Mormon Influencer Discovers the CES Letter - Haleigh Everts - Episode 1434
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ค. 2024
- After converting to Mormonism as a teen and attending BYU, Haleigh Evert’s relationship with the Mormon church grew unfulfilling and complicated. After leaving the church for a time, Haleigh came back to the Mormon church, married in the temple, and started making videos and writing about her Mormon journey.
Haleigh eventually published the book “Why I Left the Mormon Church and Came Back,” which is still sold at Deseret Book today.
Then, after years of promoting and defending the Mormon church, Haleigh read the CES Letter for the first time (just a month and a half ago).
In this episode we discuss Haleigh's conversion, her reach on social media as a Mormon influencer, and her life now after reading the CES letter.
Show Notes:
- Haleigh’s TH-cam: / @haleighmarkar
- Haleigh's Instagram: / haleighforeverts
- CES Letter: cesletter.org
- “Unveiling Grace” by Lynn Wilder: www.amazon.com/Unveiling-Grac...
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#LDS #Mormon #CESLetter #PostMormon #Spirituality
Timecodes:
0:00 Haleigh’s mom gets baptized and she attends church
16:40 Breaking the law of chastity, bishop using patriarchal blessing and temple to increase commitment
22:08 Visiting BYU and feeling that’s where the Lord wanted her
30:08 Meeting RM at BYU then breaks up with boyfriend
34:20 Markers of undue influence and YW leaders influence to marry in the temple/follow the patriarchal blessing
51:55 Exposed to BYU students who party and trying to date while staying chaste
1:01:14 Trying to go on a mission, falling for a non-Mormon man then being ghosted
1:14:11 Purity culture at BYU, feeling like God led Haleigh to AZ, losing faith
1:28:43 Complicated relationship with the church, sleeping with Elder’s quorum pres
1:38:00 Reactivating in the church and feeling hopeful
1:43:20 Meeting her future husband (CJ) and sharing her past with him (and vice versa).
1:53:56 Disciplinary council process and living out probation
2:22:33 Going through the temple and non-member family excluded from the wedding
2:52:10 Married life begins and husband discloses sins
2:56:19 Going viral for talking about coming back to Mormonism and getting book deal
3:25:48 Preaching the joys of Mormonism while feeling unhappy at church, marriage unraveling
3:43:41 Other Mormon influencer’s post spurs empathy for different beliefs
3:54:00 Haleigh lists her problems with the church while she has space to reflect during COVID
4:12:14 Haleigh feels duped after reading the CES letter
4:27:53 Regrets choosing the church over loving people and changing beliefs
4:32:35 Haleigh and her husband struggling with different views
4:44:05 Final thoughts and an apology to those Haleigh influenced in the church
5:04:26 Bishop assuming there is no happiness now for her and her family outside the church
5:16:52 Path forward for Haleigh
After years of suspecting untruths and skeletons in the closet of church history, i finally got the guts to listen to a Mormon Stories interview - this was the first one. After listening to this single interview, I knew I was out for good. Thank you for recording new interviews regularly. By releasing new content weekly, you stay relevant in the algorithm, and people like me who need rescuing can finally find you when we're ready. Keep up the good work! You're freeing people from lies, oppression, shame and exploitation.
You lost it too ? How sad ,not anveasy road the narrow road is real. Seems that people are very frágil and forgetable
Don't know you, but I'm proud of you. This can't be easy. Sorry friend. Keep your head up!
Free! Your Free! Lots Of Love And Excitement For The Big Wide World Ahead Of You. Organized Religion Is Where Danger Hides. I Know It Will Be Hard, But So Very Worth It For You And Those Who Have The Strength To Do It. The Book Of Mormon Is A Lie, And So The Leaders Tread Lightly On Serious Issues And Off Shoots Like Lori And Chad Daybell. The Very, Very Best Of Luck To You. Truly, Tracy
Jed it is the hard road to take. I left the church in 1978 when I was 18 and found the way out was lonely and ever changing. As you open your mind to the ways you have been duped you find new ways it still has you and a new layer of issues you had not considered. I just found this site too. I was doing this alone except for a brief period in the 1990s when I frequented a AOL. Chat room for exmormons. My best advice to you is be careful who you trust with your confidence, they come after exmormons in so many ways and never give up. I had to give up that short stint in that chat room because male current members trolled it and handed out viruses on a regular basis. I lost 2 computers. Only tell those that need to know and never at work, keep a religious buffer of protection. Don’t ask and don’t tell, walk away if confronted, don’t debate the believers it upsets them when you don’t come back. If you end up reading your way out of all it ….Bible too….even garden variety Christians will come after you in insidious ways, especially in this current political environment. Gays might be out of a closet but I learned it isn’t safe out there for the agnostic or atheists. ❤️ good luck to you dear. Hopefully technology has improved enough it will be ok for you to gain support here.
Holy moly! That's wild! Take care of yourself friend, it's a hard road but it's gonna be okay ❤
I loved when she said, when she left the church and people (who didn’t know yet) told her she looked like she was glowing, so happy, etc. But when people KNOW you left the church, magically they say you’ve “lost the light in your eyes”, “you look dark and sad”, etc.
lollll
This is so true! I had a random stranger tell me I had light in my eyes the other day at the same time my family keeps telling me I’ve lost it.
“Happy” is the heroine of the energies as I watched. Always praying for our own humanity. Rare breeds put mirrors up! Thankyou for sharing authenticity 💥
Exactly the same happened to me. In the beginning they said I am very happy and then they found out me leaving and said “your happiness is from satan” 🙄
Ha! I've had people online tell me that I'd lost the light in my eyes. People I'd never met or seen in person.
“I don’t need to be told WHAT to think because now I know HOW to think”. That is some powerful stuff
Super GREAT!!
Super agree - I just ... I watched her video announcing she left the church and is no longer married. And the reasons she gave were so shallow and divorced from reality - they included the prophet urging members to get vaccinated, and Uchdorf giving money to the Biden campaign. She's an anti-vaxxer. I'd say she's still learning HOW to think.
She was really influence by the Casey's of the church and to get married early to have 2 a r m so much pressure is put on that particular situation by the church that you feel inadequate if you don't follow that plan because you do feel inadequate marry someone you hardly know just to get married and have those children to me that's not as successful roadmap for a successful marriage
Bite is so damaging
@@joanteasdale2991 vv
"Why didn't God tell the Bishop I needed help?" absolutely broke my heart. I grew up Evangelical and absolutely identify with Haleigh's experiences.
My friend sent this to me… I am just now finding out after 32 yrs all this conditioning. I’m in a hurting angry phase. This gave me so much validation and comfort! I shared it with my daughter. It gave her the same comfort! Thank you!
Edited-
I wanted to add, I woke up because my daughter tried to kill her self. I got myself into counseling right away. I realized the influence I was under and pulled away. This daughter is the one I gave this video to. She felt so much validation.
One year later I hope things have gone so much better for you and are still on the up and up
I pray that since this happened you and your daughter are in a better place and found the truth.
I hope you and your daughter have found community that loves and cherishes you unconditionally. I wish you peace, and healing always❤
Going through the same
I put my faith, trust and value in who I am in what the Word of God says! Genesis 1:26, Eph. 1:4, 6, 5, 7, 11, 12
I appreciate you always making sure to explain “Mormon things” to your non Mormon listeners!
I appreciate this as well even being an ex mormon, because I left before being sealed or endowed I don't always know what they're talking about.
@@elizabethhill7901 As a non Mormon, I watched the temple ceremony here on TH-cam, NewNameNoah channel. Both fascinating and creepy.
@@elizabethhill7901 I also like that they defined what 'disfellowship' means because I used to be a Mormon and never really heard about that
@@charlesmendeley9823 I did as well. Scary to think my family and friends have done that and think it's totally fine.
I find it really cool that non Mormons are even listening 🙂
I was an active member of the LDS Church for 42 years. It’s been five years since I chose to step away due to repeated abusive counsel throughout all the years of my church membership. I was active in all ways (including RS President) and dedicated by life to the church. My husband was a classic grandiose narcissist (much like many church leaders and the church organization itself). He loved the concept of eternal marriage because it kept me trapped in his abusive cycles in our marriage.
I am just beginning to examine my doctrinal beliefs. This is my first introduction to the CES Letter. I have much to learn, so I am grateful for Hailey’s story today. I wish you the best!
Did you get a divorce? How hard or difficult was it for you to leave the church?
The best of luck to you ❤
Wow/:
My ex- was a covert malignant Narc. Cluster B. Mormon. He got favored // ( with his pathological lieing)-(born// raised in the church) -plus he is male…. He was entrenched in the P. Addiction / but I finally caught it.
He would not seek help. I was severely neglected for 11 years/ & many abuse tactics was used on me //by him & other male members.
@Gail C I'm thinking of you. I hope you are doing well. It's so very difficult to process all the horrible things we go through due to the Mormon Church - an abusive organization. My thoughts and hopes are with you. I wish I had noticed early on that the Mormon Church is a Totalitarian organization - there are no checks and balances on the leaders. They do whatever they want. Women are their primary targets for abuse. Women have no power in that abusive organization and there isn't even so much as an Ombudsman department.
You are not alone in a difficult situation. 42 years is difficult to unravel. You are loved and don’t forget it!
I’m glad you’re away from your abuser. You deserve safety and peace
I love that Haleigh owns her actions without making excuses for them. That takes a big person.
@Laura
It "could" mean that. Or, it could be a representation of the actions of a street urchin:
"Yes. I stole the piece of candy! Big deal!"
@@ahashdahnagila6884 we can all be street urchins.. she just happens to be more honest/unfiltered about it... she's a New Yorker, they ARE very blunt 😆
I don't know how I would handle any of this... just know I am too ruined make it work
She is Beautiful Brilliant and Incredibly HONEST REFRESHING & AWESOME..
I wanna be more like that
Haliegh should write a book called why I left the church and came back and left again
And never came back should be in the title
Her post after the interview with mama stories was a disgrace, I think she is as real as a three dollar bill. I wish this interview never happened. It makes the community look bad. She’s milking every minute of her purity for her own convenience.
@@gloriavasquez6953 where can I find her "momma stories" post?
@yours truly she’s so vulnerable and honest. This isn’t about money.
She’s no longer Mormon
Good conversation.
One needs to be a CRITICAL THINKER when it comes to ALL religion... not just Mormonism.
And with politics and everything else in life too. Also, the dominant culture has its own dogmas you have to completely buy into or else you get cancelled. Not much room for independent critical thought.
Correct. 100%. All organized religions are filled with guilt, shame, and control
@@joeterp5615 Seriously, unless you’re a Hollywood star you have to ignore attempts to cancel you. I’m on the left and I have the courage of my convictions; if I think something has downsides, I state it and will take and argue back whatever the backlash. Culture is a conversation. Don’t let others intimidate you (there are always people on the fringes looking to make trouble and people who will hop on without thinking) and also keep an open mind. There could be very good reasons why you’re getting push back. For example, I’m part of the LGBTQ community and if you think I don’t deserve the same civil rights as you, I will push back and not feel at all bad if you get cancelled for trying to deny LGBTQ people civil rights or make LGBTQ people be less than. (Other cultural aspects are open for debate but expect comparisons to straight people culture re their behavior that they don’t notice because they’re like fish in an ocean) There are all sorts of people who think they’re thinking critically when they’re letting bigotry influence their thinking.
@@IExpectedBSJustNotThisMuchBS I’m on the right, and I will enjoy a vigorous debate with anyone. But I agree with you that there are very serious issues where it is hard to compromise on and the differences really can’t be sugar-coated. That said, I look for the humanity in everyone I deal with, even if I think they are wrong in the most profound ways. Not looking to have such a debate here lol - but I do agree that one has to constantly evaluate oneself and be open to change when presented with evidence that runs contrary to long-held opinions. When we don’t have the humility to occasionally admit we are wrong, then it become impossible to grow as a person.
@@joeterp5615 as a man you don’t have a good reason to question the gospel, it gives you power. I researched all faiths after I left the church and learned they all have one common theme. Christian, Jew, or Muslim they all believe God likes men best, women should be silent and submissive, and women must bend over backwards to be correct in the eyes of the gospel. You add the fact a Mormon woman needs a man to call her to heaven and you have us worshiping a powerful man not a Lord. Might work for you but I don’t take kindly to being lied to.
I'm amazed by this woman's storytelling skills, charisma, and intelligence. There's something so magnetic about her. This was my favorite episode so far.
I did’t see many storytelling skills on her. She made many mistakes with some of the decision she made( which is ok) and is blaming the church.
I agree. She really puts herself into the part of the story she's telling and gives insight into her thoughts and feelings at the time. It's like you're watching her re live it kinda.
Are you LDS? What is an RM?
@@hersheyybar I'm not, but I do know that RM means "returned missionary."
@Cindy H The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints sends its members out on different types of missions - proselytizing, service, temple, family history work etc. Anyway when missionaries get home from their missions they are typically known as "returned missionaries" because they have returned home from their respective missions. Anyway the terminology "returned missionary" and "returned missionaries" often get initialized or abbreviated to "rm" or "RM" (returned missionary - singular noun) or "rms" or "RMs" (returned missionaries - plural noun). I hope this helps and is understandable. Take care and God bless you and yours.
I just lost the love of my life back to Mormonism. She hadn’t been active as well as I, and we were so happy. I’ve felt like the church isn’t true for some time now, but when she told me she was going to start going again, I went just for her. I can no longer sit there in church and listen knowing what I know now. I’ve been listening to this to help validate my feelings and understand that there is more out there than the life I knew with her. I want someone who truly challenges and understands their beliefs. Thank you John.
It sounds like that is exactly what she is doing. You are going to give up the love of your life for this? Very sad.
I left 40 years ago. She will find her way out again. Pray and love her. If you don't believe the church is true, who is God to you? Pray to God not a mormon man God. He will answer, but always pray and love her.
You left your wife because she chooses to go to church?? this is so sad this is why I hate this channel! it divides, ruins families . people are just searching for their own truth in their own belief in God and Jesus Christ..
@@catherinesusann5182 this is what hate channels like this do … no one has agency to do what they feel is right for them . If your Catholic Mormon Muslim etc. Your in a cult .
This channel seems agnostic atheism is the only way to live .. uggh
@@mkm1206 I totally agree. That is NOT a reason to leave the love of your life. What I think is happening is that he cannot stand the guilt he feels for turning away from something he isn't sure is really false and his wife reminds him of that. Can't people just allow the ones in their lives time and their own freedom? She can attend church and he can stay home and can't they still love each other?
It’s entirely possible to make good decisions, have morals, and raise children to do the same without having religion in the picture at all, just saying.
AGREED! I'm an avowed atheist and am kind, honest, moral and have raised an amazing atheist son who is also kind, and compassionate, and moral.
@@hippiekansasgirl1632 live without the Lord in our lives die without him, can you afford to live without Jesus?? He’s going to be back anytime now even at the gates!!
@@carolynaitken7632 yes, thank you. i can afford to live without him. or her. or any gender of god.
THIS......SO MUCH THIS!!!!!!!!!!
I agree. I have raised 2 lovely children who know how to behave and treat people without any religion.
What this is crazy. I watched Haleigh as a Mormon before I left the church and I looked up to her so hard because of how she spoke of modesty and other Mormon topics. Now that she's deconverted im in love and I think as a now ex Mormon ill start watching her again 🥺❤
Would you rejoin the LDS?🤔
I watched Vogel's series and particularly the first video dealing with his effort to piece together the writing and alleged dictating sequences along with his own reasoning for the strange differences and word changes and then the mystery of the added characters from the book of breathings. I noticed that nowhere does Vogel deal with the Lacuna realities where the scribes ran into problems trying to retrofit Smiths translation with the Egyptian characters. Suppose the English didn't match up with missing any wormhole places? The two margins had to line up together or no match between the two languages could possibly be made. Vogel admits how connecting the correct Alphabet with the English translation was the goal of the scribes hoping to create a verifiable alphabet and grammar document.
They obviously hoped to save face by creating verifiable results. This effort makes total sense considering their professional status in the community and reputations. Such highly educated scribes also assisted Joseph with the Book of Mormon translation which went far more smoothly finishing a far larger book more quickly. That effort was mostly accomplished by just one scribe alone. The need for multiple scribes for the Abraham translation obviously demonstrates a different approach of attempting far more objectives than just scribing alone.It was renamed transcribing obviously for that reason. Vogel seems to be trying to piece together his own theoretic creation of what he thinks might have happened while several unknown things were obviously happening simultaneously at once, all within an entirely different approach than remembered in the Book of Mormon translation.
The BOM scribes couldn't even see the Egyptian characters on those plates, nor were these scribes ever hoping to assemble the Egyptian alphabet understanding at that time. Vogel needs to study exactly how the Dead Sea scholars dealt with a multitude of Lacunas (WORM HOLES in the scrolls) causing many missing connections by gaps of missing language In order to fix this lost language the scholars needed to invent new language to replace gaps of the sentences that were forever missing. When you are forced to make up characters to connect proper sentences together the challenge becomes this, exactly how do you find new replacements to reconnect missing characters that fit with the right English translation?
Vogel makes it sound like these guys were just making up characters out of thin air trying to fool the public. He is avoiding how scholars must replace holes with temporary character's which may actually be wrong at first, while at the same time using them to mark exactly where they must try to fix that problem area later by locating better character's and then fixing them. Obviously a lot of recopying and efforts to fit things together may have been going on because their best efforts wouldn't quite always fit everything together correctly. Other factors we cannot know today might better explain what Vogel is still trying to discover.
Again, Vogel doesn't ever deal with the admitted fact that these scrolls all had Lacuna {worm hole) problems. He hopes to avoid that reality to make it appear Smith was fabricating all of these things. Lacuna gaps are what happens with all ancient materials over hundreds and thousands of years? It makes total sense that a regular translation from God to his prophet would solve such a problematic scroll since the best records are not upon the on earth but are also recorded in heaven. What Joseph Smith likely translated by the Holy Ghost was correct?
@@richarddick2955 sorry. The dead Sea Scrolls may have had "worm holes" but they knew what letters and words were supposed to be there because they have copies that contained the same exact words but we're "newer" and were better preserved. The dead Sea Scrolls were the oldest of the same books but nice try though.
The whole time she was talking she way doing the opposite.
@@waynelacroix8870about 30% of the manuscripts found in the dead sea scrolls were new discovery actually...
Haleigh, your comment around 4:22:00 about having lost your silly and quirkiness really hit home for me. I was also a convert (at 21) and left the church in 2018 at 38. In April this year my family was in Florida and there was some street music and my mom and I were dancing together. My sister made a comment about how it took my leaving the church and a divorce for me to be me again. It didn't hit me until that moment that I really had become someone completely different. I am still rediscovering who I am... and it's not easy, but it's a glorious journey.
Been there, enjoy!!
❤️ glad you found you. Easy to get lost in the details.
Inspiring story, I too lost faith in the church as I dove into church history during highschool seminary and had to tell my parents on my 18th birthday that I didn’t want to serve a mission because I didn’t want to be pressured to teach something I didn’t believe.
Good for you!! That must have been so hard, but congratulations on living your truth and not being pushed into something you don’t believe.
That took courage. I bet that was hard because as believers your parents would think you won't be with them in heaven. Plus you knew how shocked and disappointed they would be.
Well something that isn't true
I saw a few of her videos back when she was defending. I had a feeling she would eventually end up here. You can’t be an online presence as a Mormon for too long without coming across all the overwhelming evidence against it....eventually. Maybe Kwaku is next. This woman is a fantastic human being. Loved the interview.
I'm waiting for Kwaku. I'm certain it will happen sooner or later.
That is the core issue isn't it? Unless you have a paycheck tied to the Church in one form or another, the amount of disproving information becomes overwhelming and your perspective flips.
I feel like Al Fox will be in til the end.
I don't know if Kwaku will... I feel like he's already well aware by now it's not true and could ride that Sunk Cost fallacy to the end...
@@GillianAtHome you just NEVER know…
Being on Mormon Stories must be like Free Therapy with John Dehlin!
Emotional, powerful and painful. Wearing your love, faith and passion on your sleeve. You, Haleigh are the most genuine person I’ve ever heard speak. Good luck and be well.
She is so very genuine- wearing it all on her sleeve. You go girl!
I love so many things she says. "...pretty darn sure God would never do any of the crap that has happened in this church. Not of God."
Amen.
I have been a follower of Haleigh for a long time! Nobody can EVER say she’s not authentic. I’m so proud of her
Am I going to watch this when I get off my night shift instead of sleep? YES!
I love the way she tells her story. I can really feel the emotions good and bad as she speaks
I usually go away from John's great podcasts feeling so happy and validated...this one just broke my heart for Haleigh. I am so sorry that you have had to go through this absolute abuse of a cult! Thank you for sharing your story and being so eloquent, honest and vulnerable! Haleigh, you are amazing person and I wish you the best. Thank you for sharing....I agree with you with all my heart and wish you the very best in life! I wish at 28 years old, I would have been as smart as you are...I'm twice your age, and just figured it out about 3 years ago! Thank you! Much love to you!
It’s no more a cult then any other religion. Just because you had a bad experience doesn’t make it a cult. I to don’t want anything to do with the lds church (for my own reasons) but to insult those that do only degrades what you say.
@@acd2505 - High control religions like Mormonism, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Scientology, etc. may not be full-fledged cults. however, there are numerous cult - like qualities within these religions that make them so damaging. If you don’t agree, I strongly suggest you do a little more research.
@@liseklerekoper2441 like I said it’s no more a cult then any other religion.
@acd2505 the difference between this cult and other religions is if u leave mormonism ur shunned by family
@acd2505 the difference between this cult and other religions is if u leave mormonism ur shunned by family
Haleigh is an amazing person. I remember judging her Mormon content wishing she would wake up 🤣 I feel silly now. I'm so glad she figured it out
You’re not alone. There were many of us who watched her for years and wished the same thing. Don’t feel silly…she figured it out 👏
We all travel our own path!
☺️
The intensely invasive questioning of a young woman by a group of older men, is SO CREEPY. I cannot believe that this goes on.
It’s the one thing I really don’t understand - as a woman and mom. I’d never want grown men questioning my daughter OR son about sex. It’s disgusting.
It fills my whole body with mortal terror to imagine that happening to me. And having to cognitively label it good and okay while my body was screaming not safe and not right, which would then make me feel guilty. Ugh what a nightmare
Right???
In Islam I think they do a hymen check before marriage, talk about invasive.
It's for sexual gratification after they're done questioning these ladies. They call it ..."PRAYING FOR YOU SO GOD CAN TELL US WHAT TO DO IN YOUR CASE". Some of those leaders even write down these stories to keep remembering them to get aroused. I'm 72 years old and I have plenty of experience with these leaders in churches when i used to go to repair their xerox copiers😮
This was such a refreshing episode for me. I was also an investigator in my teens, got baptized when I was 18, and attended BYU. The way Haleigh described the transition from a "half-Mormon" life at home to a "full-Mormon" life at BYU was exactly my experience. I felt so alone at BYU because of the emotional consequences I endured as a result of that transition. I also had similar feelings of being unworthy compared to my peers who were born and raised in the church. I always felt like I stuck out like a sore thumb at BYU. I also experienced a very similar cognitive dissonance about having a non-member family and what that meant from an eternal perspective. I also thought that the reason why those difficult feelings never went away was because I wasn't good enough or didn't do enough. All of that led to me falling into a deep depression throughout my time at BYU and until my late 20s. There were so many things discussed in this episode that I very much relate to, which means a lot to me. For the longest time, I didn't think anyone else would be able to relate to or understand what I experienced, but it seems Haleigh's experience was similar to mine. Thank you for sharing your experience, Haleigh. Hearing your story is helping me heal.
She should be so proud. I’m impressed that she was able to find her way out after being insulated for so long. Seeing her so happy at the end felt so good. Great interview.
I've followed Haleigh since the beginning and enjoyed her videos regardless. I'm so glad she's doing this interview!
46:31 when I was 16 I got my patriarchal blessing, a short time after my older brothers friend was leaving on his mission and let me read his. Some paragraphs were word for word the the exact same as mine. We weren’t even in the same stake. I knew it was fake after that.
Thats why they say to never share your blessing
Read Ephesians 2:8 through 10 man's Wisdom will always fail you but when you trust in Christ and his forgiveness His Holy Spirit he will guide you when you ask him to
I've never seen even close to the same. They are different
Dr Dehlin, you have great insight into how the church creates the need for itself. I am not Mormon, but I can see this to some degree in other organizations. Bless you Haleigh. Great interview.
You explain things so clearly, John. I know some situations intuitively make me uncomfortable but I cannot verbalize why. You do. You have that gift. Thank you.
I just love Haleigh! I loved her as a Mormon and I love her more now she’s an exmo! Such a beautifully honest interview! 💖
Love this! I have been similar in leaving the church and coming back.. and now leaving again. It has been incredibly hard with family being incredibly rude to me, but Mormon Stories has helped me immensely. I have a support that I didn't know was out there until a couple of months ago.
YEPPer!!
I’m glad you found support. It is so hard when your family treats you like an outsider simply because you won’t be a part of their group. I have experienced that myself. I love the ex-mo communities, I have found community again, even if it is online and not in person.
I am not nor have I ever been Mormon but I have to say I’ve listen to three of these podcasts and I am getting so much out of them thank you
Dear FELLOW MORMONS,
It breaks my heart to know that this church Is in DENIAL to of the TRUE JESUS CHRIST. The BIBLE clearly teaches that JESUS is GOD manifested in the FLESH (John 1:1-14KJV)(1TIMOTHY 3:16) He is NOT "A god" among "MANY" as this "church" teaches (April 7, 1844, king follet discourse) The truth is, this religion started with a LIE, from joseph Smith. The apostle Paul Cleary says in GALATIANS 1:8 if we or an angel should preach a "different gospel" let him be ACCURSED!!!! so who was moroni??? According to 2 CORINTHIANS 11:14
We know who disguises himself as an
"angel of light" (satan). Could it be perhaps Joseph Smith was deceived since he had ties with free masonry?
This "church" teaches in WORKS as requires to keep ordinances and Laws/ strict regulations, yet JESUS FULLFILLED THE LAW, the BIBLE says in ROMANS 5:1 that we are JUSTIFIED by FAITH, so why throw in works? In GALATIANS 3:10 "Paul writes that those under the LAW are cursed. The book of mormon is an ABOMINATION before GOD. The Bible (66 books) are ENOUGH, so why add another testament bringing the lies to America? When the prophets pretty stemmed out of ISRAEL, even PAUL (A JEW/PHARISEES) who preached to the gentiles, preached in JERUSALEM. I'm sorry to say this but, JESUS is NOT satan's brother, JESUS is NOT a created being from "heavenly father" producing offspring as a result. And you WILL NOT BECOME A "god" ONE DAY!!!!! you will NOT BE MARRIED FOR ALL ETERNITY!!!! when the Sadduces talked about the resurrection pertaining to who would keep the women as wife, JESUS STATED in MARK 12:25 They WILL NOT MARRY!!!! run from this CULT, RUN FROM THESE HERESIES, AND COME TO TRUE JESUS CHRIST OF THE BIBLE, I love you mormons,
“For there are THREE that bear record in heaven, the FATHER, the WORD, and the HOLY GHOST: and these THREE are ONE.
-1 JOHN 5:7 KJV"
JESUS cried and SAID, He that believeth on ME, believeth NOT ON ME, but on HIM that SENT ME. And he that SEETH ME SEETH HIM THAT SENT ME.
-JOHN 12:44-45 KJV"
JESUS saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet HAST THOUG NOT KNOWN ME, Philip? he that HATH SEEN ME HATH SEEN THE FATHER; and how sayest thou then, SHEW US THE FATHER?
-JOHN 14:9 KJV"
“I AND MY FATHER ARE ONE.”
-JOHN 10:30 KJV"
They are relatable to all religions.
But think also of the millions who are happy as LDS. And still are.
Just watched the pod cast and I'm very proud of you and your story. In a nutshell, After 40 years and being born into the covenant, temple marriage and 5 children, I was excommunicated. The church decided to "withdraw" my membership last year. That decision nearly ruined my marriage and family and most importantly my wife is in a faith crisis. I'd be happy to discuss that story in more detail. Currently my goal now is to raise my children to live without the understanding of sin and the guilt that comes with it. It's a freedom that people in the church who are struggling need to know.
I resonated SO much with this interview! I’ve followed Haleigh for a couple years now and I’m so happy for her and I can’t wait to see how her journey plays out
Love Haleigh! Fellow Arizonaian follower and while I’m older I’ve enjoyed following her and watching her journey. She has a pure and honest heart ❤️
I was a Catholic and I can't imagine that level of scrutiny... We did confess but in my experience I only offered as much detail as I wanted and then I was told to pray and was forgiven. Never would a priest bring up your sins again, or even keep track of them, and shame you.
I love being catholic because of the eucharistic
Did you leave the catholic church?
@@pamelaq6185I did.
Another excellent interview! I'm 55 years old. I was excommunicated in 2006 and then rebaptised in 2015, and just resigned (2021) because I learned the truth. Like you, I wonder if I wasted 31 years of my life. But I raised 2 great kids, and lived a pretty good life, or so I thought. Just wish I could get all that tithing back that I paid over the years since it was paid under false pretenses! Hang in there, Haleigh!
I am 55 this week.
Wow: I got baptized 20 years ago; LDS.
This is Insanity with the whole real church History. I feel that most make members hold onto polygamy as the true doctrine.
Oops// maLe
Why were you excommunicated- just curious ?
@@gowanderlustwithme I was having "relations" with a women I was not yet married to and refused to stop. The actual reason is stated as "failure to obey the instruction of Church Leaders." 🤣
One of the best Mormon stories Video's, So open, honest, and vulnerable.
Thanks for sharing, I'm sure things work out for you and you family.
Wishing you all the best.
John Dehlin and Carah Burrell ❤💕❤💕❤ I'm not mormon, exmormon or religious at all but I absolutely LOVE this show. It is fascinating and so so important for everyone! The stories and the lessons contained within them hold so much gold for anyone from any walk of life! You guys are amazing..truly crucial work contributing to healing all over the world 👏 ❤ 💖 💗 💕 💓
That’s exactly how I feel. I’ve watched Mormon Stories everyday since the first day I ever watched. 2 weeks ago! LOVE, LOVE MORMON STORIES ❤❤❤
Well said- I totally agree. There are “life lessons” in every episode. This podcast is really awesome- and so are other channels which are suggested by John and co-hosts
You’re great Haleigh! I’m a swiss ex-mormon. My experience is so similar to yours. I wrote you on Instagram… Keep on being yourself, the brilliant positive honest woman you are!
Haleigh continue to reach out and speak the truth. Teach others about what Christianity says. There may be others in Mormon community that needs to hear about Christ and how he saves us. Good luck with all you do!
I love Haleigh and her channel. She is honest and doesn't try to fake for views. I have never been Mormon, I am Baptist, but I love her honesty and authenticity.
Ashlie, Me too. My example of intergrity. And I am a Baptist. I love Mormons. I have had a lifelong burden for Mormons. :)
We love you , Haliegh ! You have a ministry now to Mormons coming out of Mormonism ! I'm with you.
Ashlie, will you , and any other people out there who want to , join me in praying for Halieigh and CJ ? I am praying you both right now .
@@starlaharrison1783 Most definitely!!!!! Prayer can save marriage. Would be happy to pray for Haleigh and CJ.
She has fake eyelashes. A face mask of make up but she’s not being fake for views ? Ya ok
Awe. This girl is so sweet. Such integrity. Happy I caught this episode.
She’s very honest I like that about her
To have integrity is to have strong moral principles, she had sex with an returning missionary young woman should do all they can to encourage young men to stand up for what is right to stay faithful to the covenants that they made in the temple so they can one day be worthy of temple marriage.
Uoooòôo
Pppop"
@@carolynaitken7632 that missionary is 100% responsible for his own choice.
I overheard a Mormon neighbor’s phone call years ago where a financially struggling couple had to decide whether to pay their past due electric bill or their tithing that was set to be paid the next day. They had 3 kids. It was heartbreaking & it made me wonder what kind of church would do that to their members instead of helping them. 😔
They do help just no in a healthy mental responsibility way .. they have you pay your tithes with guilt shame tactics and then they pay your bill for you or give you food to free up money for said bill... the issues are big but I wanna share thst they asked for money then made the person self reliant on the church when they caused the issue... and they are the healer... if that makes sense it's manipulation at its finest my source -im mormon mopi
A long watch but definately worth the time. This is one of the best interviews i have ever seen ! What a sparkling jem of a person she is. Your answers and experiences helped me with some of my questions as well.
I know this is a Mormon story but what strikes me about her is the intense energy she has. Like something presents itself to her and she's like omg I gotta do this and she dives in full force.
Oh my gosh, when she says “I didn’t LET myself think it was weird” 💯🙌🏻
Great interview. This takes a lot of courage. To overcome the "sunk cost fallacy" is really hard, at any stage in life. Most people can't find a way to do it, even when the facts and their conscience says otherwise
Thank you for being so open, vulnerable and brave about sharing your experiences.
I’m two years late to this, but I just want to say how candid and honest this is. I TRULY appreciate it. I bet that everyone who has watched this has let go of old beliefs AND THATS OK! We have to tell our kids that “It’s ok to change your mind”. Everyone believes what they do because of what they know. When what you know changes, so do you. We are all here to learn and grow. I’m not sure what the future holds for you Haleigh but you have to keep speaking out. You are amazing!!!! I have so much admiration for you because you own your life story! ❤️ you GIRL!
This young woman is brave, impressive and is bound for greatness…such a warrior spirit with a heart for authentic experience. You go, Haleigh! I will watch you on TH-cam starting now.
Mormonism is an ABOMINATION before the GOD of ABRAHAM ISSAC and JACOB turn to the JESUS CHRIST of the bible. Not the phony "book of mormon"
Mormonism leads to hellfire, JESUS IS THE ONLY WAY TO THE FATHER. The Jesus of Mormonism is a different christ. A false christ, it's not biblical.
And you will NOT become a "god" or "goddess" one day. REPENT and believe in the gospel of JESUS CHRIST
(1 CORINTHIANS 15:1-4)
@@jerichowallsinjeopardy4634 Please learn when to use capitalization
I've been obsessed with watching her channel since she started to go through this journey. I cant wait for this!
What’s her Chanel?
Her name.
Me too!!
I absolutely love Haleigh. She's such an inspiration and I hope she continues this journey she is on.
This was the most profound interview/story that I have listened to out of all of them. Her story resonates with my mormon upbringing and into a mormon marriage SO much. She makes sense of feelings I've had that I couldn't quite make sense of. Lots and lots of emotions processed while listening to this one. Thank you.
I am thoroughly impressed with this story and Haleigh. So unbelievably authentic.
I freaking love her! Wow so vulnerable. The church was horrible to you I’m so sorry you had to go through that. Thank you for sharing your story ♥️
Absolutely love seeing such a legitimate BREAKTHROUGH. Good things are coming her way! And the church ... well, they should have paid attention.
I left the Mormon Church more than fifty years ago. I was so much luckier than the poor little girls you interview here. My father told me the things that are obviously in the “CES Letter” when I was old enough to understand and young enough to save myself from a life of being embroiled in a web of half truths and lies. He just gave me the historical facts and let me make up my own mind. Those facts have always been there. I am completely stunned by what these poor children did not know about their own religion, its history and what it means to their own lives.
Her story is so beautiful. I can’t imagine the courage it takes to be this vulnerable on such a big scale. I wish her all the best
Love the new interviews with Carah. I think she adds so much. Maybe she could have a cuter corner though? lol the whole set is all nice and she’s in this unlit, black, little corner. 😂
I’m guessing that it’s just a temporary, COVID-inspired improv setup?
Yeah, she should have a backdrop too!
“Carah’s Dark Corner”, coming soon to TH-cam. 😂
🤣 so true aye. I love her inputs
Love her in this. I get the vibe that she would almost prefer her little corner.
The tornado part of this story really highlights the arrogance of religion at times. It’s fascinating that she believed God would subject entire communities to multiple devastating tornadoes in order to tell one girl that she shouldn’t leave Utah and move back to New York.
LOL when you put it that way....
I remember when I was in AL a tornado demolished a church (not LDS), but a bar next door to the church was untouched. I remember trying to figure out why God would do that. (Now I can’t believe I thought a magical dude in the sky was guiding tornados to flatten certain buildings but not others.) 🤦♀️
it's more like she decided to go back to ny right when there was a storm, not that the storm came for her lol
So funny when you outline it objectively like that. Sounds so ridiculous bc it is. Just like how Haleigh points out how ridiculous it is that if there is a loving god he would choose to send his kids away for dumb stuff. And you can knit live with him if you pay a church your money and not drink coffee and remember the secret handshakes so you can get into his heaven club. Sounds patently retarded when you think about the church’s view on things objectively.
Oh please-- stop blaming the church and start looking at yourself. You are consistent with nothing. I don’t care one way or another what you do, but be authentic and honest.
She's a really lovely storyteller. She really goes into how she felt in those moments and it really puts you in her shoes.
Omg I’m so happy that haleigh is stepping into herself💖
Truly an absolutely incredible young woman! I have so much love for her.
I count myself blessed because my wife was raised as a “Jack Mormon” and when I told her about Joseph’s wives that Emma didn’t even know about, she jumped ship with me. Later one of my son-in-laws sent me the link to the CES letter and I was horrified and satisfied at the same time. Horrified with the seer stone that couldn’t find buried treasure but could find and translate gold plates. Satisfied with my decision to leave all the LDS Church lunacy. Thank you for making your journey public it will help many others find the truth.
I am sure they don’t miss you one bit either.
-Dep
Dep Patel : You’re right. Cuz the cult leadership cannot stand people who think for themselves, stand up for gays, or those who supported blacks having the priesthood now. That’s WHY they excommunicated 3 General Authorities who said blacks should have the priesthood, then shortly after that gave blacks the priesthood. The Mormon god only changes his mind after enough people have outcry, those people are excommunicated, then they change the doctrine. THIS has been their pattern for my 50+ years of life.
There was an outcry about gay’s kids not being able to be baptized, the next year the Mormon god changed his mind and allowed it.
So yes, the cult is excited those who have a voice & think for themselves are leaving. They only want mindless bots who sit in pews and do not think for themselves.
@@katbos4995 And yet you’re here like some obsessed ex lover who is pissed she failed in the relationship.
@@DuffyGabi Another weird ex. Ok Gabi!
Four men in a room with one young lady, making her tell EVERYTHING about her past sex life, is sick and sadistic. Everything about that church gives me the creeps. I think it’s of the devil. And that’s the feeling I discern, especially when I’m down by the church offices property.
Your honesty is so refreshing. I’m so sorry that you were put on this emotional roller coaster.
It speaks to the quality of this podcast that I got through more than five hours. Thanks for a great show.
It is such a treat to hear from someone when their awakening is so fresh! Thank you thank you thank you for sharing!
My own transition was long and slow over many years, and this has reminded me of things that I didn't even remember going through or similar justifications in my own journey.
I was a single mom of three who ran a daycare during the day, in my home, so I could stay home with my kids. My bishop ask me to do a calling in primary. lol I did turn it down. He knew I was a single mom, obviously, and knew I did daycare. I'm like "you do realize the 2 hours after sacrament are the only 2 hours a week I'm not taking care of kids right?".... I did feel a little guilty but not enough to accept a calling I couldn't handle and didn't want.
You know what’s really sad? This is the kind of girl I would have judged and called a sl** when I was still Mormon…I was absolutely brainwashed. Now, all I feel for her and anybody like her is empathy and compassion for her experience. I’ve become a better person since leaving.
Thank you, Haleigh, for being so vulnerable about such hard topics. Also, I think that what John says at 2.30.30 is something every woman of every faith needs to hear. I backed up and replayed it three times, and it hit home every time.
The point about validating yourself resonated so strongly with me. This was one of the hardest things about leaving TSCC - finding what my 'purpose' was fruitless untill I realised I didn't need to do that. Who I am will always be enough despite what anyone says.
I needed this too. thank you for your comment I will be writing this down
I am in about my 10th morman story. Everyone is in the journey of life, sometimes we have to figure out what we don't prefer in life to realize what we do prefer. Another great story & brave soul to share with us. One thing I notice in these Morman stories and not putting it down at all but many of the women spend hours crying outside the temple & extreme guilt. So happy you have awoke ❤
Never Mormon here- just followed you Haleigh, super impressed by your strength ❤ These stories & yours in particular are so inspiring to me- just sending love!
Oh my goodness! I LOVE Haleigh!! I followed her for years! I’m so glad to see her on THIS side of things! It’s a rough road but even through her “faith crisis” she’s still inspiring!
IN the middle of watching this.......I feel so sorry for this woman. Clearly, from a young age, she had issues with feeling loved and accepted. Then she finds an organization/system that will only exacerbate those feelings - purity culture and etc. Now there's an entire system to make you feel self-loathing. So she freely gives herself to others to feel loved and only be hurt and betrayed for it. And based on my own life experience, I know there are people that know how to find the vulnerable and use them - can pick them out of a crowd. That RM that used her and specifically targeted her. I don't know how they know, but he knew she was vulnerable and used that vulnerability for his own personal recreation. But essentially, she needed good clinical therapy at a young age to help her work through things, and she found the worst possible organization for mental health.
Every. Single. Word.
So well-said, thanks!!
I totally agree with your comments; 100 percent.
This was so incredible. I loved her and loved the hosts. I can't believe it was over 5 hours long and I still was sad when it was over I wanted more!
This was an incredible podcast and hit home in so many ways! I’ve been a Social Media Influencer for around 5 years or so and the most toxic fan group I’ve ever had were members of the LDS church. From my early start they tried to control me, judged me and made public claims that they were better than other fans because they were of the same church as me. Members leaked my information online, made threats and eventually started gossiping.
Glad to see how strong you were to open up and be vulnerable to share your story! Don’t let the negative comments from toxic fans effect you. You know your worth and that’s what is most important!
Preach Logan! Can't wait for your Mormon Story
Used to love her when I was part of the church, glad to see her evolution 🥰
When she talks about sex I wished adults talked like that growing up in the church. I think older adults took that as encouraging young people however it doesn’t! I think it helps women and girls to ask important questions, and to learn about sex which will be an important part of their adult life whether they wait, waited, or didn’t.
Some do though, one of the most open minded persons I know is a general authority seventies and his wife explained me more about sex than my own atheists friends.
I was a convert to “The Church” in 1983. Served a foreign mission, attended Rick’s College then BYU. Married in the Manti Temple in 1989. Mormon with a capital “M”. Unanswered doubts got the better of me and in 1996 I left the Church AND was excommunicated.
I related to so many things Haleigh shared. It really hit home. Boy oh boy is she raw and honest. That is a compliment in case anyone is wondering. Haleigh, I am sure you have learned that by being so open and honest you will get so many appreciative comments and just as many of the other kind too. I hope you can relish the good ones and shed the bad ones. Life is such a trip. Mormon life is such a long strange trip. Thank you for sharing yourself. I wish you all the best. I hope you find all that you have been seeking.
Great job all three of you, loved it. Thanks for telling your story. Edited to add, the most profound part for myself is when Haleigh said she would have to watch every influence on her children and retrain their brains. For any parent, when you're faced with that prospect, you must ask yourself, if I have to protect my children from this, then maybe it's not true or safe for any of us.
I remember her! I'm honestly not surprised she came across the CES Letter (not in any negative way). I always felt she was wayy more liberal-minded than other typical LDS bloggers. I loved her modesty video!
Yeah... it was always a matter of time! So glad she’s out!
Wow, I can relate with her so much. She is so amazingly strong.
Ugh I love Haleigh so much, so glad she shared her entire story. I’ve been watching her TH-cam videos since I found the church and it’s hilarious to me that after I joined the church and started questioning almost immediately because of church culture and a rabbit hole into church history and how grossly sheltered the children in the church are, the one LDS influencer I actually followed started going through it too for the same reasons. I commend her on this so much
I am just glad she gets to walk away from the church with her sainity
Such a great story I'm older similar story but so happy you are moving on and finding Joy!
Thank you!
You have a strong, bright mind, Haleigh, and a good heart. That’s obvious. I wish you the best of luck in continuing to navigate your inner and outer world, and lots of support! Thank you for this beautiful interview, your honesty, integrity and bravery. Very helpful.
Thank you so much for sharing! I just love the honesty and vulnerability more than anything else!
The experience that Haleigh had with repentance was crazy. As a practicing Catholic, we have confession which is similar to what she describes but it is only the Catholic and the priest who is acting on behalf of God (you are confessing to God not the priest). We do confess sexual sin but do not have to go into specifics. It has to be understood what you are confessing (pre-marital sex vs pornography) but you do not have to/should not be asked to provide details beyond that.
Keep Carah as a cohost, especially for any interviews with women, particularly younger women.
She’s a great addition on here . Does she have a channel herself too? If so what is called ?
Yes yes yes
Carah is well spoken, just like John, and brings the female energy that’s needed.
Agreed.
@@thewrongshoes Carah's channel is Nuancehoe
Excellent interview. Thankyou John and team for this support. That people that are having a " faith crisis" have a place to go, a place to be heard.Carah is an awesome addition to the podcast! Haliegh is beautiful and brave! She has a lot of insight and understanding. I promise to pray for her. For healing of her heart and wholeness.I have to say the Hamster wheel of worthiness in Mormonism sounds exhausting.the emphasis on" works" is so sad?! Jesus paid it all... We do good works bc we love God not to gain heaven.the Easter story is our hope.
Thank you for these words.
This was such a great interview. Sending goodwill to Haleigh for the future.
this was amazing, thank you for sharing your story. i left the church years ago but the wounds and bitterness are something i still deal with daily.
LDS CHURCH SINCE WE ALL KNOW YOU READ THIS - PLEASE STOP SAYING THE CHURCH IS GROWING...YOURE LOSING EVANGELISTS NOT HEATHENS, YOU MUST HAVE A CLUE THAT YOU'VE BEEN EXPOSED ENOUGH NOW THAT YOU MUST BECOME HONEST AND CHANGE. LOOK WHO YOURE LOSING...DONT ACT LIKE ITS INACTIVE PEOPLE OR THOSE WHO NEVER HAD TESTIMONIES.
So true. Here’s one of your “lazy learners” right here.
I feel like they have been rebranding for a few years now. Maybe it will be an OK church in .....one more generation.
@@manderson4803 Maybe - money wise they dont need to but brand wise, absolutely
Proud to be a Lazy Learner and a Lax Disciple
@@manderson4803 IMHO: Nope, never, won't happen.
Had I held out any real hope of that, I would not have needed to leave and put 1,000 mi. between myself and them.
I LOVE the dynamic you have now by adding Carah. It’s fabulous and has a whole new energy. Totally revitalised.
I've been following Haleigh for several years now -- great seeing her on Mormon Stories. Thank you, John! Does Haleigh know Lexi McDonald (Exmo Lex)? And by the way... in traditional Christian theology, if you're a believer in Jesus Christ as the Son of God, when you die, you go to heaven (only one heaven) and your family will be there! So yes, families are forever--just not in the Mormon theology.
Yes..
Just recently made me realize that if you get to exhalation...and have your own kingdom...you're not only no longer with your earthly family and even friends...but, your no longer with God/Jesus!!
And if you never heard of Christ, you're lost souls?
Sounds like the same conditional love to me.
Yeah. Only your “saved” family. And you can’t visit them after. The Mormon version at least sounds better in this aspect
@@dlsjr123 It is believed by many Christians that most people repent as they are close to the very point of death, but they don't get a chance to announce it.
@@Cuinn837 because it helps them deal with their guilt and confusion of knowing their loved one, who they believe was a good person in life, is now going to be burning in hell eternally. I'm agnostic and I can promise I won't be begging the Christian God for repentance on my death bed. And now I know I need to share that with my Christian family members. If God is real I will burn forever because of hurting his ego. They will not find solace by putting words in my mouth. Thank you for mentioning this, I didn't realize this was a common belief among God fearing people.
Im a raised in the church girl...but have been out for alot of years..but i have been watching alot of your videos. Theres so much i had no idea about.! Thank you for these podcasts