Ive heard about another company that literally looses money on every single vehicle sold. What bothers me is that people invest and they are not even able to demonstrate that they have a viable business model.
Your basing this on 16 battery fires. The fact that GM recalled 140,000 cars just to make sure everyone was taken care of, is sort of a testament to GM (or at least Obama era car safety measures that automakers have to abide by)
I think the German rental car company that ordered 100 000 BYD cars was not NextMove but Sixt. Sixt is a market leader in Germany while NextMove is a relatively small startup.
@@michaelstarkey9745 Listen to what Sam says at 10:39. "This experience is *not directly comparable to the Bolt EV* or the Bolt themselves and, you know, some other recalls that have happened for say the Hyundai vehicles using these same batteries *because it's not leading to fires."*
As a Bolt 2018 owner, the fire risk was real. GM purchased the car back from us. We were happy with the buy back, but not happy with the battery defect. However, the battery issue wa snot the chemistry. It was a separator that keeps the anode and cathode apart. That was out of position owing to a manufacturing defect during production in the Osan Korea plant. To my knowledge, this has been corrected now, and this is why GM restarted manufacturing the BOLT in April 22. They wouldn't do this unless they were certain the problem was corrected. To my knowledge, LG Chem picke dup the #2B tab for the recall, as is typical in the auto industry. You screw up, you pay. Tesla also has had battery fires, buy seems to have corrected this issue as well.
And don't forget how GM partnered with Nikola to build the Badger. Anyone with two brain cells knew Nikola was a total scam, yet GM happily waltzed into a reputational catastrophe.
Uh no, Lordstown - just a lease deal and GM bought some shares; Nikola - non-binding memo of understanding for Badger pickup (everything else talked about was wiped out when GM vetted Nikola); LG Chem - partnership. You got 1 out of 3 correct. Out of those 3, ONLY LG Chem is an actual partner with GM. th-cam.com/channels/4Iw3CCQkhTW2eEZx_UB-WQ.html
@@bernardbarry447 I agree... if the Badger was anything other than vaporware then GM could have very well had a trendy hit. But when a guy like me, sitting in my kitchen, knew it was a complete scam and GM fell for it, it makes you question the fundamental competence of GM's management.
@@Wrath0141 If you want to be pedantic, then you are correct that GM and Nikola did not have a "partnership". My point is that even a cursory view of Nikola should have waved big red flags... and the Badger in particular was such and obvious scam that GM shouldn't have had their name anywhere near it. The fact that GM signed a MOU (much less promoted it) shows a serious lack of judgement.
Hi Sammy! As I do remember, it was - circa half a year ago since You have started to point out -- how good LFP batteries from BYD are, in comparison with turnery batteries. For my own sake, I hope You were right! As a result of Your opinions (based on Your knowledge) next week I am collecting my brand new Atto 3. That shows -- what I am thinking about Your opinions! I think? Thank You, and all the best with Your valuable channel Sammy. Adam from Adelaide. Bye.
No way! (I mean eventually, when EV range outstrips fuel products but as for now… I suppose it’s possible if it’d simplify logistics.) I’d say we need another 5-10years before an electric HiMRS.
I am confident GM cannot properly and efficiently manage a battery anyway. I hope LG stops or pivots because their black eye on the industry is infuriating.
I'm a US id4 owner. The 12 volt battery swap and software update is not a recall. It's the very first software update to go from software 2.1 to 3.1.0 VW been promising everyone since the inception of the car. It comes with a bunch of new features updating the 2021 models to have the same software as the 2022-23 models just like Tesla does. I guess maybe you could call the battery swap a quiet recall since it's not official. I've had zero issues with my 12 volt battery and I have a thousand watt amplifier with a 12-in subwoofer in my trunk demanding a lot more energy out of the electrical system.
GM should have responded to the battery fires by saying they where going 100% LFP and would only use similar battery chemistries which are proven to not have a fire issue. It would have been a huge confidence builder for consumer safety.
I have sat on the EV sidelines for a while but I just bought a 2019 Hyundai Kona Electric. The miles were a bit high so I got it cheap (relatively). I checked the service history and it has only done 8,000 km since having a new battery in the recall last year. It also has another 5 years on the battery warranty so it was worth a punt for the range. I could not afford a new BYD Atto 3, but they are now subject to a sales hold order and possible buyback after failing Australian design rules on child restraint anchor problems. It is stressful worrying whether to wait for newer models while watching inflation take away the current options.
Sam, you're absolutely right. I do really hope that my VW e-Up (produced in May 2021, picked up in June 2021) will be stable and makes fun for many years 🙈. A few months before my car was produced, there have been a recall for e-Up LG Chem Batteries...
When all is said and done, I suspect the issue will turn out to be more about the pouch form factor than any chemistry or manufacturing defect. In a well designed cylindrical cell or blade pack, thermal runaway in a single cell can happen without serious incident. With pouch cell based packs... not so much.
I thought LG was going to stop making NMC batteries and turn all their factories into producing LFP batteries? If they're making LFP, it should be fine. If GM is still using NMC batteries, all I can say prepare for things to get HOT.
I'm on my 3rd LG Chem House backup battery in the last 4 years. No fires, just stopped working. Fortunately covered under warranty. Solar company wanted to mount the battery in my garage. I said no. Outside only or no deal. Battery on fire outside of house is bad. Battery on fire inside of house is much, much worse!
@@davidbeppler3032 You've got to tell me what planet you are broadcasting from - really. GM closed today at $33.57 down from the January 3, 2022 high of $65.74 that's an implosion of 50% and you think the investors don't care about battery fires? I've got a timeshare in Orlando you really need to buy - call me...
Initially, the ID. 4's battery pack, which is comprised of 288 pouch cells in 12 modules, was produced by South Korea's LG Chem. But now, VW is using batteries supplied by SK Innovation, another South Korean company that recently opened a $2 billion factory nearby VW's plant there.Jul 26, 2022
@@davidbeppler3032 Not really, look at the Renault Zoe, it uses pouch cells, LG cells in fact, but there have only been a handful of fires from over 400,000 cars sold.
You do realized that SK had a huge legal battle with LG since they basically copied LGs technology. Any SK factory built in the US needs to pay LG royalties. The only reason that SK was able to actually build factories in the US is because Ford bet the entire company on them and put a LOT of pressure on the government and was willing to split the cost of royalties with SK basically ending up buying LG tech at higher prices. Both Ford and GM are now locked in. They can’t budge since all battery contacts are secured 5 years into the future. Mistakes they have done 3-5 years ago are going to hunt them for the next 5+ years - and that assumed they won’t have a multi billion $ recall that would basically kill the company.
It's a shame. The Bolt EUV is a great economical ev. I have it with the new battery pack and love it. Those who did get the recall got a new battery pack after 30,000 miles so they weren't too upset.
@@michelangelobuonarroti916 Low SOC will take a charge, this battery won’t. Dead out of the box. It’s kind of an insult you don’t think we know how to plug a battery in. Kind of a pathetic, stupid defense of a lame ass company.
2013 Volt with 130000 miles, wait another year or two. You'll find out. There's a nasty surprise from EV batteries called age. tl;dr: I have one low voltage cell and two out of spec in the third module that requires a new battery that's too expensive. The car went into Low Power Propulsion mode and would not restart after I shut it down. I had it towed to the dealer where they said I'd need a new battery but it's on galactic back order (they're likely discontinued) and if I could get it, it would cost around 10K to get it replaced (or 7500K for a refurb with an 18 month warranty from a local 3rd party). I got them to clear the error code and it works again but for how long? Anyway, I drive it until it has about 10 miles left on the battery and then place it into hold mode so hopefully the BMS doesn't throw the LPP message again by detecting low voltage on that bad cell. Maybe I can eke out some more miles on this thing before it screws the pooch. Hopefully this won't be a problem with Ultium batteries since the tech is spread across multiple models, the battery chemistry is upgradeable and perhaps the batteries will be cheaper and easier to service as a result (i.e. not requiring the replacement of the entire battery over a dead cell or two). I'm also hoping that future EVs know how to work around a dead or out spec cell so it doesn't disable the entire damn car and require a tow.
Im in cali and the battery bolt fires were all over the media! Didnt appear to be hidden to me! I have a 17 volt with lg chem batts and its been flawless for 6 years! I had the notorious becm failure a few years back due to bad chip boards from supplier. Isnt LG Chem helping GM to pay for parts of the recall? Maybe they are partners.
Tesla's sells all Lithium batteries in the US, no battery recall. The problem is they are prismatic batteries, not cylindricle like Tesla. It is not the Lithium, it is the form of the battery. You don't get this.
If a company is trying to discredit EVs in favor of ICEs, then bad batteries would be a good argument for customers to NOT buy EVs. Remember many legacy car companies want to sell ICEs because that is their bread and butter. Just saying ....
Getting your car worked on is a nail biter and when you are finally able to go to the dealer's mechanic to pick it up they are there waiting to sell you a new car. It reflects bad on the EV market and on Tesla, but as consumers start realizing that Tesla's don't have these issues it will help them. Thanks EV.
Add the battery recalls to the other recalls that GM & Ford has had, and the recall numbers are startling. GM is chasing its tail, or as a salesman once told me before his sales pitch "I'm throwing jello against the wall, and see what sticks". That very much seems to be GM's strategy as well They may have battery problems, but look at Buick's vehicle lineup, and then jump to the electric that Buick is developing that won't be ready until 2024. The car looks interesting, but I don't think they'll be selling a million of them either. Can GM really afford to try to turn one of its product lines into a boutique business? I think not. Beyond that, I'm not sure why GM would devote an entire brand name to one car, because the rest of the product line longevity sure seems sketchy. GM has developed a knack for finding the dog poop regardless of the direction they take, For those that may remember the videotape days, could this be another case of B Betamax vs VHS? The better of the two formats didn't win.
Boils down to the fact that the US refuses to deal with Chinese companies. Everybody knows that CATL and BYD produces the most robust and reliable EV batteries. Even Tesla uses BYD or CATL batteries.
Lfp are best for rental companies as they tolerate full charge/discharge. With lithium ion they really want you to keep in the 20-80% range for the most part you really can not use the full range 100% of the time like LFP(IRON) I bought my first LFP 12 v battery for my motorcycle 5 years ago. I told my friends it’s lithium Iron and they kept correcting me lithium ION. I was right. I just bought a lithium12 v ion starter battery for my Porsche, $700. It is lighter, longer warranty, lasts 3-5 times longer lead acid, charges in minutes vs hours, no explosive hydrogen gas like lead acid, no corrosion, mount in any position, higher CCA, full deep starting, no need trickle charger for storage as only loses 1% charge/MONTH VS 1%/DAY WITH LEAD acid,
When ID.4 production moved to Chattanooga, Tennessee the batteries were supplied by South Korean SK Innovation (Now SK ON). The SK batteries are being made in a plant in Georgia, USA
My thoughts exactly, LG is having issues but only for their factories that used the pouch cells made before the fix. New cars shouldn't be an issue, especially if they don't have pouch cells
Both Ford and GM are now locked in. GM with LG and Ford with SK (which is actually technology SK stole from LG and now SK and Ford need to pay royalties for). They can’t budge since all battery contacts are secured 5 years into the future. Mistakes they have done 3-5 years ago are going to hunt them for the next 5+ years - and that assumed they won’t have a multi billion $ recall that would basically kill the company it hits.
I gotta wonder if these manufacturers battery management systems are also a factor. Sure there are issues with the LG cells but would Tesla still have these problems with the same cells? Guess we will find out how LGs 4680s work with Tesla.
Scary for sure ===> I own a Tesla model 3 standard with LFP batteries. That makes me sleep better at night knowing my Tesla parked in my house won’t burn down.
Well interestingly enough GM just won a DOE grant to build a factory with EV battery manufacturer Microvast. This company has said they have never had a battery pack catch fire.
My sister has a Chrysler Pacifica PHEV that had a recall last February for fires and is going in for the “fix” next week. If that had been Tesla it would have been front page, the only way I heard about it was word of mouth.
The Ultium battery packs are NMCA chemistry which are NOT the same as previous Bolt (BEV2) batteries. You know, Tesla using the same NMCA in Chinese Model Y so....
Wait a year, then buy a Tesla Model Y. They will all have LFP batteries by then. Personally I bought a TM3LR with the NMC battery on purpose. 82kw of power and 300 mile range at 80%. I paid to keep children in the Congo fed. I did my part.
Let's try to get all the facts straight. The video states the the Hummer high-voltage battery was recalled. The batteries were NOT recalled. It was a battery connector, not the actual battery! It was regarding the possibility of the battery connector corroding and if it does, water could leak into the pack if going over high water. The connector issue appears to be a pack issue on GM's side, not LG Chem's side, since it has nothing to do with the cells.
To compensate for the battery problem, maybe a forked stick and a package of marshmallows should be added to the car so the customers can snack on roasted marshmallows while they for the firetrucks,
The hummer didn't have a recall viking. GM's Ultium batteries are going to be pretty good 70% less cobalt in them and much better charging cycles due to the new ncma battery chemistry. LG has also confirmed they are absolutely working on a new lfp battery and I bet it's out in the next year or two.
There was a recall, but it was for a high voltage cable connector, nothing to do with the batteries. But facts don't seem to mean a lot to Sam nowadays, this isn't the first video he's made where he got it completely wrong, then never admitted that fact or did a retraction.
@@ledsalesoz yeah but it actually wasn't a recall issued by the highway safety which is technically what a recall is the buyer could come in or not for the cable connector. He does realize Tesla buy tons of batteries from LG right
In re: the LG Chem Li-ion CAM supply agreement with GM signed in August, "GM says the cathode materials LG Chem will be supplying are NCMA (nickel, cobalt, manganese and aluminum) for Ultium Platform EVs... With the application of the aluminum, stability is increased while the amount of cobalt used is reduced by 70% from the previous generation of batteries, says GM." I also believe these are pouch cells, as opposed to the jelly rolls they typically used in the past. Time will tell how these hold up and perform. But the cells do seem different. GM is in the process of locating it's fourth LG Chem-partnered battery cell factory, likely in Indiana, with the other three being in Ohio, Tennessee, and Michigan.
Sets hope LG and their customers have been closely following their problems and have come to a working solution to their batteries. We can hope! It’ll lower the government’s rebates, bail-outs and loans.
VW "is dodgey"! I agree. Remember Diesel gate? As an ex Audi and current VW owner I will never buy another VW Group vehicle. My Tesla M3RWD arrives on the 26th here in Victoria BC. 🇨🇦
You mixed up rental companies there, @nextmovevideos might have reported these issues (they tend to do things like that..), but the company which ordered at Byd is Sixt.
Pouch cells are way more difficult to make than cylindrical cells. I'm really surprised that so many battery manufacturers choose complex designs over simpler ones. It's asking for trouble, and puts them at a competetive disadvantage. This is what happens when you don't get it exactly right.
Japanese batteries have always had better quality control and longevity than Chinese companies. South Korean ones like LG chem aren't on par with Japan either. Tesla was smart to partner with Panasonic in the beginning when they were making few cars and safety recalls would bankrupt them, only to diversify once they hit mass production scale and needed more batteries. It's not surprising that GM has once again made another big mistake on a long history of mistakes that lead them to bankruptcy. Unfortunately, now that both the US government and the CCP have a huge financial stake in GM, they will be too big to fail for decades to come.
As a total techno-yob I am left wondering why EVs are unable to have an 'operating system' that can be adjusted for different battery characteristics. Part of the risk of buying one of todays EV is that batteries are announced as being just around the corner. The same issue is a bigger problem for manufacturers, who will have todays models stranded because they are readily changed from rregular bateries to the new high test ones when they come along
This problem is beginning to circulate down to the average buyer and GM should be very concerned. I know folks who bought the volt a while back and like it but will not stay with GM for their next one because of these issues surfacing. We are moving too fast here people and there is going to be a lot of lemon cars for sale come 10 years for now. Cheers 🇨🇦
I bought a VW 40 years ago with electronics that were sourced from the lowest bidder and had nothing but problems. The dealer just made things worse. I will never buy a VW again. I currently drive a GM truck, the major parts are good and have been reliable but the cost-cutting on the peripherals is very annoying. Pay attention when driving, how many GM trucks do you see with one running light out? Although I like the dealer service I will never again buy GM. From now on if it ain't a Tesla I'm won't buy it.
recalls are covered by warrantee right? so whats the rub if they have to replace it besides the time being without. probably get a new battery that is better right?
I'm really confused why the EU and Korean car makers don't use LFP batteries and insist on using NMC batteries. It's not as if the management doesn't know the issues with NMC batteries. It's really puzzling. Why deal with all the problems of the NMC chemistry when you can just avoid it? Tesla's don't have problems because they control the batteries being made and they use active liquid cooling to manage heat. If you let one cell run away with heat, your whole battery is toast, literally.
I think a big reason is that the legacy auto EV's are heavy compared to Tesla and they can't take added weight that the LFP batteries are imparted with. I was wondering about the why too as it would be cheaper and easier to scale LFP batteries. Especially if your starting out making EV's for the the first time or second gen at it. The other idea I was coming up with is that legacy automakers and dealers don't want cars lasting 1,000,000+ miles on the expensive components, batteries and motors.
@@JeanPierreWhite Or as fast. Or charge as fast. They might last longer though. LFP last a long time. In 2050 I bet lots of people will still be driving their Tesla Model Ys from 2022 with the original LFP batteries!
![[#2024MAMA] ROSÉ (로제), Bruno Mars - APT. | Mnet 241122 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/dgGqD28J6aQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Brilliant leadership at GM has selected so many great partners like Nikola, Lordstown and LG Chem.
If GM is doing it the default is they are doing it completely wrong until proven otherwise.
It’s the same company that killed the EV1. All the players have changed, but it’s the same company.
Mary led!!!
You beat me to the Nikola point! 😁
I'd also add richly rewarded itself
LG’s problem is the more they make, the more they have to recall it’s a vicious cycle.
Quality humor prevails YEHEHE 🤓
Washing in mud leaves you muddy.
Vicious production problem
Ive heard about another company that literally looses money on every single vehicle sold. What bothers me is that people invest and they are not even able to demonstrate that they have a viable business model.
Your basing this on 16 battery fires. The fact that GM recalled 140,000 cars just to make sure everyone was taken care of, is sort of a testament to GM (or at least Obama era car safety measures that automakers have to abide by)
I think the German rental car company that ordered 100 000 BYD cars was not NextMove but Sixt. Sixt is a market leader in Germany while NextMove is a relatively small startup.
Used Sixt when we visited Slovenia.
This Joker should get his news straight, you are absolutely right it is Sixt!
I'm VERY confident that the future of GM is pitch dark.
Not while th fire is blazin
Don’t they have a car called a Blazer?
@@michaelstarkey9745 Listen to what Sam says at 10:39. "This experience is *not directly comparable to the Bolt EV* or the Bolt themselves and, you know, some other recalls that have happened for say the Hyundai vehicles using these same batteries *because it's not leading to fires."*
They need another Obama to waste billions of taxpayer money to bail them out.
The government is the last to go out of business. Government Motors will never go down. It is just like ATT.
As a Bolt 2018 owner, the fire risk was real. GM purchased the car back from us. We were happy with the buy back, but not happy with the battery defect. However, the battery issue wa snot the chemistry. It was a separator that keeps the anode and cathode apart. That was out of position owing to a manufacturing defect during production in the Osan Korea plant. To my knowledge, this has been corrected now, and this is why GM restarted manufacturing the BOLT in April 22. They wouldn't do this unless they were certain the problem was corrected. To my knowledge, LG Chem picke dup the #2B tab for the recall, as is typical in the auto industry. You screw up, you pay. Tesla also has had battery fires, buy seems to have corrected this issue as well.
Thanks for the summary. Eagarly awaiting solid ev performance to haul around xc mtb
And don't forget how GM partnered with Nikola to build the Badger. Anyone with two brain cells knew Nikola was a total scam, yet GM happily waltzed into a reputational catastrophe.
Cause uncle San will come to the rescue
Besides the reputational damage, which most casual observers don’t care about, the contract was a win win for GM. Just some time wasted.
Uh no, Lordstown - just a lease deal and GM bought some shares; Nikola - non-binding memo of understanding for Badger pickup (everything else talked about was wiped out when GM vetted Nikola); LG Chem - partnership. You got 1 out of 3 correct. Out of those 3, ONLY LG Chem is an actual partner with GM. th-cam.com/channels/4Iw3CCQkhTW2eEZx_UB-WQ.html
@@bernardbarry447 I agree... if the Badger was anything other than vaporware then GM could have very well had a trendy hit. But when a guy like me, sitting in my kitchen, knew it was a complete scam and GM fell for it, it makes you question the fundamental competence of GM's management.
@@Wrath0141 If you want to be pedantic, then you are correct that GM and Nikola did not have a "partnership". My point is that even a cursory view of Nikola should have waved big red flags... and the Badger in particular was such and obvious scam that GM shouldn't have had their name anywhere near it. The fact that GM signed a MOU (much less promoted it) shows a serious lack of judgement.
Hi Sammy! As I do remember, it was - circa half a year ago since You have started to point out -- how good LFP batteries from BYD are, in comparison with turnery batteries. For my own sake, I hope You were right! As a result of Your opinions (based on Your knowledge) next week I am collecting my brand new Atto 3. That shows -- what I am thinking about Your opinions! I think? Thank You, and all the best with Your valuable channel Sammy. Adam from Adelaide. Bye.
And recently the US military annnounced a partnership with GM for using their Ultium batteries in military vehicles. What could go wrong?
o god plz tell me your jokeing right ?
They should use the battery as the power source and warhead!
Well if those military vehicles have a battle front life expectancy of 10 minutes (like a tank) then they should be ok.
No way! (I mean eventually, when EV range outstrips fuel products but as for now… I suppose it’s possible if it’d simplify logistics.) I’d say we need another 5-10years before an electric HiMRS.
Sadly it’s true and I can’t believe that they would do something so foolish. Once again the moniker “Government Motors” is dead right.
I am confident GM cannot properly and efficiently manage a battery anyway. I hope LG stops or pivots because their black eye on the industry is infuriating.
…………as a LG fuel cell
Fuel cells are useless without hydrogen. That’s useless until nuclear is regulated to make hydrogen.
@@michaelstarkey9745 I would trust LG even less with fuel cells. LG batteries burst into flames, but LG fuel cells will explode and level homes.
I'm a US id4 owner. The 12 volt battery swap and software update is not a recall. It's the very first software update to go from software 2.1 to 3.1.0 VW been promising everyone since the inception of the car. It comes with a bunch of new features updating the 2021 models to have the same software as the 2022-23 models just like Tesla does. I guess maybe you could call the battery swap a quiet recall since it's not official. I've had zero issues with my 12 volt battery and I have a thousand watt amplifier with a 12-in subwoofer in my trunk demanding a lot more energy out of the electrical system.
In LG's defense, they produced high-quality 18650 units for years. Hopefully any car battery issues are sorted ASAP.
Amazing how a TH-camr is smarter than those executives who make millions 😮
Goodbye GM!
GM should have responded to the battery fires by saying they where going 100% LFP and would only use similar battery chemistries which are proven to not have a fire issue. It would have been a huge confidence builder for consumer safety.
Mr. Evans we need a deep dive on LG Chem, probably deeper than this one
I have sat on the EV sidelines for a while but I just bought a 2019 Hyundai Kona Electric.
The miles were a bit high so I got it cheap (relatively).
I checked the service history and it has only done 8,000 km since having a new battery in the recall last year.
It also has another 5 years on the battery warranty so it was worth a punt for the range.
I could not afford a new BYD Atto 3, but they are now subject to a sales hold order and possible buyback after failing Australian design rules on child restraint anchor problems.
It is stressful worrying whether to wait for newer models while watching inflation take away the current options.
Sam, you're absolutely right. I do really hope that my VW e-Up (produced in May 2021, picked up in June 2021) will be stable and makes fun for many years 🙈. A few months before my car was produced, there have been a recall for e-Up LG Chem Batteries...
When all is said and done, I suspect the issue will turn out to be more about the pouch form factor than any chemistry or manufacturing defect. In a well designed cylindrical cell or blade pack, thermal runaway in a single cell can happen without serious incident. With pouch cell based packs... not so much.
The Hummer EV RECALL is due to a Battery Connector corrosion issue NOT the battery.
You left out a word. "Yet."
@@davidbeppler3032 So why dors Tesla use LG batteries for Model 3 LR?
@@abraxastulammo9940 Because LG is building 2170 batteries for the M3LR.
I thought LG was going to stop making NMC batteries and turn all their factories into producing LFP batteries? If they're making LFP, it should be fine. If GM is still using NMC batteries, all I can say prepare for things to get HOT.
@Steve D VW will use Manganese rich chemistry for their unified battery cells.
I'm on my 3rd LG Chem House backup battery in the last 4 years. No fires, just stopped working. Fortunately covered under warranty. Solar company wanted to mount the battery in my garage. I said no. Outside only or no deal. Battery on fire outside of house is bad. Battery on fire inside of house is much, much worse!
GM is it's own worst enemy.
Ah, give Mary Barra more credit - she's GM's worst enemy.
@@FrunkensteinVonZipperneck you're right she did it
Always has been
GM stock is doing fine. I guess the investors do not care about battery fires.
@@davidbeppler3032 You've got to tell me what planet you are broadcasting from - really.
GM closed today at $33.57 down from the January 3, 2022 high of $65.74
that's an implosion of 50% and you think the investors don't care about battery fires?
I've got a timeshare in Orlando you really need to buy - call me...
Initially, the ID. 4's battery pack, which is comprised of 288 pouch cells in 12 modules, was produced by South Korea's LG Chem. But now, VW is using batteries supplied by SK Innovation, another South Korean company that recently opened a $2 billion factory nearby VW's plant there.Jul 26, 2022
Pouch cells are the problem.
@@davidbeppler3032 why?
@@davidbeppler3032 Not really, look at the Renault Zoe, it uses pouch cells, LG cells in fact, but there have only been a handful of fires from over 400,000 cars sold.
You do realized that SK had a huge legal battle with LG since they basically copied LGs technology. Any SK factory built in the US needs to pay LG royalties. The only reason that SK was able to actually build factories in the US is because Ford bet the entire company on them and put a LOT of pressure on the government and was willing to split the cost of royalties with SK basically ending up buying LG tech at higher prices.
Both Ford and GM are now locked in. They can’t budge since all battery contacts are secured 5 years into the future. Mistakes they have done 3-5 years ago are going to hunt them for the next 5+ years - and that assumed they won’t have a multi billion $ recall that would basically kill the company.
@@erikwilson9498 Design flaw. You can read the research papers. Pouch batteries do not like vibrations. Cars vibrate a lot.
It's a shame. The Bolt EUV is a great economical ev. I have it with the new battery pack and love it. Those who did get the recall got a new battery pack after 30,000 miles so they weren't too upset.
My wife ended up with an LG chem battery for her ebike, yup, dead out of the box.
Probably shipped at low SOC for safety.
@@michelangelobuonarroti916 There is a big difference Michelangelo between “dead out of the box“ and a low state of charge! (SOC)
@@michelangelobuonarroti916 Low SOC will take a charge, this battery won’t. Dead out of the box. It’s kind of an insult you don’t think we know how to plug a battery in. Kind of a pathetic, stupid defense of a lame ass company.
2015 Volt with 140000 miles , no issues so far . I’d purchase another Chevy EV based on my experience .
Great news
2013 Volt with 130000 miles, wait another year or two. You'll find out. There's a nasty surprise from EV batteries called age. tl;dr: I have one low voltage cell and two out of spec in the third module that requires a new battery that's too expensive. The car went into Low Power Propulsion mode and would not restart after I shut it down. I had it towed to the dealer where they said I'd need a new battery but it's on galactic back order (they're likely discontinued) and if I could get it, it would cost around 10K to get it replaced (or 7500K for a refurb with an 18 month warranty from a local 3rd party). I got them to clear the error code and it works again but for how long? Anyway, I drive it until it has about 10 miles left on the battery and then place it into hold mode so hopefully the BMS doesn't throw the LPP message again by detecting low voltage on that bad cell. Maybe I can eke out some more miles on this thing before it screws the pooch. Hopefully this won't be a problem with Ultium batteries since the tech is spread across multiple models, the battery chemistry is upgradeable and perhaps the batteries will be cheaper and easier to service as a result (i.e. not requiring the replacement of the entire battery over a dead cell or two). I'm also hoping that future EVs know how to work around a dead or out spec cell so it doesn't disable the entire damn car and require a tow.
You noticed what I noticed. GM would say “our battery technology “, “ our software” and so on…
Im in cali and the battery bolt fires were all over the media! Didnt appear to be hidden to me! I have a 17 volt with lg chem batts and its been flawless for 6 years! I had the notorious becm failure a few years back due to bad chip boards from supplier. Isnt LG Chem helping GM to pay for parts of the recall? Maybe they are partners.
I like this format better, with just you presenting, without the intro visuals. 🙂
Tesla's sells all Lithium batteries in the US, no battery recall. The problem is they are prismatic batteries, not cylindricle like Tesla. It is not the Lithium, it is the form of the battery.
You don't get this.
If a company is trying to discredit EVs in favor of ICEs, then bad batteries would be a good argument for customers to NOT buy EVs. Remember many legacy car companies want to sell ICEs because that is their bread and butter. Just saying ....
It's pretty simple GM spends tanker loads of cash in advertising with the media so they are happy to not mention it.
The first VW rolled off the line last Friday in usa
You should also give case study on Mahindera Born Electric subsidery
The Hummer recall is for the battery connector, which is NOT the battery itself.
Getting your car worked on is a nail biter and when you are finally able to go to the dealer's mechanic to pick it up they are there waiting to sell you a new car. It reflects bad on the EV market and on Tesla, but as consumers start realizing that Tesla's don't have these issues it will help them. Thanks EV.
Bolt started the same way. Difficult to replace a module vs whole battery pack
If you missed it Honda and LG are making a battery plant in Fayette county Ohio.
Add the battery recalls to the other recalls that GM & Ford has had, and the recall numbers are startling. GM is chasing its tail, or as a salesman once told me before his sales pitch "I'm throwing jello against the wall, and see what sticks". That very much seems to be GM's strategy as well They may have battery problems, but look at Buick's vehicle lineup, and then jump to the electric that Buick is developing that won't be ready until 2024. The car looks interesting, but I don't think they'll be selling a million of them either. Can GM really afford to try to turn one of its product lines into a boutique business? I think not. Beyond that, I'm not sure why GM would devote an entire brand name to one car, because the rest of the product line longevity sure seems sketchy. GM has developed a knack for finding the dog poop regardless of the direction they take, For those that may remember the videotape days, could this be another case of B Betamax vs VHS? The better of the two formats didn't win.
Boils down to the fact that the US refuses to deal with Chinese companies. Everybody knows that CATL and BYD produces the most robust and reliable EV batteries. Even Tesla uses BYD or CATL batteries.
Totally agree with your comments. Based on the way GM and VW are doing business, they are doomed.
Lfp are best for rental companies as they tolerate full charge/discharge. With lithium ion they really want you to keep in the 20-80% range for the most part you really can not use the full range 100% of the time like LFP(IRON) I bought my first LFP 12 v battery for my motorcycle 5 years ago. I told my friends it’s lithium Iron and they kept correcting me lithium ION. I was right. I just bought a lithium12 v ion starter battery for my Porsche, $700. It is lighter, longer warranty, lasts 3-5 times longer lead acid, charges in minutes vs hours, no explosive hydrogen gas like lead acid, no corrosion, mount in any position, higher CCA, full deep starting, no need trickle charger for storage as only loses 1% charge/MONTH VS 1%/DAY WITH LEAD acid,
Love the art behind you!
When ID.4 production moved to Chattanooga, Tennessee the batteries were supplied by South Korean SK Innovation (Now SK ON). The SK batteries are being made in a plant in Georgia, USA
Tesla has signed up for any batteries that LG can provide also.
My thoughts exactly, LG is having issues but only for their factories that used the pouch cells made before the fix. New cars shouldn't be an issue, especially if they don't have pouch cells
Both Ford and GM are now locked in. GM with LG and Ford with SK (which is actually technology SK stole from LG and now SK and Ford need to pay royalties for). They can’t budge since all battery contacts are secured 5 years into the future. Mistakes they have done 3-5 years ago are going to hunt them for the next 5+ years - and that assumed they won’t have a multi billion $ recall that would basically kill the company it hits.
LG Chem makes the batteries that set Samsung phones on fire too.
Clearly it is not an LG problem. It is a Samsung, GM, VW, Hyundai problem.
You mean Chinese battery Note7?
Honda also signed a deal with LG Chem for a new joint battery plant along with GM in Ohio
Water damaged Teslas from hurricane Ian are also having serious fire issues and a threat to houses, etc. Nothing but BYD for me.
I gotta wonder if these manufacturers battery management systems are also a factor. Sure there are issues with the LG cells but would Tesla still have these problems with the same cells? Guess we will find out how LGs 4680s work with Tesla.
They don't have any problems with the LG 2170 cells
Scary for sure ===> I own a Tesla model 3 standard with LFP batteries. That makes me sleep better at night knowing my Tesla parked in my house won’t burn down.
Another nail in GM's coffin! Good one Sam!!
Barra is leading GM to total annihilation😂.
The dam LG phone 📱 burned my leg a few years ago by battery failure 🔋 🔥, just think how bad the car battery will be
Great video! Thanks for pointing us out
do you think it will make any difference if the car gets a 200 mile + range and costs $30KUSD?
Not if it burns down your $200k house.
I hope LG and GM both succeed and do well, but I wouldn't bet on it. Looking at my stock portfolio, I am and have been betting on Tesla.
Well interestingly enough GM just won a DOE grant to build a factory with EV battery manufacturer Microvast. This company has said they have never had a battery pack catch fire.
Microvast separator will solve this issue, their battery cells are in porsche mission r project.
My sister has a Chrysler Pacifica PHEV that had a recall last February for fires and is going in for the “fix” next week. If that had been Tesla it would have been front page, the only way I heard about it was word of mouth.
The Ultium battery packs are NMCA chemistry which are NOT the same as previous Bolt (BEV2) batteries. You know, Tesla using the same NMCA in Chinese Model Y so....
How will I know if EV has LFP...I don't even think dealerships knows they just to sell EV as quick as possible.
Wait a year, then buy a Tesla Model Y. They will all have LFP batteries by then. Personally I bought a TM3LR with the NMC battery on purpose. 82kw of power and 300 mile range at 80%. I paid to keep children in the Congo fed. I did my part.
I just Google it
My LG vacuum works flawlessly 😊
They’re different companies under the same conglomerate
Exactly what I was thinking. The porche's fires were also with LG batteries
And there were fires with LFP batteries, too. 😱
Let's try to get all the facts straight. The video states the the Hummer high-voltage battery was recalled. The batteries were NOT recalled. It was a battery connector, not the actual battery! It was regarding the possibility of the battery connector corroding and if it does, water could leak into the pack if going over high water. The connector issue appears to be a pack issue on GM's side, not LG Chem's side, since it has nothing to do with the cells.
Tesla is also using LG bateries on Models 3 and Y Performance made in China but I'm not sure if they are 2170 cylindrical or prismatic shaped.
To compensate for the battery problem, maybe a forked stick and a package of marshmallows should be added to the car so the customers can snack on roasted marshmallows while they for the firetrucks,
Great video...I agree... Media is keeping hush about this! If it was Tesla.. 💥💥💥💥
The hummer didn't have a recall viking. GM's Ultium batteries are going to be pretty good 70% less cobalt in them and much better charging cycles due to the new ncma battery chemistry. LG has also confirmed they are absolutely working on a new lfp battery and I bet it's out in the next year or two.
There was a recall, but it was for a high voltage cable connector, nothing to do with the batteries. But facts don't seem to mean a lot to Sam nowadays, this isn't the first video he's made where he got it completely wrong, then never admitted that fact or did a retraction.
@@ledsalesoz yeah but it actually wasn't a recall issued by the highway safety which is technically what a recall is the buyer could come in or not for the cable connector. He does realize Tesla buy tons of batteries from LG right
In re: the LG Chem Li-ion CAM supply agreement with GM signed in August, "GM says the cathode materials LG Chem will be supplying are NCMA (nickel, cobalt, manganese and aluminum) for Ultium Platform EVs... With the application of the aluminum, stability is increased while the amount of cobalt used is reduced by 70% from the previous generation of batteries, says GM." I also believe these are pouch cells, as opposed to the jelly rolls they typically used in the past. Time will tell how these hold up and perform. But the cells do seem different. GM is in the process of locating it's fourth LG Chem-partnered battery cell factory, likely in Indiana, with the other three being in Ohio, Tennessee, and Michigan.
I went thru recall hell with Hyundai
So what are the car companies that use Lithium-Iron-Phosphate batteries? In the US specifically.
Oh shit my Model Y LR has an LG battery…..i have never heard of Tesla recalls because of LG batteries
Save the LG Chem batteries for the solar packs you bolt to the side of your house to work with solar panels.
Sets hope LG and their customers have been closely following their problems and have come to a working solution to their batteries. We can hope! It’ll lower the government’s rebates, bail-outs and loans.
It's rather a problem with pouch cells, LG makes cells for Tesla too, and those cylindrical cells are fine.
VW "is dodgey"! I agree. Remember Diesel gate? As an ex Audi and current VW owner I will never buy another VW Group vehicle. My Tesla M3RWD arrives on the 26th here in Victoria BC. 🇨🇦
You mixed up rental companies there, @nextmovevideos might have reported these issues (they tend to do things like that..), but the company which ordered at Byd is Sixt.
Isn't LG Chem a manufacturer for Tesla? What brand of batteries are in M3, M3LR and M3P?
Shanghai and Berlin built long range and performance use LG Chem cylindrical 2170 cells
GMs problem is that its ran by MBA bean counters
Their only concern is to try to put out more cars than Tesla
"Classic GM" FAILURE(s) 😂
Great Mary you lead and it maters!😂GM sad to see how desperate they are to jump in electric car making
It's more like Biden has forced them to go EV
Pouch cells are way more difficult to make than cylindrical cells. I'm really surprised that so many battery manufacturers choose complex designs over simpler ones. It's asking for trouble, and puts them at a competetive disadvantage. This is what happens when you don't get it exactly right.
Japanese batteries have always had better quality control and longevity than Chinese companies. South Korean ones like LG chem aren't on par with Japan either. Tesla was smart to partner with Panasonic in the beginning when they were making few cars and safety recalls would bankrupt them, only to diversify once they hit mass production scale and needed more batteries. It's not surprising that GM has once again made another big mistake on a long history of mistakes that lead them to bankruptcy. Unfortunately, now that both the US government and the CCP have a huge financial stake in GM, they will be too big to fail for decades to come.
As a total techno-yob I am left wondering why EVs are unable to have an 'operating system' that can be adjusted for different battery characteristics. Part of the risk of buying one of todays EV is that batteries are announced as being just around the corner. The same issue is a bigger problem for manufacturers, who will have todays models stranded because they are readily changed from rregular bateries to the new high test ones when they come along
An investment in both Lordstown Motors and Nikola Motors confirms that GM does no due diligence when making investments.
The upside: As an owner of '17 & '18 Bolts, we got basically new cars with the replacement batteries - and a renewed warranty....
I bought a Bolt EV. I also bought USAA insurance too.
This problem is beginning to circulate down to the average buyer and GM should be very concerned. I know folks who bought the volt a while back and like it but will not stay with GM for their next one because of these issues surfacing. We are moving too fast here people and there is going to be a lot of lemon cars for sale come 10 years for now.
Cheers 🇨🇦
Do you think that GM's investment may be part of a change to LiFePo4 batteries ?
LFP, BYD, CATL, Panasonic.... LG disaster.....
Maybe Volkswagen can replace all the bad battery packs with Diesel engines that don’t need urea but still achieve emission targets?
LOL
100k is near. Get to the plaque!!
I bought a VW 40 years ago with electronics that were sourced from the lowest bidder and had nothing but problems. The dealer just made things worse. I will never buy a VW again. I currently drive a GM truck, the major parts are good and have been reliable but the cost-cutting on the peripherals is very annoying. Pay attention when driving, how many GM trucks do you see with one running light out? Although I like the dealer service I will never again buy GM.
From now on if it ain't a Tesla I'm won't buy it.
recalls are covered by warrantee right? so whats the rub if they have to replace it besides the time being without. probably get a new battery that is better right?
This also affects Stellantis which produces Chrysler Minivans such as the Hybrid Pacifica 2017-2023.
I just bought a Chevy. Gas powered 2500. Nice truck
Hope it wasn't new. New gas vehicles are going to depreciate fast as EVs grow.
@@michelangelobuonarroti916 yeah. It will be a while before tow capacity is up to par. But I may be wrong. Yet to be seen in action.
I’m not confident in those batteries.
I'm really confused why the EU and Korean car makers don't use LFP batteries and insist on using NMC batteries. It's not as if the management doesn't know the issues with NMC batteries. It's really puzzling. Why deal with all the problems of the NMC chemistry when you can just avoid it?
Tesla's don't have problems because they control the batteries being made and they use active liquid cooling to manage heat. If you let one cell run away with heat, your whole battery is toast, literally.
I think a big reason is that the legacy auto EV's are heavy compared to Tesla and they can't take added weight that the LFP batteries are imparted with. I was wondering about the why too as it would be cheaper and easier to scale LFP batteries. Especially if your starting out making EV's for the the first time or second gen at it.
The other idea I was coming up with is that legacy automakers and dealers don't want cars lasting 1,000,000+ miles on the expensive components, batteries and motors.
I love my TM3LR with NMC!
@@JeanPierreWhite Or as fast. Or charge as fast. They might last longer though. LFP last a long time. In 2050 I bet lots of people will still be driving their Tesla Model Ys from 2022 with the original LFP batteries!
BYD aren’t in England yet I’m looking at MG 4 do these have a good battery?
Thanks for this info. Was thinking of pre-ordering Blazer EV but looks like GM needs to sort things out still.
Microvast separator will solve these issues.