DIY toe-in alignment
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ย. 2015
- ****UPDATED VIDEO WITH MORE PRECISE METHOD FOR 4-WHEEL TOE-IN ALIGNMENT:
• DIY Toe-in Alignment 4...
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I show how to perform a precise toe-in alignment of the front wheels using an old-school method that I learned from my late grandfather.
The principle of this method applies virtually to all vehicles!
Enjoy!
Ivan - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
I was a mechanic 30 years, 10 of which as manager. While at a Mieneke shop I had a mechanic who's dad had him putting front end parts on cars since 9 years old and dad taught him how to align cars using this string method first, then by eye. I'd never seen anyone do it by eye, and certainly not as fast, and as accurate as this guy did. Every time. I've never been able to do it either way all that well myself as my vision isn't that great, even wearing my glasses, but having seen this mechanic and what he was capable of, I can assure all of you watching this it is more than just possible to get it close, but for some absolute accuracy can be achieved. As always God Bless to all and take care.
Right on!
you my friend deserve a beer. whatever all the doubters say this can and will help get your car to at least a minimum standard to be able to drive it to a garage to get it aligned properly. did this today on a project car iv been working on.. iv changed a lot of suspension parts on it and it was so toed out I refused to drive it, felt like something would collapse. done this today and used some vinyl floor tiles to allow wheels to move whilst making adjustments it now drives better than what some alignment specialists have gave me back. excellent video mate :)
Thanks, Paul. I bet that feels good to drive with the steering pointed straight and holding the road like on rails! I gladly accept beer money donations on the Patreon link ;)
Great tip with the binder clips. I have been using four jack stands and two 8' electrical conduits with holes drilled in the same locations on both conduits for the string to pass through. I will set the conduits on the jack stands in front of the car and behind the car and adjust the jack stands so that the string is equal distance from the center of the hubs in the front and center of the hubs in the back.
I knew you'd catch some flack for this one, and I think this procedure needs to be taken in context: yes a well qualified technician using good specialized equipment will beat this old school "shade tree" method. However, to get someone back on the road with much less tire wear than before and straight ahead steering, this method when done by someone with a head on their shoulders will beat a nincompoop with the latest and greatest technology every time. It's a case of getting the job done.
+gtemnykh Well, I guess for the person that has to drive cross country to get an alignment checked, yes that would be a great method.
I've used this method probably close to a hundred times over the years on many different vehicles with fantastic results! Sometimes it takes a couple test drives to get steering wheel perfectly straight... probably because even a slightly crooked steering wheel is one of my pet peeves lol 😅
I knew grandads would come in useful sometime.A really handy tip.
Thanks so much for the video. First video i clicked on and it was more than enough to get the job done.
Good job little boy I learned that, I have been spent almost 600 dollars in my heavy duty truck and my still not alignment, I will try that maybe I can get it it done right!!
Thanks for showing!!
I'm so cheap, I might have to try this, thanks.
Great video really enjoyed it .Many thanks for taking the time to post this .Just changed the bushes on the lower front arms on my old audi a3 which as sent the alignment off a tad .Im going to give this ago many thanks and all the best from the uk 👍👍.
Thank you for the teaching!
thank you so much for this video, I just did my alignment using your method in this video mostly, it works great, save time and money, thank you again for doing this video. Thumb up
I'll have to try that Ivan, good tip.
Ivan, Great video. I found you after watching some videos by Eric O at South Main Auto Repair and I've learned a lot from both of you. I just replaced the tie rod ends on a 2003 Saturn Ion and it was pulling to the left even before the replacement. After seeing your video I went out and did my own home alignment. Worked great!! Thanks
+rsawyer05 Great to hear! In my experience vehicles usually pull to the side if the caster is off, usually after hitting a curb or something. Not much you can do to fix that though...just keep rotating the tires :)
+motoYam82 great vid ivan, hey I have a Honda accord and the tie rods are behind the axles. which direction do I turn it for toe in and toe out?? thank you!
Draw a picture. It will become clear.
Thanks for this the short vid. This appears easy to do. Always looking for ways to save a few bucks😀
I used the tyre tread method, front and rear of front wheels, got it set up with zero, straight ahead. No scrub 👌
Very helpful bud, gonna try this
I feel like this method is especially well suited to the mk3 jettas because the rear toe is fixed as it's simply an axle bolted to rear beam
That's a cool tip. I'm going to check my Silverado this week and see how it looks. Thanks Ivan
Ok Ivan I checked the 2500hd today. I have changed the both upper ball joints and the left tie rod about 2 years ago. Since new I have never had an alignment done either and the truck has 278k on it and it drives true. With your string method I have just under 3/16 toe in on the rh and 1/8 on the lh. Didn't adjust a thing. Works great for me. 👍
+Steve Rob Nice! As long as it drives straight and doesn't eat tires what more can you ask for? :)
Thanks Ivan!
Very helpful buddy thanks for sharing!..👍🏾
Nice job.
Great video Ivan. I'm all for saving a few dollars.
Thank you
The track is almost never the same on front and back.
So, as you pointed out doing the BMW 325Ci, this is a variable. Maby a farly small one, but still.
That is easily removed by doing one side at the time, and setting a clearence on all points. Doesn't mather if it's 1mm or 50cm clearence (but of course, a smaller gap is easier to measure correct). Doesn't even have to be the same distance at both points on the rear wheel. You just have to measure the difference and add it to the calculation when measuring on the front wheel.
Still you would have a variable that the toe is not 0 on the rear wheels, but, this is still a variable in your way of doing it.
Keep up the good work, great vids :)
Thanks for this DIY. I just used to align my son's Acura MDX after a botched job by a local shop. Steering wheel was misaligned by 20-20 degrees!
I had one minor improvement to offer. Set string to equal offsets at C/L of front and rear axles. As long as wheel base is same front/rear this provides a good baseline for toe-in measurements.
I also found that it was necessary to realign steering wheel after each tie-rod adjustment.
regards
Nice! I've aligned dozens of vehicles this way; all with great results ;)
Ivan I would love to see you do you String Alignment At SMA and then have Eric put it on the Alignment rack to so how close you are.
I'd love to c that too
Need to note that this only works on vehicles that have the same width track between the rear and front axles. This will not work on a Dually or a pickup like a chevy since the rear axle is a couple inches narrower then the front (At least on the 2500 and 3500 SWR, not sure about the 1500).
I have been doing this for years on my offroad buggies but I use 2 ratchet straps and take them all the way around all for tires.
Exactly, first to mention it, you got it! You look up the track width on each axle, and calculate the difference between the front and rear axle. Half of this distance is then added to the string tyre distance on the shortest axle. However this is only adequate for steering the frontwheels straight, for the toe-in adjustment itself, better use the most central ridge in the threads of the tyre itself (front- and backside), as sidewals are not accurate. and on a FWD, you'd adjust for 0.5 to 1mm toe-out to pickup slack in the linkage when driving for a neutral setup!!
ok i loosen jam nut and begin adjusting tie rod but the jam nut moves in sync with the tie rod. that sounds natural, but when i try to tighten jam nut down after making adjustment the tie rod moves in sync with the jam nut defeating my purpose. so what do i do? hold one wrench on tie rod so it doesn't move while holding jam nut. because i can't see what you are doing under car.
my drivers side front tyre is wearing on the inside,do i need to screw the track rod in or out ,cheers
Wouldn't it be more accurate to measure between the string and wheel edge at 3 & 9 o'clock for the most accurate reading at the rear first then the front?
Most cars don't have adjustable rear toe so unless you've bent something it's unlikely to be changed in any major way
Nice Ivan. Do you have to worry about the rear tires if there is an adjustment on them? It would appear that the rear wheels would have to be straight for this procedure.
+stuzman52 Hey Terry, I'm thinking of doing a follow-up video on this one just to show how versatile and precise the string method can be if you use some ingenuity and common sense. Might have to pull out the white board and do some trigonometry to see what the margin of error is :)
Hey Ivan...that sounds like a great idea since I'm not to familiar with all the geometry on the workings of alignment. And the trig, wooo..that would be nice touch to tie it all together.
+motoYam82 Just do a string alignment on a car and take it to Eric O's father shop and put it on their John Bean alignment rack.
This method of gaining straight lines is tried and tested it works. We build our homes and offices with a string line. The string don't lie, if your car has adjustable rear wheel alignment then that would Allso have to be straight to align the front wheels off the back wheels, providing that the track width of your front and back wheels are the same tho and the piece of string is touching the front and back edge of the front and back tire then their is no hiding the fact that you have got a straight line, how ever my bmw has a. Wider track at the back so bmw make the wheels with a different offset to counter this, if you have not got standard wheels on a car then it is not the method to use
Slight toe ins rock on VW 😎👍
You must check the REAR TOE adjustment before doing this. Some cars are adjustable, some are not. Regardless, you should check in case anything is bent or bushings are worn to the point of affecting alignment.
I'm a firm believer of this! Many times the alignment guys with their fancy machines and lasers leave your car wondering all over the road. I aligned my 06 Yukon like this and the tires are wearing beautifully. I did not have enough string so I used the tape measure method where you measure the front and rear of the threads and get them even on both sides.
+jewllake sounds like you need to find another shop that is a little more professional. if one of my customers comes back with a pull and their car pulls / wanders, we do the alignment over for free.
what if your steering wheel is off to the right. how would i fix that ? would i do your procedure and it will correct the off center steering wheel. ?
A string and ruler never goes out of calibration and never lies. Nice job Ivan.
nice vid keep it up
You forgot to mention one important thing.. After making an adjustment, you should roll the car back and forth to let off any tension that may be on the wheels from the adjustment, especially when making a big adjustment. Move the car back and forth then take a new reading. It should be rolled after each and every adjustment before taking a new reading! If you replaced a bunch of parts, it's best to take it to a RELIABLE alignment shop. If you take it to a shop that has an old worn out machine, you might be better off doing it with the string. A good alignment comes down to having a good calibrated alignment machine, and a technician who knows how to use it properly. Taking your car to a place that doesn't specialize in alignments may be a mistake. You invest in good tires, invest in a good alignment and I would advise looking into the shop you want to use. Read reviews and ask the technician if possible questions like "how long you been doing this", "is this machine routinely calibrated" , "how old is this machine" etc. If you're not happy with the answers go somewhere else. Any good tech will know everything about the machine he uses..Some guys just want to get the car out of the shop ASAP and some will actually want to do the alignment properly.. Ask for a before and after printed readout. Most modern machines will be able to do that for you..
You're more likely to be hit by a meteor than to find a so-called "reliable" repair facility. Almost all shops are now essentially organized crime rings. I use AMMCO optical toe gauges, track flags, wheel clamps, and turntables and can get it within about .015 inches of actual dead on zero. Alignment shops "these days" are worthless as it is not their car and so they could care less what the end result is.
@@kgainer Not true! There are reliable shops out there. Not saying there aren't a million rip off shops either, but there are good places if you know how to find them.
Ok, thanks but a lot a movenment of the camera and difficult to follow you. What is the degre and the mm to fix the toe? The outer tie rod is very tight, imposible to turn the nut in these condition. In my car maybe the tie rod nut is 17, 19, 21 mm and is very tight. I can not work under the car to fix the toe. 1/8, 1/16 what represent in degre for the toe?
Hi there Ivan, Could you turn steering wheel slightly to achieve correct toe in on one wheel then adjust the other wheel accordingly? to the detriment of steering wheel position of course if only slightly off though
+Typey1 Sure you could do that if one of your tie-rod ends is seized up or something. Personally I like everything in my vehicle to be adjusted and calibrated on the $$, including the steering wheel neutral position...things like that drive me nuts haha
Personally I would lift the wheel just off the ground before adjusting to prevent friction from showing the true adjustment.. And once set drive the car and recheck. You should also mention to set the string at the front end so that the string just barely touches the protruding side of the tire. I have done this before with good results but wouldn't recommend doing it this way as a permanent alignment. Good way to set toe when replacing parts but I would recommend a professional alignment especially if you have new tires..
The rear track on that car should be 19mm narrower than the front so how does this work? I tried it on my 03 Jetta and the string wouldn't touch the front of the rear tire. There was a good 10mm gap. What gives?
Track width difference between front and rear axles popped in my mind as well.
The string doesn't have to touch the front tires. In the case of a wider rear track, just make sure the string gaps between the front of the front tire and the back of the front tire are the same (or 1/16" off if RWD).
I've just used this method on my car, after a mechanic changed the tie rods and left them well off from what the original ones were. I could see that this method wasn't working, so measured the width between left + right rims, and found the rear to be a 34mm narrower (Peugeot 205). So I put 17mm of spacers between the cord and the tyre each side, problem solved.
what if you have broken bands on the side of your tire.. or if you have some janked up tires or rims? throws it off.
Then you should definitely get new rims/tires.
i rectum so
wonderful sir. Thanks!
Браво. Моток нити и смекалка заменяют популярный сейчас 3D развал-схождение. Осмелюсь предположить целую серию видео в ближайшем времени с твоим методом. Удачи.
И прости мне мою безграмотность , что зоначает DIY.
+Сергей Клепицкий
Say what???????
Jason Curry если я не могу понять написанного, я пользуюсь переводчиком. А ты догадаешься?
+Сергей Клепицкий DIY = "Do It Yourself" или "сделай сам" без профессиональной помощи :)
+Jason Curry lol Jason welcome to a multi-lingual channel! Try using Google Translate to see what Sergey replied to you...
Just out of curiosity what about taking into consideration the crown of the road? also I thought that within a 1/16 of an inch was acceptable. I also thought being dead on zero was a no no. not trying to be a smart butt just curious.
Somewhere between 0 toe and 1/16in toe in is preferable.
So far I've watched 4 diy toe alignment videos and each one uses a different method. I don't know which one to use, frustrating!
What if your rear axle is wider then the front axle.
Then it's even easier 😁
This is really a good method, and this is how wheels have been aligned before lasers and machines. But general rule is that front wheel drive cars have toe out on the front axle, to counteract for vehicle front end rising on acceleration. Also a lot of front wheel drive cars (at least in EU) have small toe in on rear axle.
Specs for my Renault was: front: toe out 1mm, rear: toe in 3mm (not adjustable). I had to learn this stuff because i I couldnt get it to align properly.
Hope this helps you if you ran in to some unfamiliar euro cars.
Great videos btw, keep them coming.
+slavko simonovic Great tips, thanks! Yeah on front wheel drives I always see the rear wheels toed in a bit for better handling.
that MPV in the background!
+markj Most reliable vehicle on the lot!
+motoYam82 Got a soft spot for those.. grew up with my parents' 89. V6, RWD with air suspension in the rear lol
+markj Nice! The RWDs are actually fun to toss around and drift in the snow with the right tires and working shocks lol My '89 has the weak-sauce 2.6 4-banger and auto slushbox :( Been in the family since '97...it was pretty cool back then to get picked up from elementary school in a van! Keeping that thing on the road has taught me more about auto repair than any tech school ever could...
I'll have to feature the MPV in some vids before the body rust gets too far out of hand
+motoYam82 that would be awesome. I've never even seen a 4-cylinder one, even on Craigslist. I was looking for a beat up All Sport to have fun with a while back. Even found a guy who put a 300ZX twin turbo engine in his van
Hey my parents still have a '98 All-Sport 4x4 ES loaded leather etc. with 160k on the clock. Runs perfect but the rust is creeping in...just sits outside most of the time. I'm sure they would sell it cheap if the buyer is serious! My brother and I even installed heavy duty rear springs and shocks on the back to fix the leaky rear air suspension so the ass doesn't sag lol
I read that you actually want a slight toe-in, say 1/16" to keep the car going straight?
ZillaYT he literally said that in the video
Why are you measuring off the rubber and not the rim?
Just easier that way. Obviously make sure your rims and tires are in good shape to avoid bad readings :)
The bike in the background looks like an '82 maxim or seca 750
+cbsctomh Sharp eye! It's a 1982 Yamaha Seca 750, imported to the states from Canada! Got it for a grand 9 years back with only 2k miles on the clock. Super reliable and fun; made it to coast to coast no issues :)
advrider.com/index.php?threads/cross-country-on-a-50-bike-ny-sf-and-back.366117/
good job! I just don’t know how i’m going to do this with the vehicle on the ground and access the tie rods. i’d rather do this then bring it to a shop and save 170,00
Oh the old famous. " Set the toe and let it go "
Thanks, Ivan. I just put both inner tie rods and a driver side wheel bearing on a 2001 Jetta and let me tell you... This beat the PANTS OFF of any "thread counting" / comparison you can do on the new tie rods. They are of a slightly different dimension and have more threads to begin with... I did this on the jack stands to get me close, then I put her on the ground and rolled all the way to the back of my garage, centered the steering wheel perfectly, and rolled forward about 5 feet, pulled the e- brake, and fine tuned it on the ground with this method. That wheel is so perfectly centered going up the interstate, with no pulling... I'd bet $ an alignment shop could confirm it is nearly perfectly in the center of the "acceptable range" of alignment! I DID notice that the rears are "towed in" a bit (as they should be), but this should not affect the front tow angle more than a few hundredths of a degree due to the sheer distance of the wheelbase, etc.
Cool! Glad it worked out for you. It is quite satisfying to have a straight steering wheel and tight handling without going to an alignment shop and having them botch it up :D
Indeed... I also have the FasTrax Camber Caster gauge and a set of homebrew plexiglass turnstiles for caster / camber adj. / checking. Got / made these after a few "bad alignments" on various vehicles. (One my Toyota Highlander where they charged me over $70 and never even cracked the bolts!) Used carefully, it has served me well, but your method for TOE is the easiest and most accurate I've ever seen! Tx agn.
just make sure your garage floor is level ,otherwise this might not work that well
I've always did 1/16 toe in for the hole shot when weight transfers in fwd 😂 but we were hot dogging these mfs lol plus 1/16 ensures tracking straight and not following the grooves of the road. Wears beautifully
You didn't film what you did with the tie rods under the car! This would have been so much better if you had put a camera under the car to show the adjustment you did on the tie rods to align the car
JEGS has a toe bar to set toe. Center the steering wheel by turning the steering wheel full left counting turns. Then turn it to the right to center the wheel at one half the turns. In other words, suppose it's a 3 turn wheel. You turn it back 1 and a half turns. The steering wheel should be centered. Get a steering wheel holder from OTC to hold the steering wheel centered. Get a caster-camber gauge and appropriate tools.
very nice ..i fix my car
Mannnn ,,, I wanted to give it a like !!! but I will not be the one to break the 777 rule!
DOING IT WRONG.
Seen this many times on the farm.
If your back end is out of alignment or the tires are not molded exactly (exactly) the same then this method is broken. Especially if the rear is toed in making one tire stick out further. This worked better on older vehicles with real bumpers and flat walled wheels.
Stop using the rubber to make your measurements. Use the metal rims.
UGH
Skip to 2:20 to avoid a bunch of talking.
chevyman5436 the talking is how you get context
There is no way I would do this to my car. Different cars have different toe specs and there's no kite string /axel stand/ruler setup that can measure this accurately. Where I live I can get a 4 - wheel laser alignment for the equivalent of $60. Ivan - you're diagnostic work is excellent but this is disappointing. I wonder what your pal Eric would say about this!!
+ringmaster146 I agree with you. Ivan you're great at diagnostics, you would make me look like an amateur and im a tech for long time, but I agree with ringmaster146. Alignments are fairly cheap nowadays. What about the rear alignment that you're suppose to adjust first. Also, if you hit a curb, most of the time you will need suspension components due to your camber and caster being off. Even if your toe is straight at 00.0 deg on both sides, car will pull with camber / caster being off. Now to answer your question there ringmaster146, ETCG would be proud, Eric O will be fairly disapointed.
+Jim davis I really don't know what this has got to do with food :-) Listen, I'm all for old school fixes. I've done my fair share of them, I just think that this is unnecessarily risky. It might work fine, it might scrub the hell off your front tyres. By the way I don't mean to be disrespectful toward Ivan, he's clearly a talented mechanic who is willing to share his expertise with us. Thanks Ivan!!
+ringmaster146 No worries man your concerns are totally understandable! Of course you can't beat a proper 3-D laser alignment in terms of accuracy :) However if you do this method with a spec sheet and account for the variables, you can get well within the allowable tolerances. Stay tuned for Part 2 where we crunch some numbers to see how accurate the string&ruler can be...