Jehovah’s Witnesses (JW’s) deviate from biblical Christianity in several areas. First, like all the cults, they deny the Trinity. They believe there is one God, Jehovah, and that Jesus is actually Michael the Archangel, the first of God’s creation, who became flesh at the incarnation. After the resurrection, He returned to heaven as Michael the Archangel. 1 Witnesses further say that the Holy Spirit is not God, but rather an active force much like electricity or fire. Second, JW’s deny the bodily resurrection of Christ, but instead believe He was raised as a spirit and manifested Himself several times in different materialized bodies. Third, they deny the existence of hell and eternal punishment, but believe in total annihilation after death. Only the elite ruling class, the 144,000, are allowed to go to heaven. The faithful JW’s remain unconscious after death till they are resurrected in the Millennium. Those who are not in the organization are annihilated after death. Fourth, JW’s have a works-oriented salvation. Salvation is not based upon a relationship with Christ, but found in the organization. One must serve the society, and depending on one’s faithfulness and absolute obedience, one may be saved. Fifth, they believe that Jesus returned invisibly in 1914 and established His throne in heaven. At Armageddon, God will destroy all evil, and abolish all the world’s governments, and establish a new Paradise on earth. Then the living and resurrected JW’s will inherit Paradise earth. The 144,000 mentioned earlier will rule with Jesus. At this time all unbelievers who have died will be raised (with some exceptions) and will study under the JW’s during the Millennium, a period of a thousand years. Studying with them will be the unbelievers who have survived Armageddon. After the thousand years, their faith will be tested because God will release Satan from the abyss. At that point all unbelievers will have to choose between Satan or Jehovah. Those who reject Jehovah will be annihilated. Clearly the doctrines of the Jehovah’s Witnesses deviate in critical ways from sound biblical principles. False Prophecies of the Watch Tower The April 1, 1972, Watch Tower article on page 197, states clearly that JW’s are true prophets of God. However, Deuteronomy 18:20-22 says that a true prophet speaks in the name of God and predicts future things which come to pass. A false prophet speaks in the name of God, but predicts future things which do not come to pass. Also, in the 1889 issue of the Watchtower, “The Time is at Hand,” page 101 states, “The battle of the great day of God Almighty (Rev. 16:14), which will end in A.D. 1914, with the complete overthrow of earth’s present rulership, is already commenced.” This 1914 prediction of Christ’s return of course never came true, resulting in false prophecy number one. Then the Watch Tower predicted that Christ would return in 1925. The 1918 issue of, “Millions Now Living Will Never Die,” p. 89 states, “Therefore we may confidently expect that 1925 will mark the return of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and the faithful prophets of old, particularly those named by the apostle in Hebrews 11 to the condition of human perfection.” This proved to be another false prophecy. The Watch Tower then made a third prophecy of the return of Christ, which was to occur in 1975. The August 15, 1968, issue of, Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975?, p. 494, predicted the return of Christ in 1975. Once again the JW’s were shown to be false prophets. Another interesting prophecy is found on page 154 of their book, "You Can Live Forever in Paradise on Earth". Here they state, “Some of the generation living in 1914 will see the end of the system of things and survive it.” However, all of the 1914 generation are now dead, resulting in yet another false prophecy. The Name of God Another effective avenue of witnessing to the Witnesses is in the name of God. JW’s state that God’s true name is “Jehovah.” They say the term “God,” is merely a title, and that the real name for God is “Jehovah.” In fact they go so far as to say that unless one calls on the true name of God, “Jehovah,” one cannot be saved. The name of God in the Old Testament spelled YHWH, was considered holy, and was not to be read aloud. Instead, when the Hebrews came upon YHWH, they would say ADONAY, which means “Lord.” In order to indicate this substitution, the Masoretes placed the vowels of ADONAY or the English equivalent of e, o, and a underneath the consonants of YHWH. Later some Christian translators mistakenly combined the vowels of ADONAY with the consonants of YHWH producing the word “Jehovah.” Now the term is recognized to be a late hybrid form never used by the Jews. That’s the origin of the word “Jehovah.” Let’s now look at what other scholars say about the name “Jehovah.” Webster’s Collegiate Dictionary: “Jehovah” -- False reading of the Hebrew YAHWEH.8 Encyclopedia Americana: “Jehovah” -- erroneous form of the name of the God of Israel.9 Encyclopedia Britannica: The Masoretes who from the 6th to the 10th century worked to reproduce the original text of the The Jewish Encyclopedia: “Jehovah” -- a mispronunciation of the Hebrew YHWH the name of God. This pronunciation is grammatically impossible. Therefore, for JW’s to insist Jehovah is the true name of God and that one is saved only if he calls on that name, is an error. When Witnesses appear at your door explain to them the name “Jehovah” and read what the scholars say about Jehovah. Also remember, God uses many names for Himself such as, King of Kings, the Lion of Judah, the Alpha and the Omega, and others. When JWs realize what the authoritative sources have to say, especially the encyclopedia references, they will begin to realize the need to take a serious look at this error in the organization. The Bodily Resurrection of Christ A third subject area for effective witnessing to Witnesses is the bodily resurrection of Christ. JW’s believe that Christ’s crucified body was disintegrated by Jehovah never to exist again. Accordingly, Jesus was raised as a spirit who then materialized and appeared in several different fleshly bodies as the angels had done. Indeed, it was in this form that He appeared to His disciples; i.e., He wasn’t in a human body; He just appeared to be human. He ascended into heaven as a spirit and once again became Michael the Archangel.13 This doctrine can be easily disproved. First, in Luke 24:36-43, Jesus clearly states in verse 39 that He is not a spirit but a man of flesh and bone. He even ate food to prove that He was not a spirit but had a physical body. In John 20:24-27, Jesus shows Thomas His wounds. Jesus is clearly demonstrating to His disciples that the body previously on the cross had been resurrected. If Jesus had a different body than the one on the cross, He would have been deliberately deceiving the disciples. Ask the Witness, “Would Jesus deliberately deceive His disciples into believing something that was not true?” Next, turn to some passages where Jesus predicts the resurrection of His body. In John 2:19-21Jesus says, “Destroy this temple and in three days I will raise it up.” See Acts 2:26-27, another prophecy of the Messiah’s bodily resurrection. Clearly the prophecies and Jesus’ appearances prove a bodily resurrection. JW’s cite 1 Peter 3:18 and 1 Cor. 15:44-50 to back up their belief. In 1 Peter 3:18 we read, “Christ died once and for all... he being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the spirit.” This verse does not prove Jesus is a spirit. This verse says that Jesus was raised in the Spirit and by the Spirit of God who gives life. Romans 8:11 states that the Holy Spirit was involved in raising Jesus from the dead. Jesus was not raised as a spirit but by the power of the Holy Spirit. According to 1 Cor. 15:50, “flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.” Since Jesus is in heaven, JW’s say He must be a spirit.14 They are correct in saying that the earthly body cannot enter heaven. However, when Jesus rose, He had a glorified body (Luke 24:39). Therefore, He can dwell in heaven because of His glorified state. According to 1 Cor 15:39, “All flesh is not the same: Men have one kind of flesh, animals have another.... There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies.” Christ’s glorified body allows Him to travel in the earthly and heavenly dimensions. Some verses indicate that Christ exists in heaven in bodily form. “For in him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form” Colossians 2:9. The verb “dwells” in the Greek is katoikei, and is in the present tense. In other words, Jesus has a glorified body in heaven, the one that was resurrected. Note also 1 Timothy 2:5, “There is one God and one mediator, the man Christ Jesus.” The verb “is,” is a present tense verb also. How can Jesus be a man if He is Michael the Archangel? Seeing these errors may prompt them to seek the truth. Jehovah’s Witnesses Exposed | Run Away From this Cult: th-cam.com/video/RaaJdhAVWyw/w-d-xo.html 7 Facts that Prove the Jehovah’s Witnesses are a False Religion: th-cam.com/video/4x0sL2Dum5I/w-d-xo.html Top 10 Shocking Beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses: th-cam.com/video/mXdhB9kxwnA/w-d-xo.html 15 Questions for Jehovah’s Witnesses on False Predictions: th-cam.com/video/33MecN27BUY/w-d-xo.html Dr. David Reagan on The Jehovah's Witnesses, False Prophecy Gone to Seed: christinprophecy.org/articles/the-jehovahs-witnesses/ Dr. David Reagan on the Deception of the Cults: christinprophecy.org/articles/the-deception-of-the-cults/ Dr. Ron Rhodes on an Overview of Cults: th-cam.com/video/Ji2U3CWvsWU/w-d-xo.html
@@burningwateryt8704 naw if they are that stupid let them . its hard for me to say that but it is very obvious that this is non-biblical not rational... And not right.
I'm neither disassociated or disfellowshipped and all of my family and friends have shunned me because I openly said I no longer believe in it, despite pioneering for years. The biggest slap in the face I ever heard was that I was turning my back on everyone. They have brain washed people into thinking that those who are shunned rejected them, not the other way around. It makes my blood boil
*I'm sorry to hear about your situation. I sympathize with you as I also experience the same. But no worries my dear friend give it time and pray that God loosens the shackles around their mind so they too can break free and truly start living. So they too can start to experience the freedom you and I have come to cherish and appreciate. A freedom that can never be found in a cult like the Jehovah's Witness religion. The leaders will get theirs once they take their last breath unless they repent. God bless you my dear friend.*
Yes, you put it correctly. I remember when I was shunned my sister even said to me "why did you do this to me?" "What have I done to deserve this?" can you imagine?
Do not feel bad, the worst people I met were witnesses. By the way, there was no so called jesus, it is SEUZ of greek mythology taken from the Egyptians. The so called bible is the BYBLOS of Egypt which means body of fire, everything has to do with the SUN, in astrology and astrotheology...please check out exjw Santos Bonacci...
And the court was saying that, in the case of a person who has been a victim of the congregation and who is unable to continue associating with it because of their vicitmization, the response of the doctrine and leadership is profoundly cruel. The idea that, by removing themselves from a dangerous situation, a person is shunning bible beliefs, laws and principles, is Orwellian doublespeak: they are doing no such thing, and I'm sure almost none of them would claim this. The very notion that a victim is a bad associate who spoils useful habits is shocking in its cruelty and blatant Machiavellianism.
@@isaacgalvez1309 please read my comment above. My situation had nothing to do with me being 'sinful' and yet they disfellowshipped me for wanting to take a break! This organisation ruined my life. To claim that they walk with God or as God is the actual sin. I'll go to Him directly, thanks very much - no middle man needed! Please do further research and you will find, they disfellowship people for petty reasons.
What reasoning?!? There is no reasoning! They're just spitting out the same phrase over anx and over. They can't even explain their own doctrine and beliefs. The answer as to why they shun disassociated individuals is not something they keep secret.
"We respect their right to make that decision". Except respecting a person doesnt mean you treat them like they dont exist. That's not respect, its punishment.
As a current member(inactive) of the Jehovah Witness Organization, it was extremely disappointing to see these brothers not answering the questions directly. I’m particular disappointed with Brother Spinks...the clear rules/regulations on the matter of shunning, as a matter of fact, is that if a member of a congregation decides to disassociate themselves from the organization, that individual will be shunned by all other members of the congregation, NOT the other way around. Brother Spinks constantly stated that it is a persons own choice to disassociate themselves from the congregation, which in turn means that they have decided to shun the congregation, which is not correct. Furthermore, a public announcement is made in the congregation when one decides to disassociate themselves from the Organization. Basically, this is notifying everyone in the congregation that the individual is no longer a brother or sister, and must be avoided in order to keep the congregation clean.
Oh, I get it, it's people who leave the JWs who are shunning the congregation! Of course! Makes perfect sense...to absolutely no-one other than a JW talking head.
These elders know that people who leave are not shunning the congregation. They know their arguments don't make any sense . They are just pulling straws to defend the cruel practice of shunning people who leave for conscientious reasons.
Nocturnalux it's like leaving your job in supermarket say Walmart and moving to a job at Tesco. Does that mean your Friends at Walmart can't talk to you anymore.
Henry Santiago the problem with that is young people are nudged into baptism. I was baptized at 16 before knowing the consequences if I ever left. My family still talks to my worldly cousins that never got baptized but not me.
im so sorry that happened to you. i recommend you listen a message from watchman nee. if you agree with his writings please write back. may the Lord keep you and bless you.
Its sad the counsel didnt know that when they anounce that person as "No longer one of Jehovahs Witnesses" the congregation has no clue if it is by disassociation or disfellowshipping nor are they supposed to know because it is decided by the Elders and not the congregation. The congregation just follows
HummingBirdLuvah - You're absolutely right. They're so good at avoiding the questions that they should go into politics. They'd fit right in, though they'd say the politicians are "part of the world".
I seriously hate these mind controlled, heartless, morons. I hope this POS WT organization reaps exactly what they've down. Put the GB and all the leaders, elders, etc, in jail for life. Seriously hate these assholes. Bastards.
I was never baptized and still and yet most of them don't want to speak to me because I speak out against their religion. As if they don't speak out against other religions...... Talk about being a hurler of stones while living in glass houses
Me neither but my folks are and little to do with me because of their cult. They still talk and my son goes over to their house, I occasionally spend time with them but it's like a huge wall they put up. I dream of a day they say we're through with the religion unfortunately I don't think it will happen. I'm 37 and there very old and in their 70s I'm afraid they will both die and me and my son will hardly know them. My son has been pretty much been closed off from them because they feel he is to worldly. We hardly ever talk to them now
agreed! I try to show how hypocritical it is to knock on peoples doors in hopes they will listen to how they are in a false religion bc they aren't jw, but wont listen to anyone about their own religion. No humility what so ever.
David Thompson Jesus said to repent and be baptized, so why are you not doing what Jesus commanded? your better than Jesus? even Jesus was baptized. Ahh well do whatever you want of your not going to serve Jesus, you'll be in the same place at the end of the day.
thefuture ofcoal you must not have many words to use , huh ? You’re just in here saying hateful things but offering no rebuttal or anything close to a valid response. Don’t you think we know what you’re saying when you say “ you will all be next “ ? We were all once part of your silly game where we also pretended we were God’s chosen people, for a short while we also suffered the delusion that everyone in our little club was going to live and the rest were going to die . But then we noticed a few things that didn’t add up , which led to finding out things like that NWT has been tweaked illegally over 400 times , or that they misquote reference sources constantly to make them support JW claims , in short , LYING. And then it was easy to see that anyone who uses doctored evidence to create a paradigm where they are God’s Chosen People is a DELUSIONAL NARCISSIST. You’re words don’t scare us at all . You might as well tell me Hello Kitty is coming to drown us in marshmallow sauce next Thursday. It’s that ridiculous. Wake up
The answer from my bible teacher: to punish them and to make them see the wrong that they are doing. To reprimand them for turning away from jehovah. Basically, to instill fear and keep everyone in line.
This is an excellent clip‼️ The judge and the Australian Royal Commission have thoroughly done their homework‼️ We all understand there's a huge difference between no longer being a member of the Organization and disowning your family and friends... Thank you for sharing this clip‼️
They were consistent in their evasion. The judge, and the prosecutor, could not get the correct answer because the witnesses bent over backward to avoid the obvious answer, because they knew it would make them look bad. The thing is, we can all see what the real answer is, and their evasions just make them look dumb. It _is_ cruel to shun victims of sexual abuse. Shunning _is_ a cruel practice in general which only extreme fringe groups practice, because that's the only way they can maintain a modicum of doctrinal purity, because their doctrines are fucked.
Do you mean Jehovah is going to strike us down for noticing the organization has severe problems? Then we're not really walking a line, are we? We've already crossed way over to the danger zone. _If_ we believed God can't take criticism.
The greatest disappointments I experienced was with JWs. The highest form of hypocrisie I experienced with JWs. The deepest wounds and hurts I ever received was by JWs. The most slandering gossip I heard from JWs. I can go on but I rather forget and get on with my new live free from brain washing, abominations and the real truth I found in the Jewish Scriptures. Isaiah 27: 1 ... Our Heavenly Father Himself will deal with false religions.
So I just stop going, I went cold turkey on them. They called, I never answered. They came to my house several times I never answered. Soon the calls stopped and no more knocks came. Now when I see any in public they will actually talk to me. Why?, because I never wrote a letter of disassociation and I was never publicly announced in the congregation that I was no longer a witness. Now they all KNOW that I quit! But yet they still talk to me. Now here’s the kicker... if they actually followed their Jehova, then they know they should not associate with me. But because they never announced me (they being the ones that run the organization) the members will still talk to me.. so this shows they follow man and not god!
I reported something to the JW organization when I was 16 only to receive a letter in return with a 1/2 paragraph full of scriptures they suggested I read. Is there a class action lawsuit moving forward on victims behalfs? I'm only seeing all this now.
I can tell you without a doubt that YES JWs DO blame the victim!!! I was raped when I was 20- the circuit overseer and multiple elders came to my house to 'counsel' me. They asked EXTREMELY PERSONAL questions about the actual rape itself, what I was wearing, what I had been doing, who I associated with, what RACE the rapist was, whether I had been sexually active before, details about what occurred during the actual rape, etc. The circuit overseer actually sat there and TOLD me flat out that I had ' asked for it' because I had been friends with people outside JWs organization, had gone out at night to a club and danced with 'worldly men' and I had been wearing shorts when the rape occurred. I also was friends with people outside my own race and had danced with men outside my own race,they informed me race mixing and interracial relationships were frowned upon within the JWs organization. They announced that I was no longer considered good association and I was shunned by the entire congregation. There were JWs who were even spreading rumors that I had STDs etc. This organization is NOT a religion of GOD because GOD would never do the things these people do or treat people they way they treat people!!!
Those in the position to take care and shepherd the flock, FAIL! The victims are usually the ones that are pushed out especially when it comes to JW's trying to save face, as sins of this sort would bring a negative light to the organizations who tries to look so perfect in the eyes of the world. Ousting the victim is much easier. These so called, brothers/elders, stick together and will drag you, the victim, through the mud to where you want to leave! Nothing worse than not being believed by those you thought had a Godly love for you! It makes it that much more heart wrenching when you have to tell these men something so difficult and personal and painful and ends up for them to turn their backs on you in a way that rips you apart to your very core! The victim is basically a lier, spreading deceitfu and slanderous allegations AND much more!
@@geet77777 That would actually make it worse. When you are a JW you are an outsider to the "World". Having them become martyrs would simply strengthen their resolve and in their minds eye prove them right. "Evil has struck God's children and they steadfastly would not forsake him." is EXACTLY what they would say. Defending their ideology to their last breath. They cannot fathom anything outside of their community which is why isolation from the world is mandatory. No pesky think for yourselves or actual dialogues are allowed with non-believers.
@@maineiac114 I'm willing to take that risk... Of course they're going to spin it to make them look like victims. I don't care. Who's going to believe them??🤔
I am ashamed that I went door to door and wrote letters to people , I am ashamedthat,my fleshly Sister just cut me out of her life.i am HAPPY that I have so many family MEMBERS that are not associated with this cult. When you tell a family member, I don't want anything to do unless you come back that to me is emotional blackmail. I will not trust that group anymore. Thanks for letting me write about this. It does help.love to all out there.
Don't be ashamed, you were only doing what you thought was right at the time. I learned from a psychologist many years ago that any decisions we made in the past based on what we knew then we should never blame ourselves for, when we learn better we do better. If you haven't, just ask God to forgive you and forgive yourself because to Him even our sins are as far as the East is from the West and He remembers them no more. Love and healing to you!
Nothing I hate more than people evading the real issue and repeating the same crap over and over like parrots like that man! These people make me beyond sick. 🤮 I cannot stop thanking God that my mother decided to not get baptized and rejected the whole thing after she, my older sister and I had been studying with the JWs for 4 years. Twelve years later I became a born-again Christian and learned all the things they were teaching that are wrong. However, sadly enoug my only daughter has been now a JW for 8 years. I blame the non-denominational mega-church we'd been attending, another of Satan's inventions, for disappointing her and leaving her exposed to JW co-workers who groomed her by giving her a lot of attention, treating her to dinner, etc. She's in her early 30s, very intelligent, accomplished and beautiful but single because any "available" men near her age are divorced and often disfunctional, so she's just wasting her most precious years devoting them to this evil organization which has also made her colder towards me. I keep praying for God to open her eyes before it's too late, and if anyone reading this would pray too I'd be immensely grateful and may the Lord bless you for your kindness.
I always wondered what JW's thought about this question regarding their doctrine of Jesus being Michael the Archangel - In the book of Jude it says that Michael the Archangel dared not bring an accusation against the Devil, but said "the Lord rebuke you". So we see in this that he did not rely on his own power or own name or own position, but stepped back and relied upon the Lord to rebuke the Devil. However Jesus in the Gospels said in His name to cast out Devils. In the temptation in the wilderness Jesus rebuked Satan, and again when Satan tried to rebuke Christ through Peter Jesus said "Get thee behind me Satan". Furthermore, we also see Jesus forgiving sins of people (the cripple man and the woman caught in adultery), and in John 10:18 Jesus says He has power to lay down His life and raise Himself from the dead, and in John 10:27-28 Jesus says that He gives eternal life, and in John 4:26 Jesus claims to be the Messiah as prophesied of (Isaiah 9:6 called the Mighty God, Everlasting Father), and also later saying "In my name cast out devils". An angel, prophet, or holy man couldn’t do that. So according to this, in Jude, the Devil is more powerful than Michael because Michael had to rely upon the Lord. But Jesus is able to rebuke and defeat the Devil according to the Scriptures and claimed much more and did much more than any angel or archangel could. Can Jesus defeat the devil or not? Because Michael certainly couldn't, and according to Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine the Archangel Michael is Jesus. But according to the Bible Jesus could. so which is right, the Bible or the Jehovah's Witnesses? The Jehovah's Witness religion is a cult because it destroys the Sovereignty of the Lord God Jesus Christ (Isaiah 9:6 He's called the Mighty God Everlasting Father, no angel would call itself that) Additionally the Word of God says - Ephesians 3:9) "And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:" John 1:1-3) "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made." Hebrews 1:2) "Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;" Hebrews 11:3) "Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear." Colossians 1:16) "For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:" Christ Jesus is above all others - Philippians 2:10-11) "That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father." Romans 14:11) "For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God." Isaiah 45:22-23) "Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else. I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear." The Word made Flesh- John 1:1-2) "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God." John 1:14) "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth." 1 John 5:7) "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one." Additional passages - John 8:58) "Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am." - - ("I am" in the Greek is "ego eimi" meaning Always Existing, the everlasting to everlasting one) John 10:25-30) "Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me. But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one. -- (1John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.)" If Christ is not God, how can He grant eternal life to His followers? Isaiah 9:6) "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." Acts 20:28) "Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood." - - (literally just said right there that God purchased the church with His own blood) Colossians 2:8-9) "Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily." - - (the entire fullness, Jehovah God is in the body of Jesus. Thus why Jesus said if you have seen me you have seen the Father, the Father in me and I in Him, and also to His disciples receive ye my Spirit and He breathed on them the Holy Spirit.) Further Proof - John 20:28-29) "And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed." 1 Timothy 4:10) "For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe." 1 John 5:20) "And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life."
Rich Lo Its kind of like when an employee at work gets really fed up with their job & sick & tired of their boss. So they tell their boss, *“You know what?! I QUIT!”* And then their petty, vindictive boss (Watchtower) says, *“No you don’t quit! You’re fired!.”* The governing body are nothing more than a group of pathetic, power hungry & *greedy* SOB’s. Shame on all of them.
Family are shunned except for strict guidelines of family business. My father was removed as an elder for refusing to shun my seriously injured brother. There are consequences for refusing to shun.
I'm a follower of Christ, my grandparents are both JW's. I can tell you that they are devout but very confused people. They believe they are following God but they lack Grace in their daily walk, because they do not believe that Jesus is God, they can never obtain his Grace, which is a gift. I have actually taken the (NWT) and proved without a doubt using it, that Jesus IS God. You see the problem with people that attempt to "Translate" the greek without having any understanding of the Word of God from the Spirit, they make a lot of mistakes. Mistakes in the sense that they did not completely accomplish their agenda of Dishonoring God and the Truth is still in their book, though they are too blind, too indoctrinated, submitting their will to the Authority of man and not to the Holy Spirit which is why most of the time they remain blind. It's a sad thing what the Devil has done to these people and led them astray from the Grace of God.
Liars try to blame it on the persons leaving the organization like they shun . The truth is they want to punish and hurt the person leaving, prevent them from leaving in the first place. Force them to come back. Also they do not tell the congregation why they left and they don't want them to talk to them and find out the person knows things about their organization they don't want their followers to know.
I wanted to just be inactive, but was shunned by my family anyway, and then after i was cut off from my family i sought help through support groups for former members and the elders disfellowshipped for apostasy without even ever talking with me.
*The leaders are getting desperate so they give local elders a wide latitude to disfellowship inactive members for any reason. The leaders are seeing their false religion come apart at the seams and they are throwing everything at it to keep it from ripping apart. God bless you Andy.*
They were not asking them the right question. You can totally walk away, but if you get caught violating any rules after you become inactive, if you voice that you disagree with the organization, you get disfellowshipped. You don’t even have to show up to a meeting. So a person who is a victim of sexual abuse who voices that they disagree with the two witness rule will get disfellowshipped.
From this type of cult, therapy doesn't all ways help. And if you go to therapy, make sure you are going to a very experienced person, not necessarily an academic. Or else it will be more damage than good.
They sound liked broken records. If they don't understand the questions(obviously that they do), then why are they the ones to be representing the WTcult? how many times does the Judge have to ask the same simple questions over and over? A two year of could answer in a none repetitive way. So technically they do SHUN people, wherever they agree or disagree, the Judge and the people around them can read between the lines of these men
It is cruel, and that is exactly why that form of punishment was chosen!!!. THEY can't even wait on Jesus to judge his own sheep. The reason they can't answer a clear yes or no is, to repeat their own stupid bad behavior is like a slap in the face. Insane! They are mentally unable to think clearly on their own. THEY call people who can stand on their own that won't hand over their mind and soul and freewill, mentally diseased. Lol they have been driven mad!
I was inactive for 18months. Got on with my life. Visited my younger brother in the congregation one day and I was taken into a back room with 2 elders, given a grilling about the current lifestyle I was leading, I got annoyed and stormed out and 2 days later I found out through my JW neighbour that I had been disfellowshipped. No judicial committee. No formal process. Lying arseholes all of them.
In the end, these elders will pay for their actions. For it is written: "Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord." . . . . Romans 12:19
THEY actually think their sorry no HS behinds can sever you from God. THEY actually believe they are masters of your faith and you are their lowly peon subject. Lol! The vanity of Satan! Worthless men.
Danyael: wow, stunning behaviour from our loving, caring shepherds, what you describe is such compassionate behaviour hahaaa!, leaving the 99 to go after the lost sheep. Goodness me! How do they sleep at night? Sorry you were treated like that. Nobody deserves that
It's very black and white with the JW's. You're either a firm believer and part of the organisation, attending brainwashing meetings twice a week and going door to door for multiple hours each week trying to indoctrinate others... or you have issue with any of that or don't want to do it, in which case you are completely cast astride and removed from everything you once knew. Even if you're a believer still, but refuse to go door knocking. That is the very definition of a cult. This shunning/disfellowshipping is simply a cult tactic to scare people from leaving or not confining to JW laws (due to losing friends/family) and to force them to do active preaching work. The court should have got straight to the point on this matter. It's clearly a matter of manipulation being used by the 7 men at the top, or 'governing body' as they call it. Not only is it done to make it impossible for people to leave, essentially trapping them, but by taking away people's friends and family, they are opening up a door for them to come back in the future as they may feel they have to be part of the organisation again to see their loved ones. Again, it's all part of the cult tactics to stop people leaving, to force people into coming back and to scare the witnesses into following all the doctrine and going door knocking in fear of the consequences. This is something that needs to be addressed properly as I don't feel it is. The JW organisation is absolutely 100% a doomsday cult. The members are brainwashed into thinking the world is about to end any moment now, and that they must go around spending all their time preaching to save as many people a possible before 'the end'. This is actually just a cult tactic to recruit more people and increase the organisation's numbers. And the organisation preys on innocent 'wordly' people who are either having problems, lonely, or have lost a loved one, who are easily indoctrinated with all this end of the world nonsense (in the hope of reconciling with their loved ones in paradise), which makes them join the organisation because they want to survive armageddon. Consequently, they JW's have been saying that it's the 'last days' for the past 100 years. So yeah, it's all a big farce. I would say the JW's are the largest and most well established cult in the world right now. Probably due to the fact that it's members pay monthly payments to the governing body which helps further the cult...
You can NOT leave this organization honorably. My wife and I chose to leave the organization. We are not disfellowshipped or disassociated ourselves yet we lost ALL our friends of over 32 years and all our family. My wife started being harassed by her family being called Satan's Daughter among other things. It got to a point that she was driven to the verge of suicide and had to be taken to the hospital and to this day hasn't been able to go back to work.
this man is avoiding the issue..i have personal experience with many issues that have caused people to leave and they are shunned...they do lose all support..many of the issues are very valid and you would have to be nuts to stay.. I chose to become inactive after a very public divorce..my ex was a presiding overseer elder and pioneer..we had been married 33 yrs..it took them three yrs after the divorce to df him and his partner..I was put in the street..he lives ina house in florida on a golf course..I rent a room..and have no support from him whatso ever ask the reasons why people leave....I have been shunned..after I was severly abused by the congregation elders..I was told I would not be scripturally free to remarry..beause my ex said he would sue them at the time of his disfellowshipping..in the meantime witness men were asking me for naked pictures.and behaving in very vulgar manner...it was time for me to leave
What!! And they believe they are the 144000, have they actually read who these people are? First of these 144000 are undefiled men they are virgins they are from the 12 tribes of Israel jovos are not Jews, they think they are they think God has finished with the Jews,, the Bible tells us how God loves His people, those who bless Israel 🇮🇱 will be blessed, those who curse Israel 🇮🇱 will be cursed, they dont know which tribe they are from when asked,, they don't believe God is triune, yet the Bible tells us He is, they believe the Lord is created by jahovah, where do they get that from? It's certainly not biblical,, they believe only they are saved, Jesus said any one, who calls on His name and believes in Him and that He rose from the dead,, shall be saved,, not if just jovah witnesses believes shall be saved,,, its just ridiculous,,,
sometimes I'm filled with such rage that I know isn't mine to feel towards them..I do feel sorry for all the lives they have ruined and families torn apart like my own. and sometimes I have to remind myself of psalms 37:13 "but the Lord laughs at the wicked, for he knows their day is coming." So they will not get away with this, I shudder to think of God's righteous judgement for these liars leading people away from him...
Matthew Baker Oh my lord, I laughed myself silly at the thought. Bribery to an insider? We could crowd fund the effort. Almost *all* Ex-JW's would give *something* to have that happen!
I wish you could too. I wonder if we could set up a gofundme page to pay a top hacker to do that haha. JWs deserve to know what their leaders and leaders lapdogs are saying under Oath when they believe JWs will not find out.
Ridiculous. There are droves of us who no longer attend, are not disfellowshipped, did not disassociate, and are nevertheless shunned by all or part of family and friends. Even if some choose not to shun you, as soon as you post a birthday photo, or are seen doing something worthy of judicial action, they will rush to get you in a room and disfellowship you. These guys are playing semantics, and are horrible people.
Well, nowadays, inactive JW's *are* to be treated as disassociated. Now an official policy. Kim and Mikey have a mole in the organization and, perhaps a year or so ago, received a copy of a Watchtower letter to the elders informing them of this. Before I disassociated myself, my elder warned me strongly to *never* become inactive, even while battling cancer, or I might face disfellowshipping. I mean, WTF? in 9 months of chemo, I got no calls or visits by anyone in the congregation other to have the connection information given to me so I could 'attend' the convention via computer. Lovely people.
Wendy Ellen Galecki do you have a link to a copy of this letter? I appreciate the posative Kim and Mikey have accomplished, but lately they have come off as a little unhinged to me. I would be interested in reading and interpreting the policy on my own. Im not universally shunned, its about 75% to 25%.
Vandalay Industries Not exactly. I am fairly positive it was in a video here on TH-cam. I really think it was Kim and Mikey. Search for their channel and see if is in any of the video titles. If not there, then try John Cedars channel. The creator of those videos and his name is Lloyd Evans. Sorry that I cannot be more specific.
Wendy. Thanks for the response. I am pretty sure I know the letter that you are talking about, and I would stop well short of saying there has now been a "policy change" in shunning the inactive. Its kind of the same ole same ole I'm afraid. Bad association, spoils useful habits. In other words, the people who slip through, but they would actually like to see DF'd so as not to have any influence with loved ones, should still be on your radar. Know what I mean. Not trying to srgue semantics.....but we all know when speaking to JW's, semantics are all that seemingly matter. They have no official policy to shun the inactive. They of course do encourage shunning of anyone who has chosen to leave, particular for matters of "conscience" rather than "weakness". Feel me?
They just NEVER give a STRAIGHT answer. Typical WT....I'm glad that the Judge and specially Mr Stewart did a very good homework about Watchtower. They are going down, they have to pay for all of their sins and pain the caused to so many innocent people.
I disassociated myself once because of leaving my abusive husband. I lived in a small town with many JW's who I no longer wanted to talk too because they were taking sides, mainly his side. I also knew that if I just left the congregation , they would disfellowship me anyways on their own. They even told me they might do that. I do not know why but half who leave get away with living their lives very immorally and do not get disfellowshipped , while the other half get Disfellowshipped.
i was shunned by certain people yet I was never disfellowshipped or did I disassociate, and btw I didnt become an axe murderer either! A few weeks back I was waiting for a bus in my wheelchair with a carer, and an elder from my local congregation happened to cross the street towards us. I was smoking a cigarette at the time. He didnt say hello, he just scowled at me above his glasses. I now realise however about forgiveness and true Christianity and bear no grudge. What gets to me sometimes though is that I get scowled at whilst this fellow's reputation outside the congregation is so bad concerning his trade that the local council won't recommend his work! He's ripped off so many people, yet I'm the bad one! Ah well; lets hope the genuine ones wake up one day.
One way or another they will shun anyone that disagrees with their teachings. It has happened to thousands & thousands of really good people! They come after people who have left quietly & have never said anything against the organization. You must OBEY the GB or else. These elders are trying to sugar coat it.. but all of us X's know exactly how it works ! We live it everyday!!
what do you care if we disassociate with someone who we feel is bad association. That's what taking a stand for righteousness means. Hating what God hates, even if you family. Jesus said we would lose brother, sister, father, mother for his name sake. Read the bible.
Tina Alvarado - I was a witness for 40 years.. believe me, I've read the Bible. The GB takes scriptures out of context & go beyond what is written. When you start reading the Bible WITHOUT the man made watchtower publications "interpretation" of the scriptures, then you will understand that shunning is NOT biblical ! It tears families apart & is just a tactic to be used so the members don't hear real truth!! It has caused suicides, nervous breakdowns & terrible depression. Not something God would approve of. Now on a personal note : I don't care that I'm being shunned. It's been 12 years & I consider it a "blessing" now. It keeps my former family & friends from pressuring me back into an evil organization that has caused so much damage to many good people! That being said, there are many shunned ones that are struggling & hurting deeply & I do care about them, as you should, especially if you call yourself a Christian! When the JW's hear the real truth, as my family has, & they refuse to research it, then that's when they need to be held accountable . The information is at your fingertips. I pray you start researching. Go to JWFacts.com & there's a great book called Crisis of Conscience by Ray Frans. Get yourself educated on the religion you are defending & stop reiterating what the GB says. They are NOT God. Mere men who have been given a lot of power & by no means should be listened to!! Blessings 🙏
@@tinaalvarado612 We care because you do it to children. You indoctrinate them into your cult before they're old enough to understand the consequences and then you hold their family and entire social structure to ransom if they dare question their decision. You belong to a truly despicable cult. You are a hypocrite because you know you're not supposed to be on worldly forums, yet you come here to lie and bully ex-JW's.
I wasn't a victim of child abuse when a child involved with the Jehovah's witnesses (because of mother's involvement) but I really really thank God that one Elder did tell me as a 15 yr old to never never trust any elder or let myself be led in a room alone with them. Now it all makes sense.
The problem, that becomes so obvious, is that you simply cannot apply logic and reason to this religion and the ridiculous manner in which they treat the layman. Having been in this religion at one time, I can tell you for a certain pretzel logic will always rule the day when you are a foot soldier in the JWO. So sad.
As an ex special pioneer i know the process well. Very few people choose to disassociate them selfs, what actually happens is the elders will meet with these ones generally if they have become inactive, if they suspect that you know longer wish to be part of the Congregation they will pressure you to write a letter disassociating your self.The policy behind that is to make out that you are completely shunning the congregation and its members, in other words if they dont have enough evidence to disfellowship you then they will intimidate you to have your self disfellowship, this way is to let the congregation that you no longer accept their standards or beliefs and other witnesses must be warned about you not to associate with you for fear you may undermine their faith. Shunning is generally not what these ex members want but many still fell compelled to do what these Elders say, the process is often very intimating. my advice to any JW who might be in this position is not to play ball with the elders! Dont meet with them, sometimes they will ask you to the congregation to meet with elders out of concern for you, this is just a trap! Dont go! If they ask you any questions other than what they talked about to meet with you, get up and leave.
If the average witness new what goes on with these elders and how they actually deal with people most would of left years ago! They control all information of what it members hears, its tyrannical, if i had of stayed a simple publisher i would most likely still be there, but I was a true believer until I started to see how things really are.
@@rod7139 were not talking about killers or other criminals. We're talking about decent law abiding citizens being controlled by rules designed to hide the true nature of a very wicked cult
When this is all said and done, every knee in Heaven, on earth, and under the earth will bow to the name of Jesus! (Phillippians 2:9-10) Repent, turn from your sins and turn to God by putting faith in our Lord Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins.
Why did you leave? My sister in law is caught up in this cult and so is her daughter and husband. We try to share the truth of Jesus with them but they just run to elders to be told what to think overtime they are read a bible verse that proves their teachings wrong. I know she knows the truth deep down, but they are so caught up in this cult, their jobs come from it, and I keep praying but don't know what to say or do for them to open their eyes. They almost shunned their own daughter for dating a non JW boy who ended up joining and marrying her. So sad she drug that boy into these lies.
kandykissesministry trying to supplant JW teachings with traditional Christian teachings is a losing battle in my opinion. Christianity is full of its own illogical hypocricy, and much of it is why JWs even exist. The trick is to find an issue close to them, that is inaccurate. For me it was blood. For my wife it was disfellowshipping. For my friend it was 1914. Driving them to the trinity, immortality of the soul, or that everyone is going to heaven......is not going anywhere.
Right now they are saying no one even has a soul-my sister-in-law is deep into JW and she wrote my husband a big long explanation of this. We are simple praying for them to see the light because no one ever listens to their family, but strangers yes. True Christianity is not hypocrisy the problem is their are so many people like the JW's who never really read the bible and know and understand Jesus-they simple follow what a man says the bible says.
I think a big indication as to the view of disfellowshipping vs.dissociating is the fact that the announcement from the platform is the exact same. "First last name, is no longer one of Jehovahs Witnesses." By default the congregation is not allowed to know which it is, and they aren't allowed to find out either because they cant talk to the person.
Guy is lying along with being annoying. He says "the congregation" decides on disfellowshipping when in fact it's just 3 guys and "the congregation" doesn't even know what the person did and isn't ever told. The 2 witness rule Paul referred to is Jesus words found in Matt 18:15-17. It has nothing to do with what JWS use it for. Also, in the Bible you don't need 2 witnesses to rapes and murders. God's not stupid, he knows how those evils get done ... without witnesses. In Deut. if a woman screams during a rape but there's no one around to rescue her(no witnesses), she's done nothing wrong. Put the man to death.
The people who have left the truth as you call it.it seems to me that your having a hard time crossing back over to the real world and I pray for all of you.it will get better every day.you are strong people and you will be ok.god bless you and all that you do.
Do not forget to congratulate the "Faithful and Dscret Slave" and the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witness on the Anniversary: "100 years of service to the people of God: 1919-2019" (after the appointment of Jehovah and Jesus Christ, who never appointed anyone)!
It's odd they never said anything about this 100-year thing. I was expecting them to mention it at the AGM. I guess they know its a scam and they don't want to remind people of the silly story of their appointment yet again
“What kind of king makes Himself nothing for His people? The Mighty one. What kind of king lets His people humiliate and beat Him until He is unrecognizable and is still able to hold His head high? The Merciful one. What kind of king hangs Himself on a cross for his people? The Righteous one. And because He has done this for us I will make my life a living sacrifice unto Him.” His name is above all others His name is JESUS!
But there weren't two witnesses when that kid saw his friend in a birthday party. Then snitched and got his friend re brainwashed or "counseled" for going to a socially accepted function . -_- just an example. Dunno if this has actually happened
Notice how no scripture except for "at the mouth of two or three witnesses" Was looked at.. What above "love your enemies as i have loved you" where Yahushua Messiah even died for the people that whipped him and ssked Yahuwah the Father to forgive them for their lack of understanding or information.. So if I had a daughter and she decided to speak out about like my brother abusing her (it's always the victim's uncle or something) and we were all members and my daughter decides to leave the organisation because nobody saw it what will happen to my daughter and when my fellow brethren in the rest of the church come over to study are they really gonna shun my daughter in my house coz she left the church.. Am i supposed to shun my daughter in a way until she is financially stable enough leave the house and find her own place.. That's so unfair.. Yet if my brother goes and rapes my brethren daughter and she just slowly stops coming back to church every week until she doesn't come back a whole year or more she's welcome back to the church.. Is that right?
This pple are so.. I dnt know.. someone borrow me English.. I know someone in an abusive marriage verbally..sexually... Physically....and then she went to report in her congregation she was counselled on how to be loyal to the husband.. When she couldn't bear the pains she ran away with her child.. Waited for 4 years thinking he would change and come back but he never did.. Meanwhile she was an active member in the organisation , At a point she needed to move on remarried to someone non JW she was disfellowshiped. While the ex husband wasnt.. She cryed her eyes out.. For been disfellowshipped.. It makes no sence cause its a society and an organisation as its often called nothing spiritual.. Songs made by them..no other christain can sing..that disgusting..please this society should be bound..because they are leading pple to hell everyday.
What the judge said is true “ lots do disassociate because they can no longer be apart of something that caused so much pain in their life... as a consequence they loose their whole support system and they are looked upon as weak and bad association. And are SHUNNED!! The two members keep side stepping the question. And when they said a person can choose to be inactive “that’s false” I tried to be inactive. I didn’t believe anymore and my now ex husband started insisting I couldn’t be trusted and that I was cheating on him!!! He then decided to move out with our adopted daughter and asked for a scriptural divorce “ don’t leave me in limbo that’s not fair” where his words. So in the end I was disfellowshipped for infidelity. I met with a pair of elders once. One was kind and the other was quite brash and rude. Never met with them again. People with in that organization are very hypocritical and sneaky.
He nails it. Why should someone who chooses to leave have to lose their friends and family? Shunning is arbitrary and cruel. In a surreal twist, the Society is now claiming that the person who leaves is the one doing the shunning. Talk about victim-blaming.
Disfellowshipped vs Disassociated vs Inactive DF - You're forced out DA - You choose to leave and formally do so - "rejecting teachings" IA - you gradually leave without a formal rejection over simplifying it....but in a nutshell. Inactive however, are treated just like the others informally. considered spiritually "weak" and a risk to others. You would most likely get approached by elders about association with such ones.
I tried to just go away and lead my own life, the elders found out where I lived and disfellowshipped me by proxy on the assumption i was living in sin (they had no witnesses). A woman I flatted with turned out to be the disfellowshipped JW everyone talked about when I first became a JW. She was disfellowshipped/shunned for sleeping with her boyfriend. What she told me was she actually did it so her father would stop molesting her. This is what I have seen over and over with the JW org is the victim ends up being shunned more often then the guilty one. The Commission clearly sees this, be interesting if anything ever gets done about these mind control cults.
Luckily I lived under my family’s house who knew what they were like so when I walked away they tried knocking 3 times in 1 day my family told them to do one an never heard off them again I was shunned by friends all on the basis of getting to know a non jw so I chose to walk away from if elders didn’t get a hold of me either
I'd like to see where they spell out this policy in print to the membership that they can be inactive and not be shunned. Where does it say that in the things the leadership tell the sheep? When is it talked about by speakers? Where is it in the information baptismal candidates must review?
3:45 A person who disassociates themselves, they, they're taking the action. Now, for whatever reason, ....they're actually taking the stand to shun the congregation." So, does this mean, if I disassociate myself, but don't "take the action to shun the congregation," I'm not going to be shunned? I can maintain my association with my family, and my family won't be penalized by the congregation for their association with me? I should call my mom and let her know! Don't worry mom, I won't shun you. And you don't have to shun me, cuz the brothers said you don't shun for disassociating.
Tried to edit my comment below but unable so I'll add to it here. I was also shunned at 16 years of she for over 30 years... lost connection with my siblings and have suffered continously over the years. Have multiple visits to psychologists over the years to prove it.....
You have to jump through hoops to get justice in this organization. The tears I've cried, the pain I felt, the fighting I did for justice- My story is not unique and is tame compared ot many, but this is very damaging and purposefully manipulative behavior to keep people in whether they are believers or not
SONG 1: Jehovah’s Attributes Jehovah our God, exalted in might, We at the Watchtower provide all your light. The Governing Board standing so grand; Forever proclaiming "In Penis We Stand" Your heavenly throne, your truth we proclaimed. The end of the world for years we've exclaimed. The stupid believe us - the light does go brighter, The feeble believe us, and their purses are lighter. Our meat in due season, the generation has died, Many world endings to the sheep we have cried And now we pay millions to molested young, The pioneers deluded as they swallow our dung.
The pathetic answer to the judges question is "to keep Jehovah's organization clean". They view victims as unclean who make such accusations, but they still had no problem with running the child (or grown up) through the wringer and threatened them behind closed doors with sanctions or disfellowshipping them if they talk. In the end, their own actions make their organization even dirtier than it was to begin with. When it is an adult who reports being molested through belated recall, this is especially what they do due to statutes of limitations. They do their best to push them out of the organization SO THAT THEY CAN SHUN THEM.
just like in other cults, being shunned after challenging or leaving or being disfellowshipped is standard procedure. If it's not somewhere made formal policy by the 'leadership,' it's an unspoken 'rule' that the congregation fall into line under the 'leadership' of the elders or whoever runs the show, esp. on doctrinal issues, that, of course, can be misinterpreted by the system, depending on what bible version they hold to. These horrid straights above do not respond to the repeated question about people being actively shunned by family, friends and others once they decide that there's no safe haven in the group, and that they won't be heard or helped. Hence that cruelty is a lasting legacy in what occurs esp.to those abused. The shunning was not acknowledged and of course owned by these two duds. Who would ever want these two to be involved in a hot situation around abuse when they refuse to answer a simple question. The judge made it plain, and all the creepy 'respect' talk esp. by the guy on the left is horse dung. He represents that horrid unwellness in such cults, where they just don't get what truth is, and stick to what the group upholds at the expense of those who legitimately have been hurt. That shunning then takes place is a group doctrine, but the bible plainly states that there are 4 steps that must take place before someone is put out, and on any one of the previous steps, they should ensure that fair audience is given so that the offended parties are given a fair hearing and both moral and legal steps be taken to ensure their complaints are dealt with once made factual.
One of the things that pisses me off righteously in watching any part of the ARC hearing is the refusal of the Witnesses while on the stand to answer a question demanding a 'yes' or 'no' answer with a 'yes' or a 'no'. They hedge, hem and how, talk in circles and do anything to avoid simply answering the question they've been asked. The Governing Body of this ungodly organization is made of some very evil men; that evil spills down from the top all the way down to Ministerial Servants, lessening by degree with each level. Does the GB act, believing they are doing Jehovah's will, having been trained to think and act the way they do as they've risen though the ranks? Or do they *know* how evil they actually are? Trickle-down demonomics. (With a nod to President Regan) ~Ellyn~
Jehovah's Witnesses are incapable of answering the following questions. How about you? Answer A or B: "On her forehead was written a name, a mystery: Babylon the Great (all false religions as a whole), mother of the prostitutes (individual false religions)..." A. All Bethel "branch" offices as a whole are the mother of individual Bethel branch offices. B. New York Bethel is the mother of individual Bethel branch offices. A. All people called Ellyn Galecki as a whole are the mother of individuals called Ellyn Galecki. B. One original Ellyn Galecki is the mother of individuals called Ellyn Galecki. A. All false religions as a whole are the mother of individual false religions. B. One ancient false religion is the mother of individual false religions.
These elders are so ashamed to admit that shunning, no matter of a victim or others, is miserable. It is a very harsh social punishment that can draw someone to mental diseases through solitude and helplessness. And they failed to tell the Commission why this punishment is necessary: The JW hope one day the shunned will turn around, BEGGING the organisation to reassociate with them. Being one who comprehended and accepted this social arrangement, I feel ashamed to have preached these rules to others, and very upset learning the news in Australia.
*@ Sean Tsoi - My dear brother I also look back on the some of the teachings I preached and cannot comprehend what I was thinking. The reason why is because we had that dark veil over our eyes (2 Cor. 4:4). God bless.*
This so called religion nearly destroyed my family. My parents fell for this cult when my parents were in a terrible spot in their lives. My father was into drugs and heavy drinking. I guess it saved him in that aspect, he quit. But at a cost! As a 6 year old child our lives changed drastically! No longer did I get to go to mass with my grandmother, or celebrate Christmas or my birthday, play with friends or even my cousins anymore. As I got older I didn't get to participate in any school activities, I wanted to be a cheerleader or a dancer. Going to college was out of the question! This was all considered 'worldly'. I remember knocking on doors, and praying that no one I knew from school would answer the door. I rebelled big time! I'd usually get caught because the other JW kids in my class would snitch on me. I eventually left my parents house, I had just barely turned 17. My parents pretty much shunned me for a year and a half. It wasn't until I decided to try and end my life that my parents came to my side. They were starting to see things differently. My father was a Elder in the congregation, so that was difficult in itself. Now almost 30 years later my parents have apologized for putting my siblings and I through that. It's hard to accept the apology sometimes because I feel I was robbed of a life that I wanted to have.
*I'm so sorry that you experienced all of that. I did as well growing up so I can definitely understand. I hope you have found peace and happiness in your life today and are living fully. Are your parents still witnesses? God bless.*
There is hardly ever a time where there is a witness to sexual abuse. Pedophiles are very careful to get children in situations where they are alone. This idea of needing a witness is purely a way to ignore sexual abuse.
This is interesting. Thanks for posting. It made me wonder what the Bible actually said. I Cor 5 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators: 10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 2 John "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that bids him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds. In the Greco-Roman world a traveling philosopher or religious teacher was a familiar phenomenon. Christian teachers also traveled and relied on local believers for support and hospitality. (Providing lodging for heretics was unacceptable.) I was just wondering how that compares with what someone can be disfellowshipped for. Blood and blood transfusions (There were no blood transfusions even possible in Bible times.) Smoking Gluttony Non neutral activities (involvement in politics and the military) Worldly celebrations such as Christmas Military service Ps. 144:1 " Blessed be the Lord my strength which teaches my hands to war, and my fingers to fight: Not to mention the countless wars that the nation of Israel was involved in. Many people in the Bible were involved in politics. Cornelius Cornelius in the Bible was a centurion, a commander in the Italian Regiment of the Roman military. The Ethiopian The Ethiopian eunuch mentioned in the Bible was a high court official of Candace, the queen of Ethiopia. Joseph- governor Nehemiah- governor Esther- Queen Mordecai Moses King David, King Solomon, etc. etc. etc. Daniel- The satraps were the chief representatives of the king, and they most likely had charge of the various provinces of the kingdom. In Daniel 6, the satraps serving under King Darius had Daniel as one of their overseers: gotquestions.org Joseph of Arimathea (In Luke 23:50, we learn that Joseph was actually a part of the Council, or Sanhedrin), Nicodemus (John 3:1 also describes Nicodemus as a leader of the Jews.) These last two men provided a burial place and 75 pounds of spices for Jesus' body. The average person would not have had that kind of money. 1 Corinthians is also specific as to who these words apply to. This advice is in regards to a person "called a brother" who "is" a wrongdoer. No indication is given that they should be avoided when they are no longer recognized as a Jehovah's Witness brother. Nor does it say to shun a person who has stopped their wrongdoing. jwfacts.org 2 John does not indicate a polite greeting is wrong. John here shows that a person is a sharer in the Antichrist's wicked works if he shows acceptance and agreement with the evildoers cause or teachings, or wishes them favor and success. jwfacts.org As late as 1947, the Awake January 8 page 27 described the practice of excommunication as an unscriptural, pagan practice, using Hebrews 10: 26-31 to show it should be left to God to judge individuals. I guess they got 'new light.' During the millenial reign someone has got to be in charge. I wonder how that will work out? It is amazing that so much of what the WTS believes and teaches has no basis in Scripture, yet they go on believing it.? II Tim. 3:13
These so called gate keepers for Watchtower shouldn't be the only ones brought up before the ARC. It should be the maker of these unbiblical rules. The Governing body should be on the hot seat too. Its funny how God himself gave us all free will, but little MEN want to take free will away. This is rediculous when they are often, more prone to deliberate sin as the average person. Power corrupts! They want to make a hundred rules while day dreaming of sex sins with the innocent. That is why Jesus drew the line and told the religious killers to cast the first stone if they haven't sinned. We do not have to OBEY any finicky rules set by men, or a stupid corporation. Our God already gave us TEN Commandments. So stuff that up your golden calf and smoke it! Watchtower demons.
+Bill 777 Your right, we believe as many who do their research, X-mad is a pagan holiday. Along with Halloween, Easter, st.Patrick's day...do the research, God hates idolaters.
In 1 Cor 5, the word "associate" is better translated as "mix with" (so that we may more easily understand). The same Greek word for "associate" is used in the Septuagint numerous times and is translated as "mix". "Eating" is often inferred as the communal meal or the Lord's Supper, if you take in the context of the passage.
Jehovah’s Witnesses (JW’s) deviate from biblical Christianity in several areas. First, like all the cults, they deny the Trinity. They believe there is one God, Jehovah, and that Jesus is actually Michael the Archangel, the first of God’s creation, who became flesh at the incarnation. After the resurrection, He returned to heaven as Michael the Archangel. 1 Witnesses further say that the Holy Spirit is not God, but rather an active force much like electricity or fire.
Second, JW’s deny the bodily resurrection of Christ, but instead believe He was raised as a spirit and manifested Himself several times in different materialized bodies.
Third, they deny the existence of hell and eternal punishment, but believe in total annihilation after death. Only the elite ruling class, the 144,000, are allowed to go to heaven. The faithful JW’s remain unconscious after death till they are resurrected in the Millennium. Those who are not in the organization are annihilated after death.
Fourth, JW’s have a works-oriented salvation. Salvation is not based upon a relationship with Christ, but found in the organization. One must serve the society, and depending on one’s faithfulness and absolute obedience, one may be saved.
Fifth, they believe that Jesus returned invisibly in 1914 and established His throne in heaven. At Armageddon, God will destroy all evil, and abolish all the world’s governments, and establish a new Paradise on earth. Then the living and resurrected JW’s will inherit Paradise earth. The 144,000 mentioned earlier will rule with Jesus. At this time all unbelievers who have died will be raised (with some exceptions) and will study under the JW’s during the Millennium, a period of a thousand years. Studying with them will be the unbelievers who have survived Armageddon. After the thousand years, their faith will be tested because God will release Satan from the abyss. At that point all unbelievers will have to choose between Satan or Jehovah. Those who reject Jehovah will be annihilated.
Clearly the doctrines of the Jehovah’s Witnesses deviate in critical ways from sound biblical principles.
False Prophecies of the Watch Tower
The April 1, 1972, Watch Tower article on page 197, states clearly that JW’s are true prophets of God.
However, Deuteronomy 18:20-22 says that a true prophet speaks in the name of God and predicts future things which come to pass. A false prophet speaks in the name of God, but predicts future things which do not come to pass.
Also, in the 1889 issue of the Watchtower, “The Time is at Hand,” page 101 states, “The battle of the great day of God Almighty (Rev. 16:14), which will end in A.D. 1914, with the complete overthrow of earth’s present rulership, is already commenced.” This 1914 prediction of Christ’s return of course never came true, resulting in false prophecy number one.
Then the Watch Tower predicted that Christ would return in 1925. The 1918 issue of, “Millions Now Living Will Never Die,” p. 89 states, “Therefore we may confidently expect that 1925 will mark the return of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and the faithful prophets of old, particularly those named by the apostle in Hebrews 11 to the condition of human perfection.” This proved to be another false prophecy.
The Watch Tower then made a third prophecy of the return of Christ, which was to occur in 1975. The August 15, 1968, issue of, Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975?, p. 494, predicted the return of Christ in 1975. Once again the JW’s were shown to be false prophets.
Another interesting prophecy is found on page 154 of their book, "You Can Live Forever in Paradise on Earth". Here they state, “Some of the generation living in 1914 will see the end of the system of things and survive it.” However, all of the 1914 generation are now dead, resulting in yet another false prophecy.
The Name of God
Another effective avenue of witnessing to the Witnesses is in the name of God. JW’s state that God’s true name is “Jehovah.” They say the term “God,” is merely a title, and that the real name for God is “Jehovah.” In fact they go so far as to say that unless one calls on the true name of God, “Jehovah,” one cannot be saved.
The name of God in the Old Testament spelled YHWH, was considered holy, and was not to be read aloud. Instead, when the Hebrews came upon YHWH, they would say ADONAY, which means “Lord.” In order to indicate this substitution, the Masoretes placed the vowels of ADONAY or the English equivalent of e, o, and a underneath the consonants of YHWH. Later some Christian translators mistakenly combined the vowels of ADONAY with the consonants of YHWH producing the word “Jehovah.” Now the term is recognized to be a late hybrid form never used by the Jews. That’s the origin of the word “Jehovah.” Let’s now look at what other scholars say about the name “Jehovah.”
Webster’s Collegiate Dictionary: “Jehovah” -- False reading of the Hebrew YAHWEH.8 Encyclopedia Americana: “Jehovah” -- erroneous form of the name of the God of Israel.9 Encyclopedia Britannica: The Masoretes who from the 6th to the 10th century worked to reproduce the original text of the The Jewish Encyclopedia: “Jehovah” -- a mispronunciation of the Hebrew YHWH the name of God. This pronunciation is grammatically impossible.
Therefore, for JW’s to insist Jehovah is the true name of God and that one is saved only if he calls on that name, is an error. When Witnesses appear at your door explain to them the name “Jehovah” and read what the scholars say about Jehovah. Also remember, God uses many names for Himself such as, King of Kings, the Lion of Judah, the Alpha and the Omega, and others. When JWs realize what the authoritative sources have to say, especially the encyclopedia references, they will begin to realize the need to take a serious look at this error in the organization.
The Bodily Resurrection of Christ
A third subject area for effective witnessing to Witnesses is the bodily resurrection of Christ. JW’s believe that Christ’s crucified body was disintegrated by Jehovah never to exist again. Accordingly, Jesus was raised as a spirit who then materialized and appeared in several different fleshly bodies as the angels had done. Indeed, it was in this form that He appeared to His disciples; i.e., He wasn’t in a human body; He just appeared to be human. He ascended into heaven as a spirit and once again became Michael the Archangel.13 This doctrine can be easily disproved.
First, in Luke 24:36-43, Jesus clearly states in verse 39 that He is not a spirit but a man of flesh and bone. He even ate food to prove that He was not a spirit but had a physical body. In John 20:24-27, Jesus shows Thomas His wounds. Jesus is clearly demonstrating to His disciples that the body previously on the cross had been resurrected. If Jesus had a different body than the one on the cross, He would have been deliberately deceiving the disciples. Ask the Witness, “Would Jesus deliberately deceive His disciples into believing something that was not true?”
Next, turn to some passages where Jesus predicts the resurrection of His body. In John 2:19-21Jesus says, “Destroy this temple and in three days I will raise it up.” See Acts 2:26-27, another prophecy of the Messiah’s bodily resurrection. Clearly the prophecies and Jesus’ appearances prove a bodily resurrection.
JW’s cite 1 Peter 3:18 and 1 Cor. 15:44-50 to back up their belief. In 1 Peter 3:18 we read, “Christ died once and for all... he being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the spirit.” This verse does not prove Jesus is a spirit. This verse says that Jesus was raised in the Spirit and by the Spirit of God who gives life. Romans 8:11 states that the Holy Spirit was involved in raising Jesus from the dead. Jesus was not raised as a spirit but by the power of the Holy Spirit. According to 1 Cor. 15:50, “flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.” Since Jesus is in heaven, JW’s say He must be a spirit.14 They are correct in saying that the earthly body cannot enter heaven. However, when Jesus rose, He had a glorified body (Luke 24:39). Therefore, He can dwell in heaven because of His glorified state.
According to 1 Cor 15:39, “All flesh is not the same: Men have one kind of flesh, animals have another.... There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies.” Christ’s glorified body allows Him to travel in the earthly and heavenly dimensions. Some verses indicate that Christ exists in heaven in bodily form. “For in him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form” Colossians 2:9. The verb “dwells” in the Greek is katoikei, and is in the present tense. In other words, Jesus has a glorified body in heaven, the one that was resurrected. Note also 1 Timothy 2:5, “There is one God and one mediator, the man Christ Jesus.” The verb “is,” is a present tense verb also. How can Jesus be a man if He is Michael the Archangel? Seeing these errors may prompt them to seek the truth.
Jehovah’s Witnesses Exposed | Run Away From this Cult: th-cam.com/video/RaaJdhAVWyw/w-d-xo.html
7 Facts that Prove the Jehovah’s Witnesses are a False Religion: th-cam.com/video/4x0sL2Dum5I/w-d-xo.html
Top 10 Shocking Beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses: th-cam.com/video/mXdhB9kxwnA/w-d-xo.html
15 Questions for Jehovah’s Witnesses on False Predictions: th-cam.com/video/33MecN27BUY/w-d-xo.html
Dr. David Reagan on The Jehovah's Witnesses, False Prophecy Gone to Seed: christinprophecy.org/articles/the-jehovahs-witnesses/
Dr. David Reagan on the Deception of the Cults: christinprophecy.org/articles/the-deception-of-the-cults/
Dr. Ron Rhodes on an Overview of Cults: th-cam.com/video/Ji2U3CWvsWU/w-d-xo.html
*Thank you SteveMac88 for posting this information. God bless you my brother.*
Jehovah's Witnesses Testimonies, you’re welcome, and God bless!
@ChiriCuto why is he insane?
You are so on top of this. Most ex jws become atheists. Its so sad. I did for almost two decades.
@@burningwateryt8704 naw if they are that stupid let them . its hard for me to say that but it is very obvious that this is non-biblical not rational... And not right.
I'm neither disassociated or disfellowshipped and all of my family and friends have shunned me because I openly said I no longer believe in it, despite pioneering for years. The biggest slap in the face I ever heard was that I was turning my back on everyone. They have brain washed people into thinking that those who are shunned rejected them, not the other way around. It makes my blood boil
*I'm sorry to hear about your situation. I sympathize with you as I also experience the same. But no worries my dear friend give it time and pray that God loosens the shackles around their mind so they too can break free and truly start living. So they too can start to experience the freedom you and I have come to cherish and appreciate. A freedom that can never be found in a cult like the Jehovah's Witness religion. The leaders will get theirs once they take their last breath unless they repent. God bless you my dear friend.*
Yes, you put it correctly. I remember when I was shunned my sister even said to me "why did you do this to me?" "What have I done to deserve this?" can you imagine?
It's sad. Maybe one day your family will open their eyes.
Watch telltale atheist this channel just trades one cult for another
Do not feel bad, the worst people I met were witnesses. By the way, there was no so called jesus, it is SEUZ of greek mythology taken from the Egyptians. The so called bible is the BYBLOS of Egypt which means body of fire, everything has to do with the SUN, in astrology and astrotheology...please check out exjw Santos Bonacci...
They just can't answer the question directly. So deceptive. Just say yes or no, period.
The individual is shunning the congregation? Oh, that's rich. Blame the victim. The doublespeak ability is astounding.
And the court was saying that, in the case of a person who has been a victim of the congregation and who is unable to continue associating with it because of their vicitmization, the response of the doctrine and leadership is profoundly cruel. The idea that, by removing themselves from a dangerous situation, a person is shunning bible beliefs, laws and principles, is Orwellian doublespeak: they are doing no such thing, and I'm sure almost none of them would claim this. The very notion that a victim is a bad associate who spoils useful habits is shocking in its cruelty and blatant Machiavellianism.
Unless these 2 repent, they are going to hell, and it is well deserved for their cruelty.
It's called gaslighting and the JW's are extreme pros at it.
www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/here-there-and-everywhere/201701/11-warning-signs-gaslighting
@@isaacgalvez1309 please read my comment above. My situation had nothing to do with me being 'sinful' and yet they disfellowshipped me for wanting to take a break! This organisation ruined my life. To claim that they walk with God or as God is the actual sin. I'll go to Him directly, thanks very much - no middle man needed! Please do further research and you will find, they disfellowship people for petty reasons.
Listening to their "reasoning" and lies is absolutely sickening.
Listening to this idiots I want to Vomit
What reasoning?!? There is no reasoning! They're just spitting out the same phrase over anx and over. They can't even explain their own doctrine and beliefs. The answer as to why they shun disassociated individuals is not something they keep secret.
From what point view?
"We respect their right to make that decision". Except respecting a person doesnt mean you treat them like they dont exist. That's not respect, its punishment.
Exactly
Good point/definition
I love how he dances around the question. He knows the truth but refuses to admit it
As an atheist, and ex Jw of 40 years, I don't believe in hell...
But if it exists.
There's a special place for Spinks in it.
As a current member(inactive) of the Jehovah Witness Organization, it was extremely disappointing to see these brothers not answering the questions directly. I’m particular disappointed with Brother Spinks...the clear rules/regulations on the matter of shunning, as a matter of fact, is that if a member of a congregation decides to disassociate themselves from the organization, that individual will be shunned by all other members of the congregation, NOT the other way around. Brother Spinks constantly stated that it is a persons own choice to disassociate themselves from the congregation, which in turn means that they have decided to shun the congregation, which is not correct. Furthermore, a public announcement is made in the congregation when one decides to disassociate themselves from the Organization. Basically, this is notifying everyone in the congregation that the individual is no longer a brother or sister, and must be avoided in order to keep the congregation clean.
I hope you keep listening and that it hits you right between the eyes and in the heart, the atrocities these men are defending, and it sets you free.
Oh, I get it, it's people who leave the JWs who are shunning the congregation! Of course! Makes perfect sense...to absolutely no-one other than a JW talking head.
These elders know that people who leave are not shunning the congregation. They know their arguments don't make any sense . They are just pulling straws to defend the cruel practice of shunning people who leave for conscientious reasons.
Nocturnalux it's like leaving your job in supermarket say Walmart and moving to a job at Tesco. Does that mean your Friends at Walmart can't talk to you anymore.
Henry Santiago the problem with that is young people are nudged into baptism. I was baptized at 16 before knowing the consequences if I ever left. My family still talks to my worldly cousins that never got baptized but not me.
I know! In cases of child molestation or rape, it's the VICTIM who's attacking the perpetrator - by telling the truth about what happened!
im so sorry that happened to you. i recommend you listen a message from watchman nee. if you agree with his writings please write back. may the Lord keep you and bless you.
1) this video should
Be mandatory for all jws and potential jw
2) I wish I could hug your honor because atleast he had some empathy for us victims
Its sad the counsel didnt know that when they anounce that person as "No longer one of Jehovahs Witnesses" the congregation has no clue if it is by disassociation or disfellowshipping nor are they supposed to know because it is decided by the Elders and not the congregation. The congregation just follows
they sound like robots, repeating the SAME thing OVER and OVER and OVER and NEVER answered any of questions.
maybe they're trying to fool then like jws by repeating again and again
HummingBirdLuvah - You're absolutely right. They're so good at avoiding the questions that they should go into politics. They'd fit right in, though they'd say the politicians are "part of the world".
its drummed into them. The local JW boss (if there is such a thing) told me that...all thier views/responses are thoroughly drummed into them.
I seriously hate these mind controlled, heartless, morons. I hope this POS WT organization reaps exactly what they've down. Put the GB and all the leaders, elders, etc, in jail for life. Seriously hate these assholes. Bastards.
robotics sheep yes
props to the judge for his patient demeanour
Absolutely so sick of Spinks saying..with respect your honour....when he does NOT respect the Commissioners of the Royal Commission at all
I was never baptized and still and yet most of them don't want to speak to me because I speak out against their religion.
As if they don't speak out against other religions...... Talk about being a hurler of stones while living in glass houses
The double standard, yes! Consider yourself blessed that you never took the dip into Satan's organization. God bless you!
Me neither but my folks are and little to do with me because of their cult. They still talk and my son goes over to their house, I occasionally spend time with them but it's like a huge wall they put up. I dream of a day they say we're through with the religion unfortunately I don't think it will happen. I'm 37 and there very old and in their 70s I'm afraid they will both die and me and my son will hardly know them. My son has been pretty much been closed off from them because they feel he is to worldly. We hardly ever talk to them now
agreed! I try to show how hypocritical it is to knock on peoples doors in hopes they will listen to how they are in a false religion bc they aren't jw, but wont listen to anyone about their own religion. No humility what so ever.
David Thompson Jesus said to repent and be baptized, so why are you not doing what Jesus commanded? your better than Jesus? even Jesus was baptized. Ahh well do whatever you want of your not going to serve Jesus, you'll be in the same place at the end of the day.
thefuture ofcoal you must not have many words to use , huh ? You’re just in here saying hateful things but offering no rebuttal or anything close to a valid response. Don’t you think we know what you’re saying when you say “ you will all be next “ ? We were all once part of your silly game where we also pretended we were God’s chosen people, for a short while we also suffered the delusion that everyone in our little club was going to live and the rest were going to die . But then we noticed a few things that didn’t add up , which led to finding out things like that NWT has been tweaked illegally over 400 times , or that they misquote reference sources constantly to make them support JW claims , in short , LYING. And then it was easy to see that anyone who uses doctored evidence to create a paradigm where they are God’s Chosen People is a DELUSIONAL NARCISSIST. You’re words don’t scare us at all . You might as well tell me Hello Kitty is coming to drown us in marshmallow sauce next Thursday. It’s that ridiculous. Wake up
The answer from my bible teacher: to punish them and to make them see the wrong that they are doing. To reprimand them for turning away from jehovah.
Basically, to instill fear and keep everyone in line.
thats what happens when "man" tries to play "God".
This is an excellent clip‼️ The judge and the Australian Royal Commission have thoroughly done their homework‼️ We all understand there's a huge difference between no longer being a member of the Organization and disowning your family and friends... Thank you for sharing this clip‼️
I just can't imagine seeing this at a congressional hearing in the US because they wouldn't be prepared like they were.
Oh, I don’t know, I sure like that lawyer… his name starts with a Z. He’s GOOOOOD TOO! God bless these guys.
Zalken?
Their dissociation Doctrine is not even biblical.... They take the scripture out of context.
The Come Up
. . . like every thing else they do!!
Sadly it is biblical teaching, even Catholics had this practice until like 1980's ! 🤷🏻♂️
@@jangounchained5279 And look at the catholic church now. Probably should have kept that practice!
ANSWER THE QUESTIONS!!!!!!!
J3551C4 83 no kidding! Ugh!
They CONSISTENTLY never answer the question.
plus.google.com/u/0/106290817897510004649/posts/RBRBSYE2RGj
They were consistent in their evasion. The judge, and the prosecutor, could not get the correct answer because the witnesses bent over backward to avoid the obvious answer, because they knew it would make them look bad. The thing is, we can all see what the real answer is, and their evasions just make them look dumb. It _is_ cruel to shun victims of sexual abuse. Shunning _is_ a cruel practice in general which only extreme fringe groups practice, because that's the only way they can maintain a modicum of doctrinal purity, because their doctrines are fucked.
Do you mean Jehovah is going to strike us down for noticing the organization has severe problems? Then we're not really walking a line, are we? We've already crossed way over to the danger zone. _If_ we believed God can't take criticism.
This cult is the reason why I have such bad anxiety and an eating disorder. They took my family away from me and they’re completely brainwashed.
The greatest disappointments I experienced was with JWs. The highest form of hypocrisie I experienced with JWs. The deepest wounds and hurts I ever received was by JWs. The most slandering gossip I heard from JWs. I can go on but I rather forget and get on with my new live free from brain washing, abominations and the real truth I found in the Jewish Scriptures. Isaiah 27: 1 ... Our Heavenly Father Himself will deal with false religions.
So I just stop going, I went cold turkey on them. They called, I never answered. They came to my house several times I never answered. Soon the calls stopped and no more knocks came. Now when I see any in public they will actually talk to me. Why?, because I never wrote a letter of disassociation and I was never publicly announced in the congregation that I was no longer a witness. Now they all KNOW that I quit! But yet they still talk to me. Now here’s the kicker... if they actually followed their Jehova, then they know they should not associate with me. But because they never announced me (they being the ones that run the organization) the members will still talk to me.. so this shows they follow man and not god!
*Any Jehovah's Witness that claims they do not follow their leaders is lying. Sadly, they are following these men all the way to Hell.*
@@EXJehovahsWitnessesTestimoniesfacts 💯
I reported something to the JW organization when I was 16 only to receive a letter in return with a 1/2 paragraph full of scriptures they suggested I read. Is there a class action lawsuit moving forward on victims behalfs? I'm only seeing all this now.
I can tell you without a doubt that YES JWs DO blame the victim!!! I was raped when I was 20- the circuit overseer and multiple elders came to my house to 'counsel' me. They asked EXTREMELY PERSONAL questions about the actual rape itself, what I was wearing, what I had been doing, who I associated with, what RACE the rapist was, whether I had been sexually active before, details about what occurred during the actual rape, etc. The circuit overseer actually sat there and TOLD me flat out that I had ' asked for it' because I had been friends with people outside JWs organization, had gone out at night to a club and danced with 'worldly men' and I had been wearing shorts when the rape occurred. I also was friends with people outside my own race and had danced with men outside my own race,they informed me race mixing and interracial relationships were frowned upon within the JWs organization. They announced that I was no longer considered good association and I was shunned by the entire congregation. There were JWs who were even spreading rumors that I had STDs etc. This organization is NOT a religion of GOD because GOD would never do the things these people do or treat people they way they treat people!!!
I am so so sorry you went through that rharris8890 - Did your family also shun you?
How disgusting of them!😡
Those in the position to take care and shepherd the flock, FAIL! The victims are usually the ones that are pushed out especially when it comes to JW's trying to save face, as sins of this sort would bring a negative light to the organizations who tries to look so perfect in the eyes of the world. Ousting the victim is much easier. These so called, brothers/elders, stick together and will drag you, the victim, through the mud to where you want to leave! Nothing worse than not being believed by those you thought had a Godly love for you! It makes it that much more heart wrenching when you have to tell these men something so difficult and personal and painful and ends up for them to turn their backs on you in a way that rips you apart to your very core! The victim is basically a lier, spreading deceitfu and slanderous allegations AND much more!
They shunned me. I disassociated because of psychological abuse. They stole my life.
revenge can be had. people need to organize and shut them down. violently even.
@@geet77777 That would actually make it worse. When you are a JW you are an outsider to the "World". Having them become martyrs would simply strengthen their resolve and in their minds eye prove them right. "Evil has struck God's children and they steadfastly would not forsake him." is EXACTLY what they would say. Defending their ideology to their last breath. They cannot fathom anything outside of their community which is why isolation from the world is mandatory. No pesky think for yourselves or actual dialogues are allowed with non-believers.
you in longmeadow?
@@geet77777 I live in Maine.
@@maineiac114 I'm willing to take that risk... Of course they're going to spin it to make them look like victims. I don't care. Who's going to believe them??🤔
I am ashamed that I went door to door and wrote letters to people , I am ashamedthat,my fleshly Sister just cut me out of her life.i am HAPPY that I have so many family MEMBERS that are not associated with this cult. When you tell a family member, I don't want anything to do unless you come back that to me is emotional blackmail. I will not trust that group anymore. Thanks for letting me write about this. It does help.love to all out there.
Don't be ashamed, you were only doing what you thought was right at the time. I learned from a psychologist many years ago that any decisions we made in the past based on what we knew then we should never blame ourselves for, when we learn better we do better. If you haven't, just ask God to forgive you and forgive yourself because to Him even our sins are as far as the East is from the West and He remembers them no more. Love and healing to you!
"We would never want to be defensive."
(No, because they'd lose their martyr status if they are ever seen as being defensive.)
well said. they get browny points for persecution.
Nothing I hate more than people evading the real issue and repeating the same crap over and over like parrots like that man! These people make me beyond sick. 🤮
I cannot stop thanking God that my mother decided to not get baptized and rejected the whole thing after she, my older sister and I had been studying with the JWs for 4 years. Twelve years later I became a born-again Christian and learned all the things they were teaching that are wrong. However, sadly enoug my only daughter has been now a JW for 8 years. I blame the non-denominational mega-church we'd been attending, another of Satan's inventions, for disappointing her and leaving her exposed to JW co-workers who groomed her by giving her a lot of attention, treating her to dinner, etc. She's in her early 30s, very intelligent, accomplished and beautiful but single because any "available" men near her age are divorced and often disfunctional, so she's just wasting her most precious years devoting them to this evil organization which has also made her colder towards me. I keep praying for God to open her eyes before it's too late, and if anyone reading this would pray too I'd be immensely grateful and may the Lord bless you for your kindness.
I always wondered what JW's thought about this question regarding their doctrine of Jesus being Michael the Archangel -
In the book of Jude it says that Michael the Archangel dared not bring an accusation against the Devil, but said "the Lord rebuke you". So we see in this that he did not rely on his own power or own name or own position, but stepped back and relied upon the Lord to rebuke the Devil.
However Jesus in the Gospels said in His name to cast out Devils. In the temptation in the wilderness Jesus rebuked Satan, and again when Satan tried to rebuke Christ through Peter Jesus said "Get thee behind me Satan".
Furthermore, we also see Jesus forgiving sins of people (the cripple man and the woman caught in adultery), and in John 10:18 Jesus says He has power to lay down His life and raise Himself from the dead, and in John 10:27-28 Jesus says that He gives eternal life, and in John 4:26 Jesus claims to be the Messiah as prophesied of (Isaiah 9:6 called the Mighty God, Everlasting Father), and also later saying "In my name cast out devils". An angel, prophet, or holy man couldn’t do that.
So according to this, in Jude, the Devil is more powerful than Michael because Michael had to rely upon the Lord. But Jesus is able to rebuke and defeat the Devil according to the Scriptures and claimed much more and did much more than any angel or archangel could.
Can Jesus defeat the devil or not? Because Michael certainly couldn't, and according to Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine the Archangel Michael is Jesus. But according to the Bible Jesus could.
so which is right, the Bible or the Jehovah's Witnesses?
The Jehovah's Witness religion is a cult because it destroys the Sovereignty of the Lord God Jesus Christ (Isaiah 9:6 He's called the Mighty God Everlasting Father, no angel would call itself that)
Additionally the Word of God says -
Ephesians 3:9) "And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:"
John 1:1-3) "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."
Hebrews 1:2) "Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;"
Hebrews 11:3) "Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear."
Colossians 1:16) "For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:"
Christ Jesus is above all others -
Philippians 2:10-11) "That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father."
Romans 14:11) "For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God."
Isaiah 45:22-23) "Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else. I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear."
The Word made Flesh-
John 1:1-2) "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God."
John 1:14) "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."
1 John 5:7) "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one."
Additional passages -
John 8:58) "Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am." - - ("I am" in the Greek is "ego eimi" meaning Always Existing, the everlasting to everlasting one)
John 10:25-30) "Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me. But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one. -- (1John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.)"
If Christ is not God, how can He grant eternal life to His followers?
Isaiah 9:6) "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace."
Acts 20:28) "Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood." - - (literally just said right there that God purchased the church with His own blood)
Colossians 2:8-9) "Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily." - - (the entire fullness, Jehovah God is in the body of Jesus. Thus why Jesus said if you have seen me you have seen the Father, the Father in me and I in Him, and also to His disciples receive ye my Spirit and He breathed on them the Holy Spirit.)
Further Proof -
John 20:28-29) "And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed."
1 Timothy 4:10) "For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe."
1 John 5:20) "And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life."
We disassociate from the Organization‼️ We DON'T disassociate from family and friends, and we don't SHUN our families‼️
Where did they come up with that? How can you shun if you are the one being shunned first
Rich Lo Its kind of like when an employee at work gets really fed up with their job & sick & tired of their boss. So they tell their boss, *“You know what?! I QUIT!”* And then their petty, vindictive boss (Watchtower) says, *“No you don’t quit! You’re fired!.”* The governing body are nothing more than a group of pathetic, power hungry & *greedy* SOB’s. Shame on all of them.
i was shunned when i left and i left because i was asked to shun my non JW children - and that's in the UK.
Family are shunned except for strict guidelines of family business. My father was removed as an elder for refusing to shun my seriously injured brother. There are consequences for refusing to shun.
They can NEVER answer the question bcz is NOT scripture base...
I'm a follower of Christ, my grandparents are both JW's. I can tell you that they are devout but very confused people. They believe they are following God but they lack Grace in their daily walk, because they do not believe that Jesus is God, they can never obtain his Grace, which is a gift. I have actually taken the (NWT) and proved without a doubt using it, that Jesus IS God. You see the problem with people that attempt to "Translate" the greek without having any understanding of the Word of God from the Spirit, they make a lot of mistakes. Mistakes in the sense that they did not completely accomplish their agenda of Dishonoring God and the Truth is still in their book, though they are too blind, too indoctrinated, submitting their will to the Authority of man and not to the Holy Spirit which is why most of the time they remain blind. It's a sad thing what the Devil has done to these people and led them astray from the Grace of God.
*Very well said my brother. Very well said indeed.*
Liars try to blame it on the persons leaving the organization like they shun . The truth is they want to punish and hurt the person leaving, prevent them from leaving in the first place. Force them to come back. Also they do not tell the congregation why they left and they don't want them to talk to them and find out the person knows things about their organization they don't want their followers to know.
I wanted to just be inactive, but was shunned by my family anyway, and then after i was cut off from my family i sought help through support groups for former members and the elders disfellowshipped for apostasy without even ever talking with me.
*The leaders are getting desperate so they give local elders a wide latitude to disfellowship inactive members for any reason. The leaders are seeing their false religion come apart at the seams and they are throwing everything at it to keep it from ripping apart. God bless you Andy.*
Listening to this idiots I want to Vomit
They were not asking them the right question.
You can totally walk away, but if you get caught violating any rules after you become inactive, if you voice that you disagree with the organization, you get disfellowshipped. You don’t even have to show up to a meeting.
So a person who is a victim of sexual abuse who voices that they disagree with the two witness rule will get disfellowshipped.
anybody that use to be involved in this cult needs therapy.
More or less yes
thats why were all drunks now
@@geet77777 I'm in therapy AND a drunk! But in a weird way, seeing all this is kinda validating?
True.
From this type of cult, therapy doesn't all ways help. And if you go to therapy, make sure you are going to a very experienced person, not necessarily an academic. Or else it will be more damage than good.
They sound liked broken records. If they don't understand the questions(obviously that they do), then why are they the ones to be representing the WTcult? how many times does the Judge have to ask the same simple questions over and over? A two year of could answer in a none repetitive way. So technically they do SHUN people, wherever they agree or disagree, the Judge and the people around them can read between the lines of these men
It is cruel, and that is exactly why that form of punishment was chosen!!!. THEY can't even wait on Jesus to judge his own sheep. The reason they can't answer a clear yes or no is, to repeat their own stupid bad behavior is like a slap in the face. Insane! They are mentally unable to think clearly on their own. THEY call people who can stand on their own that won't hand over their mind and soul and freewill, mentally diseased. Lol they have been driven mad!
I was inactive for 18months. Got on with my life. Visited my younger brother in the congregation one day and I was taken into a back room with 2 elders, given a grilling about the current lifestyle I was leading, I got annoyed and stormed out and 2 days later I found out through my JW neighbour that I had been disfellowshipped. No judicial committee. No formal process. Lying arseholes all of them.
In the end, these elders will pay for their actions. For it is written:
"Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord." . . . . Romans 12:19
THEY actually think their sorry no HS behinds can sever you from God. THEY actually believe they are masters of your faith and you are their lowly peon subject. Lol! The vanity of Satan! Worthless men.
Danyael: wow, stunning behaviour from our loving, caring shepherds, what you describe is such compassionate behaviour hahaaa!, leaving the 99 to go after the lost sheep. Goodness me! How do they sleep at night? Sorry you were treated like that. Nobody deserves that
Jamie Angel - yeah and I was only just 19 years old when it happened. Evil cult.
It's very black and white with the JW's. You're either a firm believer and part of the organisation, attending brainwashing meetings twice a week and going door to door for multiple hours each week trying to indoctrinate others... or you have issue with any of that or don't want to do it, in which case you are completely cast astride and removed from everything you once knew. Even if you're a believer still, but refuse to go door knocking. That is the very definition of a cult.
This shunning/disfellowshipping is simply a cult tactic to scare people from leaving or not confining to JW laws (due to losing friends/family) and to force them to do active preaching work. The court should have got straight to the point on this matter. It's clearly a matter of manipulation being used by the 7 men at the top, or 'governing body' as they call it. Not only is it done to make it impossible for people to leave, essentially trapping them, but by taking away people's friends and family, they are opening up a door for them to come back in the future as they may feel they have to be part of the organisation again to see their loved ones. Again, it's all part of the cult tactics to stop people leaving, to force people into coming back and to scare the witnesses into following all the doctrine and going door knocking in fear of the consequences. This is something that needs to be addressed properly as I don't feel it is.
The JW organisation is absolutely 100% a doomsday cult. The members are brainwashed into thinking the world is about to end any moment now, and that they must go around spending all their time preaching to save as many people a possible before 'the end'. This is actually just a cult tactic to recruit more people and increase the organisation's numbers. And the organisation preys on innocent 'wordly' people who are either having problems, lonely, or have lost a loved one, who are easily indoctrinated with all this end of the world nonsense (in the hope of reconciling with their loved ones in paradise), which makes them join the organisation because they want to survive armageddon. Consequently, they JW's have been saying that it's the 'last days' for the past 100 years. So yeah, it's all a big farce. I would say the JW's are the largest and most well established cult in the world right now. Probably due to the fact that it's members pay monthly payments to the governing body which helps further the cult...
You can NOT leave this organization honorably. My wife and I chose to leave the organization. We are not disfellowshipped or disassociated ourselves yet we lost ALL our friends of over 32 years and all our family. My wife started being harassed by her family being called Satan's Daughter among other things. It got to a point that she was driven to the verge of suicide and had to be taken to the hospital and to this day hasn't been able to go back to work.
this man is avoiding the issue..i have personal experience with many issues that have caused people to leave and they are shunned...they do lose all support..many of the issues are very valid and you would have to be nuts to stay..
I chose to become inactive after a very public divorce..my ex was a presiding overseer elder and pioneer..we had been married 33 yrs..it took them three yrs after the divorce to df him and his partner..I was put in the street..he lives ina house in florida on a golf course..I rent a room..and have no support from him whatso ever
ask the reasons why people leave....I have been shunned..after I was severly abused by the congregation elders..I was told I would not be scripturally free to remarry..beause my ex said he would sue them at the time of his disfellowshipping..in the meantime witness men were asking me for naked pictures.and behaving in very vulgar manner...it was time for me to leave
What!! And they believe they are the 144000, have they actually read who these people are? First of these 144000 are undefiled men they are virgins they are from the 12 tribes of Israel jovos are not Jews, they think they are they think God has finished with the Jews,, the Bible tells us how God loves His people, those who bless Israel 🇮🇱 will be blessed, those who curse Israel 🇮🇱 will be cursed, they dont know which tribe they are from when asked,, they don't believe God is triune, yet the Bible tells us He is, they believe the Lord is created by jahovah, where do they get that from? It's certainly not biblical,, they believe only they are saved, Jesus said any one, who calls on His name and believes in Him and that He rose from the dead,, shall be saved,, not if just jovah witnesses believes shall be saved,,, its just ridiculous,,,
@@childofgodrise5832 You need to go back to scripture and stop being emotive.
Literally, Wolf's in sheep's cloak. All of them are complicit in protecting child predators.
sometimes I'm filled with such rage that I know isn't mine to feel towards them..I do feel sorry for all the lives they have ruined and families torn apart like my own. and sometimes I have to remind myself of psalms 37:13 "but the Lord laughs at the wicked, for he knows their day is coming." So they will not get away with this, I shudder to think of God's righteous judgement for these liars leading people away from him...
i wish i could hack the vids at a convention and play this
Matthew Baker Oh my lord, I laughed myself silly at the thought. Bribery to an insider? We could crowd fund the effort. Almost *all* Ex-JW's would give *something* to have that happen!
I wish you could too. I wonder if we could set up a gofundme page to pay a top hacker to do that haha. JWs deserve to know what their leaders and leaders lapdogs are saying under Oath when they believe JWs will not find out.
#MatthewBaker That would be epic to see.
Matthew Baker that is genius! 😂😂😂
Matthew Baker that sounds amazing
Ridiculous. There are droves of us who no longer attend, are not disfellowshipped, did not disassociate, and are nevertheless shunned by all or part of family and friends. Even if some choose not to shun you, as soon as you post a birthday photo, or are seen doing something worthy of judicial action, they will rush to get you in a room and disfellowship you. These guys are playing semantics, and are horrible people.
Well, nowadays, inactive JW's *are* to be treated as disassociated. Now an official policy. Kim and Mikey have a mole in the organization and, perhaps a year or so ago, received a copy of a Watchtower letter to the elders informing them of this. Before I disassociated myself, my elder warned me strongly to *never* become inactive, even while battling cancer, or I might face disfellowshipping. I mean, WTF? in 9 months of chemo, I got no calls or visits by anyone in the congregation other to have the connection information given to me so I could 'attend' the convention via computer. Lovely people.
Wendy Ellen Galecki do you have a link to a copy of this letter? I appreciate the posative Kim and Mikey have accomplished, but lately they have come off as a little unhinged to me. I would be interested in reading and interpreting the policy on my own. Im not universally shunned, its about 75% to 25%.
Vandalay Industries Not exactly. I am fairly positive it was in a video here on TH-cam. I really think it was Kim and Mikey. Search for their channel and see if is in any of the video titles. If not there, then try John Cedars channel. The creator of those videos and his name is Lloyd Evans. Sorry that I cannot be more specific.
Wendy. Thanks for the response. I am pretty sure I know the letter that you are talking about, and I would stop well short of saying there has now been a "policy change" in shunning the inactive. Its kind of the same ole same ole I'm afraid. Bad association, spoils useful habits. In other words, the people who slip through, but they would actually like to see DF'd so as not to have any influence with loved ones, should still be on your radar. Know what I mean. Not trying to srgue semantics.....but we all know when speaking to JW's, semantics are all that seemingly matter. They have no official policy to shun the inactive. They of course do encourage shunning of anyone who has chosen to leave, particular for matters of "conscience" rather than "weakness". Feel me?
Vandalay Industries I always found the GB "logic" odd. How is a person not associating with with you 'bad association'? Very odd.
They just NEVER give a STRAIGHT answer. Typical WT....I'm glad that the Judge and specially Mr Stewart did a very good homework about Watchtower. They are going down, they have to pay for all of their sins and pain the caused to so many innocent people.
Listening to this idiots I want to Vomit
We don't shun, the shunned shuns us - shift the blame! Praise Yahweh!
Should you be watching worldly videos? No you all SHUN your own flesh and blood when they wake up, how sad.
I disassociated myself once because of leaving my abusive husband. I lived in a small town with many JW's who I no longer wanted to talk too because they were taking sides, mainly his side. I also knew that if I just left the congregation , they would disfellowship me anyways on their own. They even told me they might do that. I do not know why but half who leave get away with living their lives very immorally and do not get disfellowshipped , while the other half get Disfellowshipped.
i was shunned by certain people yet I was never disfellowshipped or did I disassociate, and btw I didnt become an axe murderer either! A few weeks back I was waiting for a bus in my wheelchair with a carer, and an elder from my local congregation happened to cross the street towards us. I was smoking a cigarette at the time. He didnt say hello, he just scowled at me above his glasses. I now realise however about forgiveness and true Christianity and bear no grudge. What gets to me sometimes though is that I get scowled at whilst this fellow's reputation outside the congregation is so bad concerning his trade that the local council won't recommend his work! He's ripped off so many people, yet I'm the bad one! Ah well; lets hope the genuine ones wake up one day.
When have you ever heard of a child rape case that involved two adult witnesses?
*You know it's a cult when they say their religion is an organisation.*
One way or another they will shun anyone that disagrees with their teachings. It has happened to thousands & thousands of really good people! They come after people who have left quietly & have never said anything against the organization. You must OBEY the GB or else. These elders are trying to sugar coat it.. but all of us X's know exactly how it works ! We live it everyday!!
what do you care if we disassociate with someone who we feel is bad association. That's what taking a stand for righteousness means. Hating what God hates, even if you family. Jesus said we would lose brother, sister, father, mother for his name sake. Read the bible.
Tina Alvarado - I was a witness for 40 years.. believe me, I've read the Bible. The GB takes scriptures out of context & go beyond what is written. When you start reading the Bible WITHOUT the man made watchtower publications "interpretation" of the scriptures, then you will understand that shunning is NOT biblical ! It tears families apart & is just a tactic to be used so the members don't hear real truth!! It has caused suicides, nervous breakdowns & terrible depression. Not something God would approve of. Now on a personal note : I don't care that I'm being shunned. It's been 12 years & I consider it a "blessing" now. It keeps my former family & friends from pressuring me back into an evil organization that has caused so much damage to many good people! That being said, there are many shunned ones that are struggling & hurting deeply & I do care about them, as you should, especially if you call yourself a Christian! When the JW's hear the real truth, as my family has, & they refuse to research it, then that's when they need to be held accountable . The information is at your fingertips. I pray you start researching. Go to JWFacts.com & there's a great book called Crisis of Conscience by Ray Frans. Get yourself educated on the religion you are defending & stop reiterating what the GB says. They are NOT God. Mere men who have been given a lot of power & by no means should be listened to!! Blessings 🙏
Lonna T i
Michael Bailey - I didn't get your message.. sorry
@@tinaalvarado612 We care because you do it to children. You indoctrinate them into your cult before they're old enough to understand the consequences and then you hold their family and entire social structure to ransom if they dare question their decision. You belong to a truly despicable cult. You are a hypocrite because you know you're not supposed to be on worldly forums, yet you come here to lie and bully ex-JW's.
I wasn't a victim of child abuse when a child involved with the Jehovah's witnesses (because of mother's involvement) but I really really thank God that one Elder did tell me as a 15 yr old to never never trust any elder or let myself be led in a room alone with them. Now it all makes sense.
The problem, that becomes so obvious, is that you simply cannot apply logic and reason to this religion and the ridiculous manner in which they treat the layman. Having been in this religion at one time, I can tell you for a certain pretzel logic will always rule the day when you are a foot soldier in the JWO. So sad.
nixxkids ; Pretzel Logic ! L O L 😆
As an ex special pioneer i know the process well. Very few people choose to disassociate them selfs, what actually happens is the elders will meet with these ones generally if they have become inactive, if they suspect that you know longer wish to be part of the Congregation they will pressure you to write a letter disassociating your self.The policy behind that is to make out that you are completely shunning the congregation and its members, in other words if they dont have enough evidence to disfellowship you then they will intimidate you to have your self disfellowship, this way is to let the congregation that you no longer accept their standards or beliefs and other witnesses must be warned about you not to associate with you for fear you may undermine their faith. Shunning is generally not what these ex members want but many still fell compelled to do what these Elders say, the process is often very intimating. my advice to any JW who might be in this position is not to play ball with the elders! Dont meet with them, sometimes they will ask you to the congregation to meet with elders out of concern for you, this is just a trap! Dont go! If they ask you any questions other than what they talked about to meet with you, get up and leave.
If the average witness new what goes on with these elders and how they actually deal with people most would of left years ago! They control all information of what it members hears, its tyrannical, if i had of stayed a simple publisher i would most likely still be there, but I was a true believer until I started to see how things really are.
Thanks for the heads up.
@@rod7139 were not talking about killers or other criminals. We're talking about decent law abiding citizens being controlled by rules designed to hide the true nature of a very wicked cult
JW's membership hidden rule: ''Once You're in, There is no way out''
You must be joking. That's absurd.
@@ripcord8738Running away.
When this is all said and done, every knee in Heaven, on earth, and under the earth will bow to the name of Jesus! (Phillippians 2:9-10)
Repent, turn from your sins and turn to God by putting faith in our Lord Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins.
Im ashamed i was ever involved with this cult.
Be proud of yourself for getting out of it! That must take courage.
Why did you leave? My sister in law is caught up in this cult and so is her daughter and husband. We try to share the truth of Jesus with them but they just run to elders to be told what to think overtime they are read a bible verse that proves their teachings wrong. I know she knows the truth deep down, but they are so caught up in this cult, their jobs come from it, and I keep praying but don't know what to say or do for them to open their eyes. They almost shunned their own daughter for dating a non JW boy who ended up joining and marrying her. So sad she drug that boy into these lies.
kandykissesministry They'd rather believe a lie than the truth. Also some are afraid, it's fear based ... very afraid, of men.
kandykissesministry trying to supplant JW teachings with traditional Christian teachings is a losing battle in my opinion. Christianity is full of its own illogical hypocricy, and much of it is why JWs even exist. The trick is to find an issue close to them, that is inaccurate. For me it was blood. For my wife it was disfellowshipping. For my friend it was 1914. Driving them to the trinity, immortality of the soul, or that everyone is going to heaven......is not going anywhere.
Right now they are saying no one even has a soul-my sister-in-law is deep into JW and she wrote my husband a big long explanation of this. We are simple praying for them to see the light because no one ever listens to their family, but strangers yes. True Christianity is not hypocrisy the problem is their are so many people like the JW's who never really read the bible and know and understand Jesus-they simple follow what a man says the bible says.
So much avoiding answering and attempting to manipulate truth. Exactly how they deceive so many! Very sad!
I think a big indication as to the view of disfellowshipping vs.dissociating is the fact that the announcement from the platform is the exact same.
"First last name, is no longer one of Jehovahs Witnesses."
By default the congregation is not allowed to know which it is, and they aren't allowed to find out either because they cant talk to the person.
Guy is lying along with being annoying. He says "the congregation" decides on disfellowshipping when in fact it's just 3 guys and "the congregation" doesn't even know what the person did and isn't ever told.
The 2 witness rule Paul referred to is Jesus words found in Matt 18:15-17. It has nothing to do with what JWS use it for.
Also, in the Bible you don't need 2 witnesses to rapes and murders. God's not stupid, he knows how those evils get done ... without witnesses.
In Deut. if a woman screams during a rape but there's no one around to rescue her(no witnesses), she's done nothing wrong. Put the man to death.
The people who have left the truth as you call it.it seems to me that your having a hard time crossing back over to the real world and I pray for all of you.it will get better every day.you are strong people and you will be ok.god bless you and all that you do.
Do not forget to congratulate the "Faithful and Dscret Slave" and the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witness on the Anniversary: "100 years of service to the people of God: 1919-2019" (after the appointment of Jehovah and Jesus Christ, who never appointed anyone)!
It's odd they never said anything about this 100-year thing. I was expecting them to mention it at the AGM. I guess they know its a scam and they don't want to remind people of the silly story of their appointment yet again
Individuals who question this cult have no choice. They are out! Disfellowshipped, shunned.
“What kind of king makes Himself nothing for His people?
The Mighty one.
What kind of king lets His people humiliate and beat Him until He is unrecognizable and is still able to hold His head high?
The Merciful one.
What kind of king hangs Himself on a cross for his people?
The Righteous one.
And because He has done this for us I will make my life a living sacrifice unto Him.”
His name is above all others His name is JESUS!
But there weren't two witnesses when that kid saw his friend in a birthday party. Then snitched and got his friend re brainwashed or "counseled" for going to a socially accepted function .
-_- just an example. Dunno if this has actually happened
Notice how no scripture except for
"at the mouth of two or three witnesses"
Was looked at..
What above "love your enemies as i have loved you" where Yahushua Messiah even died for the people that whipped him and ssked Yahuwah the Father to forgive them for their lack of understanding or information..
So if I had a daughter and she decided to speak out about like my brother abusing her (it's always the victim's uncle or something) and we were all members and my daughter decides to leave the organisation because nobody saw it what will happen to my daughter and when my fellow brethren in the rest of the church come over to study are they really gonna shun my daughter in my house coz she left the church.. Am i supposed to shun my daughter in a way until she is financially stable enough leave the house and find her own place..
That's so unfair..
Yet if my brother goes and rapes my brethren daughter and she just slowly stops coming back to church every week until she doesn't come back a whole year or more she's welcome back to the church..
Is that right?
This pple are so.. I dnt know.. someone borrow me English.. I know someone in an abusive marriage verbally..sexually... Physically....and then she went to report in her congregation she was counselled on how to be loyal to the husband.. When she couldn't bear the pains she ran away with her child.. Waited for 4 years thinking he would change and come back but he never did.. Meanwhile she was an active member in the organisation ,
At a point she needed to move on
remarried to someone non JW she was disfellowshiped. While the ex husband wasnt.. She cryed her eyes out.. For been disfellowshipped.. It makes no sence cause its a society and an organisation as its often called nothing spiritual.. Songs made by them..no other christain can sing..that disgusting..please this society should be bound..because they are leading pple to hell everyday.
What the judge said is true “ lots do disassociate because they can no longer be apart of something that caused so much pain in their life... as a consequence they loose their whole support system and they are looked upon as weak and bad association. And are SHUNNED!! The two members keep side stepping the question. And when they said a person can choose to be inactive “that’s false” I tried to be inactive. I didn’t believe anymore and my now ex husband started insisting I couldn’t be trusted and that I was cheating on him!!! He then decided to move out with our adopted daughter and asked for a scriptural divorce “ don’t leave me in limbo that’s not fair” where his words. So in the end I was disfellowshipped for infidelity. I met with a pair of elders once. One was kind and the other was quite brash and rude. Never met with them again. People with in that organization are very hypocritical and sneaky.
‘I don’t think we are going to get anywhere’ i know the feeling when you show the Bible to a JW
I hope that Mr. Spinks and Mr. Obrien have woken up and understand the how bogus and cruel their religion is.
They can't and won't they've already signed their names in babies blood. They are the devils menions,they have to follow instrutions.
with all the lives they have personally destroyed, they should burn in the hell they don't believe in.
He nails it. Why should someone who chooses to leave have to lose their friends and family? Shunning is arbitrary and cruel. In a surreal twist, the Society is now claiming that the person who leaves is the one doing the shunning. Talk about victim-blaming.
😢victim blaming...typical Narcissism!
Disfellowshipped vs Disassociated vs Inactive
DF - You're forced out
DA - You choose to leave and formally do so - "rejecting teachings"
IA - you gradually leave without a formal rejection
over simplifying it....but in a nutshell.
Inactive however, are treated just like the others informally. considered spiritually "weak" and a risk to others. You would most likely get approached by elders about association with such ones.
they used to say , in their own publications , that shunning was PAGAN.... well I guess that's the old old light .. new light going off and on.
Yep WT 1947
Disco light
WOW!..I'm SPEECHLESS!!..😶......FOR NOW!
These Guy are full of shit, How can they defend the society when the victim is at hurt. Men this outrageous, I'm glad I'm done with these devils.
I tried to just go away and lead my own life, the elders found out where I lived and disfellowshipped me by proxy on the assumption i was living in sin (they had no witnesses). A woman I flatted with turned out to be the disfellowshipped JW everyone talked about when I first became a JW. She was disfellowshipped/shunned for sleeping with her boyfriend. What she told me was she actually did it so her father would stop molesting her. This is what I have seen over and over with the JW org is the victim ends up being shunned more often then the guilty one. The Commission clearly sees this, be interesting if anything ever gets done about these mind control cults.
mark helm th-cam.com/video/s6YMnaP__Os/w-d-xo.html
Luckily I lived under my family’s house who knew what they were like so when I walked away they tried knocking 3 times in 1 day my family told them to do one an never heard off them again I was shunned by friends all on the basis of getting to know a non jw so I chose to walk away from if elders didn’t get a hold of me either
Wriggle room was narrowing...narrowing......even the slippery JWs couldn't move....
My elder father is just like this. Completely mindlocked.
When these people knock on your door, and you look through the peep hole, don't answer the door.
I'd like to see where they spell out this policy in print to the membership that they can be inactive and not be shunned. Where does it say that in the things the leadership tell the sheep? When is it talked about by speakers? Where is it in the information baptismal candidates must review?
3:45 A person who disassociates themselves, they, they're taking the action. Now, for whatever reason, ....they're actually taking the stand to shun the congregation." So, does this mean, if I disassociate myself, but don't "take the action to shun the congregation," I'm not going to be shunned? I can maintain my association with my family, and my family won't be penalized by the congregation for their association with me? I should call my mom and let her know! Don't worry mom, I won't shun you. And you don't have to shun me, cuz the brothers said you don't shun for disassociating.
Tried to edit my comment below but unable so I'll add to it here. I was also shunned at 16 years of she for over 30 years... lost connection with my siblings and have suffered continously over the years. Have multiple visits to psychologists over the years to prove it.....
I'm disfellowshipped and I love it lmao. I embrace it! Freedom baby!
You have to jump through hoops to get justice in this organization. The tears I've cried, the pain I felt, the fighting I did for justice- My story is not unique and is tame compared ot many, but this is very damaging and purposefully manipulative behavior to keep people in whether they are believers or not
*The Lord's wrath is worse than anything known to man. And these men will suffer for what they've done to innocents. God bless.*
Did he just say go to another congregation?.... I'm shaking I'm so mad right now.
SONG 1: Jehovah’s Attributes
Jehovah our God, exalted in might,
We at the Watchtower provide all your light.
The Governing Board standing so grand;
Forever proclaiming "In Penis We Stand"
Your heavenly throne, your truth we proclaimed.
The end of the world for years we've exclaimed.
The stupid believe us - the light does go brighter,
The feeble believe us, and their purses are lighter.
Our meat in due season, the generation has died,
Many world endings to the sheep we have cried
And now we pay millions to molested young,
The pioneers deluded as they swallow our dung.
The pathetic answer to the judges question is "to keep Jehovah's organization clean". They view victims as unclean who make such accusations, but they still had no problem with running the child (or grown up) through the wringer and threatened them behind closed doors with sanctions or disfellowshipping them if they talk. In the end, their own actions make their organization even dirtier than it was to begin with. When it is an adult who reports being molested through belated recall, this is especially what they do due to statutes of limitations. They do their best to push them out of the organization SO THAT THEY CAN SHUN THEM.
just like in other cults, being shunned after challenging or leaving or being disfellowshipped is standard procedure. If it's not somewhere made formal policy by the 'leadership,' it's an unspoken 'rule' that the congregation fall into line under the 'leadership' of the elders or whoever runs the show, esp. on doctrinal issues, that, of course, can be misinterpreted by the system, depending on what bible version they hold to.
These horrid straights above do not respond to the repeated question about people being actively shunned by family, friends and others once they decide that there's no safe haven in the group, and that they won't be heard or helped. Hence that cruelty is a lasting legacy in what occurs esp.to those abused. The shunning was not acknowledged and of course owned by these two duds. Who would ever want these two to be involved in a hot situation around abuse when they refuse to answer a simple question.
The judge made it plain, and all the creepy 'respect' talk esp. by the guy on the left is horse dung. He represents that horrid unwellness in such cults, where they just don't get what truth is, and stick to what the group upholds at the expense of those who legitimately have been hurt. That shunning then takes place is a group doctrine, but the bible plainly states that there are 4 steps that must take place before someone is put out, and on any one of the previous steps, they should ensure that fair audience is given so that the offended parties are given a fair hearing and both moral and legal steps be taken to ensure their complaints are dealt with once made factual.
They make it impossible for a person to leave without being shunned!
One of the things that pisses me off righteously in watching any part of the ARC hearing is the refusal of the Witnesses while on the stand to answer a question demanding a 'yes' or 'no' answer with a 'yes' or a 'no'. They hedge, hem and how, talk in circles and do anything to avoid simply answering the question they've been asked. The Governing Body of this ungodly organization is made of some very evil men; that evil spills down from the top all the way down to Ministerial Servants, lessening by degree with each level. Does the GB act, believing they are doing Jehovah's will, having been trained to think and act the way they do as they've risen though the ranks? Or do they *know* how evil they actually are? Trickle-down demonomics. (With a nod to President Regan)
~Ellyn~
Jehovah's Witnesses are incapable of answering the following questions. How about you?
Answer A or B:
"On her forehead was written a name, a mystery: Babylon the Great (all false religions as a whole), mother of the prostitutes (individual false religions)..."
A. All Bethel "branch" offices as a whole are the mother of individual Bethel branch offices.
B. New York Bethel is the mother of individual Bethel branch offices.
A. All people called Ellyn Galecki as a whole are the mother of individuals called Ellyn Galecki.
B. One original Ellyn Galecki is the mother of individuals called Ellyn Galecki.
A. All false religions as a whole are the mother of individual false religions.
B. One ancient false religion is the mother of individual false religions.
These elders are so ashamed to admit that shunning, no matter of a victim or others, is miserable. It is a very harsh social punishment that can draw someone to mental diseases through solitude and helplessness. And they failed to tell the Commission why this punishment is necessary: The JW hope one day the shunned will turn around, BEGGING the organisation to reassociate with them. Being one who comprehended and accepted this social arrangement, I feel ashamed to have preached these rules to others, and very upset learning the news in Australia.
*@ Sean Tsoi - My dear brother I also look back on the some of the teachings I preached and cannot comprehend what I was thinking. The reason why is because we had that dark veil over our eyes (2 Cor. 4:4). God bless.*
Are these the guys that drink the expensive whisky like Anthony Morris?,oh and the mansions of 8 million dollars?....
Thankyou to the man questioning elders
This so called religion nearly destroyed my family. My parents fell for this cult when my parents were in a terrible spot in their lives. My father was into drugs and heavy drinking. I guess it saved him in that aspect, he quit. But at a cost! As a 6 year old child our lives changed drastically! No longer did I get to go to mass with my grandmother, or celebrate Christmas or my birthday, play with friends or even my cousins anymore. As I got older I didn't get to participate in any school activities, I wanted to be a cheerleader or a dancer. Going to college was out of the question! This was all considered 'worldly'. I remember knocking on doors, and praying that no one I knew from school would answer the door. I rebelled big time! I'd usually get caught because the other JW kids in my class would snitch on me. I eventually left my parents house, I had just barely turned 17. My parents pretty much shunned me for a year and a half. It wasn't until I decided to try and end my life that my parents came to my side. They were starting to see things differently. My father was a Elder in the congregation, so that was difficult in itself. Now almost 30 years later my parents have apologized for putting my siblings and I through that. It's hard to accept the apology sometimes because I feel I was robbed of a life that I wanted to have.
*I'm so sorry that you experienced all of that. I did as well growing up so I can definitely understand. I hope you have found peace and happiness in your life today and are living fully. Are your parents still witnesses? God bless.*
There is hardly ever a time where there is a witness to sexual abuse. Pedophiles are very careful to get children in situations where they are alone. This idea of needing a witness is purely a way to ignore sexual abuse.
This is interesting. Thanks for posting. It made me wonder what the Bible actually said.
I Cor 5 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
2 John "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
For he that bids him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
In the Greco-Roman world a traveling philosopher or religious teacher was a familiar phenomenon. Christian teachers also traveled and relied on local believers for support and hospitality. (Providing lodging for heretics was unacceptable.)
I was just wondering how that compares with what someone can be disfellowshipped for.
Blood and blood transfusions (There were no blood transfusions even possible in Bible times.)
Smoking
Gluttony
Non neutral activities (involvement in politics and the military)
Worldly celebrations such as Christmas
Military service
Ps. 144:1 " Blessed be the Lord my strength which teaches my hands to war, and my fingers to fight:
Not to mention the countless wars that the nation of Israel was involved in.
Many people in the Bible were involved in politics.
Cornelius Cornelius in the Bible was a centurion, a commander in the Italian Regiment of the Roman military.
The Ethiopian The Ethiopian eunuch mentioned in the Bible was a high court official of Candace, the queen of Ethiopia.
Joseph- governor
Nehemiah- governor
Esther- Queen
Mordecai
Moses
King David, King Solomon, etc. etc. etc.
Daniel- The satraps were the chief representatives of the king, and they most likely had charge of the various provinces of the kingdom. In Daniel 6, the satraps serving under King Darius had Daniel as one of their overseers: gotquestions.org
Joseph of Arimathea (In Luke 23:50, we learn that Joseph was actually a part of the Council, or Sanhedrin),
Nicodemus (John 3:1 also describes Nicodemus as a leader of the Jews.)
These last two men provided a burial place and 75 pounds of spices for Jesus' body. The average person would not have had that kind of money.
1 Corinthians is also specific as to who these words apply to. This advice is in regards to a person "called a brother" who "is" a wrongdoer. No indication is given that they should be avoided when they are no longer recognized as a Jehovah's Witness brother. Nor does it say to shun a person who has stopped their wrongdoing. jwfacts.org
2 John does not indicate a polite greeting is wrong. John here shows that a person is a sharer in the Antichrist's wicked works if he shows acceptance and agreement with the evildoers cause or teachings, or wishes them favor and success. jwfacts.org
As late as 1947, the Awake January 8 page 27 described the practice of excommunication as an unscriptural, pagan practice, using Hebrews 10: 26-31 to show it should be left to God to judge individuals.
I guess they got 'new light.' During the millenial reign someone has got to be in charge. I wonder how that will work out?
It is amazing that so much of what the WTS believes and teaches has no basis in Scripture, yet they go on believing it.?
II Tim. 3:13
These so called gate keepers for Watchtower shouldn't be the only ones brought up before the ARC. It should be the maker of these unbiblical rules. The Governing body should be on the hot seat too. Its funny how God himself gave us all free will, but little MEN want to take free will away. This is rediculous when they are often, more prone to deliberate sin as the average person. Power corrupts! They want to make a hundred rules while day dreaming of sex sins with the innocent. That is why Jesus drew the line and told the religious killers to cast the first stone if they haven't sinned. We do not have to OBEY any finicky rules set by men, or a stupid corporation. Our God already gave us TEN Commandments. So stuff that up your golden calf and smoke it! Watchtower demons.
Faye Lewis Christmas is not "wordly", except to people who are programmed by this cult.
+Bill 777 Your right, we believe as many who do their research, X-mad is a pagan holiday. Along with Halloween, Easter, st.Patrick's day...do the research, God hates idolaters.
In 1 Cor 5, the word "associate" is better translated as "mix with" (so that we may more easily understand). The same Greek word for "associate" is used in the Septuagint numerous times and is translated as "mix".
"Eating" is often inferred as the communal meal or the Lord's Supper, if you take in the context of the passage.
Mr spinks makes my blood pressure out of control!!!!
Just like two watchtower puppets chattering without thinking!