@@emjackson2289 there's something to be said for losing a war. Post war Japan was given considerable assistance to rebuild, within certain constraints set by the allies, including strict limits on the size and capability of its defence establishment. Britain was heavily in debt, but still had significant obligations to maintain its military presence around the world and in Europe, not least because of the cold war. The next 30 years were dominated by divestment of colonial territories and industrial decline, with manufacturing of priducts like steel, ships and motor vehicles moving to Asia where labour was cheap. As the British economy faltered and shrank, both West Germany and Japan were able to focus on manufacturing and technology - which they had always been very good at - and so reap a very substantial peace dividend. Between 1939 and the mid 1980s, London's population fell by almost 2 million people. In the same period Tokyo's population grew by about 5 million, which was accompanied by an explosion of metro and urban rail services, the like if which London has seen in its Victorian heydey. The tube in London was in a fairly grim state by the 1980s, and as the City in particular began to thrive again, the costs of underinvestment became apparent. It's a lot better now than it was then. The Elizabeth Line shows up the 150 yr old technology of Victorian tube lines, but also demonstrated how expensive and difficult it can be to create new transport infrastructure in a mature and densely developed city.
That's not really true, is it? Various ideas and suggestions were batted about for 50 years, during which planning and investment was somewhat derailed by two World Wars. Parliamentary approval was given in 1948, but that is only part of a more complex planning and approval process. Construction on the Victoria began in 1962, and the section through central London to Victoria was opened in 1968, just a few months later than planned. In its time it was a significant engineering achievement, and it now serves 200 million passengers a year, vs. a forecast of 85 million. And it's fast - a journey from Brixton to Kings Cross that would easily take an hour by car takes about 18 minutes on the train Government can be slow at times, but it is accountable to many different stakeholders, as well as the electorate. The private sector can move more quickly in many cases, there are clear benefits to market competition, and so forth; but it only has to return value to shareholders. There are some important things that the private sector cannot or will not do at all, certainly not without significant government involvement, and modern transport infrastructure falls into that category. Government must be accountable, and challenged to improve its efficiency, effectiveness and cost. However, many of the armchair critics don't really understand what it does.
Yes, there was a massive local campaign to get a station in Pimlico - people were still talking about it when I moved there or thereabouts in the mid-90s (when Pimlico was still the most recent tube station to be added to the network).
Kind of pointless station tbh. Sure it's good for people who live there but Victoria Station is just around the corner and is better served by tube lines. And You can get to Tate Britain from Vauxhall Train station which is pretty much the same walking distance from the gallery
For many years the Victoria line was the many entry to the Tube for me else it was Liverpool Street. Being a North Londoner I rarely had the need to go South of the river & the extension has eluded me, so it makes an interesting video. Youngsters can't really appreciate how modern the Victoria line was when it opened when there was still old carriages on other lines with 25w small globe bulbs that would dim, even more that the meagre light they emitted, or just go out on some sections of track. A journey could be more akin to a ride on the ghost train.
In one of the office buildings adjacent to Pimlico station (in Rampayne Street) there is an underground car park, and in the car park there is what appears to be a large loading bay - except that no lorries go in there, and it would be too high anyway. It is in fact the boxed-in roof of part of the station.
I can't blame Brixton for opening so late. Trams are wonderful and they were clearly effective back then, so competing with them was a risk. Before our conflict with the US in the fifties, our Pyongyang was one of the only cities in Korea with a tram network (the other two were Seoul and Busan). But when the war destroyed our country, we had to rebuild it from scratch. On top of that, we built a metro system based off the famous Moscow Metro. The Metro's first line opened in 1973, before Seoul's did in 1974. And the new tram system first opened in 1989, using trams built in Czechoslovakia and now uses trams built in-house.
The great Harry Beck produced what is my favourite journey planner which shows the Victoria Line in a straight diagonal line from Walthamstow Hoe Street to Victoria. London Underground rejected this design but it can be seen.
If you live anywhere south of Brixton, you’d know how much carnage there is trying to get a bus outside of Brixton station to your final destination. There is desperate need for an extension south!
Herne Hill keeps cropping up as a possible extension destination, but so far Brixton remains the Southern terminus, as it has done since it reached there 53 years ago!!
Pimlico station opened just in time for me to start at the Pimlico school, then a brand new modern glass wonder, since demolished. I spent six years traveling back and forth from Clapham South via Stockwell. My white shirt collar would be black by the time I got home. The underground was filthy back then.
Good job that Pimlico got it's station properly named otherwise there could have been riots, as depicted in a certain Ealing comedy, which portrayed the pride of those living in Pimlico, for their locality, and they do have a point... I mean you do have to admit that somehow the title "Passport to an as yet unnamed station between Victoria and the Thames" wouldn't have had quite the same ring to it as "Passport to Pimlico". ;-)
I sometimes used the line to Brixton when I'd just missed the half-hourly service from Victoria to Herne Hill. Allowing for the extra transit time to Brixton and waiting for a bus from Brixton to Herne Hill, I'm not sure I often gained anything other than a bit (though not much) less boredom. From time to time there would be rumours of an extension of the Victoria line to Herne Hill, but it never happened, and I don't know how much substance there was to the rumours. I remember riding a BR train through Brixton, where it didn't stop on that occasion, and there was a policeman standing on the platform, because people could be seen on the road below throwing bottles and other things. (Brixton riot). This, of course, seriously dates me. Oh well.
I was using the Victoria line in 1969 as I still have a dated ticket, it has a magnetic backing strong enough it will stick to steel, like a fridge magnet. I probably started using the line in 1968, and recall Walthamstow Central underground station being built. I recall some local residents complaining they could hear trains running beneath their homes after the line opened.
Ungrateful residents! They should have been thankful, not just for the melodic underground sounds, but also for the improvement to their travel options.
@@thomasburke2683: the wheel squeal that you can hear is deafening and teeth jangling. I now don't go to Walthamstow often but when I do, get the Overground from Liverpool Street.
Prior to its more recent changes, Brixton was south London's Ladbroke Grove the haunt of music hall singers and actors and some of those houses have stories to tell of out and out debauchery that took a lot to keep out of the newspapers. If Ladbroke Road was seen as trendy, Brixton was trendy AND very bohemian, anyone invited to a party with a Brixton address was assured of a pretty alcohol fuelled experience of a lifetime and also became the "go to" place for recreational ahem medical supplements ahem. But as the inner city lost its performance clientele to out of the way places with no snooping journalists, the area became very run down and immigrant folks desperate for a place to live were drawn to the area due to its cheap rents and landlords who didn't care too much about their tenants. Brixton like neighbouring Peckham flourished with the West Indian folks becoming a very vibrant part of south London that is resisting gentrification as much as they can.
Smug comment here! I have commemorative opening day yellow tickets for *both* the original Victoria Line and the Brixton extension dut to the fact that my aunt used to work for London Transport. She had *connections*! 😎
I was working for MDS Data Processing Ltd at their offices in Vauxhall Bridge Road when The `Victoria Line opened in 1968 and when Pimlico station opened it made getting around London to service computers a lot easier for me🙂 Strangely though I have never been to Brixton tube station🤔
Well done for convering construction of Pimlico tube station, as you say that really was result of some great campaigning by local councillors of the time. As someone who grew up there I'm very grateful.
Back at school we were told it was easier to put subsurface lines through the clays of north london than it was to put lines through a gravelly shingley ground in south London. But also, south London had many more commuter lines already and - well - it was the less affluent part of town. One could take exception to the latter view in that it would not have taken much to extend the Northern line to Sutton, Carshalton, Epsom which are fairly affluent. It would still seem there is a case to be made for extending from Brixton to Streatham and Croyden. There are videos around on what could have been with the Northern end of the northern line and on Metro-land. So its nice to get some perspective on what might have been/could still be in the south.
I remember a poster at Vauxhall station, when they were doing upgrade/maintenance work there, stating that they had to freeze the ground when tunneling as the river above made the shingle too unstable to work through without it being frozen.
Technically, Brixton opened three years before The Beatles broke up since the breakup didn't officially happen until 1974. The story goes that three of them were ready to sign the papers...the only one who was nowhere to be seen was John (well Ringo wasn't there either but he was present via telephone). John said, "The stars weren't right" and refused to sign, purposefully delaying it. So where did John go? TO DISNEY WORLD! So an Apple lawyer flew down to Florida, went to the Disney's Polynesian Village resort where John was staying, and forced him to sign the papers on the spot that ended the iconic group on December 29, 1974. The room he stayed in still exists today as room 1601 of the Samoa longhouse, which you can actually book yourself! And that's not the only important historical event to happen at Disney World as Nixon's infamous "I'm not a crook" speech happened in 1973 (coincidentally the year before) at the nearby Contemporary resort next to Magic Kingdom!
"It took over 70 years to finish this piece of the puzzle." That's fast! We've been planning the Second Avenue Subway for over 100 years at this point, and it's still not done.
Once upon a time there were tram routes 16 and 18 that connected Purley with Westminster. However, they were replaced by bus route 109 in 1951, and that only provided such a connection until 1985, since when the route has been ever-progressively truncated. It is about time the Victoria Line was extended to replace the tram route, something that should have been done in 1951. It would extend along the line of the main London-Brighton Road from Brixton Station, with stations at Streatham Hill (Telford Avenue), Streatham, Streatham Common, Norbury, Thornton Heath Pond, West Croydon, Croydon High Street, South Croydon, Purley Oaks, and Purley Fountain. Ideally, it should go beyond there, with stops at Old Lodge Lane, and Coulsdon, then burrow deep under the North Downs with stations at Old Coulsdon and Coulsdon Common, to terminate at Caterham-on-the-Hill. There are existing surface lines, but they all criss-cross the area and fail to provide proper rail links along direct routes.
Hadn't realised that the planning of the Brixton extension came so late; full marks to LT for getting it decided and up and running so quickly. With its very useful interchanges at Vauxhall and Stockwell, and serving Brixton itself, it's hard to imagine life without it.
@@maggiesamuels2937 Try aiming your guns at the 'teachers' who betrayed you by not doing their jobs properly. They were stealing a living. Maybe they're still stealing a living.
I rode on the first train from Brixton. For some reason the first train started at half past three in the afternoon. When we got to Victoria most of us got out and crossed to the southbound platform just in time to hear the announcement that the train pulling in was the first train to Brixton. Happy days !!
@@Clivestravelandtrains Not so.Her Majesty drove the first train when the Victoria line only went from Walthamstow Central to Victoria. She was not present at the Brixton extension.
Jago, thanks for another great video, this time on my home town. I hope you enjoyed your visit. Growing up there into my late teens, I could never understand why we never had a tube station. I remember getting out various maps of south London and planning my own tube line from central London to Brixton, then on to Croydon via Streatham and Norbury. Unfortunately, I could never get the backing😀
Sometimes the incidental occurrences you capture in your footage seem to indicate that with all the stress and strife many of us associate with a tube journey (usually because it’s a trip to or from work), you have a healthy benign outlook on life, that in turn helps me at least, see familiar sights in another light. Thanks 🙏
I'm sure I saw somewhere that the original plan when going to Croydon was more of a Crossrail size tunnel so all trains could use it. As for Brixton to Moorgate that would have been a slow route with trains turning to Loughborough Junction via the curve there now unused for passenger services and sown the Snow Hill tunnel and the Smithfield curve (no longer there) . Not I journey I would want everyday.
Used the tube from Euston to Brixton a few times to get to the Southeastern line to Beckenham Junction. Depending on timetables quicker than waiting at Victoria.
74 years? Not bad. At least they eventually got off their butts and did it. These days you're lucky if something the government has known to be needed for years ever gets greenlit; it's far easier to argue about it forever.
Very nice indeed to see Brixton today. I was there shortly after the riots in 1980, and it was like a war zone, the rozzers being twice the size of their City colleagues, not very friendly, and patrolling in twos and threes all over the place. Not one stone on top of another, and burnt-out car wrecks everywhere.
On Somerleyton Rd Brixton opposite no85 is a TFL Electricity sub station...the tunnels for the Victoria Line extend from the station under this substation....I wonder if it was ever meant to go further south......
That 67 stock caused a lot of tube strikes as ASLEF to which many of the drivers and guards then belonged did not want driver only operation. The NUR was still undecided and split over OMO (just as many bus crews were but they had to follow the TGWU guidance). Many guards did not want to retrain as drivers and becoming station staff would have meant a possible pay reduction. A compromise eventually reached by transfers to lines that still hsd guards retraining as drivers and retirement/natural wastage. A massive pay increase helped for OMO trained staff.
Funny thing is however, Guards are actually needed a lot more on Tube Trains these days compared to the past. Especially considering the high levels of demand these days.
in Passport to Pimlico (1949), after Pimlico has declared that it's an independent duchy of Burgundy ("We've always been English, we'll always be English, and it's because we ARE English that we insist on our right to be Burgundians.") they stop an underground train and ask the people for passports. I'd always assumed it was the Victoria line, but that was because I watched the film before I really knew very much about the history of the Underground - it's clearly a Q stock train on the district line - th-cam.com/video/AKrc0nIBHFs/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=PaulThompson Which raises the question... which bit of Pimlico is it possibly going through? Presumably it's the bit from Westminster to Victoria, but it's a massive stretch!
I remember going on the Vicky line when it opened. The only thing I can really remember is the Armrests !!! As they had a step in the design. So the hand was higher than the forearm , And as such more comfortable !! And indeed it is.
Oh, I have an unsubstantiated theory as to why blue was seen as "modern" in the 1960's: It is the colour of electricity when it arcs through the air from one terminal to another. And "electricity" was then "the future" (which I think turned out to be pretty correct, except when it comes to electrifying Britain's railways of course).
Loved it when Pimlico opened - it meant avoiding the long trudge up to Victoria if you wanted to get a tube - another bonus was that it was a direct line to Highbury and Islington, great stuff for me and my mates who were ardent Arsenal supporters!!!
Brixton was in South London, which in transport terms means it might as well have been Timbuktu, Tanganyika, Matebeland and other such places of that particular Era which gentlemen with beards and pipes muttered about.
If you ever get a chance, get inside the old tram building at Oval which is now the Italian church. I was invited to a Big Fat Italian Wedding there in the 90s and it is AMAZING inside. I certainly never knew about its previous life in public transport and never would have guessed.
Strange when i left South London the Victoria line was under construction in the 60's and then came back 42 years or more for a visit and reunion i actually got off at Brixton station to go to one of Joanne Good's BBC Radio London O/B' in the market. i remember the last time previous was at the Orange Luxury Coach station in Brixton long gone by now. Happy days Marc In Bletchley G6XEG
Congratulations! It took me a long time to work out what station TBC was but I remembered just before you gave the answer. (I keep meaning to have a tube map in front of me when I watch your videos, but never get around to it.)
My usual terminus into London is usually Victoria - I’ve never been south from there on the Victoria line though - I shall have to venture down the missing piece of the jigsaw at some point…
Hi Jago, here is a fun challenge for you. Find the most Western tube station then leave from there, then travel to the most Eastern tube station. Note how long it takes. Do a video about it. Then do the same thing from North to South (or vice versa, whichever your preference) then do another video about it. I'm curious to find out how long it takes. Especially for when I visit. I will be looking to make my North as quickly as humanly possible. I'll probably get lapidated if I remain in London. I'm way too chipper for you folks.
@@hb1338 I was told when I visit the UK to not talk to Londoners and not make eye contact with them. If I want to have a nice chat with easy going people, I should visit the West country, which I will probably do after the Midlands.
Yes, they end at Somerleyton Road - you can see the electrical substation and escape point on streetview. Plans were to extend to Herne Hill for National Rail interchange and a loop was looked at in the 1990s. Abandoned as the business case didn't stack up.
@@ttrjw A pity as this would again have been a rather useful interchange into South London, especially for the Thameslink routes not going through Victoria. Interesting to speculate whether LT could have taken over one of the surface lines and provide a proper tube frequency service to South London.
As a Melbourne boy who loves London and British culture in general, I associate those places with cultural references. So I first heard of Brixton in The Clash song 'Guns of Brixton' and I first knew of Pimlico as a briefly independent nation in the classic Ealing comedy 'Passport to Pimlico'.
My Dad took me and my brother for a ride on the Vic line on its first day in September 68. On opening, it only ran from Walthamstow to Highbury & Islington.
Thanks for creating and sharing this video, Jago. It's really hard to think of the southern section of the Victoria Line taking so long to come into being. I wonder why there has never been any thoughts on why the Victoria line could not go further southward, like they are planning for the Bakerloo Line.
The Beatles break-up was of course due to worries about the loss of services over the Bootle Branch, which indeed happened in 1977 to cries from Yoko of "Told you so!"
As the Victoria Line ends at Brixton from Walthamstow Central. I do think that it could of extend down to Croydon and to end at Croydon with a new Underground station built in Croydon town centre that would serve West Croydon and East Croydon stations. And to have interchange with the Tramlink and buses. Overall Brixton is a very busy area in South London with lots of things to look at and with lots old and new buildings. And maybe a new London Overground station could be built to connect with the Victoria Line and National Rail stations at Brixton as a interchange.
Deep level Tube lines have very limited capacity, due to the small loading gauge of the trains, and there's a fast Thameslink service into central London from East Croydon. But there's probably a strong argument for an extension of the Victoria line to Tulse Hill via Herne Hill, connecting with several of the surface level rail services which crisscross south London; were such an extension to be built, one would also hope that a second entrance to Brixton Tube station would be a part of the plans!
@@mbrady2329 True. London Overground could of extend to East Croydon with a new bay platform being built to serve the Class 378 trains coming from Dalston Junction and Highbury & Islington. Instead you have to change at Norwood Junction.
It would be nice to have a tube station in more central Croydon, there's lot to see and do there as well. I hope Brixton stays interesting, but the market has become depressingly sparse in the past decade.
When I go to Brixton and see that big building on top of Brixton Station, with a large Sainsbury's next to it and London Overground sailing over the top, without an interchange, I get very frustrated. It would cost relatively little to build London Overground platforms and have them connect both to the existing National Rail station and the Underground station. I'm looking forward to someone deciding to do this and Sainsbury's getting knocked down to make way for it.
Another interesting vid thanks 🙏🏻 I heard that the reason there were/are more tube tunnel/tube lines north of the river is that the ground in south London was mostly clay and so harder to burrow through . Is there any truth in that or is it not the case? Thanks
I absolutely love your videos, they are informing and very entertaining! EG; the Beatles disbanding were not necessarily related to the line going ahead👍👍 I am going to Buenos Aires again next month on business, I tried the Subte (Spanish for tube) last time. It even uses the same type of map, so it's easy to find your way around! This was quite a surprise to some of the Argentinians I was visiting there! They also have "El tren del fin del mundo" in Ushuaia. It means the train at the end of the world, as Ushuaia is the southern most town in the world! The engineers there were happy to show me the trains that were manufactured in Sussex! Very enlightening indeed! The train is remarkably similar to the Romney Hythe and Dymchurch set up! Possibly slightly larger? Top marks for content and humour, if you would like any up to date photos etc of the system in Argentina then I would be more than happy👍👍
At 0:40 you mentioned that the LC&DR terminus for the line from Brixton was Moorgate… I did not know that. However I am struggling to work out how the line got there. Could you enlighten me? Was it via the West London line and then Paddington?
According to Wikipedia it went via Loughborough Junction to Blackfriars and through the Snow Hill tunnel. There used to be a connection for trains from the south to turn east into Moorgate.
@@JagoHazzard Thanks for all the work you do on your channel. Looking at your YT subscriptions, likes and views this channel has really taken off in the last year or two. 👍🙏🙂
Jego another example of the penny-pinching hand of the Treasury on transport projects which have cost the country much more as is the case with rebuilding of the underground circulation space and extra escalators at Victoria. You did not mention the lobbying that took place to have the extension beyond Brixton to Streatham. The result is the daily scrum outside Brixton Station for the buses going up the hill.
Without trying to cross too far into Jay Foreman's unfinished London one is curious of the report of "travel in (to/from ?) the suburbs had peaked". While Hitler's V weapons had finished the main flattening of housing sites in London there was no manpower, or money, to significantly rebuild. The dispersal of population had started in the early 1950s with a mix of the five pound poms to the overseas dominions of the remnant of empire, two world wars had knocked out a substantial male generation/s of usefulness or presences, younger women had gone to the US when collected by their GI partners, and within the UK the rush was to light industry in the new towns deliberately away from easy commute to London and it was expected that population growth would be mostly in these areas, even Thamesmead would be as much the third line of invasion defence from tanks into London (why do you think it was built like that with easy machine gun lines over the A2 and the Thames). By the Mid 1950s it became noted that the population had gone too far down, invites to come and work in manual industries went out to the new commonwealth for folk to help the mother country, paid enough to live in the cheap Zone 2 housing even as Zone 3 areas were still being planned with fewer dwelling units, some bigger than the victorian terraces , others with space for garages and motor vehicle parking. London Transport's finances became challenged , mostly from the loss of the marginal fare journey that covered and exceeded fixed costs with an impact from the line extensions of the northern and the central. Finally was it not somewhere near Brixton that the M23 was supposed to join up with a widened South Circular Road ?
74 years? Still quicker than most modern goverment projects....
74 yrs, slightly less than the time between today and the end of World War Two and yet Japan has the Shinkansen, we still don't have HS2.
@@emjackson2289 yes 🙌 I can agree with you on that one ☝️.
@@emjackson2289 there's something to be said for losing a war. Post war Japan was given considerable assistance to rebuild, within certain constraints set by the allies, including strict limits on the size and capability of its defence establishment. Britain was heavily in debt, but still had significant obligations to maintain its military presence around the world and in Europe, not least because of the cold war.
The next 30 years were dominated by divestment of colonial territories and industrial decline, with manufacturing of priducts like steel, ships and motor vehicles moving to Asia where labour was cheap. As the British economy faltered and shrank, both West Germany and Japan were able to focus on manufacturing and technology - which they had always been very good at - and so reap a very substantial peace dividend.
Between 1939 and the mid 1980s, London's population fell by almost 2 million people. In the same period Tokyo's population grew by about 5 million, which was accompanied by an explosion of metro and urban rail services, the like if which London has seen in its Victorian heydey. The tube in London was in a fairly grim state by the 1980s, and as the City in particular began to thrive again, the costs of underinvestment became apparent. It's a lot better now than it was then. The Elizabeth Line shows up the 150 yr old technology of Victorian tube lines, but also demonstrated how expensive and difficult it can be to create new transport infrastructure in a mature and densely developed city.
That's not really true, is it? Various ideas and suggestions were batted about for 50 years, during which planning and investment was somewhat derailed by two World Wars. Parliamentary approval was given in 1948, but that is only part of a more complex planning and approval process. Construction on the Victoria began in 1962, and the section through central London to Victoria was opened in 1968, just a few months later than planned. In its time it was a significant engineering achievement, and it now serves 200 million passengers a year, vs. a forecast of 85 million. And it's fast - a journey from Brixton to Kings Cross that would easily take an hour by car takes about 18 minutes on the train
Government can be slow at times, but it is accountable to many different stakeholders, as well as the electorate. The private sector can move more quickly in many cases, there are clear benefits to market competition, and so forth; but it only has to return value to shareholders. There are some important things that the private sector cannot or will not do at all, certainly not without significant government involvement, and modern transport infrastructure falls into that category. Government must be accountable, and challenged to improve its efficiency, effectiveness and cost. However, many of the armchair critics don't really understand what it does.
Yes,for example, the Government has just started a "stop the boats" campaign. It's been a really long time since slavery.
Now extend the line to Streatham and then Croydon! Connect South London!
Yes, there was a massive local campaign to get a station in Pimlico - people were still talking about it when I moved there or thereabouts in the mid-90s (when Pimlico was still the most recent tube station to be added to the network).
The newest stations at that point would have been the stations on the Piccadilly Heathrow extension. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
@@GABESTA535 You're right, Hatton Cross in 1975, and Heathrow stations at various times after that.
I tried to exit Pimlico Station but was refused because I didn't have my passport with me !!
Kind of pointless station tbh. Sure it's good for people who live there but Victoria Station is just around the corner and is better served by tube lines. And You can get to Tate Britain from Vauxhall Train station which is pretty much the same walking distance from the gallery
@@franklingoodwin If it is as pointless as you say TFL would have closed it by now.
For many years the Victoria line was the many entry to the Tube for me else it was Liverpool Street. Being a North Londoner I rarely had the need to go South of the river & the extension has eluded me, so it makes an interesting video.
Youngsters can't really appreciate how modern the Victoria line was when it opened when there was still old carriages on other lines with 25w small globe bulbs that would dim, even more that the meagre light they emitted, or just go out on some sections of track. A journey could be more akin to a ride on the ghost train.
Yes, some of the platforms at stations on older lines were quite dimly lit with bulbs, even busy ones like Camden Town.
Blue has always represented modernity - It was the last colour Dye to be found and it was very expensive to make... 👍
And it's the colour of electricity.
Same with LEDs!
Maybe the Piccadilly (which parallels the Victoria line through central London) established blue as the SW-NE colour ...
also by far the final color to be mastered on LEDs was similar to the Victoria Line Color
Also in the 60s Chelsea FC had a trendy new blue strip
In one of the office buildings adjacent to Pimlico station (in Rampayne Street) there is an underground car park, and in the car park there is what appears to be a large loading bay - except that no lorries go in there, and it would be too high anyway. It is in fact the boxed-in roof of part of the station.
I can't blame Brixton for opening so late. Trams are wonderful and they were clearly effective back then, so competing with them was a risk. Before our conflict with the US in the fifties, our Pyongyang was one of the only cities in Korea with a tram network (the other two were Seoul and Busan). But when the war destroyed our country, we had to rebuild it from scratch. On top of that, we built a metro system based off the famous Moscow Metro. The Metro's first line opened in 1973, before Seoul's did in 1974. And the new tram system first opened in 1989, using trams built in Czechoslovakia and now uses trams built in-house.
thank you great leader we look up to your example
The great Harry Beck produced what is my favourite journey planner which shows the Victoria Line in a straight diagonal line from Walthamstow Hoe Street to Victoria. London Underground rejected this design but it can be seen.
If you live anywhere south of Brixton, you’d know how much carnage there is trying to get a bus outside of Brixton station to your final destination. There is desperate need for an extension south!
The buses are frequent though, well most of them.
Herne Hill keeps cropping up as a possible extension destination, but so far Brixton remains the Southern terminus, as it has done since it reached there 53 years ago!!
Pimlico station opened just in time for me to start at the Pimlico school, then a brand new modern glass wonder, since demolished. I spent six years traveling back and forth from Clapham South via Stockwell. My white shirt collar would be black by the time I got home. The underground was filthy back then.
It's still pretty dirty and the tracks have to be picked and defluffed every night.
Good job that Pimlico got it's station properly named otherwise there could have been riots, as depicted in a certain Ealing comedy, which portrayed the pride of those living in Pimlico, for their locality, and they do have a point... I mean you do have to admit that somehow the title "Passport to an as yet unnamed station between Victoria and the Thames" wouldn't have had quite the same ring to it as "Passport to Pimlico". ;-)
Jenny,
"Passport to Pimlico", "Visa to Victoria".
What's next?, "Banished to Brixton"?
@@thomasburke2683 You've got me going. 'Waltzing to Walthamstow'.
Waltzing to Walthamstow?
Not the word I'd have used !!
@@simonwinter8839 Quite right! So wading? wimping? Or worst of all, working
@@bruceperkins4601 You're nearly there !!
I sometimes used the line to Brixton when I'd just missed the half-hourly service from Victoria to Herne Hill. Allowing for the extra transit time to Brixton and waiting for a bus from Brixton to Herne Hill, I'm not sure I often gained anything other than a bit (though not much) less boredom. From time to time there would be rumours of an extension of the Victoria line to Herne Hill, but it never happened, and I don't know how much substance there was to the rumours.
I remember riding a BR train through Brixton, where it didn't stop on that occasion, and there was a policeman standing on the platform, because people could be seen on the road below throwing bottles and other things. (Brixton riot). This, of course, seriously dates me. Oh well.
I was using the Victoria line in 1969 as I still have a dated ticket, it has a magnetic backing strong enough it will stick to steel, like a fridge magnet. I probably started using the line in 1968, and recall Walthamstow Central underground station being built. I recall some local residents complaining they could hear trains running beneath their homes after the line opened.
Ungrateful residents!
They should have been thankful, not just for the melodic underground sounds, but also for the improvement to their travel options.
I used to go to uni where the central line was directly under one of the lecture halls. Their trains made a lot of noise
@@thomasburke2683: the wheel squeal that you can hear is deafening and teeth jangling. I now don't go to Walthamstow often but when I do, get the Overground from Liverpool Street.
Thx Jago, another fine instalment 🤙🏿 The other day, I rocked down to Electric Avenue, but then I took it lower (when I got the Vicky back north) 😆
Prior to its more recent changes, Brixton was south London's Ladbroke Grove the haunt of music hall singers and actors and some of those houses have stories to tell of out and out debauchery that took a lot to keep out of the newspapers. If Ladbroke Road was seen as trendy, Brixton was trendy AND very bohemian, anyone invited to a party with a Brixton address was assured of a pretty alcohol fuelled experience of a lifetime and also became the "go to" place for recreational ahem medical supplements ahem. But as the inner city lost its performance clientele to out of the way places with no snooping journalists, the area became very run down and immigrant folks desperate for a place to live were drawn to the area due to its cheap rents and landlords who didn't care too much about their tenants. Brixton like neighbouring Peckham flourished with the West Indian folks becoming a very vibrant part of south London that is resisting gentrification as much as they can.
Thank you so much for this channel.
Smug comment here! I have commemorative opening day yellow tickets for *both* the original Victoria Line and the Brixton extension dut to the fact that my aunt used to work for London Transport. She had *connections*! 😎
Nice!
I was working for MDS Data Processing Ltd at their offices in Vauxhall Bridge Road when The `Victoria Line opened in 1968 and when Pimlico station opened it made getting around London to service computers a lot easier for me🙂 Strangely though I have never been to Brixton tube station🤔
Excellent research and photography as always
Well done for convering construction of Pimlico tube station, as you say that really was result of some great campaigning by local councillors of the time. As someone who grew up there I'm very grateful.
Back at school we were told it was easier to put subsurface lines through the clays of north london than it was to put lines through a gravelly shingley ground in south London. But also, south London had many more commuter lines already and - well - it was the less affluent part of town. One could take exception to the latter view in that it would not have taken much to extend the Northern line to Sutton, Carshalton, Epsom which are fairly affluent. It would still seem there is a case to be made for extending from Brixton to Streatham and Croyden.
There are videos around on what could have been with the Northern end of the northern line and on Metro-land. So its nice to get some perspective on what might have been/could still be in the south.
I remember a poster at Vauxhall station, when they were doing upgrade/maintenance work there, stating that they had to freeze the ground when tunneling as the river above made the shingle too unstable to work through without it being frozen.
Technically, Brixton opened three years before The Beatles broke up since the breakup didn't officially happen until 1974. The story goes that three of them were ready to sign the papers...the only one who was nowhere to be seen was John (well Ringo wasn't there either but he was present via telephone). John said, "The stars weren't right" and refused to sign, purposefully delaying it. So where did John go? TO DISNEY WORLD! So an Apple lawyer flew down to Florida, went to the Disney's Polynesian Village resort where John was staying, and forced him to sign the papers on the spot that ended the iconic group on December 29, 1974. The room he stayed in still exists today as room 1601 of the Samoa longhouse, which you can actually book yourself!
And that's not the only important historical event to happen at Disney World as Nixon's infamous "I'm not a crook" speech happened in 1973 (coincidentally the year before) at the nearby Contemporary resort next to Magic Kingdom!
"It took over 70 years to finish this piece of the puzzle." That's fast! We've been planning the Second Avenue Subway for over 100 years at this point, and it's still not done.
Thank you Jago for another fun and informative Sunday episode...😊🇬🇧
Great video! The Victoria Line is definitely one of my favourites 👍
The wheel squeal is deafening on some stretches of the route.
Once upon a time there were tram routes 16 and 18 that connected Purley with Westminster. However, they were replaced by bus route 109 in 1951, and that only provided such a connection until 1985, since when the route has been ever-progressively truncated. It is about time the Victoria Line was extended to replace the tram route, something that should have been done in 1951. It would extend along the line of the main London-Brighton Road from Brixton Station, with stations at Streatham Hill (Telford Avenue), Streatham, Streatham Common, Norbury, Thornton Heath Pond, West Croydon, Croydon High Street, South Croydon, Purley Oaks, and Purley Fountain. Ideally, it should go beyond there, with stops at Old Lodge Lane, and Coulsdon, then burrow deep under the North Downs with stations at Old Coulsdon and Coulsdon Common, to terminate at Caterham-on-the-Hill. There are existing surface lines, but they all criss-cross the area and fail to provide proper rail links along direct routes.
Maybe also a station at Brixton Hill (Crown & Sceptre) where it would connect with all the buses going along the south circular road.
Hadn't realised that the planning of the Brixton extension came so late; full marks to LT for getting it decided and up and running so quickly. With its very useful interchanges at Vauxhall and Stockwell, and serving Brixton itself, it's hard to imagine life without it.
74 years - sounds like about the time it'll take to get new trains on the Bakerloo...
Or get the extension to Lewisham and maybe beyond.
The place where I live Brixton glad it got its tube station eventually. I didn't know it was that young aswell. Thank you for the information.
As well, not 'aswell'.
@English Cider Lover ok who are you the spelling police? 🚨 I can write how I want SO! THERE! 🤪 . Go hide behind your keyboard and get a life. 🤣🤣🤣
@@maggiesamuels2937 Try aiming your guns at the 'teachers' who betrayed you by not doing their jobs properly. They were stealing a living. Maybe they're still stealing a living.
Never leave us Mr Hazzard, you are a veritable fount of arcana.
Brixton is such a cool place.
Nice to see the blue lights on the fin are still working after me and my dad fixed the section that stopped working about 15 years ago.
I rode on the first train from Brixton. For some reason the first train started at half past three in the afternoon. When we got to Victoria most of us got out and crossed to the southbound platform just in time to hear the announcement that the train pulling in was the first train to Brixton. Happy days !!
Is that because the Queen was opening it in the morning? She drove the first train.
@@Clivestravelandtrains Not so.Her Majesty drove the first train when the Victoria line only went from Walthamstow Central to Victoria. She was not present at the Brixton extension.
@@simonwinter8839 Thanks for clarifying that.
@@Clivestravelandtrains To be honest nobody actually drives them,just two buttons on the sixty seven stock and away she goes !!
Jago, thanks for another great video, this time on my home town. I hope you enjoyed your visit. Growing up there into my late teens, I could never understand why we never had a tube station. I remember getting out various maps of south London and planning my own tube line from central London to Brixton, then on to Croydon via Streatham and Norbury. Unfortunately, I could never get the backing😀
74 years? Why, that's positively sprightly compared to some other government projects (railway related or otherwise).
Sometimes the incidental occurrences you capture in your footage seem to indicate that with all the stress and strife many of us associate with a tube journey (usually because it’s a trip to or from work), you have a healthy benign outlook on life, that in turn helps me at least, see familiar sights in another light. Thanks 🙏
A nice treat for a Sunday afternoon.
ps britishracinggrren, that colour came from Ireland.....
@@seanbonella I know. It is also known as Ulster green.
The main problem with the Brixton extension is always having to take your passport to be checked when the train stops in the tunnel outside Pimlico.
Thank you for sharing Jago - Interesting for it to take that long!!! 🤔🚂🚂🚂
I'm sure I saw somewhere that the original plan when going to Croydon was more of a Crossrail size tunnel so all trains could use it. As for Brixton to Moorgate that would have been a slow route with trains turning to Loughborough Junction via the curve there now unused for passenger services and sown the Snow Hill tunnel and the Smithfield curve (no longer there) . Not I journey I would want everyday.
Certainly that was covered on an earlier video in this channel. I think it was one of the episodes on the County of London Plan.
One can see why Tram to Bank was quicker
Used the tube from Euston to Brixton a few times to get to the Southeastern line to Beckenham Junction. Depending on timetables quicker than waiting at Victoria.
I nearly fell off my chair when I saw night-time shots - I thought Jago never went out after it got dark! Nice film, thanks.
74 years? Not bad. At least they eventually got off their butts and did it. These days you're lucky if something the government has known to be needed for years ever gets greenlit; it's far easier to argue about it forever.
Very nice indeed to see Brixton today. I was there shortly after the riots in 1980, and it was like a war zone, the rozzers being twice the size of their City colleagues, not very friendly, and patrolling in twos and threes all over the place. Not one stone on top of another, and burnt-out car wrecks everywhere.
On Somerleyton Rd Brixton opposite no85 is a TFL Electricity sub station...the tunnels for the Victoria Line extend from the station under this substation....I wonder if it was ever meant to go further south......
5:46 I'm gonna walk down to Electric Avenue.
I saw this after arriving home from work, a great way to wind down.
Jago, you’re such a wordsmith I love it. It’s not ‘puzzling’ to me at all 😂
Brilliant video sir.
Very enjoyable as usual Jago. What about a video about East Brixton station?
You are the edgepice to our jigsaw
The Most Relaxing Voices Ever (in no particular order)..
Morgan Freeman
Sean Connery
James Earl Jones
Barry White
Jago Hazzard
I would like to add James Mason, Jeremy Irons and George Sanders to your list.
Wasn't Gabriel Woolf considered to be the man with the golden voice ?
That 67 stock caused a lot of tube strikes as ASLEF to which many of the drivers and guards then belonged did not want driver only operation. The NUR was still undecided and split over OMO (just as many bus crews were but they had to follow the TGWU guidance). Many guards did not want to retrain as drivers and becoming station staff would have meant a possible pay reduction. A compromise eventually reached by transfers to lines that still hsd guards retraining as drivers and retirement/natural wastage. A massive pay increase helped for OMO trained staff.
Funny thing is however, Guards are actually needed a lot more on Tube Trains these days compared to the past. Especially considering the high levels of demand these days.
Great video as always! ❤
The out card outro of these vids does feel like the rolling background of a Scooby Doo cartoon chase sequence.
Electrifying!
Brilliant.
I like the Jigsaw poster. A simple explanation.
never seen it before
The art on the walls is very interesting :)
in Passport to Pimlico (1949), after Pimlico has declared that it's an independent duchy of Burgundy ("We've always been English, we'll always be English, and it's because we ARE English that we insist on our right to be Burgundians.") they stop an underground train and ask the people for passports. I'd always assumed it was the Victoria line, but that was because I watched the film before I really knew very much about the history of the Underground - it's clearly a Q stock train on the district line - th-cam.com/video/AKrc0nIBHFs/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=PaulThompson
Which raises the question... which bit of Pimlico is it possibly going through? Presumably it's the bit from Westminster to Victoria, but it's a massive stretch!
Indeed so. I suppose North Pimlico is possible.
I remember going on the Vicky line when it opened. The only thing I can really remember is the Armrests !!! As they had a step in the design. So the hand was higher than the forearm ,
And as such more comfortable !! And indeed it is.
I think the 'two-level arm-rest was so that the two people between which the arm-rest was sited could each get at least an elbow on to it.
74 years? Wow, it's quicker up north. The Liverpool loop only took 63.
Oh, I have an unsubstantiated theory as to why blue was seen as "modern" in the 1960's: It is the colour of electricity when it arcs through the air from one terminal to another. And "electricity" was then "the future" (which I think turned out to be pretty correct, except when it comes to electrifying Britain's railways of course).
Loved it when Pimlico opened - it meant avoiding the long trudge up to Victoria if you wanted to get a tube - another bonus was that it was a direct line to Highbury and Islington, great stuff for me and my mates who were ardent Arsenal supporters!!!
Brixton was in South London, which in transport terms means it might as well have been Timbuktu, Tanganyika, Matebeland and other such places of that particular Era which gentlemen with beards and pipes muttered about.
If you ever get a chance, get inside the old tram building at Oval which is now the Italian church. I was invited to a Big Fat Italian Wedding there in the 90s and it is AMAZING inside. I certainly never knew about its previous life in public transport and never would have guessed.
Strange when i left South London the Victoria line was under construction in the 60's and then came back 42 years or more for a visit and reunion i actually got off at Brixton station to go to one of Joanne Good's BBC Radio London O/B' in the market.
i remember the last time previous was at the Orange Luxury Coach station in Brixton long gone by now.
Happy days
Marc In Bletchley G6XEG
Congratulations! It took me a long time to work out what station TBC was but I remembered just before you gave the answer. (I keep meaning to have a tube map in front of me when I watch your videos, but never get around to it.)
Quote of the Day: “What, do you think that London Transport was made of money?”
Thanks!
My usual terminus into London is usually Victoria - I’ve never been south from there on the Victoria line though - I shall have to venture down the missing piece of the jigsaw at some point…
Hi Jago, here is a fun challenge for you. Find the most Western tube station then leave from there, then travel to the most Eastern tube station. Note how long it takes. Do a video about it. Then do the same thing from North to South (or vice versa, whichever your preference) then do another video about it. I'm curious to find out how long it takes. Especially for when I visit. I will be looking to make my North as quickly as humanly possible. I'll probably get lapidated if I remain in London. I'm way too chipper for you folks.
One minor problem - Chesham is both the northernmost and westernmost station.
@@Tevildo Well, where some see problems, others see opportunity. That means Jago would take off from the same spot twice then. See, problem solved. 😁
After you have been lapidated, we can reverse the process and you will then be delapidated.
@@hb1338 I was told when I visit the UK to not talk to Londoners and not make eye contact with them. If I want to have a nice chat with easy going people, I should visit the West country, which I will probably do after the Midlands.
I think the overrun tunnels extend quite a way after Brixton, was this to do with a planned further extension that never happened?
Yes, they end at Somerleyton Road - you can see the electrical substation and escape point on streetview. Plans were to extend to Herne Hill for National Rail interchange and a loop was looked at in the 1990s. Abandoned as the business case didn't stack up.
Funny you should say that, I have a video coming up on this very subject.
@@JagoHazzard Excellent, looking forward to it
@@ttrjw A pity as this would again have been a rather useful interchange into South London, especially for the Thameslink routes not going through Victoria. Interesting to speculate whether LT could have taken over one of the surface lines and provide a proper tube frequency service to South London.
I'm not sure but I believe trains are stabled there overnight
If I'm wrong no doubt someone will correct me.
As a Melbourne boy who loves London and British culture in general, I associate those places with cultural references. So I first heard of Brixton in The Clash song 'Guns of Brixton' and I first knew of Pimlico as a briefly independent nation in the classic Ealing comedy 'Passport to Pimlico'.
Passport to Pimlico is an Ealing Studios classic.
I, the Duke of Burgundy, welcome you to Pimlico…
My Dad took me and my brother for a ride on the Vic line on its first day in September 68. On opening, it only ran from Walthamstow to Highbury & Islington.
Thanks for creating and sharing this video, Jago. It's really hard to think of the southern section of the Victoria Line taking so long to come into being. I wonder why there has never been any thoughts on why the Victoria line could not go further southward, like they are planning for the Bakerloo Line.
70 years to complete the puzzle. Does that make Brixton the Rubik's Cube of the Tube!
A mere 74 years! Will HS2 be completed that quickly?
Hmmmm......................
Was there a correlation between the break-up of The Beetles and the opening of the Victoria line to Brixton?
Actually The Beatles broke up officially in 1970. Thus, it was only 1 year after they broke up.
Yes, I am that guy again.
The Beatles break-up was of course due to worries about the loss of services over the Bootle Branch, which indeed happened in 1977 to cries from Yoko of "Told you so!"
@@lordmuntague 🙀🙀🙀🙀
As the Victoria Line ends at Brixton from Walthamstow Central. I do think that it could of extend down to Croydon and to end at Croydon with a new Underground station built in Croydon town centre that would serve West Croydon and East Croydon stations. And to have interchange with the Tramlink and buses.
Overall Brixton is a very busy area in South London with lots of things to look at and with lots old and new buildings. And maybe a new London Overground station could be built to connect with the Victoria Line and National Rail stations at Brixton as a interchange.
Deep level Tube lines have very limited capacity, due to the small loading gauge of the trains, and there's a fast Thameslink service into central London from East Croydon. But there's probably a strong argument for an extension of the Victoria line to Tulse Hill via Herne Hill, connecting with several of the surface level rail services which crisscross south London; were such an extension to be built, one would also hope that a second entrance to Brixton Tube station would be a part of the plans!
@@memofromessex the north? so overground extension past Watford junction?
@@mbrady2329 True. London Overground could of extend to East Croydon with a new bay platform being built to serve the Class 378 trains coming from Dalston Junction and Highbury & Islington. Instead you have to change at Norwood Junction.
@@memediatek Lol imagine that. 😂
It would be nice to have a tube station in more central Croydon, there's lot to see and do there as well. I hope Brixton stays interesting, but the market has become depressingly sparse in the past decade.
"Well....." If that wasn't there, I'd be most disappointed.
I've now got that song by The Clash stuck in my head.
I’ve got the Eddy Grant one stuck in mine!
@@JP_TaVeryMuch Train In Vain
When I go to Brixton and see that big building on top of Brixton Station, with a large Sainsbury's next to it and London Overground sailing over the top, without an interchange, I get very frustrated.
It would cost relatively little to build London Overground platforms and have them connect both to the existing National Rail station and the Underground station. I'm looking forward to someone deciding to do this and Sainsbury's getting knocked down to make way for it.
Now THAT was punctual!
Another interesting vid thanks 🙏🏻 I heard that the reason there were/are more tube tunnel/tube lines north of the river is that the ground in south London was mostly clay and so harder to burrow through . Is there any truth in that or is it not the case? Thanks
If the Bakerloo line extension is built before 2100 it will be a miracle!
Just realised..
The front of the tube train looks like Deadpool.
Now you can't unsee it. 🙏
"Small and Basic and proving inadequate" - Have you been talking to my therapist again ?
I absolutely love your videos, they are informing and very entertaining! EG; the Beatles disbanding were not necessarily related to the line going ahead👍👍
I am going to Buenos Aires again next month on business, I tried the Subte (Spanish for tube) last time. It even uses the same type of map, so it's easy to find your way around! This was quite a surprise to some of the Argentinians I was visiting there!
They also have "El tren del fin del mundo" in Ushuaia. It means the train at the end of the world, as Ushuaia is the southern most town in the world! The engineers there were happy to show me the trains that were manufactured in Sussex! Very enlightening indeed! The train is remarkably similar to the Romney Hythe and Dymchurch set up! Possibly slightly larger?
Top marks for content and humour, if you would like any up to date photos etc of the system in Argentina then I would be more than happy👍👍
At 0:40 you mentioned that the LC&DR terminus for the line from Brixton was Moorgate… I did not know that. However I am struggling to work out how the line got there. Could you enlighten me? Was it via the West London line and then Paddington?
According to Wikipedia it went via Loughborough Junction to Blackfriars and through the Snow Hill tunnel. There used to be a connection for trains from the south to turn east into Moorgate.
2:52 ... the Deadpool train!
great video Jago
The like of foresight is staggering…there seems to be endless money for inadequate workarounds for one million problems in the UK however.
👍Nice one Jago! Must take you ages to research this stuff. I am guessing here but is every minute of narration about an hour of overall work?
This one wasn’t quite so heavy - I was fortunate in that I’d done a lot of the research already for other videos.
so you do care about people on here, i thought just me you were sarcastic too hahahahaha
@@JagoHazzard Thanks for all the work you do on your channel. Looking at your YT subscriptions, likes and views this channel has really taken off in the last year or two. 👍🙏🙂
What happened when Pimlico Station was being built? Did trains terminate at Victoria, and was there a service from Brixton to Stockwell?
That shot at 6:47 seems to show a very *clean* station.
It is a clean at platform level.
Jego another example of the penny-pinching hand of the Treasury on transport projects which have cost the country much more as is the case with rebuilding of the underground circulation space and extra escalators at Victoria. You did not mention the lobbying that took place to have the extension beyond Brixton to Streatham. The result is the daily scrum outside Brixton Station for the buses going up the hill.
Without trying to cross too far into Jay Foreman's unfinished London one is curious of the report of "travel in (to/from ?) the suburbs had peaked". While Hitler's V weapons had finished the main flattening of housing sites in London there was no manpower, or money, to significantly rebuild. The dispersal of population had started in the early 1950s with a mix of the five pound poms to the overseas dominions of the remnant of empire, two world wars had knocked out a substantial male generation/s of usefulness or presences, younger women had gone to the US when collected by their GI partners, and within the UK the rush was to light industry in the new towns deliberately away from easy commute to London and it was expected that population growth would be mostly in these areas, even Thamesmead would be as much the third line of invasion defence from tanks into London (why do you think it was built like that with easy machine gun lines over the A2 and the Thames). By the Mid 1950s it became noted that the population had gone too far down, invites to come and work in manual industries went out to the new commonwealth for folk to help the mother country, paid enough to live in the cheap Zone 2 housing even as Zone 3 areas were still being planned with fewer dwelling units, some bigger than the victorian terraces , others with space for garages and motor vehicle parking. London Transport's finances became challenged , mostly from the loss of the marginal fare journey that covered and exceeded fixed costs with an impact from the line extensions of the northern and the central. Finally was it not somewhere near Brixton that the M23 was supposed to join up with a widened South Circular Road ?
The Bakerloo Line and older siblings:🫂