For nearly 25 years, a gameplay streamlining tool has been available to Card Game Designers the world over, and yet some games still choose to not use it... Follow me on Twitter! kohdok
The funny thing is while Pokémon is the last of the big 3 TCGs to introduce a remove from play mechanic, it's the first to give it a name other than "removed from (play/the game)"
And it's all because the card effects became so long, they can't fit into the card text box anymore. One the flip side tho, it's something Konami should have done a lot sooner, as there never was a reason to keep writing the terms "graveyard" and "remove from play" on each and every card, since everyone already knew what those terms mean.
TCG still uses "Tribute Summon" while OCG changed it to "Advance Summon". Took them forever to officially adopt the term "Piercing" battle damage and "Banish".
Yeah, Yugioh tried really hard to not make use of keywords in most respects, which worked alright for a good while until the cards became bloated. There's a good reason for this being that the card designs didn't really lend themselves to cohesive keywords until archetypes became a thing, so at first there was no need for it until later.
Regarding the "tribute" and "advance" summonings, the change doesn't really mean anything tho, as it's simply a cosmetic change for the OCG to be cooler then actually trim down the fat of the card's texts. And both terms are basically interchangeable when used among the player community, more so when talking about duels shown in the anime.
I still check up on Yugioh every now and then to see if it finally broke under it's messy ruleset. Heard they made two new formats. Speed Duel with the old (good) characters and old cards. And Rush Duel, with playground rules (no sacrifice required, draw until you have 5 cards in hand). Most importantly, they finally try to fix the reminder text on the cards!
Hey, it's Cimooo! How's going pal? as a fellow YGO player, I can confirm. At least you know what it does when you finally read it, unlike with Pot of Greed.
That's more so a case of the card having multiple effects, not that they can be abbreviated into smaller sentences (considering the card plays with counters which isn't that universal)
@@iSearchTH-cam well in more general cases like instead of saying this card cannot be destroyed by battle why not just something like relentless maybe?
@@feritperliare2890 That's actually a valid argument. I was just thinking how "negate" effects can't really use key words. Since a card could negate the activation or just the effect, it could destroy, banish or not even remove the card negated. But your example is spot on
One other note with how reminder text is used in Magic: The common and uncommon cards usually have reminder text while the rares and mythics don't. This ensures that the most commonly viewed cards by newer players or in a draft environment have the necessary explanation whereas the cards that are used more by experienced players have room for larger text related to their other effects. This also feeds into a design pattern where they make a certain number of commons and uncommons with just the new keyword for the set tacked on and then make some rares and mythics that use that new keyword in an interesting way.
it's not that rares and mythics don't have it. they also printed it on rares++ if it's new mechanic (e.g. mutate) or older mechanic that made a resurface on new cards.
@Jay Morales Ice Cauldron comes from an unoptimized age, that barely counts. Everything that tried to do somethind different back then was a wall of text. Banding alone could make a card be a wall of text.
Or just cause they have more room for reminder text because even by tcg standards Magic has gotten super gacha and there's no way a common or uncommon is gonna be on equal power as a rare But somehow they avoid gambling laws
James Lucrative Gambling laws were the reason they had to remove ante from the game. (The rules originally stated that each player had to remove a random card from their deck at the start of the game, and whoever won would keep both cards. This was later made optional -- resulting in cards being printed with the text "remove [this] from your deck before playing if you are not playing for ante", either because they interacted with the ante or because they had abilities that forced the opponent to trade them for one of their cards -- and then removed entirely, resulting in all cards with that text being banned.) Also, they had the "Mr. Suitcase" problem in mind from the beginning and tried to fight it by making rarer cards more situational rather than strictly better. I remember reading that they try to make commons always somewhat useful, uncommons useful in certain situations, rares potentially game-winning in decks built around them, and mythics hard to get into play but game-winning if you do.
I think I already see one of the 7 more. Bad layout. I admit some games I never picked up because the layout was confusing to look at. Nothing to draw the eye to where to look. Can be just me, but I'm curious if others have a similar mindset.
@@laughingfurry that redemption game he reviewed for example has pretty bad layout that makes my eyes get confused and I'm playing eye of the storm in commander mtg
10 commandments implies that games would have to follow them to succeed. Plenty of games violate the 7 deadly sins in this series and survive beyond the two year curse but they tend to be exceptions if for no other reason than the fact that they tend to grab an audience long enough with its own unique mechanics. So, heavenly virtues works well so as to not imply that games must follow them to succeed or just because you follow them, you will succeed.
I can figure that out. The seven deadly sins video series is awesome. There is a lot of good ranting and critisim. Yet when I look past the negativity, I can find ways to improve. The video do give good suggestions on how to improve. The criticism is more constructive. I have seen all the videos. So I know how things can improve. From there I can construct the Seven Heavenly Virtues of Game Design. It is like how the original deadly sins of Christianity have a set of seven virtues, which re the opposite. 1. Don't rotate sets without innovating. 2. Keep track of progression without milling. 3. Have moderate mixing of attributes. 4. Use standard card sizes. 5. Make an original intellectual property. 6. Use a deck and some small pieces. 7. Add reminder text.
Also deal remaining damage to life points card is removed from play also deal remaining damage to life points card is removed from play EXCEPT FROG THE JAM
This is the cardinal sin of TCGs, in my opinion. I've had numerous heated discussions with the people who did the fan translated Digimon 2020 cards, because they would only print reminder on ONE card and the rest just had the keyword. Luckily the official cards use reminder text every damn time.
@@HunterSerge Seriously. When BT2 came out, it took me way too long to figure out what "Vengeance" (Retaliation) did because they only put it on Myotismon.
@@CynicalPete It is bad, when you think that you shouldn't be searching for things on other places on a tournament, or how every game can take a lot more if you need to search what a card does.
I agree with you but calling it the cardinal sin of TCG might be a bit much lol, keywords don't always need reminder text. The original only use reminder text if there's room for it in the card, which is a good way to do it.
This is one of the places where digital card games have a major advantage. Just looking at digital versions of Magic like Arena or Duels of the Planeswalkers, the reminder text is always available with just a simple button press or hover. It's one of the reasons I feel those are two of the best ways to introduce somebody to MtG. Heck my mom learned how to play that way.
Indeed, especially for some games like Slay the Spire or its derivatives where keyword descriptions themselves can have keywords within them, which in turn can recursively have other keywords in their own descriptions, and so ont
It helped with a digital deck building game that I tried out on my phone. Sadly, the tutorial is a grating experience to sit through because of how weird the voiceover was
4:24 - On the topic of Haste's reminder text, it's actually a perfect example of what the often misunderstood adage "exception that proves the rule" means, and is a great way of teaching people how the game works through the cards themselves. The reminder text for haste teaches new players of MTG that usually creatures may _NOT_ attack and use tap abilities the turn it comes under your control - it is an exception to a rule that players might night know about already, and the exception helps to explain this rule. The same is true for the reminder text for vigilance in the next shot - "Attacking doesn't cause this creature to tap" is another exception which helps to teach new players that _normally,_ attacking _does_ require creatures to tap. Writing out these rules as abilities that function as exceptions to those rules helps players learn the basics on their own with only the cards. The phrase does apply in real life as well and is a good way to teach people without some kind of exposition dump. A "No Right On Red" sign is another example of something that proves that a general rule of, "you may make right turns at red lights" exists, just not where the sign is present. Unfortunately, "an exception that proves the rule", seems to usually get misunderstood as some kind of declaration that a rule isn't a _real_ rule until it's broken, or something, which is just kind of dumb.
ngl this is actually the first time I've heard this particular interpretation of that adage. I'd actually kinda been operating on a third, also incorrect but completely different interpretation. So the adage comes from a medieval legal principle that was often written out in Latin as "exceptio probat regulam in casibus non exceptis" or literally "the exception tests the rule in the cases not excepted." I had interpreted it not as "an explicit exception to a rule implies the existence of that rule" or "a rule having exceptions proves that the rule is valid, actually," but as "an exception to a rule that tests the limits or validity of that rule," assuming that "proves" was a mistranslation that became more widespread than a more correct translation like "the exception that tests the rule" or "the exception that probes the rule"
they're both insanely complex but banding is more "it's insanely complex but no one uses it today because all the cards that have it are terrible" while phasing and phase out still exist in cards that are used in the older formats so people still have to deal with it
@@herrabanani Eh, phasing is much simpler to understand, regardless. All you have to know is "thing on the field phases out before untap, it ceases to exist. At the same time, things that were phased out phase back in and exist again, without triggering any ETB". There. I just explained it in less than 2 lines. Now, banding? Banding has a huge rules baggage related to how it works, how blocking with it works, how damage with it works. It's a nightmare.
@@caveshinobi1726 Banding on its own is pretty straightforward; the problems with it that cause banding to be such a headache are in relation to how it interacts with keywords that affect how damage is assigned (and what happens when an effect kills the banding creature after blockers are declared but before combat resolves)
@@flametitan100 And that's kind of the point I made. All the baggage that comes with banding IS hard to understand, because it has just way too much stuff. Phasing doesn't have any extra complexity besides what I just said. Absolutely everything that asks "what happens if I try to X the phased out permanent?" can be answered by "nothing, it doesn't exist". It ceases to exist and then exists again at the beginning of the following turn. Simple as that.
Keywords can also have reminder text when there is room for simple cards, while more complex cards in the same set can just have the keyword as they need the space for their unique abilities.
This. In addition to that, it makes sense to have reminder text on low rarity cards that will show up in packs often as this allows players to see that reminder text constantly and learn what the keyword does through osmosis. Then games can leave the text off of the higher rarity cards that will by nature show up less often because they will already know what the keywords mean by going through dozens of more common cards.
I now It may sound weird, but would you talk about alternative win conditions in Trading Card Games? Other forms outside the standard forms that the game gives the players in order to win the game. Exodia the Forbidden One been one of the most famous example of an alternative win condition in Trading Card Games.
Yeah, but that's not a sin, let alone a deadly sin. Magic the Gathering does alternate win conditions all of the time. In the past 2 years alone, we've had 4 new cards that win you the game outright, of which only 3 are worth playing, only 2 have seen play (coincidentally, they share the same condition - if your deck is empty, you win the game), and only ONE of them actually sees competitive play (Thassa's Oracle). And even then, that card is not overpowered, or busted or anything. We've also had five cards that read "an opponent loses the game". None of them has been actually used in any competitive setting to win the game through their game-ending effect.
Though the cards say "you win the duel" if certain conditions are met, which are explained on the main card (The card "Exodia the Forbidden One" (which has the head), the card "Destiny Board", etc.)
I'm surprised this video never mentioned digital card games and how they handle keywords and reminder text. Hearthstone, for example, doesn't put reminder text on the card but rather has that text appears next to the card whenever you hover over it. Given how Hearthstone is designed for a very casual audience as well as competitive players, their cards tend not to have card text that's very long, being quite big on the card itself. The hearthstone card with the most text is Curious Glimmerroot I believe, and it only has 19 words of card text, which isn't a lot. Saving on real-estate with keywords has got to be one of the biggest advantaged to digital-only card games.
Boy do I have a story about this. During the end of my fourth year in college, I decided to try and make my own card game. I ended up modelling it heavily after the card game Yomi (like simultaneous turns, focus on non-creature combat, and the preconstructed decks built with a single character in mind) but added elements of deckbuilding games like Slay the Spire (where cards get put into your deck during gameplay) and the use of permanents like in Magic, Pokemon, etc. (Yomi's simultaneous turns didn't allow for permanents because of the problems with activating effects from existing cards on the field). Long story short I ended up using way too many keywords (at one point I had at least 30 keywords across around 70 unique cards), and because of the nature of simultaneous turns each card needed more text so there wasn't much room for explaining the mechanics. Soon after I started playtesting and quickly learned that having so many keywords, especially without reminder text, was really, really bad because players kept getting confused about what cards do. Throw in an unreasonably large 11 card types, unique shuffling mechanics, detrimental placeholder statistic art, and a combat system with an unreasonably large number of exceptions and you have perhaps the most unnecessarily complex card games ever made. Eventually I reduced the number of keywords to a much more reasonable 12-13. This included getting rid of unreasonably complex keywords, adjusting keywords so others weren't necessary, adjusting card types to reduce "simulation" keywords that were there just so one card type could simulate another. I still don't have reminder text, but I did design around it by including all keywords in the instruction manual in an easy-to-access location and by making each keyword either used by every character (so the keyword is constantly reinforced) or by having it heavily used by one character (so it's not something you need to learn when not playing against that character). These can be further reinforced by having a separate rules card for each character that lets both players learn their unique mechanics in an easily accessible way. I'm still technically playtesting it, but it's come a long way from my original designs in terms of simplifying the mechanics so it's easier to understand while still having the depth that it offered.
That was a great point you made with that "Burn" keyword. Rules should also take into consideration the keywords used in other card games. Expect to have players who are brand new to card games and veterans who play many. Don't fall into the trap of confusing veteran card game players by making their previous knowledge of other games hurt them when playing yours.
Some keywords you have to "dodge" if you are making your own game. Because lawsuits and etc. Yeah that was a stupid usage of the term burn when they applied it to a keyword.
I would say that PSCT in and of itself could be considered the real keywords of YGO, but yes, a lot of it is just understanding the underlying "mechanics" of the card text, and reminder text could not help the elaborate effects
Ygo introduced problem solving card text like 4 years ago though which really helped in the clarity. But those long text explanations are down to the D&D inspirations the game took on.
YGO doesn't actually use keywords. The full effect is simply always written down on the card itself, in great details. But it doesn't mean the game doesn't have specific terms for specific effects and board placements, and it tends to use those terms to simplify the effects written on the cards.
@GamerBear I'm confident it's because of the abnormal shape. It scrolls offscreen enough that a standard card wouldn't be visible anymore, so I suspect that, whatever video editing software Kohdok used, he programmed the cards to scroll a certain distance offscreen before stopping and then disappearing. But since Hecatomb cards are regular pentagons, they're wider, and that distance isn't enough for them, so it's got a corner sticking out.
I loved this series! Thank you for putting in so much time and effort into the rewatchability in this series and the thought process of dummy-down for viewers like me!
This series and your channel have been a huge help to me! I have been working on a card game for a couple years now, had to restart after losing all my previous work more than a couple times but in finding your series you have helped give me a lot of ideas and advice on what and what not to do. Your channel and game knowledge especially about TCG's is priceless. I hopeto see more videos even though the series has ended. Card games have been a huge part of my life and my experiences with learning to get out of my comfort zone. I hope one day I can share the same passion with a new group of people and maybe create something fresh to keep minds sharp and tables roaring with laughter and fun. Please keep up the good work! Godspeed
@@goncaloferreira6429 it solved a lot of problems actually. Look up Dzeef who has a whole series on old cards pre-PSCT with nonsensical/confusing ways to write effects. But outside of those extremes, there was general confusion on basic things like cost, if something targeted, etc. PSCT made things uniform in that regard so as long as you knew the "grammar" of the cards, you could work it out. After that the ruling confusion came from the effect and interactions themselves, rather than just the way they were written.
@@CaptBackwards as someone who made an edh deck that's entire goal was to confuse ppl, I can tell you without a doubt banding gets more of a response from players than phasing. I have seen other ppl run phasing cards whereas I had to remove most banding cards from the deck as it was becoming an issue explaining it. Phasing means "before this card's controller's untap step this card either phases in or out. While it's phased out treat it like it's not there" Banding means "all cards with banding and up to one without act like one creature in combat, kinda. If you can block one you block the entire band and among the band it's controller assigns combat damage" I think
So I didn’t know what either of these were (don’t play magic) so was looking it up and on the wiki under banding it says “Although some players claim to understand banding, in reality, almost no one does.” Given that this is not on the phasing page I am forced to agree with you.
I'm actually very interested, but I can't think of a viable way of keeping it going for years. You could extend to Urban legends as well, but it would still be limited. Well, perhaps my mind is limited and you already have a great idea in yours
@@thiagoleal5841 I don't think one need to come up with new creatures in order to support a ccg... at any rate, if I were to create something based on brazilian folklore, I'd go for an assimetrical, one closed deck per character kind of thing
5:02 *Fun Fact:* Old Fogey is the _only_ MtG card with the "Bands with other" keyword. All the other cards with it are a creature that makes tokens with "Bands with other," five lands that grant "Bands with other" to certain-colored legendary creatures, and a creature that _removes_ "Bands with other" from enemy creatures.
I only started following your channel because of this series, but your other stuff seemed pretty interesting too, so I think I'll stick around for now :)
No set rotation, no unmixable attributes, no life decking, use the asian standard card size (wich is A standard), does not require more than a deck and some coin, if anything to much reminder text. It commited just one lol. If anything commited many mistakes that were not part of the 7.
Funny thing: When you showed off a bunch of cards at 4:41 to show how Magic uses reminder text on new mechanics to be able to leave it out in subsequent sets, the Golgari Thug with the reminder text for the Dredge mechanic is actually a reprint released years after the mechanic first showed up, while your example without the reminder text, Golgari Grave-Troll, was printed just like this in the first set the ability showed up in.
I think the seven deadly sins lay an excellent foundation for your yt channel because if you talk about specific tcgs you can simply link to these videos. Btw, if you haven't heard about it, Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Champions is a tcg with quite some neat ideas and it incorporates it's idea of "hero" cards pretty well in my opinion. But what completely destroyed it was deck splitting. Yeah, there are 4 factions and I can't mix cards for decks. So that game is pretty dead. I bought a whole booster display for 10 bucks.
Great video, I can remember my friends and I when we first started playing magic at 10 years old. We had no clue what some of the words or symbols meant so we just made up explinations. For example: llanowar elves says "tap: add [forest mana symbol] to your mana pool". We thought the mana pool meant the area where you have your mana cards, so we assumed it meant search your library for a forest land card and put it in the pool. Needless to say everyone would splash green and add llanowar elves to quickly ramp. The game is still fun with the correct rules, but those crazy ones we made up made the game very wild.
I've heard a lot of discussion about how yugioh just avoids keywords all together. I could see this being in the follow up to this video. But definitely needs to be discussed
@@goncaloferreira6429 To some degree, everything is unique, but no one can say that most games have some kind of inspiration, mainly on Magic, while Yu-gi-oh took a different arguably more straightforward way, like the Final Fantasy to Magic's Dragon Quest or a Pokémon to Shin Megami Tensei comparison, not like it is necesarilly a better way, but it is more unique, atleast on the biggest TCG spectrum.
@@Franciscomeirajr it's for yugioh. Normalized all the ways to describe an effect and broke down condition, cost and effect in a sentence format that could be easily deciphered without relying on keywords/reminder text in the first place.
@@JustJules250 You could still rely on keywords on top of PSCT (which is a template to word card effects properly and should be a standard for any game really) so that you don't end up with bloated text. "Cannot be destroyed by battle" could be cut to "indestructible" or "cannot be targeted by card effect" could be "hexproof" (from Mtg). This would help toward reducing text on card because PSCT can be quite wordy.
I know you are really only talking about physical card games in this video, but digital card games are a lot better than physical ones if there is no reminder text on it. You were talking about the physical card game of Lightseekers, how having no reminder text is bad, but in the digital version of it, it's actually a blesssing, as the reminder text can pop up to tell you what the card does. Anyway, this was great video nonetheless, and congrats on finishing on the "Seven Deadly Sins" series! It was a great ride all the way through.
I want to thank you for this series. I'm an aspiring game maker and this is all very useful advice. Hopefully you will be talking positively about one of my games in the future.
in Hearthstone, you can get reminder text on any keyword by hovering over it and yet they still chose to replace "Enrage" with just its reminder text. also partially Echo, and arguably Overkill...
The Hearthstone designers have this weird obsession with making keywords COMPLETELY set- or season-specific, with only a few exceptions: keywords like Rush and Discover that have essentially replaced old text, Rush having replaced "Charge, but cannot attack heroes this turn" (a wording that is technically still available in Wild, and can be used for screwball combo setups Rush can't do) and Discover having displaced a lot of draw/generation effects that didn't give any direct control. They're also very slow to introduce any keywords into classes they didn't originate in. These two decisions, in hindsight, have probably contributed to the game's near-total collapse over the past year, as the dev team's obsession with introducing at least one new keyword per set gave rise to unprecedentedly meta-destroying cards like Questlines (or rather, the about 3-4 specific ones that are Tier 1, and the rest are kinda meh), or ones that are just janky to use like Frenzy and Tradeable.
OH BOY that making of Mitos y Leyendas TCG at the start really brings back memories that game was the one that woke up this obsesion with cards I had a blast with them.
PSCT doesn't really involve keywords past "banish" or "piercing", and even then, it's sloppily added on to the existing card text. Most of Yu-Gi-Oh!'s PSCT rulings are so that the text follows a consistent structure to make it simpler to understand
Jetstream Matt “(Quick Effect):”, “Flip:”, “destroy”, “Tribute”, “Equip”, “material”, “linked”, “co-linked”, “negate”, “set”, “target”, basically every summoning method, and more are all keywords. They mean something specific that is different from what the words mean normally, and have rules attached to them. PSCT is full of generic keywords to describe parts of effects, rather than the keywords being effects themselves like in magic, where you see a keyword and maybe a cost or number attached.
@@qedsoku849 ???? most of these describe the actions by themselves. These are not keywords. How is material a keyword? Tributing has been in the game since the beggining. Equip? Negate? Set? These are all basic game mechanics.
Jetstream Matt In the same way “banish” is an action. Yugioh doesn’t have keywords that describe full effects, and it doesn’t have many that describe full activation conditions, but it has a lot that describe specific parts of effects, “material” refers to any monster used to summon an extra deck monster, monsters like “eater of millions” read “cannot be used as material for a __ Summon”.
When I was developing my card game, I just looked up other cards online and just took notes from other cards texts, without even thinking about it. Now I see with keywords, I made the right call.
Also a nice bonus of keywords amd reminder text is that you can literally just skip over the reminder text if you know the keyword already which makes reading easier
It's so true. For my professional wrestling card game I'm working (it's at an alpha test stage now) on I knew from early on I was going to be using reminder text.
And now, several years later, it’s kinda clear that Magic’s given up on new keywords being easily readable, at least as paper cards, three sets in a row. “Craft” is a mechanic that does have reminder text, but only because it is so complicated that every damn Standard card needs reminder text for every different take on it. “Collect evidence” is mercifully just a set of words and a number afterwards, but still a little more involved, and gives no hints as to how it works. And once Thunder Junction comes out, I feel so, so bad for every judge who has to explain what the rules for “committing a crime” is. Your keywords should not be three words long, or mistaken for an out of game action, or mistaken for a bad joke about Commander table dynamics
At this point they are just jamming one-off dumb keywords into the game to make hamfisted nods to the flavor of the card instead of using existing keywords to build top down flavor where possible and trusting their audience’s intelligence in deciphering them. I haven’t played any MKM limited because it’s the dumbest looking set ever, but it’s the whole descent/fathomless descend bs. Surely there is design space already explored with this without having to keyword 2 incredibly similarly keyworded mechanics in a set that already has at least 2 more new keywords already. And don’t get me started on cards that have a sentence as a keyword, for flavor alone… of course non-intuitive effects for those keywords, as you’re saying. It’s exhausting playing limited these days if you’re unfamiliar with the cards, so many words and it only increases the complexity for the less enfranchised player. The sets don’t even have a shelf life long enough to justify this complexity creep.
Really great video and I really love this series. I know that for whatever reason you hate it, but this series got me into Cardfight!! Vanguard. I've played magic since 1994, and never cared about any other card game. Watching this series opened my eyes, and I took the plunge on a new game. Still no idea why you hate that game, but regardless, I have you to thank for opening my horizons.
Me: oh this series looks interesting I’m going to check out the first video. Me at 3am: oh no I just watched the entire season of it This was really fun! Thanks for making the series!
Hugely agree, but one major benefit you missed around 4:25 is that you can put the reminder text on the common cards (the ones opened in largest quantities which new/inexperienced players will have a ton of and which already have little rules text anyway), while omitting them on rare cards. That way, you can use the advantages of keywording when you really need it on rare cards, but forego this benefit on common cards when it's not necessary.
One thing - when MTG gains new keyword it (for most of the time) have reminder text only on Common and Uncommon cards - Rares and Mithic Rares rarely use reminder texts even for new keywords.
This was true a while back. It's very very rare to see a card with a new block keyword that doesn't have reminder text. It only happens when the card is craving for text space.
This video really spoke to me. In my Dungeon Dice Monsters reboot I'm working on, I have 150 dice made for the core set and use about six key words for abilities, all of which is easily explained in a quick-help rule sheet. Honestly, I feel like that was part of the reason DDM fell so flat in the US despite the hype it got. Again, my goal is to make it a stand alone board game with expansions.
Magic: "exile"
Yugioh: "banish"
Pokemon TCG: *"THE LOST ZONE"*
"Removed from play"
The funny thing is while Pokémon is the last of the big 3 TCGs to introduce a remove from play mechanic, it's the first to give it a name other than "removed from (play/the game)"
I wonder what the deepest removal in any TCG is? In some sense, Yu-Gi-Oh has a degree of 3 (GY, banish, and finally banished facedown).
@@Dyllon2012 Isn't there some gimmick card in Magic that requires you tear it up after playing?
@@Zetact_ blacker lotus
This last one feels so short. I'm going to miss this series.
I think we already can sum up this sin of TCG easily.
This will probably have a more lengthy follow up; he usualy does a case study after and i assume this wouldnt be any different.
Wslasher, why are you just everywhere???
@@kankouya Because I'm not bound to my channel's contents & have a multitude of other interest?
Here's hoping we get a lengthy follow up video
Meanwhile Yugioh changes "graveyard" to "GY" and calls it a day.
And it's all because the card effects became so long, they can't fit into the card text box anymore. One the flip side tho, it's something Konami should have done a lot sooner, as there never was a reason to keep writing the terms "graveyard" and "remove from play" on each and every card, since everyone already knew what those terms mean.
TCG still uses "Tribute Summon" while OCG changed it to "Advance Summon". Took them forever to officially adopt the term "Piercing" battle damage and "Banish".
It is more of a problem in the TCG than the OCG, as the Japanese get more info-per-character in their language.
Yeah, Yugioh tried really hard to not make use of keywords in most respects, which worked alright for a good while until the cards became bloated. There's a good reason for this being that the card designs didn't really lend themselves to cohesive keywords until archetypes became a thing, so at first there was no need for it until later.
Regarding the "tribute" and "advance" summonings, the change doesn't really mean anything tho, as it's simply a cosmetic change for the OCG to be cooler then actually trim down the fat of the card's texts. And both terms are basically interchangeable when used among the player community, more so when talking about duels shown in the anime.
The Virgin Keywords vs the Chad Endymion Bible
“Imagine having keywords”.
-This post was made by Yugioh players
@@newcontentin100years9 Hey! We do have keywords, like Piercing, and Banish, and... and... Piercing... But we do have keywords!!
@@erickjr9 dont forget target and my favorite send/
who needs keywords when we have the legandary psct
I still check up on Yugioh every now and then to see if it finally broke under it's messy ruleset.
Heard they made two new formats. Speed Duel with the old (good) characters and old cards.
And Rush Duel, with playground rules (no sacrifice required, draw until you have 5 cards in hand). Most importantly, they finally try to fix the reminder text on the cards!
Meanwhile, Yu-Gi-Oh: *Stares at Endymion*
Hey, it's Cimooo! How's going pal?
as a fellow YGO player, I can confirm. At least you know what it does when you finally read it, unlike with Pot of Greed.
Yeah. We made some progress with piercing damage and whatnot, but oof.
That's more so a case of the card having multiple effects, not that they can be abbreviated into smaller sentences (considering the card plays with counters which isn't that universal)
@@iSearchTH-cam well in more general cases like instead of saying this card cannot be destroyed by battle why not just something like relentless maybe?
@@feritperliare2890 That's actually a valid argument. I was just thinking how "negate" effects can't really use key words. Since a card could negate the activation or just the effect, it could destroy, banish or not even remove the card negated. But your example is spot on
One other note with how reminder text is used in Magic: The common and uncommon cards usually have reminder text while the rares and mythics don't. This ensures that the most commonly viewed cards by newer players or in a draft environment have the necessary explanation whereas the cards that are used more by experienced players have room for larger text related to their other effects. This also feeds into a design pattern where they make a certain number of commons and uncommons with just the new keyword for the set tacked on and then make some rares and mythics that use that new keyword in an interesting way.
This design also gives them room for walls of text, like my boy Questing Beast.
it's not that rares and mythics don't have it. they also printed it on rares++ if it's new mechanic (e.g. mutate) or older mechanic that made a resurface on new cards.
@Jay Morales Ice Cauldron comes from an unoptimized age, that barely counts. Everything that tried to do somethind different back then was a wall of text. Banding alone could make a card be a wall of text.
Or just cause they have more room for reminder text because even by tcg standards Magic has gotten super gacha and there's no way a common or uncommon is gonna be on equal power as a rare
But somehow they avoid gambling laws
James Lucrative Gambling laws were the reason they had to remove ante from the game. (The rules originally stated that each player had to remove a random card from their deck at the start of the game, and whoever won would keep both cards. This was later made optional -- resulting in cards being printed with the text "remove [this] from your deck before playing if you are not playing for ante", either because they interacted with the ante or because they had abilities that forced the opponent to trade them for one of their cards -- and then removed entirely, resulting in all cards with that text being banned.)
Also, they had the "Mr. Suitcase" problem in mind from the beginning and tried to fight it by making rarer cards more situational rather than strictly better. I remember reading that they try to make commons always somewhat useful, uncommons useful in certain situations, rares potentially game-winning in decks built around them, and mythics hard to get into play but game-winning if you do.
The seven deadly sins were good and everything, but what about the 14 deadly sins?
I think I already see one of the 7 more. Bad layout. I admit some games I never picked up because the layout was confusing to look at. Nothing to draw the eye to where to look.
Can be just me, but I'm curious if others have a similar mindset.
are you TheDuelLogs?
@@laughingfurry that redemption game he reviewed for example has pretty bad layout that makes my eyes get confused and I'm playing eye of the storm in commander mtg
Maybe 7 Saintly Virtues?
Correct, that's his WOW account.
There's also the idea of "The Seven Heavenly Virtues of Game Design"....
10 Commandments
10 commandments implies that games would have to follow them to succeed. Plenty of games violate the 7 deadly sins in this series and survive beyond the two year curse but they tend to be exceptions if for no other reason than the fact that they tend to grab an audience long enough with its own unique mechanics. So, heavenly virtues works well so as to not imply that games must follow them to succeed or just because you follow them, you will succeed.
I can figure that out. The seven deadly sins video series is awesome. There is a lot of good ranting and critisim. Yet when I look past the negativity, I can find ways to improve. The video do give good suggestions on how to improve. The criticism is more constructive. I have seen all the videos. So I know how things can improve. From there I can construct the Seven Heavenly Virtues of Game Design. It is like how the original deadly sins of Christianity have a set of seven virtues, which re the opposite.
1. Don't rotate sets without innovating.
2. Keep track of progression without milling.
3. Have moderate mixing of attributes.
4. Use standard card sizes.
5. Make an original intellectual property.
6. Use a deck and some small pieces.
7. Add reminder text.
Man, remember how long it took Konami to figure out "Piercing" and "Banish"? Good times..
Also deal remaining damage to life points card is removed from play also deal remaining damage to life points card is removed from play EXCEPT FROG THE JAM
I still laugh at Man Eater Bug very first version. Destroy 1 monster on the field "(REGARDLESS OF POSITION)"
😂😂
You do not need to offer a tribute for the special summon of a level 5 or higher monster.
This is the cardinal sin of TCGs, in my opinion. I've had numerous heated discussions with the people who did the fan translated Digimon 2020 cards, because they would only print reminder on ONE card and the rest just had the keyword.
Luckily the official cards use reminder text every damn time.
Oh boy that group is the absolute worst with that stuff.
@@HunterSerge Seriously. When BT2 came out, it took me way too long to figure out what "Vengeance" (Retaliation) did because they only put it on Myotismon.
eh, that doesn't seem too bad to me. these days stuff like that can be looked up so easily it renders reminder text unnecessary
@@CynicalPete It is bad, when you think that you shouldn't be searching for things on other places on a tournament, or how every game can take a lot more if you need to search what a card does.
I agree with you but calling it the cardinal sin of TCG might be a bit much lol, keywords don't always need reminder text. The original only use reminder text if there's room for it in the card, which is a good way to do it.
This is one of the places where digital card games have a major advantage. Just looking at digital versions of Magic like Arena or Duels of the Planeswalkers, the reminder text is always available with just a simple button press or hover. It's one of the reasons I feel those are two of the best ways to introduce somebody to MtG. Heck my mom learned how to play that way.
Indeed, especially for some games like Slay the Spire or its derivatives where keyword descriptions themselves can have keywords within them, which in turn can recursively have other keywords in their own descriptions, and so ont
It helped with a digital deck building game that I tried out on my phone. Sadly, the tutorial is a grating experience to sit through because of how weird the voiceover was
Slay the spire uses it wonderfully
4:24 - On the topic of Haste's reminder text, it's actually a perfect example of what the often misunderstood adage "exception that proves the rule" means, and is a great way of teaching people how the game works through the cards themselves. The reminder text for haste teaches new players of MTG that usually creatures may _NOT_ attack and use tap abilities the turn it comes under your control - it is an exception to a rule that players might night know about already, and the exception helps to explain this rule. The same is true for the reminder text for vigilance in the next shot - "Attacking doesn't cause this creature to tap" is another exception which helps to teach new players that _normally,_ attacking _does_ require creatures to tap. Writing out these rules as abilities that function as exceptions to those rules helps players learn the basics on their own with only the cards.
The phrase does apply in real life as well and is a good way to teach people without some kind of exposition dump. A "No Right On Red" sign is another example of something that proves that a general rule of, "you may make right turns at red lights" exists, just not where the sign is present. Unfortunately, "an exception that proves the rule", seems to usually get misunderstood as some kind of declaration that a rule isn't a _real_ rule until it's broken, or something, which is just kind of dumb.
More of an exception shows that a rule normally applies.
... and the exception gets you hype for more stuff that breaks rules.
ngl this is actually the first time I've heard this particular interpretation of that adage. I'd actually kinda been operating on a third, also incorrect but completely different interpretation.
So the adage comes from a medieval legal principle that was often written out in Latin as "exceptio probat regulam in casibus non exceptis" or literally "the exception tests the rule in the cases not excepted." I had interpreted it not as "an explicit exception to a rule implies the existence of that rule" or "a rule having exceptions proves that the rule is valid, actually," but as "an exception to a rule that tests the limits or validity of that rule," assuming that "proves" was a mistranslation that became more widespread than a more correct translation like "the exception that tests the rule" or "the exception that probes the rule"
now it all makes sense...
Banding is an infinitely more notorious and hated mechanic than Phasing.
they're both insanely complex but banding is more "it's insanely complex but no one uses it today because all the cards that have it are terrible" while phasing and phase out still exist in cards that are used in the older formats so people still have to deal with it
@@herrabanani Eh, phasing is much simpler to understand, regardless. All you have to know is "thing on the field phases out before untap, it ceases to exist. At the same time, things that were phased out phase back in and exist again, without triggering any ETB". There. I just explained it in less than 2 lines. Now, banding? Banding has a huge rules baggage related to how it works, how blocking with it works, how damage with it works. It's a nightmare.
my exact words while watching the video
@@caveshinobi1726 Banding on its own is pretty straightforward; the problems with it that cause banding to be such a headache are in relation to how it interacts with keywords that affect how damage is assigned (and what happens when an effect kills the banding creature after blockers are declared but before combat resolves)
@@flametitan100 And that's kind of the point I made. All the baggage that comes with banding IS hard to understand, because it has just way too much stuff. Phasing doesn't have any extra complexity besides what I just said. Absolutely everything that asks "what happens if I try to X the phased out permanent?" can be answered by "nothing, it doesn't exist". It ceases to exist and then exists again at the beginning of the following turn. Simple as that.
Keywords can also have reminder text when there is room for simple cards, while more complex cards in the same set can just have the keyword as they need the space for their unique abilities.
This. In addition to that, it makes sense to have reminder text on low rarity cards that will show up in packs often as this allows players to see that reminder text constantly and learn what the keyword does through osmosis. Then games can leave the text off of the higher rarity cards that will by nature show up less often because they will already know what the keywords mean by going through dozens of more common cards.
"Phasing is probably MTG's most infamous keyword"
Banding would like to have a word (or 50) with you.
Phasing is probably Magic's most infamous keyword.
Banding: Am I a joke to you?
Islandhome, Horsemanship, Fortify and 9 others would like to know your location
@@ereshkigalvandrekkenov5657 Those are all pretty understandable.
@@cutecommie yeah, horsemanship is just Flying but different.
Can't wait for Yugioh to implement the _Linear Algebra_ keyword.
What, Linear Equation Cannon having its formula written down rather than it being a word problem?
g = (xl)+c
I now It may sound weird, but would you talk about alternative win conditions in Trading Card Games?
Other forms outside the standard forms that the game gives the players in order to win the game. Exodia the Forbidden One been one of the most famous example of an alternative win condition in Trading Card Games.
Are you the dinomist guy?? From the yugioh create a card contest????
Id love to see that!
Yeah, but that's not a sin, let alone a deadly sin. Magic the Gathering does alternate win conditions all of the time. In the past 2 years alone, we've had 4 new cards that win you the game outright, of which only 3 are worth playing, only 2 have seen play (coincidentally, they share the same condition - if your deck is empty, you win the game), and only ONE of them actually sees competitive play (Thassa's Oracle). And even then, that card is not overpowered, or busted or anything.
We've also had five cards that read "an opponent loses the game". None of them has been actually used in any competitive setting to win the game through their game-ending effect.
@@notsoundgenoff I mean talk about the alternate win conditions overall, not only in Magic, also in other TCG. In an off-topic video.
Though the cards say "you win the duel" if certain conditions are met, which are explained on the main card (The card "Exodia the Forbidden One" (which has the head), the card "Destiny Board", etc.)
I imagine this being said in the “No pomegranates” voice.
I'm surprised this video never mentioned digital card games and how they handle keywords and reminder text. Hearthstone, for example, doesn't put reminder text on the card but rather has that text appears next to the card whenever you hover over it. Given how Hearthstone is designed for a very casual audience as well as competitive players, their cards tend not to have card text that's very long, being quite big on the card itself. The hearthstone card with the most text is Curious Glimmerroot I believe, and it only has 19 words of card text, which isn't a lot. Saving on real-estate with keywords has got to be one of the biggest advantaged to digital-only card games.
Kinda like LOR too.
Boy do I have a story about this.
During the end of my fourth year in college, I decided to try and make my own card game. I ended up modelling it heavily after the card game Yomi (like simultaneous turns, focus on non-creature combat, and the preconstructed decks built with a single character in mind) but added elements of deckbuilding games like Slay the Spire (where cards get put into your deck during gameplay) and the use of permanents like in Magic, Pokemon, etc. (Yomi's simultaneous turns didn't allow for permanents because of the problems with activating effects from existing cards on the field).
Long story short I ended up using way too many keywords (at one point I had at least 30 keywords across around 70 unique cards), and because of the nature of simultaneous turns each card needed more text so there wasn't much room for explaining the mechanics. Soon after I started playtesting and quickly learned that having so many keywords, especially without reminder text, was really, really bad because players kept getting confused about what cards do. Throw in an unreasonably large 11 card types, unique shuffling mechanics, detrimental placeholder statistic art, and a combat system with an unreasonably large number of exceptions and you have perhaps the most unnecessarily complex card games ever made.
Eventually I reduced the number of keywords to a much more reasonable 12-13. This included getting rid of unreasonably complex keywords, adjusting keywords so others weren't necessary, adjusting card types to reduce "simulation" keywords that were there just so one card type could simulate another. I still don't have reminder text, but I did design around it by including all keywords in the instruction manual in an easy-to-access location and by making each keyword either used by every character (so the keyword is constantly reinforced) or by having it heavily used by one character (so it's not something you need to learn when not playing against that character). These can be further reinforced by having a separate rules card for each character that lets both players learn their unique mechanics in an easily accessible way.
I'm still technically playtesting it, but it's come a long way from my original designs in terms of simplifying the mechanics so it's easier to understand while still having the depth that it offered.
Sad to see this series go...
That was a great point you made with that "Burn" keyword. Rules should also take into consideration the keywords used in other card games. Expect to have players who are brand new to card games and veterans who play many. Don't fall into the trap of confusing veteran card game players by making their previous knowledge of other games hurt them when playing yours.
Some keywords you have to "dodge" if you are making your own game.
Because lawsuits and etc. Yeah that was a stupid usage of the term burn when they applied it to a keyword.
Meanwhile Yugioh has like 7 keywords if not fewer, and has an essay on every card.
I would say that PSCT in and of itself could be considered the real keywords of YGO, but yes, a lot of it is just understanding the underlying "mechanics" of the card text, and reminder text could not help the elaborate effects
Ygo introduced problem solving card text like 4 years ago though which really helped in the clarity.
But those long text explanations are down to the D&D inspirations the game took on.
@@Roboshi2007 It was like 10 years ago, but it wouldn't be bad to update it to some degree, specially for things like Endymion
@@erickjr9 Keywords don't work in Yugioh because even similar effects might have different conditions, restrictions and execution
YGO doesn't actually use keywords. The full effect is simply always written down on the card itself, in great details. But it doesn't mean the game doesn't have specific terms for specific effects and board placements, and it tends to use those terms to simplify the effects written on the cards.
I will always hold this series in high regards
I really hope Kohdok's channel continues to grow. His content is unique and insightful.
The pokemon tcg gba music is so good
Scroll here to read this. What a wonderful tune.
It really amuses me that, in the intro, the Hecatomb card doesn't scroll offscreen properly. It just stops 90% of the way there, then disappears.
@GamerBear I'm confident it's because of the abnormal shape. It scrolls offscreen enough that a standard card wouldn't be visible anymore, so I suspect that, whatever video editing software Kohdok used, he programmed the cards to scroll a certain distance offscreen before stopping and then disappearing. But since Hecatomb cards are regular pentagons, they're wider, and that distance isn't enough for them, so it's got a corner sticking out.
Nice vids. Definitely deserves a "7 More Deadly Sins... " series.
Or seven virtues?
This is one of the best series on game design I've ever watched. Absolutely incredible work.
I loved this series! Thank you for putting in so much time and effort into the rewatchability in this series and the thought process of dummy-down for viewers like me!
This series and your channel have been a huge help to me! I have been working on a card game for a couple years now, had to restart after losing all my previous work more than a couple times but in finding your series you have helped give me a lot of ideas and advice on what and what not to do. Your channel and game knowledge especially about TCG's is priceless. I hopeto see more videos even though the series has ended. Card games have been a huge part of my life and my experiences with learning to get out of my comfort zone. I hope one day I can share the same passion with a new group of people and maybe create something fresh to keep minds sharp and tables roaring with laughter and fun. Please keep up the good work!
Godspeed
Love the way you talk about card games, really going to miss this series...
I would love a follow-up video about Yu-Gi-Oh about reminder text and it's inclusion/exclusion in the card game.
And their use of PSCT
@@ScionStorm1 people praise the thing but it doesnt seem to have solved any problem.
@@goncaloferreira6429 It does.
@@goncaloferreira6429 it solved a lot of problems actually. Look up Dzeef who has a whole series on old cards pre-PSCT with nonsensical/confusing ways to write effects.
But outside of those extremes, there was general confusion on basic things like cost, if something targeted, etc. PSCT made things uniform in that regard so as long as you knew the "grammar" of the cards, you could work it out. After that the ruling confusion came from the effect and interactions themselves, rather than just the way they were written.
@@ecassl2994 it seems people think yugioh ha s no problems and no confusion anymore. it gets me confused.but hey, its the world of yugioh.
Love this series so much- thanks Kohdok!
I’ve been really loving this series man. You’re really doing a great job with it!
I really loved this series. Thank you. I'm really looking forward for your next videos.
Yo Kohdak man congratz on completing such an ambitious project, looking forward to your next series
Designing my own TCG, your series was awesome, awesome editing, great tips, and funny too :p Thanks man
I've enjoyed this series very much!! Thank you!!
Congrats on a great series, looking forward to your next work
I mean IMO banding is the most infamous mtg keyword not phasing.
IDK
I think phasing is really up there.
I think more people are aware of phasing in comparison to branding.
@@CaptBackwards as someone who made an edh deck that's entire goal was to confuse ppl, I can tell you without a doubt banding gets more of a response from players than phasing. I have seen other ppl run phasing cards whereas I had to remove most banding cards from the deck as it was becoming an issue explaining it.
Phasing means "before this card's controller's untap step this card either phases in or out. While it's phased out treat it like it's not there"
Banding means "all cards with banding and up to one without act like one creature in combat, kinda. If you can block one you block the entire band and among the band it's controller assigns combat damage" I think
So I didn’t know what either of these were (don’t play magic) so was looking it up and on the wiki under banding it says “Although some players claim to understand banding, in reality, almost no one does.”
Given that this is not on the phasing page I am forced to agree with you.
now that I know all t7ds, I can make a TCG based on Brazilian folklore! TY! 👏🏼👏🏼😄
Go for it, man! Let us know once you have a prototype?
As a brazilian, I'd love to see that. There was a project called Batalha de Mitos, but I think it folded. The artwork was awesome.
I'm actually very interested, but I can't think of a viable way of keeping it going for years. You could extend to Urban legends as well, but it would still be limited. Well, perhaps my mind is limited and you already have a great idea in yours
@@thiagoleal5841 I don't think one need to come up with new creatures in order to support a ccg... at any rate, if I were to create something based on brazilian folklore, I'd go for an assimetrical, one closed deck per character kind of thing
@@pabloschulman4726 that's an interesting idea. But one would have to find a way to not turn it into another vanguard
5:02 *Fun Fact:* Old Fogey is the _only_ MtG card with the "Bands with other" keyword. All the other cards with it are a creature that makes tokens with "Bands with other," five lands that grant "Bands with other" to certain-colored legendary creatures, and a creature that _removes_ "Bands with other" from enemy creatures.
I only started following your channel because of this series, but your other stuff seemed pretty interesting too, so I think I'll stick around for now :)
Nice touch using DQ VIII battle music in your description of keywords.
Clearly you're a man of taste.
Love the series, keep up the good work!
I like how weird yugioh keywords are, theres the psct, Toon, Tuner, Gemini etc and the symbols on the spell and trapcards.
The Chad Yugioh commited nearly every sin and is still going strong
Less than Voldemort sins
No set rotation, no unmixable attributes, no life decking, use the asian standard card size (wich is A standard), does not require more than a deck and some coin, if anything to much reminder text.
It commited just one lol. If anything commited many mistakes that were not part of the 7.
Really enjoyed this series! great content
Finally, the one ive been waiting for.
Wrow, catching it the second it comes out. Nice
I love the edit on the might of night to have reminder text while it was crawling across the screen XD
The Pokemon TCG music at the end... one of my single most favorite songs in all of video games. Loved this series!
Funny thing: When you showed off a bunch of cards at 4:41 to show how Magic uses reminder text on new mechanics to be able to leave it out in subsequent sets, the Golgari Thug with the reminder text for the Dredge mechanic is actually a reprint released years after the mechanic first showed up, while your example without the reminder text, Golgari Grave-Troll, was printed just like this in the first set the ability showed up in.
Well, that was an interesting series. Cheers man
I think the seven deadly sins lay an excellent foundation for your yt channel because if you talk about specific tcgs you can simply link to these videos.
Btw, if you haven't heard about it, Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Champions is a tcg with quite some neat ideas and it incorporates it's idea of "hero" cards pretty well in my opinion. But what completely destroyed it was deck splitting. Yeah, there are 4 factions and I can't mix cards for decks. So that game is pretty dead. I bought a whole booster display for 10 bucks.
Great video, I can remember my friends and I when we first started playing magic at 10 years old. We had no clue what some of the words or symbols meant so we just made up explinations. For example: llanowar elves says "tap: add [forest mana symbol] to your mana pool". We thought the mana pool meant the area where you have your mana cards, so we assumed it meant search your library for a forest land card and put it in the pool. Needless to say everyone would splash green and add llanowar elves to quickly ramp. The game is still fun with the correct rules, but those crazy ones we made up made the game very wild.
This series was awesome
I've heard a lot of discussion about how yugioh just avoids keywords all together. I could see this being in the follow up to this video. But definitely needs to be discussed
It's weird that YGO actually seems like a common game, but once you analize it with other games, it basically follows a unique style of design
@@erickjr9 are you saying it is special?
@@goncaloferreira6429 I wouldn't say it isn't, but I think "Unique" works better
@@erickjr9 trying to clarify since every game is unique.
@@goncaloferreira6429 To some degree, everything is unique, but no one can say that most games have some kind of inspiration, mainly on Magic, while Yu-gi-oh took a different arguably more straightforward way, like the Final Fantasy to Magic's Dragon Quest or a Pokémon to Shin Megami Tensei comparison, not like it is necesarilly a better way, but it is more unique, atleast on the biggest TCG spectrum.
that's why PSCT is the best way to write effects-
What's that?
@@Franciscomeirajr Problem-Solving Card Text
@@Franciscomeirajr it's for yugioh. Normalized all the ways to describe an effect and broke down condition, cost and effect in a sentence format that could be easily deciphered without relying on keywords/reminder text in the first place.
@@Franciscomeirajr read yu gi oh cards
@@JustJules250 You could still rely on keywords on top of PSCT (which is a template to word card effects properly and should be a standard for any game really) so that you don't end up with bloated text. "Cannot be destroyed by battle" could be cut to "indestructible" or "cannot be targeted by card effect" could be "hexproof" (from Mtg). This would help toward reducing text on card because PSCT can be quite wordy.
I love Duel Masters
From a mechanics standpoint,
Ignoring the stuff that's Japan exclusive.
But still the basic premise is so good.
The Pokémon TCG game music at the end was awesome.
Glad you finished this. Oh, and Shivan Dragon's my favorite card BTW.
I know you are really only talking about physical card games in this video, but digital card games are a lot better than physical ones if there is no reminder text on it. You were talking about the physical card game of Lightseekers, how having no reminder text is bad, but in the digital version of it, it's actually a blesssing, as the reminder text can pop up to tell you what the card does.
Anyway, this was great video nonetheless, and congrats on finishing on the "Seven Deadly Sins" series! It was a great ride all the way through.
Lol I loved the GB Pokemon TCG game music at the end. so nostalgic!
I love the Dragon Quest battle music in the background
Seriously Kohdok, you're one of the best TCG channels.
Oh why did there only have to be seven sins? This series got me into your channel and has kept me coming back. Guess we'll have to see what's next!
I want to thank you for this series. I'm an aspiring game maker and this is all very useful advice. Hopefully you will be talking positively about one of my games in the future.
in Hearthstone, you can get reminder text on any keyword by hovering over it
and yet they still chose to replace "Enrage" with just its reminder text.
also partially Echo, and arguably Overkill...
The Hearthstone designers have this weird obsession with making keywords COMPLETELY set- or season-specific, with only a few exceptions: keywords like Rush and Discover that have essentially replaced old text, Rush having replaced "Charge, but cannot attack heroes this turn" (a wording that is technically still available in Wild, and can be used for screwball combo setups Rush can't do) and Discover having displaced a lot of draw/generation effects that didn't give any direct control. They're also very slow to introduce any keywords into classes they didn't originate in. These two decisions, in hindsight, have probably contributed to the game's near-total collapse over the past year, as the dev team's obsession with introducing at least one new keyword per set gave rise to unprecedentedly meta-destroying cards like Questlines (or rather, the about 3-4 specific ones that are Tier 1, and the rest are kinda meh), or ones that are just janky to use like Frenzy and Tradeable.
OH BOY that making of Mitos y Leyendas TCG at the start really brings back memories that game was the one that woke up this obsesion with cards I had a blast with them.
Yugioh has keywords as well with the introduction psct. It is just less obvious
I feel a lot of people don’t realize just how helpful psct is
PSCT doesn't really involve keywords past "banish" or "piercing", and even then, it's sloppily added on to the existing card text. Most of Yu-Gi-Oh!'s PSCT rulings are so that the text follows a consistent structure to make it simpler to understand
Jetstream Matt “(Quick Effect):”, “Flip:”, “destroy”, “Tribute”, “Equip”, “material”, “linked”, “co-linked”, “negate”, “set”, “target”, basically every summoning method, and more are all keywords. They mean something specific that is different from what the words mean normally, and have rules attached to them. PSCT is full of generic keywords to describe parts of effects, rather than the keywords being effects themselves like in magic, where you see a keyword and maybe a cost or number attached.
@@qedsoku849 ???? most of these describe the actions by themselves. These are not keywords. How is material a keyword? Tributing has been in the game since the beggining. Equip? Negate? Set? These are all basic game mechanics.
Jetstream Matt In the same way “banish” is an action. Yugioh doesn’t have keywords that describe full effects, and it doesn’t have many that describe full activation conditions, but it has a lot that describe specific parts of effects, “material” refers to any monster used to summon an extra deck monster, monsters like “eater of millions” read “cannot be used as material for a __ Summon”.
The grand finale!
My body is ready
When I was developing my card game, I just looked up other cards online and just took notes from other cards texts, without even thinking about it.
Now I see with keywords, I made the right call.
Finally it’s here
dang it now I have the Pokemon Card Game Game Boy game battle music stuck in my head.
omg, the music from pokemon TCG! that brings back some memories
Dude you nailed the intro
Also a nice bonus of keywords amd reminder text is that you can literally just skip over the reminder text if you know the keyword already which makes reading easier
Love the GB Pokemon TCG music at the end
"Opppnent's face roughly over here" had me laughing more than it probably should have.
It's so true. For my professional wrestling card game I'm working (it's at an alpha test stage now) on I knew from early on I was going to be using reminder text.
1:44 ahh the Dragon Quest music! Reminds me of the monster summons
I think you put this one in the right spot, if there's anyone you want to stick better the others in new designers heads, it's this one.
Domo arigato, Kohdok-sama!
I would love to see a video talking about Structure/Starter Deck presentation.
This one exploded! 27k views! Congratulations
And now, several years later, it’s kinda clear that Magic’s given up on new keywords being easily readable, at least as paper cards, three sets in a row.
“Craft” is a mechanic that does have reminder text, but only because it is so complicated that every damn Standard card needs reminder text for every different take on it.
“Collect evidence” is mercifully just a set of words and a number afterwards, but still a little more involved, and gives no hints as to how it works.
And once Thunder Junction comes out, I feel so, so bad for every judge who has to explain what the rules for “committing a crime” is. Your keywords should not be three words long, or mistaken for an out of game action, or mistaken for a bad joke about Commander table dynamics
At this point they are just jamming one-off dumb keywords into the game to make hamfisted nods to the flavor of the card instead of using existing keywords to build top down flavor where possible and trusting their audience’s intelligence in deciphering them. I haven’t played any MKM limited because it’s the dumbest looking set ever, but it’s the whole descent/fathomless descend bs. Surely there is design space already explored with this without having to keyword 2 incredibly similarly keyworded mechanics in a set that already has at least 2 more new keywords already. And don’t get me started on cards that have a sentence as a keyword, for flavor alone… of course non-intuitive effects for those keywords, as you’re saying. It’s exhausting playing limited these days if you’re unfamiliar with the cards, so many words and it only increases the complexity for the less enfranchised player. The sets don’t even have a shelf life long enough to justify this complexity creep.
Commenting for the algorithm, ily kohdok
Reminder TEXT CHECK! 5:10 LOVE THE ORCISH HELLRAISER! MY CARD! Loved to play Empty the Warrens in Standard with those seethings songs...back in 2008!
The Pokemon TCG gameboy music bring back so many good memories.
Next series: the 14 somewhat hazardous sins
Really great video and I really love this series. I know that for whatever reason you hate it, but this series got me into Cardfight!! Vanguard. I've played magic since 1994, and never cared about any other card game. Watching this series opened my eyes, and I took the plunge on a new game. Still no idea why you hate that game, but regardless, I have you to thank for opening my horizons.
Me: oh this series looks interesting I’m going to check out the first video.
Me at 3am: oh no I just watched the entire season of it
This was really fun! Thanks for making the series!
Next you should do the 10 Commandments of Game Design
Hugely agree, but one major benefit you missed around 4:25 is that you can put the reminder text on the common cards (the ones opened in largest quantities which new/inexperienced players will have a ton of and which already have little rules text anyway), while omitting them on rare cards. That way, you can use the advantages of keywording when you really need it on rare cards, but forego this benefit on common cards when it's not necessary.
One thing - when MTG gains new keyword it (for most of the time) have reminder text only on Common and Uncommon cards - Rares and Mithic Rares rarely use reminder texts even for new keywords.
This was true a while back. It's very very rare to see a card with a new block keyword that doesn't have reminder text. It only happens when the card is craving for text space.
This video really spoke to me. In my Dungeon Dice Monsters reboot I'm working on, I have 150 dice made for the core set and use about six key words for abilities, all of which is easily explained in a quick-help rule sheet. Honestly, I feel like that was part of the reason DDM fell so flat in the US despite the hype it got. Again, my goal is to make it a stand alone board game with expansions.