The problem with Carlos Kleiber is that after hearing his conducting of any piece, one never wants to hear anyone else's version--because he does not create a version, only the music itself....
SALIMPUL Je suis parfaitement d' accord! Même si je ne comprend pas l'allemand, ses gestes, son sourire, ses yeux, sa sensibilité, c'est une belle manifestation de la Vie. Norah de Almeida
Un trésor précieux que ces moments faisant partie de l'histoire de la musique avec ce chef d'orchestre de génie qu'était Carlos Kleiber. Merci beaucoup pour le partage de cet excellent document!
Unbelievable how Kleiber speaks to the drummer and means, guides and thus educates the orchestra, the famous Vienna Philharmonic one, where Vienna Waltz is intrinsic. Outstanding!
+Johann Schneider is planning to post a complete translation of this eventually. Meanwhile, here is a translation of part of it -- beginning at about 1:46 and going to about 3:46. Kleiber: Deeda deeda dubda dubda dah … tss! There should be a percussion. There is only a percussion for 1?” Male voice: “The fifth bar, it has a percussion.” Kleiber: “It’s certainly always nice and loud, but there, in the areas where one should box an ear, there is nothing. Do you know why? On this Zampapa, is there nothing?” (Male voices in background talking about a bar.) Kleiber:”Well, in Bavaria we had … back then we had… Okay, then…” Male voice: “Just a moment, that should be possible.” Kleiber:” Do we have the repeat sign?” Male voice: “Before the repeat sign, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9…the ninth bar, there is a percussion.” Kleiber:”Is there nothing on 1?” Male voices, all talking at the same time, but one clearly audible: ”…very normal, there is nothing to indicate an accent. That’s the whole problem.” Kleiber: “And who plays 1? Who? Cymbals? Yes, well, a little nasty knock on the ear right there. Tatata chim! I’ll sing it alone. Lets play from the beginning.”
There seem to be only three items of rehearsal online of Carlos for the 1992 New Years Concert. I wonder why. I have read he didn’t like being filmed in rehearsals. Maybe this is why. Our loss. Kleiber is so relaxed and natural here, especially in the waltz Tausend Nacht und eine. He just radiates his love of it all to all of us and it is in his whole demeanour. Thank you.
Yeah, CK usually never allowed anyone to watch his rehearsals (he’d have his “thugs” check the halls before he began) let alone film them! So this was a surprise for sure. From what I’m able to gather, these rehearsal videos were filmed on 29th December 1991, the final rehearsal of the new year’s concerts and it was a favour granted to Marcel Prawy, who turned 80 that day. He was the chief dramatug in the Vienna state opera in the 1970s, and he was known in austria and Germany alike for introducing viewers to opera on the ORF channel with a wild sense of humour, ( his humour being something which would have appealed to CK.)
It might be the rehearsal for new-year-concert 1992. The Concertmaster in this rehearsel is still Gerhart Hetzel, who died about seven months later in July 1992 after an accident while hiking in the mountains.
This is Vienna philharmonic. I recognize the concert master. Such an open discussion between the player and conductor. All for the sake of music. Although I can’t understand German but I think this is what’s all about .
Poignant that this was just 7 months before the tragedy, and that he ended up performing his last new year's concert for the year he was to die😢 It is also perhaps one of the rare opportunities to hear his voice at 1:26, 1:58-2:10, and 2:53-3:00, though the camera doesn't show him directly at those scenes.
@@mooriable Absolutely. He seemed to be extremely keen as well to try to keep CK´s patience as much as possible. He could lose temper easily when things were not understood quickly. So here you can see how Hetzel tries to help the percussionist to find the passage and show Kleiber at the same time, that the orchestra wants to play exactly as he would like them to do so.
Karl Ludwig Bonifatius Kleiber. My old Pen pal! We miss you terribly. Look what they* have done, to your many attributes, and Legacy! You KNEW they would. * critics/fault-finders
@magnifier2020: Was bedeutet Probe? Das sind alles Spitzenmusiker (Wiener Philharmoniker). Jeder Dirigent wäre töricht, wenn er deren Meinung ignorierte. Es gilt im Sinne des Werkes das Beste herauszuholen. Dies ist für mich exzellente Probenarbeit, die den Vergleich mit Karajan (den ich nicht so sehr schätze) und Furtwängler nicht zu scheuen braucht.
He's talking about with Bavarian State Orchestra he does it THIS way....Vienna has a bit more raucous, less tight thunder, Bavaria sounds like machine gun fire.
IamNoMan776 "Stiff,narrow-minded group of musicians".....?? How insulting and obviously you never knew any of them, because your ignorant comment certainly does not apply to this lively interesting lively first class orchestra.
haha l'ironia finissima di "wuerden Sie die originale Bayreuther Fassung lassen" toll!!!! solo il Konzertmeister (che sarebbe morto dopo 6 mesi precipitando da una montagna) l'ha capita e sorride.
+Andrea Dobetti I agree. And every time I see pictures of this Konzertmeister I think of that terrible, tragic accident which took him from us too soon.
+Pathatique Dvorak Gerhart Hetzel died in 1992 after falling whilst walking in the mountains. He was an extremely fine violinist and orchestral leader and his death was a shocking event for the VPO.
magnifier2020 Ich habe wohl verstanden was er haben will und zwar deutlichst . Anscheinend verstehst nur Du es nicht - aber was spielt es für eine Rolle?
gegen ihre meinung spricht, dass kleiber seinen musikern noten gab, bei denen er bis ins letzte detail alles fein säuberlich notierte, was er als klang haben wollte. sollte irgendein musiker seine zusätzlichen ansagen in den proben trotz allem nicht verstanden haben, dürfte es an dessen mangelndem Horizont gelegen haben und nicht an ihm. Furtwängler und Kleiber liefern die interessantesten Klänge, Karajan schaffte das Außergewöhnliche, aus der Menge aller Aufnahmen Herausragende leider zu selten
@emilio65largo Das Problem hierbei war, dass wie Carlos selbst sagte, er die "Halodrio"-Fassung aus Bayern mitgebracht hatte, aber die Wiener Philharmoniker die Urschrift verwenden! Dort fehlen eben genau die Noten, die Carlos so gewohnt war! Eine herrliche Probe, die diesen Unterschied zwischen verschiedenen Versionen aufzeigt! ;) Und nein, der Dirigent hat nicht immer recht! :P
yeah, what a human being: wasting rehearsal time because he cannot count bar numbers to give to the cymbal player, instead insistent on beatboxing to the guy what he wants, and then acting frustrated when the guy has no idea where to strike. quite the humanity. everyone else is sitting there all, "Wann bitte ist Mittagspause?!?!" SHAMEFUL AS USUAL KLEIBER
It's okay Frank, you're musically insufficient and stupid, and that's absolutely fine. Who are you to criticize one of the greatest 20th-century conductors? Whom have you conducted? when you conduct the most important classical event of the year then you can come and criticize. Otherwise, shut up.
The problem with Carlos Kleiber is that after hearing his conducting of any piece, one never wants to hear anyone else's version--because he does not create a version, only the music itself....
One of the rarest and most special of conductors - transcendence of music!! THANKS
This is so precious that nobody will ever have any idea!...
gone far too soon.the man was a genius
I can't stop laughing when he's trolling the Viennese with his "... In Bayern ..." :D
Quelle joie immense de revoir Carlos Kleiber en répétition!! Quelle émotion de l'entendre à nouveau!!!
SALIMPUL
Je suis parfaitement d' accord! Même si je ne comprend pas l'allemand, ses gestes, son sourire, ses yeux, sa sensibilité, c'est une belle manifestation de la Vie. Norah de Almeida
Er war ein großartiger Dirigent!!!
herrlich einfach super Herr Kleiber
Das ist großartiger Stoff! Danke!
練習番号２の９小節前１拍目のベッケンの音符について、フィルハーモニカーのパート譜とマエストロがバイエルンの劇場で慣れているパート譜の記述が違っていて、そこを何度も確認しておられますが、最後は自分がミュンヘンからパート譜を持ってくればよかったねということで落着してますね。
Un trésor précieux que ces moments faisant partie de l'histoire de la musique avec ce chef d'orchestre de génie qu'était Carlos Kleiber.
Merci beaucoup pour le partage de cet excellent document!
Unbelievable how Kleiber speaks to the drummer and means, guides and thus educates the orchestra, the famous Vienna Philharmonic one, where Vienna Waltz is intrinsic. Outstanding!
They pretend doing it as a rehersal!!!
+Johann Schneider is planning to post a complete translation of this eventually. Meanwhile, here is a translation of part of it -- beginning at about 1:46 and going to about 3:46.
Kleiber: Deeda deeda dubda dubda dah … tss! There should be a percussion. There is only a percussion for 1?”
Male voice: “The fifth bar, it has a percussion.”
Kleiber: “It’s certainly always nice and loud, but there, in the areas where one should box an ear, there is nothing. Do you know why? On this Zampapa, is there nothing?”
(Male voices in background talking about a bar.)
Kleiber:”Well, in Bavaria we had … back then we had… Okay, then…”
Male voice: “Just a moment, that should be possible.”
Kleiber:” Do we have the repeat sign?”
Male voice: “Before the repeat sign, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9…the ninth bar, there is a percussion.”
Kleiber:”Is there nothing on 1?”
Male voices, all talking at the same time, but one clearly audible:
”…very normal, there is nothing to indicate an accent. That’s the whole problem.”
Kleiber: “And who plays 1? Who? Cymbals? Yes, well, a little nasty knock on the ear right there.
Tatata chim! I’ll sing it alone. Lets play from the beginning.”
dizzyology h
Thank you for taking the time to post the English translation
Georg, thanks for posting.
NH, USA
There seem to be only three items of rehearsal online of Carlos for the 1992
New Years Concert. I wonder why. I have read he didn’t like being filmed
in rehearsals. Maybe this is why. Our loss. Kleiber is so relaxed and natural
here, especially in the waltz Tausend Nacht und eine. He just radiates his
love of it all to all of us and it is in his whole demeanour. Thank you.
Yeah, CK usually never allowed anyone to watch his rehearsals (he’d have his “thugs” check the halls before he began) let alone film them! So this was a surprise for sure.
From what I’m able to gather, these rehearsal videos were filmed on 29th December 1991, the final rehearsal of the new year’s concerts and it was a favour granted to Marcel Prawy, who turned 80 that day. He was the chief dramatug in the Vienna state opera in the 1970s, and he was known in austria and Germany alike for introducing viewers to opera on the ORF channel with a wild sense of humour, ( his humour being something which would have appealed to CK.)
Dear Cymbals Player sehr geehrter Prof. Franz Zamazal RIP (February 2016) :(
It might be the rehearsal for new-year-concert 1992. The Concertmaster in this rehearsel is still Gerhart Hetzel, who died about seven months later in July 1992 after an accident while hiking in the mountains.
It's very hard to satisfy this incredible genius,but although I feel sorry for the musicians, but I am sure they all love him admire his personality ❤
Incredible musician and probably the greatest conductor of all times!
"An den Stellen, wo man eine Ohrfeige braucht, ist auf einmal nichts..." ^^
楽友協会のリハーサルですね‼️クライバーさんも亡くなり、悲しいです！でもお声が聞け、とっても嬉しいです💕💕🎶🎶最高‼️
La classe dell'insuperabile , inimitabile Carlos Kleiber!!!!!
Das hat mir sehr gefallen. Danke fürs hochladen!
excellence du travail, justesse de l'homme : un bonheur ...
Le meilleur chef de orchestre depuis toscanini et furtwaengler
This is Vienna philharmonic. I recognize the concert master. Such an open discussion between the player and conductor. All for the sake of music. Although I can’t understand German but I think this is what’s all about .
Yes. The concertmaster was Gerhart Hetzel. Sadly, he died in a mountaineering accident in 1992..
Poignant that this was just 7 months before the tragedy, and that he ended up performing his last new year's concert for the year he was to die😢 It is also perhaps one of the rare opportunities to hear his voice at 1:26, 1:58-2:10, and 2:53-3:00, though the camera doesn't show him directly at those scenes.
@@mooriable Absolutely. He seemed to be extremely keen as well to try to keep CK´s patience as much as possible. He could lose temper easily when things were not understood quickly. So here you can see how Hetzel tries to help the percussionist to find the passage and show Kleiber at the same time, that the orchestra wants to play exactly as he would like them to do so.
Karl Ludwig Bonifatius Kleiber. My old Pen pal! We miss you terribly. Look what they*
have done, to your many attributes, and Legacy! You KNEW they would.
* critics/fault-finders
”Well, in Bavaria we had … back then we had… Okay, then…” LOLLLLLLL Yeah, Kleiber just conducted Die Fledermaus with Bavaria about 2 years ago then.
Thank you for sharing this. Its quality isn't really bad at all. Not great, but perfectly watchable.
Thanks a lot for sharing...
Number One!!!!! The best!!!
なんでこんな幸せになるんだろう
I suoi magnifici unici pizzicati!!!
僕が聴く限り、１番好きな指揮者
カルロスが
Faszinierend.
Amazing forever ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
We have sung it with a Text in our Chorus. Awesome fast,and difficult ,but great.
Kleiber .....just plain made it look so easy.
The one and only
RIP maestro
カルロスが指揮すると、
聴いていてウキウキする
@magnifier2020: Was bedeutet Probe? Das sind alles Spitzenmusiker (Wiener Philharmoniker). Jeder Dirigent wäre töricht, wenn er deren Meinung ignorierte. Es gilt im Sinne des Werkes das Beste herauszuholen. Dies ist für mich exzellente Probenarbeit, die den Vergleich mit Karajan (den ich nicht so sehr schätze) und Furtwängler nicht zu scheuen braucht.
もっと独裁的なマエストロだと思っていたけど、意外と対話で作り上げていく指揮者だったのかな。
この映像でマエストロをさらに好きになりました。
He's talking about with Bavarian State Orchestra he does it THIS way....Vienna has a bit more raucous, less tight thunder, Bavaria sounds like machine gun fire.
Wow
Kleiber discusses interpretation with orchestra members. Unlike the usual conductors that do all the talking. More collaborative.
カルロスの頭の中では
打楽器が良く鳴ってる
同期がしっかりする
アンサンブル能力が極致
I wish there was a translation of this.
+Saïd Mrabet I'm going to translate it!
+Johann Schneider Wow cool, let me know!
Hi Johann, can you please give me a copy of the translation, thank you
Saïd Mrabet
Me too!
@@johannschneider6372 It's been 3 long years...lol
Le prove estenuanti e piene di suggerimenti ai Wiener Philharmoniker!
0:38 Was ist bloß mit dem Fotograf los??
❤😢
I understand him only when he speaks music
+אברהם מילר Thats enough, because this is the great thing of him.
+אברהם מילר I'm going to translate it!
プローベと言うよりも
カルロスの頭の中で鳴る音を
オーケストラ団員に必死に伝えてる
この動画は1992ニューイヤーのプローベですよね？
これはどこかで放映されたものですか？それともDVDですか？
日本語訳をどうしてもみてみたいのです。
和やかで素敵な映像です。ほんとに日本語訳が欲しいです。
1992年ニユーイヤーなら、コンサートマスターのゲアアルト・ヘッツェルの最晩年の映像ということになりますね。その意味でも貴重です。
Was the musikverein damaged in WW2 at all?
Kleiber was a breath of fresh musical air in a normally stiff, narrow-minded group of musicians.
Would it be air to refer to the Wiener Philharmoniker this?
IamNoMan776 "Stiff,narrow-minded group of musicians".....?? How insulting and obviously you never knew any of them, because your ignorant comment certainly does not apply to this lively interesting lively first class orchestra.
No, it isn’t fair! Great orchestra wonderful Carlos Kleiber!
haha l'ironia finissima di "wuerden Sie die originale Bayreuther Fassung lassen" toll!!!!
solo il Konzertmeister (che sarebbe morto dopo 6 mesi precipitando da una montagna) l'ha capita e sorride.
+Andrea Dobetti I agree. And every time I see pictures of this Konzertmeister I think of that terrible, tragic accident which took him from us too soon.
Nai61a
Could you please tell me about loosing this concertmaster? Thank you!
+Pathatique Dvorak Gerhart Hetzel died in 1992 after falling whilst walking in the mountains. He was an extremely fine violinist and orchestral leader and his death was a shocking event for the VPO.
Nai61a
Many thanks for important info, unfortunately we loose great musicians as him this way, thank you again!
Prof. Zamazal dead 2016. I dont like the young cymbalist of VPO. Zamazal was the best.
Is it possible someone put the subtitles?
+Samuel Samuel Co I'm going to translate it!
magnifier2020 Ich habe wohl verstanden was er haben will und zwar deutlichst . Anscheinend verstehst nur Du es nicht - aber was spielt es für eine Rolle?
magnifier2020 Jeder vernünftige Dirigent entschuldigt sich für Unterbrechungen, weil sie meistens da unterbrechen, wo man weiterspielen möchte...
gegen ihre meinung spricht, dass kleiber seinen musikern noten gab, bei denen er bis ins letzte detail alles fein säuberlich notierte, was er als klang haben wollte.
sollte irgendein musiker seine zusätzlichen ansagen in den proben trotz allem nicht verstanden haben, dürfte es an dessen mangelndem Horizont gelegen haben und nicht an ihm.
Furtwängler und Kleiber liefern die interessantesten Klänge, Karajan schaffte das Außergewöhnliche, aus der Menge aller Aufnahmen Herausragende leider zu selten
@emilio65largo Das Problem hierbei war, dass wie Carlos selbst sagte, er die "Halodrio"-Fassung aus Bayern mitgebracht hatte, aber die Wiener Philharmoniker die Urschrift verwenden! Dort fehlen eben genau die Noten, die Carlos so gewohnt war! Eine herrliche Probe, die diesen Unterschied zwischen verschiedenen Versionen aufzeigt! ;)
Und nein, der Dirigent hat nicht immer recht! :P
At one point Kleiber asks, “nur Anfang” . . . from the beginning?
There is a version with full translation at th-cam.com/video/EgaFotDzEtc/w-d-xo.html. Perhaps that is helpful for you?
The Viennese aren't rhythmically precise like the Berliners. But they make up for it with more lush and 'singing'.
父息子の２代で天才
奇跡
3:08 Kleiber looks stoned ....away with the fairies?
クライバーがプローベすると、輝く
Kleiber had such suave conducting in Strauss, putting the third rate Barenboim, Ozawa, Mehta, Abbado to shame....
Unglaublich,diese Arrogants von manchen Orchestermusiker.Die Entschuldigung vom Carlos Kleiber ist natürlich ironisch gemeint!
Deine Meinung wurde notiert.
Sorry, but do you speak german? Your comment is false.
Carlosのプローベは厳しい
本当の演奏を要求した厳しいさ
オーケストラ団員は不満もあったはず
しかし結果は極致
What's the music that they're playing?
+João Maria Vasconcelos Fontes de Barros Taveira Unter Donner und Blitz
演奏に厳しいベルクが唯一認めた指揮者は、カルロスのお父さんエーリッヒ
椿姫の序曲みたいにワクワクする
カルロスが指揮すると
私はショルティの椿姫がすき
you'd better understand Deutsche if wanna work with great conductors like him!
Who says waltzes are easy
It's a Polka not a Waltz! ;)
È…” lui”
Lava jato
yeah, what a human being: wasting rehearsal time because he cannot count bar numbers to give to the cymbal player, instead insistent on beatboxing to the guy what he wants, and then acting frustrated when the guy has no idea where to strike.
quite the humanity.
everyone else is sitting there all, "Wann bitte ist Mittagspause?!?!"
SHAMEFUL AS USUAL KLEIBER
come on, any decent musician would understand what he wanted with this Beckenschlag.
It's okay Frank, you're musically insufficient and stupid, and that's absolutely fine. Who are you to criticize one of the greatest 20th-century conductors? Whom have you conducted? when you conduct the most important classical event of the year then you can come and criticize. Otherwise, shut up.
Luis Ventoso
,
This is so precious on YT : everytime we have some incredible testimony like here, comes so a moron, "der ewige Troll" ....
l'ultima bacchetta magica.