Thanks for posting this video - I like the tip on using the DB Browser. I was mucking around with the Live DB using just command line tools last week and DB Browser is a much better interface for looking at and modifying a database like this. For me, I created a more complex structure in my User Library for Ableton Sounds, 3rd Party Sounds, Audio Effects, & MIDI Effects, essentially creating a hierarchy of folders that makes sense to me. It allowed me to do the same thing as you - put all delays together under a hierarchy of audio effects where delays could be my go-to Ableton delays, NI delays, and other third party delays, for example. I keep Ableton Sounds separate from 3rd party Sounds mostly because I have a large collection of Ableton Packs that I've built up and I think a lot of those virtual instruments sound as good or better than the VIs from 3rd party vendors, and the Ableton virtual instruments load faster, don't create giant popup config windows like the 3rd party VIs, and I can stay focused on fewer tools to master that do the same job. Again - thanks!
Great hack. Thank you. As another Workaround to get your VST3s organized as before in the VST2 world, is to just make yourself folders within the User Library of Ableton Live and name them as you wish (just as you did with the VST2s). Place that Folder(s) in "places" of the Ableton Live browser. Now open the VST, set it as you wish to have it in default und drag/drop it to this directory. You actually saving presets this way.
I just tried: It works for real! Thanks a lot for the hack. I guess there's a downside: there will be some work to do on every update release of plugins UPDATE: Actually no: when the update swap the plugin with the same name, the hacked database remains intact
I know this is going to sound sarcastic, but anyone using ableton needs to use the search bar more often when looking for plug ins. For anything really. I recently started using it more and the effect it's had on my workflow is astronomical. It just takes a bit of unlearning what one is used to, being going through folders as apposed to searching. Great video!
Leftists love chaos. The search functionality instead of personalized order, is only an excuse to live with chaos (e.g. Win11 without start menu...). But does it really work? Example? Good luck remembering all my Subharmonic Enhancers: *bx subsynth *Leapwing RootOne *Melda MBassador *Melda Sub8assDoctor808 *MetricHaIo Thump *reFuse Lowender x64 *ToneBoosters Enhancer v1 *Voxengo LF Max Punch *Waves LoAir 5.0 5.1 *Waves LoAir 5.1 *Waves LoAir Mono *Waves LoAir Stereo *Waves Scheps Parallel Particles Mono *Waves Scheps Parallel Particles Stereo *Waves Submarine Mono *Waves Submarine Stereo And this single category may not to be confused with Bass-Exciters, Treble-Exciters, Fullrange-Exciters and Multiband-Exciters. Good luck finding anything useful with a search name...
Not sarcastic but also not necessarily as practical as you might think. The usefulness of the search seriously breaks down when you have a massive library. I have 25 years of samples, all the major suites (Native, Arturia, Korg, etc).. My search brings up hundreds of results for everything.
@@dustysmusichacking8134 I get you, but that's up to you to organise your samples properly. When you type something in the search bar it looks for that within the selected folder. Like typing EQ and selecting audio effects Vs VSTs. If you just create a good system of folders and sub folders then the search bar is still king. (IMO)
Brilliant, thank you sir ! To help the windows users, i've done it on windows 11 with DB browser for SQL Lite and the path for the database on windows is: C:\Users\username\AppData\Local\Ableton\Live Database\ Just two drawbacks, i guess that it is impossible to add sub-folders (sub vendors) and the second one is that you have to edit the DB each time you add a new plug-in, right? Thank you again sir and for the windows users: enjoy ! :-)
Thanks for explaining this trick, but it's still not good enough for me. I want a couple of layers sub-folders. Annoying that Ableton didn't provide this functionality out of the box.
TBH this video is more about giving people exposure to how easy it is to hack Live, hopefully it will inspire others to do the same.. What you'd like is not possible with this approach, they didn't program to support that.. I've tried to figure out other tricks in the browser but no luck. It's not my favorite way to do it but for VST2 & AU you have to manually add every plugin as a plugin group and then save that as a preset into your User Library.. With VST3 you can plugin groups or save a preset.. Save them into your folders, then add the top level folder as a favorite.. It will give the ability to organize things but it's a lot of work to setup, it's slower to navigate and the plugin group either has to be removed after added to the track or it will add another thing to navigate for automation..
Hi, thanks for the perfect video on this topic) However, if I downloaded a new plugin would it be automatically added to my own database file? Thanks in advance
When you add new plugins you'll need to go in and add in a new entry for it. I haven't had any issues with updates as long as I don't change the original record. I have found that I need to keep a backup of the SQlite file as Ableton wiped it out for some reason.. but restoring it (copy and replace) fixed that no problems.. This is a def a hack. I do plan on making a GUI editor to make this much easier but I've gotten caught up with a few other projects..
@@dustysmusichacking8134 Hi again!) I am planning to switch to Mac from many years of using windows. How do you organise your audio unit plugins? Do you use a "folder" method or a "database" method? Thanks in advance)
What about Ableton Live 12 Beta ? The way Live 12 shows the plugins has changed. We can now select/filter them by vendors but the way it displays it is not really clean IMO. Any idea ? Thank you.
That does fix a lot of the problems, not sure if they changed the database or not, I'll check when I 12 is released. Very good chance there is a ton new useful data to explore..
@@dustysmusichacking8134I didn't explored the new instruments but i really like the mixer in the arrangement view ! Just for the moment i don't like the way Live 12 displays the plugins sorted by vendor.
Is it possible to change the AUv2 and VST2 plugins this way as well? I was able to change the VST3's the same way you did, but the VST2's don't seem to change, and I don't see the AUv2's in the database. Not really worried about the VST2's, but if you know how to do this with AUv2's let me know please. Most of my UAD plugins are only AU versions. I'd appreciate the help.
I try to avoid VST2 as it adds a lot of instability to Ableton, so it's been a while. I'm not sure if it still works like this but I VST2 is organized through folders in the OS.. However if you move them around to subfolders it messes up the installers when you get updates.. So what I used to do is create a folder with all my categories and then use hard links to the VST plugin.. I needed to use hard links because some applications won't use soft links (the normal shortcut link). With hard links it appeared to the app as if the plugin was actually in folder and not just a link.. Can't say about AU, I only use VST3
Is this way of presenting the VST3 plugins a decision by Ableton or is part of the the Steinberg VST3 standard. Do other DAWs do it differently? I spent all afternoon making an inventory of all my VST3 plugins mainly to rediscover the ones that got lost by getting out of sight. I remember the plugin names but have to search for them on vendor name which I forgot. I noticed there was a poor relationship between folder names on disk and 'folder' names in Ableton. Live 10 is organized in another way on disk, btw. This way of presenting benefits the large existing companies and impairs the smaller and new manufacturers. Free plugins disappear behind unknown 'folder' names (sometimes revealing inexperience in this area). When it won't violate the standard I'd like to see an option in the preferences to choose a way of organizing the presentation of the VST, or maybe a toggle switch, order by vendor/order by plugin name. Adding a category might be a bit more tricky, but these should be no big challenges for company like Ableton. Or someone might make a plugin to do this ;-)
Btw I noticed this database contains all kinds of information about my drive that IMO should not be there at all (the table 'files' (I was looking for the VST2, because of one of the comments) contains names of images I downloaded, for instance).
It's Ableton's implementation. They get the metadata from the plugin and save it into the DB to recall later for populating the plugin browser window. Their implementation is pretty outdated compared to other DAWs IMO. They could easily add better search and organization functionality (from the DB side anyway).
I believe it's the stupid standard. Cakewalk Sonar did the same thing. So much improvement can be made by Ableton for VST3 organization...as well as more than 7 fucking Favorites! It's only been requested on Centercode's beta-testing platform for the last 5 fucking years. But alas, we'll have to fork out another upgrade cost to *possibly* get it.
Sorry but this isn't a step by step tutorial as much as it's a path to follow. It is intended to inspire others to hack around and see what we can learn. Versions change, people have different machines with different configurations. There is just to many unknown factors that can cause issues. If when you startup Ableton you see it rescan the plugins again it could be rebuilding the DB for some reason. Every once and a while I have to restore the records I add (I export them to a CSV and import them in).
Thanks for posting this video - I like the tip on using the DB Browser. I was mucking around with the Live DB using just command line tools last week and DB Browser is a much better interface for looking at and modifying a database like this.
For me, I created a more complex structure in my User Library for Ableton Sounds, 3rd Party Sounds, Audio Effects, & MIDI Effects, essentially creating a hierarchy of folders that makes sense to me. It allowed me to do the same thing as you - put all delays together under a hierarchy of audio effects where delays could be my go-to Ableton delays, NI delays, and other third party delays, for example.
I keep Ableton Sounds separate from 3rd party Sounds mostly because I have a large collection of Ableton Packs that I've built up and I think a lot of those virtual instruments sound as good or better than the VIs from 3rd party vendors, and the Ableton virtual instruments load faster, don't create giant popup config windows like the 3rd party VIs, and I can stay focused on fewer tools to master that do the same job.
Again - thanks!
Great hack. Thank you. As another Workaround to get your VST3s organized as before in the VST2 world, is to just make yourself folders within the User Library of Ableton Live and name them as you wish (just as you did with the VST2s). Place that Folder(s) in "places" of the Ableton Live browser. Now open the VST, set it as you wish to have it in default und drag/drop it to this directory. You actually saving presets this way.
Wow! Brilliant.
i might try this because the above video i spent a full day doing and it ruined ableton for me lol
I just tried: It works for real! Thanks a lot for the hack. I guess there's a downside: there will be some work to do on every update release of plugins
UPDATE: Actually no: when the update swap the plugin with the same name, the hacked database remains intact
This was a massive help, thanks so much!
that's insightful hepl, have to try it! thanks!
I know this is going to sound sarcastic, but anyone using ableton needs to use the search bar more often when looking for plug ins. For anything really. I recently started using it more and the effect it's had on my workflow is astronomical. It just takes a bit of unlearning what one is used to, being going through folders as apposed to searching. Great video!
Leftists love chaos. The search functionality instead of personalized order, is only an excuse to live with chaos (e.g. Win11 without start menu...). But does it really work? Example? Good luck remembering all my Subharmonic Enhancers:
*bx subsynth
*Leapwing RootOne
*Melda MBassador
*Melda Sub8assDoctor808
*MetricHaIo Thump
*reFuse Lowender x64
*ToneBoosters Enhancer v1
*Voxengo LF Max Punch
*Waves LoAir 5.0 5.1
*Waves LoAir 5.1
*Waves LoAir Mono
*Waves LoAir Stereo
*Waves Scheps Parallel Particles Mono
*Waves Scheps Parallel Particles Stereo
*Waves Submarine Mono
*Waves Submarine Stereo
And this single category may not to be confused with Bass-Exciters, Treble-Exciters, Fullrange-Exciters and Multiband-Exciters.
Good luck finding anything useful with a search name...
Not sarcastic but also not necessarily as practical as you might think. The usefulness of the search seriously breaks down when you have a massive library. I have 25 years of samples, all the major suites (Native, Arturia, Korg, etc).. My search brings up hundreds of results for everything.
@@dustysmusichacking8134 I get you, but that's up to you to organise your samples properly.
When you type something in the search bar it looks for that within the selected folder. Like typing EQ and selecting audio effects Vs VSTs.
If you just create a good system of folders and sub folders then the search bar is still king. (IMO)
Thanks you so much! Easy peazy. Now I just have to sort 100 plug ins. lol
Brilliant, thank you sir !
To help the windows users, i've done it on windows 11 with DB browser for SQL Lite and the path for the database on windows is: C:\Users\username\AppData\Local\Ableton\Live Database\
Just two drawbacks, i guess that it is impossible to add sub-folders (sub vendors) and the second one is that you have to edit the DB each time you add a new plug-in, right?
Thank you again sir and for the windows users: enjoy ! :-)
Legend
Thanks!
Thanks for explaining this trick, but it's still not good enough for me. I want a couple of layers sub-folders. Annoying that Ableton didn't provide this functionality out of the box.
TBH this video is more about giving people exposure to how easy it is to hack Live, hopefully it will inspire others to do the same..
What you'd like is not possible with this approach, they didn't program to support that.. I've tried to figure out other tricks in the browser but no luck.
It's not my favorite way to do it but for VST2 & AU you have to manually add every plugin as a plugin group and then save that as a preset into your User Library.. With VST3 you can plugin groups or save a preset.. Save them into your folders, then add the top level folder as a favorite..
It will give the ability to organize things but it's a lot of work to setup, it's slower to navigate and the plugin group either has to be removed after added to the track or it will add another thing to navigate for automation..
for windows the database is C:\Users\{username}\AppData\Local\Ableton\Live Database
Ace!
Hi, thanks for the perfect video on this topic)
However, if I downloaded a new plugin would it be automatically added to my own database file?
Thanks in advance
When you add new plugins you'll need to go in and add in a new entry for it. I haven't had any issues with updates as long as I don't change the original record. I have found that I need to keep a backup of the SQlite file as Ableton wiped it out for some reason.. but restoring it (copy and replace) fixed that no problems.. This is a def a hack.
I do plan on making a GUI editor to make this much easier but I've gotten caught up with a few other projects..
Hey, thanks so much for the tip)
Good luck with your projects!
@@dustysmusichacking8134 Hi again!)
I am planning to switch to Mac from many years of using windows. How do you organise your audio unit plugins? Do you use a "folder" method or a "database" method?
Thanks in advance)
What about Ableton Live 12 Beta ?
The way Live 12 shows the plugins has changed.
We can now select/filter them by vendors but the way it displays it is not really clean IMO.
Any idea ?
Thank you.
That does fix a lot of the problems, not sure if they changed the database or not, I'll check when I 12 is released. Very good chance there is a ton new useful data to explore..
@@dustysmusichacking8134I didn't explored the new instruments but i really like the mixer in the arrangement view !
Just for the moment i don't like the way Live 12 displays the plugins sorted by vendor.
🏆
It would be awesome to make Ableton display favourited / tagged search results at the top of the list.. Is that entirely impossible?
Is it possible to change the AUv2 and VST2 plugins this way as well? I was able to change the VST3's the same way you did, but the VST2's don't seem to change, and I don't see the AUv2's in the database. Not really worried about the VST2's, but if you know how to do this with AUv2's let me know please. Most of my UAD plugins are only AU versions. I'd appreciate the help.
I try to avoid VST2 as it adds a lot of instability to Ableton, so it's been a while. I'm not sure if it still works like this but I VST2 is organized through folders in the OS.. However if you move them around to subfolders it messes up the installers when you get updates.. So what I used to do is create a folder with all my categories and then use hard links to the VST plugin.. I needed to use hard links because some applications won't use soft links (the normal shortcut link). With hard links it appeared to the app as if the plugin was actually in folder and not just a link..
Can't say about AU, I only use VST3
How about AU / Component?
Is this way of presenting the VST3 plugins a decision by Ableton or is part of the the Steinberg VST3 standard. Do other DAWs do it differently? I spent all afternoon making an inventory of all my VST3 plugins mainly to rediscover the ones that got lost by getting out of sight. I remember the plugin names but have to search for them on vendor name which I forgot. I noticed there was a poor relationship between folder names on disk and 'folder' names in Ableton. Live 10 is organized in another way on disk, btw. This way of presenting benefits the large existing companies and impairs the smaller and new manufacturers. Free plugins disappear behind unknown 'folder' names (sometimes revealing inexperience in this area). When it won't violate the standard I'd like to see an option in the preferences to choose a way of organizing the presentation of the VST, or maybe a toggle switch, order by vendor/order by plugin name. Adding a category might be a bit more tricky, but these should be no big challenges for company like Ableton. Or someone might make a plugin to do this ;-)
Btw I noticed this database contains all kinds of information about my drive that IMO should not be there at all (the table 'files' (I was looking for the VST2, because of one of the comments) contains names of images I downloaded, for instance).
It's Ableton's implementation. They get the metadata from the plugin and save it into the DB to recall later for populating the plugin browser window. Their implementation is pretty outdated compared to other DAWs IMO. They could easily add better search and organization functionality (from the DB side anyway).
I believe it's the stupid standard. Cakewalk Sonar did the same thing. So much improvement can be made by Ableton for VST3 organization...as well as more than 7 fucking Favorites! It's only been requested on Centercode's beta-testing platform for the last 5 fucking years. But alas, we'll have to fork out another upgrade cost to *possibly* get it.
Damn it's just plain not working for me, followed directions to a T, same application, I'm on M2
Sorry but this isn't a step by step tutorial as much as it's a path to follow. It is intended to inspire others to hack around and see what we can learn.
Versions change, people have different machines with different configurations. There is just to many unknown factors that can cause issues.
If when you startup Ableton you see it rescan the plugins again it could be rebuilding the DB for some reason. Every once and a while I have to restore the records I add (I export them to a CSV and import them in).
some day developers maybe add plugin list like steinberg did in cubase
They are too full of themselves to do it, should've been done years. Ableton really pisses me off. Cubase is so good
My database file is 6.49 GB