This is a slightly edited video I made earlier today and was streamed live to my Patrons. In this video I am stripping down a clone of the popular chronograph movement, the Venus 175 made by the Chinese company Seagull
Watch Repair Channel Cher ami. C'est avec un grand plaisir que je découvre que le voeu que je vous avais soumis il y a seulement quelques semaines s'est réalisé. Merci infiniment de Fayence (sud France)et surtout longue continuation. MERCI. MERCI.;-)
@O Boz Quality control has nothing to do with the precision or accuracy of your watch's movement. That is a sample size of one, which means absolutely nothing. Poor QC means that if 1000 people buy one of these, more than one will be messed up in some way. (>0.1%) In reality, the seagull clones are probably more along the lines of 5%. And if you include things like not being able to reinstall a screw after it has been removed, because of the threads being poorly machined, and the screw being stripped into place, it's much higher. (The screw holds well until you remove it and try reinstalling it.)
Would love to hear more of your comments as you disassemble the movement about the quality of the finishing and also the design of the movement architecture. what's good whats not etc. Also how come they can do a column wheel movement cheaply when the swiss cant?
Nice to see the Seagull getting stripped down! We use the hand winding version (ST1901) in our line of chronograph watches, Not the last word in horology but for an affordable mechanical chronograph there's nothing else out there that comes close for the price, and our customers love it!
I have it on my 1963. Got it with a display caseback to admire the movement. I have it since about a year, wearing it 3 times a week or so, and I'm very happy with it. Very affordable and reliable, and nice to look at.
Hey, EMG, how about less hanging out in TH-cam comments, and more producing your AUTO chronos? 😏😉 Seriously. Please!!! Pretty please! I wanna wanna wanna... but you are always sold out 😩
It’s hard to find adequate words to describe this mans dedication, expertise, gift. “Vocational” comes close. He is a zen master. These videos may very well save your life if anxiety is a burden you have to bear. The sheer generosity, the attention to detail, the calm, step by step (and I do mean every step) approach somehow transcends the logical, mechanical work and enters into a state of grace that mirrors the ephemeral nature of time itself. Never mind million dollar athletes: this gentleman is a role model for our children.
I like the fact that he picked up the balance wheel with the bridge to protect it. Less strain on the spring. Not an expert just something science tell me to watch out for and balance spring is important.
I attended a training course held by the German Society of Chronography at the State Watchmaker´s School in Glashütte, Saxony, Germany, explaining the detailed functions of a column wheel chronograph. For practising disassembling, reassembling and adjusting of a typical column wheel chronograph they gave us a Sea Gull ST19. They are, of course, much cheaper than any original chronograph movements made by various companies in Glashütte. I also noticed a lack of quality control by Sea Gull. But nevertheless, the basic movement worked pretty good. Later, after I serviced my Sea Gull 1963 Chinese Air Force chronograph, I was very satisfied with the accuracy of this movement at approx. +4 sec./day and almost no beat error and flawless chronograph functions. I suppose that Sea Gull produce different quality levels: the best ones for their own watches, sold under the name Sea Gull, and a lower quality for other brands. But anyway, chronograph watches using the ST19 offer reasonable quality for a low price, compared to Swiss Made column wheel chronograph watches.
They bought it (patents, machinery) in the early 1960s because venus had financial trouble and needed money to invest in a newer chronograph. The russians didnt want it, so it was sold to china and the young firm Tianjin Watch Factory (Now Tianjin Seagull). They used it to build the first chinese own mechanical aviation chronograph, with reissues known as Seagull 1963. It is in fact better than the original movement, and there is even an automatic version of it: ST1940. I have 3 of them and all of them are very precise.
I must admit, i do not own any classic watches(Rolex et al) tending to stick to run o the mill Seiko manual mechanisms, kinetic - even the odd citizen that takes my eye and simply love my Bulova accutron smooth sweep second hand watch - but i bow gracefully at the patience and skill breaking these watches down, it soothes the soul and after a stressful day is all i need - thank you 🙏
Hi Mark, great video, love the addition of the wide angle cam on the corner. I have a Seagull 1963 chrono and the finishing is quite a lot better. Seagull has different levels of QC afaik, so perhaps the movement you sourced was one of the "cheap" ones. Hey, I've always wondered, why do you watchmakers assemble the watch while it's running? And why do you put the hands with it running? It's just a silly question but I guess there's a reason. Cheers!
Wow! I have several watches with these movements. Not perfect movements by any means but the one you are dismantling has a terrible finish. Mine under a microscope does not show the same abrasions and scratches. Display side is nicely polished and the non visible side finish is OK
Rumor is that Seagull keeps the best examples for its1963 chronograph. And, Baltic inspects each unit before their watches are assembled. Other brands may do the same. So you guys might be looking at the best. Also, I could easily see where the worst pieces are sent to the watch supply houses. The Venus 175 is so attractive yet the Baltic, for example (which I do like) is at too high a price point for me to take the gamble. Good QC is tough: even the mighty Seiko cannot come to grips with it at their entry level. My 2¢, YMMV.
@@jonchaton7541 You might be interested in the Perpetual Watch Company in Hong Kong. They use Seagull movements but because they only make about 60 watches a month, each movement is inspected and regulated before it is put in the case. I have no affiliation with the company, I simply bought one online and have worn the watch for a month now. Really impressed with it. They had a problem with a batch of movements from Seagull and rejected every one of them which must have caused them a financial loss because all pre-orders were offered a slightly different watch for half price or the option of waiting until March for their first choice. perpetual-watch.com Hope this helps.
I have this movement in an 'Alpha' chronograph watch. The rear of the case is crystal to display the movement. Obviously, I can't see every part, but the finish quality of the visible parts is about a million times better than the movement you have - The original manufacturing machinery bought from Switzerland must have worn out long ago - perhaps they have copied this too for extra production? BTW - my entire watch cost around £120 and is decent quality, so £100 just for the movement seems a bit steep? Thanks for the video - interesting to see how intricate the movement is.
What really amazes me is , how do you know where all the parts go back to , that is placement, order, direction etc Especially if it’s a first time tear down !!
I purchased one right after they came out, and I love it. The ones being offered at a sub 200 USD price do not show the same quality as the older ones. Even the red star on the dial seems to be badly printed in these later editions. I'm thinking not a real Sea-Gull.
If you buy an uncased ST19 movement the first thing you should do is strip it down, clean it, lubricate it, regulate it. It's likely the movement isn't even lubricated at the factory because they store better dry. This movement looks way less finished than the ones I have, hopefully that's really the bottom of the barrel. I have several variations on the basic model, including the ST1903, ST1908 (a real moon phase model, not day/night), and automatic versions like the 1940. They are among my favorite movements to look at and to wear. The level of finish is no match for a good swiss chronograph but for the price these are just amazing.
Had one of these in a 1963 panda chronograph. Sold it. Daily rate graph looked like a seismograph. Random fibers visible in the movement under a loop and finger prints.
🤣 soo true with the seismograph word.. i've owned 3 watches with chinese movement which the one of them is asian 7750. I swear i will never buy any chinese watch anymore, lack of quality control, inconsistency in timekeping, dirty movements with huge fingerprints.. i think chinese products are like to see the finish line of a racing but not able to reach to it.
I have one of those Seagull 1963 chronographs watches with this movement, and out of the box it runs about +8spd. Not bad for a relatively inexpensive timepiece. It runs tighter timing than a good handful of my watches that were more expensive.
I haven't seen all your videos yet so I'm not sure if you've done this, but I think it would be interesting to take apart a non clone example of this at the same time so we can see the difference side by side.
I have inherited a 1963 watch, ST1901 movement, with a broken hairspring. Is it possible to replace the balance wheel/spring/assembly? And would a repair like this be more economical than just sourcing a whole new movement?
I’m curious, do you have any knowledge that the seagull 1963 has any gaskets from caseback and stem that will demonstrate some form of water resistance?
If anyone is interested, on the watchuseek forum there is a post with pictures from 10 years ago where one of the members (presumably a watchmaker) does a stripdown of this very same movement. In the article it appears that his movement has a better overall finish than the one here.
Great skill and dexterity as always, along with some super macro photography as to be expected from this channel. Enthralling as always, keep uploadin! 👍💨⌚💨👊 PS: I'm not too impressed with Chinese (or Russian) watches, had a couple of them Parnis and Seagull, they both packed up after a couple of weeks (Parnis) months (Sea-Gull) they don't like being hand-wound. The rotor sounds like dried peas going around the inside of a baked bean can when you shake em with the case-back off. Rough as a bears arse on a cheese grater! Hypocrisy et Al: I do have a _DeTomaso Tasca_ pocket watch integrated with the remarkable Seagull ST1770 skeleton movement, its nothing short of phenomenal, being the most delicate skeletonized work I've ever seen, (seen a fair few in my 56 years) its smooth to wind no clicking at all, quite accurate and has been working now for over 4 years faultlessly.⌚😍💨💋
Please make a tutorial disassembling and reassembling a Longines Master Collection moon face chronograph, explaining how are added complications to a movement, please, an thanks for all your videos, all are so interesting and very professional.
I love the ST19. I'm on my second watch with one. I do think the previous owner was rough on this one though, the central seconds jerk back a little when you stop the chrono.
I have an odd question. Im got caravelle automatic watch that lost a jewel with in a month of buying it. The watch shop sent it out to be rebuilt. It worked for about a month. I like the case and would like to know if a different movement can be placed inside the case?
Thats a good price for the movement. Just wondering, Seagul movements are usually pretty well finished overall, and the bridges in your example seem decent, given that the price is not much more than the 2824 clones, have the suppliers gotten a deal on a batch thats maybe not representative of the usual standard ? Anyhow, at the price, a great training aid, and probably worth bearing in mind that ebauche movements from ETA require a strip and clean unless you pay the extra for the hermetically sealed ones ?
Watch enthusiasts have been purchasing the seagull 1963 reissue and there has been little mention of problems. Seagull movements have been used in many automatic ranges so they must be doing something right.
I have a vintage Omega Seamaster. The movement is a quartz 1342 but it's broken. I can't find a decent replacement BUT! even if I could find one I don't think I'd get it because as far as I can tell the 1342 is RUBBISH! So... I just happened to be cracking open a new Casio watch that i bought and noticed it has an S. Epson movement. I checked online and the movements can be bought for I think... $26. Can I replace the Omega movement with a reliable S. Epson one? I think the issue will be the retaining frame/ring and the depth of the face relative to the case. Can it be done??? :-s
Dear sir, could you tell me where to get the tool to remove the minute cannon and more importantly the courses are taught in Spanish, thank you very much
I think it would boost wiews on your channel to do a service on couple of seagull 1963 chronographs. Especially if you find one of the original old ones vs new 19 jewels or vs 22 jewls or even old seagull vs old venus or something like that. Also one of the red star tripple calednar moonhase or big date chronographs. Seagull went mainstream it seems and a lot of people would like to learn more about them
Where can i buy watch cases that are not just voor the 6497/6498 movement. I am looking for a small case for a womens watch i want to build for my girlfriend.
The thing that surprised me most about this video was the fact you placed all the screws together in your tray. Surely they vary in size and/or are specific to areas within the movement?
I've wondered a fair bit as to what movement is in my £16 Jaragar which has three working subdials but day, date and 24h instead of the Breitling chrono functions. It even has the Breitling printing saying its time is in 100'th of secs etc but day, date and 24 hour is what you get lol I have had it for some months now and it does keep still very good time, setting the day and date can be tedious as the button pushes are a bit on the extremity so have to really grind hard on the buttons to get it to change.
Hi Mark, I'm sorry to hear level 4 won't be base on the more popular 7750 chronograph :) it would have been so useful... Any chance you would consider an episode on this one?
Great video Mark- I was hoping to see the strip down of the TY29xx movement eventually as it has so much in common with the Venus 175; I've read Seagull has the original Venus tooling- I wonder if there is any truth to that? As many have stated, the finishing is quite poor when compared to a Venus original but considering the price (under 100 USD) it's to be expected. In fact for that price it hardly makes sense to service the movement, you can just drop a new one in (assuming it's lubricated and keeping time). Thanks for sharing!
I have a Seagull 1963 38mm with sapphire crystal. Can’t fault it, cost less than £150 new, runs within COSC standards straight out of the box Maybe I’m just lucky...
@@martinda7446 Most Soviet movements were actually home-grown designs though. The only five that I know for sure were foreign movements that were licensed to the USSR are the ZiM 2602 (originally LIP R-26), Zvezda 1802 ( originally LIP T18), Molnija ChK-6 (originally Cortebert 616), Kirovskie Type 1 (originally a Dueber-Hampden size 16 movement), and the Poljot 3133 (originally Valjoux 7734).
@@jakekaywell5972 I know they took the Contax factory practically brick by brick as they did with many industries, I may have assumed the watch movements. Thanks for that.
I find it astonishing that you get all that machine work essembly etc for only 100 quid, when a pair of trainers cost that and they are just pieces of plastic, it really does show the value for money you get with the lower end watches.
Need some help ... fiddeling with my automatic eta movement i lost a small u shaped metal thingy that sits at the wheel for the mainspring. When you wind up the movement it allows movement of the wheel but also holds the wheel in place, so the power can be used by the mainspring. Now the movement dosent work.... i dont know what the tiny thing is called so i cant order a new LOL...
If you really want to judge the quality Seagull can produce, there is no way around picking up one of their watches. Not sure how "fair" it is, but they keep the best movements for themselves. Even so, I don't believe they will look much nicer than say a 7S26, but more than fair for the price. I have a Seagull 1963 Chinese Air Force Reissue, and from what I can see through the display caseback, you get a lot of watch for 250€. I also hear good things about their skeletonized watches.
I have one too and it can be a number of different things, mine had the chronograph gears too tight and it always stopped at 30 sec. I opened and adjusted the gear backlash and worked fine. You have to service and check moving parts one by one. It can be even lubrication as I bought some movements running dry
I have one in a really cool looking chronograph. It's my most accurate piece compared to a 2824, and a 4R35 by far. It hand winds beautifully and feels good to use. Yes it's kind of rough looking up close but tbh, in terms of manual wind chronographs, you have this, then jump all the way to a Speedmaster, then it's like Patek, VC and ALS, which are all just crazy expensive.
Dismantling is a thing, but rebuild the whole watch seems very difficult to me, do you ever get lost with all the pieces and differents mechanisms ? I suppose you don't know all of them do you ?
can you explain why you remove the hands while the movement is running? I am assuming this movement doesn't have hacking but wouldn't it be easier and better for the watch to remove the hands while it's not running?
Slightly confusing: is this a real Seagull movement, or a cheaper clone of that movement, made by someone else? Interesting that the Cousins listing does not call it a Seagull.
Hi there, I am a genuine watch collector but given the improvements made by the replica factories I am looking into few watches to wear them on a daily basis with less risk than wearing a 30 kusd. However, in spite of excellent replicas of outer parts (case, dial, bezel, crown, hands, needles), I am not totally satisfied of the movements which are supposed to be cloned. There was one model from Panerai, a rattrapante called PAM213, which was replicated by a factory called VSF and what I could say with this watch is that it was the very first complication movement made with quite high standards. Unfortunately, the production has been discontinued after 80 watches produced for any reason. Looking at the other movements such as the Asian 7750 or Asian Sea gull, I realize that the reliability and quality of fabrication are far from being satisfactory. The only movement which still impressed me is the Asian tourbillon which has to be aligned with the rattrapante movement I was speaking above. First of all, the jewels used for these movements are plastic or very cheap synthetic jewels, which substantially degrade the reliability of the movement. Moreover, what is called clone should be a replication of the genuine movement but a clone refers to a “look alike” movement with a decorated bridge for example; so it is just an aesthetic modification of a movement which is quite cheap in general. My question then is : for which cloned movement should I go for according to your experience knowing that I am aware that great complications are most of the time not running (even subdials are not working sometimes), which is a pity... I would definitely go for watches which are nice from the outside but also the inside...
I am not sure whether you would call it a clone seeing as they bought the watch fair and square from Venus, they may have modified it but the basic movement is the same, it would not be an exaggeration to call it a venus175
Buy a Seagull 1963 or not? This is my problem. I LOVE its design but, is this movement as good as the VENUS 175? I think the chinese added some Jewel after buying the Venus machinery... Buy a Seagull 1963 or not?
This video highlights the poor finishing of the component parts, which is not a good sign when considering overall quality control standards. Given the Seagull 1963 watches cost about £150-£200 online, any watch collector would be better off spending say £300 for a nice Valjoux 7733/34 powered chrono, with a lesser brand name on the dial, or finding a good nick Landeron chrono in running order. Those Swiss made vintage watches are more likely to retain some value in the future, and keep going for another 30 years imho.
This is a new chronograph made using a licensed-built Venus 175. The fact that the only comparable watches in its price range are all USED pieces speaks volumes as to how good of a value it is. I have full confidence that this Sea-Gull will work in any number of watches for years to come.
Actually, I've just read a piece on Chinese watch brands and there's one called Memorigin that makes only tourbillion movements in house based out of Hong Kong and this is a brief excerpt..... "Memorigin does not use Chinese parts exclusively, given that some components are incredibly specialized. Regardless, they devote resources R&D, continually raising the bar on their own technical limitations. Their tourbillons watches can range in price from a couple thousand dollars, to over a quarter million." Well, not quite what you would expect from a Chinese watch!
This is a slightly edited video I made earlier today and was streamed live to my Patrons. In this video I am stripping down a clone of the popular chronograph movement, the Venus 175 made by the Chinese company Seagull
Watch Repair Channel
Cher ami. C'est avec un grand plaisir que je découvre que le voeu que je vous avais soumis il y a seulement quelques semaines s'est réalisé. Merci infiniment de Fayence (sud France)et surtout longue continuation. MERCI. MERCI.;-)
I really like the two camera system you used. It certainly added to the experience. Thank you.
@O Boz Quality control has nothing to do with the precision or accuracy of your watch's movement. That is a sample size of one, which means absolutely nothing. Poor QC means that if 1000 people buy one of these, more than one will be messed up in some way. (>0.1%) In reality, the seagull clones are probably more along the lines of 5%. And if you include things like not being able to reinstall a screw after it has been removed, because of the threads being poorly machined, and the screw being stripped into place, it's much higher. (The screw holds well until you remove it and try reinstalling it.)
Would love to hear more of your comments as you disassemble the movement about the quality of the finishing and also the design of the movement architecture. what's good whats not etc. Also how come they can do a column wheel movement cheaply when the swiss cant?
Did you ever rebuild? If so what kind of accuracy did you achieve?
Nice to see the Seagull getting stripped down! We use the hand winding version (ST1901) in our line of chronograph watches, Not the last word in horology but for an affordable mechanical chronograph there's nothing else out there that comes close for the price, and our customers love it!
Most people realise that it is an excellent movement for it's price point and some!
I have it on my 1963. Got it with a display caseback to admire the movement.
I have it since about a year, wearing it 3 times a week or so, and I'm very happy with it. Very affordable and reliable, and nice to look at.
Hey, EMG, how about less hanging out in TH-cam comments, and more producing your AUTO chronos? 😏😉
Seriously.
Please!!!
Pretty please!
I wanna wanna wanna... but you are always sold out 😩
Anyone else uses this videos to get into sleeping? They're amazing... but oh so relaxing.
Panaceias Úberes True, yep. 😞
Haha. Great videos and yes they also help me get to sleep.
Every night 😂💤💤
Yes just had an hour's nap
It’s pretty boring without Voiceover… Don’t like this kind of videos.
My friend owns a Seagull
Still running fine after more than 7 years
The movement actually outlasted the strap
That's normal. Straps are a consumable item, they should always wear out long before the movement.
I love my seagulls i have spent way more on watches for less satisfaction
It’s hard to find adequate words to describe this mans dedication, expertise, gift. “Vocational” comes close. He is a zen master. These videos may very well save your life if anxiety is a burden you have to bear. The sheer generosity, the attention to detail, the calm, step by step (and I do mean every step) approach somehow transcends the logical, mechanical work and enters into a state of grace that mirrors the ephemeral nature of time itself. Never mind million dollar athletes: this gentleman is a role model for our children.
Wow! That was a lovely thing to say.
Thank you so much for your encouragement - very kind of you.
I like the fact that he picked up the balance wheel with the bridge to protect it. Less strain on the spring. Not an expert just something science tell me to watch out for and balance spring is important.
I attended a training course held by the German Society of Chronography at the State Watchmaker´s School in Glashütte, Saxony, Germany, explaining the detailed functions of a column wheel chronograph. For practising disassembling, reassembling and adjusting of a typical column wheel chronograph they gave us a Sea Gull ST19. They are, of course, much cheaper than any original chronograph movements made by various companies in Glashütte.
I also noticed a lack of quality control by Sea Gull. But nevertheless, the basic movement worked pretty good.
Later, after I serviced my Sea Gull 1963 Chinese Air Force chronograph, I was very satisfied with the accuracy of this movement at approx. +4 sec./day and almost no beat error and flawless chronograph functions.
I suppose that Sea Gull produce different quality levels: the best ones for their own watches, sold under the name Sea Gull, and a lower quality for other brands.
But anyway, chronograph watches using the ST19 offer reasonable quality for a low price, compared to Swiss Made column wheel chronograph watches.
You're like the "Bob Ross" of watch repair. I somehow find it very relaxing watching you strip down and re-assemble the watch.
1963! St19 movement
Also this is not a clone in anyway shape or form. They are using the original Venus machinery.
That's cool to know. So they bought up all the original machine equipment and shipped it to china and restarted it?
Tynchy Temper do you have a source? I’d like to read more about it
@@kikcodog Venus went bust so Seagull bought up the equipment
@@rickmulder1853 It's hearsay.
They bought it (patents, machinery) in the early 1960s because venus had financial trouble and needed money to invest in a newer chronograph. The russians didnt want it, so it was sold to china and the young firm Tianjin Watch Factory (Now Tianjin Seagull). They used it to build the first chinese own mechanical aviation chronograph, with reissues known as Seagull 1963. It is in fact better than the original movement, and there is even an automatic version of it: ST1940. I have 3 of them and all of them are very precise.
I must admit, i do not own any classic watches(Rolex et al) tending to stick to run o the mill Seiko manual mechanisms, kinetic - even the odd citizen that takes my eye and simply love my Bulova accutron smooth sweep second hand watch - but i bow gracefully at the patience and skill breaking these watches down, it soothes the soul and after a stressful day is all i need - thank you 🙏
Rolex - founded in 1905: "classic"
Seiko - founded in 1881: "run of the mill"
OK then
Wow what’s with all the scratches on this movement looks like wolverine had a battle with it.
Sorry, but wolverine is equipment with adamantium claws. If he did battle with this steel movement, it would have been completely ruined!
The ability to remember where each screw goes when re-assembling is pretty amazing.
it's not really remembering it, you have to know where everything goes like you designed it.
mechanical things are simple enough, it'll only go back together one way AND work.
Having a video recording and/or a whole slew of photos of the disassembly can really help when doing this the first few times.
Whenever I take something apart, theres always extra screws left over when I reassemble it... so weird.
thhizon me too.
Ahahah same here
Watching you at work is a gift for any watch lover, i must say better at the courses, Thanks Mark
Hi Mark, great video, love the addition of the wide angle cam on the corner. I have a Seagull 1963 chrono and the finishing is quite a lot better. Seagull has different levels of QC afaik, so perhaps the movement you sourced was one of the "cheap" ones.
Hey, I've always wondered, why do you watchmakers assemble the watch while it's running? And why do you put the hands with it running? It's just a silly question but I guess there's a reason.
Cheers!
It would be interesting to disassemble the Seagull chronograph movement from a Baltic watch for comparison.
Wow! I have several watches with these movements. Not perfect movements by any means but the one you are dismantling has a terrible finish. Mine under a microscope does not show the same abrasions and scratches. Display side is nicely polished and the non visible side finish is OK
I have one too - mine seems to be much better finished than the one in this video, although I haven't dismantled it (of course) :-)
Rumor is that Seagull keeps the best examples for its1963 chronograph. And, Baltic inspects each unit before their watches are assembled. Other brands may do the same. So you guys might be looking at the best. Also, I could easily see where the worst pieces are sent to the watch supply houses. The Venus 175 is so attractive yet the Baltic, for example (which I do like) is at too high a price point for me to take the gamble. Good QC is tough: even the mighty Seiko cannot come to grips with it at their entry level. My 2¢, YMMV.
@@Mister_Phafanapolis Wrong.
@@jonchaton7541 You might be interested in the Perpetual Watch Company in Hong Kong. They use Seagull movements but because they only make about 60 watches a month, each movement is inspected and regulated before it is put in the case. I have no affiliation with the company, I simply bought one online and have worn the watch for a month now. Really impressed with it. They had a problem with a batch of movements from Seagull and rejected every one of them which must have caused them a financial loss because all pre-orders were offered a slightly different watch for half price or the option of waiting until March for their first choice.
perpetual-watch.com
Hope this helps.
I have this movement in an 'Alpha' chronograph watch. The rear of the case is crystal to display the movement. Obviously, I can't see every part, but the finish quality of the visible parts is about a million times better than the movement you have - The original manufacturing machinery bought from Switzerland must have worn out long ago - perhaps they have copied this too for extra production? BTW - my entire watch cost around £120 and is decent quality, so £100 just for the movement seems a bit steep? Thanks for the video - interesting to see how intricate the movement is.
Always enjoyable but I missed the narrative while you work. Looking forward to the assembly of cleaned parts and your valuable commentary.
It looks like the factory just got a delivery of some really course sandpaper... 😣
I wish you had an edited version that just talked about your findings with video highlights
What really amazes me is , how do you know where all the parts go back to , that is placement, order, direction etc
Especially if it’s a first time tear down !!
Anymore of your excellent videos on the horizon?🤞
Nice to see the innards, I've been pondering a 63 Re issue for a while and wondered how they looked and performed. Looking forward to the update.
I purchased one right after they came out, and I love it. The ones being offered at a sub 200 USD price do not show the same quality as the older ones. Even the red star on the dial seems to be badly printed in these later editions. I'm thinking not a real Sea-Gull.
If you buy an uncased ST19 movement the first thing you should do is strip it down, clean it, lubricate it, regulate it. It's likely the movement isn't even lubricated at the factory because they store better dry. This movement looks way less finished than the ones I have, hopefully that's really the bottom of the barrel.
I have several variations on the basic model, including the ST1903, ST1908 (a real moon phase model, not day/night), and automatic versions like the 1940. They are among my favorite movements to look at and to wear. The level of finish is no match for a good swiss chronograph but for the price these are just amazing.
Obviously we want to see the rest.... shinny parts reassembled and put to the test!
Had one of these in a 1963 panda chronograph. Sold it. Daily rate graph looked like a seismograph. Random fibers visible in the movement under a loop and finger prints.
🤣 soo true with the seismograph word.. i've owned 3 watches with chinese movement which the one of them is asian 7750. I swear i will never buy any chinese watch anymore, lack of quality control, inconsistency in timekeping, dirty movements with huge fingerprints.. i think chinese products are like to see the finish line of a racing but not able to reach to it.
@O Boz think my ex got it for me from Amazon... The seagull ocean star I bought directly from seagull has been fine.
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I have one of those Seagull 1963 chronographs watches with this movement, and out of the box it runs about +8spd. Not bad for a relatively inexpensive timepiece. It runs tighter timing than a good handful of my watches that were more expensive.
Your videos are fantastic, i've learned so much watching these.
I haven't seen all your videos yet so I'm not sure if you've done this, but I think it would be interesting to take apart a non clone example of this at the same time so we can see the difference side by side.
I have inherited a 1963 watch, ST1901 movement, with a broken hairspring. Is it possible to replace the balance wheel/spring/assembly? And would a repair like this be more economical than just sourcing a whole new movement?
I’m curious, do you have any knowledge that the seagull 1963 has any gaskets from caseback and stem that will demonstrate some form of water resistance?
Christian Motos l was wondering the same thing. Whenever I've seen watches with this movement with the back taken off, I've never seen a gasket?
If anyone is interested, on the watchuseek forum there is a post with pictures from 10 years ago where one of the members (presumably a watchmaker) does a stripdown of this very same movement. In the article it appears that his movement has a better overall finish than the one here.
Great skill and dexterity as always, along with some super macro photography as to be expected from this channel. Enthralling as always, keep uploadin! 👍💨⌚💨👊
PS: I'm not too impressed with Chinese (or Russian) watches, had a couple of them Parnis and Seagull, they both packed up after a couple of weeks (Parnis) months (Sea-Gull) they don't like being hand-wound. The rotor sounds like dried peas going around the inside of a baked bean can when you shake em with the case-back off. Rough as a bears arse on a cheese grater!
Hypocrisy et Al: I do have a _DeTomaso Tasca_ pocket watch integrated with the remarkable Seagull ST1770 skeleton movement, its nothing short of phenomenal, being the most delicate skeletonized work I've ever seen, (seen a fair few in my 56 years) its smooth to wind no clicking at all, quite accurate and has been working now for over 4 years faultlessly.⌚😍💨💋
Hi I have the seagull 1963 with the st19 mov. I need a stem and crown but I cant find them online. any help? thanks
Please make a tutorial disassembling and reassembling a Longines Master Collection moon face chronograph, explaining how are added complications to a movement, please, an thanks for all your videos, all are so interesting and very professional.
I love the ST19. I'm on my second watch with one.
I do think the previous owner was rough on this one though, the central seconds jerk back a little when you stop the chrono.
The most aesthetically pleasing part of this movement seems to be the main spring.
I have an odd question. Im got caravelle automatic watch that lost a jewel with in a month of buying it. The watch shop sent it out to be rebuilt. It worked for about a month. I like the case and would like to know if a different movement can be placed inside the case?
Thats a good price for the movement. Just wondering, Seagul movements are usually pretty well finished overall, and the bridges in your example seem decent, given that the price is not much more than the 2824 clones, have the suppliers gotten a deal on a batch thats maybe not representative of the usual standard ? Anyhow, at the price, a great training aid, and probably worth bearing in mind that ebauche movements from ETA require a strip and clean unless you pay the extra for the hermetically sealed ones ?
Watch enthusiasts have been purchasing the seagull 1963 reissue and there has been little mention of problems.
Seagull movements have been used in many automatic ranges so they must be doing something right.
Fatt Matt the reissue numbered watches have better finished movements, and more decorated too, have seagull branding embossed in gold color
I have a vintage Omega Seamaster. The movement is a quartz 1342 but it's broken. I can't find a decent replacement BUT! even if I could find one I don't think I'd get it because as far as I can tell the 1342 is RUBBISH! So... I just happened to be cracking open a new Casio watch that i bought and noticed it has an S. Epson movement. I checked online and the movements can be bought for I think... $26. Can I replace the Omega movement with a reliable S. Epson one? I think the issue will be the retaining frame/ring and the depth of the face relative to the case. Can it be done??? :-s
Dear sir, could you tell me where to get the tool to remove the minute cannon and more importantly the courses are taught in Spanish, thank you very much
I think it would boost wiews on your channel to do a service on couple of seagull 1963 chronographs. Especially if you find one of the original old ones vs new 19 jewels or vs 22 jewls or even old seagull vs old venus or something like that. Also one of the red star tripple calednar moonhase or big date chronographs. Seagull went mainstream it seems and a lot of people would like to learn more about them
Mark, I see you're using Horotec screwdrivers....do you like them better than the Bergeon 30081Mini you were using prior. Why the change?
Where can i buy watch cases that are not just voor the 6497/6498 movement. I am looking for a small case for a womens watch i want to build for my girlfriend.
I actually own a Seagull 1963, it is an awesome watch.
Thanks Mark, good as always. The main plate has a lot of scratch. No idea why they won't make it good...
Maybe because it's unnecesarily time consuming, and time is...
I know that they're not a terribly common complication, but could do a video on servicing a hammer-lock mechanism?
The thing that surprised me most about this video was the fact you placed all the screws together in your tray. Surely they vary in size and/or are specific to areas within the movement?
Of course they are, but he’s been working on these movements that he could probably put one back together blindfolded! 🤣🤣 He does some amazing work!
Call me old fashioned but I'd watch your videos in slow motion!
Is there different quality jewels? If so, will replacing with higher quality jewels improve a watch's performance?
Thank you very much for the useful information.
Hi - great content! How difficult is it to make a three button chronograph into a monopusher?
Kinda neat that it comes with that rudimentary watch face.
Holy shit! It looks like someone used the inside of that watch as a snowboard.
Does anyone know which case is needed for this movement? If so, where do i find them?
It would be very interesting if you made the current Seiko chronograph. the NE88 ir 8RXX
I've wondered a fair bit as to what movement is in my £16 Jaragar which has three working subdials but day, date and 24h instead of the Breitling chrono functions. It even has the Breitling printing saying its time is in 100'th of secs etc but day, date and 24 hour is what you get lol I have had it for some months now and it does keep still very good time, setting the day and date can be tedious as the button pushes are a bit on the extremity so have to really grind hard on the buttons to get it to change.
If you willing to pay double price, you will get a well finished movement like original authentic Venus!
Hi Mark, I'm sorry to hear level 4 won't be base on the more popular 7750 chronograph :) it would have been so useful... Any chance you would consider an episode on this one?
Your vids are great.... just joined your Facebook page and ordered all the tools needed to start taking your beginners course. Can’t wait.
Great video Mark- I was hoping to see the strip down of the TY29xx movement eventually as it has so much in common with the Venus 175; I've read Seagull has the original Venus tooling- I wonder if there is any truth to that? As many have stated, the finishing is quite poor when compared to a Venus original but considering the price (under 100 USD) it's to be expected. In fact for that price it hardly makes sense to service the movement, you can just drop a new one in (assuming it's lubricated and keeping time). Thanks for sharing!
This video is very helpful many thanks
Amazing video !! You have a great content
I have a Seagull 1963 38mm with sapphire crystal. Can’t fault it, cost less than £150 new, runs within COSC standards straight out of the box
Maybe I’m just lucky...
Peter Shallis where did you buy your Seagull?
I have had many Soviet movements that were brilliant performers too. I guess the Germans knew how to build a good watch in the 30s...
@@martinda7446 Most Soviet movements were actually home-grown designs though. The only five that I know for sure were foreign movements that were licensed to the USSR are the ZiM 2602 (originally LIP R-26), Zvezda 1802 ( originally LIP T18), Molnija ChK-6 (originally Cortebert 616), Kirovskie Type 1 (originally a Dueber-Hampden size 16 movement), and the Poljot 3133 (originally Valjoux 7734).
@@jakekaywell5972 I know they took the Contax factory practically brick by brick as they did with many industries, I may have assumed the watch movements. Thanks for that.
@@jakekaywell5972 Very interesting.
I find it astonishing that you get all that machine work essembly etc for only 100 quid, when a pair of trainers cost that and they are just pieces of plastic, it really does show the value for money you get with the lower end watches.
Need some help ... fiddeling with my automatic eta movement i lost a small u shaped metal thingy that sits at the wheel for the mainspring. When you wind up the movement it allows movement of the wheel but also holds the wheel in place, so the power can be used by the mainspring. Now the movement dosent work.... i dont know what the tiny thing is called so i cant order a new LOL...
Pallet fork
If you really want to judge the quality Seagull can produce, there is no way around picking up one of their watches. Not sure how "fair" it is, but they keep the best movements for themselves. Even so, I don't believe they will look much nicer than say a 7S26, but more than fair for the price.
I have a Seagull 1963 Chinese Air Force Reissue, and from what I can see through the display caseback, you get a lot of watch for 250€. I also hear good things about their skeletonized watches.
I have got a clone 7750 it stops running some times when I wear it have any idea? It’s fully wind
I have one too and it can be a number of different things, mine had the chronograph gears too tight and it always stopped at 30 sec. I opened and adjusted the gear backlash and worked fine. You have to service and check moving parts one by one. It can be even lubrication as I bought some movements running dry
I have one in a really cool looking chronograph. It's my most accurate piece compared to a 2824, and a 4R35 by far. It hand winds beautifully and feels good to use. Yes it's kind of rough looking up close but tbh, in terms of manual wind chronographs, you have this, then jump all the way to a Speedmaster, then it's like Patek, VC and ALS, which are all just crazy expensive.
Are mechanical clocks built the same as watches? And have you worked on any?
Avoid Cousins like the plague is what I was told by my watchmender.
neil piper Why?
@@huangcjz poor quality
As usual, a a wonderful viewing!
Dismantling is a thing, but rebuild the whole watch seems very difficult to me, do you ever get lost with all the pieces and differents mechanisms ? I suppose you don't know all of them do you ?
What size of screwdriver (in millimeter) do you need for this movement ?
can you explain why you remove the hands while the movement is running? I am assuming this movement doesn't have hacking but wouldn't it be easier and better for the watch to remove the hands while it's not running?
Roy van der Lee zat ik inderdaad ook al naar te kijken
off topic but your guitar background music is amazing, how can I find it? thanks
Check it out with the shazam app
Parabéns e obrigado pelo excelente vídeo.
Slightly confusing: is this a real Seagull movement, or a cheaper clone of that movement, made by someone else?
Interesting that the Cousins listing does not call it a Seagull.
I adjusted to 2x making 4x total for acceptable speed. :)
Off topic: Are all spring bars used in wristwatch straps created equal in quality and reliability? Thanks in advance.
M C Short answer, no
How were the numbers before the tear down? Second, amplitude and beat error? Great video thanks, was interested in this movement.
mike burns He says he forgot to check them before starting.
Always wonder where you get so ridiculously high prices? Ebay ban you? M.b change your IP to US one and buy it for less than 5%?
Hi there, I am a genuine watch collector but given the improvements made by the replica factories I am looking into few watches to wear them on a daily basis with less risk than wearing a 30 kusd. However, in spite of excellent replicas of outer parts (case, dial, bezel, crown, hands, needles), I am not totally satisfied of the movements which are supposed to be cloned. There was one model from Panerai, a rattrapante called PAM213, which was replicated by a factory called VSF and what I could say with this watch is that it was the very first complication movement made with quite high standards. Unfortunately, the production has been discontinued after 80 watches produced for any reason. Looking at the other movements such as the Asian 7750 or Asian Sea gull, I realize that the reliability and quality of fabrication are far from being satisfactory. The only movement which still impressed me is the Asian tourbillon which has to be aligned with the rattrapante movement I was speaking above. First of all, the jewels used for these movements are plastic or very cheap synthetic jewels, which substantially degrade the reliability of the movement. Moreover, what is called clone should be a replication of the genuine movement but a clone refers to a “look alike” movement with a decorated bridge for example; so it is just an aesthetic modification of a movement which is quite cheap in general. My question then is : for which cloned movement should I go for according to your experience knowing that I am aware that great complications are most of the time not running (even subdials are not working sometimes), which is a pity... I would definitely go for watches which are nice from the outside but also the inside...
Will your course teach me how to service my 1964 Rolex Oyster Perpetual?
Liked as soon as the like button loads up.
I am not sure whether you would call it a clone seeing as they bought the watch fair and square from Venus, they may have modified it but the basic movement is the same, it would not be an exaggeration to call it a venus175
你的视频很棒，我在中国学习维修手表。 谢谢你的视频！
Buy a Seagull 1963 or not? This is my problem. I LOVE its design but, is this movement as good as the VENUS 175? I think the chinese added some Jewel after buying the Venus machinery... Buy a Seagull 1963 or not?
Buy
Absolutely, since there's no mechanical difference between the two.
Amazing sir, you are the Master 👏
Add some turning to the plates??
A Master in action☘
Goddamn fingerprint right on the mainspring. Wtf, so many parts!!
Where is part two?
How does one remember where all these parts go! Do you take a snapshot before hand?
Yeah. It's called a video. But he doesn't need that anyways, since he knows where the parts go.
This video highlights the poor finishing of the component parts, which is not a good sign when considering overall quality control standards. Given the Seagull 1963 watches cost about £150-£200 online, any watch collector would be better off spending say £300 for a nice Valjoux 7733/34 powered chrono, with a lesser brand name on the dial, or finding a good nick Landeron chrono in running order. Those Swiss made vintage watches are more likely to retain some value in the future, and keep going for another 30 years imho.
This is a new chronograph made using a licensed-built Venus 175. The fact that the only comparable watches in its price range are all USED pieces speaks volumes as to how good of a value it is. I have full confidence that this Sea-Gull will work in any number of watches for years to come.
question. how do you remove the stemcrown?
Is it any good? (Silence) Strip down complete. WTF???? What's your opinion?
Next video: Chinese tourbillion!
Actually, I've just read a piece on Chinese watch brands and there's one called Memorigin that makes only tourbillion movements in house based out of Hong Kong and this is a brief excerpt..... "Memorigin does not use Chinese parts exclusively, given that some components are incredibly specialized. Regardless, they devote resources R&D, continually raising the bar on their own technical limitations.
Their tourbillons watches can range in price from a couple thousand dollars, to over a quarter million." Well, not quite what you would expect from a Chinese watch!
Seagull has a flying tourbillion movement，extremely tough for a tourbillion.
Sounds like Acoustic Alchemy in the background...