I think it's one of those moments that shows that although Bill is a formidable survivalist, engineer, farmer, hunter, and cook, that does not mean he's good at fighting. He clearly wished he was, but I think his eagerness to protect his partner and home got in the way of using sound tactics. It doesn't seem that he's ever been in combat before, so he doesn't have much, if any, experience to go off of.
Frank actually distracts him by yelling, thus his man gets shot. Frank should have stayed in bed and let Bill do what he does best. Babe are you coming back to bed? Bam! Shot in center mass. Deerrrp!
What I like about this scene is before Frank even wakes up to the threat Bill is already out there rifle in hand. It’s great character building because not only does it show how sharp of a survivalist Bill is but the fact that he chose not to wake up Frank to take care of it solo shows he doesn’t want to worry Frank or risk him getting hurt in a firefight.
Well Frank is a nice guy. But he is an useless person for an apocalypse if bill didn’t take him in chances are Frank dies on his way to the Boston QZ since at that point he by himself.
I think what people don’t understand is that bill was confident that he can shoot the raiders in a open space without cover because he thought he had a good fence/traps but instead he got hurt. Now if you see maybe the next time skip that’s why he has cars covering the fence now
Why do you think people don’t understand that? Or is that just your way of segueing into being able to get people to listen to you talk about something?
I saw someone else comment this and I like it as an idea. Bill wasn’t in the house when the raiders set off the traps, instead he was likely already outside with his rifle doing anything from some night hunting to checking the perimeter for infected, when the raiders set off the traps he’s caught off guard and possibly even panics firing back at the raiders who aren’t on fire. I say this because if Bill was in the house he would have known that he had time to get to the bunker to get a better gun, he also would have sent Frank to hide down there, and he would have know it was raiders because of his cameras. Just an idea
Even IF Bill was already outside when the traps were being set off, it was raining and dark. BIll KNOWS for a fact that his traps and the fence will hold back the raiders while he runs for cover. ANY cover.
I explain this away as Bill spotted a deer near the compound on his monitors and quickly grabbed his rifle to go out and hunt it for the fresh meat. Look how he’s equipped. Hunting rifle, knife on hip, and his trusty old hunting hat on even though it’s night. Anyone who hunts should recognise that look. However, he was unaware that the deer was there because it had been spooked by the encroaching Raiders. Bill was then caught out as he was about to exit the main gate. With the defensive measures taking down most of the raiders Bill was focusing his fire on the few that posed an immediate threat before he could retreat to cover. I mean, if someone is raising their gun to shoot you it’s not an effective strategy to immediately seek cover. You eliminate the primary threat or threats, then seek cover, otherwise they’d just shoot you easily as you ran across the open ground. We’ve seen that Bill is an extremely poor runner. He’d probably have been fine if Frank hadn’t distracted him before he took out that last guy. Anyway, that’s my view. I mean, we’ve already seen that Bill goes out geared for war if he suspects there’s a true threat. Think of the scene where Bill meet Frank where Bill is well armed and extremely wary. I just feel it highlights that Bill had got a bit complacent after years of no true threats to the compound. I don’t feel it’s poor writing like others on this comment section.
Is it ever mentioned if Bill has training or ever even had to shoot at people like this? He seems very capable in setting up his compound (probably an engineer of some sort) and deep in the prepper/survivalist mentality but that doesn't mean he did any shooting/self defense training that would help him here. He has shown many times he is more willing to let people in or go (Frank and Joel) rather then kill them in the show. I expect he was really out of his element in this scene and didn't know what he was doing when it came to fighting people and figured he could just sit back and pick them off. Smart? No. But I expect a lot of people would do dumb things like this.
Nah bro no one is that dumb to go in the middle of street to shoot everyone unless adrenaline kicks in, maybe that's why, l think its more dumb Frank didnt cover fire Bill
I like this scene because it reminds us that no matter how safe Bill and Frank's town might seem, they're still living in a post-apocalyptic world. You almost forghet because of the comfort that they're liviing in. They've got a clean home, warm running water, fresh food and clean clothes. But Joel was obviously absolutely right earlier when he warned Bill that raiders would come, and they almost killed Bill.
I think this is Accurate bill might know how to build all the traps in the world and how to "Survive" but he's never been in actual combat or has any actual combat experience against REAL people the only thing he's probably shot and killed at this point were clickers and infected and his ego and lack of combat experience in a actual firefight throw in some adrenaline shows Loud and clear here as he doesn't take cover and uses a rifle that he probably normally used on infected thinking it would do the job just the same.
That's..... Actually the best explanation for this( besides it being a Segway for the next scene and to show how they care for each other). He would be more familiar with the bolt rifle then a AK or M18. True he really did have some combat training he would be much more weary of ppl
You make a good point, on what earth would Bill go and pay a guy to get a gun license and tactical training? That would just alert the illuminati of how trained he is.
In fairness aswell, realism aside, its much more narratively compelling to see a lone man standing against a great enemy, then lying behind sandbags, particularly if you're going to do a dramatic reveal. Which I think they nailed well.
It's really warming how, Bill was so resistant to becoming friends with or even trusting Joel and Tess, and denies it right to the end in his note, but this here shows how much he trusts them and unwittingly cares about them.
We all realize this is happens at least 7 years after the outbreak, if not 10. Bill has been dulled to what actual combat even is. He has settled down to quiet life in his compound living with Frank. When the buzzers went off he likely was walking out to see what was approaching not knowing it was finally raiders. He gets stuck in the middle of the street realizing there is a threat. He doesn't know how many there are, he probably thinks he has the upper hand. Long range rifle vs what appears to be shotguns and hand guns. He ultimately gets shot when he is distracted by Frank. I don't consider this a flaw or bad writing. I consider it a very real possibility from a man who has been in near isolation for 7-10 years, and is likely "cocky" of his abilities. Look at how he reacted when Joel told him his fence had maybe a year left on it. He doesn't think anything of anyone that isn't him ( but eventually Frank). Also look at his complete change after this in the time jump, he is an accepting man vs one that forges his own destiny.
Bullshit. Aside from the fact that this is a bastardized version of Bill and Frank, you don’t just lose your combat training. You get rusty. You get slow and you lose your cadence but you don’t suddenly start doing borderline retarded things like stand out in the open with a deer rifle during a raid. Especially if you’re a seasoned prepper/survivalist like Bill.
I love how Frank is the one that needs protecting. No toxic masculinity or expectation that he should just be able to take care of himself. Some people are built for survival & some aren't, regardless of gender. It's also just so sweet how Bill & Joel are hard asses, but that's how they show care.
That made this episode so powerful for me, Frank saves Bill so many times by accepting him and teaching him that even life is the apocalypse is a life that can still be enjoyed. And without Bill, it wouldn't all be possible. They are truly saving each other and complementing sides in the other that's lacking.
@@tyasbank yeah, but tbh this episode sucked from the perspective of the series. Give them their own show but this episode had nothing to do with anything at all.
@@mr.doctorcaptain1124Did you skip the scene with the letter? Bill & Frank’s story is a direct parallel to Joel’s. Bill learned to choose love over survival, and encouraged Joel to do the same. This directly plays into the choices Joel makes in the final episode.
I love how they came exactly like Joel predicted too. I really wished we had more relationship building between Bill and Joel but I think these versions are so similar which bills note is going to be a big trigger for Joel at the end.
A soldier? Me and my friends always run for cover when we shot at each other with BB guns, and we were 8 years old. The writing in this show is straight up bad.
It's scenes like this that prove shows like this need an expert to explain why it's a bad idea to stand in the middle of the road in a bright white shirt when in a shootout. And Frank grabbed a little 32 acp pistol, great for Ellie and her small hands but come man
I was just getting ready to comment asking why Bill decided not to take ANY sort of cover. Thank you for seeing this weird decision-making plot hole by someone were shown for the entirety of the episode to be a survivalist
@@Ashbrash1998 Bill has a triangular American flag on his mantle. Those only go to retirees or survivors of retirees which are awarded at the funeral. Point being, he was either a veteran or had a direct family member who was.
Well, he's been safe & sound for a very long time, might have underestimated the threat or overestimated himself...or just grabbed the one he had nearby, rather than lose time getting down into the basement.
Plus he didn’t need to get close to them, just pick out those that stood out, he didn’t need to go all out (he could risk destroying the fence, which did all the work he needed anyway)
I love how the raiders are self-defeated by the traps, just absolutely decimated. He may not have even needed to be out there with how well the traps were BBQ'ing those guys lol.
Bill built a fortified town, traps, had hot water, gas, good amount of food and alcohol. Large amounts of weapons and ammo, he was the epitome of a survivalist and yet the man stood in the center of the street, with no cover just begging to be shot. The writers did him dirty.
Beside the lousy firing position, this ep highlights Bill's greatest mistake which most fans do not realize: the important of creating a community in the apocalypse. I mean if Bill has more people in his neighborhood, he could have survived the gunshot since he would receive help from other people quickly not just Frank and if anyone of them is doctor, his chance of survival would be increased even more. Furthermore, by having tons of people, bandits would least likely to attack since more people mean more manpower to guard the place from threat. The series shows that bandits are unwilling to attack a large communities
Bill used to be a national parks ranger and manager of a towns parks and recreations services when the apocolypse came his ex wife became a raider warlady and sent her men to claim her ex husband
You know. With the music after Bill said “He’ll take care of you…” I genuinely thought he died. And I was in shocked. But no it’s fine for now. Dam, this scene made Bill badass, him standing in the middle of the road , no cover, nothing to be protected. Bill is the best
Why do they always just have people standing in the center of an open area during firefights? I get it for the Raiders since there is no cover except the vehicle but Bill had a rifle and several houses to snipe from. Kinda stupid tbh.
the biggest plot twist was this scene, cause normally you watch these shows and one person doesnt make it, its always a cliche except his time they suberveted our expectations and they both made it to the very end
I always loved this scene. I know a lot of arm chair quarterbacks in the comments are pointing out the error of Bills ways and I can totally see that thinking but it's still a great scene. It was totally in line with what I would think Bill would do in that situation. I loved their storyline so much.
In my opinion this was the one bad part about this episode, just didn’t seem intense enough. Something that could’ve made this scene better was probably bill actually taking cover or even a raider that got past the traps and snuck up behind Frank when he was treating Bill’s wounds and Frank having to fight him off
That's really good dude. And maybe bill is activiating all his traps one button /lever at a time. With bullets tearing the surroundings apart. A grenade trap here, a flying spear trap over there. Just anything to beat them back.
Some people critique that this was apparently the only time this settlement was ever attacked, but my headcanon is that they mounted all the raiders bodies on spikes a la Vlad the Impaler and that warded off any further attacks. And that got the message across that you do not mess with this place. A bit grim, but hey it's the apocalypse
Bill had a rifle capable of hitting targets at long distances accurately and the defence advantage... WHY WAS HE OUT IN THE OPEN IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET?!
If Bill is gonna do that crazy stand off out in the open with those raiders, he mind as well get closer to them, effectively spraying them with the Uzi like they were cockroaches. 😎
The writers of this should have consulted with real firearms and tactical experts. This is so silly on so many levels. Bill was a prepper and owns multiple rifles yet stands in the middle of the road with a bolt action hunting rifle. A good semi auto rifle and shooting behind cover as well as a good escape plan would have increased his chances of survival. The writers are children.
@@GANJØ808 The least the writers can is portray the action scenes with some degree of reality. 70% of the audience who has either military or firearm knowledge looks at this guy with a bolt gun and firing with no cover and HBO lose's that portion of viewers. Especially since he was portrayed as a prepper type guy. The walking dead managed to do it. If you had any experience and knowledge with firearms and basic defense tactics you would laugh to. This scenario is what you would do if you wanted to die. claymore mines would have been far more effective than the silly Nat gas booby trap.
@@rayc.8555 ya it’s pretty stupid that he was standing out in the open, but it’s not this egregious error that ruins everything that you make it out to be. Just make up a headcanon reason and move on with your life. Maybe the rifle was the closest to bill when the attack started, and maybe he just went out in the open for those few seconds frank saw him since he thought the raiders were almost finished, which is the mistake that gets him shot in the 10 years they had survived up to that point. It’s really easy to just brush off a little nitpick like that, doesn’t excuse there not being an explanation, but something that small won’t terminate a large chunk of their viewer base lmao
Shows he actually failed to plan or think in how he fought standing in the open in the middle of the street. Unless he secretly just wanted it to be over.
I just wanna note; Bill has an entire wall of firearms. Including.. an FAL. And of all the weapons he chooses to fight with, it’s the crappy bolt action rifle instead of the semi automatic battle rifle built for that very purpose. Bill deserved what he got.
In the beginning when he steps out of his house with a gas mask, he not only doesn't check from his windows to see if the streets are empty but continues to walk out into the open with a shotgun. In reality, dude should have a gun in every room so he can quickly grab it
@@Excalibur01 Yeah like; They did such a good job with Bill; And then they did this scene and just filled every single thought with 'He really that dumb?' lol
I mean, the moment the flamethrowers lights up, I'd tell my guys to just pack it up and go xD It's like the bad guys from Home Alone that keeps on trying despite being outmatched right away :P
Why would a guy who prepared for this kind of exact scenario just stand out in the middle of his yard with no cover? Doesn't make any sense. Anyone with half a brain would have constructed an armoured look-out post on the roof to get the high ground and field of view/fire against any attacking force. You can then pick 'em off at your leisure whilst they're busy dealing with the fire and electric fence etc.........
For those of you who keep screaming “bad writing” because Bill is standing in the middle of the street, do you know what a writer does? I’ll give you a hint, they don’t influence where an actor stands or how a shot is framed. Screenwriters do not typically write in stage direction because that is not their job. I can accept that this scene is worth criticizing for how it was shot, it’s not entirely consistent with what we know of Bill’s intuition (though I’d counter that he’s in a heightened emotional state and more prone to irrational decisions), but spamming “bad writing” every time you want to complain literally only tells people that you don’t understand what you’re talking about 🙄
Fighting off armed raiders bent on killing you with a bolt action rifle and standing in the middle if the street in a white shirt. I could believe this, even fir a hard core prepper , if it’s taking place in New Jersey
@@alexanderwindh4830 I don’t even think it’s lazy, just a crazy oversight. They could’ve kept everything the exact same but have him behind a fence or some bushes, it wouldn’t have required anymore effort to write or film
Well, this scene takes place about 10 years after the plague hit, and Bill's combat experience since then, while extensive, has only been against zombies that are incapable of using firearms. In this moment, his instincts which were so well-honed to fighting frenzied mushroom people probably didn't translate well to fighting raiders.
no tac vest bolt action instead of AR for close combat with multiple targets standing full height, white shirt, in the middle of the open (instead of getting cover) what the actual?.. He supposed to be well-trained. Am I missing something here?
So clearly, people are going to be criticizing bill stands to be in the middle of the road and fighting off the Raiders. Or others things just to be a flaw in the logic of the scene. It’s actually very true to builds character because of his pride and aggression. He’s standing facing off Toto Toto I can see his Raiders in contempt of their arrogance to even challenge him. We can see this is true to his character, because his partner immediately takes cover and it’s calling for him. So yes, it’s probably stupid but it’s an emotional truth to his personality.
Bill would have had concealed parapets dotted around the property. One or two would have had a 50 cal at the ready. He'd keep an AR, a vest and night goggles by his bed in case he had to fight his way to the defensive positions.
This episode was fantastic, but as anyone who has ever left a Dewalt appliance out in the rain even once can tell you there is no way those grinders would still be working.
For anyone wondering why he used a bolt rifle or didn't have simple combat sense. Dude was teacupping his pistol when he met Frank. Bill in the show is more of hide and endure survivalist as apart to his seek and destroy, schizophrenic game self.
I wonder why bill was using a bolt action rifle, maybe he was going to do some night hunting for deer. But then the raiders came I would think if he was not hunting then he would have been using an automatic rifle.
My theory is that I believe Bill was tired that is why he left the list the keys and the information about Joel. That's why he stood out during the middle of the street with a bolt-action just seeing how many kapop off before they ended his life, I believe he was just tired.
Good scene, but completely unrealistic from the perspective of Bill’s response. This guy is a survivalist….he wouldn’t be standing out in the open without cover and he CERTAINLY would not be engaging the attackers with a bolt action rifle. They show his armory in the beginning, and he had multiple AR platforms. The director blew it here.
A scope on a hunting rifle does little good at nigh, even when lit up by flames. Bill had all these AR with High capaicy mags, and his weapon of choice is a bolt action rifle? Spray and pray would have been a better choice at a target rich environment with a lit up back ground.
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The only bad thing in this episode was watching Bill trying to fight the raiders while standing in the middle of the street without cover
Incredibly stupid. And pretty lame action considering length of episode
Hey, at-least it’s game-accurate.
@@TimmyStreams But the game is a _cover-shooter_
I think it's one of those moments that shows that although Bill is a formidable survivalist, engineer, farmer, hunter, and cook, that does not mean he's good at fighting. He clearly wished he was, but I think his eagerness to protect his partner and home got in the way of using sound tactics. It doesn't seem that he's ever been in combat before, so he doesn't have much, if any, experience to go off of.
@@cbir4830 yeah that’s true but I think it’s common sense to not stand out in the open while people are shooting at you. Bills way smarter than that.
It gets me how Bill know Joels a caring person and would trust him to protect Frank
Men like us have a job to do!
They were the same person, cold to the world and survivalists that’s why he knew Joel would
@@mcsquilliams7044 God help anyone that gets in our way!
It’s not about caring. It’s about being a protector, and being willing and able to do absolutely anything to protect another person if necessary.
@@mcsquilliams7044 WAKE UP BELL
Dude loaded his gat and went out there to get his man, badass.
He stands by his man. 🦅
Frank actually distracts him by yelling, thus his man gets shot. Frank should have stayed in bed and let Bill do what he does best. Babe are you coming back to bed? Bam! Shot in center mass. Deerrrp!
Hell yeah!
Whos mans is this ?
@@Basedlocationbill's man
The way these 2 men were able to fill their lives with activities and even friends/associates was so beautiful. It was almost like paradise.
They did fill each other every now and then❤
They won the post-apocalypse. They not only survived, they lived.
Bill standing out in the open completely exposed to gunfire has to be one of the stupidest things in this episode.
Yeah...He's got an entire house full of windows to take cover in? Lazy writing.
Just because Bill knows how to survive doesn't mean he's combat trained
He’s a survivalist not an ex military
Lol what about the guy doing a figure 8 while on fire
Just a bolt action too not even a ar15 or something.
What I like about this scene is before Frank even wakes up to the threat Bill is already out there rifle in hand. It’s great character building because not only does it show how sharp of a survivalist Bill is but the fact that he chose not to wake up Frank to take care of it solo shows he doesn’t want to worry Frank or risk him getting hurt in a firefight.
Sharp not. Neurotic yes.
Such a sharp survivalist, standing in the middle of the street during a gunfight
I like to think the reason he went out in the street to fight them is to draw attention away from the house. Away from Frank.
Well Frank is a nice guy. But he is an useless person for an apocalypse if bill didn’t take him in chances are Frank dies on his way to the Boston QZ since at that point he by himself.
@@wavyjay_nyc he seemed pretty knowledgeable on medical info, washing his hands with PGA and disinfecting the wound.
I think what people don’t understand is that bill was confident that he can shoot the raiders in a open space without cover because he thought he had a good fence/traps but instead he got hurt. Now if you see maybe the next time skip that’s why he has cars covering the fence now
How exactly did he move the cars and put them on top of one another in a pile like that? There was only him and his boyfriend.
@@muhammadsagifshahab5334 Probably commandeered a tractor or a bulldozer.
Cope.
@@muhammadsagifshahab5334 He lifted them all with his pinky, duh.
Why do you think people don’t understand that? Or is that just your way of segueing into being able to get people to listen to you talk about something?
I saw someone else comment this and I like it as an idea. Bill wasn’t in the house when the raiders set off the traps, instead he was likely already outside with his rifle doing anything from some night hunting to checking the perimeter for infected, when the raiders set off the traps he’s caught off guard and possibly even panics firing back at the raiders who aren’t on fire. I say this because if Bill was in the house he would have known that he had time to get to the bunker to get a better gun, he also would have sent Frank to hide down there, and he would have know it was raiders because of his cameras. Just an idea
Even IF Bill was already outside when the traps were being set off, it was raining and dark. BIll KNOWS for a fact that his traps and the fence will hold back the raiders while he runs for cover. ANY cover.
@@Excalibur01yes but in an apocalypse, someone should always be on guard, no matter what defenses you have
@@J_V0706 that has nothing to do with what I said
I explain this away as Bill spotted a deer near the compound on his monitors and quickly grabbed his rifle to go out and hunt it for the fresh meat. Look how he’s equipped. Hunting rifle, knife on hip, and his trusty old hunting hat on even though it’s night. Anyone who hunts should recognise that look. However, he was unaware that the deer was there because it had been spooked by the encroaching Raiders. Bill was then caught out as he was about to exit the main gate. With the defensive measures taking down most of the raiders Bill was focusing his fire on the few that posed an immediate threat before he could retreat to cover. I mean, if someone is raising their gun to shoot you it’s not an effective strategy to immediately seek cover. You eliminate the primary threat or threats, then seek cover, otherwise they’d just shoot you easily as you ran across the open ground. We’ve seen that Bill is an extremely poor runner. He’d probably have been fine if Frank hadn’t distracted him before he took out that last guy. Anyway, that’s my view. I mean, we’ve already seen that Bill goes out geared for war if he suspects there’s a true threat. Think of the scene where Bill meet Frank where Bill is well armed and extremely wary. I just feel it highlights that Bill had got a bit complacent after years of no true threats to the compound. I don’t feel it’s poor writing like others on this comment section.
I completely agree
I’m not sure if I’m supposed to take this serious or not.
@@Dustyphoto915 It’s just my thoughts on the matter. You’re welcome to disagree.
I was wondering why Bill didn't take cover, but I can see what you mean now
You put more thought into this than the writers did
Is it ever mentioned if Bill has training or ever even had to shoot at people like this? He seems very capable in setting up his compound (probably an engineer of some sort) and deep in the prepper/survivalist mentality but that doesn't mean he did any shooting/self defense training that would help him here. He has shown many times he is more willing to let people in or go (Frank and Joel) rather then kill them in the show. I expect he was really out of his element in this scene and didn't know what he was doing when it came to fighting people and figured he could just sit back and pick them off. Smart? No. But I expect a lot of people would do dumb things like this.
Idk I doubt anyone would be dumb enough to do that, even if you’ve never held a gun in your life. He could’ve took cover behind anything
Nah bro no one is that dumb to go in the middle of street to shoot everyone unless adrenaline kicks in, maybe that's why, l think its more dumb Frank didnt cover fire Bill
I doubt it, I saw it more as a adrenaline rush, he wasent thinking clearly and wanted to protect his home and frank
@David Calderón Gomez you’d think he’d set up some kind of snipers nest in church or something too
It's simply called bad writing for plot device.
I like this scene because it reminds us that no matter how safe Bill and Frank's town might seem, they're still living in a post-apocalyptic world. You almost forghet because of the comfort that they're liviing in. They've got a clean home, warm running water, fresh food and clean clothes. But Joel was obviously absolutely right earlier when he warned Bill that raiders would come, and they almost killed Bill.
I think this is Accurate bill might know how to build all the traps in the world and how to "Survive" but he's never been in actual combat or has any actual combat experience against REAL people the only thing he's probably shot and killed at this point were clickers and infected and his ego and lack of combat experience in a actual firefight throw in some adrenaline shows Loud and clear here as he doesn't take cover and uses a rifle that he probably normally used on infected thinking it would do the job just the same.
That's..... Actually the best explanation for this( besides it being a Segway for the next scene and to show how they care for each other). He would be more familiar with the bolt rifle then a AK or M18. True he really did have some combat training he would be much more weary of ppl
You make a good point, on what earth would Bill go and pay a guy to get a gun license and tactical training? That would just alert the illuminati of how trained he is.
In fairness aswell, realism aside, its much more narratively compelling to see a lone man standing against a great enemy, then lying behind sandbags, particularly if you're going to do a dramatic reveal. Which I think they nailed well.
When frank heard them gunshots it sounded like a war outside
Bill was a one man army
He shoulda never stood out in the open though
@@ell3655 that's fair
All I say is he was in the moment
@@ell3655 man thought he was the MC
Another example of bad writing.
@@tommyblade8093 BECAUSE HE WAS
It's really warming how, Bill was so resistant to becoming friends with or even trusting Joel and Tess, and denies it right to the end in his note, but this here shows how much he trusts them and unwittingly cares about them.
We all realize this is happens at least 7 years after the outbreak, if not 10. Bill has been dulled to what actual combat even is. He has settled down to quiet life in his compound living with Frank. When the buzzers went off he likely was walking out to see what was approaching not knowing it was finally raiders. He gets stuck in the middle of the street realizing there is a threat. He doesn't know how many there are, he probably thinks he has the upper hand. Long range rifle vs what appears to be shotguns and hand guns. He ultimately gets shot when he is distracted by Frank. I don't consider this a flaw or bad writing. I consider it a very real possibility from a man who has been in near isolation for 7-10 years, and is likely "cocky" of his abilities. Look at how he reacted when Joel told him his fence had maybe a year left on it. He doesn't think anything of anyone that isn't him ( but eventually Frank). Also look at his complete change after this in the time jump, he is an accepting man vs one that forges his own destiny.
Bullshit. Aside from the fact that this is a bastardized version of Bill and Frank, you don’t just lose your combat training. You get rusty. You get slow and you lose your cadence but you don’t suddenly start doing borderline retarded things like stand out in the open with a deer rifle during a raid. Especially if you’re a seasoned prepper/survivalist like Bill.
“Quiet life” only in the show. In the game there were infected EVERYWHERE
Sir I've got your medical results. I'm afraid you are suffering from copium overdose.
Me and my friends always ran for cover when we shot at each other with BB guns, and we were 8 years old.
The writing in this show is straight up bad.
Bad writing. I knew the moment he went toward him that THATS the moment he gets shot. It was so obvious that it should not have been written.
I love how Frank is the one that needs protecting. No toxic masculinity or expectation that he should just be able to take care of himself. Some people are built for survival & some aren't, regardless of gender. It's also just so sweet how Bill & Joel are hard asses, but that's how they show care.
That made this episode so powerful for me, Frank saves Bill so many times by accepting him and teaching him that even life is the apocalypse is a life that can still be enjoyed. And without Bill, it wouldn't all be possible. They are truly saving each other and complementing sides in the other that's lacking.
@@tyasbank agreed
@@tyasbank yeah, but tbh this episode sucked from the perspective of the series.
Give them their own show but this episode had nothing to do with anything at all.
@@mr.doctorcaptain1124Did you skip the scene with the letter? Bill & Frank’s story is a direct parallel to Joel’s. Bill learned to choose love over survival, and encouraged Joel to do the same. This directly plays into the choices Joel makes in the final episode.
That's the stupidest comment ive ever read
I love how they came exactly like Joel predicted too. I really wished we had more relationship building between Bill and Joel but I think these versions are so similar which bills note is going to be a big trigger for Joel at the end.
Joel knows because he used to do it
Big difference in being a survivor and a soldier
A soldier? Me and my friends always run for cover when we shot at each other with BB guns, and we were 8 years old.
The writing in this show is straight up bad.
@@Pedro_Le_Chef Not bad writing, he wanted to get as clear a shot on them as possible.
It's scenes like this that prove shows like this need an expert to explain why it's a bad idea to stand in the middle of the road in a bright white shirt when in a shootout.
And Frank grabbed a little 32 acp pistol, great for Ellie and her small hands but come man
Well that’s why bill got shot lol
I don’t think you need an expert to explain that 😅
I was just getting ready to comment asking why Bill decided not to take ANY sort of cover. Thank you for seeing this weird decision-making plot hole by someone were shown for the entirety of the episode to be a survivalist
the writers never consulted a real survivalist. they would have attacked from the top windows.
Nobody who's ever been shot at asks what caliber it was.
Explain to me why the hell Bill would fire a scoped rifle from wide out in the open. He was practically begging to get shot.
Because then he never would of realised joel was a good guy obvs 🙄
Plot armor
@@crazybiscut clearly it didn't work
@@crazybiscutUh, he got shot tho???
He probably could have fired from top floor window with clear sight of the fence. But as you know, plot armor usually wins out 🤣
survival skills : 10
combat skills : -10
sense of humor : 8
Bill is giving Frank survival tips while he thinks he is dying and Frank doesnt even rlly listen, just wants to keep him talking so he doesnt pass out
I love how he's just like "yeah the gas and the fence will kill the rest, we're good."
Right? Like they'll just suicide charge the fence😂
this is one of those moments where joel can say to bill that" i told you so"
Hard to believe a trained individual like Bill would not fire from cover.
He is not trained, he is just a madman with a gun, thats why he go shot
Trained by who though? Bill to me seems like a guy who wouldn't go the legal route of training or a license from the government
Trained? He maybe played some COD, that's probably it.
@@Ashbrash1998 Bill has a triangular American flag on his mantle. Those only go to retirees or survivors of retirees which are awarded at the funeral. Point being, he was either a veteran or had a direct family member who was.
Trained from who?
Hard to think anyone wouldn't shoot from covers
Entire armory in his basement and he picks the boomer deer hunting rifle? lmao HBO never change.
Well, he's been safe & sound for a very long time, might have underestimated the threat or overestimated himself...or just grabbed the one he had nearby, rather than lose time getting down into the basement.
For all you know he thought it was one or two infected
Boomer deer hunting rifle? Jesus, you're a f***ing meme.
Plus he didn’t need to get close to them, just pick out those that stood out, he didn’t need to go all out (he could risk destroying the fence, which did all the work he needed anyway)
Well can't have him using an AR because Hollywood wants those banned and theyre scary black rifles that kill kids...
I love how the raiders are self-defeated by the traps, just absolutely decimated. He may not have even needed to be out there with how well the traps were BBQ'ing those guys lol.
Well yeah when you walk into the fire and then stand there flailing around while the ground is 2 inches of water, you get BBQ'd.
Bill built a fortified town, traps, had hot water, gas, good amount of food and alcohol. Large amounts of weapons and ammo, he was the epitome of a survivalist and yet the man stood in the center of the street, with no cover just begging to be shot. The writers did him dirty.
Frank just knows how to turn situations around - he is a beacon of light.
Someone mentioned him as a "bipedal golden retriever" haha. I get that.
Beside the lousy firing position, this ep highlights Bill's greatest mistake which most fans do not realize: the important of creating a community in the apocalypse. I mean if Bill has more people in his neighborhood, he could have survived the gunshot since he would receive help from other people quickly not just Frank and if anyone of them is doctor, his chance of survival would be increased even more. Furthermore, by having tons of people, bandits would least likely to attack since more people mean more manpower to guard the place from threat. The series shows that bandits are unwilling to attack a large communities
I just realized that Bill got injured in the same area as Joel did later, when Ellie took care of him.
Bill could’ve been snipping them from his roof or from one of his windows but he wanted to stand on in the street like an idiot
I like how when he was getting his gun frank was walking like how you do when you sneak in the game
"get inside! While I just stand here in the middle of the street as a really easy target especially as im overweight"
Bill used to be a national parks ranger and manager of a towns parks and recreations services when the apocolypse came his ex wife became a raider warlady and sent her men to claim her ex husband
It’s wholesome to see Bill mention Joel to watch over his partner, Frank. Shows how much he knew and respected him
2:00 Robert Baratheon, is that you?
You know. With the music after Bill said “He’ll take care of you…” I genuinely thought he died. And I was in shocked. But no it’s fine for now. Dam, this scene made Bill badass, him standing in the middle of the road , no cover, nothing to be protected. Bill is the best
Why do they always just have people standing in the center of an open area during firefights? I get it for the Raiders since there is no cover except the vehicle but Bill had a rifle and several houses to snipe from. Kinda stupid tbh.
the biggest plot twist was this scene, cause normally you watch these shows and one person doesnt make it, its always a cliche
except his time they suberveted our expectations and they both made it to the very end
I always loved this scene. I know a lot of arm chair quarterbacks in the comments are pointing out the error of Bills ways and I can totally see that thinking but it's still a great scene. It was totally in line with what I would think Bill would do in that situation. I loved their storyline so much.
1:48 stop at this,you see rick grimes 🤣
Whoa so true
911 during apocalypse..
"Call Joel..!"
Those fence flamethrowers was so badass .
1:46
"I'm just gonna stay angry, I find that relaxes me"
He has cover everywhere and a scope. He coulda been perched in his bedroom window.
Couldn’t believe they survived that night.
In my opinion this was the one bad part about this episode, just didn’t seem intense enough. Something that could’ve made this scene better was probably bill actually taking cover or even a raider that got past the traps and snuck up behind Frank when he was treating Bill’s wounds and Frank having to fight him off
That's really good dude. And maybe bill is activiating all his traps one button /lever at a time. With bullets tearing the surroundings apart.
A grenade trap here, a flying spear trap over there. Just anything to beat them back.
Hurry this scene up we need to show people more how these two are in love. Quickly! Now! It's the most important thing right now.
@@CallingAllMadMen what did you want to see?
@Cmon find my name I wanted to see better choices being made.
@@CallingAllMadMen like?
home alone a whole town sounds like the perfect way to survive a zombie apocalypse
has upstairs, scoped rifle, multi barrier defense, wtf...needless death.
Some people critique that this was apparently the only time this settlement was ever attacked, but my headcanon is that they mounted all the raiders bodies on spikes a la Vlad the Impaler and that warded off any further attacks. And that got the message across that you do not mess with this place. A bit grim, but hey it's the apocalypse
Bill had a rifle capable of hitting targets at long distances accurately and the defence advantage...
WHY WAS HE OUT IN THE OPEN IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET?!
It's like people are somehow just now realizing this shows writing is beyond mediocre
Bill had a whole Fallout defense system.
In the morning, Frank checked the fences, reset the traps, collected weapons and tools from the raiders.
Ive got to love the fact bill was going to let frank just sleep through this
Awe man he’s like call joel you can’t be here alone. Actually made tear up cuz he knows how will help frank if he dies.
Bolt action? An Uzi 9mm would’ve given him an upper hand in this situation...
Probably saving it for a more rainy day
Not from that distance, and you wouldn’t choose to get close when heavily outnumbered. He should’ve been sniping out of alternating windows.
Or firing the rifle from cover and not in the middle of the street.
If Bill is gonna do that crazy stand off out in the open with those raiders, he mind as well get closer to them, effectively spraying them with the Uzi like they were cockroaches. 😎
I don't think the writers of the show or the game have ever handled firearms.
The writers of this should have consulted with real firearms and tactical experts. This is so silly on so many levels. Bill was a prepper and owns multiple rifles yet stands in the middle of the road with a bolt action hunting rifle. A good semi auto rifle and shooting behind cover as well as a good escape plan would have increased his chances of survival. The writers are children.
Lol this is a drama, relax. Just because they escalate the stakes for the sake of the plot doesn't make the writers "children".
@@GANJØ808 nah bro him not being in cover was just stupid man can easily pop outta cover and get a kill
@@GANJØ808 The least the writers can is portray the action scenes with some degree of reality. 70% of the audience who has either military or firearm knowledge looks at this guy with a bolt gun and firing with no cover and HBO lose's that portion of viewers. Especially since he was portrayed as a prepper type guy. The walking dead managed to do it. If you had any experience and knowledge with firearms and basic defense tactics you would laugh to. This scenario is what you would do if you wanted to die. claymore mines would have been far more effective than the silly Nat gas booby trap.
@@rayc.8555 ya it’s pretty stupid that he was standing out in the open, but it’s not this egregious error that ruins everything that you make it out to be. Just make up a headcanon reason and move on with your life. Maybe the rifle was the closest to bill when the attack started, and maybe he just went out in the open for those few seconds frank saw him since he thought the raiders were almost finished, which is the mistake that gets him shot in the 10 years they had survived up to that point. It’s really easy to just brush off a little nitpick like that, doesn’t excuse there not being an explanation, but something that small won’t terminate a large chunk of their viewer base lmao
Exactly
Shows he actually failed to plan or think in how he fought standing in the open in the middle of the street. Unless he secretly just wanted it to be over.
If that was the case, the show pooorly showed it
A man that smart, cautious, and prepared would not stand in the wide open like that. There's no way.
Bill got hurt because Frank distracted him! Couldn’t keep up the attack.
I just wanna note; Bill has an entire wall of firearms. Including.. an FAL. And of all the weapons he chooses to fight with, it’s the crappy bolt action rifle instead of the semi automatic battle rifle built for that very purpose.
Bill deserved what he got.
In the beginning when he steps out of his house with a gas mask, he not only doesn't check from his windows to see if the streets are empty but continues to walk out into the open with a shotgun. In reality, dude should have a gun in every room so he can quickly grab it
@@Excalibur01 Yeah like; They did such a good job with Bill; And then they did this scene and just filled every single thought with 'He really that dumb?' lol
I mean, the moment the flamethrowers lights up, I'd tell my guys to just pack it up and go xD
It's like the bad guys from Home Alone that keeps on trying despite being outmatched right away :P
Why would a guy who prepared for this kind of exact scenario just stand out in the middle of his yard with no cover? Doesn't make any sense.
Anyone with half a brain would have constructed an armoured look-out post on the roof to get the high ground and field of view/fire against any attacking force. You can then pick 'em off at your leisure whilst they're busy dealing with the fire and electric fence etc.........
We dont need your help 😂😂😂 "Call joel!" 😂😂😂
For those of you who keep screaming “bad writing” because Bill is standing in the middle of the street, do you know what a writer does? I’ll give you a hint, they don’t influence where an actor stands or how a shot is framed. Screenwriters do not typically write in stage direction because that is not their job.
I can accept that this scene is worth criticizing for how it was shot, it’s not entirely consistent with what we know of Bill’s intuition (though I’d counter that he’s in a heightened emotional state and more prone to irrational decisions), but spamming “bad writing” every time you want to complain literally only tells people that you don’t understand what you’re talking about 🙄
Bill needed some night vision goggles and a vantage point on top of his roof.
Fighting off armed raiders bent on killing you with a bolt action rifle and standing in the middle if the street in a white shirt. I could believe this, even fir a hard core prepper , if it’s taking place in New Jersey
Incredibly lazy writing
@@alexanderwindh4830 I don’t even think it’s lazy, just a crazy oversight. They could’ve kept everything the exact same but have him behind a fence or some bushes, it wouldn’t have required anymore effort to write or film
never leave cover or concealment
This would never happen to video game Bill
You’d think he would have had time to find body armor or make some..
I love how everyone had the same reaction when watching this scene: “Why aren’t you sniping from your house or from behind cover”
Because it's true.
Well, this scene takes place about 10 years after the plague hit, and Bill's combat experience since then, while extensive, has only been against zombies that are incapable of using firearms. In this moment, his instincts which were so well-honed to fighting frenzied mushroom people probably didn't translate well to fighting raiders.
Thats one hell of a security system.
no tac vest
bolt action instead of AR for close combat with multiple targets
standing full height, white shirt, in the middle of the open (instead of getting cover)
what the actual?.. He supposed to be well-trained.
Am I missing something here?
Yes, you're not taking into account dramatic effect..
i also thought of that until i saw the really big bright flame throwers in front of them
The nit picking here is insane
its a reference to his ingame AI
Liberal HBO writers/execs would no way show an evil scary black AR15 on TV. Boomer bolt action much safer and audience friendly.
Full armory and the man grabs a bolt gun....
Do you think Joel told the raiders about the location? Win, win. If Bill and Frank are gone he gets his cut. If not Bill buys the supplies from him.
Bill standing off and firing at the enemy is above board.
He had an AK 47 on his gun wall, and he went outside with a hunting rifle...
So clearly, people are going to be criticizing bill stands to be in the middle of the road and fighting off the Raiders. Or others things just to be a flaw in the logic of the scene. It’s actually very true to builds character because of his pride and aggression. He’s standing facing off Toto Toto I can see his Raiders in contempt of their arrogance to even challenge him. We can see this is true to his character, because his partner immediately takes cover and it’s calling for him. So yes, it’s probably stupid but it’s an emotional truth to his personality.
Yeh ya know those guys that were so overly cautious they spent years prepping, only to stand out in the open when it goes down.
Bill would have had concealed parapets dotted around the property. One or two would have had a 50 cal at the ready. He'd keep an AR, a vest and night goggles by his bed in case he had to fight his way to the defensive positions.
Which episode was this?
This episode was fantastic, but as anyone who has ever left a Dewalt appliance out in the rain even once can tell you there is no way those grinders would still be working.
For anyone wondering why he used a bolt rifle or didn't have simple combat sense. Dude was teacupping his pistol when he met Frank. Bill in the show is more of hide and endure survivalist as apart to his seek and destroy, schizophrenic game self.
I wonder why bill was using a bolt action rifle, maybe he was going to do some night hunting for deer. But then the raiders came I would think if he was not hunting then he would have been using an automatic rifle.
HFS not only did he burn alive but he was also electrocuted at the same time ooooof
ron has battle rifles yet grabs a 5 shot bolty to defend his love from Tammy 2s raiders
Haha i love all the traps bill has made its like ww3 when the raiders start setting them off lol
Thst's where you keep your gun in the apocolypse
My theory is that I believe Bill was tired that is why he left the list the keys and the information about Joel. That's why he stood out during the middle of the street with a bolt-action just seeing how many kapop off before they ended his life, I believe he was just tired.
Good scene, but completely unrealistic from the perspective of Bill’s response. This guy is a survivalist….he wouldn’t be standing out in the open without cover and he CERTAINLY would not be engaging the attackers with a bolt action rifle. They show his armory in the beginning, and he had multiple AR platforms. The director blew it here.
Goddamnit Frank! The best care in a firefight is return fire!!
C’mon, Bill; the bolt-action? Really? At that range you should have gone with a semiautomatic (or even fully automatic) carbine. 😈
Frank distracted Bill. Bill got shot. Thanks Frank.
A scope on a hunting rifle does little good at nigh, even when lit up by flames. Bill had all these AR with High capaicy mags, and his weapon of choice is a bolt action rifle? Spray and pray would have been a better choice at a target rich environment with a lit up back ground.
Same with Joel. He took stuff from Bill's arsenal and only got the bolt action and not the ARs?
That’s a fitting end to Ron Swanson
Survival expert: Stand right out in the open wearing white. It's the last thing they'll expect.
Bill picks a hunting riffle instead of an assault rifle?
With all the gear he has?
nvr noticed this is the gun ellie takes