This is the best video I’ve seen on this subject. I’ve been playing for more than 35 years and have, over the years, experimented with different weights to see what felt best to me. I currently use a 17oz break cue that came with a 4oz extension giving me the option of a 21oz break cue. I imagine adding 4oz to the very back of the cue changes the dynamic of the cue beyond just the added weight. I’ve tried it in both configuration and 17oz is a better fit for me. I appreciate you going beyond what I normally hear… “lighter is better PERIOD” or “heavier is better PERIOD. I’ll be sharing this video with my local pool groups Facebook page.
ok you have given me a little homework to do for when i get ready to have my cue set built, thank you. I think the weight of the playing cue is another great topic because i hear a lot about what weight is the best to use.
Great video I've been having discussions with other pool players past several months about the topic of breaking and weight and also tip types. Your example of the brick and feather is a pretty good one I always tell people if you have two sticks the same length but one's double the diameter which one can you swing faster. I found I have a friend that breaks around 26 to 28 but can't really get a good spread whereas I break between 13 and 1/2 to 15 miles an hour and I get a really consistently good break. If I'm getting a good break at that speed and controlling the cue ball. I'm using a BK Rush jump brake cue and I have fallen in love with it! I will say though if someone buys a Viking Valhalla just regular old nothing special for like 150 bucks and slaps a white diamond tip on it you can get almost the same power just a fun fact we're talking $175 versus 850$. Thanks for the video as always!
Hmmm. Thanks for the app. I just went out and tried it. My break cue is a Predator BK shaft from about 2000 or so I think on a Predator Sneaky Pete butt (1998). I also added a six inch extension in the middle. I tried with the six inches, no extension, and then a two inch extension. The cue was definitely lighter with no extension, but the highest speed was with the two inch extension. I suspect that’s because I’m 6’3” tall and the 90 degree point with no extension is with my last finger wrapped around the rubber bumper. I got almost 15 mph with the 6” extension, 16+ mph with no extension, and almost 18 mph with the two inch extension with just a few breaks each. I can see I’m going to have to spend more time with the app and breaking in my practice sessions. Thank you for more drills - lol. It’s 10:30 PM here in the PH and raining hard (my pool room is outside under a large covered patio) so I had to cut the data collection session short for now. Love your channel - it’s been chock full of good information. Again, thank you very much.
Great content as always! I fight the timing of my break, and other shots sometimes. My grip hand tends to be a little forward at contact which causes the tip of the cue to drop at contact. To combat this I shorten my bridge a little. This could be a good topic for timing, if you haven’t already covered it. Pendulum too far forward equals tip contacting lower than expected and too far back equals tip contacting higher than expected.
Force (f) equals Mass(m) times Acceleration (a), f=ma. With limited in ability to accelerate the cue, a heavier cue would be the better choice. If you are capable of high acceleration, then a lighter cue would be the better choice. For example, at 30, I used a 15 oz. cue for breaking; at 85, I use a 23 oz. cue.
You might be right - but it's not that simple. I might not be able to generate enough acceleration with a heavier cue for that mass to matter. The trade off between force and acceleration varies from person to person - which is a big focus of this video. So ya, while you are 'mathematically correct' - the on table application matters more.
The answer is found through the speed result of the Break speed app. It gives the resulting speed of the cue ball. The energy transferred to the first ball of the rack. The transfer is MxV, mass times speed. As all the balls weight around 5,68 Oz (161g), the speed is then calculated. But behind that resulting speed was the cue mass x the speed of the cue. And as mv=mv is true (almost) with two hard balls, but between the cue and the ball there is a tip. The harder, the more it will transfer the energy. So, the speed result on the app gives the bottom line result: the energy smacking the rack. So trying different cue weight will give you different results and perhaps a lighter cue will be easier on you and able to be more precised than a heavier one... ... so how do I tried different brake cue... Haha, nothing is easy !! Have good pool games, billiard is a great fun !!
Good video and yes controversial and it’s custom to what individuals can handle with accuracy. 35 years ago I had Huebler make me a custom 18 oz break cue & then I quit completion 30 years ago and completely left the scene to then start playing again 8 months ago and found out all the changes in cues and tips gloves etc. I added .5 making it 18.5 and I’m completely satisfied with my breaking power & accuracy and have a La Pro tip in it which I like, trust and can control. I was a good jumper back then too and now don’t jump much I kick or swerve/curve at balls if needed. I’m not at all even tempted to buy a new graphite break cue or phenolic tip or heavier break cue. I’m gonna down load that preditor break speed app just to see what my speed is but again I don’t really care because I’m completely happy with my breaking results. Cheers.
Thanks for the video, Chris. Good tips and explanations. I took some weight out of my break cue 25 oz to 21 oz. I have been hitting my breaks good. I am leaving my cue ball into the center of the table. I never heard of a twitch muscle. Good to know.
We need to stop driving this focus on break speed. A fantastic 8 and 9 ball break is possible with as little as 14mph. I was breaking in the low 20s until working with Jerry Powers. I now break with better spread, more consistency, and much better position at 16-17mph. This is a huge problem all the way up to the elite level.
What an awesome channel for information. I am 53 years old and have played pool most of my life. I have always struggled with my break. I have owned so many break cues, I can't even count them. From 14oz to 24 oz and everything in between. I am 5'4". How does heighth effect breaking power. I have seen even the shortest pros spread the balls effortlessly. Thank you.
@@CuemakersGuild thank you for responding. So I could go either way with heavy or light with my height? I feel so weak when it comes to the break. Thanks once again.
I had a 18.75 and got told I broke really good. 25 was too back heavy so the tip liked to rise so I didn’t like it. Waiting on my 21 oz try. Broke the leather tip on it. Waiting for it to come back. But it was decent
Extra points: tips make a big difference. Technique is probably the biggest difference. Small athletic women have learned to break really good. Big athletic men that don't know how to play good can't break well. Then the different games need different break techniques and speeds.
You see this play out in an obvious way in golf.Korean lpga pros are like 5’3” and are driving the ball 250+ yards. And your average man is driving the ball 200-220 yards even though they are almost 100 pounds heavier.
35 years ago the break was all about speed. These days players are often purposely hitting at less than their top speeds. They do this to make sure that accuracy hasn't suffered, and that the racked balls behave as expected. Like when they're doing a cut break to put the one in the side. Speed is great on a break, but accuracy is better, and proper speed with proper accuracy is the best.
That’s because of magic racks. Before with wood racks you couldn’t guaranteed a perfect break every time. Now it’s about finding the correct speed for the table to make the wing balls , in mine all at least. For me about 17 mph with a magic rack works well. With wood rack I’m hitting them 21-22 mph
Just thanks....I have an old and ugly 17oz cue and buy a verry nice 3 piece cue..beutifull but I cant break as I do with my old one ..a d now understad why the new one is 20.5 oz..thanks 😁
I have a 25 ounce break cue. I have downloaded the Predator break cue speed app this week. I was hitting my break at 8,9,10 mph. I changed my bridge to be on the rail. Then I tried snapping my wrist. The highest I got up to was 14 mph. The last day I was at 8 mph. Maybe I need to practice more? What do you think Chris?
@@CuemakersGuild Absolutly. I have straight line, i dont need too hit hard and i use my normal stroke, whit a soft break. And make 3 too 4 balls. Whit a rail break whit draw. Its perfect.
So i found the discussion on timing very interesting. I agree that the nomenclature 'timing' is impresice and leads to a lot of confusion. I prefer to think of stroke mechanics in terms of speed and acceleration which works well with your lecture tonight. But. The break technique seems to be so much different than the textbook shooting mechanic. This might be an extreme example, but think of SVB. His brake technique. He's choked up very high on the q. He actually rises up in his stroke but as he hits the ball everything is wrong with it. But he has one of the best breaks in the game. I get what you were saying and for other players the example might fit really well like Cory Dual with his very controlled and structured break. There are a lot of things going on there and well, I think the timing explanation works for a classic pool. Stroke mechanic doesn't always translate well to breaking
Force = Mass x Acceleration, Mass is simple, but defining acceleration you need to add the equation a = Δv/Δt where change in velocity over change in time.
went from a 18oz. cue and tried up to a 24oz cue and found that the 24oz. cue sent the cue about a 1 mph faster then the light cue? surprise, surprise on me.
Thanks. This the best explanation of breaking I have ever been given. I will try to put what you explained to see if I can break better.
Thank you very much, I hope you find it to be helpful.
This is the best video I’ve seen on this subject. I’ve been playing for more than 35 years and have, over the years, experimented with different weights to see what felt best to me. I currently use a 17oz break cue that came with a 4oz extension giving me the option of a 21oz break cue. I imagine adding 4oz to the very back of the cue changes the dynamic of the cue beyond just the added weight. I’ve tried it in both configuration and 17oz is a better fit for me. I appreciate you going beyond what I normally hear… “lighter is better PERIOD” or “heavier is better PERIOD. I’ll be sharing this video with my local pool groups Facebook page.
Thank you very much! I'm glad this has helped to shed more light on the topic for you.
ok you have given me a little homework to do for when i get ready to have my cue set built, thank you. I think the weight of the playing cue is another great topic because i hear a lot about what weight is the best to use.
Thanks, I would be more than happy to do a video about that as well.
Great video I've been having discussions with other pool players past several months about the topic of breaking and weight and also tip types. Your example of the brick and feather is a pretty good one I always tell people if you have two sticks the same length but one's double the diameter which one can you swing faster. I found I have a friend that breaks around 26 to 28 but can't really get a good spread whereas I break between 13 and 1/2 to 15 miles an hour and I get a really consistently good break. If I'm getting a good break at that speed and controlling the cue ball. I'm using a BK Rush jump brake cue and I have fallen in love with it! I will say though if someone buys a Viking Valhalla just regular old nothing special for like 150 bucks and slaps a white diamond tip on it you can get almost the same power just a fun fact we're talking $175 versus 850$. Thanks for the video as always!
Thank you for watching, I'm glad you found it to be helpful!
Thank you for the information.
You are more than welcome, I hope it has helped!
Great points, info, and facts! Do appreciate the sharing of knowledge; promotion of the sport/game. : ) I love it!!! Be Safe
Thank you very much! Please consider donating to the channel to help keep the content coming.
Hmmm. Thanks for the app. I just went out and tried it. My break cue is a Predator BK shaft from about 2000 or so I think on a Predator Sneaky Pete butt (1998). I also added a six inch extension in the middle. I tried with the six inches, no extension, and then a two inch extension. The cue was definitely lighter with no extension, but the highest speed was with the two inch extension. I suspect that’s because I’m 6’3” tall and the 90 degree point with no extension is with my last finger wrapped around the rubber bumper. I got almost 15 mph with the 6” extension, 16+ mph with no extension, and almost 18 mph with the two inch extension with just a few breaks each. I can see I’m going to have to spend more time with the app and breaking in my practice sessions. Thank you for more drills - lol. It’s 10:30 PM here in the PH and raining hard (my pool room is outside under a large covered patio) so I had to cut the data collection session short for now. Love your channel - it’s been chock full of good information. Again, thank you very much.
Thank you for your comment! I'm glad that you are finding it to be useful, please stay tuned fir more!
Great content as always! I fight the timing of my break, and other shots sometimes. My grip hand tends to be a little forward at contact which causes the tip of the cue to drop at contact. To combat this I shorten my bridge a little. This could be a good topic for timing, if you haven’t already covered it. Pendulum too far forward equals tip contacting lower than expected and too far back equals tip contacting higher than expected.
Thank you, this could make a good topic.
Force (f) equals Mass(m) times Acceleration (a), f=ma. With limited in ability to accelerate the cue, a heavier cue would be the better choice. If you are capable of high acceleration, then a lighter cue would be the better choice. For example, at 30, I used a 15 oz. cue for breaking; at 85, I use a 23 oz. cue.
Thank you for your feedback.
You might be right - but it's not that simple.
I might not be able to generate enough acceleration with a heavier cue for that mass to matter. The trade off between force and acceleration varies from person to person - which is a big focus of this video.
So ya, while you are 'mathematically correct' - the on table application matters more.
The answer is found through the speed result of the Break speed app.
It gives the resulting speed of the cue ball. The energy transferred to the first ball of the rack.
The transfer is MxV, mass times speed. As all the balls weight around 5,68 Oz (161g), the speed is then calculated. But behind that resulting speed was the cue mass x the speed of the cue. And as mv=mv is true (almost) with two hard balls, but between the cue and the ball there is a tip. The harder, the more it will transfer the energy.
So, the speed result on the app gives the bottom line result: the energy smacking the rack. So trying different cue weight will give you different results and perhaps a lighter cue will be easier on you and able to be more precised than a heavier one...
... so how do I tried different brake cue...
Haha, nothing is easy !!
Have good pool games, billiard is a great fun !!
Good video and yes controversial and it’s custom to what individuals can handle with accuracy. 35 years ago I had Huebler make me a custom 18 oz break cue & then I quit completion 30 years ago and completely left the scene to then start playing again 8 months ago and found out all the changes in cues and tips gloves etc. I added .5 making it 18.5 and I’m completely satisfied with my breaking power & accuracy and have a La Pro tip in it which I like, trust and can control. I was a good jumper back then too and now don’t jump much I kick or swerve/curve at balls if needed. I’m not at all even tempted to buy a new graphite break cue or phenolic tip or heavier break cue. I’m gonna down load that preditor break speed app just to see what my speed is but again I don’t really care because I’m completely happy with my breaking results. Cheers.
Thank you very much for watching.
Thanks for the video, Chris. Good tips and explanations. I took some weight out of my break cue 25 oz to 21 oz. I have been hitting my breaks good. I am leaving my cue ball into the center of the table. I never heard of a twitch muscle. Good to know.
I am glad this has helped!
We need to stop driving this focus on break speed. A fantastic 8 and 9 ball break is possible with as little as 14mph. I was breaking in the low 20s until working with Jerry Powers. I now break with better spread, more consistency, and much better position at 16-17mph.
This is a huge problem all the way up to the elite level.
What an awesome channel for information. I am 53 years old and have played pool most of my life. I have always struggled with my break. I have owned so many break cues, I can't even count them. From 14oz to 24 oz and everything in between. I am 5'4". How does heighth effect breaking power. I have seen even the shortest pros spread the balls effortlessly. Thank you.
Height doesn't really play a part in break speed. It is more about the mechanics not the size.
@@CuemakersGuild thank you for responding. So I could go either way with heavy or light with my height? I feel so weak when it comes to the break. Thanks once again.
@@TheGunit272 focus on the light end first and work your way up to heavy in order to find your OPTIMAL.
Waiting for pool to catch up to golf. Players can hit multiple clubs and get feedback from a monitor. This should be possible for pool breaks. One shaft with interchangeable weights and tips
Come on Trackman©️ make this happen
I had a 18.75 and got told I broke really good. 25 was too back heavy so the tip liked to rise so I didn’t like it. Waiting on my 21 oz try. Broke the leather tip on it. Waiting for it to come back. But it was decent
Thank you very much for watching!
Extra points: tips make a big difference. Technique is probably the biggest difference. Small athletic women have learned to break really good. Big athletic men that don't know how to play good can't break well. Then the different games need different break techniques and speeds.
Yes, this is very true.
You see this play out in an obvious way in golf.Korean lpga pros are like 5’3” and are driving the ball 250+ yards. And your average man is driving the ball 200-220 yards even though they are almost 100 pounds heavier.
Nice audio quality!!!
Thank you, I purchased new Laviler Mics lol.
35 years ago the break was all about speed. These days players are often purposely hitting at less than their top speeds. They do this to make sure that accuracy hasn't suffered, and that the racked balls behave as expected. Like when they're doing a cut break to put the one in the side. Speed is great on a break, but accuracy is better, and proper speed with proper accuracy is the best.
I agree, which is why I included how to find your controlled break speed drill.
@@CuemakersGuild We're on the same page. You've been making cues for a long time, and I've been playing for a long time.
That’s because of magic racks.
Before with wood racks you couldn’t guaranteed a perfect break every time.
Now it’s about finding the correct speed for the table to make the wing balls , in mine all at least.
For me about 17 mph with a magic rack works well. With wood rack I’m hitting them 21-22 mph
I break well with 19-20 oz cues. My personal breaker is 20oz.
Lighter or heavier I lose speed.
Just thanks....I have an old and ugly 17oz cue and buy a verry nice 3 piece cue..beutifull but I cant break as I do with my old one ..a d now understad why the new one is 20.5 oz..thanks 😁
You are more than welcome!
i must also say you don't have to smash the rack to get a good break. its like shooting a gun, its all shot placement
this ^ .. its more of a pop..
Yes, This is true as well.
i play with a 21.5 and break with an 18. it works for me
Awesome! Glad to hear it.
I have a 25 ounce break cue. I have downloaded the Predator break cue speed app this week. I was hitting my break at 8,9,10 mph. I changed my bridge to be on the rail. Then I tried snapping my wrist. The highest I got up to was 14 mph. The last day I was at 8 mph. Maybe I need to practice more? What do you think Chris?
Also, I have a hard time to keeping my cue down and not go up. I think I loose some speed when this happens.
Try putting your bridge hand on the table and breaking from the box with a closed bridge.
Ok. I am a big guy. I am 6'1" 220 lbs. I think I should be able to generate the power
@MikeWilson-fb6qv-mesa then simply reduce weight and you should be able to bring it up to max speed in time.
Best answer i got
?
Accuracy over power....
with accuracy comes power. ;)
for the most part, yes
Is this pertaining to me or the commenter?
I play and break whit 27 oz cue.
Hope its working for you.
@@CuemakersGuild
Absolutly. I have straight line, i dont need too hit hard and i use my normal stroke, whit a soft break. And make 3 too 4 balls.
Whit a rail break whit draw. Its perfect.
Just checked, the app is $4.99, not free.
It used to be free, but I'm sure it is worth 5 bucks to potentially help.
So i found the discussion on timing very interesting. I agree that the nomenclature 'timing' is impresice and leads to a lot of confusion.
I prefer to think of stroke mechanics in terms of speed and acceleration which works well with your lecture tonight.
But. The break technique seems to be so much different than the textbook shooting mechanic. This might be an extreme example, but think of SVB. His brake technique. He's choked up very high on the q. He actually rises up in his stroke but as he hits the ball everything is wrong with it. But he has one of the best breaks in the game.
I get what you were saying and for other players the example might fit really well like Cory Dual with his very controlled and structured break.
There are a lot of things going on there and well, I think the timing explanation works for a classic pool. Stroke mechanic doesn't always translate well to breaking
Thank you for your detailed insight on this. Very much appreciated!
I play and break with 19oz cues
The Predator break app is not free.
@@DennisGlenn-vw2zk yes sir, it is
It cost 5,99 CDN$@@CuemakersGuild
I prefer a small fee like 6$CDN against an app full of ads...
@@CuemakersGuild i paid $5.99 CAD
Can we see you break on video to see how you do it?
Absolutely!
Actually, you can view my break now by watching the video that I posted of me and Johnny Archer playing a couple of money matches.
Cool. I am not seeing it yet. It must still be uploading.
@@MikeWilson-fb6qv-mesa th-cam.com/video/RY_Faa7x4eU/w-d-xo.htmlsi=zyhylNYUtap8OOz-
It doesn’t look like you hitting the break that hard. You are getting 22 mph?
@MikeWilson-fb6qv-mesa yes sir, on average. It's sort of like golf, the best strokes more effortless. Plus good timing.
Force = Mass x Acceleration, Mass is simple, but defining acceleration you need to add the equation a = Δv/Δt where change in velocity over change in time.
went from a 18oz. cue and tried up to a 24oz cue and found that the 24oz. cue sent the cue about a 1 mph faster then the light cue? surprise, surprise on me.
Thank you for your comment, I'm glad this has helped.