Later EDIT: As some of you pointed out, Durandal is not a Form. Durandal is at Equinox level, which is basically when a human fully awakens their stigma. Forms are people created inside the stigmata like Veliona and that one person I'm not gonna mention because of spoilers but if you know, you know. I apologize for the confusion! Please note that this is a THEORY video. The presented content is speculative, based on information and dialogue presented to us in the latest story chapters. Also, I know that there is some information presented to us in the latest chapter from the CN server that could be added here, but I purposefully chose to ignore it since I don't want to talk about unreleased content on GLB, and I want to experience the chapter in-game first, and not rely on fan translations that often times lack context and cannot offer a complete understanding. Rather than haphazardly talking about things I don't fully understand, I prefer to take my time and tackle them in a future video when I'm confident that I fully understand the chapter's content with the added context. Thanks & Please SUBSCRIBE!!!
Just a somewhat minor correction. Stigmata awakened people aren't Form. Durandal is an Equinox rather than Form, according to Will of Stigmata. Form is basically a stigmata crystallized in human form. Imagine if Veliona or Will of Stigma could materialize a physical body in the real world. That's what a Form is. A human with an awakened stigmata is not even close to that, though maybe if they could awaken their stigmata to a higher level they would become kinda like that. I'm not sure about that though. In any case, there's only one Form that we know of but I'm not gonna say who it is because it's a pretty big spoiler.
@@elysainempire4628 Everyone had a stigmata from birth, not just Mei. But Mei stigmata is not awakened because she became a Herrscher. A Herrscher is the opposite of an awakened stigmata. In fact, awakened stigmata can interfere or even destroy a herrscher core. This was revealed in chapter 33.
@@elysainempire4628 He said all people have stigmata. He didn't need to name Mei specifically. Also, Seele's stigmata is not a Herrscher stigmata anymore. It was modified in the PE and turned into a Project Stigma stigmata. So now it's not a herrscher stigmata anymore. I's the same type of stigmata as the Kaslana stigmata, which is also a Project Stigma stigmata. Those stigmata are fundamentally different than Herrscher stigmata. Seele inherited her stigmata through her bloodline, just like the Kaslana stigmata is also passed down through the Kaslana bloodline.
@@elysainempire4628 Dude, I can't read all the wall of text. I don't have that kind of time. I'm just gonna explain a few things quickly. First, every human has a "natural stigmata." They're dormant (not awakened) though, and most of them are degraded after many generations of mixing DNA. There are some that don't degrade due to special modifications done by Fire Moth, like the Kaslana stigmata. Still, all "natural stigmata" come from the same source: Fire Moth. They were all designed by Mobious and Dr.MEI. They aren't truly natural. Now, Seele's stigmata is a special case. As Veliona explains to Seele in the Azure Waters manga, Seele's stigmata was encoded into human DNA in the PE. Veliona doesn't say who encoded it, but it's probably Mobious since she was the one doing that kinda of research in the PE. This stigmata isn't a herrscher stigmata anymore since it's compatible with Project Stigma. We know this for a fact because Seele was transported to the moon by Project Stigma. Not only that, but in chapter 32, Hare says that Veliona is the same kind as Hare. This means she's the opposite of a Herrscher. Veliona is not like HoV or HoS. Those are Herrschers personas. Veliona is not like that. She's like Hare, the crystallization of stigmata. It's a totally different thing enterily.
Now that you talked about the stigma being an idealized version of the host i just realized how Durandal is exactly what Cecilia wanted her to be, her child that can grow and become the best without being in the shadow of her parents and the herrscher persona of Mei is also what Mei wanted to be strong and confident
11:54 "you can say that humans are the Imaginary Tree itself" This is exactly how Akashic Records work - a collection of human thoughts throughout time, preserved in a special space Genshin also has a more overt reference to this, i.e Irminsul, which is also a tree
Irminsul is NOT a preservation of human thoughts through time. It's data from thoughts of every sentient being from the 'past', 'present', and 'future', broken down into data which is timeless, which is why chronology is meaningless to the irminsul tree. The data _manifests_ as memories when stuff leaks out from the tree, but that's ultimately just a manifestation, not the true form of the information inside its roots/branches. The imaginary tree is the 'structure' that hosts all possibilities within the universe: it exists in a higher dimension since it's a concept beyond three dimensions, it's in an 'imaginary' realm since it's not a concept meant to have a material form or meant to be bound by physics or rules of existence, it's a 'tree' because it has branching worldlines that are all parallel worlds of each other but is ultimately just _compared_ to a tree. It's more like the fabric of the universe, the foil to everything that has ever existed, exists, and could exist- by not really 'existing' as anything more than a concept. Meanwhile the irminsul tree isn't a 'concept'. It's real: just because it's a tree that can't be seen or touched or accessed by normal means, doesn't mean it's not a tree. Its branches and roots aren't 'metaphors' they are actual roots and branches with a distinct color and shape (perhaps it may look different to different people, or have a different form in higher dimensions, but it has a material form. it's appearance in the game file isn't just a placeholder for something that can't be visualized (in contrast, there's no way to truly visualize a branch of the imaginary tree, apart from waving a hand and saying the universe we live inside in right now is a branch.) Perhaps an imaginary dimension even higher than the dimension the imaginary tree 'exists' on could 'flatten' the tree to make visualizing it possible (in the way we flatten a 3D object in artworks onto our 2D screens) but at a dimension so high, I don't think 'material forms' and 'visualization' will even retain any meaning. The Irminsul tree is far, far less complex than the Imaginary tree in concept.
WOW. How you combined quantum physics and the theory of ideas made my mind blow it was like mental orgasm! I never thought of this but yes quantum superposition is very similar to the forms found in different dimensional states when you think about it. Both superposition and form exist in a different level compared to real world. And a superposition decides its spin property when it's observed just like how forms turn into real world objects when a human consciousness puts a grasp on it. Like how the idea of "apple" is very constant in every human but apples in real world are very very different. Although theory of ideas work on sentience and real world and quantum superposition works on subatomic particles. It's actually extremelly thought provoking how Plato could come up with such a theory in ancient greece and how we are starting to find similar things in subatomic world. IT MUST BE ALIENS
Phenomenal video! One thing I'd like to point out (though you may have chosen the consciousness quantum theory purposefully cuz it may have made more sense) is that, from what I studied for quantum physics, quantum phenomena actually does not collapse (has definite value) unto reality until it is somehow measured. The measurement can be any interaction; like a bounce, a crash, like an impact with another thing that was already collapsed, like another particle. I think this somehow relates to why future Ai-chan does not want her name to be revealed to seele in ch. 31
Thank you for both explaining Honkai universe and also feeding my fantasy world with much more information so I can just sit around and fantasise about an alternative Honkai lore in my head😂❤️
14:18 "Veliona is not PE HODeath but a projection of a "perfect Seele" from Stigma Space" What if it's instead... in the Imaginary Space there's this being/collection of infos/"data" called "Seele", which is then projected through the real world in different ways? It can explain the PE Seele (who is HODeath) and Current Era Seele sharing some characteristics Come to think of it, THIS is probably how "Mihoyo copy-paste/expy characters" work across their games
Honkai has a great story with many hidden meanings between it. But sadly most people don't understand it due to its complexity and say it's mid. I would say it just fails to deliver its message in a more simpler manner for everyone to understand but it's true that honkai has a really good story. Take the elysian realm for example. It's story was simple to understand so everyone liked it so much.
12:37 "my theory is that Stigmata are a projection of the Stigma Space in a lower dimension in the form of marks on people's bodies" I guess this explains the "space" where Mei and Kiana's consciousness meet each other in chapter 28? It's probably the Herrscher Stigma version of Stigma Space Though with how the "natural Stigma" is genetic and how it's diluted by the process of inheritance, I dunno how it's gonna be connected to Stigma Space by your theory - perhaps this just mean people who lack stigmata can't connect to the Stigma Space?
Yes, people that don't have Stigmata can't connect to Stigma Space. That's why Project: Stigma exists, to "force" that connection for every human on Earth.
@@HomuLabs Maybe you'd be willing to recap how the Project Stigma work? (Or maybe in another video) IIRC the project pulls most normal humans into a "dream world", where their dreams will coalesce into one being called "Adam Ruhani" who will become the "new humanity" while the old humanity will become its "stigma"? I think what you said about "imaginary renormalization" has to do with the way the project works too
Man, I bet thousands of people would love to see the summary of the final arc, since the story being uncomprehensible reaches its peak there I think. Looking forward to future videos
You have taken my brain and chucked it out the window… I have always been curious about stigmata, I think they’re really cool, but boy was that a lot to digest. I got maybe half of what you said there😂 I did enjoy the video tho
I want hoyo to show us what all the herrscher’s stigmata look like, we know what Death, Thunder, Wind, Fire, and Void look like, (ironically all the cores Sirin had) but not any others…
Amazing work! 😍 I would also expect Stigma research by Dr Mei was possible due to support of Elysia. Then Stigmata as such would be Marks of God Child on its followers / choosen ones - confirming Elysia being Jesus of Honkai 😎
Very good explanation sir!!! but I think the proper analogy for the will of the stigma can also be taken from Plato's Chariot Allegory. There is a charioteer who controls two horses that black and white horses. The dark horse (appetites, concupiscence, and bodily desires and lusts or in this case the power of the imaginary tree) and the white horse (boldness, heroism or in this case the desire of humanity).
As a side note for a topic I did not create: For those who are hung-up on Himeko's death in HI3rd and get sad over that (myself included) keep in note what HomuLabs brought up about Himeko and Artificial Stigmatas' fatal drawbacks. Himeko was on the brink of death even before fighting Herrscher of the Void, she knew she was dying. And rather than using on herself the Honkai-suppressing thing she was given, to buy her abit more time to live, she decided that her death is more meaningful to save someone important to her: Kiana. By sacrificing herself while suppressing the Honkai energy inside Kiana's body to free her from HoV's control, her death had more meaning to it, to save someone she cares about. Had Himeko used it on herself, the fluid would only temporarily halt her demise from her Artificial Stigma. As the Honkai energy within herself cannot be permanently suppressed by that. By suppressing the Honkai energy in Kiana, she gave time for Kiana to be free, stopping the Herrscher of the Void without killing Kiana. Unlike how a "certain group of people" would've handled that situation of Kiana being controlled by HoV, they would've tried to kill Kiana entirely. Wherever they would succeed to take her down, is highly unlikely, since HoV can send more and more Honkai Beasts to fight on her behalf, when she herself is super strong. I want to keep on going with this wall of text, but I ran out of things to say
9:38 "Imaginary spaces are how imaginary number translated form math to physics" Actually physical representation of imaginary number is already exists. That is a phase. Mainly used in wave. Imaginary notation used to write the energy that not yet to be seen at the wave. Another example is an electrical circuit : a full representation of voltage in AC circuit is : V(t) = V0*cos(wt) + i*V0*sin(wt) When you measure the voltage you only can get the real part : V0*cos(wt) as for the imaginary part, the energy are stored on energy storing device (like capacitor on inductor). In conclusion it is exists but not yet to be seen. But yeah you can also say that the energy are stored on some imaginary space
so if the honkai that we see in HI3 is just one of the endless forms that it can take. is the abyss from gneshin possibly be another form of the honkai? it's kinda hinted that genshin is on the imaginary tree so. . . it's possible it is said the the abyss in not from teyvat and the symptoms that people experience when exposed to abyssal energy kinda resembles the weaker form of honkai infection.
Thank you so much for giving form to these confusing concepts. The effort of the game devs in applying these in the story and the gameplay itself is superb and needs more recognition. 😭
5:01 The reason the Artificial stigmata is a defect is not because it’s a copy buts it’s a imperfect copy, if it was a Perfect Copy ands possibly more than that it would have been in Equal in Everything and possibly even Better
Great video! I've been a honkai fan for a while now but I only just found your channel. Very good deep dive and theory connections! I really appreciate that you actually researched the quantum physics concepts that the honkai writers love to use
A question to the educated captain. Do you think it is a good thing for the story to be this complicated? Judging from this video and others from your channel, not only do you need to read the enormous amount of lore that is already in-game but also study or research about Philosophy and Physics. I can already guess that most Honkai players are fans of sci-fi and such, but I can also guess that a majority of players have not majored in these fields/ just want to be intrigued by how they blend and mold real history with their own. Would love to hear your opinion (or any captain).
There is no right or wrong way of telling a story IMO. It all depends how you choose to look at the situation. Honkai is miHoYo's love letter to EVA, so being this complicate and heavy on technicalities is to be expected. If you want to look at the situation from a game marketing and development perspective, it's a bit counterproductive to have a convoluted story like this because not many will be able to follow it due to it's major time investment that it requires to make sense of it. On the other hand, Honkai is a niche game, that focuses on a very specific type of player that enjoys these kind of themes and complicated universes. It's clear that HoYo makes Honkai because they like doing this stuff. They are otakus at the end of the day, and they wanted to make a game where they don't have to hold back anything and just do what they want. It's fine if you accept it and take Honkai for what it is. That's why they are much tamer with Genshin for example, because they want the game to appeal to a large audience, meanwhile, for Honkai they are focused on a specific niche.
Eyyyy, you used my stigma traces, nice! Good video dude, very informative. (I can tell they're mine, cuz a), I made them, b) I still have them and can compare and c) the Kaslana stigma's center sword had a trace error at its tip at the bottom, there are two pointy tips there).
Wait wait wait. Isn’t there that theory that Genshin is a version or project arc? What if it’s a version of project stigma. Gnoses are either herrscher cores or legendary stigma, while visions are natural stigma people awaken. Visions mostly seem to be gained in a desperate moment or at a time when someone embraces their true selves. And that would make delusions artificial stigma- a copy of a copy with negative health effects
I actually think that Forms are opposites of their hosts. I don't think that Senti is the ideal version Fu Hua, and yes even though she's a newborn Herrscher, she still kept her childlike personality until this day. Corruption is another infant Herrscher but it soon matured and even learnt to copy Elysia. Veliona and Seele's case is too obvious already so yeah
How I feel replaying this video every ten seconds but still understand absolutely nothing: 😋🥰😍😘 I see that you have a good command of knowledge on Honkai lore though, so props to you!
That confirms without a doubt that "Veliona" is the personification of the herrscher of death. Who knows, maybe in the next chapters we might get to see Seele awaken her true powers. Btw your explination was spot on, you really made it easier to understand the origin behind the stigmatas. Keep up the good work :)
just remembered when my friend got into Honkai after i did, and he mistook stigmata for the eye problem astigmatism “what are stigmata, is that like the eye disease?” lol
I think that the naming convection for this concept it's an interesting debate. I saw some people not really satisfied with the word "from" in the english localization. To me, the word makes sense as a reference to Plato. But I think that in this context, both "forms" and "ideas" works in the same way, since the "forms" described by Plato are essentially ideas.
@@HomuLabs From Wikipedia: The word idea comes from Greek ἰδέα idea "form, pattern," from the root of ἰδεῖν idein, "to see." The way WOS Kevin pronounces it in JP follows the original Greek pronounciation too But yeah, it's still a reference to Plato's Theory of Forms (which is sometimes called "Theory of Ideas")
So, stigma awaken is like awaking to your persona, your imaginry self. The person you dream to be, and I assume for some people this works differently because Seele stigma its self took the form of Seele, while others just got really powerful. If the reality that people see is just a projection of a higher exsistance then when you are stigma awakened its reversed to where you're no longer tied down by the limitations of reality? And as for natural stigma, if it's in the human genome and all humans have it, but for many, it lays dorment unactive. Does that mean the ones with an active natural stigma are the only ones that can be stigma awaken? And stigma awaken are the closest to the new humans AKA the ideas/forms? And thats why stigma awaken people wont lose there bodies durning project stigma? While project stigma forces the rest of humanity with dorment stigma to lose there physical body and become there stigma self the (ideal self/imaginry self/form)? Anyway is this sorta right? Sooo sorry for wall....
You know what i think is fascinating? Abyss Lance that should have the stigmata of Death only has the Shariac stigmata. Judah which should have the Stigmaga of binding has the Kaslana Stigmata. In the manga about the divine keys they are represented via the Herrscher stigma but that iconography is not consistent at all. I think the original concept was to put a soulium shell over the DK assigned to the person who can weild the key. Hence why we get Shariac and Kaslana stigs. But that was quickly dropped as it creates a bunch of extra work in the long run
That's a great point! I'll go back and check again just to be sure. But from my understanding of what the Will of Stigma said, a human that fully awakened their stigma is called an Equinox. Now, Forms can be both humans with fully awakened stigma and stigma people like Veliona and Hare. Since I am pretty sure that in Ch 28, he called Durandal both a Form and said that she achieved Equinox. Anyway, I'll check again and add it to the pinned comment if I'm wrong. Thanks for pointing this out! Edit: I went back and checked. Seems you are right. There is a clear distinction between Forms and Equinox.
if the devs take inspiration from christianity, they must be well aware of the concept of body, soul, and spirit in human. the spirit portion, some kind of "will" that transcends the soul and can connect with God, could be equivalent to stigma in the honkai universe. the people who passed the selection process of project stigma might be the people who at least have the awareness of spirit-level. Li Sushang achieved it by means of discipline teaching from Fu Hua, Dudu achieved it by means of bloodline and events happened throughout her life, while the four herrschers probably achieved it when they made contact with herrscher core which is gifted directly by the god.
And here alot of si alway thought of project stigma as just the bomb in arc city Also I wonder what the elysian realm characters ( flame chasers) thought when they realised that some normal person connected a lot of dots of their world and even analysis it just cause they enjoy the game that base of it
Ok, this shit is way more confusing than I thought, but I would like if I said the video was not informative and at least provided some context as to why Kevin is doing what he's doing. But I think I will mostly think of Stigmata as the "Gacha equip for the waifu you want" :)))) But I subbed cause this video was good and funny.
Why are they so hot? a truer question has not been asked ;) Joking aside, this was a very informative video considering its very hard to wrap ones mind around it considering the game's bad english translation at times. Gonna watch the other video once i finish part 3 thats coming out today.
Best way to start is to take a note and a pen. (or open a word document) Then go on TH-cam, watch videos, and write down the most important things. I recommend channels like PBS Space Time and Dr Ben Miles for theoretical understanding, and The Action Lab for a more practical understanding of the processes. Also, if you ever want to go more in-depth into a concept, Wikipedia is your friend.
I knew about seele having the herrscher of death stigmata but not the core -- does that mean if she obtained the core/gem from kiana would she become HoD? would any core work or would it have to be that one specifically? does the type of gem/core + stigmata not lining up affect the nature of the herrscher manifestation? thanks for the vid and I await your project sigma one because you have a real knack for communicating complicated subjects in a way that's easy to grasp.
For Seele obtaining the gem, yes she would probably be Herrscher of Death, it would be that one specifically (you wouldn't have Mei and Kiana suddenly become Herrschers of Void and Thunder if they have opposite cores of that element?) I don't think stigma affects it but idk
Question about the power of the Herrschers in Honkai impact3. The wiki says they are about equal to judgement class Honkai but they lose to the 13 flame chaser. Which are people with emperor class honkai right? (Idk know much about the flame chasers cuz I’m not that far into the story but aren’t they just people with the emperor class inside them.) so is emperor class>Herrschers?
Probably not. What the video didn't say is that the stigma Seele has is not a Herrscher stigma anymore. It was re-coded by someone from Fire Moth (probably Mobious) and turned into a stigma compatible with Project Stigma (Herrscher stigmata are incompatible with it). So Seele's stigma has a different evolutionary path than a Herrscher stigma. A powerup for Seele would probably consist in achieving a higher level of stigma awakening rather than becoming a Herrscher. Stigma awakening has various levels as far as we know: base level (Seele is here), Equinox level (Durandal is here). So Seele can still grow stronger by getting a higher awakening.
@@1idd0kun but that is the evolutionary path of the stigma without the core so the question was if she somehow obtain the gem of serenity from kiana and somehow awaken it into a core. She can technically hold the title "herscherr" as it seems that the only requirement for it is a functioning core/authority. Perhaps a stigma awakener with herscherr title. I know it's kinda opposing since natural stigma awakeners are the opposite of herrschers based on this video but how i imagine it is that since veliona is the manifestation of the natural stigma, seele (base ego) could become the honkai/herscherr will of the core (like mei and herscherr mei back in the HotV arc) so her body will house 2 wills that can evolve independently (veliona, a natural stigma that can become a form/equinox and seele, the will of the core that can become a herrscher). Moreover, seele hasn't been shown using the white flower but i believe she will take on the creation side of the core and become the Herscherr of Soul (or something like that since it balances life and death, creation and corrosion). Just speculations Edit: i'm using veliona to address the stigma born ego of seele. I know they already embraced each other as the same. Just to make it less confussing
Hmm.... Actually Kiana doesn't need to give Seele the gem. Maybe. Remember what happened to Mei? Once Seele fully awakened as a Herrscher, the gem inside Kiana will vanish and reconstructed inside Seele. Then why Seele never became a Herrscher? Yes. She has GREAT potential as one. But my personal guess is that she unconsciously reject any notions about it. Because if Seele truly awakened as a Herrscher, a battle would truly start between Seele and "Seele". I forgot where but once I've ever read somewhere that "Seele" exist as a "method of coping" for Seele until she is "ready". When the time comes, they would duke it out to determine which one among them to exist.
@@b.ardner6903 so if seele one day transforms into herscherr of death veli will be erased probably or be supressed by the herscherr ego?or maybe veli will be the herscherr ego?idk theres too much to theorize about that
@@en9719 I think if Seele became a Herrscher, Veliona would disappear, because their nature are opposite. In chapter 33 we see how the stigmata can interfere and even destroy a herrscher core. They're totally incompatible. Seele could become a Herrscher but she would have to give up on Veliona who is the crystallization of her stigmata, and I don't see that happening.
9:04 I'm not a physics expert but I wanna know: 1. Are you implying here that by classic physics, being "lightspeed apart" means that the 2 particles shouldn't move in a coordinated way anymore? 2. Do particles even "communicate"? You talked about how theoretically it'd be hard for 2 particles to communicate when they're "lightspeed away", but you're jumping 1 spaces ahead here - i.e if "communication" was somehow why the "quantum entanglement" was possible in the first place, you didn't make that clear yet here 3. How exactly can we (as an observer) tell that 2 particles that are quantum entangled will move to opposite directions even if they're "lightspeed apart"? I thought manmade direct observation becomes hard to do when the thing we observe is light years away from us
1. Think about this way. Also, remember that in the field of quantum physics we are mostly talking on a theoretical spectrum based on observation. If both particles are in opposite corners of the universe and one of the would suddenly change the direction it moves, the other would do the same. Using classic physics, there is no way for them to "communicate" to each other the fact that they started moving in another direction that fast in order for the other one to adapt. 2. We don't fully understand quantum entanglement yet. It is just a process that we have observed. They must "communicate" somehow, because otherwise the process itself wouldn't be possible. We apply the concept of Imaginary Space when disusing the process because we don't understand it and just assume that they must exist in a higher dimension as one unit for the process to make sense for us. Most of what we know about Quantum Physics is based on theory and speculation. 3. Based on what we observed and know about quantum entanglement, it's a process that remains constant no matter where the particles are situated in space. So it doesn't matter if the particles are right next to each other, or in opposite corners of the universe, based on our observations the process should still be the same.
@@HomuLabs 1. Okay, clear enough 2. Just for the sake of analogy, I think there are other phenomena in physics that are about "if X changes in a certain way, the Y that is connected to X also changes in a certain way"? I.e I'm trying to use another phenomenon to explain quantum entanglement, rathet than the word "communicating" - the problem is that, well, I dunno if there are any kind of phenomenon like that 3. So you mean, we (i.e researchers) did observe that the particles will move in the opposite direction even if they're, say, 150 million kms (the distance light goes in 1 sec) apart? I mean, I thought "movement" is a relative measurement based on whatever the observer deems as the "point of reference" and that, if the thing observed is more than 150 million kms from the observer, whatever it is that "detects" the particles' movement will get a delayed/not-real-time result (or am I getting it wrong?)
2. I believe that the issue here is the fact that you try to apply common logic to understand the process when that is not the correct way to approach it. The truth is that scientists don't understand quantum entanglement. It's a process that just happens and has been observed among subatomic particles that are intimately linked to each other. It's like they have an invisible string that connects them and can process and transmit information faster than the speed of light. Scientists believe that for that to be possible, the particles are in fact the same particle that travels in a higher dimension and is projected as two different particles in our perception. There is another process that is linked to it called quantum superposition, which represents the ability of a quantum system to be in multiple states at the same time until it is measured. So, until observed by somebody, both particles can exist in multiple states. So, think of it as the same particle that can exist in multiple states (spin to the left, and spin to the right) until observed. When observed, they take one of those positions in the perception of the observed. That's what we call a quantum collapse. 3. Well, researchers did not observe them that far apart because it would be impossible. This is just an assumption based on what we observed and understand about the process.
@@HomuLabs 2. So the order of logic goes that, when scientists observe a peculiar pair of particles that are always moving to the direction opposite to each other, they deem them to be in a state of "quantum entanglement"? Btw quantum superposition is basically Schrodinger's Cat right? 3. So it's still only hypothesis as of now... I asked this bc I know that when we see the "light of stars" in the night sky, the real star that gives that light might not be "there" anymore, but instead somewhere else
i needed this; the latest chapters are way too big brain for me🥲 also, Veliona is a Form according to Hare so you were rlly close i gues idk i'm too stupid🥲
You are right, but Veliona became a more recognizable name in the community. It's also easier for me to call her that, instead of saying "red Seele" or "the other Seele".
@@HomuLabs well yeah, but it can also be misleading to say the red seele as veliona... would be much better if you say 'alter-seele' tho... just sayin 👌🏻
@@WaldiKenway I'm not arguing about how canon it is to the main story. I was pointing out how they existed as actual names to correct your claim on how there is no Veliona.
Yeah, like the others said, "Veliona" is how she is referred to in the skills description for Stygian Nymph. Since before Ch 23 she didn't really have a name, people used Veliona when referring to her. There were a few people that brought this up today. I guess that for newer players that started after Ch 23 was already in the game it feels weird, so I will call her by her proper name from now on. I think that's better, and I also don't want to create more confusion.
@@HomuLabs oh ok i see i didn't know this was due to her skill i like the name Veliona and i wished that was her name in the game i am a new player and in the story i was waiting for the moment where they're going to call her like that... 😅
Later EDIT: As some of you pointed out, Durandal is not a Form. Durandal is at Equinox level, which is basically when a human fully awakens their stigma. Forms are people created inside the stigmata like Veliona and that one person I'm not gonna mention because of spoilers but if you know, you know. I apologize for the confusion!
Please note that this is a THEORY video. The presented content is speculative, based on information and dialogue presented to us in the latest story chapters.
Also, I know that there is some information presented to us in the latest chapter from the CN server that could be added here, but I purposefully chose to ignore it since I don't want to talk about unreleased content on GLB, and I want to experience the chapter in-game first, and not rely on fan translations that often times lack context and cannot offer a complete understanding. Rather than haphazardly talking about things I don't fully understand, I prefer to take my time and tackle them in a future video when I'm confident that I fully understand the chapter's content with the added context.
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Just a somewhat minor correction. Stigmata awakened people aren't Form. Durandal is an Equinox rather than Form, according to Will of Stigmata.
Form is basically a stigmata crystallized in human form. Imagine if Veliona or Will of Stigma could materialize a physical body in the real world. That's what a Form is. A human with an awakened stigmata is not even close to that, though maybe if they could awaken their stigmata to a higher level they would become kinda like that. I'm not sure about that though.
In any case, there's only one Form that we know of but I'm not gonna say who it is because it's a pretty big spoiler.
Yeah. Thanks for the correction! The English translation was a bit confusing on that part and I misunderstood.
@@elysainempire4628
Everyone had a stigmata from birth, not just Mei. But Mei stigmata is not awakened because she became a Herrscher. A Herrscher is the opposite of an awakened stigmata. In fact, awakened stigmata can interfere or even destroy a herrscher core. This was revealed in chapter 33.
@@elysainempire4628
He said all people have stigmata. He didn't need to name Mei specifically.
Also, Seele's stigmata is not a Herrscher stigmata anymore. It was modified in the PE and turned into a Project Stigma stigmata. So now it's not a herrscher stigmata anymore. I's the same type of stigmata as the Kaslana stigmata, which is also a Project Stigma stigmata. Those stigmata are fundamentally different than Herrscher stigmata.
Seele inherited her stigmata through her bloodline, just like the Kaslana stigmata is also passed down through the Kaslana bloodline.
@@elysainempire4628
Dude, I can't read all the wall of text. I don't have that kind of time. I'm just gonna explain a few things quickly.
First, every human has a "natural stigmata." They're dormant (not awakened) though, and most of them are degraded after many generations of mixing DNA. There are some that don't degrade due to special modifications done by Fire Moth, like the Kaslana stigmata. Still, all "natural stigmata" come from the same source: Fire Moth. They were all designed by Mobious and Dr.MEI. They aren't truly natural.
Now, Seele's stigmata is a special case. As Veliona explains to Seele in the Azure Waters manga, Seele's stigmata was encoded into human DNA in the PE. Veliona doesn't say who encoded it, but it's probably Mobious since she was the one doing that kinda of research in the PE.
This stigmata isn't a herrscher stigmata anymore since it's compatible with Project Stigma. We know this for a fact because Seele was transported to the moon by Project Stigma. Not only that, but in chapter 32, Hare says that Veliona is the same kind as Hare. This means she's the opposite of a Herrscher. Veliona is not like HoV or HoS. Those are Herrschers personas. Veliona is not like that. She's like Hare, the crystallization of stigmata. It's a totally different thing enterily.
I dont know we got here, from Hannah set to a stigma set full of MEMES
Hannah m, if u upgrade it the materials go in her ass
Hannah’s stigmata is disturbing 🙂😐☹️
@HoshikosDream especially the-
It's making me tingles
somehow this video goes from honkai lore to a philosophyical nightmare about existence, mind and humanity
Pretty much in tune with the game itself I would say.
Now that you talked about the stigma being an idealized version of the host i just realized how Durandal is exactly what Cecilia wanted her to be, her child that can grow and become the best without being in the shadow of her parents and the herrscher persona of Mei is also what Mei wanted to be strong and confident
I didn't even think of this it really makes sense for that particular storyline!
11:54 "you can say that humans are the Imaginary Tree itself"
This is exactly how Akashic Records work - a collection of human thoughts throughout time, preserved in a special space
Genshin also has a more overt reference to this, i.e Irminsul, which is also a tree
This Theory Is Absolutely False sorry
@@Zino_Kohiruimaki your source?
Irminsul is NOT a preservation of human thoughts through time. It's data from thoughts of every sentient being from the 'past', 'present', and 'future', broken down into data which is timeless, which is why chronology is meaningless to the irminsul tree. The data _manifests_ as memories when stuff leaks out from the tree, but that's ultimately just a manifestation, not the true form of the information inside its roots/branches.
The imaginary tree is the 'structure' that hosts all possibilities within the universe: it exists in a higher dimension since it's a concept beyond three dimensions, it's in an 'imaginary' realm since it's not a concept meant to have a material form or meant to be bound by physics or rules of existence, it's a 'tree' because it has branching worldlines that are all parallel worlds of each other but is ultimately just _compared_ to a tree. It's more like the fabric of the universe, the foil to everything that has ever existed, exists, and could exist- by not really 'existing' as anything more than a concept.
Meanwhile the irminsul tree isn't a 'concept'. It's real: just because it's a tree that can't be seen or touched or accessed by normal means, doesn't mean it's not a tree. Its branches and roots aren't 'metaphors' they are actual roots and branches with a distinct color and shape (perhaps it may look different to different people, or have a different form in higher dimensions, but it has a material form. it's appearance in the game file isn't just a placeholder for something that can't be visualized (in contrast, there's no way to truly visualize a branch of the imaginary tree, apart from waving a hand and saying the universe we live inside in right now is a branch.)
Perhaps an imaginary dimension even higher than the dimension the imaginary tree 'exists' on could 'flatten' the tree to make visualizing it possible (in the way we flatten a 3D object in artworks onto our 2D screens) but at a dimension so high, I don't think 'material forms' and 'visualization' will even retain any meaning. The Irminsul tree is far, far less complex than the Imaginary tree in concept.
So Honkai Impact is basically a game used by physicists to teach students basic concepts. Got it.
WOW. How you combined quantum physics and the theory of ideas made my mind blow it was like mental orgasm! I never thought of this but yes quantum superposition is very similar to the forms found in different dimensional states when you think about it. Both superposition and form exist in a different level compared to real world. And a superposition decides its spin property when it's observed just like how forms turn into real world objects when a human consciousness puts a grasp on it. Like how the idea of "apple" is very constant in every human but apples in real world are very very different. Although theory of ideas work on sentience and real world and quantum superposition works on subatomic particles.
It's actually extremelly thought provoking how Plato could come up with such a theory in ancient greece and how we are starting to find similar things in subatomic world. IT MUST BE ALIENS
Fr though. He wasn't playing when he said. "I'm about to blow your mind." 😂
Good video!
Phenomenal video! One thing I'd like to point out (though you may have chosen the consciousness quantum theory purposefully cuz it may have made more sense) is that, from what I studied for quantum physics, quantum phenomena actually does not collapse (has definite value) unto reality until it is somehow measured.
The measurement can be any interaction; like a bounce, a crash, like an impact with another thing that was already collapsed, like another particle. I think this somehow relates to why future Ai-chan does not want her name to be revealed to seele in ch. 31
Yeah, honestly, I didn't want to complicate things even more than they already are.
wow. just wow.
At first I didn't think stigma is that important. It becomes reasonable that Mihoyo put arc about stigma in the end of the story.
How you made this so concise is beyond me. So many big concepts to establish and contextualise.. you killed it.
Bro studying quantum physics for a game theory.
Keep up the grind
Thank you for both explaining Honkai universe and also feeding my fantasy world with much more information so I can just sit around and fantasise about an alternative Honkai lore in my head😂❤️
just fantasize whatever you want, because whatever you fantasize, it is canon, in a bubble universe
Same, XD
0:15
now we're asking the real questions
11:42 actually I heard that in gun girls z there were an ancient being similar to Azathoth who could do same thing like that.
This theory makes so much sense for me i cant even see other explanations, you did a very good job, thank you
14:18 "Veliona is not PE HODeath but a projection of a "perfect Seele" from Stigma Space"
What if it's instead... in the Imaginary Space there's this being/collection of infos/"data" called "Seele", which is then projected through the real world in different ways? It can explain the PE Seele (who is HODeath) and Current Era Seele sharing some characteristics
Come to think of it, THIS is probably how "Mihoyo copy-paste/expy characters" work across their games
Seele herrscherr form soon please
Anyway nice theory
Helped me to understand Stigmata more
Honkai has a great story with many hidden meanings between it. But sadly most people don't understand it due to its complexity and say it's mid.
I would say it just fails to deliver its message in a more simpler manner for everyone to understand but it's true that honkai has a really good story. Take the elysian realm for example. It's story was simple to understand so everyone liked it so much.
12:37 "my theory is that Stigmata are a projection of the Stigma Space in a lower dimension in the form of marks on people's bodies"
I guess this explains the "space" where Mei and Kiana's consciousness meet each other in chapter 28? It's probably the Herrscher Stigma version of Stigma Space
Though with how the "natural Stigma" is genetic and how it's diluted by the process of inheritance, I dunno how it's gonna be connected to Stigma Space by your theory - perhaps this just mean people who lack stigmata can't connect to the Stigma Space?
Yes, people that don't have Stigmata can't connect to Stigma Space. That's why Project: Stigma exists, to "force" that connection for every human on Earth.
@@HomuLabs
Maybe you'd be willing to recap how the Project Stigma work? (Or maybe in another video)
IIRC the project pulls most normal humans into a "dream world", where their dreams will coalesce into one being called "Adam Ruhani" who will become the "new humanity" while the old humanity will become its "stigma"? I think what you said about "imaginary renormalization" has to do with the way the project works too
This is put very well together. Glad there is someone like you umaking videos about Honkai.
I learn more and more not just on Honkai but on different stuff as well thanks to these!
Man, I bet thousands of people would love to see the summary of the final arc, since the story being uncomprehensible reaches its peak there I think. Looking forward to future videos
I haven't understood anything that's happened since thunders over nagazora
You have taken my brain and chucked it out the window… I have always been curious about stigmata, I think they’re really cool, but boy was that a lot to digest. I got maybe half of what you said there😂 I did enjoy the video tho
I want hoyo to show us what all the herrscher’s stigmata look like, we know what Death, Thunder, Wind, Fire, and Void look like, (ironically all the cores Sirin had) but not any others…
This would be nice but I don't think they will.
Otto after meeting WoH: yeah thats how it feel
New knowledge added.
Mind = Blown
I wish you have a lot more subscribers because your videos give a lot of understanding to the game lores!
I have absolutely no idea what you just said, but it was a great video
Amazing work! 😍
I would also expect Stigma research by Dr Mei was possible due to support of Elysia. Then Stigmata as such would be Marks of God Child on its followers / choosen ones - confirming Elysia being Jesus of Honkai 😎
Seriously sometimes I wonder if the Honkai story writers are a bunch of weebs and quantum physics nerds. Like how tf they came up with those stuff?
Well... They admitted themselves that they're "Tech otaku"
Very good explanation sir!!! but I think the proper analogy for the will of the stigma can also be taken from Plato's Chariot Allegory. There is a charioteer who controls two horses that black and white horses. The dark horse (appetites, concupiscence, and bodily desires and lusts or in this case the power of the imaginary tree) and the white horse (boldness, heroism or in this case the desire of humanity).
what I can say your videos always blow my mind, keep it up champ
Finally I Understand Thx For The Explanation
As a side note for a topic I did not create: For those who are hung-up on Himeko's death in HI3rd and get sad over that (myself included) keep in note what HomuLabs brought up about Himeko and Artificial Stigmatas' fatal drawbacks. Himeko was on the brink of death even before fighting Herrscher of the Void, she knew she was dying. And rather than using on herself the Honkai-suppressing thing she was given, to buy her abit more time to live, she decided that her death is more meaningful to save someone important to her: Kiana. By sacrificing herself while suppressing the Honkai energy inside Kiana's body to free her from HoV's control, her death had more meaning to it, to save someone she cares about. Had Himeko used it on herself, the fluid would only temporarily halt her demise from her Artificial Stigma. As the Honkai energy within herself cannot be permanently suppressed by that. By suppressing the Honkai energy in Kiana, she gave time for Kiana to be free, stopping the Herrscher of the Void without killing Kiana. Unlike how a "certain group of people" would've handled that situation of Kiana being controlled by HoV, they would've tried to kill Kiana entirely. Wherever they would succeed to take her down, is highly unlikely, since HoV can send more and more Honkai Beasts to fight on her behalf, when she herself is super strong. I want to keep on going with this wall of text, but I ran out of things to say
Aight imma need to sit down
my brain is lagging from all these information
9:38 "Imaginary spaces are how imaginary number translated form math to physics"
Actually physical representation of imaginary number is already exists.
That is a phase. Mainly used in wave. Imaginary notation used to write the energy that not yet to be seen at the wave. Another example is an electrical circuit : a full representation of voltage in AC circuit is :
V(t) = V0*cos(wt) + i*V0*sin(wt)
When you measure the voltage you only can get the real part : V0*cos(wt)
as for the imaginary part, the energy are stored on energy storing device (like capacitor on inductor).
In conclusion it is exists but not yet to be seen.
But yeah you can also say that the energy are stored on some imaginary space
so if the honkai that we see in HI3 is just one of the endless forms that it can take.
is the abyss from gneshin possibly be another form of the honkai?
it's kinda hinted that genshin is on the imaginary tree so. . . it's possible
it is said the the abyss in not from teyvat and the symptoms that people experience when exposed to abyssal energy
kinda resembles the weaker form of honkai infection.
Yeah, on a universal scale, the abyss kinda seems like some sort of manifestation similar to honkai.
Thank you so much for giving form to these confusing concepts. The effort of the game devs in applying these in the story and the gameplay itself is superb and needs more recognition. 😭
my brain may not able to grasp everything but some points are clear to me it was a great video!
OMG, he has predicted Seele being a Herrscher of Death, that’s some good theorist sense right there
5:01 The reason the Artificial stigmata is a defect is not because it’s a copy buts it’s a imperfect copy, if it was a Perfect Copy ands possibly more than that it would have been in Equal in Everything and possibly even Better
Great video! I've been a honkai fan for a while now but I only just found your channel. Very good deep dive and theory connections! I really appreciate that you actually researched the quantum physics concepts that the honkai writers love to use
A question to the educated captain. Do you think it is a good thing for the story to be this complicated? Judging from this video and others from your channel, not only do you need to read the enormous amount of lore that is already in-game but also study or research about Philosophy and Physics.
I can already guess that most Honkai players are fans of sci-fi and such, but I can also guess that a majority of players have not majored in these fields/ just want to be intrigued by how they blend and mold real history with their own. Would love to hear your opinion (or any captain).
There is no right or wrong way of telling a story IMO. It all depends how you choose to look at the situation. Honkai is miHoYo's love letter to EVA, so being this complicate and heavy on technicalities is to be expected.
If you want to look at the situation from a game marketing and development perspective, it's a bit counterproductive to have a convoluted story like this because not many will be able to follow it due to it's major time investment that it requires to make sense of it. On the other hand, Honkai is a niche game, that focuses on a very specific type of player that enjoys these kind of themes and complicated universes. It's clear that HoYo makes Honkai because they like doing this stuff. They are otakus at the end of the day, and they wanted to make a game where they don't have to hold back anything and just do what they want. It's fine if you accept it and take Honkai for what it is. That's why they are much tamer with Genshin for example, because they want the game to appeal to a large audience, meanwhile, for Honkai they are focused on a specific niche.
Eyyyy, you used my stigma traces, nice! Good video dude, very informative.
(I can tell they're mine, cuz a), I made them, b) I still have them and can compare and c) the Kaslana stigma's center sword had a trace error at its tip at the bottom, there are two pointy tips there).
Yoo, thank you very much!
You're traces are amazingly well done! They are the only high quality stigma art you can find on the internet.
@@HomuLabs Well, thank you very much, I'm glad to have helped :)
Thanks for the video
Ah THANK YOU! This is so helpful :)
Artificial Stigmata are a suicide! Poor Himeko... 💔
Thank you, for the explanation my brain was leaking out of my ears trying to wrap my head around this plan.
ah, finally done with the story, and I can watch all your videos without protecting myself from spoilers!
Wait wait wait. Isn’t there that theory that Genshin is a version or project arc? What if it’s a version of project stigma. Gnoses are either herrscher cores or legendary stigma, while visions are natural stigma people awaken. Visions mostly seem to be gained in a desperate moment or at a time when someone embraces their true selves. And that would make delusions artificial stigma- a copy of a copy with negative health effects
Thanks a lot to you! Your video making more easy to understand honkaverse!
3:18 Oh~ I know what you did there sub guy. Very NICE touch
That last plan of changing the people in the real world kind of the same with Fire Force plot
Well there goes my brain
I actually think that Forms are opposites of their hosts.
I don't think that Senti is the ideal version Fu Hua, and yes even though she's a newborn Herrscher, she still kept her childlike personality until this day. Corruption is another infant Herrscher but it soon matured and even learnt to copy Elysia.
Veliona and Seele's case is too obvious already so yeah
How I feel replaying this video every ten seconds but still understand absolutely nothing: 😋🥰😍😘
I see that you have a good command of knowledge on Honkai lore though, so props to you!
That confirms without a doubt that "Veliona" is the personification of the herrscher of death.
Who knows, maybe in the next chapters we might get to see Seele awaken her true powers.
Btw your explination was spot on, you really made it easier to understand the origin behind the stigmatas.
Keep up the good work :)
i want to see a herrscher version seele
@@tonzhanlotus1299. Sa has fulfilled your wish
2:40 About the meaning of the stigmata, its wording in Chinese would be divine/holy mark.
Ohhh by the Way is “the wheel of stigmata” and “Conclusion” 16:05 sections in your video also a theory or a fact????
just remembered when my friend got into Honkai after i did, and he mistook stigmata for the eye problem astigmatism
“what are stigmata, is that like the eye disease?” lol
Hannah might be the projection of Captain's perfect self where He/She could actually fight alongside Valkyries in HI3 World
Holy shit such an open-minded story. I knew their games must be connected in some ways.
@ "Forms"
I'd personally call it "Idea" since that's what WOS Kevin called it in JP voice
I think that the naming convection for this concept it's an interesting debate. I saw some people not really satisfied with the word "from" in the english localization. To me, the word makes sense as a reference to Plato. But I think that in this context, both "forms" and "ideas" works in the same way, since the "forms" described by Plato are essentially ideas.
@@HomuLabs
From Wikipedia:
The word idea comes from Greek ἰδέα idea "form, pattern," from the root of ἰδεῖν idein, "to see."
The way WOS Kevin pronounces it in JP follows the original Greek pronounciation too
But yeah, it's still a reference to Plato's Theory of Forms (which is sometimes called "Theory of Ideas")
So, stigma awaken is like awaking to your persona, your imaginry self. The person you dream to be, and I assume for some people this works differently because Seele stigma its self took the form of Seele, while others just got really powerful. If the reality that people see is just a projection of a higher exsistance then when you are stigma awakened its reversed to where you're no longer tied down by the limitations of reality? And as for natural stigma, if it's in the human genome and all humans have it, but for many, it lays dorment unactive. Does that mean the ones with an active natural stigma are the only ones that can be stigma awaken? And stigma awaken are the closest to the new humans AKA the ideas/forms? And thats why stigma awaken people wont lose there bodies durning project stigma? While project stigma forces the rest of humanity with dorment stigma to lose there physical body and become there stigma self the (ideal self/imaginry self/form)? Anyway is this sorta right? Sooo sorry for wall....
You know what i think is fascinating?
Abyss Lance that should have the stigmata of Death only has the Shariac stigmata.
Judah which should have the Stigmaga of binding has the Kaslana Stigmata.
In the manga about the divine keys they are represented via the Herrscher stigma but that iconography is not consistent at all.
I think the original concept was to put a soulium shell over the DK assigned to the person who can weild the key. Hence why we get Shariac and Kaslana stigs. But that was quickly dropped as it creates a bunch of extra work in the long run
They should really hire you to write out the scripts, you make this so much easier to understand hahaha
Isnt Dudu a Equinox. Its Herrschers - Equinox - Forms on the spectrum of ways to control honkai
That's a great point! I'll go back and check again just to be sure. But from my understanding of what the Will of Stigma said, a human that fully awakened their stigma is called an Equinox. Now, Forms can be both humans with fully awakened stigma and stigma people like Veliona and Hare. Since I am pretty sure that in Ch 28, he called Durandal both a Form and said that she achieved Equinox. Anyway, I'll check again and add it to the pinned comment if I'm wrong. Thanks for pointing this out!
Edit: I went back and checked. Seems you are right. There is a clear distinction between Forms and Equinox.
Yeah. Not all stigma awakened are Form level. Durandal is Equinox which is a lower level of awakening than Form. The only Form we know of is Hare.
waouh c'est incroyable et enrichissant. 00 merci.
How the hell did we got in this rabbit hole?! 😅
That's what I've been asking myself for a long time!
Are you somehow related to Christopher Nolan??? That's a higher level of explanation! Great job!
if the devs take inspiration from christianity, they must be well aware of the concept of body, soul, and spirit in human. the spirit portion, some kind of "will" that transcends the soul and can connect with God, could be equivalent to stigma in the honkai universe. the people who passed the selection process of project stigma might be the people who at least have the awareness of spirit-level. Li Sushang achieved it by means of discipline teaching from Fu Hua, Dudu achieved it by means of bloodline and events happened throughout her life, while the four herrschers probably achieved it when they made contact with herrscher core which is gifted directly by the god.
And here alot of si alway thought of project stigma as just the bomb in arc city
Also I wonder what the elysian realm characters ( flame chasers) thought when they realised that some normal person connected a lot of dots of their world and even analysis it just cause they enjoy the game that base of it
Homu Labs: "We ARE the Honkai!"
Perfectly balanced, as all things should be.
Do divine keys next.
Ok, this shit is way more confusing than I thought, but I would like if I said the video was not informative and at least provided some context as to why Kevin is doing what he's doing.
But I think I will mostly think of Stigmata as the "Gacha equip for the waifu you want" :))))
But I subbed cause this video was good and funny.
what did I get from this video:
fear about life, universe and consciousness. Also brain damage 😢
Why are they so hot? a truer question has not been asked ;)
Joking aside, this was a very informative video considering its very hard to wrap ones mind around it considering the game's bad english translation at times.
Gonna watch the other video once i finish part 3 thats coming out today.
Hey homu, would you be able to make a theory about seele being able to use the abyss flower with venolina, or have you alredy done that?
Maybe in the future.
10:35 GOLD😂😂😂
Also the theory Starting from 6:14 is Absolutely wrong and Time does exist in the imaginary Tree but it’s functions differently
How did we get in quantum physics and philosophy...
Btw do you have the source in where you study quantum physics?
I'm interested
Best way to start is to take a note and a pen. (or open a word document) Then go on TH-cam, watch videos, and write down the most important things. I recommend channels like PBS Space Time and Dr Ben Miles for theoretical understanding, and The Action Lab for a more practical understanding of the processes. Also, if you ever want to go more in-depth into a concept, Wikipedia is your friend.
@@HomuLabs thank you
Since Seele is the main mc in the latest chapter hope she can become a Herrscher
I knew about seele having the herrscher of death stigmata but not the core -- does that mean if she obtained the core/gem from kiana would she become HoD? would any core work or would it have to be that one specifically? does the type of gem/core + stigmata not lining up affect the nature of the herrscher manifestation? thanks for the vid and I await your project sigma one because you have a real knack for communicating complicated subjects in a way that's easy to grasp.
For Seele obtaining the gem, yes she would probably be Herrscher of Death, it would be that one specifically (you wouldn't have Mei and Kiana suddenly become Herrschers of Void and Thunder if they have opposite cores of that element?) I don't think stigma affects it but idk
Question about the power of the Herrschers in Honkai impact3. The wiki says they are about equal to judgement class Honkai but they lose to the 13 flame chaser. Which are people with emperor class honkai right? (Idk know much about the flame chasers cuz I’m not that far into the story but aren’t they just people with the emperor class inside them.) so is emperor class>Herrschers?
How strong would seele be then. Is she on the level of an S-class valk or higher like an emperor class honkai or maybe even a Herrscher
do a video explaining all the divine key's 🙏🙏
so if kiana gave seele the gem of serenity will she become a herscherr eventually?
Probably not. What the video didn't say is that the stigma Seele has is not a Herrscher stigma anymore. It was re-coded by someone from Fire Moth (probably Mobious) and turned into a stigma compatible with Project Stigma (Herrscher stigmata are incompatible with it).
So Seele's stigma has a different evolutionary path than a Herrscher stigma. A powerup for Seele would probably consist in achieving a higher level of stigma awakening rather than becoming a Herrscher. Stigma awakening has various levels as far as we know: base level (Seele is here), Equinox level (Durandal is here). So Seele can still grow stronger by getting a higher awakening.
@@1idd0kun but that is the evolutionary path of the stigma without the core so the question was if she somehow obtain the gem of serenity from kiana and somehow awaken it into a core. She can technically hold the title "herscherr" as it seems that the only requirement for it is a functioning core/authority. Perhaps a stigma awakener with herscherr title. I know it's kinda opposing since natural stigma awakeners are the opposite of herrschers based on this video but how i imagine it is that since veliona is the manifestation of the natural stigma, seele (base ego) could become the honkai/herscherr will of the core (like mei and herscherr mei back in the HotV arc) so her body will house 2 wills that can evolve independently (veliona, a natural stigma that can become a form/equinox and seele, the will of the core that can become a herrscher). Moreover, seele hasn't been shown using the white flower but i believe she will take on the creation side of the core and become the Herscherr of Soul (or something like that since it balances life and death, creation and corrosion). Just speculations
Edit: i'm using veliona to address the stigma born ego of seele. I know they already embraced each other as the same. Just to make it less confussing
Hmm.... Actually Kiana doesn't need to give Seele the gem. Maybe. Remember what happened to Mei? Once Seele fully awakened as a Herrscher, the gem inside Kiana will vanish and reconstructed inside Seele. Then why Seele never became a Herrscher? Yes. She has GREAT potential as one. But my personal guess is that she unconsciously reject any notions about it. Because if Seele truly awakened as a Herrscher, a battle would truly start between Seele and "Seele". I forgot where but once I've ever read somewhere that "Seele" exist as a "method of coping" for Seele until she is "ready". When the time comes, they would duke it out to determine which one among them to exist.
@@b.ardner6903 so if seele one day transforms into herscherr of death veli will be erased probably or be supressed by the herscherr ego?or maybe veli will be the herscherr ego?idk theres too much to theorize about that
@@en9719
I think if Seele became a Herrscher, Veliona would disappear, because their nature are opposite. In chapter 33 we see how the stigmata can interfere and even destroy a herrscher core. They're totally incompatible. Seele could become a Herrscher but she would have to give up on Veliona who is the crystallization of her stigmata, and I don't see that happening.
i love science and physics but i think you hurt my brain.
9:04
I'm not a physics expert but I wanna know:
1. Are you implying here that by classic physics, being "lightspeed apart" means that the 2 particles shouldn't move in a coordinated way anymore?
2. Do particles even "communicate"? You talked about how theoretically it'd be hard for 2 particles to communicate when they're "lightspeed away", but you're jumping 1 spaces ahead here - i.e if "communication" was somehow why the "quantum entanglement" was possible in the first place, you didn't make that clear yet here
3. How exactly can we (as an observer) tell that 2 particles that are quantum entangled will move to opposite directions even if they're "lightspeed apart"? I thought manmade direct observation becomes hard to do when the thing we observe is light years away from us
1. Think about this way. Also, remember that in the field of quantum physics we are mostly talking on a theoretical spectrum based on observation. If both particles are in opposite corners of the universe and one of the would suddenly change the direction it moves, the other would do the same. Using classic physics, there is no way for them to "communicate" to each other the fact that they started moving in another direction that fast in order for the other one to adapt.
2. We don't fully understand quantum entanglement yet. It is just a process that we have observed. They must "communicate" somehow, because otherwise the process itself wouldn't be possible. We apply the concept of Imaginary Space when disusing the process because we don't understand it and just assume that they must exist in a higher dimension as one unit for the process to make sense for us. Most of what we know about Quantum Physics is based on theory and speculation.
3. Based on what we observed and know about quantum entanglement, it's a process that remains constant no matter where the particles are situated in space. So it doesn't matter if the particles are right next to each other, or in opposite corners of the universe, based on our observations the process should still be the same.
@@HomuLabs
1. Okay, clear enough
2. Just for the sake of analogy, I think there are other phenomena in physics that are about "if X changes in a certain way, the Y that is connected to X also changes in a certain way"? I.e I'm trying to use another phenomenon to explain quantum entanglement, rathet than the word "communicating" - the problem is that, well, I dunno if there are any kind of phenomenon like that
3. So you mean, we (i.e researchers) did observe that the particles will move in the opposite direction even if they're, say, 150 million kms (the distance light goes in 1 sec) apart? I mean, I thought "movement" is a relative measurement based on whatever the observer deems as the "point of reference" and that, if the thing observed is more than 150 million kms from the observer, whatever it is that "detects" the particles' movement will get a delayed/not-real-time result (or am I getting it wrong?)
2. I believe that the issue here is the fact that you try to apply common logic to understand the process when that is not the correct way to approach it. The truth is that scientists don't understand quantum entanglement. It's a process that just happens and has been observed among subatomic particles that are intimately linked to each other. It's like they have an invisible string that connects them and can process and transmit information faster than the speed of light. Scientists believe that for that to be possible, the particles are in fact the same particle that travels in a higher dimension and is projected as two different particles in our perception. There is another process that is linked to it called quantum superposition, which represents the ability of a quantum system to be in multiple states at the same time until it is measured. So, until observed by somebody, both particles can exist in multiple states. So, think of it as the same particle that can exist in multiple states (spin to the left, and spin to the right) until observed. When observed, they take one of those positions in the perception of the observed. That's what we call a quantum collapse.
3. Well, researchers did not observe them that far apart because it would be impossible. This is just an assumption based on what we observed and understand about the process.
@@HomuLabs
2. So the order of logic goes that, when scientists observe a peculiar pair of particles that are always moving to the direction opposite to each other, they deem them to be in a state of "quantum entanglement"?
Btw quantum superposition is basically Schrodinger's Cat right?
3. So it's still only hypothesis as of now... I asked this bc I know that when we see the "light of stars" in the night sky, the real star that gives that light might not be "there" anymore, but instead somewhere else
Yes, and yes, it's basically Schrodinger's Cat
i needed this; the latest chapters are way too big brain for me🥲 also, Veliona is a Form according to Hare so you were rlly close i gues idk i'm too stupid🥲
So did Kiana inherit the HoV stigma along with the core?
Btw, 'seele' is seele, there is no veliona... It's a battlesuit mode...
You are right, but Veliona became a more recognizable name in the community. It's also easier for me to call her that, instead of saying "red Seele" or "the other Seele".
@@HomuLabs well yeah, but it can also be misleading to say the red seele as veliona... would be much better if you say 'alter-seele' tho... just sayin 👌🏻
There is still Veliona, and even Saule, but only in one of the event stories. Still exists tho.
@@ashadyoutsider1195 not canon, and also both is battlesuit mode of stygian nymph
@@WaldiKenway I'm not arguing about how canon it is to the main story. I was pointing out how they existed as actual names to correct your claim on how there is no Veliona.
I just want to clarify again. Do Shicksal valkyries have artificial stigmata? Like, all of them?
Not all of them
Heya home labs wanted to ask do u have a discord server?
I don't have a discord for the moment.
💀man I gotta be Albert Einstein to under honkai lore
Teacher! Will this be on the test?
I feel like ive learned nothing, just left with more questioning.
I know its not his fault
Does anyone else feel like this?
I understand that it makes sense, but I don't understand the sense. Make sense?
Why evryone call dark Seele "Veliona" ? The game says that her name is Seele too ? Is Veliana her real name ? Cuz i've never seen it in the game... 😅
Fan name based from her battlesuit skill description
Makes it easier to identify Seeles dark Seele is called veliona cause of her skill name I guess
Yeah, like the others said, "Veliona" is how she is referred to in the skills description for Stygian Nymph. Since before Ch 23 she didn't really have a name, people used Veliona when referring to her. There were a few people that brought this up today. I guess that for newer players that started after Ch 23 was already in the game it feels weird, so I will call her by her proper name from now on. I think that's better, and I also don't want to create more confusion.
@@HomuLabs oh ok i see i didn't know this was due to her skill i like the name Veliona and i wished that was her name in the game i am a new player and in the story i was waiting for the moment where they're going to call her like that... 😅
And this is why we smarter than Genshin players.
My 1 digit iq stops at: waifus
💀