Professor Donald Hoffman - The Case Against Reality | The Tim Ferriss Show
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 มิ.ย. 2024
- Professor Donald Hoffman - The Case Against Reality, Beyond Spacetime, Rethinking Death, Panpsychism, QBism, and More | Brought to you by FreshBooks cloud-based small business accounting software freshbooks.com/tim and Athletic Greens all-in-one nutritional supplement athleticgreens.com/tim
Donald Hoffman ( @donalddhoffman) received a PhD in computational psychology from MIT and is a Professor Emeritus of Cognitive Sciences at the University of California, Irvine. He is an author of over 120 scientific papers and three books, including The Case Against Reality: Why Evolution Hid the Truth from Our Eyes. He is the recipient of the Distinguished Scientific Award of the American Psychological Association and the Troland Research Award of the US National Academy of Sciences.
His writing has appeared in Scientific American, New Scientist, LA Review of Books, and Edge, and his work has been featured in Wired, Quanta, The Atlantic, Ars Technica, National Public Radio, Discover Magazine, and Through the Wormhole with Morgan Freeman. His TED Talk, titled “Do We See Reality as It Is?,” has almost 4M views.
Please enjoy!
00:00 Start
00:32 The Helmholtz Club
06:15 Consciousness defined
15:50 Consciousness research: implications
34:53 Holographic model of the universe
32:28 Possible future technologies
43:53 Conscious agents
01:07:14 Panpsychism
01:14:06 The cosmological polytope
01:21:06 Portals to consciousness
01:37:12 QBism and quantum physics
01:44:51 Current interests
01:51:59 Spiritual connections
02:04:25 Fitness payoff function
Show notes: tim.blog/2022/04/13/donald-ho...
SUBSCRIBE: bit.ly/1dSzTkW
LINK TO ALL SHOW TRANSCRIPTS: tim.blog/2018/09/20/all-trans...
About Tim Ferriss:
Tim Ferriss is one of Fast Company’s “Most Innovative Business People” and an early-stage tech investor/advisor in Uber, Facebook, Twitter, Shopify, Duolingo, Alibaba, and 50+ other companies. He is also the author of five #1 New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestsellers: The 4-Hour Workweek, The 4-Hour Body, The 4-Hour Chef, Tools of Titans and Tribe of Mentors. The Observer and other media have named him “the Oprah of audio” due to the influence of his podcast, The Tim Ferriss Show, which has exceeded 500 million downloads and been selected for “Best of Apple Podcasts” three years running.
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For consciousness, see my papers, like "Meaning and Context: A Brief Introduction".
Oh my... Did Tim just reference TOE? As a huge fan, thank you Tim. It's an honor and a blessing. Feel free to reach out. - Curt
What's TOE? Please 🥺
@@kevincoakley6811 Theories of Everything channel th-cam.com/users/TheoriesofEverything
@@carneliansound1125 AHH, Thank you! 👍👽
Yes please interview Curt!!
TOE is a podcast by Curt that is excellent on physics, consciousness and the nature of reality, he interviews many great thinkers and goes deep
First talk in 63 years that made me want to be a mathematician
Physics is cool.
Yes! Lol
Me too! I’m watching physics classes on TH-cam at 64! When you are lucky enough to be born in the Information Age, one lifetime is not enough!!
I think many people think math and science is boring because school has given them the impression that those subjects are boring and something you just do because you have to. Donald Hoffman is a great example of a academic that dosnt make their subject feel stale and boring but instead intresting and fascinating.
@Cypher lmao
Donald Hoffman! Where were you when I was a frustrated neuroscience grad student/post doc!? As a neuroscientist who always thought materialism fell short when it came to consciousness, I find this interview as refreshing as an oasis in a desert one has been roaming for years.
I have always viewed those who seek answers though materialistic explanations as clowns.
Hoffman’s hypotheses are gonna go to a whole new level when he finally tries psychedelics
@Lutz That makes sense.
@Lutz I think you are right about that.
@@inveele 😂 nice one!
This level of metaphysical insight only comes from physcotropic interfacing. Those of us who have rangered in the trip world, this all sounds very familiar.
That’s what I’m saying. Would love to trip with this guy for suree
Hoffman is awesome.
This goes in the top ten - of single best podcast episodes I’ve ever heard on the internet. Thanks you guys
Every single podcast with Professor Donald Hoffman on it has been amazing. Thanks for this one!
Absolutely same!
Donald with Lex Friedman is my all time favorite podcast episode. Well, except for Shane mauss returns episode of Pete Holmes, but that's more in the "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas" vain.
Hopefully you're a big fan of Bernardo Kastrup then. Which in turn leads to Swami Sarvapriyananda and/or Rupert Spira
@@yourlogicalnightmare1014 Advaita (non dualism ),my way has been the opposite of what you said.
This is incredible. I am in awe of the great minds we see here and hear about from this conversation- thank you thank you thank you. This is the conversation I’ve been searching for & Donald so eloquently articulates our shared frustration with the physicalist framework in science and dogmatism in spirituality among so many other things. Thank you Donald for sharing your work, thoughts, feelings and more- your presence. Thank you Tim also for yours and your effort in curating this. Please have more conversations & share so we-the witness- could learn and grow as individuals and also as culture. May you and your loved ones be happy and healthy 💚🙏💚
Stay humble
Honestly, Donald Hoffman’s book blew my mind. I’ve never been the same since reading it. I’d recommend getting Phillip Goff on too, his ideas are pretty interesting
It is a very good book the world presented to us through our senses are symbols that the brain creates so we can function in it. However, these symbols are only reflections of the real underlying nature of reality. The qualia is a self-generated brain delusion, we cannot know the ding an sich.
There are indigenous people in this world who have no idea what blue means they cannot see it and they have no word in their native tongue to express it. Perceptual psychologists show us that our senses can be tricked which means the brain is making it up this means seeing is not believing its vice versa.
Get the experience behind the theory. it will blow your mind. meitate ;)
Amazing screen name btw. Or whatever the cool kids are calling it nowadays. #aol
IMHO as I am listening to your brilliant conversation, we are immersed in a field of universal and infinite consciousness, that is starting to become aware of itself by waking up each and every particle of itself through communication with each other. And through open communication of more and more brilliant minds such as yours, you will soon be able to prove “scientifically” that there is no death. There is only an expanding Living Consciousness that is based in one single Truth:
“There is nothing outside of this One Consciousness of ‘I AM❤️’ ”
Almost correct. It's not 'starting to become aware of itself' from the universal point of view. It has always been aware of itself. From the fractionated viewpoint (you, me, dogs, goats, pigs, rodents, insects, ...) most 'living' entities have instinct, feelings, intention, will, awareness, but they lack 'self' awareness as that is a mental construct they aren't capable of forming.
The leap from 'self' awareness to 'universal' awareness is too big a chasm for most humans to cross. We possess a lot of 'conditioned beliefs' that have been solidified over a lifetime, much longer portion of our lifetime than even religious indoctrination.
Most science proponents are so dogmatic they refuse to even consider their own direct experience as anything that should be trusted. If they literally met god in the realm of mentation, they would chalk it up to a delusion and check themselves into a mental hospital.
Religious zealots insist that ANY awareness that is foreign to their own is satan. Particularly universe travelling aliens, which would be greeted with guns and bombs by christians and muslims.
Most humans just aren't capable of getting to your understanding, and they'll be forced to live over and over and over until they do get it.
@@yourlogicalnightmare1014 Thank you for your amazing insight that it has always been aware of itself. Of course! The Universe inside of me is rejoicing in your brilliant logic!🥳 PS: You are not at all a nightmare!😂….More like a ‘LogicalEnlightenment’😊😇😉
thats a thought
I loved u having DON HOFFMAN ON!!! More people like him please!
good point--
I agree, i listen to Donald all i can- he's got some great ones on Youtbe- long ones too... only problem when you say "more like him " is that even though there's interesting folks out there, we dont have too many people around like D. Hoffman ... and very few as interesting.
What a fantastic conversation. I love listening to Donald Hoffman, and I think this may be my favorite interview yet. It was a wonderful way to spend the evening!
Thanks, Gentlemen- Great conversation!
The Tesla quote "The day science begins to study non-physical phenomena, it will make more progress in one decade than in all the previous centuries of its existence" seems to apply. Thanks for the contribution
Haha, i was going to quote the same, tesla was the only man who understood this shit even at that time 😀 imho
Yes and that’s why I think the portals he speaks of will have something to do with vibrations and/or frequency. Maybe we need to resonate at some same level as the greater reality..
at the end, if not love, does not make any sense..
Where, exactly, is the beginning of a circle?
Tesla was a genius.
This is one of my fav interviews with Donald Hoffman ever! Thrilling *
I really appreciate how this talk with Donald Hoffman went. Ive watched many interviews and talks with him; this one was particularly special- Tim you were able to get to some more sophisticated points with out over doing intellectualism. Enjoyed it!
The big picture description of what’s going sounds exactly like Alan Watt’s explanation of the basically Hindu worldview
I've also noticed the similarities between Donald's theories and Alan's talks regarding Hinduism. Great stuff.
Not so much Hinduism as Advaita Vedanta. Hinduism is a very loosely defined set of many traditions that exist under one umbrella. Hinduism, as a religion, came after the Vedas. They accept the Vedas as authority, but they are not really the Vedas. Rather, they are a set of traditions that has roots in the Vedas.
Highly underrated Donald Hoffman's interview.
So many good points and info in this one.
And then the thought at 2:03:20, insightful. And 2:10:10 :)
This guy got me looking at reality completely differently ever since I heard him on Lex Fridman.
I need Donald Hoffman podcast. I'm drawn to his ideas.
1:00:40 - 1:01:40 is another (very good) explanation of what Alan Watts called the Dramatic Model of the Universe which itself is a translation of Vedic philosophy. "All the world`s a stage .." and Consciousness (or God if you prefer) is so caught up in Playing that It forgets that it's a Show and mistakes Itself for the Persona (or mask or appearance) that it is Playing. That mistaking of the Appearance with Reality/Consciousness is who we appear to be and yet we are the very Show itself, all of It, in every moment.
The whole discussion put forth by Hoffman very much resonates with Realization at its deepest of depths. It is very much aligned. It makes perfect sense that he is a meditator (though not the only path to such realizations), but the discussion is focusing on HOW Consciousness IS primary and how it informs mind. Know ThySelf via negativa. I was impressed by how Hoffman was able to thread scientific terminology to point to it. Well done.
As a student of Tibetan Buddhism, this is right down my alley. I had a 2 month long DMT trip..(I was in a altered state after taking psycodelics and my family called the paramedics. The medics not knowing what I was on gave me a dissasosiave SSRI, prolongeing my trip. Before this, in an another event, I had returned from neurological death, so that's why my family called the paramedics.) .... it's a long story and if you want to know the whole thing I am glad to share...but I experienced the beginning of reality during the trip. (Later I have confirmation it wasn't just in my head. I was sent to the opposite side of the earth to meet people who tell me without any information from me that it Was the birth of the universe I partook in!) ---So, God was in the state of primordial bliss that the Hindus described as the first state of being... God asked 'what am I?' bliss being the only answer because God was all there was...so God asked next 'what am I not?' and BOOM! This duality happened, when what God is collides with what God is not making the illusion we are in. Yen/Yang etc. Eventually the illusion will become selfrealized and God will have the Answer. Well, that was my experience. Thanks for this great show! ✨
i have a question, why do you think because u went to the other side of the world and the people there confirmed it, still not be something made inside your head? also the first stage in hinduism, do you mean the being in oneness with the supreme being, the result of moksha?
Very interesting, if you ever type out or make a video about your story I'd love to read/hear/watch it !
I had a neat trip where I knew I didn't need my body or to breathe to exist . That I and all that is is merely the imagination of consciousness with the illusion of a solid reality. I pictured oneness of consciousness then it dripping like an ooze or liquid, each drop, a differentiation of consciousness, individuation, but each drop still connected and becoming itself from the one primary "mass" by becoming more differentiated as it "dripped" "down and away from the mass. Some drips and drops intersected at some points as our lives do. It was just a visual representation of how consciousness makes it way from oneness to individuation while still being one. Each person or different consciousness would be representes by each drop , the perspective from each drop is different and the consciousness experiences and observes itself in this way, not realizing in it's more fully segregated form that it is still itself and so is all it sees. I felt no fear of death and almost felt like I was alive without breathing.
@@Sridarsh Well, the Western mystics say: " As above, so below." In Eastern traditions, it is similar: " What is outside is also inside." So yes, it's in my head, but the implications are profound, it would imply reality is in my head... it's a very deep rabbit hole. Beginning and result are paradoxically intertwined. The beginning is the end, the first is the last. You will understand at some point.
@@simplysavvy0113 Thanks, I will but it's not a easy decision... and not sure about how to present it. Any suggestions? I don't want to start a new religion. But I sorta am a Avatar because of what happened and weird stuff is always happening. I live in Spain and a toddler maybe 3 years old walking past me says " Buddha, Buddha!" And points his finger at the sky. And his parent says "yes, Buddah common." And keeps walking away. Another time, I'm walking down a road and a little kid 4-5 years old points at me yelling "Allah! Allah!" . And many other things like that.
Three different individuals met me in southern Spain saying that they were sent to find me and a sect of Sufis performed a ritual because I was somebody they were expecting to show up, but my mission is to END religion not promote one. They think I'm Mahdi, but if I am, I can't support the sacrifice of animals, so I denounced the act of killing animals and suddenly they don't want me anymore despite the 46 prophecies I fulfilled. You can appreciate the irony. And I am a long way from perfect. Perfection comes After judgment day and while I remember it, it hasn't happened yet in linear time but my future self is looking after me. Yes, crazy... it's why I like having Outside confirmation. Keeps the loonies on the path. I have one message for you: learn Magic and Use it to recreate the world. I know magic is real, I know that the beings who control the world believe in magic and use it against our evolution. If I am what I appear to be, than I'm a catalyst to make us God. The more of us using Magic, the better. The world is ours, and magic is our birthright, don't let anyone tell you otherwise. My spiritual name is Kalki Dasa (pronounced 'Doss') if you want to meet up in the astral.
Thanks again.
I'm so thankful Professor Hoffman is better now. I got so caught up with enthusiasm for the work he's helped advance that it never occured to me...
I won't complete that thought. It's been a hell of a couple of years, but we who are fortunate enough to still be here got to keep trucking. ❤
Glad to know Donald finally got out of covid
Brilliant conversation. Strongly supportive of Alan Watts' ideas.
Donald! You mentioned that you're reading Eckhart tolle and I read his work before discovering yours and I was initially awestruck by how similar his concepts and perspective on consciousness is to your findings! When I first heard your book my jaw dropped because I had only recently read his book before yours and wow it really is the same exact thing but he came to those realizations through self reflection and yours were from hard science. It's just so crazy to me how at a fundamental level you are positing the same conclusions! I'm not sure how much more his work would reveal from you but you're on the same track!
Meister Eckhart is different from Eckhart Tolle. I recommend Manly P Hall's lecture on Meister Eckhart here on youtube. Insane.
th-cam.com/video/aEOLnF-sgVs/w-d-xo.html
@@astonesthrow 1:55:35
@@controllerbrain Hoffman is the man
Looking forward to see how Tim is going to tackle this challenging topic..
Thank you to both for a wonderful two hours! I very much look forward to the next discussion with Prof. Hoffman.
I agree! I too look forward to the next discussion with prof. Hoffman too.👍
Absolutely fascinating conversation!
All is conscious, all is mind. There is no such thing as objective reality, but there is consensus reality.
Amazing & Fabulous. I have no words to do this discussion justice. Great contribution to the relentless search for the fundamental. Thank you both.
Advaita Vedenta
It was just one of the most fascinating conversations I have listen to on this channel!!! Infinite thanks to you Tim. And Donald Hoffman was an incredible guest! No more words. Pure gold. Thank you all)
⛩️👁️✨ This is one of the best podcasts I've heard recently. Hoffman is one of the only scientists I've heard who creates a solid bridge to mysticism without mentioning any mystical concepts. Very profound and insightful.
Mysticism is on the other side of the bridge😉
“Nothing in space and time has any causal powers. Nothing. Everything in space and time are merely perceptions within consciousness.” That pretty much sums it up. 😚
Doesn't it sound very mystical? Consciousness is a tail chasing itself. The Upanishads are much easier to read. What say you?
Tim, you should talk with Rupert Spira. Would love to listen to this conversation.
Amazing! Thank you both.
A true scientist is without dogma, still kind of rare, David Hoffman seems to be one... Thanks for this interview!
i like this person he explains it simply - and with enthusiasm
Thank you so much...we are living fascinating times
Mark my words, Donald Hoffman will be as well known as Einstein is now in 100 years.
If you embrace the possibility of what Donald suggests and that of others with similar thinking (Bernardo Kastrup, Rupert Spira), it comes with profound changes to how you look at life and death.
Oh golly yes please interview Bernardo
@♜Pínned_By Tim Fērríss Massive fan love to
Yeah, especially the concept of consciousness trying out different lifeforms like suits.. that sounds strikingly like reincarnation. Either the old Buddhists knew more than we do, or some modern researchers have borrowed ideas from them.
Humans are NOT supposed to see the fundamental reality of the world because then they would "opt" out of participation on Earth.
can you explain for layman? please?
Hoffman is my FAVORITE person to listen to talk. 😊😊😊❤❤❤
Absolutely Brilliant .!!!.Many Thanks for sharing such Valuable Information !!
Fantastic Information and Presentation.
TU both.
I Love Love Love this!
I totally understand!
I understand conceptually completely. I understand scientifically at an Intro college level. I understand & experience at a spiritual level. Hoffman is brave! Hoffman is more than "on to something"!
Go Don! Thank you!!
Love it!
Would you be interested in understanding more? Just wondering. If anyone would take the time to see what I know, it will change their entire life. The answers aren’t going to come in detail from anyone who’s know as a professional.. they are already in a level of disconnect to the depth.. that’s why they at most say things like illusion or simulation. There’s more to it than that. I had a near death experience in 1998 and have been reaching out to everyone I possibly can for the last 5 years as in 2018 there was an even deeper and more profound revelation.. as unbelievable as I know it sounds, I remember the beginning of time and can explain it to anyone with the attention span to listen. The biggest issue is that it goes against EVERYTHING society is hooked on doing. If I could speak with Mr. Hoffman or someone with that level of public exposure, it would change the face of our world. I say it because I mean it. Hopefully you aren’t offended that I commented on your post. I have a lot to teach and no one willing to listen because I don’t play the “certified professional” game. God bless. Have a great day.
@@danalexander186 I am interested 🙂
@@danalexander186 I'm interested too
I love that Prof. Hoffman is open to pushback and testing of his theory, because this kind of science is what we all need: bold and courageous enough not to rule out other things that up to now were not accepted in any scientific context (like spirituality), respectful and yet always critical with all findings. We need to think much broader and yet be more open for critical evaluation of all scientific results instead of holding on to theories just because the scientists who came up with them are/were being venerated or because the theory has been accepted and established. As Prof. Hoffman is saying, we probably will be laughing at our theories of today in a 100 years.
Excellent content, thank you so much! I will have to listen to it several times to kind of grasp at least the rough ideas ... if I might be able to. ;-)
Tim is such a likable guy.
Thanks Tim.
So I have listened to this podcast and other's with Donald Hoffman going on at least 10 times or more. Finally sinking in somewhat... I remain fascinated...
The idea of an inherent electronic field controlling a person's lifelong morphogenesis is a brilliant idea for a dystopian horror novel.
Just like the one playing out right before our eyes.
Regarding the hallucinogenic part, my opinion is that the brain itself processes reality through a limited aperture much like a camera. Certain chemical substances cause the aperture to relax and widen allowing conscious appreciation of other out of previously perceived dimensions. The same effect can be caused by exhaustion or sleep deprivation to a degree of potency.
exactly or I say the brain filters consciousness to a level we can cope with day to day.
True science and spirituality are not antithetical, they are complimentary. They are different approaches to understanding and appreciating our experience of life as we know it. Great talk!
32:39 Very zen move, "So that's why I don't believe my own theory."
What a wonderful ideal experience!!!
This podcast has every one of my brain cells working in overdrive - and i'm only comprehending about 25% of what they're talking about.
hes saying time and space are not real. The present moment has only ever existed
I'm 62 and no scientist...but I already developed these exact same ideas of Donald's. He makes perfect logical sense to me.
@@bumblebeme Thank you, great summary! I've tried listening to a few of these interviews, but I can't seem to merge all of Professor Hoffman's scattered phrases into one coherent philosophy.
@@PowPowSunshine100 its not just him saying it all the great meditators have intimate experience with the infinite now. It means whatever happened last week never happened all that exists and has ever existed it right now. We keep the information from the past inside the mind but its just imagination.
@@bumblebeme No, I get it, thanks to your succinct explanation. I decided long ago that there is no such thing as time, everything happens at once, in a nutshell. But I just can't follow Donald Hoffman's thought process, guess that's my failing. 🙂
Your videos are so wonderful Kandace, thank you so much! I can’t wait to try this! I’ve just started medical medium protocol in the last two weeks but I’ll be trying this is soon as I get acclimated.I also have a question, for other family members that are not on medical medium do you think it would be helpful for them to take these shots even though they are not on the protocol?
Great conversation
This is amazing.
fascinating perspective
Thank you for such an excellent interview! I will be listening more than once.
Just one thing that jumps out at me at this moment...At around 1:45 where he begins to talk about various spiritual traditions/ having insights but not necessarily being able to 'evolve or develop them in a way that is useful or meaningful (my lacking paraphrase) - he refers to the need for mathematics for that. That kind of blows my mind a bit and I need to study that more. But I think of stages of cognitive/cultural development as outlined by people in transpersonal psychology such as Ken Wilber. Having insights but only being able to cognize them through the lens of one's developmental stage.
I’m so excited for what Donald Hoffman is doing.
Tom Campbell is another pioneer in this field and it’s highly recommended to anyone interested in this subject. I’m surprised his name didn’t come up in the podcast. Nonetheless, this was a excellent conversation.
I dont think he makes any sense. I think William Buhlman would be a good addition.
fantastic discussion! thank you! vipassana meditation would answer beautifully to many points in this dialog. must go beyond the thinker.that is a good portal into the interface. would accelerate the research.
the apes speak different language ! your sick irrational senile is a thief ! the apes attract each other !
unbelievable not humans !
Donald Hoffman is an admitted meditator!
Seems a very focused man. 🙏
I've wondered for sometime if the reason exercise changes our bodies is the act of exercising keeps the mind focusing on changing the body...
Wow! Minute 22:11 @TimFerriss in awe after hearing that space time is not fundamental 😅! EPIC look on your face, I loved it! I wonder, can you share what was going through your mind in those seconds?
This morning feeling distraught about the insanity in the world especially Europe at the moment, and Americas not looking too clever if you’re a woman, either.
Love listening to Donald Hoffman and, having been a practising Buddhist for nigh on 30 years(but the dogma got me in the end) I came to his ideas through a spiritual(sorry Tim) interest.To hear him reference Eckhart Tolle (he seems to me to be a “spiritual teacher” with out dogma) was beyond exciting.
Please have a dialogue with each other.😁😁😁👍
The world needs wisdom and science if it is going to wake up and stop all this madness.
Fundamentally science and spirituality’s value can only be measured, I feel, by it’s ability to change the world for the better, where we can learn to choose love and wisdom.
Thank you both for a mesmerising dialogue.
Ann Gerrard
He is very careful to avoid bringing up Advaita Vedanta, the school of thought that beat him to these ideas by thousands of years. The whole “Spacetime is a projection and not base reality” is fundamental to much of Indian philosophy and not a new idea whatsoever. It is very interesting to see science beginning to point back toward what the greatest spiritual philosophers have said for millennia.
Ok but personally, I haven't heard of Advaita Vedanta so this conversation has been refreshing.
Your comment reminds me of Ecclesiates
...
What has been will be again,
and what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun.
Is there a case where one can say,
“Look, this is new”?
It has already existed
in the ages before us.
There is no remembrance
of those who came before,
and those yet to come will not be remembered
by those who follow after.
...
Fascinating that chapter one ends with "For with much wisdom comes much sorrow,
and as knowledge grows, grief increases."
Thanks for your comment that prompted me to remember Solomon's words. Peace to you.
Right on. I'm so eager to merge with universal consciousness and detach from this aching, aging body...
I was wondering all the time why he didn't mention those old hinduistic thoughts. Had to conclude he didn't know about them, which seems strange.. ?
In his conversation with lex Friedman, he does mention the concept of "Maya" and the yogis have been claiming same/similar.
I think he wants to steer clear of that conversation for obvious reason.
He himself has been meditating for 2 decades now.
@@zilla7444 That happens to be among my favorite books of the Bible, maybe number 1.
My deepest desire is indescribable
For words would lay her
Dark-hole-pigeoned
Bruised wings under skin
My deepest desire
Wears no color
Smokes no fire
For she has no view for perception
No lungs to taste resin
My deepest desire
Rests in the Womb
And drinks the Liquid Sound
Of Wisdom~~~
Thank you for this conversation.
Don I'm sure he studied at Advaita Vedanta. it's Hindu philosophy of non-dualism. What Don is discussing and proposing is exactly this a 5,000-year-old philosophy from the upanishads. Highly recommended reading it correlates exactly what Donald is discussing about consciousness and that the world is an illusion. Great guest, he's on the right path. 🙏
Yep, it’s true I’ve shared a vision with a friend, either our brain function was super fast working on suggestions or we experienced the same things simultaneously. There is definitely something more deeper to consciousness than our intellect can comprehend
Professor Hoffman, I think your work is like the incompleteness theorem of empiricism similar to the godel incompleteness theorem. The implications to the scientific method is deep.
Can we please get Donald Hoffman and Stephen Wolfram into a room together.
You ROCK Tim #TYSM brew!! Ect ect
Once you go deep enough science, psychodelic drugs and spirituality all meet at the same point: we are conciousness, the bodies are just a vehicle.
We are living in the kali yuga.
@@SunnyDayTeaFactory Yes we are
@@SunnyDayTeaFactory After listening to this, there is hope that we are coming out of this dark age. Physicalism is no longer primary.
recall hearing the quip that would shed the body but i need it for transportation
@@marylaporte6996 Though destabilizing at first, it has made me tune into this life more, and honor and respect it more...to truly honor our time here. Have a great day!
I love an optimistic scientist/ mathematician.
You need to define what you mean when you say 'when we're not looking'. What is 'observation' when you say nothing is there until you look.
Awesome. I suppose, without having seen a single one of the other episodes on this channel, that this is by far the best episode on the whole channel and will always be.
Thanks for sharing this =)
❤ I'm so excited about talking. I forgot to mention depends on the type of person. Person that can't handle their emotions should never do anything. I real strong-minded person can handle quite a bit.
Well, I think you yet my draft. I have seen and watched so many. That's why I never did. It but I wrote down a lot of information that I found extremely fascinating. Of course In a course in the 60s, they were the sixties.
And of course I did try drugs. Some never overdid it but wrote down a lot of creative
I wonder what Professor Hoffman might think about the concept of morphic resonance and Rupert Sheldrake. Sheldrake wrote a book as well The Science Delusion pointing out the dogmatic materialistic foundation of mainstream science.
I think it would be interesting to see someone organize a discussion with Donald Hoffman and Tom Campbell.
I would love to hear Donald Hoffman's take on The Origins and History of Consciousness by Erich Neumann which is based on Carl Jung's life work.
Words are inadequate to express my gratitude for the effort you both have made to bring this discussion to the masses in this manner. Art is your experiment. This is absolutely the most fascinating discussion on the internet. Thank you. Thank you.
Nice, for a second i though i was going to have to slog through a lex freidman interview with this guy, ill take Tim any day ...
I did that and would highly not recommend it, lol. I do recommend the Jitender Kumar interview with Hoffman, both part 1 and 2.
This is the first one.. th-cam.com/video/pPJZm_-OKQ8/w-d-xo.html the second one is best.
Part 2 th-cam.com/video/5zHdq_ba2W8/w-d-xo.html very good
Wonderful discussion.
I actually came to the idea that I witness the 'source code, beneath the user interface' when I did Ayahuasca, and then googled the idea and found Donald Hoffman. Its truly what I feel and its amazing to me to see its where MUCH brighter minds are looking too!
Some of this reminds me of a comment the comedian Duncan Trussel made once - 'the brain is the virtual reality headset the soul puts on' :)
I don't have a TOE but, I do have conservation of unity theory that is foundational to consciousness and to the notion of consciousness as a foundation for physical experience.
Reciprocal Philosophy
Reciprocal philosophy is a branch of the greater discipline of Reciprocal Science. Reciprocal Science is based in the combined perspective of unity, relationship and action. The basic tenets of Reciprocal philosophy are:
1.) All of awareness is based on reciprocating relationship, a single action with a simultaneous two-way reference. For ex. A dimension has two simultaneous references like, up and down or left and right. A dimension is a reciprocating relationship. The two simultaneous references for awareness are self-assertion and self-reception (self-sensing). The relationship between self-assertion/self-sensing is the action of awareness, showing awareness to be a reciprocating relationship.
2.) Life is an infinite, eternal, unified state of self-awareness.
3.) Life is self-generating, self-originating, self-referring and self-reciprocating. It is self-organizing, self-learning and self-taught
4.) The action of Life, which is living, is acausal, synchronistic, non-sequenced and continuous. Awareness is the action of living.
5.) The unbroken ground of simple self-awareness is the most solid comprehension in conscious experience and is the basis of all that exists.
6.) Physicality is the most measurable and therefore most predictable arrangements or patterns of awareness. Non-physicality is the most un-measurable and therefore unpredictable arrangements or patterns of awareness. These two orientations of awareness arrangements reciprocate each other in the relationship between the infinite and the finite The physical orientations of life and the non-physical orientations of life reciprocate each other in the transmutation of infinite non-physical possibilities into finite physical manifestations. Imagination is the conceptual state, the state of conception, in which this relationship is occurring.
7.) The Human-we is the collective of humanity that has and does and will inhabit the Earth and is a living unified expression of human meaning.
8.) Human awareness is based in simple self- awareness (SSA) spatial awareness (SA) and rational self-awareness (RSA). RSA is the state of consciousness that holds the potential for the personal experience of cosmic self-awareness (CSA).
(Note: see glossary for definitions of orientations of awareness.)
9.) In light of unity, anything that affects one human affects all of humanity as a whole. All human activity affects all humans.
10.) Friendship is the most basic and therefore the most integral and highest form of human relationship.
11.) Love is pure receptivity. Love freely allows all. Freedom is pure assertion. Freedom expresses all. Love loves freedom for expressing all for love to receive and Freedom loves Love for freely allowing all that freedom has to express. This is the reciprocating relationship between Love and Freedom which is the action of living, the origin of our own being and self-awareness. We live every moment of our existence in this beautiful relationship.
12.) Unity is the prevalent and most revealing state of being. Unity is an orientation of awareness and is available as a point of view and experience to human consciousness as individuals and collectives. Mystery is the prevalent and most un-revealing state of being. Mystery is an orientation of awareness and is available as a point of view to human consciousness as individuals and collectives.
( Unity = 1 and Mystery = 0. Note the relationship between 1 and 0 and the creative
nature of each. The organizational capacity of binary code is what makes it “sacred
math”. 1 and 0 reciprocate each other in information ordering. 1, 0 are a pair, a
constant 2. Since the individual and shared states are constant, there is also a constant
of 3, 0 and 1 are embedded in 2 and 0,1 and 2 are embedded in 3. This is all the code
needed to generate physicality and transmutate the constant and immeasurable into
the temporal and measurable. Conceptualization, conceiving of pattern, form and
relationship, is utilizing this code. Any generation of concept has this code embedded
in it. Primary, binary or secondary and tertiary code are meta-constructs of existence
as conscious experience. Edited, 2/20/2013.)
Focus of attention is our nonphysical to physical interface. An interface is a reciprocating relationship because, the physical is receiving and asserting in the non-physical and vice versa. The action is simultaneous and that's part of why we can observe it but, not hold it. Attention is observation happening and the focus is the observer. The focus is the director and orienter of attention. Our focus is diffuse and multi-domain or else nothing would ever happen.
Btw, I registered the copyright for the Theory of Reciprocity and it's accompanying math in 2003
Note: the above is the philosophy not the actual theory and it's mathematical basis. That's a whole paper. The above is from the introduction to the Reciprocity dictionary. The dictionary redefines elementary terms within the framework of reciprocity.
Why is Mathematical evidence so important and final. After all Mathematics is a human construct and in a way Metaphysics itself.
Please Don, talk to Tom Campbell (MBT)! The exchange could be very potent.
Around 59 mins in, his concepts sound VERY reminiscent of Tom Campbell. They always have as I follow both Hoffman & Campbell, but this is the first time I've heard his purpose for consciousness so closely aligned to Cambells.. though they're still apart... so many similarities in theory & practices too... they both Always say don't believe em and be skeptical. Love it.. thx for the vid 👍
I think you meant to write JOESEPH Campbell, the mythologist (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Campbell)
@@vpconroy He does mean Tom Campbell see th-cam.com/video/ZQbgRglCU0k/w-d-xo.html
I think it would be interesting to see someone organize a discussion with Donald Hoffman and Tom Campbell.
Professor Hoffman, is it possible to artificially evolve a single sensor on an AI machine for maybe the detection of magnetism such that the fitness payoff is to match "reality" and then it can "teach" humans what it learnt? There is the problem of physically evolving the sensor hardware too and 3d printing cannot modify the sensor itself which requires the discovery or invention of novel materials?
Life strives to live and experience itself as diverse as possible. No matter if as matter. Never mind if as mind.
Does this definition makes sense? It's from Ayn Rqnd: Consciousness is the faculty of awareness-the faculty of perceiving that which exists.
Awareness is not a passive state, but an active process. On the lower levels of awareness, a complex neurological process is required to enable man to experience a sensation and to integrate sensations into percepts; that process is automatic and non-volitional: man is aware of its results, but not of the process itself. On the higher, conceptual level, the process is psychological, conscious and volitional. In either case, awareness is achieved and maintained by continuous action.
Directly or indirectly, every phenomenon of consciousness is derived from one’s awareness of the external world. Some object, i.e., some content, is involved in every state of awareness. Extrospection is a process of cognition directed outward-a process of apprehending some existent(s) of the external world. Introspection is a process of cognition directed inward-a process of apprehending one’s own psychological actions in regard to some existent(s) of the external world, such actions as thinking, feeling, reminiscing, etc. It is only in relation to the external world that the various actions of a consciousness can be experienced, grasped, defined or communicated. Awareness is awareness of something. A content-less state of consciousness is a contradiction in terms.
You didn't have to write all that! But !!! Yes you are right!😎
@@kevincoakley6811 👍🏻it’s just a matter of logic.
Exactly.....stuff exists to provide experience to consciousness. That's the purpose of "stuff".
Shared visions are common. We have little of that in the West anymore. It can be restored. Great talk.
Even consciousness is an appearance. A good place to rest, but still an appearance.
This is wild after a good joint! Fucking love it 🌿🙏
Omg...we are totally related....as I this ego construction.at this time.... You are spot on our crazy truth .... right now! LOL
I totally understand...how can anyone really explain this... TRUE shit!
My kittens and I are all laughing right now.... and we don't need no words too totally understand!
True... it's all true... just hard too explain using cognatic words!
Thanks bro....I feel seen and understood by another human right now.... and it is always eventually.... and even always now.... about our Emotionally significant experiences++memories.... along these same Emotionally significant.premises!
Hugs and kisses a million thanks!
One of the things you are predicting with science and mysticism examining each other is that participation in the scientific endeavor will require more individuals than the universities can produce and the typical funding of science. Methods will need to be devised to handle the shortfall. Similar to astronomy supplementing sky coverage with amateurs.
Spiritual science is the next necessity - for humanity for keeping the consciousness alive …..🌞
Riddle me this: does the unconscious (in the psychological sense) exist independently of our unawareness of it? Serious question. Tell me how that paradox works out in his terms.
Donald has also had great conversations also with Bernado Kastrup PhD in both computer engineering and philosophy Who is at the forefront of promoting Analytical Idealism….panpsychism a step further …..very similar to Spira as well…there is a video of three of the on you tube. Bernado now heads up the Essentia Foundation promoting a consciousness only ontology…it would be worth having him on your show
Great conversation ….consciousness - is the living force as awareness ( of the recognition of knowledge -( see ,know ,experience ,force ,change ,create transformative energies ) - make sounds that are vibrating specific words letters as basic vibrating fundamentally connected to the universal language construction - that is or has the labeled quantum pressed energy field to be recognized ….🌞