It's interesting, people go bananas over cutting edge, leading tech, ground breaking etc etc, but hey, they're building a relatively (in comparison) safe battery that fulfills a market need TODAY, that is comparable in energy to weight considering the safety of the units. AND they're MOVING PRODUCT! They're NOT abusing the environment so bad as all the MINING these cutting edge batteries are using.. I think it's GREAT, I've told all my friends to invest in BYD if at all possible (if not use a firm that holds them).. Good on you for putting the news out there for what it is!
We don’t use nitro fuels in road vehicles because it’s far too volatile. Gasoline (and diesel) are good enough. Why would batteries be any different? Keep the super-duper Ternary type for sports cars. Everyone else has more than enough with LFP.
@@LithiumBatteryGuy if you can invest in Chinese stock market purchasing the shares directly, yeah, little to no risk. But if you talking about depository shares traded in US market, then it has a pretty high risk of getting frozen or withdrawn at some point.
@@Dave5843-d9m Your analogy certainly works up to a point but Turnery batteries can certainly be safe relative to petrol, it's those spreading FUD who would have you believe they are stupidly dangerous. That said the other advantages of Lithium Iron Phosphate such as extreme longevity and relative cheapness plus abundant raw materials make it a category winner.
Personally, choosing safety for slightly less range alone is a good deal for me, not to mention, LFP batteries are cheaper... I don't know why anyone would go the opposite. Be careful, you play with non LFP EV, you could get burned, and I don't want to be a toast turkey.
@@rogerstarkey5390 im a fund manager invest in new energy area , LFP is way cheaper then LTB about 0.1-0.2 RMB /Wh = 0.014USD-0.030USD/Wh cheap. it mean in a 50 kWh just the battery cell cost will 740USD-1470USD cheapr then LTB . by the way average price of 50 kwh LTB package here in china cost about 8000 USD
I think BYD strategy here is that they have a battery that is good enough for production and to be able to meet the insane demand for EV’s for the next few years. Once that this initial demand slows they will then focus more on improving it going forward. Most everyday people just want a battery that works and that won’t explode or catch fire and get the every day usage job done at a reasonable price. This is what every OEM should be doing to solve the main problem of reducing emissions ASAP rather than making a so called ‘killer car’ or ‘better battery’.
Actually, BYD had revealed that they are developing LiMnxFe1-xPO4 battery which is a more efficient lfp battery by adding magnesium material. But it is BYD style that they will only show the finished product when it is put on production. Moreover, a new battery pattern patent that is different from blade battery has just been registered by BYD recently.
Mn is manganese, not magnesium. Several companies are working on improving the energy density of LFP batteries in different ways, sometimes called LMFP or M3P (where the 3 stands for ternary).
I think BYD is keeping their more advanced development close to the vest. Just because they don't announce everything they are working on doesn't mean it's not in the works.
The second generation blade battery is coming out later this year. It will offer 180 wh/kg at pack level. Not industry leading, but pretty good. The thing is that BYD's products are never going to sound like the greatest, but they work as expected and are safe and are cost efficient. With CTB technology, they save a lot of structural weight. So I think in practice, they are always going to be the cheapest and among the most dense LFP technologies out there. They don't need to boast about having the highest density level to get sales. They keep their mouth shut and just build stuff.
thanks Viking... you've EARNED your status as an expert in all things EV all around... and you never limited yourself to just Tesla... that turned out to be wise strategy, which makes even more sense now, credit to your Aussie perspective... cheers
I am a 10 year employee of BYD in America. I think your comments are spot on. We never beat our chest we just do what we do well. Safety is our top priority. We will always compromise battery density for safety.
Hello friend, BYD has now become the number one car company in China. In the future, if there are no accidents, they should export their cars to the United States. Do you think that at that time, they will be
There’s also the fact that, unlike Li-ion, LFP batteries can utilize their entire capacity, from 0-100% when charging. Not having to be limited to the recommended 20-80% range is a huge bonus. Depending on one’s use case, this feature alone can make up for the loss of overall density. Plus, add in it’s more compact packaging (ie. rectangle vs round), lower cost, higher safety, better reliability and longer life… seems like leading tech to my eyes. And it’s only going to get better? Sign me up.
If I remember well, this is how I get you on my list. Yes, BYD blade batteries were a marketing thing at the start, and still are, but also have obvious advantages.
@@rogerstarkey5390 Yes, but it is not odd, it can be cooling space or whatever. The air is not adding weight, it is taking space/volume. If it is used as a cooling air system, that space is smartly used as is not add weight, as in fluid cooling systems. In fact, is a better solution to control the temperature with air instead of fluids. Furthermore, the space between blades makes the structure more stable (remember why the steel H beams have thick flanges and a thin web). So the designer's job is to accommodate that volume between wheels. This is why on all EVs the wheelbase is bigger than any ICE car, ICE cars have the engine in front of the wheels, EVs do not have this limitation so wheels can be pushed forward and backward.
LFP struggles at temperatures below 5 degs C. But thermal insulate the pack and battery power can be used to keep it warm. Once it’s in use, normal discharge current will keep it warm enough.
One more disadvantage is the lowered performance in cold climate. I would still choose LFP if it was available for a 4wd Tesla. I hope it soon will be. Love how you can charge to 100% without any worries. Thank you for your hard work Sam.
That is not what is happening if we refer to Motor winter range test in 2022. Two Model 3 one with Li-ion and one with LFP batteries performed exactly the same. Maybe it’s more of the heat regulation is manage. The Electric Viking as made a video on that test.
@@jeanpaulmartin9696 I first bought a M3 Performance, sold it and bought a M3 SR+. I know for sure that the Wh per km increases dramatically with LFP during winter. In summer the SR+ is about 20-30wh more efficient than the M3 Performance, in winter, they are about the same.
U should mention the energy density of the structural battery pack with blade batteries. Not the chemistry is revolutionary but the suitable for EV form factor makes it great
Sam, Glad to hear your voice getting better. I have read that BYD Blade battery packs are a structural part of the car, with the cells as stressed members. This is state of the art tech that helps compensate for lower cell energy density. Also the cell format has a lot of surface area, making them easier to heat and cool when needed. It seems that the blade cell format is uniquely suited to LFP chemistry.
So, BYD is following the Toyota approach rather than the Mercedes approach: aiming for spectacular reliability and affordability rather than cutting edge performance. This makes their cars a better choice for a very large section of the market.
@@rogerstarkey5390 I was referring to the business strategy generally. However Toyota is developing EVs and the video mentions that Toyota has signed up for some of BYD’s blade batteries, presumably because they fit in well with Toyota’s general approach.
Sam, you did a video last year about batteries developed by a company called C4V, (The manufacturer is called IM3NY, which is majority owned by Magnis Energy). Their current battery, know as Liser, seems to resemble LFP (Lithium, Iron, Phosphate for those new to this subject). The C4V battery seems to replace the iron with "biomineralized mixed metals". This is the one that I think is a step up from LFP. Have you continued to follow this development?
I do agree with you, rather than make massive high density packs by sticking to around 50-60kwh size which gets most cars around 300-400km range is all 95% of most people need, sell them cheap and get most of the lower-middle price bracket Most people arnt buying new cars, they buy the second hand 5year old ones that are only 10k not 50k +
I agree. Supposedly Tesla is using Blade batteries for some Model Y's in Europe I believe. If so, it would be interesting to know the performance and range of these vehicles. 🤔
As with most products, there is a sweet spot where you get the best value for your money. If you go anymore premium, you pay a lot of money for small increase in performance. If you go cheaper, the performance drops significantly for not much saving in money. Most people would have no idea about the energy density of their EV. In the next few years as BYD and others ramp up production, the energy densities will most likely increase at a rapid rate. People would much rather a have long lasting, reliable EV.
But I’m tired of people saying, is that producing a battery that’s safe at high volume and having all these safety features and place is not revolutionary. A Viking, stop beating the drum. This is revolutionary. Just because it doesn’t have more rain does not mean it’s not revolutionary or that it’s more dense with energy. Energy density is not the only form of innovation. Come on man.
I don’t think this is all correct, BYD don’t talk, they do as you mentioned, so they won’t deploy a new battery tech until they have it ready. Before they introduced the Blade battery no one new much about what they were working on.
Frank Coffey is correct! BYD probably has some tricks up their sleave or maybe they will keep improving their density 3-5% at a steady pace. You are certainly correct that AT THIS MOMENT byd is not the leader in battery density. But they are number 1 in business savy. Their cars are going all over the world except america. You are correct that byd will be the number 1 in auto sales world wide by 2030. Keep up the good work! You are bringing up topics that no one else are talking about!
Byd is about practicality. They are about realism when building your dreams. That said, if you want to know what tech BYD is developing just see the patents they are registering. Being quiet doesn't mean they are doing anything about R&D.. The fact is they pour alot of their money into research and development.
In oriental philosophy, being "braggadocios" (imagine Biden tried that word!) is not a virtue, it's a shortcoming. “Hide our capabilities and bide our time” is a purer philosophy. At the end of the day, "might" speaks louder.
What's the difference between ternary battery and a pouch battery? SK, LG, CATL I'll make pouch batteries. The pouch batteries have the history of catching fire. Can you explain on a video what the difference is between a ternary and the pouch? That would be awesome! Thank you
As far as I know, ternary refers to battery chemistries where nickel, cobalt and manganese are used. Pouch is physical way of manufacturing cells. So in other words it is two different things. You could make a pouch LFP cell or an pouch NMC cell, for instance.
There are a few disadvantages of LFP batteries: 1. Energy density 2. Weight 3. Recyclability 4. Memory effect - this is why they need to be charged to 100% all the time
While i see that for an Australian there are virtually no downsides to LFP besides energy density, for us up north (Norway) there are some significant downsides that can't really be ignored and that mainly has to do with our cold climate. Rapid charging of LFP is quite a bit slower than other chemistry types even at normal summer temperatures (15-25 Celsius) in winter we might see -25 Celsius or even colder. at these temperatures LFP becomes really impractical as I believe they will not charge at all if the pack temperature drops below 0C. If you have a slower level 2 charger (2-4 Kw) you may be using almost all the energy to heat the battery before it can even accept a charge. Many people have experienced this already even with other chemistry types, typically at winter cabin where they may only have 240V 10A charging available. Typically they would see the battery heating for 8-10 hours before charging for a few hours and starting the heating cycle again
Info Potassium and Potash. It used predominantly as fertilizer and is a competitive use for potassium. The current conflict in Europe shows that the predominant producer of potash is you know who. Potassium may be in limited supply and cost is rising depending on geopolitics.
In all Li batteries, thermal management is crucial. There is a reason our modern phones are the shape they are, the flat playing card shape allows heat to dissipate easily through the sides, evening out the temperature and preventing the development of hot spots. The blade shape with a large surface area to volume ratio does the same thing albeit with some sacrifice of overall battery energy density. In contrast are the compact pouch cell LiPo flight batteries used by aero modellers (and in some pocket sized vehicle jump starters). These are volumetricallt efficient and can have spectacular energy density and power output (typically over a kilowatt from something weighing just several hundred grams). However, they are comparatively shortlived, good for just a hundred or so cycles. Occasional internal short circuits, overheating and even fire are the price of this high performance.
Excellent report, as always! 👍 In oriental philosophy, being "braggadocios" (imagine Biden tried that word!) is not a virtue, it's a shortcoming. “Hide our capabilities and bide our time” is a purer philosophy. At the end of the day, "might" speaks louder.
The only battery that truly excites me, is that of GMG Australia, who have just received production approval. The sooner it is mass manufactured for electric vehicles the better!
A Watt or kiloWatt (1000 watts) is a unit of Power, where Power is the RATE at which Energy is used (during discharging) or obtained or stored (during charging). So, Watt-hours (Wh) or kiloWatt-hours (kWh) are the units of Energy corresponding to the Watt (W) or kiloWatt (kW) units of Power. Perhaps a better way of explaining this relationship is the formula relating Power (P), Energy (E) and Time (T), where P = E/T. Likewise, E = P x T. Thus, when the unit of Power is kiloWatt (kW) and Time is given in hours (h), your corresponding unit of Energy would be kiloWatt-hour (abbreviated as kWh). I hope this helps everyone appreciate that Gravimetric or Specific ENERGY is given in units of watt-HOURS per kilogram (wh/kg), while the corresponding Gravimetric or Specific POWER would be in units of watts per kilo(gram), or w/kg.
Ilon should say in his fashion that cilindrical form factor is stupid for EV, its good for sony fotocameras but Ev need a special form factor of batteries Byd nailed that whith blade battery and a structural battery pack.
I have the BYD Dolphin, driving range 405KM, I have a psychological problem I want some help with should I feel guilty when I recharge the car many times I drive a little far to work so every 3 days I have to recharge the car I usually start charging at 100 km left on the battery. And in from what I read about the new battery blade technology in this kind of car for 2022 will not be hurt when you used fast charging Do you agree with that?
You need to understand *volumetric* density. Sodium ion ("salt") cells are light (ok gravimetric density) but *large* (volumetric density poor). Meaning they don't fit in the space available.
Depends on which technology is appropriate. You don't look for light weight construction on a tractor, you look for reliability and strength. With the blade battery my criteria for my everyday driver, Yuan Plus, is fire safety, reliability, long life and sufficient range for my needs. If I were replacing a Ferrari I'd sacrifice those requirements for light weight and rigidity. Horses for courses.
You REALLY need to understand the correct terminology. "kW/kg" isn't it. Try Wh/kg . Even if you meant "kWh/kg" you just proposed a cell with 1000 times the capacity of a typical Tesla 2170 cell. Sloppy.
Scaling batteries is most important right now so they are smart to do this. There doing good with batteries but every time they get a bev car production to 10k a month they come out with a new model. I think this is because they have not figured out how to design a car that can be mass produced at 20 k a month.
The E6 was Leased to Taxis in Quebec, doesn't do much for me over here in BC, hopefully, we get some more competition. we need price wars in Electric cars. This is the company I am kind of most excited about, I can't buy a Tesla yet.
Is the comment about no recalls true? BYD have had to recall nearly 10k cars because, according to the regulator " problems with the battery packs could cause fires". Social media posts suggest that BYD is voluntarily replacing battery packs in additional vehicles and other media posts show BYD vehicles on fire. I accept that the problem might be water ingress into the battery pack rather than an issue with the cells themselves but I doubt that owners affected will split hairs -- for them the recall is to avoid their car catching fire. I also accept that the cars affected are BYD hybrids but it still seems an exaggeration to say that BYD haven't been subject to recalls connected to their batteries.
Hi, Sam, do I have news for you.I am invitited to the first store from BYD in Amsterdam (The Netherlands) in September THIS year to see all there models who comes to my country and I will know the price, rance and models
@@brunoheggli2888 there are much more countries( dictatorships) where there will be trades with and let’s not forget Childs labour in a lot of countries and still much people buying stuff, so if you think that only China is bad, think again and let people self decide where to buy
Anyone got an idea how much the Toyota Corolla with Blade Battery (car made by BYD) will cost in Australia???? Im trying to find a way to buy a BYD car and Blade battery, without the EVDirect BS!!!
Interesting. But TH-cam is now awash with videos of BYD Hans and other BYDs fitted only with Blade batteries burning and exploding while charging or driving or parked. The Blade battery always sounded too good to be true. If its supposed safety advantage were really anywhere near what was claimed all other types of EV battery should have been banned immediately.
You think ?? Maybe the blade batteries could be making an appearance in a semi truck near you !!! You heard it here first.... LFP and LFMP could work in the 300 mile range semi and even a new 400 mile variant.... you heard it here first
You forgot to mention LFP batteries currently have poor performance in freezing weather losing as much as 30-40% of their range.. They can make more which is critical as they do not need the high grade of lithium; but lower density means higher weight for a given range; EVs were already too heavy. Weight means more CO2 to make and to move; more than cancelling out the benefit of electric motors. They need higher density.
3 years ago maybe a little longer when they put it in the Han I’m not sure you said it’s a game changer, trust me this is the only game changer in those 3 years. The next game changer will probably a be BYD battery.
I’m guessing EVs will likely last longer than ICE (all those engine and drive train problems gone), especially with long life reliable batteries. That means in 30 years of use, lots of unexpected things can happen. For example, accidents that violently short out the battery or salt spray corrosion in critical places like high current connectors or inside the battery box. A fail safe battery would enhance the reputation of such EVs and keep resale value high for decades.
Batteries are topped out for now. and maybe for forever . They need to switch to a range extender design . Cut the size of the battery by 2/3 and make E as it's going down the road.
Sam, you were late to the party! Sorry, but you are new to TH-cam. Tesla's 4680 isn't tabless it is a continuous tabbed cut and folded. The blade is LFP long pouch with a long tab.
How does BYD and their blade batteries stack up to IM3NY and C4Vs liser batteries, they seem very very similar. I found out about them through Magnis energy company ($mnsef)
It's interesting, people go bananas over cutting edge, leading tech, ground breaking etc etc, but hey, they're building a relatively (in comparison) safe battery that fulfills a market need TODAY, that is comparable in energy to weight considering the safety of the units. AND they're MOVING PRODUCT! They're NOT abusing the environment so bad as all the MINING these cutting edge batteries are using.. I think it's GREAT, I've told all my friends to invest in BYD if at all possible (if not use a firm that holds them).. Good on you for putting the news out there for what it is!
It's a chinese company so it's extremely risky in todays environment.
@@matiashamalainen4574 yeah not that risky.
We don’t use nitro fuels in road vehicles because it’s far too volatile. Gasoline (and diesel) are good enough. Why would batteries be any different? Keep the super-duper Ternary type for sports cars. Everyone else has more than enough with LFP.
@@LithiumBatteryGuy if you can invest in Chinese stock market purchasing the shares directly, yeah, little to no risk. But if you talking about depository shares traded in US market, then it has a pretty high risk of getting frozen or withdrawn at some point.
@@Dave5843-d9m Your analogy certainly works up to a point but Turnery batteries can certainly be safe relative to petrol, it's those spreading FUD who would have you believe they are stupidly dangerous. That said the other advantages of Lithium Iron Phosphate such as extreme longevity and relative cheapness plus abundant raw materials make it a category winner.
Personally, choosing safety for slightly less range alone is a good deal for me, not to mention, LFP batteries are cheaper... I don't know why anyone would go the opposite. Be careful, you play with non LFP EV, you could get burned, and I don't want to be a toast turkey.
LFP batteries are cheaper?
Really?
Per kWh?
🤔
@@rogerstarkey5390 im a fund manager invest in new energy area , LFP is way cheaper then LTB about 0.1-0.2 RMB /Wh = 0.014USD-0.030USD/Wh cheap. it mean in a 50 kWh just the battery cell cost will 740USD-1470USD cheapr then LTB . by the way average price of 50 kwh LTB package here in china cost about 8000 USD
I think BYD strategy here is that they have a battery that is good enough for production and to be able to meet the insane demand for EV’s for the next few years. Once that this initial demand slows they will then focus more on improving it going forward. Most everyday people just want a battery that works and that won’t explode or catch fire and get the every day usage job done at a reasonable price. This is what every OEM should be doing to solve the main problem of reducing emissions ASAP rather than making a so called ‘killer car’ or ‘better battery’.
Interesting to see the Model Y blade battery version coming out of Berlin.
Actually, BYD had revealed that they are developing LiMnxFe1-xPO4 battery which is a more efficient lfp battery by adding magnesium material. But it is BYD style that they will only show the finished product when it is put on production. Moreover, a new battery pattern patent that is different from blade battery has just been registered by BYD recently.
Mn is manganese, not magnesium. Several companies are working on improving the energy density of LFP batteries in different ways, sometimes called LMFP or M3P (where the 3 stands for ternary).
Ty for ur comment
I think BYD is keeping their more advanced development close to the vest. Just because they don't announce everything they are working on doesn't mean it's not in the works.
Everyone is keeping their more advanced development close to the "chest" (not "vest"😉)
Except it's often their "partners" development (ref GM)
Yes BYD put a lot into R&D
BYD Full financials can only be accessed in China. I am sure BYD are doing well
@@rogerstarkey5390 "vest" is quite funny!
@@brunoheggli2888
You're a sad individual.
The second generation blade battery is coming out later this year. It will offer 180 wh/kg at pack level. Not industry leading, but pretty good. The thing is that BYD's products are never going to sound like the greatest, but they work as expected and are safe and are cost efficient. With CTB technology, they save a lot of structural weight. So I think in practice, they are always going to be the cheapest and among the most dense LFP technologies out there. They don't need to boast about having the highest density level to get sales. They keep their mouth shut and just build stuff.
The safety by itself is revolutionary
I agree
The blade design is revolutionary itself.
So says Elon Musk
@@ianburnett4605
?
@@rogerstarkey5390 th-cam.com/video/0E_EQKzRVcc/w-d-xo.html
thanks Viking... you've EARNED your status as an expert in all things EV all around... and you never limited yourself to just Tesla... that turned out to be wise strategy, which makes even more sense now, credit to your Aussie perspective... cheers
Well, he does hype Tesla a lot since his stock portfolio consists of mostly Tesla shares.
Not an "expert'
A "reporter".
Little technical understanding.
I am a 10 year employee of BYD in America. I think your comments are spot on. We never beat our chest we just do what we do well. Safety is our top priority. We will always compromise battery density for safety.
Hello friend, BYD has now become the number one car company in China. In the future, if there are no accidents, they should export their cars to the United States. Do you think that at that time, they will be
There’s also the fact that, unlike Li-ion, LFP batteries can utilize their entire capacity, from 0-100% when charging. Not having to be limited to the recommended 20-80% range is a huge bonus. Depending on one’s use case, this feature alone can make up for the loss of overall density.
Plus, add in it’s more compact packaging (ie. rectangle vs round), lower cost, higher safety, better reliability and longer life… seems like leading tech to my eyes. And it’s only going to get better? Sign me up.
If I remember well, this is how I get you on my list. Yes, BYD blade batteries were a marketing thing at the start, and still are, but also have obvious advantages.
Have you ever noticed that every picture or diagram of a "blade" pack had a gap between every cell?
I find that odd in a structural pack?
@@rogerstarkey5390 Yes, but it is not odd, it can be cooling space or whatever. The air is not adding weight, it is taking space/volume. If it is used as a cooling air system, that space is smartly used as is not add weight, as in fluid cooling systems. In fact, is a better solution to control the temperature with air instead of fluids. Furthermore, the space between blades makes the structure more stable (remember why the steel H beams have thick flanges and a thin web). So the designer's job is to accommodate that volume between wheels. This is why on all EVs the wheelbase is bigger than any ICE car, ICE cars have the engine in front of the wheels, EVs do not have this limitation so wheels can be pushed forward and backward.
LFP struggles at temperatures below 5 degs C. But thermal insulate the pack and battery power can be used to keep it warm. Once it’s in use, normal discharge current will keep it warm enough.
Exactly, should not be charged or discharged below 0C and above 55C.
One more disadvantage is the lowered performance in cold climate. I would still choose LFP if it was available for a 4wd Tesla. I hope it soon will be. Love how you can charge to 100% without any worries. Thank you for your hard work Sam.
That is not what is happening if we refer to Motor winter range test in 2022. Two Model 3 one with Li-ion and one with LFP batteries performed exactly the same. Maybe it’s more of the heat regulation is manage. The Electric Viking as made a video on that test.
@@jeanpaulmartin9696 I first bought a M3 Performance, sold it and bought a M3 SR+. I know for sure that the Wh per km increases dramatically with LFP during winter. In summer the SR+ is about 20-30wh more efficient than the M3 Performance, in winter, they are about the same.
Make sure you schedule battery pre-heating for before you drive in the winter mornings. Makes a big difference to LFP effeciency@@heppo6
I would rather take safety over density as far as EV battery is concerned.
You could do both. Tesla Model 3 Long Range.
I'm looking forward to seeing BYD cars everywhere, not just white model 3 's
Well, it's about time *somebody* produced enough....
U should mention the energy density of the structural battery pack with blade batteries. Not the chemistry is revolutionary but the suitable for EV form factor makes it great
Should also mention that the 4680 had *all* those properties, plus *fast* manufacture in smaller factories.
Sam, Glad to hear your voice getting better. I have read that BYD Blade battery packs are a structural part of the car, with the cells as stressed members. This is state of the art tech that helps compensate for lower cell energy density. Also the cell format has a lot of surface area, making them easier to heat and cool when needed. It seems that the blade cell format is uniquely suited to LFP chemistry.
Gotta Give you Props for quality and in depth research. This is what a small time investor like me, needs
So, BYD is following the Toyota approach rather than the Mercedes approach: aiming for spectacular reliability and affordability rather than cutting edge performance. This makes their cars a better choice for a very large section of the market.
Toyota is doing that with EVs?
Or batteries?
Where?
@@rogerstarkey5390 I was referring to the business strategy generally. However Toyota is developing EVs and the video mentions that Toyota has signed up for some of BYD’s blade batteries, presumably because they fit in well with Toyota’s general approach.
No ..It's Toyota following BYD....Not the other way around..................Paul
Good news!!! When does my BYDDY stock quadruple?
Sam, you did a video last year about batteries developed by a company called C4V, (The manufacturer is called IM3NY, which is majority owned by Magnis Energy). Their current battery, know as Liser, seems to resemble LFP (Lithium, Iron, Phosphate for those new to this subject). The C4V battery seems to replace the iron with "biomineralized mixed metals". This is the one that I think is a step up from LFP. Have you continued to follow this development?
I asked almost this same question on another video wondering about IM3NY in NY
@@RM-rh3mz They just started commercial production at their N.Y. plant. They plan to ramp up to 38 GWhr in the next 7 years or so. Exciting times!
@@bryanstrom812 exciting ! 😬
BYD
We build work horses
Not race horses.
This is revolutionary battery safety already. I don't see how this doesn't count as developing "revolutionary battery tech".
I do agree with you, rather than make massive high density packs by sticking to around 50-60kwh size which gets most cars around 300-400km range is all 95% of most people need, sell them cheap and get most of the lower-middle price bracket
Most people arnt buying new cars, they buy the second hand 5year old ones that are only 10k not 50k +
I totally endorse BYD's business plan. Good enough technology efficiently mass produced to meet market demand.
I agree.
Supposedly Tesla is using Blade batteries for some Model Y's in Europe I believe. If so, it would be interesting to know the performance and range of these vehicles. 🤔
As with most products, there is a sweet spot where you get the best value for your money. If you go anymore premium, you pay a lot of money for small increase in performance. If you go cheaper, the performance drops significantly for not much saving in money. Most people would have no idea about the energy density of their EV. In the next few years as BYD and others ramp up production, the energy densities will most likely increase at a rapid rate. People would much rather a have long lasting, reliable EV.
The packaging in the blade format helps with energy density, how many cells( power) you can pack into a specific area equals good volume power density
But I’m tired of people saying, is that producing a battery that’s safe at high volume and having all these safety features and place is not revolutionary. A Viking, stop beating the drum. This is revolutionary. Just because it doesn’t have more rain does not mean it’s not revolutionary or that it’s more dense with energy. Energy density is not the only form of innovation. Come on man.
As others have also said, BYD most likely just keeps their latest tech quiet until they are ready to release.
Congrets on the 80 thousand milestone 🎉
In other word. The BYD Blade battery is not about cutting edge capacity. It is about cutting edge safety. Fire safety.
I don’t think this is all correct, BYD don’t talk, they do as you mentioned, so they won’t deploy a new battery tech until they have it ready. Before they introduced the Blade battery no one new much about what they were working on.
Another example is the CTB battery tech, nobody was talking about or new anything before they showed it in the Seal
I think safety is the most important factor tbh.
Frank Coffey is correct! BYD probably has some tricks up their sleave or maybe they will keep improving their density 3-5% at a steady pace. You are certainly correct that AT THIS MOMENT byd is not the leader in battery density. But they are number 1 in business savy. Their cars are going all over the world except america. You are correct that byd will be the number 1 in auto sales world wide by 2030. Keep up the good work! You are bringing up topics that no one else are talking about!
You just described Tesla.
Byd is about practicality. They are about realism when building your dreams. That said, if you want to know what tech BYD is developing just see the patents they are registering.
Being quiet doesn't mean they are doing anything about R&D.. The fact is they pour alot of their money into research and development.
In oriental philosophy, being "braggadocios" (imagine Biden tried that word!) is not a virtue, it's a shortcoming.
“Hide our capabilities and bide our time” is a purer philosophy. At the end of the day, "might" speaks louder.
There have been two fires in BYD Han cars, but seems unclear what was really the problem.
Do you know if BYD is coming to South Africa?
As the saying goes, "Action speaks louder than words".
If you can get past the LFP and focus on the blade you’ll figure it out
I bought one like you where is this vehicle I haven’t heard anymore
What's the difference between ternary battery and a pouch battery?
SK, LG, CATL I'll make pouch batteries. The pouch batteries have the history of catching fire.
Can you explain on a video what the difference is between a ternary and the pouch? That would be awesome! Thank you
As far as I know, ternary refers to battery chemistries where nickel, cobalt and manganese are used. Pouch is physical way of manufacturing cells. So in other words it is two different things. You could make a pouch LFP cell or an pouch NMC cell, for instance.
@@itekani
Well said.
Far too many people mixing and confusing terms without understanding what they mean or bothering to find out.
Interesting comment Sam, "humanly possible" for vehicles built by robots .thanks for your great work Sam .
Good clarification.
There are a few disadvantages of LFP batteries:
1. Energy density
2. Weight
3. Recyclability
4. Memory effect - this is why they need to be charged to 100% all the time
They don t liké cold température
While i see that for an Australian there are virtually no downsides to LFP besides energy density, for us up north (Norway) there are some significant downsides that can't really be ignored and that mainly has to do with our cold climate. Rapid charging of LFP is quite a bit slower than other chemistry types even at normal summer temperatures (15-25 Celsius) in winter we might see -25 Celsius or even colder. at these temperatures LFP becomes really impractical as I believe they will not charge at all if the pack temperature drops below 0C. If you have a slower level 2 charger (2-4 Kw) you may be using almost all the energy to heat the battery before it can even accept a charge. Many people have experienced this already even with other chemistry types, typically at winter cabin where they may only have 240V 10A charging available. Typically they would see the battery heating for 8-10 hours before charging for a few hours and starting the heating cycle again
When do we start seeing reliability specifications from the EV manufacturers?
Info Potassium and Potash. It used predominantly as fertilizer and is a competitive use for potassium. The current conflict in Europe shows that the predominant producer of potash is you know who. Potassium may be in limited supply and cost is rising depending on geopolitics.
Congrats on 80K subs, Sam! 👍🙂
So basically BYD batteries leads in all areas except energy density - that is leading technology in real world practicality.
Blade design is great and safe design
As BYD's CEO said "Safety is the utmost luxury of an EV, and that is what we are doing."
In all Li batteries, thermal management is crucial. There is a reason our modern phones are the shape they are, the flat playing card shape allows heat to dissipate easily through the sides, evening out the temperature and preventing the development of hot spots. The blade shape with a large surface area to volume ratio does the same thing albeit with some sacrifice of overall battery energy density.
In contrast are the compact pouch cell LiPo flight batteries used by aero modellers (and in some pocket sized vehicle jump starters). These are volumetricallt efficient and can have spectacular energy density and power output (typically over a kilowatt from something weighing just several hundred grams). However, they are comparatively shortlived, good for just a hundred or so cycles. Occasional internal short circuits, overheating and even fire are the price of this high performance.
Excellent report, as always! 👍
In oriental philosophy, being "braggadocios" (imagine Biden tried that word!) is not a virtue, it's a shortcoming.
“Hide our capabilities and bide our time” is a purer philosophy. At the end of the day, "might" speaks louder.
Bjorn Nyland is putting the BYD Tang through its paces.
Real world usage on many levels.
Not exactly "efficient"?
Bjorn Hyland Hell Yeah man!!
How many fist high is the car? His measurements haha.
The only battery that truly excites me, is that of GMG Australia, who have just received production approval. The sooner it is mass manufactured for electric vehicles the better!
A Watt or kiloWatt (1000 watts) is a unit of Power, where Power is the RATE at which Energy is used (during discharging) or obtained or stored (during charging). So, Watt-hours (Wh) or kiloWatt-hours (kWh) are the units of Energy corresponding to the Watt (W) or kiloWatt (kW) units of Power.
Perhaps a better way of explaining this relationship is the formula relating Power (P), Energy (E) and Time (T), where P = E/T. Likewise, E = P x T. Thus, when the unit of Power is kiloWatt (kW) and Time is given in hours (h), your corresponding unit of Energy would be kiloWatt-hour (abbreviated as kWh). I hope this helps everyone appreciate that Gravimetric or Specific ENERGY is given in units of watt-HOURS per kilogram (wh/kg), while the corresponding Gravimetric or Specific POWER would be in units of watts per kilo(gram), or w/kg.
Are those 166W/kg at the cell level or at the pack level?
Byd blade battery technology as MASSIVELY AMAZING
But if they’re humanoid robot can’t do a backflip -str8 gahbage yehehe
Can't wait 😁
Ilon should say in his fashion that cilindrical form factor is stupid for EV, its good for sony fotocameras but Ev need a special form factor of batteries Byd nailed that whith blade battery and a structural battery pack.
You haven't thought it through.
I have the BYD Dolphin, driving range 405KM, I have a psychological problem I want some help with should I feel guilty when I recharge the car many times I drive a little far to work so every 3 days I have to recharge the car I usually start charging at 100 km left on the battery. And in from what I read about the new battery blade technology in this kind of car for 2022 will not be hurt when you used fast charging Do you agree with that?
Hello, Sam. Can you make a video comparing the density of the blade batteries and the new iron phosphate (Qilin) from CATL?
You can only *really* compare what you truly know.
Nobody knows the actual data for the CATL cells yet.
Whats a turnery battery?
In 2023，the BYD's battery Product plan is 200Gwah，and in the next 2 years plan，it's still high speed increasing。
We need a video comparing byd batteries and teslas 4680. Please
This is an example of simple can be genius.
In just the last few months, numerous BYD cars with Blade batteries have started on fire!
i'm excited over the salt batteries, supposedly they'll have a slightly better energy density than LPF, so i hope BYD adopts them.
You need to understand *volumetric* density.
Sodium ion ("salt") cells are light (ok gravimetric density) but *large* (volumetric density poor).
Meaning they don't fit in the space available.
I wonder if the aliens are watching this and pissing themselves laughing. "Get yerself some element 115 boys..."
Depends on which technology is appropriate. You don't look for light weight construction on a tractor, you look for reliability and strength. With the blade battery my criteria for my everyday driver, Yuan Plus, is fire safety, reliability, long life and sufficient range for my needs. If I were replacing a Ferrari I'd sacrifice those requirements for light weight and rigidity. Horses for courses.
This was a great video.
is it prismatic or does it have zylindrical cells?
byd has a new battery in the pipeline with 270Wh/kg. byd just doesn't talk much.
You REALLY need to understand the correct terminology.
"kW/kg" isn't it.
Try Wh/kg
.
Even if you meant "kWh/kg" you just proposed a cell with 1000 times the capacity of a typical Tesla 2170 cell.
Sloppy.
Scaling batteries is most important right now so they are smart to do this. There doing good with batteries but every time they get a bev car production to 10k a month they come out with a new model. I think this is because they have not figured out how to design a car that can be mass produced at 20 k a month.
The E6 was Leased to Taxis in Quebec, doesn't do much for me over here in BC, hopefully, we get some more competition. we need price wars in Electric cars. This is the company I am kind of most excited about, I can't buy a Tesla yet.
Canadian car dealerships seem to be slowest in terms of importing Chinese EVs.
LFP emits Hydrogen in thermal runaway. Li-ion emits Oxygen in thermal runaway.
While one makes furious fires, the other explodes! 😳
Is the comment about no recalls true? BYD have had to recall nearly 10k cars because, according to the regulator " problems with the battery packs could cause fires". Social media posts suggest that BYD is voluntarily replacing battery packs in additional vehicles and other media posts show BYD vehicles on fire.
I accept that the problem might be water ingress into the battery pack rather than an issue with the cells themselves but I doubt that owners affected will split hairs -- for them the recall is to avoid their car catching fire. I also accept that the cars affected are BYD hybrids but it still seems an exaggeration to say that BYD haven't been subject to recalls connected to their batteries.
But are they LFP?
Hi, Sam, do I have news for you.I am invitited to the first store from BYD in Amsterdam (The Netherlands) in September THIS year to see all there models who comes to my country and I will know the price, rance and models
@@brunoheggli2888 what is your problem Bruno with BYD cars coming to Europe?
@@brunoheggli2888 why you think this??? Next month the first BYD models stand in the new showroom in Amsterdam, The Netherlands
@@brunoheggli2888 there are much more countries( dictatorships) where there will be trades with and let’s not forget Childs labour in a lot of countries and still much people buying stuff, so if you think that only China is bad, think again and let people self decide where to buy
@@brunoheggli2888 that is your opinion
@@brunoheggli2888 I don’t have to go on my knees as much as I would buy a Tesla!
Wondering what ANCAP rating BYD cars have..
Anyone got an idea how much the Toyota Corolla with Blade Battery (car made by BYD) will cost in Australia????
Im trying to find a way to buy a BYD car and Blade battery, without the EVDirect BS!!!
How on earth did they puncture it with a nail, and not only did it not catch fire immediately, but they still used it in a vehicle afterwards
Interesting. But TH-cam is now awash with videos of BYD Hans and other BYDs fitted only with Blade batteries burning and exploding while charging or driving or parked. The Blade battery always sounded too good to be true. If its supposed safety advantage were really anywhere near what was claimed all other types of EV battery should have been banned immediately.
It would be interesting if Sandy Munroe make a BYD EV analysis 🧐
I'd like that.......From No bullshit Munro...............Paul
You think ?? Maybe the blade batteries could be making an appearance in a semi truck near you !!! You heard it here first.... LFP and LFMP could work in the 300 mile range semi and even a new 400 mile variant.... you heard it here first
Negative....You'll hear it first from Sam...............NEVER heard of You.............Paul
And now, "we" just discovered that BYD is using forbidden substances, like Hexavalent Chromium in some vehicles. Definitely, a brand to avoid.
You forgot to mention LFP batteries currently have poor performance in freezing weather losing as much as 30-40% of their range.. They can make more which is critical as they do not need the high grade of lithium; but lower density means higher weight for a given range; EVs were already too heavy. Weight means more CO2 to make and to move; more than cancelling out the benefit of electric motors. They need higher density.
Do a video on your new cars please.
3 years ago maybe a little longer when they put it in the Han I’m not sure you said it’s a game changer, trust me this is the only game changer in those 3 years.
The next game changer will probably a be BYD battery.
dobry film
I’m guessing EVs will likely last longer than ICE (all those engine and drive train problems gone), especially with long life reliable batteries. That means in 30 years of use, lots of unexpected things can happen. For example, accidents that violently short out the battery or salt spray corrosion in critical places like high current connectors or inside the battery box. A fail safe battery would enhance the reputation of such EVs and keep resale value high for decades.
Blade battery is the best what we have right now, live with that.
BYD, BIGGEST 👍
Batteries are topped out for now. and maybe for forever . They need to switch to a range extender design . Cut the size of the battery by 2/3 and make E as it's going down the road.
right now byd batteries are what you say
Sam, you were late to the party! Sorry, but you are new to TH-cam. Tesla's 4680 isn't tabless it is a continuous tabbed cut and folded. The blade is LFP long pouch with a long tab.
You do know that the blade battery doesn't catch fire, right?
How does BYD and their blade batteries stack up to IM3NY and C4Vs liser batteries, they seem very very similar. I found out about them through Magnis energy company ($mnsef)