Are Human Beings Special? | Joshua Swamidass & Hugh Ross at Cal Poly
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ก.พ. 2018
- Joshua Swamidass and Hugh Ross offer perspectives from astrophysics and biology surrounding the question, "Are human beings special?" | Cal Poly, 2018 | Explore more at www.veritas.org.
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Hugh Ross saved my life when I was losing my faith.
When I wear my Glorified body, I want to tour this MAGNIFICENT ENVIRONMENT!
A historical tour from just before the beginning would be amazing.
Always a pleasure to listen to Dr. Hugh Ross. May God bless him.
Amen, sister!
I have been greatly helped by Dr Hugh Ross. I also have been blessed by Dr Swamidas. I don’t see why there are so many negative comments about his presentation. I don’t agree with his belief in evolution, but his sincere expression of faith in Jesus Christ was inspiring.
I think, like anything, the answer is in the middle. Naturalistic evolutionary dogma is forced in the vast majority of universities. So we shouldn’t be surprised by Swamidas’ opinions, especially since he started as a Young Earth Creationist, which likely led him to want to jump ship and go the other way (a common human reactionary behavior). I do personally believe that evolution is partially true, but it is missing direction and inspiration that is covered up by an over reliance on natural selection to stand in place of a mind. That is why I and many other Christians I know stand in the middle ground of Intelligent Design. That is, at least, my opinion after incessant reading and searching.
Excellent and gentlemanly discussion. Thank you, Dr. Ross and Dr. Swamidass.
Just discovered Hugh Ross . Awesome insights !
Me too! Can't get enough!
Thank you Dr. Hugh Ross for your explanation so rich in matter relating to Our God and all of His Creation. I really like your videos and admire your work. May God bless you.
I have been blessed and have a clearer understanding in the bible and Genesis.
From my similar experienceS, this was the worst time for Dr Swamidass to present anything, right after his father's sudden death. I know he will do much better a year later.
You have the characteristic of compassion.
Appreciate both men:s great learning. I perceive the difference is said in 2 Cor 2:10 " these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit. For the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God." It is the "spiritual person" discerns and judges all things (1 Cor 2:15) . Bro Hugh Ross has it.
i think you misinterpret what that verse is meant for
I found it interesting how Ross had reasonable, scientific, and biblical answers for every question whereas Swamidass’s responses usually started with, “I don’t know” or “I can’t buy it.” I mean no disrespect to Joshua but I just think that his position would be more acceptable if he had answers to the questions asked. Another scientist, like Ross, who actually has answers and brilliantly fit these puzzle pieces together is Stephen Meyer. In fact, his work (books and lectures) dismantle theistic evolution IMHO. That all being the case, I wonder if many Christians in our culture have too strong a desire to be loved and accepted by the world?
No we don't have such desire. We only desire for the world to love and accept God.
Christian people know that they're going to be hated by the world and they usually go against world standards, they are warned about it in scripture. Even though, they keep preaching what they claim to be truth even if it costs their lives. We see it happened with apostles who had horrible deaths, they believed so deeply the gospel that they died for it. Not only apostles other church fathers and apologists like Justin Martyr and Clement of Rome were also executed because of their convictions.
WHEN you eventually read the Bible you will realize that you actually don't want to be accepted by this finite world.
Steven Meyer is excellent.
I’m so happy Joshua is on our side he has to let other people speak and stop interrupting so much
The human heart and blood vessels are so fine tuned with even an exact pace. The heart and blood vessels had to be exact at the beginning of birth to have ways to live. The entire circulory system has to be exact at the very beginning.
I newly found this scientist & indeed he has the purpose of being.. Godbless sir🙏💒🙏
Professional and authentic presentation..
Awesome talk. I love open kind Chrisman debates. It is possible to be family and still disagree. Thank you both
God is not in the universe, the universe is in God.
both are forms of pantheism and probably aren't true.
no....
Great stuff
I just turn into Penny. My brain can't grasp astro speak. He is extremely brilliant, Hugh that is.
Ross conveys confidence and the other gentleman is repetitively defensive in a deflective manner. He keeps trying to state his credentials
Because he is internally struggling. Please have compassion. He is a biologist. You must realize the tremendous pressure the life sciences community places on individuals to affirm a materialistic/naturalistic worldview. He is struggling with this because this is how he was taught. It is no different from a Young Earth Creationist viewpoint, which he came from ironically and likely struggled with that too. We are human and struggling is a part of life.
So Josh believes evolution he believes God created evolution I like Hugh Ross approach he shows you things in nature that strongly suggest that had to be a God behind it all I am astonished when I listen to Hugh Ross
No where in the scientific theory of evolution does it suggest God had to be behind it. In fact, it goes against that claim.
@@twokidsmovies that’s not what Earth is the only planet we know that has plate Titanic the improbable invent of the moon forming through a collision they gave us a great Ice Age put the earth and its axis rotation give us a short night so photosynthesis could take place nature did not make chemicals becomelife that’s impossible the Cambrian explosion animal suddenly appear in with no time to evolve with no ancestors and then the mechanism is a freaking joke for evolution it’s mathematically impossible
@@MMAGUY13 I dont think english is your first language so I dont really understand what you are saying here, but I gather you think the evolution of the Earth and life is impossible, but provide no evidence that God is any more probable. If you think that it is more probably that life was instantaneously created by a magic man in the sky then I am sorry but you are severely mistaken.
@@twokidsmoviesYou are proving a persistent stereotype. Please quit with the thinly-veiled attacks. Respect others’ intellect.
Maybe it's just me, but Ross's ideas seem head and shoulders above Swamidass's.
They are facing very different questions. Both are very important. Dr. Ross gives incredible insight into how the universe proclaims the most High. Dr. Swamidass not only was dealing with grief, his field of study is more irritating to Christians IE condescending evolution arguments ad nosium. If you dont know, Dr Lane Craig is working on the 'historical adam' and makes the claim thats evolution doesnt affect his theology. And has had conversations with Dr Swamidass.
Dr. Ross has great depth of discernment and balances that gift with humility. Trying to put God in a box can and will give you a head ache! We are limited!!
Biologically speaking, human beings are no exception
In what regard
Dr. Nathaniel Jeanson has written a book called “Traced” about the genetic Y chromosome being traced back to Noah, and the growth of earth’s population. This is worth exploring.
Amazing end statement from Ross: we do need to study the “book of Nature” and take all scripture into the considerations ... allow science to include all aspects and all ideas to eventually discover Gods Ultimate plan of redemption and promise of a New World without suffering... this creation is just a transitional construct to conquer Evil and bring everything to what he intended... ( in my words what he Said )
God bless Mr.Ross.
Nice young man. He needs to keep searching and studying. His lack of confidence stems from doubt and a lack of understanding. Dr. Ross has sought the truth and is confident and collected based on the firm foundation it provides. I pray the young man not assume the answers cannot be found or influence others to doubt simply because they do not yet have understanding. We too often think there are no answers or jump to an incorrect assumption when we lack understanding.
Presenter Washington University (St Louis) Professor Josh Swamidass has both a M.D. AND a Ph.D. ... in my opinion, it's a bit condescending to refer to him as a "nice young man" and a "lack of confidence stems from doubt and a lack of understanding." I know doctors who are M.D.'s and I know scientists with Ph.D's. I know very few medical scientists who have both.
Please note Dr. Swamidass' father died unexpectedly the week before, but he decided not to cancel the Forum, which had been planned for 8 months.
Both these men are committed followers of Jesus Christ, brilliant men, and outstanding scientists.
Precisely. Thank you for noticing this.
Well, "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." (Genesis 1:1). Instead of say, "Origin of Species" by Charles Darwin, or, "Cosmos" by Carl Sagan. I think I'll go more with "A Christian Manifesto" by Francis Schaeffer; than ""The God Delusion" by Dr. Richard Dawkins. Better to be by the Lord's Saving Grace, with Saint Peter in Heaven with God's Children; than to be with Judas Iscariot with Satan's children in Hell; obviously. Thanks to God for Christ's Sake, that I am one of the fortunate few with God's Children, on the straight and narrow road of salvation.
what is the meaning of "Joshua Swami Dass"...? ==> Joshua = Yeshuva , Swami = GOD, Elohim , Dass = Follower, ===> "Yeshuva Elohim follower"
Given how humanity suffers and dies it seems unlikely any one of us are special.
Sad.
This life is but a speck in time as compared to eternity.
All of God's children are "special".
He loves you while you are a sinner.
He awaits you with open arms!
That is a very sad viewpoint you have. I do understand why you think it. I do believe, however, that it is shortsighted.
No evelution, just creation
prove it
I would argue it is both.
Evolutionary morality:
I'm just an accident and life is about doing whatever I want or have to to keep the species alive, and being the best, the richest.
And I have all the money a person needs. My fortress is secure, so all I need to do is keep up appearances to keep the public happy, so they don't come after me for being rich while they're miserable, and.. look at that 15 year old, whoa. I will have her too. I'll surround myself with evolutionary purists like me and we'll keep it our secret while we had the best of everything in this universe - I had the best of everything this planet had to offer.
Thank God Jesus is God.
Nicely put Nathan
this light measurement has to be defined, somehow...
when the student is studenting lol
I felt like Swamidass didn’t actually offer any evidence.
Did God say he created the earth or not... what is this evolution crap?
Faith How does evolution negate God creating the Earth? BTW I do not believe in evolution but your argument is not clear
@@Papasquatch73 I agree. I have no idea what this person is trying to say.
John Lennox's argument is that evolution, if 100% factual, is a mechanism much like the internal combustion engine is a mechanism. The existence of evolution does not negate the existence of the creator of life, namely God. In the same way the internal combustion engine does not negate the existence of the creator of automobiles, namely Henry Ford (technically he didn't invent them but the point is clear).
Thank you. Very interesting. Be blessed. Dr Joshua, are you comfortable thinking that your great grand father was a monkey.?
1:01:24 Where did God come from? 🤔 Hmmm.... how to answer that one....🙃
Hugh Ross - Beyond the Cosmos: How Science Reveals God's Trans-Dimensional Power at 8 minute mark
I don't think Ross recognizes how fakely humble and condescending Joshua is. This seemed like watching a Muslim trying to seem respectful while simultaneously being abusive, but in a way that plays to the appearances of their culture (and I've seen that over and over again). It was quite alarming. His interruptions were also quite alarming. Very similar to Peter Atkins.
I have respect for Muslims though I disagree with their theology. Let us all be a little more humble.
@@BabyBugBug Humility has nothing to do with this. They are an evil people steeped in the abuse of honor-shame culture. Fake humility dominates their behavior (at least until they find someone who has enough shame on them that they can be as abusive as they want without looking like a bad guy).
Stay humble, people. During the millions of years when the dinosaurs ruled this planet, they probably thought they were also special. Then the asteroid showed up and changed their minds...
Never heard of Christians who believe in Evolution. Verse please?
why is Ross even debating this guy? it sounds like hes struggling to speak and dont know how to bring himself over. Seems like hes just trying to disbelief anything.
If you look at God as the Creator of everything , you could look at the term " Image of God " as a possessive grammatically , an image that God invented as an artist creator . We are mammals , our image was created by God , it is an image of God . It does not mean we look like God or anything other than that it is an image that belongs to God , God having made it ! I could be wrong but this is my simple take on the words at this point .
God said among the Elohim " Let us make man in OUR image. Speaking to the angels.
@@gutzycowardbmeOne of those strange formulations as this one (after expeling from the Eden) "God said: Now man become as one of us, knowing good and evil."
Mahavatar Faustin Patrick Lewis.when you think like humans you are Satan .You have to think like God.Only to create not to destroy.
01 Genesis = Creation, Evolution and Entropy. 010
Dr ross with all respect how can you believe in bible n not be a christian.
zoraida ortiz Explain your statement. He believes in the gospel and has accepted Jesus as his savior so how is he not a Christian
Yes please explain. I have no idea how your comment makes sense.
He is one of the best christian apologists ever so... How is he not supposed to believe in Jesus as his savior?
@29 mins...his dad dies of a heart attack....i wonder if he got the covid shot????!!!!hhhhhhhmmmmmmm
Wrong! Death came into the world when Adam sinned, ... NOT before that.
Cathy S Rom 5:12 plainly states death to all people. It doesn’t say all living creatures
What, animals started killing each other after Adam sinned, did they start sinning too? Adam himself didn't die for hundreds of years later.
SamytheGreek animals don’t have morals
Hugh Ross is in a class by himself he makes Josh look like he has no education at all.
Why doesn't brown suit guy just admit to himself he has no faith.
So - If all the bees worms or bugs went extinct over night what would happen to life on earth? Oppps oh right ....if Humans were wiped out overnight the planet WOULD FLOURISH! BEES GONE WE ALL DIE!
Bees aren't the only insect that pollinates. Honey bees are actually an invasive species in the Americas and there was still other insects that pollinated instead of the bees. Like butterflies for example.
Clueless what matters www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=1097
The world was created to take care of us. So in order to do that it needs to be able function without us. Your parents take care of you. You dont take care of your parents. You're parents would be fine and functional if you were not born but you can not be born without you're parents. The world does not need us but we need the world. And the animals that God designed. Everything was made to be perfect for us to live and prosper. I hope that makes sense.
@@robotspartan9351 How do you know your not a virus to the world... you are in a time machine and in a cave before man could write...do tell.
JediStockTrader clearly God’s word the Bible you have no knowledge of . Read Genesis God created human unique . God came in the flesh and died on the cross out of love for humanity .
www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=85 love story . Do not listen Hugh Ross . Open the Bible
Well, in Hinduism there are so many schools of thought, one of which supports the idea of the creator above the creation.
Sebastian Bhattarai I don’t think so. It is a pantheism. Maybe panentheism. So creation is part of Brahman or the same as Brahman. No separate from it
Well, but it entails many philosophical grounds which cannot be logically supported in many cases. God, as an unique, is very different from what Hinduism defend.
Swamidass is totally CLUELESS!! 😢
The dude can't hold a candle to Hugh Ross. It turns into nauseam
Had we evolved with paws, or hooves, how much preaching to you think would be done concerning a hereafter? The only thing that humans have more of than other forms of life, is egoism. Massive amounts of egoism.
Joshua Swamidass 😑😑😑
Josh is cringy
You think I was uncomfortable? Or I made you feel uncomfortable? In some ways I was uncomfortable. I have a great deal of respect for Hugh, but also have major scientific disagreements with him. Engaging him in public is a great honor, but also difficult to do with integrity to both my affinity to him and disagreement with some of his ideas. Peace.
Both. But understood. Peace
@ sm1th: respectfully disagree. I think that both Dr. Swamidass and Dr. Ross did an outstanding job. We were very fortunate to have both of them here at Cal Poly.
The universe is not fine tuned, it appears fine tuned as we presuppose humanity and life are the goals in universe formation. Don't mistakenly believe the fine tuning argument. I'll explain why.
In a pack of cards the odds of being dealt 4 aces is the same as being dealt any 4 cards. The difference is, as with the universe we assign value to the combination of 4 aces, but not to 2,3,5,9 or a non-life sustaining universe.
Humans assign value to our universe as it supports life, this makes it special to us (like 4 aces. However based on this alone it doesn't change the odds or chance.
We don't know how many universe there are nor the odds that lead to life sustaining universes. This is because we only have one universe to examine and no others to compare it with. The constants may be fixed, universes may only form this way, there may infinite universes, ours may be rare although non-god caused.. etc. We don't know, another reason fine tuning is a bad argument.
Thus the fine tuning argument is fallacious. Hugh is a scientist but clearly not a philosopher.
Simplistic thinking my friend. You go to a deck of cards straight to the number of universes. Fine tuning is a fallacious argument because we have no way of comparing one universe to others ? You admitted that we only theorize of more than one universe. Personally, I think there are more but they are much smaller and may even be bubbles on multiple planes. My opinion is that something from nothing is ridiculous. Also, let me skip billions of years later to the dinosaur extinction event where 95% of all life, both animal and plant were destroyed on the planet Earth. Do the math, the following periods of time are like crushed vertebrae, there is simply not enough time nor room for all of the complicated animal life to evolve outside a supernatural event which brought these differing creatures and ultimately the human into being. The time frame for this to happen is simply not there.
@@perryarrington8446 You have a simplistic understanding of the arguments. How can a sample (this universe) in a sample size of 1, be classed as having unlikely attributes when there are no others samples (universes) to compare against? In addition know one knows what started the big bang or came "before". Science doesn't know whether it was something from nothing, or something from something.. nor do you.
Whats the odds of be dealt card X from a pack of X?
That which does not exists can not serve as a cause. Therefor you need to demonstrate a supernatural exists before you claim it as a cause.
Darryl Dempsey I see what you’re saying, how can our universe be considered as unlikely when we have no others to compare it to. The way scientists do this is by postulating multiple universes, and asking how many would it take to get the same results as they are found in ours. So technically, every universe in this multiple universe theory has the same slim chance of having those exact constants, making our universe not special by probability. However, taking into account that every other one of those universes would not permit life, and knowing that ours does, you could stack all the non-life universes against our life universe, and that surely makes for unspeakable odds. And then to consider that our life is capable of understanding our universe, and finds itself longing for a purpose? I find that too unlikely to be shrugged off as random coincidence.
The multiverse theory is interesting, but it does not explain how this ‘universe generator’ allows for universes to pop into existence. And simply saying “we don’t know” or “we can’t know” is just as much a cop out as saying “God works in mysterious ways” and leaving it at that. The only difference is that we have reason to believe God exists, and no other reason to believe in the multiverse theory, other than it makes our universe seem less special and more likely.
As for the idea that universes may necessarily exist as life permitting, we simply have no reason to think this is the case. Let’s assume the universe came from nothing, I see no reason to think that nothing could not have remained as nothing, so saying that life may have been a necessary outcome is as outlandish as saying nothing must necessarily turn into something. Now let’s assume the universe was a result of something coming from something. If the universe must have necessarily been life permitting as a result of this something, I think that only helps prove the idea of God.
Saying that science does not know whether the Big Bang was something coming from nothing or something coming from something and neither do you is just silly. Sure science can’t prove what happened before the Big Bang, but given those two options, which one obviously makes sense? Just because we cannot know by scientific methods, what came before the Big Bang, does not mean we cannot postulate a causal agent, especially when we have a book such as the Bible that can answer such questions. So I’d say that the fine tuning argument may not be a good argument alone when challenged by the multiverse theory, but when you compile it with all the other arguments for God’s existence I believe it makes a very sound case.
What if the cards had free will?
@@nanababytwa i liked your name,not comment!...
The blatant cough at the end was childish and rude. I also love how condescending this guy is, he gets amazing opportunities to go to school's and learn many thing's but dose not know what human is?
Many thing's are mysterious but his attitude is that were just smarter monkeys?
Please sir look at the skeletal functions and design much more closely.... they are as different as mammals can be. The conditions they live in, there social structure, how they move, if they kill we do not put them in prison? if they rape or force sex on another we do not put them in prison?
Why is that sir..... because there not human.
Dr ross how can you be more concern about universal n not your soul.?
You can't satisfy the mind of atheist, the more answers the more questions.?????????????
We can't never figture out the fullness of God.stop it.
There is so much of God on the universal.
You took the time to go back and edit your comment and I still have no idea what you said here. Not trying to upset you or make you angry, just pointing out that you might want to make your point a bit more clearly.
Jaden Hanson I understand what he is saying
No theory says that god created time, you are literally putting god in at the frontier of what science doesnt understand
Ever heard of space TIME theories?
@@MutsPub yes, where is god?
@@twokidsmovies Hugh Ross - Beyond the Cosmos: How Science Reveals God's Trans-Dimensional Power
@@MutsPub i asked a simple question, where is God, how do you know he is real, and why should anyone worship a horrible barbaric maniac
@@twokidsmovies I answered your questions, which turned out not to be questions, but rather "bait" in an attempt to talk atheist trash! - TROLL!
In the words of Mark Twain, "No amount of evidence will ever persuade an idiot."
Now crawl back into your miserable little squalor!
Your future will be bleak, ending in cold nothingness.
Then comes judgement!
He will give you exactly what you want, eternal separation from His presence.- fool!
How can he be a scientist and a preacher he want to play safe