Even La Callas did not go this wild on the chest voice (in this particular work). They both knew that the voice should be kept light down there so it could move upwards more easily, which results in more overall freedom and agility. Callas' singing is phenomenal. It's basically Pallas Athena during the Gigantomachy. Fleming is a human being with exceptionally super vocal skills. I adore them both.
Fleming has one of the richest chest registers we have ever heard but she often dives down there in a way so raw (Especially in her Imogene) that somehow she looses the refinement... still not here, I find her fabulous here
@@LohengrinO there's only one soprano in recorded history who has been able to maintain such refinement in her singing. And that's Callas. Even past her prime! Her Arrigo is a testament. From C6 to F#3 with no audible break and then a trill on chest voice in one aria! Fleming here is sublime, though. Sutherland never could sing this. And that says something about Fleming.
I realized how refined Callas' chest is when I heard other chest-blessed singers.... when you hear Callas' chest the IMPRESSION created is Gigantic.. I think that led several singers with rich chest registers to push down there creating an almost Vulgar demonstration of chest voice... there I realized that despite the Gigantic Emotions Callas conveys down there, she remaines THE MOST refined singer of them all...
@@LohengrinO Callas' entire vocal training was based on that kind of singing. When she went to study with de Hidalgo she did not have the stratospheric highs, and her chest voice had been neglected. She knew she had to work on both ends to make something out of that voice. Someone who has disconnected registers can connect those registers through scalework etc better than anyone else! She was a miracle. She could sing her highest notes and her lowest ones side by side without losing that refinement!
I never understood though from a physiological point of view how her Voice sounds as homogenous when she does the descend from C6 to F3sharp in Arrigo while her signature sign was always the 3 timbrically different registers. Could it be that heterogeinity was something desired by Callas for interpetation reasons..?
This singer is a mature woman. In her pop song Endlessly, l was floored. I thought l was listening to a contralto. A strong chest voice, with a very dark colour, like chocolate and a bit smoky to boot. Renee shows us that age and maturation in the female voice, even in a high Soprano is a good thing. There's so much more strength, colour and drama to her voice. So exciting!
Very beautiful and lush, however I guess we can't avoid comparing every singer that does Armida with Callas. Lol. The 1952 recording is absolutely insane. Fleming here simply gives a present to every true opera lover. Gorgeous.
Hm, it would be perfect with the high E at the finale. But to be honest - this is miraculous. She had a voice consistent in all placements, and her timbre seems to melt everything around with its warmth as I'm listening to this. I don't even have the adjectives to describe how astonished I am. And that coloratura festival from 5:30, and the hold of the last note... to say that I'm content would be a huge understatement
Magica artista Renee Fleming...la sua voce e la sua bravura tingono di note d' oro le composizioni straordinarie dell' Imortale Maestro Gioachino Rossini ! Grazie LohengrinO ...ti saluto e ti auguro una buona giornata...🎷🎻🎸🎻di lavoro. Elsa Asta.Errata corrige alla parola..immortale manca una 'm' dimenticata nelle dita della mia mano..ciao ancora .
One would have thought that with the overwhelming success of her Armida, she would have focused more on bel canto in the 90s but we got one of the best Strauss sopranos in the world instead of a woman trying to be a lyric sized Callas.
for some strange reason after 1995-6 her Bel Canto approaches were plagued by a scooping that her singing mechanism self-developed to maintain the Lustrous, Divine, Gorgeous Surface of her Sound (wich was a Miracle by itself)... I always trust the choices such Artists make... I do regret though she never sang Norma (and Joan Sutherland never singing Kostanze - I will never forgive the Bonynges for that)
Lohengrin O Renee was engaged to sing Norma at the MET and then turned the invitation away on advice of Marilyn Horne. She was also supposed to sing Semiramide and nothing ever came of it.
Blame Marilyn Horne for Fleming never doing Norma. She asked her what she thought of her doing the role, having sung Adalgisa with some of the best, and Horne immediately replied "oh, no!"
I believe that by that time Fleming's coloratura abilities had gotten rather mushy, so while she had the range and the vocal color for it, she didn't have the last ingredient.
It is an amazing demonstration of an amazing voice in its radiant prime - the high notes and low notes are exceptional, and what a treat to hear this most difficult of coloratura arias unaspirated. I know you and primohomme and the writer of the assoluta book all disagree with me here, but I really prefer the 1993 version - I don’t like the scoops she does here in 1996 (eg 1:09 and 2:50) and I don’t like Qualers incredibly unsteady conducting constantly slowing down to let Fleming add an embellishment, instead of letting her do the rubato herself which she is such a master of - she’s indulging Fleming, but forgetting that Fleming has a very subtle rhythmic sense and can do amazing things with “robbed time” when she isn’t so indulged!) Fleming benefits from the dramatic context in the earlier recordings and the result is Cleaner, more urgent, thrilling singing. Yes it doesn’t have the Eb in the finale but I prefer everything else! I might be in the minority here amongst Fleming lovers.
Lohengrin O, Thank you this is so beautiful. Unfortunately my Callas Armida does not have a very good sound. Renee has several recordings of Armida, which would you recommend I buy? The one with Gregory Kunde perhaps? I appreciate your suggestions. Thanks
I have the same problem with Flemings Armida as with her Imogene: too nice singing.. when you hear Callas she is singing these arias like singung Medea or Abigaille.. spitting fire, wanting blood! You can hear how she spitts the words out and the scales are so built into the vocal line that they are actual screams/blasts of anguish/hurt and not just vocal tricks... But then again this really sounds great! Just not feeling anything from it.. the same with Sutherland.. a well 🙄 Regards, Dana
The difference is in preserving the voice - Callas and Sills are two great singers who opted to sacrifice voice for character - legitimate choices and definitely dramatic - but I feel Fleming acted and sang beautifully without placing her voice in danger - can’t say the same about either Callas or Sills - while it’s thrilling to hear singers sacrifice their voices for drama - it shortens careers and the problems show up
@@predickament This myth needs to end, Callas did not ruin her voice with her technique. She had connective tissue disease which caused her voice and body to decline. So many old school bel canto singers sang with her exact technique well into their 60s.
@@scottjohnson4850 well personally I wasn’t a fan - I never found her voice pleasant, but I did appreciate her stamina, musicianship and theatricality. I’m a singer and have a lot of technical knowledge, she had problems
@@predickament I think a big part of that is what records you’re inclined to listen to. Her singing 1953 and before is the best singing to exist, particularly live recordings not studio recordings. After that it’s questionable and I don’t always like it either
Her timbre is one of the most beautiful of history. I believe what you might not like are her vocal mannerism which are kind of weird here since she is not a natural coloratura, she is an accomplished coloratura singer but not natural.
She is a dark lyric soprano, had she not had that upper extension she would had been classified as a lyric mezzo. I believe her voice is A-class, just a bit on the small size. The way she rings her super easy upper register is priceless.
I don't like this timbre neither her interpretation. I also find her vibrato a bit annoying in the middle/low registers. Nevertheless, I do love some of her very high notes.
For mortal Armidas (as opposed to the demigod Armida we all know) Fleming does as much justice as she can to the role. It is impressive she did as well considering her face. I’ve had the pleasure of meeting Renee. I got a picture with her and was pretty much speechless. The only time I’ve been star-struck in my life! I could not speak other than a “....thank you....” Also I’ve posted a couple of uploads recently of Pinza and Callas th-cam.com/video/ARxPvd-GQrw/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/WA8Z5whuaIo/w-d-xo.html
Hermosa voz, buena técnica, pero no es el estilo, la coloratuta se nota forzada y los agudos tensos. Además no es una sfogatto, tuvo la inteligencia de cantar este tipo de óperas pocas veces y se introdujo en el mundo de su profesora, la prefiero en Straus, ella no es para la Ópera italiana
Vocalement c'est impressionnant, mais je suis toujours très agacé par ces minauderies qui viennent gâcher la ligne de chant. Des effets un peu jazzy et alanguis qui ne sont pas dans le style et qui "puccinisent" certains passages. Je l'ai entendue souvent en scène et notamment dans Imogène c'était insupportable. Pourtant quelle artiste et quelle voix- mais on peut se laisser charmer au miroir de sa voix- c'est de l'hédonisme.
I didn't enjoy it at all, regardless of the range. Her intense vibrato affected her pitch badly - it's a one-or-the-other job because they compete with each other for the singer's focus. She's by no means the only singer who falls down on this early in their career, and the American school has a lot to answer for one this. A few years ago I was listening to a "Live from the Met" of Tchaikovsky's Onegin with, I think, the bass David Morris singing a low aria. There was so much vibrato that his overall pitch was about a quarter of a tone low throughout the aria! Ghastly! I couldn't enjoy that performance so turned it off, and the American style tends to have that kind of effect as far as I'm concerned.
Expanding a bit on my comment, her vibrato gets much less intense as she becomes more experienced and musically aware, as in her Casta diva which I keep returning to compulsively!
jmiller05, I just don't like listening to off-key music. I avoid Anna Netrebko like the plague for that reason - I've heard her sing in tune occasionally, but that doesn't make up for the rest. There's an interesting comparison with pop music though: singers aren't so obsessed with the "right" technique, so at the professional level they sing in tune. Pulling the right strings in classical music can mean you'll get away with almost anything.
theinkbrain, so what? It's my response to the music. The pop world would never get away with this kind of highbrow pretentiousness where technique overrides musicality from the heart.
![Maria Callas in Nabucco (Highlights) [Napoli, 20/12/1949]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/rkXtkq0MUo4/mqdefault.jpg)
Even La Callas did not go this wild on the chest voice (in this particular work). They both knew that the voice should be kept light down there so it could move upwards more easily, which results in more overall freedom and agility. Callas' singing is phenomenal. It's basically Pallas Athena during the Gigantomachy. Fleming is a human being with exceptionally super vocal skills. I adore them both.
Fleming has one of the richest chest registers we have ever heard but she often dives down there in a way so raw (Especially in her Imogene) that somehow she looses the refinement... still not here, I find her fabulous here
@@LohengrinO there's only one soprano in recorded history who has been able to maintain such refinement in her singing. And that's Callas. Even past her prime! Her Arrigo is a testament. From C6 to F#3 with no audible break and then a trill on chest voice in one aria! Fleming here is sublime, though. Sutherland never could sing this. And that says something about Fleming.
I realized how refined Callas' chest is when I heard other chest-blessed singers.... when you hear Callas' chest the IMPRESSION created is Gigantic.. I think that led several singers with rich chest registers to push down there creating an almost Vulgar demonstration of chest voice... there I realized that despite the Gigantic Emotions Callas conveys down there, she remaines THE MOST refined singer of them all...
@@LohengrinO Callas' entire vocal training was based on that kind of singing. When she went to study with de Hidalgo she did not have the stratospheric highs, and her chest voice had been neglected. She knew she had to work on both ends to make something out of that voice. Someone who has disconnected registers can connect those registers through scalework etc better than anyone else! She was a miracle. She could sing her highest notes and her lowest ones side by side without losing that refinement!
I never understood though from a physiological point of view how her Voice sounds as homogenous when she does the descend from C6 to F3sharp in Arrigo while her signature sign was always the 3 timbrically different registers. Could it be that heterogeinity was something desired by Callas for interpetation reasons..?
Having equal weight in all registers is a vocal miracle itself.
Absofreakinglutely!
Sad news from today: Caballé has passed away. May her memory be eternal
This singer is a mature woman. In her pop song Endlessly, l was floored. I thought l was listening to a contralto. A strong chest voice, with a very dark colour, like chocolate and a bit smoky to boot. Renee shows us that age and maturation in the female voice, even in a high Soprano is a good thing. There's so much more strength, colour and drama to her voice. So exciting!
Always loved her Armida. She takes that velvety voice from top to bottom and back again! ^_^
Very beautiful and lush, however I guess we can't avoid comparing every singer that does Armida with Callas. Lol. The 1952 recording is absolutely insane. Fleming here simply gives a present to every true opera lover. Gorgeous.
Hm, it would be perfect with the high E at the finale. But to be honest - this is miraculous. She had a voice consistent in all placements, and her timbre seems to melt everything around with its warmth as I'm listening to this. I don't even have the adjectives to describe how astonished I am. And that coloratura festival from 5:30, and the hold of the last note... to say that I'm content would be a huge understatement
Magica artista Renee Fleming...la sua voce e la sua bravura tingono di note d' oro le composizioni straordinarie dell' Imortale Maestro Gioachino Rossini ! Grazie LohengrinO ...ti saluto e ti auguro una buona giornata...🎷🎻🎸🎻di lavoro. Elsa Asta.Errata corrige alla parola..immortale manca una 'm' dimenticata nelle dita della mia mano..ciao ancora .
WOW---------WHAT A VOICE !!
Freakin outrageously wonderful!!!
😊😊😊
One would have thought that with the overwhelming success of her Armida, she would have focused more on bel canto in the 90s but we got one of the best Strauss sopranos in the world instead of a woman trying to be a lyric sized Callas.
for some strange reason after 1995-6 her Bel Canto approaches were plagued by a scooping that her singing mechanism self-developed to maintain the Lustrous, Divine, Gorgeous Surface of her Sound (wich was a Miracle by itself)... I always trust the choices such Artists make... I do regret though she never sang Norma (and Joan Sutherland never singing Kostanze - I will never forgive the Bonynges for that)
Lohengrin O Renee was engaged to sing Norma at the MET and then turned the invitation away on advice of Marilyn Horne. She was also supposed to sing Semiramide and nothing ever came of it.
Blame Marilyn Horne for Fleming never doing Norma. She asked her what she thought of her doing the role, having sung Adalgisa with some of the best, and Horne immediately replied "oh, no!"
@@ThomasDawkins88 ... Do you know if anyone ever explained WHY Horne said no? Or why Fleming accepted that? Very disappointing!
I believe that by that time Fleming's coloratura abilities had gotten rather mushy, so while she had the range and the vocal color for it, she didn't have the last ingredient.
Beautiful voice indeed :)
what a Chest Voice !!!
and stamina, rich voice :)
Her voice is heavenly!!!
@@LohengrinO truly!
Wowza!
This is out of this world. What Rossini is this from, what recording or production, year? Extraordinary.
Happy New Year Lohengrin, and to all your followers......have a peaceful 2019......😚
Splendida!!!!
Splendide Renée Fleming.
It is an amazing demonstration of an amazing voice in its radiant prime - the high notes and low notes are exceptional, and what a treat to hear this most difficult of coloratura arias unaspirated. I know you and primohomme and the writer of the assoluta book all disagree with me here, but I really prefer the 1993 version - I don’t like the scoops she does here in 1996 (eg 1:09 and 2:50) and I don’t like Qualers incredibly unsteady conducting constantly slowing down to let Fleming add an embellishment, instead of letting her do the rubato herself which she is such a master of - she’s indulging Fleming, but forgetting that Fleming has a very subtle rhythmic sense and can do amazing things with “robbed time” when she isn’t so indulged!) Fleming benefits from the dramatic context in the earlier recordings and the result is Cleaner, more urgent, thrilling singing. Yes it doesn’t have the Eb in the finale but I prefer everything else! I might be in the minority here amongst Fleming lovers.
is there a D amore by Renee where she reaches an Eb6 in this aria? doesnt she here at some point?
Lohengrin O no, not in this aria only in the finale.
2:48 no Eb6?
Lohengrin O Db6
No e visto otra mejor que la CALLAS
Love it
BRAVA!
What an great Friday afternoon discovery
👏👏👏👏👏👏
Lohengrin O, Thank you this is so beautiful. Unfortunately my Callas Armida does not have a very good sound. Renee has several recordings of Armida, which would you recommend I buy? The one with Gregory Kunde perhaps? I appreciate your suggestions. Thanks
yes her very early one with Kunde in Pesaro is simply gorgeous and recorded live which gives extra energy... Renee is in flawless vocal form there
Thank you , thank you, thank you!!!!
I'm speechless
ye she is Gorgeous
@@LohengrinO Not only gorgeous, this is complete mastery of the instrument. THIS is how you utilise your voice to the fullest. Jaw dropping
Renee had a Miracle inside her throat
What happened to her agility? When I saw her live 10 years ago her voice was stiff and immovable. In the 90s she had a different throat
She lost weight, hence everything changed. I prefer her 90s version of whatever she sung than her later career.
@@danielng7795 too bad so lost so much weight, I saw the 2007 MET recording of her in Eugene Onegin , she looked famished, tiny waist.
Where did you find this picture?
it is me actually in a rather crazy state of mind...
Lohengrin O haha! Sometimes new pictures from that armida appear and I’m always so happy!
I have the same problem with Flemings Armida as with her Imogene: too nice singing.. when you hear Callas she is singing these arias like singung Medea or Abigaille.. spitting fire, wanting blood! You can hear how she spitts the words out and the scales are so built into the vocal line that they are actual screams/blasts of anguish/hurt and not just vocal tricks...
But then again this really sounds great! Just not feeling anything from it.. the same with Sutherland.. a well 🙄
Regards, Dana
The difference is in preserving the voice - Callas and Sills are two great singers who opted to sacrifice voice for character - legitimate choices and definitely dramatic - but I feel Fleming acted and sang beautifully without placing her voice in danger - can’t say the same about either Callas or Sills - while it’s thrilling to hear singers sacrifice their voices for drama - it shortens careers and the problems show up
@@predickament This myth needs to end, Callas did not ruin her voice with her technique. She had connective tissue disease which caused her voice and body to decline. So many old school bel canto singers sang with her exact technique well into their 60s.
@@scottjohnson4850 well personally I wasn’t a fan - I never found her voice pleasant, but I did appreciate her stamina, musicianship and theatricality. I’m a singer and have a lot of technical knowledge, she had problems
@@predickament I think a big part of that is what records you’re inclined to listen to. Her singing 1953 and before is the best singing to exist, particularly live recordings not studio recordings. After that it’s questionable and I don’t always like it either
@@scottjohnson4850 I have Callas to thank for my introduction and love for opera, I’ve only heard her on radio broadcast and recordings - I’m old :)
Upper and lower register- 9/10. Coloratura- 8/10.
Rene is good, but somehow I never could warm up to her timbre.
Her timbre is one of the most beautiful of history. I believe what you might not like are her vocal mannerism which are kind of weird here since she is not a natural coloratura, she is an accomplished coloratura singer but not natural.
@@beachfanatic2010 Nope, I ment her timbre. She is a good singer overall, but I don't like her sound.
She is a dark lyric soprano, had she not had that upper extension she would had been classified as a lyric mezzo. I believe her voice is A-class, just a bit on the small size. The way she rings her super easy upper register is priceless.
I don't like this timbre neither her interpretation. I also find her vibrato a bit annoying in the middle/low registers. Nevertheless, I do love some of her very high notes.
For mortal Armidas (as opposed to the demigod Armida we all know) Fleming does as much justice as she can to the role. It is impressive she did as well considering her face.
I’ve had the pleasure of meeting Renee. I got a picture with her and was pretty much speechless. The only time I’ve been star-struck in my life! I could not speak other than a “....thank you....”
Also I’ve posted a couple of uploads recently of Pinza and Callas
th-cam.com/video/ARxPvd-GQrw/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/WA8Z5whuaIo/w-d-xo.html
Hermosa voz, buena técnica, pero no es el estilo, la coloratuta se nota forzada y los agudos tensos. Además no es una sfogatto, tuvo la inteligencia de cantar este tipo de óperas pocas veces y se introdujo en el mundo de su profesora, la prefiero en Straus, ella no es para la Ópera italiana
Vocalement c'est impressionnant, mais je suis toujours très agacé par ces minauderies qui viennent gâcher la ligne de chant. Des effets un peu jazzy et alanguis qui ne sont pas dans le style et qui "puccinisent" certains passages. Je l'ai entendue souvent en scène et notamment dans Imogène c'était insupportable. Pourtant quelle artiste et quelle voix- mais on peut se laisser charmer au miroir de sa voix- c'est de l'hédonisme.
I didn't enjoy it at all, regardless of the range. Her intense vibrato affected her pitch badly - it's a one-or-the-other job because they compete with each other for the singer's focus. She's by no means the only singer who falls down on this early in their career, and the American school has a lot to answer for one this.
A few years ago I was listening to a "Live from the Met" of Tchaikovsky's Onegin with, I think, the bass David Morris singing a low aria. There was so much vibrato that his overall pitch was about a quarter of a tone low throughout the aria! Ghastly! I couldn't enjoy that performance so turned it off, and the American style tends to have that kind of effect as far as I'm concerned.
Expanding a bit on my comment, her vibrato gets much less intense as she becomes more experienced and musically aware, as in her Casta diva which I keep returning to compulsively!
You are obsessed with pitch. I think you have distorted frequencies or something lol.
jmiller05, I just don't like listening to off-key music. I avoid Anna Netrebko like the plague for that reason - I've heard her sing in tune occasionally, but that doesn't make up for the rest. There's an interesting comparison with pop music though: singers aren't so obsessed with the "right" technique, so at the professional level they sing in tune. Pulling the right strings in classical music can mean you'll get away with almost anything.
@@PeterBrodie You sound soooo fatuous.
theinkbrain, so what? It's my response to the music. The pop world would never get away with this kind of highbrow pretentiousness where technique overrides musicality from the heart.