Me, a Dark Souls 2 enjoyer: Well now there's a pleasant surprise. There's barely been any mention of DS2 at all so far. (sees that this video is only numbers 20 to 11) Oh no.
@@maximilianwonschik1304 Sure! I think it mainly comes down to exploration. I don't replay games, so basically all of my impression of a game comes from how I feel in the initial playthrough, and I get easily wowed by cool new environments, and DS2 had a pretty huge variety of those. I didn't mind that some of the bosses were pretty sub-par, since there were so many unique ones to discover and there were still great ones (although the best ones were largely in the DLCs, but I got into the series after the DLCs had come out so the game was all one big experience for me as opposed to playing it and waiting for those). Those reasons for loving DS2 probably explains why my other favorite FromSoft game is Elden Ring. Also, this is just hard to explain personal preference, but I also just really liked the lore and story of DS2. The game absolutely has its flaws and overly frustrating moments (For example I never beat Blue Smelter Demon because the runback was just too absurd), but the good stuff just ended up sticking with me more.
@@guillermosolacorral597yeah you can go through Frigid Outskirts without seeing a horse if you know what you’re doing. You can soul appease cheese Iron Passage but its still worse
Wait what?😳 I am now on my 3rd playthrough and I never realized that you could do that. That what I love about Elden Ring. You always find something new😊😊
13:07 “Using the shortcut near the Depths door that leaves you dealing with two assassins and a couple of doggos.” How dare you forget about my boy, the archer! I have named him Arnold, and he may not be the biggest threat, but he does his best.
Renalla’s runback doesn't deserve to be on here. The quickest way to her is to take the stairs. You can disable the boulder trap so it doesn't bother you. Once you do that and Moongrum is dead, you have a short runback with very little danger from the enemies.
Regarding the question of “what constitutes a runback?”, I would argue getting to the boss in the first place isn’t a runback. That’s running to the boss, but not having to go back to it. Not sure if that makes sense. I’m saying you would have to die from the boss (or homeward bone) only to have to run all the way BACK to the boss.
I wouldn't consider it a runback either. By that logic any runback that have a shortcut should also count as a longer/worse runback, as you have to do that before getting to the boss.
I'm glad Demon's Souls Remake was my first game in the genre, when I was at my most clueless and died WAY more than in every other game. I did some of the runbacks so many times, that even the worst runbacks in DS1 and 2 were only mildly annoying.
The Heide knights before old dragonslayer were so bad, I literally had to kill every enemy in that level so many times that they despawned, just so I could have a fair fight with the wyvern. Took me hours.
What makes ds1 runbacks worse that ds2 to me is the limited healing. I can get hit constantly running back in ds2 but still have plenty of healing items plus full health for the boss, you can’t do that in ds1
For all the grief the Dark Souls 2 dlc boss runs can give you, one factor is there to help you. The more times you kill enemies, the quicker they are removed! For Blue Smelter I went through the cells half a dozen times, killed the enemies in the valley of death via range at the same time. Result: all enemies killed, bring along your two summons and Smelty was dead on my first boss attempt. Got to make the game work for you and it's better than being killed by Smelty six times, plus you pick up a fair bit of xp! Attempted to do the same thing with Sir Allone but defeated him on my second attempt!
I think a compromise implementation of the Stake of Marika is if it would savestate your status. If you died, you could try again immediately but with whatever damage or loss of flasks the enemies could inflict on you. So you were still incentivized to figure out a clean route to that check point and then execute it well, once.
Some that come to mind from the games I've played so far: DS1: Ornstein and Smough, Capra Demon, Pinwheel (if you somehow died to him, like I did once) Bloodborne: Father Gascoigne, The One Reborn, Martyr Logarius Sekiro: None of the main bosses, but I think both versions of Juzou the Drunkard have pretty vicious paths back to them
Worst boss run backs for me are bed of chaos, tower knight, the adjudicator but by far the worst because I did realise there was a bonfire up a ladder that also shuts off the flame vents 😱😮💨🙈 was the run back to the old iron king I’m looking forward to the next chapter of this video
Im so glad i found your channel, you're the only youtuber who posts consistently, and i can always watch you when playing demon souls (and the rest of the series minus ds1) thank you
The bed of chaos from daughter of chaos takes around two and a half minutes to complete if you have decent stamina. I tested it once after I got frustrated on having to run back to the bed of bullshit for the 20th time
Honorable mention to the Centipede from Ds1, being the very first boss to have a short run back, yet having the unfortunate chance that a shortcut basically skips him
@@couchwilly5575 One, the runback is quite long including an elevator ride. Two, you have to deal with the blowdart sniper hidden behind an army of ghost ladies before you can climb up the ladder to the rooftops. Three, there's forced damage on one of the drop-offs. Four, Martyr Logarius is a pretty beefy boss who can easily force you to run this gauntlet multiple times. The Shadows of Yharnam runback is quite long, but there's a clear path back on which you only have to deal with the Maneater Boar (who you can run past) and no other enemy.
Currently hard stuck on Seath the Scaleless on my mage character. Lost the boss fight so many times cause I need to cut the tail for Moonlight Greatsword, died even more in the runback. And now I havent played that save in such a long time, I dont remember the way back. Tried to get back into it multiple time but seriously fuck that boss run.
When I first started playing elden ring I didn’t realize that the stakes of marika teleported you to the little statues and not the first site of grace in the game. It took me til the end of my second playthrough to misclick on a mohg attempt. I was livid
Old Hero, Flamelurker, Dirty Colossus, Darklurker, Lud and Zallen are the worst that come to my head now. Very curious if any of these make your top 10.
I don't know how do you consider the Blue Smelter Demon a good boss. The original one? Sure. But Blue Smelter Demon is literally the same, except with magic damage and different timings to his attacks. That is, on paper, a good boss, but unless you get the SotFS edition of the game... you're paying for this. You're paying for a glorified modded boss, the Smelter Demon is worse than Lud and Zallen in that regard, because at least Lud and Zallen are copies of a DLC boss.
Y'know, I actually really like Tomb of the Giants. It's so atmospheric to be in such a dark area, the only light coming from your lantern. Makes it very haunting. And then those dog skeletons and their sounds? Amazing. It's honestly one of my favorite areas in the entire soulsborne series
I actually agree on the hot topic of the Seath runback. It is not as bad as people say, especially if you know the trick of using the falling snow to navigate the invisible cystals, and certainly not as bad as other boss runbacks in Dark Souls 1. CoughcoughFourKingscoughcough. Oh my god I DESPISE that runback. F them bloody Darkwraiths in the way. You even need to kill the last ones right before the fog gate if you want to summon that witch NPC for the boss fight. But even if not, the Darkwraits are just bloody annoying. And for some reason, I keep struggling with the Four Kings as is. I don't wanna waste an Estus on the bloody mobs on the way to the boss. It's not short either, unfortunately. That said, I'm curious about part 2, and if the Four Kings will actually appear on there. Looking forward to it, Billy!
I have to actually point out another factor that makes the runback to Rennala worse that is so...innocuous: that one behatted Aristocrat on the stairs. I've had. So many. Runbacks ruined by him deciding 'Oh hey bro where you goin' so fast' and walk in front of me just in time for me to get railed by glintstone shards. And my feelings about the Iron Passage are. *Abundantly* spread. I feel like whoever designed that should have their game design privileges seriously monitored.
2 months ago I would have watched this video 1. because you're one of my favorite new youtubers I've discovered, and 2. to see what I would be getting myself into as I play through the series. But now I've played every game in the series except ds3 and sekiro, and I've just left Limgrave in Elden Ring. So I can HOPEFULLY see that the bad runbacks are behind me. Stakes of Marika exist so THERE BETTER NOT BE AWFUL RUNBACKS IN ELDEN RING, PLEASE!
True. On the other hand, one shouldn't go down to Blighttown without enough purple moss anyways. If you stock up on that beforehand, the poisoning shouldn't be an issure. Especially coupled with other equipment reducing poison building. Like that ninja set, whatever it's called again, and the spider shield. And isn't the Poison Bite Ring available before you go down there?
As others have pointed out, yeah, Purple Moss and the Rusted Iron Ring render the run pretty much a non-issue. Sure, you might end up having to burn an Estus before you enter the arena, but that doesn't mean much for a boss where you can guarantee your safety from almost all attacks by sticking to her sides.
The vast majority of runbacks require zero fighting, once you find a route that works for you. The DS2 optional co-op challenge areas, the infamous Alonne and Blue Smelter runbacks, take a minute or less, consistently. The notorious Frigid Outskirts is where things get spicy, because it’s a long distance, and getting to the boss without having to fight a Reindeer or two is unusual. But for my money, the number 1 is in the Iron Keep. The runback to Smelter Demon, specifically in the Scholar remake edition, requires you to fight the enemies the entire way there. The overhauled enemy placements will stop you from entering the fog wall 9/10 times. There are other boss runbacks with enemies you have to fight, but none where it is pretty much essential that every single enemy along the way is dispatched.
Can't recall if I'm remembering it right, but I think Dragonslayer Armor deserves a mention. Since I think that runback is two very long elevator rides that are needlessly slow. Though again there might be something I forgot about it.
Thank Marika for her precious statues. I’m not great at Souls games despite my many hours in these games so I still regularly die against even the „easy“ bosses. It’s not dying to the boss that makes me hate my life but a tedious runback. My personal „favorite“ is the one to the Four Kings. Back when I did some „challenge running“ to join the Darkwraith Covenant those guys were my Nemesis(es?) and the runback was their strongest gank partner.
Darklurker is an example of a great boss with such a bafflingly awful run that I dont do it much. The fact that you have to use an effigy and then clear a mini-level just to fight it again feels like padding the length of the game (an all bosses playthrough at least)
I don't mind long boss runbacks THAT ARE EXACTLY LIKE RENNALS AND PLACIS so they aren't that bad for me but ones that are long like sir alonnes combined with disgustingly bad level design it is cancer inducing
For Rennala, you can disable boulder spawn to make it somewhat easier. But I understand the placement, as it is quite long. However, such low place for BoC somewhat surprises me since path to boss is just bad for me, either forcing to wear ring or run past a enemy that is hard to dodge in small place. Can't wait for Part 2, which could easily be filled only by Dark Souls 2. My boy, no entry has such large amount of awful runbacks to bosses - co-op bosses, Sir Alonne, Red Smelter Demon, Charriot just to name a few after seconds of memories from game completed long ago.
I personally found the run to Red Wolf of Radagon far worse than the run to Renalla. The Red Wolf run has several unavoidable mage encounters, and trying to run past instead of confronting them is often an effective way to get yourself killed. Rennala's run, conversely, has enemies that are either easy to run past or can be perma-killed. Even the rolling ball can become a complete non-issue by taking out the crew that spawns it. I personally found the shortcut to be pointless, because you need to take a significantly more dangerous route to access it.
Funny that you showed Cainhurst and highlighted that you liked the area as a set piece because that exact area is my least favorite run back in Bloodborne. There's only one lantern in Cainhurst. Then, you take the elevator, have to rush past a room of shrieking ghosts and blow dart imps, climb a ladder and then, to add insult to injury, the game forces fall damage on you right before the boss so you'll never face Martyr Logarius at full strength no matter how good you are at fighting/avoiding enemies. Totally agree Cainhurst is one of the most beautiful environments in the game but we have to agree to disagree on it balancing that awful, awful runback
Rennala's run back was kinda tedious, but it was made worse by that one carian knight npc. Bro is, was and always will be an annoying bugger to deal with.
rennala’s run back is so easy. literally just turn off the thing spawning the giant balls, kill the npc guy, and after that there is 0 threats throughout the whole runback PERMANENTLY.
You say Rennala is going to be the only ER entry, thanks to Marika's statues, but I remember hating the runback to Commander Niall's in Castle Sol, but maybe I'm remembering it wrong?
Let me rephrase - I'd love to know how long the quickest variant of the runback is. So one where I'm not stopping to fight enemies, etc. I don't have a save near the location so I can't check without playing through half of the game again ^^
Runbacks contribute nothing but frustration to the game. Even makes you enjoy the boss less because you just want to get it over with so you don’t have to go through the run back again.
imo True King Allant should be way higher because its not just the room with various enemies and a red eye knight, its not just the bridge with the dragon, its not just the stairs with the dragon and not just because it has no shortcut wich would already be very bad...... its the ELEVATOR that takes like a whole minute to get to the boss, wtf is that elevator fr? this runback is unbearable
Worst boss runback for me is between Sir Alonne and The One Reborn. Alonne is objectively worse but the stupid casket pile things are my personal least favourite enemy ever. They're like the elden ring lobsters if I remember right.
Placements I disagree with: Sheaths runback isn’t that bad because you never have to run back to Seath. Also, going through my favorite area in the game again doesn’t sound bad. The bed of chaos runback is not a runback I hate because I found the hidden bonfire. Gravelord Nitos runback is not a runback I hate because I found the hidden bonfire.
Calling it now before I watch the video: they are all gonna be from OG demons souls and Dark Souls 2 adding on Tomb of the Giants Edit: I love the name “blue goobers”
My thoughts on some of these 20: This is so tame compared to some of the older games. It takes kind of a long time, but the threat of dying is not there compared to others. I understand putting it there for variety though 18: the clams are kind of stupid and some of the geometry is really janky but I agree it's not horrible. 17: This one isn't horrible compared to some others, but what makes it really dreadful is that there is nothing to look forward to. Also fuck that annoying noise that walking in the lava makes 16/15: havent played DeS but this is definitely not selling me on it 14: yeah I always stand behind the fire in lower burg so the dogs run into it. I have enough dogs to deal with past the boss fog already 13: correct. Fuck scholar "hurr durr it has Heide in the name so let's put 30 of them scattered all around the area" 11: I assume cave of the dead will be higher than this, which I disagree with. With the petrified resistance ring it's actually really easy, much more consistent than this. (Im live commenting as I watch so I will finish this later)
Boss run backs are the absolute worst parts of many soulsborne games that’s why I’m so happy Soulsborne and soulslikes in general are starting to move away from them. With Elden ring and Lies Of P barely having them or having shorter ones
"So unbalanced for a single player experience" - except the ds2 dlc side paths are /explicitly/ intended for co-op play. You're not /supposed/ to solo them. Even co-op they're not great, but the awful reputation really isn't deserved when you play them as intended. Soloing them is essentially a challenge run.
Personally Bed of Chaos has one of the worst. If it were any other boss, it wouldn’t be anywhere close to the worst, but considering you can lose in literally seconds through (mostly) no fault of your own, that runback shouldn’t be any longer than 10 seconds
I have played only Sekiro, DS1, and DS3. The Twin Princes run back is worse than the bed of chaos. I’ll say it. All I have to do is run up a root, pass dragon statue things and a huge grinder with eyes, take a left, and I’m at the bed. I have to get through stabbing skeletons, archers, and knights that I hope buff their weapons so that I don’t have to try to dodge their attacks to get to the twins. It’s way more annoying because they placed so many enemies on the stairs. Seath’s boss run is the overall worst boss run in my opinion though. Edit: I lied. The Capra Demon run is the worst one for me.
@@redfish337 I was using the grand archives bonfire. I had no idea that there was an elevator to the right of the building door. I heard about it while searching on reddit but I couldn’t find a video of how to actually find it. I just skimmed through fightingcowboy’s play through after you replied to maybe find it and he used the shortcut you’re talking about. It’s not bad after all. Thanks.
Would you rather get rid of boss runbacks but boss difficulty is doubled or keep the runbacks? I just want to know cause with all this talk about how bad the runbacks are, all I can say is damn! Also, I watched my uncle play the dark souls trilogy and Elden ring was my first fromsoft game and I haven't gotten to play any others, so I truly can't argue just how bad certain bosses or runbacks are.
Did you include Rennala's runback, simply to have something from Elden Ring included? To be honest, that runback isn't even bad. It falls at a simular level as a mediocre runback from Bloodborn and DS3. Which is far from top 20 worst
![Ranking the Worst Boss Runbacks in Soulsborne! [Part 2]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/xMg6TVSXovc/mqdefault.jpg)
![Ranking the Worst Boss Runbacks in Soulsborne! [Part 2]](/img/tr.png)
Me, a Dark Souls 2 enjoyer: Well now there's a pleasant surprise. There's barely been any mention of DS2 at all so far.
(sees that this video is only numbers 20 to 11)
Oh no.
Same lol
Dark Souls 2 is my favorite of the trilogy, but I'm definitely willing to recognize boss runbacks are a big weakness it had.
Yeah..... come 10-1 we are gonna get flamed for liking Dark Souls 2
I really want to understand how ds2 is your favourite in the series. I am genuinly curious cause it's my least favourite by a long shot@@redpoemage
@@maximilianwonschik1304 Sure! I think it mainly comes down to exploration. I don't replay games, so basically all of my impression of a game comes from how I feel in the initial playthrough, and I get easily wowed by cool new environments, and DS2 had a pretty huge variety of those. I didn't mind that some of the bosses were pretty sub-par, since there were so many unique ones to discover and there were still great ones (although the best ones were largely in the DLCs, but I got into the series after the DLCs had come out so the game was all one big experience for me as opposed to playing it and waiting for those). Those reasons for loving DS2 probably explains why my other favorite FromSoft game is Elden Ring. Also, this is just hard to explain personal preference, but I also just really liked the lore and story of DS2.
The game absolutely has its flaws and overly frustrating moments (For example I never beat Blue Smelter Demon because the runback was just too absurd), but the good stuff just ended up sticking with me more.
We all know that the fridges outskirts are gonna be 1
Ngl, Iron Passage is way worst.
@@guillermosolacorral597yeah you can go through Frigid Outskirts without seeing a horse if you know what you’re doing. You can soul appease cheese Iron Passage but its still worse
@@guillermosolacorral597I didn’t mind iron passage that much
@@whodatiscody Exactly this. The Soul Appease method is tedious af, but it it is the only way to deal with it without being gangbanged.
Idk if this is JUST the run back and not the combo of boss run back + boss itself, the blue smelter demon’s run back is worse
Stakes of Marika were such a welcome addition.
Edit: also, if you kill the upstairs crew that drop the ball, they will stop dropping it permanently.
Indeed, they did a great thing. Bloodborne and Demons souls had some terrible boss runs.
bloodborne?@@issi529
Wait what?😳
I am now on my 3rd playthrough and I never realized that you could do that.
That what I love about Elden Ring.
You always find something new😊😊
I’m a bit shocked about cainhurst not being included. That mandatory damage feels like from soft just flipping me the bird every time
Do you remember the One reborn runback?
@mauro.d2728 One Reborn runback doesn't have mandatory damage. Logarius only has one route and it requires fall damage.
@@mauro.d2728yeah but one reborn doesnt feel as bad since Logarius is so much harder
i went into tomb of the giants and ran into a dark souls veteran who guided me throughout the whole level, my hero.. we need more people like him
Become him.
13:07 “Using the shortcut near the Depths door that leaves you dealing with two assassins and a couple of doggos.” How dare you forget about my boy, the archer! I have named him Arnold, and he may not be the biggest threat, but he does his best.
Renalla’s runback doesn't deserve to be on here. The quickest way to her is to take the stairs. You can disable the boulder trap so it doesn't bother you. Once you do that and Moongrum is dead, you have a short runback with very little danger from the enemies.
Yeah it’s actually not bad at all I can think of many more run backs that are worse
Regarding the question of “what constitutes a runback?”, I would argue getting to the boss in the first place isn’t a runback. That’s running to the boss, but not having to go back to it.
Not sure if that makes sense. I’m saying you would have to die from the boss (or homeward bone) only to have to run all the way BACK to the boss.
I wouldn't consider it a runback either. By that logic any runback that have a shortcut should also count as a longer/worse runback, as you have to do that before getting to the boss.
I'm glad Demon's Souls Remake was my first game in the genre, when I was at my most clueless and died WAY more than in every other game. I did some of the runbacks so many times, that even the worst runbacks in DS1 and 2 were only mildly annoying.
The Heide knights before old dragonslayer were so bad, I literally had to kill every enemy in that level so many times that they despawned, just so I could have a fair fight with the wyvern. Took me hours.
What makes ds1 runbacks worse that ds2 to me is the limited healing. I can get hit constantly running back in ds2 but still have plenty of healing items plus full health for the boss, you can’t do that in ds1
As infuriating as the iron passage, frigid outskirts and cave of the dead are... they have nothing on the sheer length of the Four Kings runback.
Oceiros and Midir runbacks are worse than Rennala's runback.
For all the grief the Dark Souls 2 dlc boss runs can give you, one factor is there to help you. The more times you kill enemies, the quicker they are removed! For Blue Smelter I went through the cells half a dozen times, killed the enemies in the valley of death via range at the same time. Result: all enemies killed, bring along your two summons and Smelty was dead on my first boss attempt. Got to make the game work for you and it's better than being killed by Smelty six times, plus you pick up a fair bit of xp! Attempted to do the same thing with Sir Allone but defeated him on my second attempt!
I think a compromise implementation of the Stake of Marika is if it would savestate your status.
If you died, you could try again immediately but with whatever damage or loss of flasks the enemies could inflict on you.
So you were still incentivized to figure out a clean route to that check point and then execute it well, once.
As someone who didn’t know or use stakes of marika, I hate the Radhan run back
Some that come to mind from the games I've played so far:
DS1: Ornstein and Smough, Capra Demon, Pinwheel (if you somehow died to him, like I did once)
Bloodborne: Father Gascoigne, The One Reborn, Martyr Logarius
Sekiro: None of the main bosses, but I think both versions of Juzou the Drunkard have pretty vicious paths back to them
Worst boss run backs for me are bed of chaos, tower knight, the adjudicator but by far the worst because I did realise there was a bonfire up a ladder that also shuts off the flame vents 😱😮💨🙈 was the run back to the old iron king I’m looking forward to the next chapter of this video
how do you lose in adjudicator
@@konstantino2009 the run down the cliff side manta rays firing crystals at you and the rolling skelys
Im so glad i found your channel, you're the only youtuber who posts consistently, and i can always watch you when playing demon souls (and the rest of the series minus ds1) thank you
The bed of chaos from daughter of chaos takes around two and a half minutes to complete if you have decent stamina. I tested it once after I got frustrated on having to run back to the bed of bullshit for the 20th time
Honorable mention to the Centipede from Ds1, being the very first boss to have a short run back, yet having the unfortunate chance that a shortcut basically skips him
The Martyr Logarius runback is torturous
I didn’t think it was too bad, just a little too long
@@couchwilly5575 One, the runback is quite long including an elevator ride. Two, you have to deal with the blowdart sniper hidden behind an army of ghost ladies before you can climb up the ladder to the rooftops. Three, there's forced damage on one of the drop-offs. Four, Martyr Logarius is a pretty beefy boss who can easily force you to run this gauntlet multiple times. The Shadows of Yharnam runback is quite long, but there's a clear path back on which you only have to deal with the Maneater Boar (who you can run past) and no other enemy.
Currently hard stuck on Seath the Scaleless on my mage character. Lost the boss fight so many times cause I need to cut the tail for Moonlight Greatsword, died even more in the runback. And now I havent played that save in such a long time, I dont remember the way back. Tried to get back into it multiple time but seriously fuck that boss run.
Check out fightin cowboys walkthrough for all the help you need!
When I first started playing elden ring I didn’t realize that the stakes of marika teleported you to the little statues and not the first site of grace in the game. It took me til the end of my second playthrough to misclick on a mohg attempt. I was livid
Old Hero, Flamelurker, Dirty Colossus, Darklurker, Lud and Zallen are the worst that come to my head now. Very curious if any of these make your top 10.
I don't know how do you consider the Blue Smelter Demon a good boss. The original one? Sure. But Blue Smelter Demon is literally the same, except with magic damage and different timings to his attacks. That is, on paper, a good boss, but unless you get the SotFS edition of the game... you're paying for this. You're paying for a glorified modded boss, the Smelter Demon is worse than Lud and Zallen in that regard, because at least Lud and Zallen are copies of a DLC boss.
Didn’t include Sekiro in this list because he wants to mention it as least as possible with how much he hates it
I can't really recall a single bad runback in that game anyway
Y'know, I actually really like Tomb of the Giants. It's so atmospheric to be in such a dark area, the only light coming from your lantern. Makes it very haunting. And then those dog skeletons and their sounds? Amazing. It's honestly one of my favorite areas in the entire soulsborne series
Ah man I hoped the second part was up already. Great video you activated some PTSD from some DS2 runbacks so far.
I actually agree on the hot topic of the Seath runback. It is not as bad as people say, especially if you know the trick of using the falling snow to navigate the invisible cystals, and certainly not as bad as other boss runbacks in Dark Souls 1. CoughcoughFourKingscoughcough. Oh my god I DESPISE that runback. F them bloody Darkwraiths in the way. You even need to kill the last ones right before the fog gate if you want to summon that witch NPC for the boss fight. But even if not, the Darkwraits are just bloody annoying. And for some reason, I keep struggling with the Four Kings as is. I don't wanna waste an Estus on the bloody mobs on the way to the boss. It's not short either, unfortunately. That said, I'm curious about part 2, and if the Four Kings will actually appear on there. Looking forward to it, Billy!
I have to actually point out another factor that makes the runback to Rennala worse that is so...innocuous: that one behatted Aristocrat on the stairs. I've had. So many. Runbacks ruined by him deciding 'Oh hey bro where you goin' so fast' and walk in front of me just in time for me to get railed by glintstone shards.
And my feelings about the Iron Passage are. *Abundantly* spread. I feel like whoever designed that should have their game design privileges seriously monitored.
2 months ago I would have watched this video 1. because you're one of my favorite new youtubers I've discovered, and 2. to see what I would be getting myself into as I play through the series. But now I've played every game in the series except ds3 and sekiro, and I've just left Limgrave in Elden Ring. So I can HOPEFULLY see that the bad runbacks are behind me. Stakes of Marika exist so THERE BETTER NOT BE AWFUL RUNBACKS IN ELDEN RING, PLEASE!
it’s funny cuz I was literally about to search for a list on this topic and my guy BILLY THE BADMAN got me once again
I'm quite surprised there's no Quelagg runback where you pretty much can't avoid being poisoned
True. On the other hand, one shouldn't go down to Blighttown without enough purple moss anyways. If you stock up on that beforehand, the poisoning shouldn't be an issure. Especially coupled with other equipment reducing poison building. Like that ninja set, whatever it's called again, and the spider shield. And isn't the Poison Bite Ring available before you go down there?
Oh I fully expect that one to be within the top 10 HAAHAHA
@@AiorosSagittariusalso you can go back and get the rusted iron ring before going so you aren’t slow in the muck
As others have pointed out, yeah, Purple Moss and the Rusted Iron Ring render the run pretty much a non-issue. Sure, you might end up having to burn an Estus before you enter the arena, but that doesn't mean much for a boss where you can guarantee your safety from almost all attacks by sticking to her sides.
The vast majority of runbacks require zero fighting, once you find a route that works for you. The DS2 optional co-op challenge areas, the infamous Alonne and Blue Smelter runbacks, take a minute or less, consistently. The notorious Frigid Outskirts is where things get spicy, because it’s a long distance, and getting to the boss without having to fight a Reindeer or two is unusual. But for my money, the number 1 is in the Iron Keep. The runback to Smelter Demon, specifically in the Scholar remake edition, requires you to fight the enemies the entire way there. The overhauled enemy placements will stop you from entering the fog wall 9/10 times. There are other boss runbacks with enemies you have to fight, but none where it is pretty much essential that every single enemy along the way is dispatched.
Can't recall if I'm remembering it right, but I think Dragonslayer Armor deserves a mention. Since I think that runback is two very long elevator rides that are needlessly slow. Though again there might be something I forgot about it.
Daughters of Chaos to Bed of Chaos takes approximately 2,5 minutes. If you dodge the Titanite Demon, that is.
Thank Marika for her precious statues. I’m not great at Souls games despite my many hours in these games so I still regularly die against even the „easy“ bosses. It’s not dying to the boss that makes me hate my life but a tedious runback.
My personal „favorite“ is the one to the Four Kings. Back when I did some „challenge running“ to join the Darkwraith Covenant those guys were my Nemesis(es?) and the runback was their strongest gank partner.
Darklurker is an example of a great boss with such a bafflingly awful run that I dont do it much. The fact that you have to use an effigy and then clear a mini-level just to fight it again feels like padding the length of the game (an all bosses playthrough at least)
I just got seikiro for my birthday last night and spent 3 1/2 hours getting thrown around by that stupid ogre💀
I don't mind long boss runbacks THAT ARE EXACTLY LIKE RENNALS AND PLACIS so they aren't that bad for me but ones that are long like sir alonnes combined with disgustingly bad level design it is cancer inducing
For Rennala, you can disable boulder spawn to make it somewhat easier. But I understand the placement, as it is quite long. However, such low place for BoC somewhat surprises me since path to boss is just bad for me, either forcing to wear ring or run past a enemy that is hard to dodge in small place.
Can't wait for Part 2, which could easily be filled only by Dark Souls 2. My boy, no entry has such large amount of awful runbacks to bosses - co-op bosses, Sir Alonne, Red Smelter Demon, Charriot just to name a few after seconds of memories from game completed long ago.
Dark Souls 2 is my favorite. But it has the absolute worst runbacks. I cannot deny it. Frigid Outskirts will be number 1, it deserves it.
Just wanted to put a comment of appreciation for your content. My favourite Soulsbourne content creator rn!
I personally found the run to Red Wolf of Radagon far worse than the run to Renalla. The Red Wolf run has several unavoidable mage encounters, and trying to run past instead of confronting them is often an effective way to get yourself killed.
Rennala's run, conversely, has enemies that are either easy to run past or can be perma-killed. Even the rolling ball can become a complete non-issue by taking out the crew that spawns it. I personally found the shortcut to be pointless, because you need to take a significantly more dangerous route to access it.
Let's not forget that there's no bonfires in New londo ruins.
I still hate to do that dreadfull runback each time I have to fight Lady Maria, thank god the fight isn't that hard.
You know it's a painful runback when you memorize the less painful path.
This a complilation of DS 1&2 being what I most want to reexperience but always end up installing 3 or Bloodborne instead
i know old but i do think martyr logarius deserves a shout for this, maybe not on the list itself but the ladder with the knife thrower enrages me.
If you think runbacks are good for the games then you’re insane
Funny that you showed Cainhurst and highlighted that you liked the area as a set piece because that exact area is my least favorite run back in Bloodborne.
There's only one lantern in Cainhurst. Then, you take the elevator, have to rush past a room of shrieking ghosts and blow dart imps, climb a ladder and then, to add insult to injury, the game forces fall damage on you right before the boss so you'll never face Martyr Logarius at full strength no matter how good you are at fighting/avoiding enemies.
Totally agree Cainhurst is one of the most beautiful environments in the game but we have to agree to disagree on it balancing that awful, awful runback
I've only beaten ER and DS1 so far:
ER: none
DS1: bed of chaos, four kings (hate waiting for elevators), seath, nito
Rennala's run back was kinda tedious, but it was made worse by that one carian knight npc. Bro is, was and always will be an annoying bugger to deal with.
His weakness is Night Comet and Walking Backwards (assuming you shut down the ball first)
rennala’s run back is so easy. literally just turn off the thing spawning the giant balls, kill the npc guy, and after that there is 0 threats throughout the whole runback PERMANENTLY.
...I watched this in hopes that I was an idiot and missed a bonfire somewhere... *sigh* sadly no
Final Fantasy X battle theme in the intro ? Instant like
You say Rennala is going to be the only ER entry, thanks to Marika's statues, but I remember hating the runback to Commander Niall's in Castle Sol, but maybe I'm remembering it wrong?
I found that runback super easy. Only a couple enemies, easy to dodge past. I do think including that one elevator that nobody used was a dumb idea.
I guess I just sucked at it, also didnt help I struggled way too much on Niall :p
“I’d love to know how long the run back is” bro you literally have the footage in front of you
Let me rephrase - I'd love to know how long the quickest variant of the runback is. So one where I'm not stopping to fight enemies, etc. I don't have a save near the location so I can't check without playing through half of the game again ^^
I hear battle music from a fantasy game that's an ending. Cheers!
Your original Nito run 😮. The nearer bonfire was bad enough
The One reborn's runback is much worse than the Shadows
You had me at peepeepoopoo watermelon garb-bage 😂
We all know what #1 is gonna be. And we all know exactly what story he’s gonna tell about it.
Billy complains about Lost Izolith titanite demon but only has mid game health stat
Runbacks contribute nothing but frustration to the game. Even makes you enjoy the boss less because you just want to get it over with so you don’t have to go through the run back again.
Before I start, blue flame Smelter Demon needs to be #1 😂 this video was made specifically for DS2
imo True King Allant should be way higher because its not just the room with various enemies and a red eye knight, its not just the bridge with the dragon, its not just the stairs with the dragon and not just because it has no shortcut wich would already be very bad...... its the ELEVATOR that takes like a whole minute to get to the boss, wtf is that elevator fr? this runback is unbearable
Been replaying bloodborne lately, forgot how much I love the level design and basically lack of boss run backs, that game is so lovely
bloodborne has like some of the worst boss runs in the series but ok
dark souls 2 says hello@@ll-ll5gt
Okay like, have you only ever first tried Shadows of Yharnam and Laurence?
@@Keycil shadows are an issue yeah but I just don't fight laurence when I play the game anymore lmao
@@ll-ll5gt I wouldn't say some of the worst in the series, shadows is a pain in the neck of a run back though
It's called a run back.
You're running back to it.
There's no back if you haven't been there yet.
First time won't count.
Worst boss runback for me is between Sir Alonne and The One Reborn. Alonne is objectively worse but the stupid casket pile things are my personal least favourite enemy ever. They're like the elden ring lobsters if I remember right.
Why are you running through the woods for shadows of yharnam when there are two elevators to them
Placements I disagree with:
Sheaths runback isn’t that bad because you never have to run back to Seath. Also, going through my favorite area in the game again doesn’t sound bad.
The bed of chaos runback is not a runback I hate because I found the hidden bonfire.
Gravelord Nitos runback is not a runback I hate because I found the hidden bonfire.
idk who can beat Sir Alonne boss run, legit most cancer boss run i've had to do
Honestly, boss runbacks that force you to take damage before even fighting the boss should be illegal
You really caught me off guard with the Spanish swearing 💀
Calling it now before I watch the video: they are all gonna be from OG demons souls and Dark Souls 2 adding on Tomb of the Giants
Edit: I love the name “blue goobers”
Whats that weapon youre using in the DS1 crystal caves? It looks awesome.
I used the Dragon Greatsword that you get by cutting the tail off of the Ancient Dragon at the end of Ash Lake ^^
My thoughts on some of these
20: This is so tame compared to some of the older games. It takes kind of a long time, but the threat of dying is not there compared to others. I understand putting it there for variety though
18: the clams are kind of stupid and some of the geometry is really janky but I agree it's not horrible.
17: This one isn't horrible compared to some others, but what makes it really dreadful is that there is nothing to look forward to. Also fuck that annoying noise that walking in the lava makes
16/15: havent played DeS but this is definitely not selling me on it
14: yeah I always stand behind the fire in lower burg so the dogs run into it. I have enough dogs to deal with past the boss fog already
13: correct. Fuck scholar "hurr durr it has Heide in the name so let's put 30 of them scattered all around the area"
11: I assume cave of the dead will be higher than this, which I disagree with. With the petrified resistance ring it's actually really easy, much more consistent than this.
(Im live commenting as I watch so I will finish this later)
Boss run backs are the absolute worst parts of many soulsborne games that’s why I’m so happy Soulsborne and soulslikes in general are starting to move away from them. With Elden ring and Lies Of P barely having them or having shorter ones
"So unbalanced for a single player experience" - except the ds2 dlc side paths are /explicitly/ intended for co-op play. You're not /supposed/ to solo them. Even co-op they're not great, but the awful reputation really isn't deserved when you play them as intended. Soloing them is essentially a challenge run.
Personally Bed of Chaos has one of the worst. If it were any other boss, it wouldn’t be anywhere close to the worst, but considering you can lose in literally seconds through (mostly) no fault of your own, that runback shouldn’t be any longer than 10 seconds
I feel like The One's Reborn and Laurence boss runback were way worse
I have played only Sekiro, DS1, and DS3. The Twin Princes run back is worse than the bed of chaos. I’ll say it. All I have to do is run up a root, pass dragon statue things and a huge grinder with eyes, take a left, and I’m at the bed. I have to get through stabbing skeletons, archers, and knights that I hope buff their weapons so that I don’t have to try to dodge their attacks to get to the twins. It’s way more annoying because they placed so many enemies on the stairs. Seath’s boss run is the overall worst boss run in my opinion though.
Edit: I lied. The Capra Demon run is the worst one for me.
Uhh... are you using the wrong bonfire?
It's an annoying runback, but it's literally just an elevator to Twin Princes.
@@redfish337 I was using the grand archives bonfire. I had no idea that there was an elevator to the right of the building door. I heard about it while searching on reddit but I couldn’t find a video of how to actually find it. I just skimmed through fightingcowboy’s play through after you replied to maybe find it and he used the shortcut you’re talking about. It’s not bad after all. Thanks.
I wonder what number 1 will be. Definitely not snowy
The fact that all of the runbacks of old school demon's souls aren't in the list only attests to Billy's self control
Bare in mind, this is 20 to 11... they are soon to come.
counterpoint: rennala doesn't have any stakes of marika there because marika is her ex-wife and she's still mad at her for the divorce 🤔
Valid
"A worse runback in the same dlc in the next video"
Aw man, he's about to tear into Flume Knight!
There's a bonfire right next to fume knight
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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm
Run backs aren’t an issue if you just beat the boss.
Old Hero gotta be top 3
I know DS3 isn't on this list but man I hate the Oceiros boss run
Would you rather get rid of boss runbacks but boss difficulty is doubled or keep the runbacks? I just want to know cause with all this talk about how bad the runbacks are, all I can say is damn! Also, I watched my uncle play the dark souls trilogy and Elden ring was my first fromsoft game and I haven't gotten to play any others, so I truly can't argue just how bad certain bosses or runbacks are.
Doubling the difficulty at the expense of the runbacks is a trade I'd be willing to make.
Did you include Rennala's runback, simply to have something from Elden Ring included? To be honest, that runback isn't even bad. It falls at a simular level as a mediocre runback from Bloodborn and DS3. Which is far from top 20 worst
I haven't watched the video yet, but i assume it will be a lot of Dark Souls 2😅
Rennalla "runback"? You mean there a people who lose to her?
Why did your DS2 footage look so much better thsn the actual game was that PC? 😂
Nah, just PS4 footage of Scholar.
Does anyone know the name of the song which played at the end of the outro?
Rough and Decent, from the Armoured Cor VI Soundtrack
@@BillySYT Much appreciated thank you
Old iron keep…
No quelaag?
I hate all run backs
Demon’s souls 4-2 is a bitch