluster (by way of a lamp test) and (4) the rear light if park is selected on the ignition key. All the rest were ac-powered. So yes, interesting, thank you for your thoughts.
Hi, no problems. Yes it sounds right. The flasher relay does need upgrading to 12 v too. I think the cluster bulbs were okay. I do go through the bulbs in part two here: th-cam.com/video/jjOqs0VaWWU/w-d-xo.html Cheers Dave
So to clarify what was actually done were all the coils just joined together making one coil or were the 2 coils made to be out of phase with each other creating a 2 phase system?
Hi Bret - as I understand (not being an electrician) the lighting and charging coils were connected together hence doubling the amount of turns in the coil and doubling the voltage.
The charging and lighting coil are basically one coil of wire but a 'tapping' is taken off it which is the yellow wire, it would have powered the lights or gone to the rectifier to charge the battery. Some of these old crappy systems did not regulate the voltage, they only rectified it. I guess in some ways you could say it consists of two coils connected in serial. One end of the coil was connected to ground which also means that you can only half-wave rectify it which is a bit wasteful. The modification basically uses the whole coil as the charging coil, also because the earth has been removed and connected to one of the regulator/rectifier AC inputs along with the original AC wire it means that both the positive and negative AC wave is rectified into DC. Finally, because the whole coil is now being used the AC input voltage will be over 14.7 volts which means that the reg/rec unit can convert it to DC and give and output of 14.7v. (I knew my degree in electronic systems engineering would become useful one day! 🙂 )
@@sidecarbod1441 cheers Pete :) I'm trying to pin this comment but it won't let me. I'll maybe have to cut and paste it into a new comment and pin then.
Hi, there's no conversion kit as such. I modified the generator as per the online article and just got a 12 volt battery and a cheap rectifier off ebay.
Hi Abdul, I'm not too sure really. The AR had a separate charging and headlight coil that gave 8 volt AC as standard but when connected together they gave 16 volts AC that then could be rectified and regulated to max 13.7 volt DC. If the Honda is a similar system then I guess it could? Is there a later model that has a 12 volt system?
@@AutoBeta2T yes honda cd 70 1986 model is japanese made. It has same two coils yellow and white wires with point system. Also yes the versions of cd 70 using 12v coils circuit and cdi.
Abdul, after having a look online I can't see a CD70 diagram. I've found a CD90 one that may be of some use if it's similar? oldmanhonda.com/MC/WiringDiagrams/
Hi, there is a diagram and some good info here: www.thumpertalk.com/forums/topic/1361399-kawasaki-ar-6v-to-12v-conversion-confused-on-yellow-wire-from-stator-wiring-diagram-attachted/
I used this guide to do the conversion. It was really helpful. www.instructables.com/Kawasaki-AR-5080-12v-Conversion/ With this and the diagram from the last message I managed to get it working. Cheers Dave
From Sidecarbod further down the comments:
9 minutes ago (edited)
The charging and lighting coil are basically one coil of wire but a 'tapping' is taken off it which is the yellow wire, it would have powered the lights or gone to the rectifier to charge the battery. Some of these old crappy systems did not regulate the voltage, they only rectified it. I guess in some ways you could say it consists of two coils connected in serial. One end of the coil was connected to ground which also means that you can only half-wave rectify it which is a bit wasteful. The modification basically uses the whole coil as the charging coil, also because the earth has been removed and connected to one of the regulator/rectifier AC inputs along with the original AC wire it means that both the positive and negative AC wave is rectified into DC. Finally, because the whole coil is now being used the AC input voltage will be over 14.7 volts which means that the reg/rec unit can convert it to DC and give and output of 14.7v"
Glad my little guide helped! been through the Engmod process on my own AR80 a few years ago, albeit as a road bike so a bit less extreme.. managed about 14hp..
Hi Martin - you little guide was invaluable to the conversion. I wouldn't have been able to do it without as I'm no electrician 🙄 so thank you very much.
14 hp sounds good! What Dyno did you measure it on? Also what speed would it do?
Ive got an RG80LC suzuki do u know anything about these bikes as nobody has any info on em?
@@AutoBeta2T it was a dynojet, top speed I don't know, probably 70-75? (wasn't geared for top speed) I'll try and dig out the curve somewhere..
Cheers Martin 😊
@@cliveswabs9365 I don't have any experience with these but Google this "suzuki 80 gamma tuning zylinder" there seems to be a few bits on German forums that Google translate should be able to translate for you.
Was contemplating converting my 76 Kawasaki 175ke to 12 volts. The 6 volt regulator blew, and with it, all the lights. I don't ride it on the road much, but it would be nice to have some lights back. Wasn't sure if I want to go to 12 or stay at 6 and fix it. I looked at an exploded view of my bikes magneto and it shows that there are 3 different stators (or whatever they are called inside of a magneto) not 2 like you had. So, I'm still at a loss. 🤔 Nice video though. Hope that it helps other people with your type of bike.
Hi Derek, thanks for the feedback :)
Regarding converting from 6 to 12 volt I've noticed a big difference in the brightness of the lights, particularly the indicators.
I wonder if this place could help you out with a conversion? www.rexs-speedshop.com/product-category/charging-system/12-volt-conversions/
Maybe you'r has a separate charging and lighting coil?
There are 3 coils in the system but 1 coil is actually 2 just 1 inside the other
@@bretearwood7027 Yep, and one of the coils supplies AC to the CDI, the other 'two' coils are really just one coil with a tapping taken off it.
Adding to library.⚙️🚲⚙️💥 great job sir. Very helpful.
Cheers Roger 🙂
nice presentation!
Cheers Joe 😀
Nice video! What happens to the cdi if its originally a 6 volt bike? Do i have to change the cdi to a 12v cdi too?
Hi, as I remember tye CDI and ignition. Are powered from a separate coil. The ignition coil.
@AutoBeta2T so when you make a conversion you only change the charge coil to 12v and the ignition coil keeps 6v?
@carlosdavidgalarza9338 yes.
I viewed this with some considerable interest since the original electrics from the factory are pretty crude. Voltage regulation is essentially achieved via the rectifier and current dumping into the battery. If the rectifier goes open-circuit, or the battery fails in a manner which prevents it taking any current, and it does happen because it recently happened to me suddenly whilst riding - yes, just like that, the result is that all lamps get blown instantly - rather expensive and certainly bad at night!. So I was intrigued how this 12v conversion was achieved. In particular I was hoping to to know what happens to the 6v horn, 6v ignition coil and 6v CDI unit when they suddenly see 12Vd.c.. Won't they all get stressed and fail? Did they all have to get replaced? If so, with what? Did I miss something?
Hi BongbongA99, I've just had a re-run through the vid and can hopefully answer your questions.
I did the conversion as per this guide:
www.instructables.com/Kawasaki-AR-5080-12v-Conversion/
All it is doing is connecting the two parts of the 6 volt charging coil to the 6 volt lighting coil to give 12 volts. The original set up had one coil split in two to give 6 volts to charge the battery and 6 volts to power the headlight. After connecting the two sides of the coil together the windings are doubled and hence the voltage so 12 volts.
In reality before the split the separate coils gave about 8 volts AC. Combining the two coils gave 16 volts AC that goes into the reg/rec to charge the battery at about 14-14.7 volts DC. The original headlight (which ran off 6 (8) volt AC was connected to the other lighting that was always run from the 6 volt battery. All bulbs were replaced with 12 volt bulbs so they wouldn't blow.
The CDI and Ignition coil are powered from the Ignition coil (opposite the lighting/charging coil). So the battery being converted to 12 volts is only for the lights (and the horn that's happy with 12v).
The ignition is totally separate so would work as designed.
Note. I'm running a Ignitec ignition that wants 12 volts so I run it off the battery (charged from the lighting/charge coil) so the ignition could be removed completely.
Just typed this on the phone so I hope makes sense?
I'm no electrician but I'll try my best to answer questions.
Regards
Dave.
@@AutoBeta2T Hello Dave, thank you for taking the time and trouble to explain. I guess I really need to dig up the original circuit to see what's going on. Following the mod, I guess the other 6v item that will now see 12v will be the flasher relay. I don't know whether that's a problem or not. Of course originally, the only lights that would come on without the engine turning over were (1) the rear brake light, (2) the neutral lamp on the instrument cluster (if in neutral of course), (3) the 2 stroke level warning indicator on the instrument cluster (by way of a lamp test) and (4) the rear light if park is selected on the ignition key. All the rest were ac-powered.
So yes, interesting, thank you for your thoughts.
Hi, no problems.
Yes it sounds right.
The flasher relay does need upgrading to 12 v too. I think the cluster bulbs were okay.
I do go through the bulbs in part two here: th-cam.com/video/jjOqs0VaWWU/w-d-xo.html
Cheers
Dave
@@AutoBeta2T Thank you Dave. Good game eh.
No problems 🙂
So to clarify what was actually done were all the coils just joined together making one coil or were the 2 coils made to be out of phase with each other creating a 2 phase system?
Hi Bret - as I understand (not being an electrician) the lighting and charging coils were connected together hence doubling the amount of turns in the coil and doubling the voltage.
The charging and lighting coil are basically one coil of wire but a 'tapping' is taken off it which is the yellow wire, it would have powered the lights or gone to the rectifier to charge the battery. Some of these old crappy systems did not regulate the voltage, they only rectified it. I guess in some ways you could say it consists of two coils connected in serial. One end of the coil was connected to ground which also means that you can only half-wave rectify it which is a bit wasteful. The modification basically uses the whole coil as the charging coil, also because the earth has been removed and connected to one of the regulator/rectifier AC inputs along with the original AC wire it means that both the positive and negative AC wave is rectified into DC. Finally, because the whole coil is now being used the AC input voltage will be over 14.7 volts which means that the reg/rec unit can convert it to DC and give and output of 14.7v. (I knew my degree in electronic systems engineering would become useful one day! 🙂 )
@@sidecarbod1441 cheers Pete :)
I'm trying to pin this comment but it won't let me. I'll maybe have to cut and paste it into a new comment and pin then.
@@AutoBeta2T Just spotted an error! I wrote 'half way', it should read 'half wave'
Edited 🙂
Will this be a battery operated headlight?
Yes, it is now 🙂
Where can I buy a 12v conversion kit?
Hi, there's no conversion kit as such.
I modified the generator as per the online article and just got a 12 volt battery and a cheap rectifier off ebay.
Will it work for 6v honda cd 70 1986 model. I am struggling to make it 12v volts
Hi Abdul, I'm not too sure really. The AR had a separate charging and headlight coil that gave 8 volt AC as standard but when connected together they gave 16 volts AC that then could be rectified and regulated to max 13.7 volt DC.
If the Honda is a similar system then I guess it could? Is there a later model that has a 12 volt system?
@@AutoBeta2T yes honda cd 70 1986 model is japanese made. It has same two coils yellow and white wires with point system.
Also yes the versions of cd 70 using 12v coils circuit and cdi.
Abdul, after having a look online I can't see a CD70 diagram. I've found a CD90 one that may be of some use if it's similar? oldmanhonda.com/MC/WiringDiagrams/
Hello, can i ask for the clear copy of this wire diagram sir
Hi, is it the standard AR electrical diagram you are after or when it is modified to 12 volts?
Yes sir, id be happy to have the standard one too if possible
Hi, there is a diagram and some good info here: www.thumpertalk.com/forums/topic/1361399-kawasaki-ar-6v-to-12v-conversion-confused-on-yellow-wire-from-stator-wiring-diagram-attachted/
I used this guide to do the conversion. It was really helpful. www.instructables.com/Kawasaki-AR-5080-12v-Conversion/
With this and the diagram from the last message I managed to get it working.
Cheers
Dave
Thank you so much, this is very helpful.