Your videos covering translations are all so great. Your videos have led me to use multiple translations, and feel comfortable knowing that regardless of the one I choose to use for a range of uses, it can be trustworthy. Thank you
I have used the Holman Bible since 2015, after graduating from Bible college and using the ESV through my schooling. I bought a nice thin line reference, a study Bible, and a journaling Bible that were HCSB. Then, in 2017 when Holman decided to drop their name, I bought a few CSBs. And now again, since they updated the translation, I have bought a new CSB. I say all that to say, I am loyal to this translation because I have found it to be very accurate! As a preacher/teacher I am speaking with others that don’t know the original languages, so I have found this translation to be very helpful in ministry. Thank you for the video!
Mark, I am in nerd love right now. This is precisely the information I was looking for in evaluating a Bible translation. Thank you for this. It was invaluable in selecting a Bible translation.
I am so thankful to Tim Frish (@A Frisch Perspective) for recommending this channel. Subscribed and looking forward to watching older and yet-to-come vids.
As someone who grew up reading a bilingual Bible (king James and Reina Valera) and having English as my second language I have felt more comfortable reading CSB due to its reading level. The ESV and NASB are good too (I lean more towards ESV due to KJV) but I do still struggle reading some passages that the CSB has helped clarify. Thank you for your video!
The Latin base recognition of synonyms and base words has to help. I think all English speakers should learn some Latin, English is easier and most European is vaguely intelligible afterwards.
Curiously, if you are a native Spanish speaker, you probably understand one aspect of the KJV better than many native English speakers today. "Thee/Thou" is just the English version of "Tu", whereas "You" = "Usted". The T-V distinction was lost in English, but not in Spanish.
I just discovered your channel and im loving it!!!! I have done so much research on bible translations over the years. I grew up around the NIV, then got the CEV (contemporary English version) as a gift in high school. Then in college I was introduced to the NLT which is the translation I read the whole bible cover to cover for the first time. As I grew older and wanted to study the bible, get deep in original languages, I got anxiety over which version to read. I ended up using the KJV to study primarily because of Strong's concordance, yikes, but over time I just got bogged down in "translating" KJV English into modern English. I still use it but sparingly. I then started to use other literal translations to study like NASB and ESV but they were still too robotic in my mind to get the flow of scripture. Then I discovered the CBS; it has become my go to translation for study and readability (As well as the NET for it's thousands of commentaries). But in the end I discovered that ALL translations have their strengths and weaknesses. The old adage is true that the best bible translation is the one you'll actually read, just not the message or passion translation :P We English speakers are so blessed to have SO many options for bible translations.
"We English speakers are so blessed to have SO many options for bible translations." In a weird sort of way, this blessing is the source of these Bible translation wars. Some languages have one translation. You're stuck with what you have. And so many languages still have none at all. That's heartbreaking. I am to the point where I think we should be done with English translations for a while. Energy and resources need to be put toward other languages that are in need.
The KJV does have a newer update the Modern English Version. Or you can look for the Holman Christian Standard Bible. Unfortunately it's been out of print for some time but it is still available on eBay it follows the KJV however it is still very readable.
That you could present all this information off the top of your head without notes is really impressive. Was someone behind the cameraman with cue cards? No, seriously, well done! I always find your videos informative and presented well. Kudos!
As a pastor and expository preacher I’ve settled on the CSB for exactly the reasons you’ve stated here. It’s formal enough for preaching but readable enough for more laypeople. I found myself switching between the ESV and NIV for those very reasons before I discovered the CSB. Also, I very much appreciate that it doesn’t lump me into a certain camp like other translations do. The only issue I have with it is that for memory work it’s not quite as “sticky” as a more traditional translation like the ESV.
As a pastor using the CSB, let me ask you the same question as the author of this video is struggling. At Heb 3:16 the CSB says that all who followed Moses out of Egypt fell by the wayside and did not enter the promised land. Can you tell us what happened to Joshua and Caleb?
@@tonimccoy9778 read the following which is the topic of this thread: For who heard and rebelled? Wasn’t it all who came out of Egypt under Moses? Heb.3.16 CSB The above is the reading from the csb however in that same version one should find that Joshua and Caleb followed Moses out of Egypt and did indeed enter the promised land. So let me rephrase the question for you: why call a book the word of God when that very book does not agree with itself? You did open a can of worms for another discussion when you said Joshua and Caleb entered God's rest when they died. Did you mean they went to Heaven or to the bosom of Abraham? The scriptures place the OT Saint in Abraham's bosom not Heaven before the blood of Christ was physically shed. Sorry, this reply was intended for the previous post.
@@tonimccoy9778 I'm still hoping you might further explain your statement. Did they go directly to Heaven upon their physical death or to the bosom of Abraham?
The skateboarders criticism of the NLT comment made me laugh out loud! Translation oversight committee joke was great too. Great stuff! As someone who does struggle between choosing formal and dynamic translations I do keep finding that I really love the CSB and it really does fall well in the middle. I especially appreciate their rendering of John 3:16 and use of contractions making the language feel more relatable.
Excellent video! In personal experience, I do find the CSB an easier read than my NASB or ESV, but I preach from the ESV. I'm seriously considering switching to the CSB for preaching and teaching.
I'm almost religious about my study from both the ESV & NKJV, @@slawsonscot , and I appreciate your comment. I picked up a CSB in order to see what all the fuss is about. Very interested.
I have to confess after watching Mr. Frisch discussing the CSB as well that, even with my HCSB, I know there are updates, and so I've ordered a 2017 version of the CSB. Once again I am waiting on the Post to arrive with a great anticipation. Recently got an ISV NT in paperback and like it as well. If I keep this up I may have to add shelves to my library!! Great video Mark! I enjoy so much.
Just got a copy of you book today and just started on the intro and already had a chuckle (trust me in a good way) I know I am going to enjoy this. Just a passing note for a paperback the paper seems to be really nice quality. I have read the CSB all the way through and I know feelings mean nothing. But I always feel that this translation sits between the NKJV and the NIV. Thank you 🙏🏽
Thank you for this detailed analysis! I made up my mind. I will study both the NLT version and the CSB version side by side. Maybe it will take longer to read and to understand the entire Bible, but my understanding will be off the charts. I am 67 and so very late in life to study the Bible and to move deeper into Christianity. Thanks for helping us out.
The CSB is the best Bible translation for these four reasons, but watch video for detailed explanations and qualifications: 0:50 If your church already uses it. 2:49 If you want an optimal balance between accuracy and readability. 19:51 If you can't decide between formal equivalence vs. functional equivalence. 21:29 If you want to be free from the tribal partisanship in choosing a Bible translation.
As the worship leader at my church, I get the scripture readings ahead of time and read through them as I prepare for Sunday. The CSB wasn't a Bible I used for my preparation, and in fact I hadn't really used it for anything in my own personal study...but I decided these past couple of months to give it a fairer shot than I had been giving it. Well, I happen to appreciate far more than I had. I still will always use my KJV for memorization as I always have, but I will officially say that the CSB is now my weekly goto when I do my diligence in music preparation. I am really enjoying the perspective it gives more than any of the other modern translations
FANTASTIC video! I LOVE the CSB! Probably about a year ago the CSB became my primary and preferred translation. It's cool to see the data supporting the "optimal equivalence". Thanks for the video!
I've gone through every English translation over the last 10 years and for overall English clarity sans "biblish" as well as staying relatively close to the original languages (clarity and accuracy), I think that overall, the CSB is the best....for us. I used the '95 NASB for over 20 years, and just recently made the definitive switch to the CSB in my ministry and personal use and couldn't be happier. They knocked the ball out of the park on this one.
Are you OSAS or faith plus works. Just curious. I believe the kjv is the best wich covers osas and more help against Satan's lies and attacks of the faith. Might have to use along with another translation and dictionary but the help of strong faith pays off
@@donaldwortham6227 To put your mind at ease, I grew up using the RSV and about ten years ago switched to the ESV when I graduated high school (because it is actually in print). I also believe (quite firmly in fact) that a born again person cannot lose their salvation. I've come to realize that which translation one uses is of little importance compared to reading the Bible with context in mind. I also am very convinced that eternal life is given to those who simply believe in Jesus. I would gladly defend that belief from the CSB. In fact I've actually done that using the CSB while talking with Mormon missionaries.
@@nobodyspecial1852 I don't understand the point you're trying to make. So people shouldn't interpret the Bible in the context of the discourse they're reading?
This is a great video. I was looking for a Bible translation for my elderly father, who would say he is a Christian, but never reads the Bible. Instead I found a great teacher and the answer.
I too was one to think that the word for word bibles were "better" than the thought for thought ones and therefore started with the NKJV then moved to the NASB for my main bibles. But our pastor uses the CSB and I have grown to love it and also give more of a chance to other thought for thought translations like the NLT that I looked down upon when I was first saved and learning about different translations. Thank you for this video. It was very interesting.
Although I respect the ESV & it’s what my church uses, I find it hard to read as my daily. So I use CSB as my daily then cross reference and study with the ESV. I’m an idealist and want there to be one perfect translation. Obviously that’s not possible but these two together are probably the best I can find.
For someone who hasn't read much at all of the CSB translation, is it somewhat of a safe assumption that it is a good middle ground between something like the NIV or NLT and the ESV?
Excellent video, Mark. Really helpful. I've always been more of a NASB/ESV/KJV guy but as I've gotten older, I've realized just how valuable translations like the CSB and NIV are in helping people understand what they're reading. Now I have to decide between the CSB and NIV! :-)
@@wardonwords Please check their rendering of "pornea" in Matthew 5:32 and 19:9. The translator's notes talk about this some, but it seems irresponsible to distribute the main text without the notes, as when being too broad, someone might be led astray.
Hey @markwardonwords at around 8:45 you mention the seeming impossibility of a computer accurately diagramming every sentence of the bible. A year later, chatGPT was released, and we've started to scratch the surface of what AI could do. Do you still think your statment is true? Impressive as it is, chatGPT struggles with accuracy, but diagramming seems like something well suited to AI. In a wider sense, can you make any recommendations for who is thinking/writing/working on bible translation / analysis with AI? I've heard some people discuss moral dimensions of AI (i.e. misrepresentation of someone), but not much in this area. Imagine a bible translated into a language for the first time entirely by humans, and then AI is used to assess its accuracy/readability, and suggest areas that may need refinement?
I have to say I enjoy just reading the CSB! It is very refreshing. I often refer back to the Linear Bible to see exact word for word Hebrew and Greek. In the end, I rely on the Holy Spirit to help me understand God’s Word.
Thank you. I found your channel through Sean McDowell's. I find myself sometimes becoming overwhelmed with which bible I am going to read. I have many to choose from. It was interesting to see all the other walkers went iut if the way to not interrupt the video.
When comparing Ephesians 1-3 with the ESV compared to the NIV I found something interesting, apart from when you said in the Greek it is, you being dead in the trespasses and the sins of you, which is translated you were dead, the word here is a past tense, but the word being is a present tense, if I was to translate it I would put you are dead or keep the word you being dead, which makes more sense, however this may be neither here nor there, but when I get down to Ephesians 3 the NIV says deserving of wrath whereby the ESV says sons of wrath, which holds two different meanings, the NIV deserving of Wrath is an act of punishment, but sons of Wrath is an act of character, those who belong to this world are sonsof wrath because they bring forth wrath, but the sons of God bring forth mercy, as it is shown when Christ is weeping for Jerusalem, while at the same time the disciples want to bring forth fire from heaven to destroy them, so Christ says to them look at your spirits, your character the content of your hearts,
My home is CSB/HCSB that is it is our base translation. This is the argument I used to pick it. "I lost my KJV that Dad and Mom gave me when I was 11. But my wife could not read it anyway and a family should all have the same translation for reading around the table. And I am a Baptist and the church I am going to uses the ASV so I want to check that."
Oh My KJV was lost at church but in the mercy of God it was found one year later. So I have it and can still read this one KJV that has been my friend and spoken Word of God to me for 32 years.
Thanks for the presentation. I purchased not long ago, a CSB larger print paperback not too long ago. I wanted to see how it stacked up against my favored NKJV. That I have a quality large print copy of. I was impressed with the CSB. And will buy another one in the future. . Possibly in leather or hard cover.
I was going back and forth for a long time. I used the NKJV, and ESV. When I took over the youth I settle down on CSB. Im Pentecostal so maybe I’m part of small circle in our sect that use it. It reads out loud easy and it so easy to understand and it accurate. I understand more, so I know the youth has to understand it more. Our church doesn’t really have official translation we use but it leans NKJV.
@@wardonwords I hope so too. Cause I'm definitely interested in your thoughts. I've been fascinated in it ever since I briefly saw a video of a TH-camr who switching from the CSB to the NET because he felt the NET is closer to the original Greek and Hebrew then the CSB. I also looked it up on got questions and it says that like most dynamic translations it's a bit interpretive. But nevertheless it's more formal than most dynamic translations. Given the fact that it has more note I just want any other English Bible there is I'm definitely interested of a brilliant scholar such as yourself
Mark - funny question for you: have you ever seen the episode of Star Trek: The Next Generation titled "Darmok"? Apart from the joy of seeing Paul Winfield in anything he's in, this episode essentially stars issues of translation, in ways that underscore points you make regularly.
In all of these charts, I am charting where the NRSV is, and it seems its right where it belongs: in the middle, right on the heels of the CSB, but modest in its balance between literal vs readable. In other words, "as literal as possible, as free as necessary".
I think you’ll find the Ignatius NRSV second Catholic edition, to be an even more accurate translation. They got rid of a lot of the inclusive language and it seems more conservative. The Ignatius Bible has a nice layout.
Even though I do agree with a lot of what he says before you decide you should actually read the CSB or its predecessor the HCSB. In particular the changes made to the two versions of the Lord's Prayer found in these bibes.
At the time Holman was publishing the HCSB , a study from the Masters Seminary, of a match between literal to the various translations, found that the HCSB was more literal than the NKJV . Don’t know how the CSB will match up.
I found a CSB Apologetics Study Bible at a thrift store and picked it up to check it out. I really like it although as one who grew up in the church of the 1980s when everyone was either KJV or NIV, some of the passage changes (like Psalm 23 and the Lord’s Prayer in Matthew) took some getting used to. I get why they made the changes for optimal readability. My current pastor looooooves his NASB77 but I have no issues following along with the CSB. I use the CSB now for daily reading and a NASB for comparing and contrasting. My ancient, threadbare, NIV84 now enjoys retirement.
"My ancient, threadbare, NIV84 now enjoys retirement." Aaaaaww! I love my NIV 84 Study. It lives in its case/cover these days. It's still in pretty good shape, but it does feel fragile. It has so many personal notes/highlights in it. It's like a diary of my life for so many years. It's one of the first things I'd grab if I had to run out of the house in a fire!
I used to be Mormon and was therefore in the KJV-only camp. Since being drawn by God, I've taken great interest in Biblical translation. Thanks for the great info.
Thanks, Mark. I appreciate your explanation of the CSB analysis previously done. I know Holman has been using that X-Y graph as a marketing visual since the CSB was published. Curious if the analysis was independent or funded by Holman??? Also, I would assume that the 2020 update to the CSB would not altar the conclusions very much. Opinion? Thanks for all you are doing!
Today is 10/24/2022, and I just got a brown CSB large print personal size bible in from off ebay. Its the 2017 printing. I've been waiting for this one! I'm so pleased to get it!! Great bible!! The double-column format is my favorite.
Hi Mark. Thanks for your ministry. I've been really enjoying your videos here in Australia. Extremely edifying. My pastor uses the NLT and it seems at our church everyone uses a variety of translations (which can be seen be the bible is read before it is expounded - usually NIV or NLT). I serve at our evening congregation and regularly preach. I usually use the ESV as it has been my main squeeze for the last 6 years. I like my wide margin to preach from, as it is my main devotion Bible. I've been prayerfully considering switching to the CSB as my main preaching Bible ( I use multiple translations in my prep including the NLT and the CSB). I lean towards the more formal side of things, but I appreciate the CSB...I did like the the HCSB, as it was the rage while I was at Theological College. Recently your thoughts on 1 Cor 14 have had an impact on me. Hence, my prayerfully considering what translation I preach from. It is just hard when there is no 'one' translation at our church. I know all our evangelical translations are good. My time at college taught me that. But I just can't bring myself to use the NLT ( I do refer to it at times) for serious text work in my preaching. Any thoughts? Grace and Peace, Benny
I'm still working this out, after all these years. The strongest answer I have for you right now is that it probably isn't accidental that expository preaching ministries, in my experience, tend not to go much further toward the functional end of the spectrum than the CSB or NIV. Ironically, I think I'd tend to stick with tradition here: the KJV gave us a good balance of formal vs. functional renderings. That balance has proven its utility over time. But I won't stand on tradition against other Christians, only (when necessary, of course) on Bible. I absolutely preached expositional sermons from the NIrV to my tiny, functionally illiterate outreach "congregation" for 5 or so years.
@@wardonwords Wow! I'd like to hear more about that experience using the NIrV for that congregation for half a decade. Could you do a video about that sometime?
I used to only want the most literal translations until I learned Spanish and had to translate sermons. I realized that translation is complicated and can be done in many different ways faithfully. I think CSB is a great line between thought-for-thought and word-for-word translating.
The CSB is the translation I recommend the most. I may recommend other translations for specific purposes (the NRSV and ESV for more academic or literary contexts, the NLT and GNT for more casual, less study-oriented reading, and so on), but the CSB is the one that I can point to as the current standard for a well-balanced translation. For instance, I find that the CSB does quite well in deciding when to retain or rework an idiomatic or figurative phrase. The translations in the Tyndale tradition love their Hebrew idioms a bit too much at times, and other translations are sometimes too quick to scrub out an undesirable metaphor. Even so, I recently noticed an example in Joshua 7.5. I leave it to you to decide if this one was a good call. Let's run though the KJV progeny first: - NKJV: [T]herefore the hearts of the people melted and became like water. - NRSV: The hearts of the people failed and turned to water. - ESV: And the hearts of the people melted and became as water. - NASB'20: [A]nd the hearts of the people melted and became like water. - MEV: [A]nd the hearts of the people melted like water. They're fairly consistent, as one would expect. Surprisingly, most of the "mediating" versions (NIV, REB, NABRE, NET, and CEB) are quite similar to the "formal" versions in this passage. They all decided to retain the imagery in some fashion. Meanwhile, the "dynamic" versions do what you'd expect, with the NLT offering a bit of a compromise: - GNT: Then the Israelites lost their courage and were afraid. - NLT: The Israelites were paralyzed with fear at this turn of events, and their courage melted away. - CEV: [A]nd the Israelite army felt discouraged. - GW: Israel’s troops lost heart and were scared stiff. - MSG: The heart of the people sank, all spirit knocked out of them. But then the CSB decides to favor the less literal approach, breaking from the earlier HCSB: - HCSB: As a result, the people’s hearts melted and became like water. - CSB: As a result, the people lost heart. The CSB's phrasing has the benefit of capturing the original Hebrew idiom's meaning with an English idiom that shares the word "heart." And the odd imagery of melting and water could certainly break a reader's concentration's in a read-through, while the figurative language itself offers hardly any additional clarity to the text. But at the same time, there is an argument to be made for keeping the text a little weird and alien as a reminder of its ancient vintage. Still, I'm willing to defend this choice.
Im currently going through Alter's Hebrew translation; Ill let you know how he handles that. (Currently out of town,). (Look at that beautiful language of the NLT, though!)
@@joest.eggbenedictus1896 I just checked it. Alter's wording is strikingly similar to that of the NRSV: "And the people's heart failed and turned to water."
@Mark Ward I'm a late comer to your work, but I love it. What's more, I LOVE that you snuck that little line in from "The Horse and His Boy" when talking about the KJV only meme. AWESOME!
My favorite is the ESV but I like the CSB as well. My wife prefers the NLT which I do not really care for. Her NLT is falling apart from use so I am not about to try to convince her that my preference should be hers. Appreciate your work.
Great break down of readability vs. accuracy. I love the CSB but that is not the only one I study from. I do find it interesting that you filmed this at s KJV camp 😲
I haven’t really given CSB a chance yet, I absolutely love ESV for reading and bible study although I grew up memorizing from NIV with some verses in NKJV or KJV. Maybe I will pick up a CSB for some bible journaling
Hi. Please some things I have t read from CSB make me wonder if they lean toward once saved always saved. If I am in error I apologize but do wish to point out that there is more at stake than readability etc. there are important belief differences as well.
I really don't think so, my friend! I think proponents and opponents of perseverance of the saints are probably able to use the same Bible translation.
I really appreciate that the weights and measurements are in standard American terms that I can understand without having to stop reading and go figure out what the measurements would be in standard then do the math
@@wardonwords do you know of any videos or articles explaining why cross references are different from translation to translation? Or even better could you make a video on that?
@@Rexpbass They're all just judgment calls made by various editors, editors who are trying their best (almost certainly based on the work of past editors) to make connections between passages. That's why they differ. Does that make sense?
I'm going to leave some important information below that many have never seen. It may make some angry or even confused as to why I'd post it on this video. If it does I do apologize but it really is that important. If it helps just one person it would be so worth it and if that person gets it they will share in my love, freedom and joy. Study is so important and one day a week is simply not enough. Buying into all the falsehoods of why it's not true or can't be His Word is deadly. With the amount of proof we now have in this age of abundance of information there's simply no longer any excuse or argument to be made. So here goes and for those that do read it please just think about what it means and will mean for you if you take it seriously: The case for Biblical accuracy and how we know we have the absolute, proven true Word of God in our modern Bibles if they maintain a word for word translation or as close as possible. First let's look at secular history and written sources that are taken as matter of fact. These other books and writings from antiquity are held up as truth and in some cases factual history. These other books/poems and there evidence/sources, data: Second most common manuscript document Homer's Iliad meaning there are more copies of it than any other secular writing/document from antiquity of which only 643 exist dating from 13th century AD. Homer is believed to have wrote it in the 8th century BC. The Gallic Wars of Cesar in 1st century BC, there are only 10 manuscripts of that in existence dating over 1000 years after they were supposed to have been written. Herodotus wrote of history and is known as one of the first historians 5th century BC and only 8 manuscripts exist and they are from more than 1300 years after he wrote anything. History of the Peloponnesian War written by Thucydides. There are only 8 manuscripts that are from 1300 years after he supposedly wrote his account. These are just a few examples but it doesn't get any better by adding more. Now let's look at Biblical proofs: There can be no doubt as to the accuracy of our current Bibles as it is proven via all the source fragments, scrolls, papyri, codex' and sources dating all the way back to before Christ around 700 BC for the OT and between 100 to 150 AD for the NT. There is no doubt and no room for any argument against these facts. We have more proof for God's Word than any other written word in history and it is by order of magnitudes more as in some 66,000+ such sources for Scripture. The early Church Fathers prior to 325 AD: Those known as the Anti-Nicene Fathers writings contain over 32,000 quotes from the New Testament from which we could reconstruct the entire/complete NT from just those. They also contain over 19,000+ quotes from the Gospels alone again from prior to 325 AD. All these sources allow us to be critical when it comes to the level of accuracy in our Bibles. The oldest manuscripts end The Gospel of Mark at chapter 16 verse 8. It is the perfect ending to Mark's Gospel when you think about it as there really was no more that needed said. There is a lot of evidence that anything after Mark 16:8 was added later gathering parts from all the other Gospels and even Acts. There have been many ideas put forward about why the rest was added but none truly fits, things such as knowing Mark's intent and inspiration and that had he been able he would have added to his Gospel. That after Peter was martyred he stopped short due to that but if you read his Gospel there's no need for anything to be added. There's also some idea that there's a lost ending but how can you think that if you don't even know if such an ending existed? So a bunch of endings began to appear, tacked onto the original Autograph. We have an abundance of evidence that prove anything after 16:8 was added later. 4th Century Church fathers Eusebius and Gerome both wrote that Mark ended at 16:8. Many, many other very early Church Fathers knew these alternate endings existed and didn't use them or just denounced them. This is a huge error in both the KJV and NKJV both of which are based on more recent manuscripts that the older manuscripts disprove. So those two translations have the added ending consisting of anything after Mark 16:8 in the Gospel of Mark. Newer translations may or may not include the additions after Mark 16:8 but if they do they're bracketed or mentioned in the notes in the margins, sidebar or at the bottom of the page. The external evidence, (oldest sources), indicates that anything after 16:8 does not belong in the Gospel of Mark because those additions simply do not exist in them. The internal evidence is that it is all borrowed from the other Gospel accounts and Acts. The transition from vs 8 to 9 is very awkward as in no transition from the story of the women, the use of a masculine pronoun, why would Mark also identify Mary Magdalene as the one whom Jesus cast demons from again, the angel spoke to Jesus' followers and told them He would appear to them in Galilee, the vocabulary is not Mark's there are 18 different words he never used, completely different structure to the writing, all these out of place themes, signs that don't appear in any of the other Gospels and the weird discussion of them like serpents and other such oddities are foreign to Mark. We don't know who these additions came from but we know where they got them: (below are not time stamps but Chapter and verses) .16:9 = is taken write out of Luke 8:1-3 .16:10 = John 20:18 .16:12 = Luke 24:13-32 .16:13 = Luke 24:14 .16:14 = Luke 24:36-38 .16:15 = Mathew 28:19 .16:16 = John 20:23 .16:17-18 = drawn from a lot of sources: Mathew 10, Mark 6, Luke 10, just a lot of stuff cobbled together. Acts 23-26 and Acts 28:3-6 Paul's encounter with the Asp/venomous snake. None of it after Mark 16:8 makes any sense and adds more than a little confusion with the discussion of signs/miracles and other such things. It is clear to see what was written after 16:8 was not inspired as the rest of his Gospel surely was. This was all done by someone or a group who thought Mark's ending was to brief. To help him get a "better ending" in their eyes because they couldn't accept how he had ended his. His True Gospel account of the life, death and resurrection of Christ Jesus and the awe and wonderment of it all. Why does Mark end the way he does? It was just how he wrote, look at the beginning of his Gospel and all throughout it reads like a highlight real of Christ's Deity and that He is in fact the very Son of God. He made the point and was done he didn't need to go further. Mark's last words were about fear, a Godly Fear of our Lord and the pure awe and wonderment of Him. No other book in history has the proof the Bible does, it is not even close. As I've shown because of the over abundance of source materials we can even be critical of what we have and know for certain whether we have His Word or not. Biblical Historian/Theologian AT. Robertson said we have a vast array of Biblical Manuscripts/Sources that allow us to reconstruct the Bible with more than a 99.9% degree of accuracy. With the number of archaeological excavations, (25,000+ and counting to date). Add in the current excavations under way throughout the Middle East, it is only a matter of time until we see more ancient biblical texts uncovered. Given the recent search for more Dead Sea Scroll caves, this may be sooner rather than later. The Bible is the very Word of God and It is a collection of eyewitness accounts written by other inspired eyewitnesses. There's no longer any excuse for anyone to ignore that fact or to dispute it. The evidence simply does not support their arguments/views. Take care and God Bless...
And also it's about trust. We can trust the peer reviewed translations/transliterations and have faith in the work our brothers have done to bring them to us. Do we actually think God shot Himself in the foot and threw a wrench in His own plan when He confused our language into languages at Babel? No, He knew what He was doing. God does not honor translation cults, God honors and reveals Himself to the heart that diligently seeks Him, often times before an individual even picks up a Bible for the first time.
Dr. Wu can start a new analysis of degrees of Literalism vs. Fidelity. People that get stuck on literalism but fail to appreciate nor adhere to the fidelity of the idea(s) being communicated I encounter all the time. Lately, one person said that "If it's more literal, then it's more accurate!" I would place my money on the horse that neighs "This person only knows one language fluently".
As to various bible translations: I own 1560 GENEVA, 1599 GENEVA, KJV, NKJV, HCSB, NASB 1995, NRSV, ESV, NIV mainline translations. The research volumes are YLT, 5 Greek to English NT renderings, 3 Septuagints, 2 concordants and probably one or two others I can't recall at present. I have a decent library. And I actually use all of these when doing research on a particular topic. My main daily carry bible is my now 35 year old Nelson NKJB double-column wide -margin bible that is filled with deletions, edits, and additions and corrections. It is a MY translation.
I was today years old when I learned Lojban exists. I just did a quick search but I could lose hours looking into that! I do love this stuff. Language, in and of itself, is a miracle.
I do tend to use the ESV as my default, because it hit me at a key time in my life (it came out as I was starting seminary); because it immediately leapt out to the front of the pack when it came to quality typography, and I care a lot about that; because it had many nice editions; because it stands squarely in the KJV tradition and is (to my mind) the KJV's most natural heir; and because I got a nice copy given to me by a mentor.
@markwardonwords I have an esv also. I Wanted to stay with the newer found older dated critical texts so got the ESV. But i have found it does seem alot like the kjv in wording. So I was wondering if I was to get one of these new fresh translations that's not a revision from the kjv family, which would you recommend out of them eg csb niv net etc. Thanks
@markwardonwords wow fast response. Thanks. I have been looking at the csb but worried it is biased towards baptist denomination? The read up on niv seems like it's a cross denomination and unbiased however gender issues and loose.
@@krissaundersjoinery2881 I haven't seen credible allegations of any passages with a Baptist bias. The committee who translated the CSB was not all Baptist.
"Standard" used to mean "an American translation in the lineage of the KJV." Now it's part of the handful of words that get randomly shuffled around to make a translation name, alongside "Revised" and "New."
@@wardonwords If it's a marketing term, then this is not of God; _"Ye cannot serve God and mammon."_ _Matthew 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon._ (KJV)
@@libertypastor1307, my friend, "Authorised Version" is a kind of marketing term, too-just from a different era. It was never actually "authorized" by anyone. It was "appointed to be read in churches." Marketing is not in itself wrong. It becomes wrong when it tells lies or acts manipulatively. But my Christian friends at Zondervan and Holman and other places are not, to my mind, guilty of doing these things. If they are, God only knows. I cannot see it.
Your videos covering translations are all so great. Your videos have led me to use multiple translations, and feel comfortable knowing that regardless of the one I choose to use for a range of uses, it can be trustworthy. Thank you
Glad you like them! That's the goal: get riches out of the use of multiple translations!
Love the video Authorized: the use and misuse of the KJV, which I have on DVD.
I have used the Holman Bible since 2015, after graduating from Bible college and using the ESV through my schooling. I bought a nice thin line reference, a study Bible, and a journaling Bible that were HCSB. Then, in 2017 when Holman decided to drop their name, I bought a few CSBs. And now again, since they updated the translation, I have bought a new CSB. I say all that to say, I am loyal to this translation because I have found it to be very accurate! As a preacher/teacher I am speaking with others that don’t know the original languages, so I have found this translation to be very helpful in ministry. Thank you for the video!
Amen, and may the Lord bless your teaching!
Mark, I am in nerd love right now. This is precisely the information I was looking for in evaluating a Bible translation. Thank you for this. It was invaluable in selecting a Bible translation.
Ha! Glad to be of service!
Your channel and videos are a breath of fresh air. Thank you for your very thorough yet concise videos.
Wow, thank you!
I am so thankful to Tim Frish (@A Frisch Perspective) for recommending this channel. Subscribed and looking forward to watching older and yet-to-come vids.
As someone who grew up reading a bilingual Bible (king James and Reina Valera) and having English as my second language I have felt more comfortable reading CSB due to its reading level. The ESV and NASB are good too (I lean more towards ESV due to KJV) but I do still struggle reading some passages that the CSB has helped clarify. Thank you for your video!
The Latin base recognition of synonyms and base words has to help. I think all English speakers should learn some Latin, English is easier and most European is vaguely intelligible afterwards.
Curiously, if you are a native Spanish speaker, you probably understand one aspect of the KJV better than many native English speakers today. "Thee/Thou" is just the English version of "Tu", whereas "You" = "Usted". The T-V distinction was lost in English, but not in Spanish.
@tmorganriley true, Portuguese is the same. Tu e Vós have a similar rendering as thee and thou!@@tmorganriley
Dude… how does your brain fit in your head? So much knowledge made understandable for us! Thank you
I am ignorant about so many things! I just try to stay in my few lanes!
If Mark was to place his knowledge in your head, you would literally E X P L O D E !!
😆😉
@@Alexleight a year later, and I just want to say teaching is a spiritual gift, and I believe he has it!
“The CSB is for those who can’t make up their minds.” Haha @ me.
Awesome video!
Thank you so much!
That’s me lol
So me😂
I just discovered your channel and im loving it!!!! I have done so much research on bible translations over the years. I grew up around the NIV, then got the CEV (contemporary English version) as a gift in high school. Then in college I was introduced to the NLT which is the translation I read the whole bible cover to cover for the first time. As I grew older and wanted to study the bible, get deep in original languages, I got anxiety over which version to read. I ended up using the KJV to study primarily because of Strong's concordance, yikes, but over time I just got bogged down in "translating" KJV English into modern English. I still use it but sparingly. I then started to use other literal translations to study like NASB and ESV but they were still too robotic in my mind to get the flow of scripture. Then I discovered the CBS; it has become my go to translation for study and readability (As well as the NET for it's thousands of commentaries). But in the end I discovered that ALL translations have their strengths and weaknesses. The old adage is true that the best bible translation is the one you'll actually read, just not the message or passion translation :P We English speakers are so blessed to have SO many options for bible translations.
"We English speakers are so blessed to have SO many options for bible translations."
In a weird sort of way, this blessing is the source of these Bible translation wars. Some languages have one translation. You're stuck with what you have. And so many languages still have none at all. That's heartbreaking. I am to the point where I think we should be done with English translations for a while. Energy and resources need to be put toward other languages that are in need.
The KJV does have a newer update the Modern English Version. Or you can look for the Holman Christian Standard Bible. Unfortunately it's been out of print for some time but it is still available on eBay it follows the KJV however it is still very readable.
Thanks!
Welcome!
You deserve way more subscribers. Phenomenal.
Many thanks!
That you could present all this information off the top of your head without notes is really impressive. Was someone behind the cameraman with cue cards? No, seriously, well done! I always find your videos informative and presented well. Kudos!
Camera tricks! This was indeed a prepared script, pretty much every word.
As a pastor and expository preacher I’ve settled on the CSB for exactly the reasons you’ve stated here. It’s formal enough for preaching but readable enough for more laypeople. I found myself switching between the ESV and NIV for those very reasons before I discovered the CSB. Also, I very much appreciate that it doesn’t lump me into a certain camp like other translations do. The only issue I have with it is that for memory work it’s not quite as “sticky” as a more traditional translation like the ESV.
I've memorised CSB , please feel free to join Josh Summers Bible Memory Goal online community
As a pastor using the CSB, let me ask you the same question as the author of this video is struggling.
At Heb 3:16 the CSB says that all who followed Moses out of Egypt fell by the wayside and did not enter the promised land.
Can you tell us what happened to Joshua and Caleb?
Joshua and Caleb entered Gods rest when they died..blessings.
Toni's husband
@@tonimccoy9778 read the following which is the topic of this thread:
For who heard and rebelled? Wasn’t it all who came out of Egypt under Moses? Heb.3.16 CSB
The above is the reading from the csb however in that same version one should find that Joshua and Caleb followed Moses out of Egypt and did indeed enter the promised land.
So let me rephrase the question for you: why call a book the word of God when that very book does not agree with itself?
You did open a can of worms for another discussion when you said Joshua and Caleb entered God's rest when they died.
Did you mean they went to Heaven or to the bosom of Abraham? The scriptures place the OT Saint in Abraham's bosom not Heaven before the blood of Christ was physically shed.
Sorry, this reply was intended for the previous post.
@@tonimccoy9778 I'm still hoping you might further explain your statement. Did they go directly to Heaven upon their physical death or to the bosom of Abraham?
The skateboarders criticism of the NLT comment made me laugh out loud! Translation oversight committee joke was great too. Great stuff! As someone who does struggle between choosing formal and dynamic translations I do keep finding that I really love the CSB and it really does fall well in the middle. I especially appreciate their rendering of John 3:16 and use of contractions making the language feel more relatable.
I think I love obscure humor too much… Glad there's someone else out there who enjoys it!
Excellent video! In personal experience, I do find the CSB an easier read than my NASB or ESV, but I preach from the ESV. I'm seriously considering switching to the CSB for preaching and teaching.
I friend of mine who is a pastor switched from the ESV to the CSB last year for the exact reason you mentioned.
I might switch myself someday. Have a new main squeeze.
I switched over in 2017 from esv and nkjv to the csb for preaching and we’ve subsequently adopted it across all ministry ages with great success.
I'm almost religious about my study from both the ESV & NKJV, @@slawsonscot , and I appreciate your comment. I picked up a CSB in order to see what all the fuss is about. Very interested.
You da man!
I have to confess after watching Mr. Frisch discussing the CSB as well that, even with my HCSB, I know there are updates, and so I've ordered a 2017 version of the CSB. Once again I am waiting on the Post to arrive with a great anticipation. Recently got an ISV NT in paperback and like it as well. If I keep this up I may have to add shelves to my library!! Great video Mark! I enjoy so much.
Thanks for sharing!
The CSB is sooooo good!
In part due to a couple of your videos I decided to give the CSB a try and I have really been enjoying it.
Awesome! So glad! Let me know if there's a particular insight or two or three you achieve through reading the CSB!
Just got a copy of you book today and just started on the intro and already had a chuckle (trust me in a good way) I know I am going to enjoy this.
Just a passing note for a paperback the paper seems to be really nice quality. I have read the CSB all the way through and I know feelings mean nothing. But I always feel that this translation sits between the NKJV and the NIV. Thank you 🙏🏽
Enjoy! I’d LOVE to get an honest review at Amazon and/or Goodreads when you’re done!
Thank you for this detailed analysis! I made up my mind. I will study both the NLT version and the CSB version side by side. Maybe it will take longer to read and to understand the entire Bible, but my understanding will be off the charts. I am 67 and so very late in life to study the Bible and to move deeper into Christianity. Thanks for helping us out.
Very well said, brother Mark. Your Christian common sense and scholarship are a real gift to us all.
Many thanks for the kind words!
I love the ESV but rescued a brand new CSB from a garage sale and I really like it as well it's solid.
Excellent!
The CSB is the best Bible translation for these four reasons, but watch video for detailed explanations and qualifications:
0:50 If your church already uses it.
2:49 If you want an optimal balance between accuracy and readability.
19:51 If you can't decide between formal equivalence vs. functional equivalence.
21:29 If you want to be free from the tribal partisanship in choosing a Bible translation.
As the worship leader at my church, I get the scripture readings ahead of time and read through them as I prepare for Sunday. The CSB wasn't a Bible I used for my preparation, and in fact I hadn't really used it for anything in my own personal study...but I decided these past couple of months to give it a fairer shot than I had been giving it. Well, I happen to appreciate far more than I had. I still will always use my KJV for memorization as I always have, but I will officially say that the CSB is now my weekly goto when I do my diligence in music preparation. I am really enjoying the perspective it gives more than any of the other modern translations
Nice! Glad to hear this! It's a good one.
I love your insights into Bible translations.
Happy to serve!
FANTASTIC video! I LOVE the CSB! Probably about a year ago the CSB became my primary and preferred translation. It's cool to see the data supporting the "optimal equivalence". Thanks for the video!
Excellent!
I've gone through every English translation over the last 10 years and for overall English clarity sans "biblish" as well as staying relatively close to the original languages (clarity and accuracy), I think that overall, the CSB is the best....for us. I used the '95 NASB for over 20 years, and just recently made the definitive switch to the CSB in my ministry and personal use and couldn't be happier. They knocked the ball out of the park on this one.
Then you'll love my next video! Drops Thursday!
Are you OSAS or faith plus works. Just curious. I believe the kjv is the best wich covers osas and more help against Satan's lies and attacks of the faith. Might have to use along with another translation and dictionary but the help of strong faith pays off
@@donaldwortham6227 To put your mind at ease, I grew up using the RSV and about ten years ago switched to the ESV when I graduated high school (because it is actually in print). I also believe (quite firmly in fact) that a born again person cannot lose their salvation. I've come to realize that which translation one uses is of little importance compared to reading the Bible with context in mind. I also am very convinced that eternal life is given to those who simply believe in Jesus. I would gladly defend that belief from the CSB. In fact I've actually done that using the CSB while talking with Mormon missionaries.
@@nobodyspecial1852 I don't understand the point you're trying to make. So people shouldn't interpret the Bible in the context of the discourse they're reading?
You've gone through all 151 translations of the Bible in the last 10 years? Are you sure about that? Or is that hyperbole?
This is a great video. I was looking for a Bible translation for my elderly father, who would say he is a Christian, but never reads the Bible. Instead I found a great teacher and the answer.
And check out the other videos in The Best Bible Translation series!
I too was one to think that the word for word bibles were "better" than the thought for thought ones and therefore started with the NKJV then moved to the NASB for my main bibles. But our pastor uses the CSB and I have grown to love it and also give more of a chance to other thought for thought translations like the NLT that I looked down upon when I was first saved and learning about different translations.
Thank you for this video. It was very interesting.
Right! All good translations have their uses!
Wow. What a mini master class. Thank you for this.
You're very welcome!
Although I respect the ESV & it’s what my church uses, I find it hard to read as my daily. So I use CSB as my daily then cross reference and study with the ESV. I’m an idealist and want there to be one perfect translation. Obviously that’s not possible but these two together are probably the best I can find.
Enjoyed your much more relaxed demeanor in this outdoor setting! Thank you for such an in depth evaluation.
Glad you enjoyed it!
For someone who hasn't read much at all of the CSB translation, is it somewhat of a safe assumption that it is a good middle ground between something like the NIV or NLT and the ESV?
Yes!
I'll have to check that out. I was super encouraged to hear that the ESV is so literal because in my mind, it is eminently readable as well.
✔
Excellent video, Mark. Really helpful. I've always been more of a NASB/ESV/KJV guy but as I've gotten older, I've realized just how valuable translations like the CSB and NIV are in helping people understand what they're reading. Now I have to decide between the CSB and NIV! :-)
You don't have to decide! Get 'em both!
NIV for me and NKJV as my secondary
Would love a video like this on the NET.
Planned!
@@wardonwords Please check their rendering of "pornea" in Matthew 5:32 and 19:9. The translator's notes talk about this some, but it seems irresponsible to distribute the main text without the notes, as when being too broad, someone might be led astray.
Ohhhh, so that is why, after all these years, I have settled on the CSB. Thank you for the information.
Any time!
Thank you for making this video. I just bought a copy of the CSB and so far I have really liked it.
P.S. That camp is one of my favorite places!
Yes! I loved it there!
Hey @markwardonwords at around 8:45 you mention the seeming impossibility of a computer accurately diagramming every sentence of the bible. A year later, chatGPT was released, and we've started to scratch the surface of what AI could do. Do you still think your statment is true? Impressive as it is, chatGPT struggles with accuracy, but diagramming seems like something well suited to AI. In a wider sense, can you make any recommendations for who is thinking/writing/working on bible translation / analysis with AI? I've heard some people discuss moral dimensions of AI (i.e. misrepresentation of someone), but not much in this area. Imagine a bible translated into a language for the first time entirely by humans, and then AI is used to assess its accuracy/readability, and suggest areas that may need refinement?
Thank you very much for this episode, I'm a big fan of the CSB Bible.also I found your episode very informative and enjoyable. God Bless my friend.
Thank you!
I have to say I enjoy just reading the CSB! It is very refreshing. I often refer back to the Linear Bible to see exact word for word Hebrew and Greek. In the end, I rely on the Holy Spirit to help me understand God’s Word.
Awesome! More power to you!
This was so helpful in my growing in knowledge of different translations. Thank you for sharing this!
Glad it was helpful!
Love it! Great job, Mark!
Thank you, sir! Means a lot!
Data Scientist here who recently become interested in bible translation. Looks like I am getting a CSV.
Thank you. I found your channel through Sean McDowell's. I find myself sometimes becoming overwhelmed with which bible I am going to read. I have many to choose from. It was interesting to see all the other walkers went iut if the way to not interrupt the video.
You are so welcome! You can’t go wrong with one of the major evangelical versions. The CSB would be an excellent choice.
When comparing Ephesians 1-3 with the ESV compared to the NIV I found something interesting, apart from when you said in the Greek it is, you being dead in the trespasses and the sins of you, which is translated you were dead, the word here is a past tense, but the word being is a present tense, if I was to translate it I would put you are dead or keep the word you being dead, which makes more sense, however this may be neither here nor there, but when I get down to Ephesians 3 the NIV says deserving of wrath whereby the ESV says sons of wrath, which holds two different meanings, the NIV deserving of Wrath is an act of punishment, but sons of Wrath is an act of character, those who belong to this world are sonsof wrath because they bring forth wrath, but the sons of God bring forth mercy, as it is shown when Christ is weeping for Jerusalem, while at the same time the disciples want to bring forth fire from heaven to destroy them, so Christ says to them look at your spirits, your character the content of your hearts,
My home is CSB/HCSB that is it is our base translation. This is the argument I used to pick it. "I lost my KJV that Dad and Mom gave me when I was 11. But my wife could not read it anyway and a family should all have the same translation for reading around the table. And I am a Baptist and the church I am going to uses the ASV so I want to check that."
Oh My KJV was lost at church but in the mercy of God it was found one year later. So I have it and can still read this one KJV that has been my friend and spoken Word of God to me for 32 years.
Interesting! Two good translations!
Great presentation of this analysis. I usually use ESV for personal study and the CSB for preaching.
Thank you, and I like that plan!
I do the same
Thanks for the presentation. I purchased not long ago, a CSB larger print paperback not too long ago. I wanted to see how it stacked up against my favored NKJV. That I have a quality large print copy of. I was impressed with the CSB. And will buy another one in the future. . Possibly in leather or hard cover.
Hope you enjoy it!
20:15 One of your best comedic moments.
. . . and John Piper
John Piper won.
I was going back and forth for a long time. I used the NKJV, and ESV. When I took over the youth I settle down on CSB. Im Pentecostal so maybe I’m part of small circle in our sect that use it. It reads out loud easy and it so easy to understand and it accurate. I understand more, so I know the youth has to understand it more. Our church doesn’t really have official translation we use but it leans NKJV.
Excellent!
Have you made any videos about the NET yet or said anything about the NET yet ?
If so. Could you send me a link to it ?
Not yet. Hoping to. Planning to.
@@wardonwords I hope so too.
Cause I'm definitely interested in your thoughts.
I've been fascinated in it ever since I briefly saw a video of a TH-camr who switching from the CSB to the NET because he felt the NET is closer to the original Greek and Hebrew then the CSB. I also looked it up on got questions and it says that like most dynamic translations it's a bit interpretive. But nevertheless it's more formal than most dynamic translations. Given the fact that it has more note I just want any other English Bible there is I'm definitely interested of a brilliant scholar such as yourself
Mark - funny question for you: have you ever seen the episode of Star Trek: The Next Generation titled "Darmok"? Apart from the joy of seeing Paul Winfield in anything he's in, this episode essentially stars issues of translation, in ways that underscore points you make regularly.
Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra! Yes! I need to go rewatch that one in light of what you've said!
In all of these charts, I am charting where the NRSV is, and it seems its right where it belongs: in the middle, right on the heels of the CSB, but modest in its balance between literal vs readable. In other words, "as literal as possible, as free as necessary".
I’ll bet you’re right. But I’m just not familiar with the NRSV.
I think you’ll find the Ignatius NRSV second Catholic edition, to be an even more accurate translation. They got rid of a lot of the inclusive language and it seems more conservative. The Ignatius Bible has a nice layout.
Even though I do agree with a lot of what he says before you decide you should actually read the CSB or its predecessor the HCSB. In particular the changes made to the two versions of the Lord's Prayer found in these bibes.
Wow..the Larry Flint shot... so relevant and hard hitting.
;)
At the time Holman was publishing the HCSB , a study from the Masters Seminary, of a match between literal to the various translations, found that the HCSB was more literal than the NKJV . Don’t know how the CSB will match up.
Got a link? Very interested in this.
No. False. Not even close. If the NKJV got anymore literal, we'd be reading about joy in people's kidneys.
I found a CSB Apologetics Study Bible at a thrift store and picked it up to check it out. I really like it although as one who grew up in the church of the 1980s when everyone was either KJV or NIV, some of the passage changes (like Psalm 23 and the Lord’s Prayer in Matthew) took some getting used to. I get why they made the changes for optimal readability.
My current pastor looooooves his NASB77 but I have no issues following along with the CSB. I use the CSB now for daily reading and a NASB for comparing and contrasting. My ancient, threadbare, NIV84 now enjoys retirement.
Great choice! Enjoy The Best Bible Translation!
"My ancient, threadbare, NIV84 now enjoys retirement."
Aaaaaww! I love my NIV 84 Study. It lives in its case/cover these days. It's still in pretty good shape, but it does feel fragile. It has so many personal notes/highlights in it. It's like a diary of my life for so many years. It's one of the first things I'd grab if I had to run out of the house in a fire!
I used to be Mormon and was therefore in the KJV-only camp. Since being drawn by God, I've taken great interest in Biblical translation. Thanks for the great info.
My pleasure!
I take my HCSB Minister's Bible to all my pulpits (gypsy pastor) and listen to it on CD audio every night.
For me, it's the best ever.
I think I’ve seen that edition. If I’m remembering right, it’s a nice one!
Thanks, Mark. I appreciate your explanation of the CSB analysis previously done. I know Holman has been using that X-Y graph as a marketing visual since the CSB was published. Curious if the analysis was independent or funded by Holman??? Also, I would assume that the 2020 update to the CSB would not altar the conclusions very much. Opinion? Thanks for all you are doing!
It was paid for by Lifeway, I believe. This makes it less than fully trustworthy. But I examined the methods and approve of them.
The CSB feels good, I can bond with it.
Thanx, Pastor Mark.
🌹 🌹 🌹
Today is 10/24/2022, and I just got a brown CSB large print personal size bible in from off ebay. Its the 2017 printing. I've been waiting for this one! I'm so pleased to get it!! Great bible!! The double-column format is my favorite.
Awesome!
Yes these are the reasons I think the CSB is the best Bible (at least for my family)
More power to you!
Wow! Such a cool breakdown
✔
Hi Mark. Thanks for your ministry. I've been really enjoying your videos here in Australia. Extremely edifying. My pastor uses the NLT and it seems at our church everyone uses a variety of translations (which can be seen be the bible is read before it is expounded - usually NIV or NLT). I serve at our evening congregation and regularly preach. I usually use the ESV as it has been my main squeeze for the last 6 years. I like my wide margin to preach from, as it is my main devotion Bible. I've been prayerfully considering switching to the CSB as my main preaching Bible ( I use multiple translations in my prep including the NLT and the CSB). I lean towards the more formal side of things, but I appreciate the CSB...I did like the the HCSB, as it was the rage while I was at Theological College. Recently your thoughts on 1 Cor 14 have had an impact on me. Hence, my prayerfully considering what translation I preach from. It is just hard when there is no 'one' translation at our church. I know all our evangelical translations are good. My time at college taught me that. But I just can't bring myself to use the NLT ( I do refer to it at times) for serious text work in my preaching. Any thoughts?
Grace and Peace,
Benny
I'm still working this out, after all these years. The strongest answer I have for you right now is that it probably isn't accidental that expository preaching ministries, in my experience, tend not to go much further toward the functional end of the spectrum than the CSB or NIV. Ironically, I think I'd tend to stick with tradition here: the KJV gave us a good balance of formal vs. functional renderings. That balance has proven its utility over time. But I won't stand on tradition against other Christians, only (when necessary, of course) on Bible. I absolutely preached expositional sermons from the NIrV to my tiny, functionally illiterate outreach "congregation" for 5 or so years.
@@wardonwords Wow! I'd like to hear more about that experience using the NIrV for that congregation for half a decade. Could you do a video about that sometime?
I only wish the CSB translation committee would make the expanded Apocrypha available - in the Bible - between the Testaments.
I really like the CSB, I’m glad it exists. However, for memorization, I’d still pick the KJV, NKJV, and ESV in that order
I used to only want the most literal translations until I learned Spanish and had to translate sermons. I realized that translation is complicated and can be done in many different ways faithfully. I think CSB is a great line between thought-for-thought and word-for-word translating.
AMEN AMEN!!
The CSB is the translation I recommend the most. I may recommend other translations for specific purposes (the NRSV and ESV for more academic or literary contexts, the NLT and GNT for more casual, less study-oriented reading, and so on), but the CSB is the one that I can point to as the current standard for a well-balanced translation.
For instance, I find that the CSB does quite well in deciding when to retain or rework an idiomatic or figurative phrase. The translations in the Tyndale tradition love their Hebrew idioms a bit too much at times, and other translations are sometimes too quick to scrub out an undesirable metaphor.
Even so, I recently noticed an example in Joshua 7.5. I leave it to you to decide if this one was a good call.
Let's run though the KJV progeny first:
- NKJV: [T]herefore the hearts of the people melted and became like water.
- NRSV: The hearts of the people failed and turned to water.
- ESV: And the hearts of the people melted and became as water.
- NASB'20: [A]nd the hearts of the people melted and became like water.
- MEV: [A]nd the hearts of the people melted like water.
They're fairly consistent, as one would expect. Surprisingly, most of the "mediating" versions (NIV, REB, NABRE, NET, and CEB) are quite similar to the "formal" versions in this passage. They all decided to retain the imagery in some fashion.
Meanwhile, the "dynamic" versions do what you'd expect, with the NLT offering a bit of a compromise:
- GNT: Then the Israelites lost their courage and were afraid.
- NLT: The Israelites were paralyzed with fear at this turn of events, and their courage melted away.
- CEV: [A]nd the Israelite army felt discouraged.
- GW: Israel’s troops lost heart and were scared stiff.
- MSG: The heart of the people sank, all spirit knocked out of them.
But then the CSB decides to favor the less literal approach, breaking from the earlier HCSB:
- HCSB: As a result, the people’s hearts melted and became like water.
- CSB: As a result, the people lost heart.
The CSB's phrasing has the benefit of capturing the original Hebrew idiom's meaning with an English idiom that shares the word "heart." And the odd imagery of melting and water could certainly break a reader's concentration's in a read-through, while the figurative language itself offers hardly any additional clarity to the text. But at the same time, there is an argument to be made for keeping the text a little weird and alien as a reminder of its ancient vintage. Still, I'm willing to defend this choice.
Excellent analysis. This is a great example of why having and checking multiple translations is beneficial.
Im currently going through Alter's Hebrew translation; Ill let you know how he handles that. (Currently out of town,). (Look at that beautiful language of the NLT, though!)
@@joest.eggbenedictus1896 Alter loves Hebraisms, so I expect it would be especially literal.
@@MAMoreno You have it nearby? Im far from home camping!!
@@joest.eggbenedictus1896 I just checked it. Alter's wording is strikingly similar to that of the NRSV: "And the people's heart failed and turned to water."
Awesome analysis!
Glad you enjoyed it
@Mark Ward I'm a late comer to your work, but I love it. What's more, I LOVE that you snuck that little line in from "The Horse and His Boy" when talking about the KJV only meme. AWESOME!
I love Narnia!
Welcome aboard!
Nice presentation. I like the CSB even though I also have a lot of others...
My favorite is the ESV but I like the CSB as well. My wife prefers the NLT which I do not really care for. Her NLT is falling apart from use so I am not about to try to convince her that my preference should be hers. Appreciate your work.
The CSB would be a good middle ground for her between the ESV and NLT.
I still can't get away from the NKJV but your videos are truly given me courage.
Nkjv is a good choice!
Loved that you brought up Arika Okrent's excellent book, In the Land of Invented Languages!
LOVED that book!
Great break down of readability vs. accuracy. I love the CSB but that is not the only one I study from. I do find it interesting that you filmed this at s KJV camp 😲
It’s not KJV-Only. I wouldn’t preach at a camp that is doctrinally committed to KJV-Onlyism.
@@wardonwords I didn't really think they were.
Great video and your humor was on point near the end! 🤣🤣🤣
;)
This was an excellent discussion. Thank you.
My pleasure!
I haven’t really given CSB a chance yet, I absolutely love ESV for reading and bible study although I grew up memorizing from NIV with some verses in NKJV or KJV. Maybe I will pick up a CSB for some bible journaling
Sounds great!
By the way, where can I get a shirt like yours?
I want to look casual and intelligent. The shirt might help.
Goodwill. ;)
Hi. Please some things I have t read from CSB make me wonder if they lean toward once saved always saved. If I am in error I apologize but do wish to point out that there is more at stake than readability etc. there are important belief differences as well.
I really don't think so, my friend! I think proponents and opponents of perseverance of the saints are probably able to use the same Bible translation.
I wonder where the Berean Standard Bible would fall?
I have insufficient knowledge.
Great writing, Brother Ward. Love your presentations. (Third time through😁).🌹🌹🌹🌹
Wow! An honor!
I really appreciate that the weights and measurements are in standard American terms that I can understand without having to stop reading and go figure out what the measurements would be in standard then do the math
Yes, a nice thing! A difficult question for translators. I don’t think there is one right answer. I’m glad to have both.
@@wardonwords do you know of any videos or articles explaining why cross references are different from translation to translation? Or even better could you make a video on that?
@@Rexpbass They're all just judgment calls made by various editors, editors who are trying their best (almost certainly based on the work of past editors) to make connections between passages. That's why they differ. Does that make sense?
@@wardonwords yes sir, thank you so much!!
I'm going to leave some important information below that many have never seen. It may make some angry or even confused as to why I'd post it on this video. If it does I do apologize but it really is that important. If it helps just one person it would be so worth it and if that person gets it they will share in my love, freedom and joy. Study is so important and one day a week is simply not enough. Buying into all the falsehoods of why it's not true or can't be His Word is deadly. With the amount of proof we now have in this age of abundance of information there's simply no longer any excuse or argument to be made. So here goes and for those that do read it please just think about what it means and will mean for you if you take it seriously:
The case for Biblical accuracy and how we know we have the absolute, proven true Word of God in our modern Bibles if they maintain a word for word translation or as close as possible.
First let's look at secular history and written sources that are taken as matter of fact. These other books and writings from antiquity are held up as truth and in some cases factual history.
These other books/poems and there evidence/sources, data:
Second most common manuscript document Homer's Iliad meaning there are more copies of it than any other secular writing/document from antiquity of which only 643 exist dating from 13th century AD. Homer is believed to have wrote it in the 8th century BC.
The Gallic Wars of Cesar in 1st century BC, there are only 10 manuscripts of that in existence dating over 1000 years after they were supposed to have been written.
Herodotus wrote of history and is known as one of the first historians 5th century BC and only 8 manuscripts exist and they are from more than 1300 years after he wrote anything.
History of the Peloponnesian War written by Thucydides. There are only 8 manuscripts that are from 1300 years after he supposedly wrote his account.
These are just a few examples but it doesn't get any better by adding more.
Now let's look at Biblical proofs:
There can be no doubt as to the accuracy of our current Bibles as it is proven via all the source fragments, scrolls, papyri, codex' and sources dating all the way back to before Christ around 700 BC for the OT and between 100 to 150 AD for the NT. There is no doubt and no room for any argument against these facts. We have more proof for God's Word than any other written word in history and it is by order of magnitudes more as in some 66,000+ such sources for Scripture.
The early Church Fathers prior to 325 AD:
Those known as the Anti-Nicene Fathers writings contain over 32,000 quotes from the New Testament from which we could reconstruct the entire/complete NT from just those.
They also contain over 19,000+ quotes from the Gospels alone again from prior to 325 AD.
All these sources allow us to be critical when it comes to the level of accuracy in our Bibles.
The oldest manuscripts end The Gospel of Mark at chapter 16 verse 8. It is the perfect ending to Mark's Gospel when you think about it as there really was no more that needed said.
There is a lot of evidence that anything after Mark 16:8 was added later gathering parts from all the other Gospels and even Acts. There have been many ideas put forward about why the rest was added but none truly fits, things such as knowing Mark's intent and inspiration and that had he been able he would have added to his Gospel. That after Peter was martyred he stopped short due to that but if you read his Gospel there's no need for anything to be added. There's also some idea that there's a lost ending but how can you think that if you don't even know if such an ending existed? So a bunch of endings began to appear, tacked onto the original Autograph. We have an abundance of evidence that prove anything after 16:8 was added later.
4th Century Church fathers Eusebius and Gerome both wrote that Mark ended at 16:8. Many, many other very early Church Fathers knew these alternate endings existed and didn't use them or just denounced them.
This is a huge error in both the KJV and NKJV both of which are based on more recent manuscripts that the older manuscripts disprove. So those two translations have the added ending consisting of anything after Mark 16:8 in the Gospel of Mark. Newer translations may or may not include the additions after Mark 16:8 but if they do they're bracketed or mentioned in the notes in the margins, sidebar or at the bottom of the page.
The external evidence, (oldest sources), indicates that anything after 16:8 does not belong in the Gospel of Mark because those additions simply do not exist in them.
The internal evidence is that it is all borrowed from the other Gospel accounts and Acts. The transition from vs 8 to 9 is very awkward as in no transition from the story of the women, the use of a masculine pronoun, why would Mark also identify Mary Magdalene as the one whom Jesus cast demons from again, the angel spoke to Jesus' followers and told them He would appear to them in Galilee, the vocabulary is not Mark's there are 18 different words he never used, completely different structure to the writing, all these out of place themes, signs that don't appear in any of the other Gospels and the weird discussion of them like serpents and other such oddities are foreign to Mark.
We don't know who these additions came from but we know where they got them:
(below are not time stamps but Chapter and verses)
.16:9 = is taken write out of Luke 8:1-3
.16:10 = John 20:18
.16:12 = Luke 24:13-32
.16:13 = Luke 24:14
.16:14 = Luke 24:36-38
.16:15 = Mathew 28:19
.16:16 = John 20:23
.16:17-18 = drawn from a lot of sources: Mathew 10, Mark 6, Luke 10, just a lot of stuff cobbled together. Acts 23-26 and Acts 28:3-6 Paul's encounter with the Asp/venomous snake. None of it after Mark 16:8 makes any sense and adds more than a little confusion with the discussion of signs/miracles and other such things. It is clear to see what was written after 16:8 was not inspired as the rest of his Gospel surely was.
This was all done by someone or a group who thought Mark's ending was to brief. To help him get a "better ending" in their eyes because they couldn't accept how he had ended his. His True Gospel account of the life, death and resurrection of Christ Jesus and the awe and wonderment of it all.
Why does Mark end the way he does?
It was just how he wrote, look at the beginning of his Gospel and all throughout it reads like a highlight real of Christ's Deity and that He is in fact the very Son of God. He made the point and was done he didn't need to go further.
Mark's last words were about fear, a Godly Fear of our Lord and the pure awe and wonderment of Him.
No other book in history has the proof the Bible does, it is not even close. As I've shown because of the over abundance of source materials we can even be critical of what we have and know for certain whether we have His Word or not.
Biblical Historian/Theologian AT. Robertson said we have a vast array of Biblical Manuscripts/Sources that allow us to reconstruct the Bible with more than a 99.9% degree of accuracy.
With the number of archaeological excavations, (25,000+ and counting to date). Add in the current excavations under way throughout the Middle East, it is only a matter of time until we see more ancient biblical texts uncovered. Given the recent search for more Dead Sea Scroll caves, this may be sooner rather than later.
The Bible is the very Word of God and It is a collection of eyewitness accounts written by other inspired eyewitnesses.
There's no longer any excuse for anyone to ignore that fact or to dispute it.
The evidence simply does not support their arguments/views.
Take care and God Bless...
And also it's about trust. We can trust the peer reviewed translations/transliterations and have faith in the work our brothers have done to bring them to us. Do we actually think God shot Himself in the foot and threw a wrench in His own plan when He confused our language into languages at Babel? No, He knew what He was doing. God does not honor translation cults, God honors and reveals Himself to the heart that diligently seeks Him, often times before an individual even picks up a Bible for the first time.
God is so gracious!
Fascinating
Thank you kindly!
Dr. Wu can start a new analysis of degrees of Literalism vs. Fidelity.
People that get stuck on literalism but fail to appreciate nor adhere to the fidelity of the idea(s) being communicated I encounter all the time.
Lately, one person said that "If it's more literal, then it's more accurate!"
I would place my money on the horse that neighs "This person only knows one language fluently".
Thanks, Mark
As to various bible translations: I own 1560 GENEVA, 1599 GENEVA, KJV, NKJV, HCSB, NASB 1995, NRSV, ESV, NIV mainline translations. The research volumes are YLT, 5 Greek to English NT renderings, 3 Septuagints, 2 concordants and probably one or two others I can't recall at present. I have a decent library. And I actually use all of these when doing research on a particular topic. My main daily carry bible is my now 35 year old Nelson NKJB double-column wide -margin bible that is filled with deletions, edits, and additions and corrections. It is a MY translation.
Good list!
I was today years old when I learned Lojban exists. I just did a quick search but I could lose hours looking into that! I do love this stuff. Language, in and of itself, is a miracle.
You HAVE to read In the Land of Invented Languages:
www.amazon.com/dp/0812980891?tag=3755-20
@@wardonwords I saw the title and thought the same! I will do so soon. Tackling Moby Dick and a few others right now.
My church uses the CSB. It's good
What kind of church? What denomination?
@@wardonwords Baptist ... independent
Where can I get a physical copy of the Painfully Literal Version? 😁
lsbible.org/
Just kidding!
Great stuff, Mark. Thanks for this.
Thank you for watching, and for the kind word!
superbly done
My pleasure!
Noticed the fine print
;)
I would love to know what translation out of them all does Mark (op) personally use and why?
Thanks
I do tend to use the ESV as my default, because it hit me at a key time in my life (it came out as I was starting seminary); because it immediately leapt out to the front of the pack when it came to quality typography, and I care a lot about that; because it had many nice editions; because it stands squarely in the KJV tradition and is (to my mind) the KJV's most natural heir; and because I got a nice copy given to me by a mentor.
@markwardonwords I have an esv also. I Wanted to stay with the newer found older dated critical texts so got the ESV. But i have found it does seem alot like the kjv in wording. So I was wondering if I was to get one of these new fresh translations that's not a revision from the kjv family, which would you recommend out of them eg csb niv net etc.
Thanks
@@krissaundersjoinery2881 CSB!
@markwardonwords wow fast response. Thanks. I have been looking at the csb but worried it is biased towards baptist denomination? The read up on niv seems like it's a cross denomination and unbiased however gender issues and loose.
@@krissaundersjoinery2881 I haven't seen credible allegations of any passages with a Baptist bias. The committee who translated the CSB was not all Baptist.
In your opinion what is the overall true to the word Bible translation?
th-cam.com/video/gFsQv7Z4jis/w-d-xo.html
That’s my answer!
When a translation like this comes out, how is it the "standard" version? Standard according to whom or what?
Agreed. It’s a marketing term.
"Standard" used to mean "an American translation in the lineage of the KJV." Now it's part of the handful of words that get randomly shuffled around to make a translation name, alongside "Revised" and "New."
Agreed.
@@wardonwords If it's a marketing term, then this is not of God; _"Ye cannot serve God and mammon."_
_Matthew 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon._ (KJV)
@@libertypastor1307, my friend, "Authorised Version" is a kind of marketing term, too-just from a different era. It was never actually "authorized" by anyone. It was "appointed to be read in churches." Marketing is not in itself wrong. It becomes wrong when it tells lies or acts manipulatively. But my Christian friends at Zondervan and Holman and other places are not, to my mind, guilty of doing these things. If they are, God only knows. I cannot see it.