The Big Picture - EVERYTHING MUST GO! (WARNER BROS 2021 SLATE)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ต.ค. 2024
- / moviebob1
www.redbubble....
Warner Bros Studios and AT&T just blew a gigantic gaping wound the movie industry (or maybe just their corner of it) in order to prop up their failing HBO/MAX streaming service by dumping their entire 2021 theatrical slate to day-and-date and blaming on the pandemic... or did they?
The new era of THE BIG PICTURE breaks down the most shocking Hollywood business shift of the year until the next one, explains why this is (maybe?) a bad idea - even if you think they had no other choice and tries to figure out what happens next.
#WarnerBros #AT&T #HBOMAX
AT&T tried to tell people internally about it first, but they had bad reception, and couldn't get ahold of customer service.
I work in live theater. I don't foresee audiences for us until October, if we are lucky. We are just lucky to still be working due to a switch to making online content and donors.
From a former Thesbian, I’m wishing you good luck. I love seeing live performances.
Sorry Bob, but this is gonna have to be one of the rare times I have to disagree. We might finally be reaching a point where it looks like there could be a light at the end of the tunnel, a light that isn't another oncoming train, but we're still in no condition to just go back to "normal" as if nothing changed. The consequences and fallout are still going to be with us and echo into if not all of next year, at least the first half.
Is Warner pushing things too far too fast? Maybe, but the sad truth is we still don't know when it's going to be safe to reopen theaters. Something had to break, and this is still preferable to the alternative. Especially since it's not like Warner is skipping the theaters entirely. Most of their movies are still going to hit a big screen wherever it's "safe" to do so.
Is simultaneous release on streaming going to hurt the theater industry? Probably, but if exclusivity was the only thing keeping that industry alive, it's hard to deny that it's basically been on life support for years.
Well the key points is that we don't know what kind of conditions will be in 6 months from now and Warner decided to dump EVERYTHING right now instead of taking it on a more case by case basis. Not only have Vaccine's been developed but the next administration is gonna be enacting plans for mass distribution. As the Vaccine is distributed numbers will go down and it will become safer for theaters to re-open. We could see a lot of theaters in a position to re-open by summer. We won't now for sure what the conditions will be until we see how things play out over the next few months
This is why Warner's plans seem like a huge disservice to everyone else involved in those films. Sure maybe they should just go head and stream some titles, but other bigger titles could afford to wait a few more months to see if they can see the situation changing. It would be one thing if Warner's was just doing what was needed to get through this pandemic, but they are a mutli-billion dollar company that can easily weather this pandemic putting them in a position to compromise and this decision of theirs seems unnecessary and harmful to everyone else involved in those films.
I too usual agree with Bob and I was about to say everything you just said but you put it more eloquently so thank you.
@@MonteCreations Huge disservice? Those movies are sitting on a shelf, doing nothing and making no one any money. WB is doing them a favor. Their films can now be seen by a wider audience, safely. David Fincher and Martin Scorsese do not have a problem with streaming. Why should anyone else? To preserve an archaic tradition? Is MovieBob worried no one will watch movie reviews when movies can bypass critics and go straight to launch day on streaming? Bob better evolve with the times or he will end up like movie theaters.
@@breadordecide HBO Max only has 8.6 million users, so no the streaming service is actually a FAR more limited audience than what theaters would normally get. The films will also be making FAR less money by being put on a streaming service than they would if they were to be delayed until they could be released in theaters...
So no this is not about doing what's best for the films, their creators and everyone else involved in these films, and its not even really about protecting poeple during the pandemic since film releases can always be delayed for the sake of safety. This is about Time Warner wanting to push their streaming service.
I sorta have to agree with Emeral. It's rare that I feel like Bob is on the wrong side of a take, but as some who used to work at a hospital just before COVID and is still in touch with my old co-workers there, the idea that 2021 is going to suddenly turn into sunshine and smiles just because we managed to oust the head of the most corrupt administration ever in the history of the United States ignores how we got to this place in the first point.
Even if there are no technical hiccups with the vaccine, we still have a huge population of COVID-19 deniers who aren't going to play along, a huge political faction who will want to fuck over everything just because they don't want the guys running things to get any credit and a deck that's been prestacked to help them do it. The idea that by June it'll be safe to go to the theater is a given is wish fulfillment, not certainty.
*Sees this whole controversy between WB and directors/actors/producers/partner studios.*
Me:
LetThemFight.gif
I’m a bad person to look forward to this?
@@katherinealvarez9216 Not really, but I wouldn't pay yourself on the back either were I in your shoes.
@@alearnedman I have no intention of patting myself on the back. Actually, I lost all feeling. Pettiness is very fleeting feeling.
Fun fact: at 10 percent penetration and a 3 percent death rate and $15 a ticket, $360 million worldwide for Tenet equals 72 thousand dead.
Only that? It's a bargain to experience Tenet in the True Way its Director Envisioned!
lol yikes. math is fun.
But the same would worth it for Godzilla because Godzilla! Now isn't it?
@@fpedrosa2076 You too can enjoy this 7/10 film exactly as Christopher "200$ million dollar networth" Nolan wants you to see it. I'm sure 20% of a billionaire is happily paying taxes on that to help folks like us survive the pandemic he forcefully published his film in.
Suppose some people seen the movie more than once?
Please keep making stuff. You're great moviebob!
I disagree with Bob's general standpoint here - I think not providing incentives to go out will help the vaccines corral the virus and allow herd immunity to develop - but I do agree with this statement! You're great moviebob!
@@RoryGlynn I actually agree with you. I think he is a bit hyper focused on the film industry in this video and minimizes the current severity of the pandemic a little bit. That said, viewed In a vacuum his points are still well stated and changed my mind a bit.
@@RoryGlynn He is talking mostly about bad business practices that hurt the industry and all workers involved. And he is right about that point in my opinion.
He is probably too optimistic about the future of the pandemic, but this is secondary. Each movie should be approached differently depending on the time of release and with people involved.
I don't agree Bob, I live in a area where I sadly can't go to theaters, and I do not think despite a new leader, well help and effect people like me, so having the option to watch them at home is helpful
Covid is NEVER OVER!
Especially Joe Fucking Biden
“What? You didn’t see that coming?”
AT&T to the rest of the studios.
As a film lover who hates going to the theater I'm apprehensive to admit that I took this as good news when i first heard it 😬. I can appreciate the concerns you raise and the lack of choice that this decision imposes on the consumer but honestly .... I'm just excited to watch Wonder Woman at home in my PJs.
I imagine everyone would be excited to see WW at home in their PJ's. Or hers.
moviebob You make several logical and as well as decent moral points on the movie industry. But to be honest the Plague has ravaged America and has revealed all the flaws of America which we have neglected to deal with sense the 1980's. Real change has to be made for everyone in America in all walks of life even if it means less fun stuff. At least that is how I see it.
thank you for saying this! i feel like Bob gets a bit too convinced of his own opinion sometimes. this has been a disaster decades in the making.
Well, the point he's making kinda ties into that. If you look around, you'll notice that, while a lot of smaller potatoes have lost a lot over the last year, the larger companies are doing fine. There's more centralization of large corporations than ever before.
And this move by WB is more of that. Less WB product outside of WB's control means fewer smaller companies (theaters) getting a cut and the actual filmmakers likely getting less than what they might have made otherwise.
What WB is doing is not "real change" that's "made for everyone in America". It's just more centralizing of power in a few large corporations. It's not that we are going to have "less fun stuff"; it's that we as the people here will have less *control* over the "fun stuff."
General Bolas you raise a good point.
These new Big Pictures are the best things you've made in years. Keep it up, because this kicks ass.
Sorry Bob, the US and Europe is not going to get OUT of COVID-19 for another year.
And that's the Big Picture.
That's true - it's going to be a really long, probably multi-year slog. The situation will be much more relaxed as people are immunized progressively in order of vulnerability to the virus though, and basic public health measures adopted top-down have proven effective in other countries so things could get brighter through 2021.
I would highly encourage you to check the mechanism of action for the Pfizer and Modena vaccines. The only thing that might hold us up is production or dumb asses refusing to take them. Not to mention the other, less flashy but still reasonably effective more conventional products set to roll out.
@@edwardjobst1 "The only thing that will hold us up is production"
Yeah, man, that's a pretty definite factor. That and transport. It isn't something you can just brush off.
LMFAO. I'd say 3 months tops. 4 months for the U.S. accounting for the sheer stupidity of 74 million people who voted for the Orange jackass despite all the damage he's done. Besides that, the core cock up is that Warner Bros. basically did this all at once, screwing with a lot of people in the industry who have put their trust in them over the years.
@@edwardjobst1 people won’t take it because they want to see the results. It’s not a magic elixir.
Bob. Things aren't going to be getting to a point where you should be going to see movies until March at best.
You're probably referring to March 2021, but unless infrastructure and logistics across America gets a hell of a lot better March 2022 might be more reasonable - and that's if they work backwards from the most vulnerable sections of the population down.
Also, it's worth noting that the infection rate and death toll from Covid in the US has pretty much never been higher than it is now. It's good that there seems to be a light at the end of the tunnel but it's still an awfully long, dark, scary tunnel.
That's actually the point. A lot of these films COULD still make it to theaters if they are just delayed for a few more months. No need for Warners to rush to the decision to release ALL of them for streaming. They should release some for streaming, but maintain a wait and see approach for their bigger titles
@@MonteCreations exactly.
Things aren't gonna get any better until The Democrats get arrested. and China gets nuked!
Bob’s such a liberal. Biden sucks. The pandemic is worse now than ever. Just because Trump is out doesn’t mean things are magically going to be all better.
Honestly, yes, it hurts theatres and AT&T is doing this to boost their streaming service. However, I don't think any of us will be capable to venture out in any normal capacity until the end of 2021 at the earliest. I imagine that the majority of the theatres will still be shut down throughout 2021. Projections show we won't even begin to see signs of recovery until 2022 if everything goes right. We don't even have a firm roll-out plan for vaccines. Regardless of the reasons behind it, I think it is the right decision because of how things are looking now we won't be able to see any of these movies for another year.
I'm not unsympathetic to all the people getting screwed over by this, but let's be realistic: theaters were already dying out due to the rise of streaming, and younger generations could honestly care less about the big screen experience in favor of the convenience of small screens they carry around everywhere. Also, if you're all about cinematic fidelity, get yourself an 8k HDTV and 7.1 surround sound system. It'll be the better deal in the long run, compared to shelling out for ever rising ticket prices. Sooner or later, movie theaters will go the way of vinyl: for niche consumers only.
How is an 8k tv better than tickets? I would rather buy a 15$ ticket then shell out 5$k for a tv
For context 5$k is 10% of the avg salary
@SaiyanHeretic I've said this so many times, if theaters die out then so will major blockbusters that everyone love so much. Studios simply can't afford to have tent poles films go straight to streaming. That means if theaters cease to exist there will never be another original property that is could be the new Star Wars or the new Jurassic Park of our era. Also, why are you under the impression that everyone can afford a home theater system? Sure, more people can afford it now then before, but that is NOT true for everyone.
Dude, I exclusively went to theaters on discount days/times and never bought concessions. I would have to see at least a thousand films at my $6 rate for your scenario to make sense, and the quality of streaming media is garbage by comparison (and 4k Blu Ray is being killed off). Even if my cost doubled, I would still need to see over 500 films, and that doesn't even touch on the planned obsolescence of consumer electronics. Please think more before you post garbage like that.
I honestly felt like the "movies have to release in theaters first" was an outdated concept before the pandemic. Simultaneous releases to theaters and streaming is more beneficial to consumers anyway. Covid simply accelerated a process that was already probably inevitable. Now I admit I don't have any insider views on how this change will affect the industry you may be right about this hurting more than just theater chains. But I think all this changes is when the industry will have to deal with those changes, ie now, suddenly instead of slowly over the next decade or so by which time it would have near inevitably happened anyway. Personally I am likely to get the vaccine a little sooner than some due to a history of pre-existing respiratory conditions, but from what I am hearing even that is likely to be in the third wave of vaccines at the earliest. Then I have to wait for the second dose, then a few more weeks for the vaccine to fully take effect, before I am remotely safe enough to think about attending a theatrical movie release. It is likely to be half or more way through 2021 before the majority have been vaccinated, and the full public may not be vaccinated by years end. Streaming releases are going to be better for the public as a whole throughout 2021 in all likelihood. My personal view is that anyone releasing a movie to Theaters only before the CDC is reporting 99+% vaccination rates is putting financial or artistic needs above the lives and health of the public and doesn't deserve to profit off of it any more than hand sanitizer and toilet paper stockpiling resellers did.
It is nice to see Bob sounding a little more lively and a little less despairing.
My local 2nd run movie theater closed for good last month. It was just another business lost due to the pandemic. My first job was selling ticks and concessions at that theater and I wouldn't risk my life doing that now during a pandemic. I wouldn't ask someone else to risk their health or their family's health just so I can see a movie on the big screen.
Haha! I want the whole Chris you ain't that good mini rant in a tshirt
We aren’t going back to normal for at least six months.
I honestly can't remember a net positive theatergoing experience that warranted seeing a picture in theaters. I'm sure they can exist, but dealing with overpriced snacks and obnoxious filmgoers generally outweighs any benefits of the big screen.
Agreed.
I politely but firmly disagree.
Seeing a well shot movie on the big screens is an almost transcendent experience for me.
A night at the movies with my best friends (including the meal and debrief after) is one of the things I'm most looking forward to after the plague fucks off.
Especially since most movie lovers have big screen TVs at home now.
Your Name hits different on the big screen. Still not worth dying for.
Idk, seeing Avengers Endgame in a packed theatres was a energy I’ll never forget. Plus ya can just sneak your own snacks and drinks in.
I agree that it's a bad idea, but your take that it is less "immediately perilous" at the moment is insane. Most people aren't going to be vaccinated until Thanksgiving 2021 and more than 2,000 Americans are dying of covid everyday.
yeah, but those dying are in Bob's eyes insignificant anyway. so says the Uebermensch bob.
Glad you were able to break this down for us laypeople cause as merely a consumer Ive been struggling to find the issues with the decision WB was making regarding this. Now I finally see the other side of things a little clearer
Yeah... I really don't care much about movie theaters either way, but I hadn't considered how this will potentially screw over a lot of artists and subsidiaries, especially those whose contracts gave them percentages of movie ticket sales. Which was pretty standard in the before times. I suspect Legendary won't be the only ones suing WB over this.
look I'm sorry about the people who own movie theaters and stuff like that but even after this pandemic goes away my knowledge will not. Going to enclosed spaces with hundreds of people that you don't know sitting right next to them I will never do that again in my life. Gathering like that is a thing of the past. We will always gather in streets and some will continue to go to bars and restaurants but for the most part I think a lot of people even if they don't want to admit it I think they're done with a lot of old stuff we used to do. one of my favorite things in the world is live music but I can guarantee you I will never be caught dead in the middle of a mosh pit again. I love Wonder woman I really do but I'm not going to risk my life to watch her second movie and besides risking your life for a character which originally started out as an s&m fetish I'm sorry but I'm not going to die for that.
I'm one of the bad ones. Since Covid, I really don't see myself going to a movie theater again. I've grown accustomed to watching everything on my phone and not being bothered by it
Bob....The worst of the pandemic was not months ago. The worst of the pandemic is right now.
Seriously. Nearly 300,000 new cases yesterday. 3000 Dead.
Gotta admit, the Batman fanfiction bit was hilarious
WB pushing the nuclear option isn’t exactly surprising, they didn’t have the advantage that Disney has had for the past decade of being a blockbuster titan raking in tens of billions of dollars a year. Outside of what’s left of the DC universe and the “fantastic” beast films that have quickly exhausted any lingering Harry Potter nostalgia that JK Rowling hasn’t killed yet, WB doesn’t have a tent pole to serve as the “safe” money maker to anchor their studio, and they don’t have a line of theme parks that are gonna make tens of billions a year again as soon as this plague ends. Disney could afford to wait this whole thing out and play the long game, even Comcast could afford to play the long game. WB needed a Hail Mary, and this is it.
I still expect that this longshot pass is gonna be incomplete.
Considering the circumstances, I don’t blame WB for making this move. The virus is more widespread now than it was when Tenet was released, recent reports indicate the U.S. won’t have enough vaccine doses until the second half of the year, and it’s highly unlikely you’ll get enough of the population willing to be vaccinated right away.
Even with competent U.S. leadership on the horizon, this pandemic is not going away in time for movie theaters to operate normally in 2021.
movie theaters have been dying for years, the pandemic was just the final nail
I'm optimistic people will want to go to the theatre after a year-long pandemic.
@@garonmario99 true but it wont be the same. not sure who but someone i watched said something about big stadium like movie theaters where you watch only the biggest of big block busters (like the next endgame and such)
Never setting a foot in a movie theater again pandemic or not.
"I need my film to come out in theatres because imax" the big screen should be a bonus. If you film can't be good being watched again...Well I won't say it's a bad film, but a one view wonder i guess.
If I had to call a month, I'd call June 2021 before theaters opening would be a safe thing to do. (Remember that there's two shots, and full protection doesn't start until a couple weeks after the second. The general population doesn't even start getting shots until March-ish, and there's likely still going to be supply issues then.) With that in mind, pushing the entire 2021 schedule onto streaming is overly pessimistic, but putting the Jan-Jun schedule on there is the only way to safely release those movies, with possibly more months on top if things go slower than expected.
Then there's the very important question of "how many movie theaters are even going to be left at that point?". People doing things they really shouldn't be doing aside, there will be a bunch of movie theaters closed for over a year once the country reopens, (even the ones that stayed open are dealing with massively-reduced customers) and government assistance is thin on the ground. A lot of theaters aren't coming back.
Hey Bob, fan here. Speaking as someone that has always preferred going to theaters for films vs watching them at home, I have no interest whatsoever in going back to theaters until April at the earliest. I also work in healthcare - we are nowhere near as well off as you are implying in this video, and likely won't be until June. That ETA is dependent not only on the vaccinations working at the efficacy rate achieved in the labs, but also the vast majority of the population getting it - neither of which is particularly likely in my personal experience.
Theaters have been on their way out for a decade now and your belief that Covid is on its way out soon isn't really going to change that. The convenience of streaming a movie at home with a couple of friends is ultimately cheaper and well, more convenient than the theater going experience and studios,/producers/etc are going to have to adjust to a new model. The music industry has been able to make the change and now it's time for the movie industry to do the same.
Christopher Nolan wanting people to go to theatres to see his movie in a pandemic made me loss all respect for him.
I don’t think of Christopher Nolan as a detector anymore I think of him as the ass who wanted people to risk their lives for his ego.
I still think highly of Nolan but it's the same way I do Kubrick (which contrary to Bob's sour assessment, he does indeed resemble in key ways). That view was summed up in Kirk Douglas' autobiography The Ragman's Son: "A talented shit."
Now he’s bitching over people given a choice between theaters and playing it safe at home
If Christopher Nolan wanted to have his movie in theatres and not be a asshole that is fine with you dying for his ego. then release it later when it's safe. Tenet is a stand alone movie that could be released in a few years when it won't kill people. I'm never watching another Christopher Nolan movie again his movies are not worth peoples lives.
Christopher Nolan basically said "Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice I am willing to make"
Thanks. I agreed with the decision originally and was excited. Now I am gonna think it over and reevaluate it
As always you have a great argument
Around here, things are far worse than they were months ago. Our death rate and contagion rates are way up. THIS is the worst time, and considering what we are hearing about vaccine availability, we're easily half a year from even the thought of normality, and I don't think holding all these films for yet another 6 months is better than dumping them now. I'm absolutely for big screens--I love going to theaters, but now isn't the time, nor will it be in 3 months, or 5 months. So it is a bad situation, but time to put some of these films out, even if it is in the much lesser streaming form.
I've been consistent in saying we're in this until 2023.
Warner Bros. isn’t skipping theatres entirely. They’re doing a same-day release strategy. Those who can’t or won’t go to the theatre can still see the movie and those who can and will can see it in the theatre. I see this as a win-win. Theatres actually might be able to make MORE money off of ticket sales because they might not have to pay Warner Bros. as much. Also, the pandemic is worse now than ever. I don’t think most theatres are going to reopen and smart people certainly won’t be going even if they were. I don’t really see a problem.
I didn't actually say it at the time, but as someone who waited to see Avatar on Blu-ray, if your movie can't fully be appreciated unless it's seen in theaters specifically, then maybe it isn't actually all that worthwhile as a movie, period.
While I understand where this is coming from, the Cinema experience was heading the way of physical media. - The pandemic was an accelerant, and we were going to hit 1:1 streaming/cinema at one point (certain countries already have this). Instead of this hitting in 5-10 years, it hit now.
The root problem that should be tackled here is that IP Holders/Content Creators own the Streaming Service - This is where all the focus should be going now. There is no reason why Netflix should have exclusivity on streaming The Witcher, nor should Disney+ have exclusivity on the Mandalorian. Streaming services should be able to pick up every show they deem worthy, and show it for their subscribers, and paying the producers of this content a fair share. - Right now this sounds like a fantasy world, but its the solution to all the problems you outlined in your video. Content Producers should not be the gatekeepers - It worked for Cinema for 90 years, but we, unfortunately, adopted the TV model for Streaming.
The hell was I suppose to watch on HBO Max once I was done Infinity Train before?
Or at least I'd ask that if HBO Max was a thing in my country.
... you do remember that a vaccine is not a cure? This pandemic isn’t done. Progress was made, but we’ve yet to have even a guarantee for the functionality of any of the vaccines. As an usher who had to walk between the limited-screening sits at the start of the pandemic and repeatedly remind the viewers that they had to keep their mask on at all times within the theatre, I’m not that assured we’re ready to return to normal. It’s hard to think of a reason to vault away so many planned releases, there might’ve been an argument against releasing all of them for streaming, but we’re still at the unknown phase. Non science-denialism is not the same as having absolute clear medical knowledge. We’ve got more to go through before we can return to normalcy.
Personally, I could easily see this backfiring on WB, because of that dirty p-word: *Piracy.* Every one of these movies will be on TPB within a few hours of going live on HBO Max, unlike how dedicated theatrical releases usually only get cam bootlegs for a few months. That's going to undoubtedly cut into sales/subs, particularly for people who still feel unsafe going out to theaters. OTOH, D+ made out like gangbusters this year despite their flagships being widely pirated... but that doesn't necessarily mean lightning will strike twice.
It helped D+ already had a plan in place that they modified with the pandemic in mind. Despite the change of owners, WB is doing what it always has, playing catch up.
I'm in canada and my theatre is closed due to covid so if I want to watch WW2 day of release I gotta pirate lol
Sorry but 2021 will still be extremely dangerous for movie goers. I want to see Mortal Kombat in theaters but I also don’t want to die just to see it...
If that would happened, it would be a... Fatality.
(Sorry... I’ll see myself out)
7:18 and none has the Batfamily in them. I mean, I get why the Joker and BoP didn’t have them (I’m gonna headcanon that the Cassie in BoP isn’t the Cassandra aka Bruce’s favorite kid, she’s another Cassandra). But seriously, grieving dad Batman was there and they ignored it.
They know most people don't read the comics so they have no reason to bother.
@@jordanloux3883 true, but- it’s not I need a ‘faithful adaptation’ or whatever, I just think they could do something with Bruce and his family. I mean they sort of did it with Titans (or my canon version of it) and I just think it’ll be fun seeing the Dark Knight being a dad.
Yeah, I know I'm in the minority here, but I was rolling my eyes at The Batman's trailer. Oh boy, let's take emotionally-stunted lonely angry manchild Batman and make it even MORE grimdark. I'll probably be giving that one a pass unless the reviews suggest it's somehow really amazing. I'm genuinely bored out of my mind with simplistic neckbeard-power-fantasy takes on the character.
Independent cinemas are hardly strapped for content - for every tentpole movie that comes out every month, there are 100+ independent movies. 99% of media is indie, but people still give mindshare to the 1% anyway.
Okay the part I agree with is that there are surely a fair to small number of people who may have done some sort of backroom deals regarding box office sales and they are now potentially all the more screwed by ticket sale numbers going away in favor of home distribution, as well as the notion that independent movie theaters will likely need to think all the further on their feet regarding things like selling seats for films that are otherwise in their homes.
The rest of it I call bull on.
And I call it because (and I say this as a fan of going to movie theaters with its focused and captive viewing environment really makes for a superior viewing experience that no home experience I have yet had surpasses) movie theaters aren't as big a deal anymore in the era of steaming content... for the price of a single new movie ticket I can experience an entire month's worth of movies from the comfort of my home with the only distractions ones I will have within that environment.
Independent theaters are the ones I am most concerned about, but that's been an ongoing concern for a while now even pre-Covid. I have seen theaters broadcasting football games, old movies, pay-per-view events, and video game tournaments... what's to stop them from selling tickets screening theaters of streamed movies? Licenses are an obvious concern, but hell, maybe that'll take that sort of thing to court and get some more pro-consumer rights for us.
As for the industry types, the only manner in which I feel really bad is how it might mean that the people making the content will be paid less and the people holding the rights will be paid more... and that was a concern that's been held for a long time and likely was going to be an issue no matter where you could see films.
Every record album will now release day n date on spotify!!! Yeah, progress sucks, but consumers love these decisions. And our money is what they want.
This will only embolden torrent venues with immediate access to high quality footage of the latest releases.
oh definitely.
I used to be of the mindset, probably a few years ago, that this was a step forward in the right direction - digital is the future, streaming is the future. I still believe this to be true; however, this most recent development has really saddened me... Plague or no plague, making a decision like this now, rather than at appropriate time, and refusing to judge each situation on a case by case basis, is a huge issue, not only for movie culture, but for the world at large... There's just too much fear circulating at the moment and it's driving far too many decision, some arguably good, others objectively bad... I view this one to be in the latter category. Thank you for clearing everything up, Bob, hope you're well!
As a poor man I say this is good, I can afford watching these movies
Honestly, I wouldn’t care to ever see a movie in a theater ever again, but what bothers me about this is that I’ll need to purchase ANOTHER streaming service if I want to see Godzilla vs Kong. The isolation of all these properties is what’s going to kill them, because there’s no streaming platform owned by a third party company that can adequately replace in person theaters, where ALL the studios’ stuff ended up.
I think you’re being too optimistic about the situation. I don’t think we’re anywhere near actual theatrical releases.
And frankly I’m tired of waiting. I’m tired of sitting back and hoping for theaters to be able to come back before I see these things I’ve been waiting to see for years. I feel like I’ve been robbed and WB is giving me a chance to take something back. And if the industry is robbed a bit for that, so be it. I’m done waiting on fuckin movie theaters. Done with it.
"Someday never comes."--John Fogerty
Love that Bob makes a point of saying it's small potatoes.
The potatoes in this case are niche and the people most affected deserve their voice heard.
Good on you.
All economic thoughts aside, I love the theater experience: sharing the experience with the crowd, the seats, the big screen, BUT at home my screen is ultrawide and has a far better image than the "big screen", I can pause to pee, I can drink and smoke whatever I want, I can make and eat a lasagne if I want while the movie is playing..... I prefer watching movies at home.
Okay, this is important, Bob:
There are vaccines around the corner, but, right now, the US is in the worst state of infection it has ever been in. There were over 200k new cases just yesterday. There were 2600 deaths, again, just yesterday. It's going to be months before a significant portion of the population has been vaccinated, and that's assuming the fearmongering of antivaxxers doesn't have a significant impact.
Maybe save the "We're in a much better position than we were a few months ago" for a time where you haven't had 16,000 deaths in the last *week* (That's over *five* 9-11s, in American units. in a week.)
Gotta say, I don't think our current situation is going to change soon enough to warrant a return to theaters or lament the transition to streaming as it's developed. I am all for a streaming slate in that regard.
I’m sorry, but we’re still in the middle of a fucking pandemic, with higher infection numbers than we had back in April. Absolutely nobody has any business going to a goddamn movie theater. It sucks, and is likely going to cause long term damage to basically every industry that involves strangers grouping together inside, but it’s either release these films to streaming or have no idea when anything is going to be released. I’m honestly annoyed they’re talking about any theatrical releases at this point. We ain’t there yet.
I get all of the issues with people’s contracts, paying the gaffers, etc. Absolutely none of it is worth people risking their health. Bottom line, neither government nor corporate handling of this pandemic has been or IS being sufficiently competent enough to justify thinking we’re going to be anything close to safe into 2021 when we’re still “setting records” with viral cases, and fucking Biden getting into office isn’t the panacea you seem to think it is.
My understanding is this, WB is going to win out with this move in the long run. They might take some hits in the short turn, but the theater business has been slowing dying for decades. It was only a mater of time before streaming took over as the premium platform. This is just expediting the processes. I think that in ten years time movie theatres will only be around as novelties, kept going only by a niche market of dedicated cinephiles. The mega-sized cineplex is going the wat of the dodo.
Am I saying this is a good thing? No. Am I happy about this? No. Is it a terrible move for society as a whole? Yes, I think it it. But I also think that it's enviable. Unless I'm proven wrong, this will be the new norm in about a decade. Say goodbye to cable television too, because it'll all be streaming on our faces soon enough.
Nolan turns out had a huge financial stake in a theatrical release. If not they could have released Tenet as a flipbook.
As a theatre worker that's currently out of work...I'd still rather we reopen when its safe than when it isn't. At the same time, the decisions being made may end up killing a lot of theatres before we do re-open. The three weeks ours did re-open...just were a poorly planned and dangerous risk that only lost money. Even so, I get why our theatre did it, too. They didn't have a choice, if they wanted to have any negotiating power at all by the end of this. Its a very complicated problem for everyone involved.
I think film studios have seen the writing on the wall for a while and knew streaming would completely overtake them eventually, but the pandemic shutting theaters down accelerated things way faster than anyone expected so Warner Bros decided to slam the panic button. Plus releasing them simultaneously gives people the option to pick and choose which movies are worth going to theaters to see and which are worth staying home for.
I'm sure there are a lot of people getting screwed over this whole thing, and that is a fair argument. But the pandemic has screwed over a lot of people, so it's hard to get worked up over a bunch of millionaires getting a bad deal when millions have lost their jobs. It's hard to get worked up when the Tenet opening early to test the waters is one of the many reasons we have a new and more deadly spike because we all stop isolating too early. And in all this video, it was never discussed about if this is good or bad for the consumer. I've never really bought in on the idea that a film "has" to be shown in the theater to get the full experience. Sure it can bring an added experience, but if the film feels like less because it didn't show in a theater, then it probably isn't a great film (remember Avatar. Seriously, does anyone remember that one?)
In the end, this is good for consumers and good for public safety. It give the choice to the consumer. And I'm not going to pretend that was WB ultimate goal in all this, but it's good amends after what they tried pulling with Tenet. We need to act like this is a long haul disease. You know, like a pandemic of sorts.
I watch a film in theaters once. The 20 other times I watch it I am at home. So really, I won’t be too sad skipping the theater part.
I think it a mistake to consider the possibility that we'll be out of this before fall 2021. That's my most optimistic. That said, it's been a long time since going to a movie theater was a better experience for me than just watching a movie at home. I'm not terribly disappointed. I grok the movie business side of this and my sympathy goes out to anyone unemployed or underemployed right now. These are the people that we need to be thinking about.
The release window for HBO Max here in Latin America is still "sometime in 2021" and even then the release schedule might end up pretty different from the US version. Our only option to see these movies is still wait for VOD or go to the still unsafe theaters.
You know, way back in the day, we decided film studios and theater chains shouldn't be owned by the same people, and so we made laws to make that illegal. I don't see how streaming services & theaters are any different in that regard, so maybe it's time to make a new law.
I don't care about seeing movies in theaters I just want to see them as soon as possible and I don't think theaters are going to open any time soon so they should put them on steaming.
I think what Bob highlights, and many commenters are maybe overlooking a bit, is the "Case-by-case basis evaluation" he championed before the final section. I feel like he's not saying "We should open now, today, 100% open gogogo!" he's saying "Okay, we know SOME of these should be streamed, but maybe we should negotiate new deals with those people like Wonder Woman did (instead of springing this on them), maybe we should see how things develop over a few months before blanket declaring everything go to HBOmax.
MAYBE everything does need to go streaming, but they didn't have to decide that with no discussion or evaluation of things as time goes on... they could've changed them over one by one as we got closer to each, like how Mulan and Wonder Woman went.
Food for thought. Thanks for the content Bob!
bob you're a breathe of fresh air in these stifling times
I think the next few movies should have still been on streaming for safety's sake, but taking it case by case would have been better for the little guy.
That Christopher Nolan slam is pure gold
Good video. Since Bob wrote the script for this last night, he seemingly left out the new reports of huge spikes of online film piracy that a streaming exclusive future will exacerbate (yes, you can still pirate movies in theaters, but it's much more difficult to do with having to sneak recording equipment into the showroom, hope you don't get caught by an usher and get thrown out/charged, arrested and indicted for theft that is constantly shown on various FBI content theft warnings, and go through all that trouble just to have a poor quality recording of a theater screen when you finally upload it to Pirate Bay, as opposed to just being able to wait for the company to drop a high quality streamer on whatever service they own/license to and have a great image quality copy of it floating on torrent sites, that's partially what happened to Mulan when it went the straight to Disney+ route).
In addition to that, Bob left out the fact (as he talked about in his James Gunn rehired for Guardians 3 video last year) that Hollywood is a Union town that is run on paperwork. I bring this up because the DGA (Director's Guild of America) ALSO blasted Warner AND AT&T for this (Side note: I blame AT&T more than I blame Warner, as Warner is pretty much forced to do this with marching orders) and if the DGA is blasting Warner about this, what about the WGA, PGA, and SAG-AFTRA? I will bet you anything that those four Hollywood unions are scouring their rules (as the DGA has threatened boycott of Warner over this) to see if the unions can use them to NAIL the studios over this.
Let's say for example that Disney announces a Black Widow skipping theaters for Disney+ on Thursday. That would DEFINITELY piss off the DGA, PGA, and SAG-AFTRA, since their ambitions for a streaming exclusive future could end up screwing a lot of talent Union members out of their pre-signed contract pay, as they can't get the money they would have gotten from the box office if there is no box office as streaming doesn't do "box office." (Couple of side-notes: I doubt that every studio can afford to compensate that lost revenue to union talent like Warner allegedly did for Patty Jenkins and Gal Gadot vis-a-vis Wonder Woman 1984, and the only reason that Hollywood unions didn't spring on the studios earlier when Disney had Mulan and Soul skip theaters was because of the then situation of whether or not we would have vaccines and if whether or not Trump was getting another four years or not, as the 2020 election ending with a Biden victory over Trump wasn't a forgone conclusion at the time).
I can also see some consumer rights groups entering into the fray to see if this streaming exclusive future could be stopped by any currently existing anti-monopoly/consumer protection laws (think a 2020s streaming version of United States of America vs. Paramount Pictures Inc. as Bob talked about in his 2011 History of Hollywood series) which COULD theoretically help theaters.
Not only that, but I also think we are seeing early signs of the streaming war bubble starting to burst. Movie studios in 2020 seem to be making the same mistake with streaming that electronics companies made with video game consoles in the early 80s that led to the Video Game Crash of 1983, or the Comic Book industry did in the 90s that led to the speculator bubble bursting: flooding the market with too many options. Ever since the announcement of Wonder Woman 1984 going day-and-date, I have seen plenty of comments on social media complaining about not wanting to pay for ANOTHER streaming service. With the overlap of popular content getting fractured up rather than having a universal streaming service (or just two or three different options) studios are planning to replace movie theaters with a new version of the cable package problem? (Which is ironic that streaming is becoming what it was originally invented and intended to replace). I mean, after all, those individual subscription prices WILL begin to add up, won't they? To the point that ironically the concept of streaming replacing movie theaters will become more expensive than theaters ever were in the first place?
How will I ever survive not paying a 1300% markup for Popcorn while enjoying movies from home?
Wait, hold up.
ATT owns Crunchyroll? Did someone drop acid in my mountain dew?
Okay, hold on... Matrix 4? Seriously, who dropped acid in my mountain dew!?
God that Beavis & Butthead clip almost killed me.
In theory I could get behind a system where we start seeing films go straight to streaming alongside or soon after theatrical releases, except that the big media companies have so thoroughly carved up the streaming market as to make it nearly indistinguishable from cable TV (as many warned would be the case). I still haven't bothered to sign up for Disney+ despite my love for Star Wars and Marvel, and wouldn't even consider doing so with HBO Max if not for WW84, but I'm not going to throw money at a monthly service just for one movie. I think that going straight to streaming is the right call for a pandemic but I don't trust either WB or Disney not to abuse the newfound viability of this distribution method now that they know it can work.
Remember in 2011 when DC Comics (a subsidiary of Time-Warner) announced they were going day-and-date with their universal relaunch, the New 52? Remember how all the industry experts said that it would be the death of comic book stores, and people would just download everything because why would they leave their house to go to the store when they could just read everything on an iPad? Remember when that lead to industry-wide growth for a number of years for ALL comic book companies, because people could try out a comic at home and then decide that if they liked it they could go get a physical copy as well, and then all the comic publishers picked up the same distribution models within a year? And, sure, a few other innovations shortly after (particularly Marvel Digital Comics Unlimited) ended up taking a lot of physical sales of monthly books in exchange for more collection-style releases, but the whole thing got more people into comic shops than had been in for the past decade.
I mean, I'm not saying that this EXACT thing is going to happen with this move, but wouldn't be interesting if I could watch, say, a half hour of The Matrix 4 at home and decide, "yeah, I'd like to see this on the big screen," and then go and pay 15 bucks to do that, rather than NOT see the movie because I don't know how well I'll like it and will it be worth my money and time?
Again, not saying that is is 100% what will happen. Just a possibility.
Christopher Nolan basically said "Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice I am willing to make"
If the only thing keeping the theater business open is an artificial monopoly on new movies, they deserve to die.
Good point.
I think a solid compromise would have been something akin to what happened with movies once the pandemic started. Everything that was in cinemas or about to go to cinemas was rushed to streaming. If it was "Hey, here's the release day for the movie in cinemas. After it's done a theatrical run that will go for a variable length of time depending on the state of the US [as the HBOMax release is US exclusive so I can't say anything about how it affects things here in Australia for example], we'll put it onto streaming. May have been a better compromise that at least gives the cinemas a chance to make some money off the movie.
From an outside-US perspective on the streaming: I'm all for streaming as long as the creators actually get the proper compensation. But: I wouldn't be able to see it anyway because HBO Max isn't available in my region (they plan to release it sometime before 2022 here) and frankly I'm not paying for yet another streaming deal to watch one or two movies.
Also, the US numbers look terrifying at the moment and I expect them to rise after Christmas. Be safe.
I'll never be able to go back to normal... My dad is dead he died of covid
Whatever it's worth, friend, I'm sorry. Condolences to you and the family.
This feels like the mice on the verge of eating each other or the Oroborus's tail is getting shorter.
If Legendary actually get somewhere it might embolden more under AT&T to revolt
The Warner Bros revolution.
Big companies are like big ships, it takes a long time to turn course. They took a while to respond to the plague, they respond late to the incoming reopening
Best big picture in long time good job!
Nice breakdown of the issues. I'm a fan of movie theaters--I like getting out of the house for a few hours, maybe eating some junk food, and sitting too close to the screen. With some movies I even enjoy crowded theaters for the group reactions (Sin City, Paranormal Activity, Lord of the Rings, and Endgame all come to mind). So, I'll watch WW84 from my couch this Christmas, but as soon as the vaccines make the rounds, I'm getting off the sofa and going to my favorite prestige theater for a boozy milkshake or three. I think WB made a shortsighted call committing their whole slate to day of streaming, and I think Bob is right that this was done purely to drive up their subscription numbers. But I also think it's going to blow up in their face: there are, quite simply, too many streaming services already, and I think WB is going to have a hard time getting the kind of numbers they so desperately want to join their service. If I didn't already have an HBO subscription through cable, I probably wouldn't be looking to join (heck, I haven't even signed up for Disney+ yet).
But I guess we'll see! I don't think this is the end of movie theaters though by any stretch--at least so long as the other studios don't panic and do the same thing (and as Bob and others have said, Disney has absolutely no reason to do it after their Mulan fiasco, plus they've shown no trouble getting subscription numbers for their service).
I hope these movies hit theaters at some point. I want to see them. But I don't want another streaming service. I already think they are two many of them.
More and more I'm fearing that the landscape of TV was becoming "cable with extra steps".
Isp cost plus 5-10 bucks per creator you like. This shift, and if this really does make HBO max enough money, means every studio/distributor will look for ways of locking down their properties into never existing outside of their companies website/app, and if you want to make any content, it exist and gets made under their wants no matter what
I could definitely see WB changing course on this decision over the next month or two. I'm sure some, maybe even most, of these films will end up being streaming releases but with the pending lawsuits from Legendary and others, plus the overall negative reaction from the industry, they might go back on it.
nice video. its interesting learning more about the business side of the movie industry.
I don't want theaters to fail as a whole, but I haven't had a good theater experience in a long time. Reclining LazyBoy theater seats and assigned seating doesn't make up for the increasing lack of etiquette of selfish people who spend entire runtimes talking, vaping, and looking at brightly lit up phone screens. Not the fault of theaters, but also not who I want to share my movie experience with.
5:47 I thought I heard Bob about to cry at that part. If so, I know how you feel, man.
7:38 And now we know how Zack Snyder got away with everything.
A typical thing with capitalism. Usually it devours itself at times.
I'm indifferent with it. I usually paid $15-$20 buck per person with my gf in watching it in high quality at theaters.
I'm not willing to go to the theater whether its free during the pandemic. 2021 is the same.
I'm still buying the merchandise though.
This was a good episode, but I wish it touched, even briefly, on the fact that the vast majority of people who were planning on watching these films, including in countries where the plague was never as bad as in the US, do not have any legal way to access HBO Max and so how these films are going to be released in these countries is now uncertain.
I think Bob has a point. WB is wrong, not for what they did, but for what they seemed to have not done in support of what they did: inform and renegotiate with the parties they contracted with.
Simultaneous vod/theater release s and rehashing your agreements with the parties that helped make this stuff are not mutually exclusive
Delta: Hello
Omicron: Hold my beer.
I agreed with you when you criticized Nolan for trying to get people into theaters. And, strangely enough, I *also* agree with you now on WB's decision. I don't see the hypocrisy.