Congrats on being the first reviewer of the ACE. Got mine early at the pre-release. Lovin this paddle so far. You did as usual a very comprehensive review. I have old elbow issues to respect, so any design that can help keeping it in check gets thumbs up from me. I play with the Callan Dawson ping pong or choked up grip, so handle length is not an issue for me.The loss in power from my swing gets made up for with the Ace Face. Coming from a Gear Box CX11E which I still like playing with, I'll stick with the Ace for now. Thanks for all your efforts John.
My PK Black Ace XF just came in this week, so I've only had a couple of days to play with. I've been using the Gearbox CX14 but was intrigued by the kinetic system. After only a couple of days, I've become a fan. I'm still working on "dialing" in on touch shots. The surface face is lively and initially, I found that I was blocking and hitting shots out, that were "cans of corn" before. It'll take some time. I do love the feel though of this paddle and look forward to getting past that break-in period (not the paddle, but my game).
@@mlee9049 The Black Ace is all power, all day! I didn't need the extra power, but it's a very noticeable difference. I now have it dialed in and am extremely pleased with the paddle. I did have to put some time in with the ball machine at the gym and now I'm in great shape. It's a terrific paddle and would highly recommend it. Cheers!
Great review, thanks! I'm a long-time Paddletek guy and have played the Tempest Reign Pro for a few years - great paddle. I suffered a severe case of biceps tendinitis and knew ProKennex was an alternative. Bought the Pro Spin before the Black Ace came out and really liked the feel. As soon as the Black Ace came out I bought it and have played it for about a week now. I am so impressed by this paddle. First, ProKennex has nearly eliminated my shoulder pain. I am playing pain free for the first time in several months. Second, the fit and finish of this paddle is awesome - rock solid and none of the manufacturing issues that you see with other brands like loose edge guards, etc...the quality is readily apparent. Power is all there as everyone has said. The biggest surprise is that control has not really dropped off. It's a bit of an adjustment going from 16 mm core to 11 mm, but I'm surprised by how little adjustment it actually is. As you have said, this paddle feels more like a thicker core paddle than either the Gearbox or the Selkirk Power Air Invikta both of which seem much more stiff and unforgiving to me.
I'm researching this paddle but it's giving me worse golfer's elbow! I had the pro flight paddle before when I first started to play PB. Found that the paddle was too powerful for me and I sold it. I played tennis and badminton in high school, so that was 30 years ago. I have played with many paddles in the last 3 years. I've gotten better but still have golfers elbow now matter what I have done. Gone to an accupuncturist, use the flex bar, prolotherapy. I've played with the Black Ace for about 8-10 games and tonight my elbow was on fire! It hurts to straighten my arm. I play great with this paddle!! I switched to my Selkirk Luxx for the last 2 games and the pain subsided. I do not understand what's going on when this paddle is supposed to help with tennis/golfer's elbow. This paddle has power but I can still dink and drop. It could be that I'm a better player now at a 4.0-4.5 skill level.
Nice review as always! I only got to hit one for an hour the other day, but one thing I found fascinating is I could not keep the ball in on drives. It felt like the power to spin ratio was off. Ball came off so hot that there wasn’t enough grab on the ball to keep it in. Going to a 002 right after was a world of difference. Singles it become very obvious that I had to modify my stroke to keep my shots in. Curious if you noticed that during testing.
I definitely had to make some adjustments to my serve and drive to accommodate the extra power. But the more I play with it, the more I'm realizing that my accuracy is better with this than with my previous paddles. So I'm able to keep the ball lower over the net instead of looping it way over. I do wish the spin was slightly better on this paddle, though. If it were just 300 RPM higher, it would be up there with the best of the best (Power Air). That would make me so happy to be able to shape the ball even more with this paddle in particular. It would be nearly the perfect power paddle. Fromuth is sending me a new Black Ace to continue testing it, and I'm curious to see if there's any variability in the texture of the carbon fiber. I hope I hit the jackpot and get a super gritty one!
That is why I returned it. It shoots bullets during kills shots but if you can’t generate a lot of spin then you sacrifice too much on drives and limits the utility of the power
@@johnkewpickleball let us know what you find. Your observation of the carbon fiber weave is really intriguing and I think you are onto something there.
@@johnkewpickleball interesting you talk about variability right after I got a joola vision which has a clear difference between the two faces- one side is standard CFS grit feeling, and the other is incredibly gritty CFS surface, and in my quite unscientific tests I can tell the ball is rotating probably 300+ more rpm from that side. So to your point, variability is a thing! and it makes me wonder about the quality control process as one bad batch can really hinder a company if tested at the wrong time and place (too soon CRBN?) I would expect Pro Kennex has pretty good QC and you wont see much difference as they are made here in the US and Steve probably has a lot of checks in place, as he is very quality oriented.
@@Thejoeb you know, I never even considered that the same paddle might have texture differences on each side, but that makes sense too. I’ll be spin testing two additional Black Aces soon, so we’ll get a little more data about the spin consistency for ProKennex
I am using the black ace ovation which took some getting used to from my Franklin Ben Johns and frustrated me at first, but I am now loving it. (3.5-4.0 player)
Wow! I just had my first session with this paddle and was shocked at how much I liked it. I typically play with a Hyperion and have struggled with 'power' paddles (like the Power Air) keeping balls in and having anything close to a control game, but this felt very different. Drops and dinks took a second to calibrate, but got fairly dialed in after a couple games. That said, who needs to drop when you can drive this hard and shake and bake all day?!
Overgrip is great to make it like tennis Raquet's and shift the weight back on handle not head heavy good on tennis elbow with soft grip and damping shock 😊 01/25/24
Just to update you, John. Seems the link will take us to the paddle website but the Square Ace paddle is not on there! At least I couldn't find it after 20 mins. I think this review sold me on that paddle. I'm brand new to pickleball... Played 3 times! Haha.... But I do desire to play it much more!
Thanks John for yet another very comprehensive paddle review! I was able to hit and play with the Black Ace for a short time. My impression of the paddle based on this short time pretty much mirrors your review. It's a very intriguing paddle that I'm now strongly considering. When I first held the paddle, I was very surprised by the big overlay. To my uninformed eyes, that large area in the inner part of the paddle where the overlay adheres to the exposed carbon forming the Ace shape looks to me like an obvious first point of failure. I know that Dizon and Dawson have been playing with the Black Ace for a good number of months now, so I'm sure that the adhesion has held up during this extended period and that ProKennex has tested this. Still, it just seems to me that that the overlay adhesion could be subject to failure after many hits on it over an extended period of time. Any thoughts about that? Also, I wonder what the ProKennex official reason is for the large overlay, which I've never seen on any other paddle. In any event, I hope you'll do a follow-up video on the Black Ace after you play with it for an extended time, or earlier if something of significance comes up. Thanks again John!
I was also surprised to see the overlay up close. I thought it might even affect the trajectory of the ball, but that hasn’t happened as far as I can tell. I’ll definitely keep an eye on it for delamination; I agree that it could be a risk. And the pros don’t play with a paddle long enough for that to be an issue. I do think that the overlay could have some benefits by potentially enlarging the sweet spot, by working in combination with the tungsten beads to make the perimeter of the paddle denser, similar to Joola hyperfoam edge wall. The sweet spot on the Black Ace is just too big for such a thin paddle without there being something going on.
@@johnkewpickleball Good point about the pros not playing long enough with a paddle to expose any longer term design flaws. So, I contacted ProKennex a couple of days ago and asked them what the purpose of the large overlay is. This is their response. "Thank you for contacting ProKennex support. The Black Ace is a Toray 700 carbon face paddle with an Ace logo overlay for a uniquely sleek, visual aesthetic. - Alice from ProKennex Pickleball" I then immediately followed up and asked, just to be sure, if the overlay had any other purpose other than aesthetics, since there has been conjecture about the overlay's purpose, such as the overlay somehow helps to expand the sweet spot, or it somehow helps with dampening or control, etc. I told them their response would help put those sorts of speculation to rest. This was 2 days ago and I haven't heard back from them. Perhaps they're very busy shipping Black Ace's out! Anyway, based on their initial response, perhaps the overlay is just for aesthetics, or perhaps they don't want to reveal any other purpose for competitive reasons, which I'm leaning towards believing. My uninformed reasoning is that I would think that adding such a large overlay to create the logo would add production cost and a possible point of adhesion failure when they could of just created the Ace logo within the paddle surface just like the other paddle manufacturers do. In any event, I ordered a Black Ace Ovation right at the launch time. I noticed that the Ovation was already sold out a few hours later, while the Pro is still available as of a few minutes ago.
@@barney9997 excellent work! I didn’t mention it in the video, but under a microscope, the overlay has applied grit like that looks similar to the Power Air and other grit texture paddles. So some performance R&D went into the overlay, and I think there’s more there than just aesthetics, whether intentional or not
Would anyone happen to know where you could purchase these facing materials or something similar? I want to make a Frankenstein paddle using the gearbox cx14 and it’s hyperbite technology and apply the carbon or fiberglass surfacing material to it to make it spin faster than the Tasmanian devil.
Hi, what's your opinion on the Electrum II. I could not find a review. Considering, that it does not have thermoforming, I'm wondering if it's worth the price.
Great reviews and Analysis. Not just here but especially in your 2022 Spin Rate review video. Another brand I’d love to see you analyze/review is the Nuipipo ExplorerPRO. Which I can’t seem to find any in-depth videos on, and would greatly appreciate your take on it.
I use an Explorer Pro, it's a good budget paddle. It's for people who want a decent paddle but don't want to spend 100+ dollars on one. Got mine for $60 on a black Friday Amazon deal. Just don't expect it to be comparable to a Joola or something like that, lol
thanks for content!! .. I'm new to pb but have been avid tennis player for years ... I live out in literal no-mans land and have a silent partner scoop tennis ball machine... does anyone know if these machines can be used with pb balls??
Do you notice any dents in your paddle? I heard about this online and then I have a demo that has quite a few little dents. I love the paddle though so I was going to buy it but I am worried about the durability
Thanks for the great review. I've had some questions about this paddle and hoping for a bit more in depth comparison. Previous Prokennex paddles to me have had that 'board-like' feel, similar to the Power-air and some of the gearbox paddles (CX11 for example). You mentioned it felt closer to a honeycomb core / CF paddle than the powerair did. This is where I would love a bit more clarity. Is it still 'board-like' or how close on the spectrum to say a Gruvn 13 or 16mm (which is totally a control paddle however I noticed you had tested one before) or a Joola CFS. I do understand Im comparing control paddles to a power paddle. I am personally looking for something that moves into the power spectrum without losing a great deal of control. Thanks for the great information!
Correct, the black Ace feels far less board like than any of the Prokennex paddles that I played with. I compare it more to the feel of a 14mm poly core, such as the Joola Solaire. Not quite as much control as the Solaire, but more than any other 11mm paddle IMO
@@johnkewpickleball Great review, and thanks for interacting with viewers in the comments. I hadn't phrased it that way before, but now that you mention it my Ovation Flight does have a "board" like feel, very different from the Gearbox CX14. The two paddles I would most like to demo or see a comparison review are the Black Ace and the Power Air - how are they similar or different as both have great spin and power.
@@johnkewpickleballhi. I wanted to follow up. I finally got my black ace pro today (in Canada) and joined a ladder to give it a play. Wow! Lol. (What a horrible comment) it’s definitely a power paddle. I was able to adjust my serve to allow my spin to work. Hard, fast with spin is amazing. I can’t do everything I could with my Gruvn Cf paddle (on the serve spin side but almost). The drives took a couple goes to adjust so I didn’t send them out of bounds. The soft game wasn’t too bad to be honest. Maybe missed 5% which isn’t bad. Dinks were easy. It’s the resets off hard shots that are going to take some work. Accuracy is amazing! My fast hard drives just worked. Hands battles at the net were good. Now onto the comparison to the Selkirk Power Air. I couldn’t get the SPAir to work for me. It was clunky in my hands. The Ace was great and stayed great in my 2 hour session. One draw back… man is it loud lol. But I think I’m totally game to pull this paddle out first. Thanks for your review. Totally helped me.
@@Firesong4ng Thanks for following up, and I’m glad it’s working for you! Your impression of the Black Ace is exactly how I felt the first week with it. Insane power, a bit wild, but maneuverable soft game and good accuracy. Four weeks in, and I’m loving this paddle more and more. I think my soft game is nearly as good as with a 16mm core after getting the Black Ace dialed in. And the power is always a joy.
I have the PRO FLIGHT love the paddle . Also hit both gearbox cx11 and cx 14 how does this compare want to purchase but $250 trying to get as much feed back as possible thankyou
Haven’t pulled trigger yet any updates on how paddle feels like I said using pro flight just love the look of this paddle worried paddle may have to much power already a banger thanks again
I picked up the Black Ace Ovation a few weeks ago at the early release after demoing both it and the Pro model and coming from the Gearbox CX11. I got the CX11 back in April after demoing it and the ProKennex Flight models. I gave the Flight a slight edge in control but got a discount on the cx11 that was too hard to pass on. And I thought that would be the last paddle for a long time, but the Black Ace has been a game changer for me. There definitely felt like a learning curve in the beginning for me and experienced the same thing as in the video where I was scared of the pop at the net. But once you adjust, the power is just insane. I’m noticing a lot more serves becoming nonreturnable then just a few weeks ago and winning games that I was losing in my league prior. Maybe it’s in my head and now have more confidence but whatever it is, I’m really enjoying this paddle. If you’re already a banger you’re going to scare people with the speed and the sound this thing makes haha. I swear it’s the loudest paddle I’ve heard. ProKennex also has a 30 day no questions asked, return policy if you give it a go and don’t like it. That was what made me try it. But take all this with a grain of salt because what do I know, but hope some of this helps. Cheers!
Thanks for another very comprehensive review. ProKennex claimed on their website "The Black Ace Pro is the first ever single piece TORAY faced carbon paddle," what does it mean? I thought only Gearbox has a single carbon fiber construction. Does Black Ace has a PP honeycomb core?
I think they mean the first time ProKennex has used raw carbon fiber on the paddle face. Yes, the core of the Black Ace is honeycomb...you can see the impressions through the carbon fiber. Although I just saw the email from Steve Dawson about the launch of the Black Ace tomorrow, and he mentioned the same thing: the first ever edgeless T700 single piece design. Gearbox advertises 3k carbon fiber on both the face and perimeter, but I wonder if it’s not a single piece?
Basically Gearbox has multiple carbon fiber ribs bonded to each other and bonded to top/bottom faces to form a one-piece carbon fiber composite structure
Over the top of the factory grip, I layered the following: Yonex overgrip - Tourna Pro Gel replacement grip - Yonex overgrip. Where did you hear about the longer handle version?
I don't think Electrum is the only other mfg that advertises T700? GRUVN does, as does Engage (Evolution Extreme for example) and CRBN. Unless T700 is a generic term and doesn't mean Toray T700?
Sure wish the handle circumference was bigger. Funny how a bigger circumference was recommended in Tennis for tennis elbow! That overgrip stuff, you end with broomstick with no bevel!
Nice review very detailed. It might be something I would try after your review. I never really like their other models and shapes. Sounds like a nice combination of power, spin and decent touch for the soft game. Does it seem to have less pop-up tendencies than the Pro II? Thanks again there are a lot of viewers that really like this type of content. I'm a fan.
Thanks for the compliment! I’d say this has about the same control as the Electrum Pro II. But honestly, I was really impressed with the Pro II also. I know it’s gotten some poor reviews, but to me, it felt like the control of at least a 14 mm paddle.
Yes, apparently Prokennex and Selkirk don't offer discounts to retailers, so my code doesn't work for them. I clipped that part of my video out after figuring this out.
Congrats on being the first reviewer of the ACE. Got mine early at the pre-release. Lovin this paddle so far. You did as usual a very comprehensive review. I have old elbow issues to respect, so any design that can help keeping it in check gets thumbs up from me. I play with the Callan Dawson
ping pong or choked up grip, so handle length is not an issue for me.The loss in power from my swing gets made up for with the Ace Face. Coming from a Gear Box CX11E which I still like playing with, I'll stick with the Ace for now. Thanks for all your efforts John.
Nice, I can see why you and Callan would love the Black Ace with your choked-up grip - so much power coming off the face alone.
How does this paddle feel compared to your cx11 I demoed it liked it but was shooting some rockets thankyou
The Black Ace has more power than the E Pro II, with the same control
The Ace has more "pop" off the face. My CX11E ain't goin away. I'll use it to block "bangers" I'm up against.
Thanks for the frank honesty. You won me over and I have subscribed.
My PK Black Ace XF just came in this week, so I've only had a couple of days to play with. I've been using the Gearbox CX14 but was intrigued by the kinetic system. After only a couple of days, I've become a fan. I'm still working on "dialing" in on touch shots. The surface face is lively and initially, I found that I was blocking and hitting shots out, that were "cans of corn" before. It'll take some time. I do love the feel though of this paddle and look forward to getting past that break-in period (not the paddle, but my game).
Hi, which of your 2 paddles do you now prefer?
@@mlee9049 The Black Ace is all power, all day! I didn't need the extra power, but it's a very noticeable difference. I now have it dialed in and am extremely pleased with the paddle. I did have to put some time in with the ball machine at the gym and now I'm in great shape.
It's a terrific paddle and would highly recommend it. Cheers!
@@wesbutterfield9816 Thank you for your reply!
Great review, thanks! I'm a long-time Paddletek guy and have played the Tempest Reign Pro for a few years - great paddle. I suffered a severe case of biceps tendinitis and knew ProKennex was an alternative. Bought the Pro Spin before the Black Ace came out and really liked the feel. As soon as the Black Ace came out I bought it and have played it for about a week now. I am so impressed by this paddle. First, ProKennex has nearly eliminated my shoulder pain. I am playing pain free for the first time in several months. Second, the fit and finish of this paddle is awesome - rock solid and none of the manufacturing issues that you see with other brands like loose edge guards, etc...the quality is readily apparent. Power is all there as everyone has said. The biggest surprise is that control has not really dropped off. It's a bit of an adjustment going from 16 mm core to 11 mm, but I'm surprised by how little adjustment it actually is. As you have said, this paddle feels more like a thicker core paddle than either the Gearbox or the Selkirk Power Air Invikta both of which seem much more stiff and unforgiving to me.
That’s great to hear that the Kinetic system is working for you. I really hope to have the same result
Do you prefer the Pro Spin or the Ace? Thinking of buying one but worried about pop ups from the Ace.
I'm researching this paddle but it's giving me worse golfer's elbow! I had the pro flight paddle before when I first started to play PB. Found that the paddle was too powerful for me and I sold it. I played tennis and badminton in high school, so that was 30 years ago. I have played with many paddles in the last 3 years. I've gotten better but still have golfers elbow now matter what I have done. Gone to an accupuncturist, use the flex bar, prolotherapy. I've played with the Black Ace for about 8-10 games and tonight my elbow was on fire! It hurts to straighten my arm. I play great with this paddle!! I switched to my Selkirk Luxx for the last 2 games and the pain subsided. I do not understand what's going on when this paddle is supposed to help with tennis/golfer's elbow. This paddle has power but I can still dink and drop. It could be that I'm a better player now at a 4.0-4.5 skill level.
Nice review as always!
I only got to hit one for an hour the other day, but one thing I found fascinating is I could not keep the ball in on drives. It felt like the power to spin ratio was off. Ball came off so hot that there wasn’t enough grab on the ball to keep it in. Going to a 002 right after was a world of difference.
Singles it become very obvious that I had to modify my stroke to keep my shots in. Curious if you noticed that during testing.
I definitely had to make some adjustments to my serve and drive to accommodate the extra power. But the more I play with it, the more I'm realizing that my accuracy is better with this than with my previous paddles. So I'm able to keep the ball lower over the net instead of looping it way over. I do wish the spin was slightly better on this paddle, though. If it were just 300 RPM higher, it would be up there with the best of the best (Power Air). That would make me so happy to be able to shape the ball even more with this paddle in particular. It would be nearly the perfect power paddle.
Fromuth is sending me a new Black Ace to continue testing it, and I'm curious to see if there's any variability in the texture of the carbon fiber. I hope I hit the jackpot and get a super gritty one!
That is why I returned it. It shoots bullets during kills shots but if you can’t generate a lot of spin then you sacrifice too much on drives and limits the utility of the power
@@johnkewpickleball let us know what you find. Your observation of the carbon fiber weave is really intriguing and I think you are onto something there.
@@johnkewpickleball interesting you talk about variability right after I got a joola vision which has a clear difference between the two faces- one side is standard CFS grit feeling, and the other is incredibly gritty CFS surface, and in my quite unscientific tests I can tell the ball is rotating probably 300+ more rpm from that side. So to your point, variability is a thing! and it makes me wonder about the quality control process as one bad batch can really hinder a company if tested at the wrong time and place (too soon CRBN?) I would expect Pro Kennex has pretty good QC and you wont see much difference as they are made here in the US and Steve probably has a lot of checks in place, as he is very quality oriented.
@@Thejoeb you know, I never even considered that the same paddle might have texture differences on each side, but that makes sense too. I’ll be spin testing two additional Black Aces soon, so we’ll get a little more data about the spin consistency for ProKennex
I am using the black ace ovation which took some getting used to from my Franklin Ben Johns and frustrated me at first, but I am now loving it. (3.5-4.0 player)
Another great video. I always thought I would stick with the electrum line of paddles but I want to give this paddle a try.
Wow! I just had my first session with this paddle and was shocked at how much I liked it.
I typically play with a Hyperion and have struggled with 'power' paddles (like the Power Air) keeping balls in and having anything close to a control game, but this felt very different. Drops and dinks took a second to calibrate, but got fairly dialed in after a couple games. That said, who needs to drop when you can drive this hard and shake and bake all day?!
I'm glad you're having the same experience with this paddle as I am!
Did you try putting weight on it to make it top heavy like the Hyperion?
FYI - Selkirk, Engage and CRBN all use Toray carbon fiber and produce an insane amount of spin - even after six months.
I'm curious if you still have the black Ace & how is lit holding up? I just ordered the new XF version of it.
Overgrip is great to make it like tennis Raquet's and shift the weight back on handle not head heavy good on tennis elbow with soft grip and damping shock 😊 01/25/24
Thanks for the review! I've been curious how this was going to stack up vs the Prokennex spin line.
Just to update you, John. Seems the link will take us to the paddle website but the Square Ace paddle is not on there! At least I couldn't find it after 20 mins. I think this review sold me on that paddle. I'm brand new to pickleball... Played 3 times! Haha.... But I do desire to play it much more!
Thanks John for yet another very comprehensive paddle review!
I was able to hit and play with the Black Ace for a short time. My impression of the paddle based on this short time pretty much mirrors your review. It's a very intriguing paddle that I'm now strongly considering.
When I first held the paddle, I was very surprised by the big overlay. To my uninformed eyes, that large area in the inner part of the paddle where the overlay adheres to the exposed carbon forming the Ace shape looks to me like an obvious first point of failure. I know that Dizon and Dawson have been playing with the Black Ace for a good number of months now, so I'm sure that the adhesion has held up during this extended period and that ProKennex has tested this. Still, it just seems to me that that the overlay adhesion could be subject to failure after many hits on it over an extended period of time. Any thoughts about that?
Also, I wonder what the ProKennex official reason is for the large overlay, which I've never seen on any other paddle.
In any event, I hope you'll do a follow-up video on the Black Ace after you play with it for an extended time, or earlier if something of significance comes up.
Thanks again John!
I was also surprised to see the overlay up close. I thought it might even affect the trajectory of the ball, but that hasn’t happened as far as I can tell. I’ll definitely keep an eye on it for delamination; I agree that it could be a risk. And the pros don’t play with a paddle long enough for that to be an issue.
I do think that the overlay could have some benefits by potentially enlarging the sweet spot, by working in combination with the tungsten beads to make the perimeter of the paddle denser, similar to Joola hyperfoam edge wall. The sweet spot on the Black Ace is just too big for such a thin paddle without there being something going on.
@@johnkewpickleball Good point about the pros not playing long enough with a paddle to expose any longer term design flaws.
So, I contacted ProKennex a couple of days ago and asked them what the purpose of the large overlay is. This is their response.
"Thank you for contacting ProKennex support.
The Black Ace is a Toray 700 carbon face paddle with an Ace logo overlay for a uniquely sleek, visual aesthetic.
- Alice from ProKennex Pickleball"
I then immediately followed up and asked, just to be sure, if the overlay had any other purpose other than aesthetics, since there has been conjecture about the overlay's purpose, such as the overlay somehow helps to expand the sweet spot, or it somehow helps with dampening or control, etc. I told them their response would help put those sorts of speculation to rest.
This was 2 days ago and I haven't heard back from them. Perhaps they're very busy shipping Black Ace's out!
Anyway, based on their initial response, perhaps the overlay is just for aesthetics, or perhaps they don't want to reveal any other purpose for competitive reasons, which I'm leaning towards believing.
My uninformed reasoning is that I would think that adding such a large overlay to create the logo would add production cost and a possible point of adhesion failure when they could of just created the Ace logo within the paddle surface just like the other paddle manufacturers do.
In any event, I ordered a Black Ace Ovation right at the launch time. I noticed that the Ovation was already sold out a few hours later, while the Pro is still available as of a few minutes ago.
@@barney9997 excellent work! I didn’t mention it in the video, but under a microscope, the overlay has applied grit like that looks similar to the Power Air and other grit texture paddles. So some performance R&D went into the overlay, and I think there’s more there than just aesthetics, whether intentional or not
Would anyone happen to know where you could purchase these facing materials or something similar? I want to make a Frankenstein paddle using the gearbox cx14 and it’s hyperbite technology and apply the carbon or fiberglass surfacing material to it to make it spin faster than the Tasmanian devil.
Hi, what's your opinion on the Electrum II. I could not find a review. Considering, that it does not have thermoforming, I'm wondering if it's worth the price.
Great reviews and Analysis. Not just here but especially in your 2022 Spin Rate review video.
Another brand I’d love to see you analyze/review is the Nuipipo ExplorerPRO. Which I can’t seem to find any in-depth videos on, and would greatly appreciate your take on it.
I use an Explorer Pro, it's a good budget paddle. It's for people who want a decent paddle but don't want to spend 100+ dollars on one. Got mine for $60 on a black Friday Amazon deal. Just don't expect it to be comparable to a Joola or something like that, lol
love the ovation Black Ace
thanks for content!! ..
I'm new to pb but have been avid tennis player for years ...
I live out in literal no-mans land and have a silent partner scoop tennis ball machine... does anyone know if these machines can be used with pb balls??
Do you notice any dents in your paddle? I heard about this online and then I have a demo that has quite a few little dents. I love the paddle though so I was going to buy it but I am worried about the durability
Thanks for the great review. I've had some questions about this paddle and hoping for a bit more in depth comparison. Previous Prokennex paddles to me have had that 'board-like' feel, similar to the Power-air and some of the gearbox paddles (CX11 for example). You mentioned it felt closer to a honeycomb core / CF paddle than the powerair did. This is where I would love a bit more clarity. Is it still 'board-like' or how close on the spectrum to say a Gruvn 13 or 16mm (which is totally a control paddle however I noticed you had tested one before) or a Joola CFS. I do understand Im comparing control paddles to a power paddle. I am personally looking for something that moves into the power spectrum without losing a great deal of control. Thanks for the great information!
Correct, the black Ace feels far less board like than any of the Prokennex paddles that I played with. I compare it more to the feel of a 14mm poly core, such as the Joola Solaire. Not quite as much control as the Solaire, but more than any other 11mm paddle IMO
@@johnkewpickleball Perfect, thanks for taking the time to reply!
@@johnkewpickleball Great review, and thanks for interacting with viewers in the comments. I hadn't phrased it that way before, but now that you mention it my Ovation Flight does have a "board" like feel, very different from the Gearbox CX14. The two paddles I would most like to demo or see a comparison review are the Black Ace and the Power Air - how are they similar or different as both have great spin and power.
@@johnkewpickleballhi. I wanted to follow up. I finally got my black ace pro today (in Canada) and joined a ladder to give it a play. Wow! Lol. (What a horrible comment) it’s definitely a power paddle. I was able to adjust my serve to allow my spin to work. Hard, fast with spin is amazing. I can’t do everything I could with my Gruvn Cf paddle (on the serve spin side but almost). The drives took a couple goes to adjust so I didn’t send them out of bounds. The soft game wasn’t too bad to be honest. Maybe missed 5% which isn’t bad. Dinks were easy. It’s the resets off hard shots that are going to take some work. Accuracy is amazing! My fast hard drives just worked. Hands battles at the net were good. Now onto the comparison to the Selkirk Power Air. I couldn’t get the SPAir to work for me. It was clunky in my hands. The Ace was great and stayed great in my 2 hour session. One draw back… man is it loud lol. But I think I’m totally game to pull this paddle out first. Thanks for your review. Totally helped me.
@@Firesong4ng Thanks for following up, and I’m glad it’s working for you! Your impression of the Black Ace is exactly how I felt the first week with it. Insane power, a bit wild, but maneuverable soft game and good accuracy. Four weeks in, and I’m loving this paddle more and more. I think my soft game is nearly as good as with a 16mm core after getting the Black Ace dialed in. And the power is always a joy.
Are u going to review this paddle again BLACK ACE PROKENNEX is there a coupon on this paddle ? 01/25/2025
Thursday
I have the PRO FLIGHT love the paddle . Also hit both gearbox cx11 and cx 14 how does this compare want to purchase but $250 trying to get as much feed back as possible thankyou
Way more power than Gearbox, and more than the pro flight
@@johnkewpickleball
Haven’t pulled trigger yet any updates on how paddle feels like I said using pro flight just love the look of this paddle worried paddle may have to much power already a banger thanks again
I picked up the Black Ace Ovation a few weeks ago at the early release after demoing both it and the Pro model and coming from the Gearbox CX11. I got the CX11 back in April after demoing it and the ProKennex Flight models. I gave the Flight a slight edge in control but got a discount on the cx11 that was too hard to pass on. And I thought that would be the last paddle for a long time, but the Black Ace has been a game changer for me. There definitely felt like a learning curve in the beginning for me and experienced the same thing as in the video where I was scared of the pop at the net. But once you adjust, the power is just insane. I’m noticing a lot more serves becoming nonreturnable then just a few weeks ago and winning games that I was losing in my league prior. Maybe it’s in my head and now have more confidence but whatever it is, I’m really enjoying this paddle. If you’re already a banger you’re going to scare people with the speed and the sound this thing makes haha. I swear it’s the loudest paddle I’ve heard. ProKennex also has a 30 day no questions asked, return policy if you give it a go and don’t like it. That was what made me try it. But take all this with a grain of salt because what do I know, but hope some of this helps. Cheers!
@@rulala422 thankyou
Great review!
Thanks, Will!
Thanks for another very comprehensive review. ProKennex claimed on their website "The Black Ace Pro is the first ever single piece TORAY faced carbon paddle," what does it mean? I thought only Gearbox has a single carbon fiber construction. Does Black Ace has a PP honeycomb core?
I think they mean the first time ProKennex has used raw carbon fiber on the paddle face. Yes, the core of the Black Ace is honeycomb...you can see the impressions through the carbon fiber.
Although I just saw the email from Steve Dawson about the launch of the Black Ace tomorrow, and he mentioned the same thing: the first ever edgeless T700 single piece design. Gearbox advertises 3k carbon fiber on both the face and perimeter, but I wonder if it’s not a single piece?
@@johnkewpickleball drive.google.com/file/d/1sKBqzpqVb9bKS2ZXt6bJwwbTaYNkyNPe/view?usp=share_link This drawing shows those Gearbox ribs
Basically Gearbox has multiple carbon fiber ribs bonded to each other and bonded to top/bottom faces to form a one-piece carbon fiber composite structure
@Johnkew Do you happen to live in Denver? That looks like Pickleball Food Pub?!
Yes indeed!
@@johnkewpickleball if I see you there, I'll be to say hi!
John, how much difference do you think the bit of extra length and width makes in the Ovation version?
I'm not sure, but I'd like to demo one of the ovations to see
I think they are coming out with a long handle version early next year. 🎉🎉 what grips did you use ? Looks nice. Good video and love my ACE as well.
Over the top of the factory grip, I layered the following: Yonex overgrip - Tourna Pro Gel replacement grip - Yonex overgrip.
Where did you hear about the longer handle version?
Cool, and good news about the long handle version!
Can you give any info on the XF? Am I losing handle length for the elongated shape (Tyler Loong's Vulcan/Selkirk Omni)?
Hows the paddles durability now since uploading this video??
Legacy Pro also uses Toray
This is an awesome vid. However, is the Black Ace Ovation the same as the Black Ace Pro only with an oval shape?
Yes
Do you have any other videos besides the four on your channel? Not sure if you made some private. Looking forward to more paddle reviews though!
No, I just started making these videos. Glad you enjoy them, and there will be more!
I don't think Electrum is the only other mfg that advertises T700? GRUVN does, as does Engage (Evolution Extreme for example) and CRBN. Unless T700 is a generic term and doesn't mean Toray T700?
Best I can tell, T700 refers to the breakdown of carbon on the filaments and isn’t specific to Toray
Sure wish the handle circumference was bigger. Funny how a bigger circumference was recommended in Tennis for tennis elbow! That overgrip stuff, you end with broomstick with no bevel!
Did you ever get the LG version?
Pello had been using TORAY for a while now
Great review! 👍
Nice review very detailed. It might be something I would try after your review. I never really like their other models and shapes. Sounds like a nice combination of power, spin and decent touch for the soft game. Does it seem to have less pop-up tendencies than the Pro II? Thanks again there are a lot of viewers that really like this type of content. I'm a fan.
Thanks for the compliment! I’d say this has about the same control as the Electrum Pro II. But honestly, I was really impressed with the Pro II also. I know it’s gotten some poor reviews, but to me, it felt like the control of at least a 14 mm paddle.
FYI, Fromuth must be out of the paddle, it’s not even listed on their website.
They should be getting more soon
So, they painted over parts of the raw carbon?
It’s not paint, but seems to be a composite layer glued to the carbon fiber
Hi, How to contact you for a new product review
Hi Joy, you can email me at
@@johnkewpickleball Thank you, I will
longer Black Ace and longer handle coming out early 2023
What site do I use your discount code for the Black Ace, please?
Fromuth Pickleball. This link will directly apply my code: fromuthpickleball.com/?rfsn=6974693.8bb0153
I see some people received a black ace insignia carry bag instead of just a PROKENNEX bag. I know you are a detail guy, any thoughts ?
Interesting - I haven't seen the Black Ace bags yet. Are they the same as the ProKennex bag, but with a different graphic?
It looks like it's shinier with the black ace logo debossed on one side and then the words black Ace on the other side
@@johnkewpickleball they have the special black ace case again. They have a Black Ace XF "elongated"version now,thoughts?
Thanks John
After one month of using it, Im not recomend it for advance players. No spin. A lot of pop but 4 from 10 on spin.
Your content is very good, you should make videos more frequently
Ronbus advertises "Raw Toray T700 Carbon Fiber"
Great Review
Someone mentioned the "ace" graphic looks like a butt passing wind...it's all I can see now.
Hi 👋
👌😎🙏🏻
Great review-unfortunately your code doesn’t work for this paddle at Fromuth.
Yes, apparently Prokennex and Selkirk don't offer discounts to retailers, so my code doesn't work for them. I clipped that part of my video out after figuring this out.
gimmick
John do you have an email address?
Yes indeed - email me at johnk.williams (at) gmail.com