Man I had no idea they had such different roles and this thing about the power amp changing the way you produce dynamics (volume vs timbre) is really interesting.
Just got a reactive load attenuator for my Silver Jubilee Combo and now life is wonderful at low volumes. I finally got that rich and full sounding lead tone that I struggled so long to get to. It really is the combination of edge of breakup preamp gain plus the well opened up poweramp section that gets me what I wanted.
Brilliant help I sorely needed. I've always focused on a very clean tone in the one amp I owned for decades, a Roland JC77. I never understood how to get proper tube sounds in sims until I got a spark go and found your series on the spark 40, and now this. I know the universe is saturated with spark amp videos but I would love one more, in which you focus directly on the theory side as it applies to the amp series. You covered a lot while dialing in tones or doing overviews of the effects categories, but I suspect there is a lot more in your head we could learn from. Regardless, Thank you!
Another great video. Any chance of a more in depth look at the difference between pre and power distortion, how you blend them together and also whether the basic amp sims (e.g. ampire) do a decent job of modelling the differences?
Hey Paul, awesome content as always. Going forward, any chance you would consider doing a video using a Bugera PS1 powersoak? Seen as you own the high end and mid range attenuators/ load boxes , maybe covering the PS1 as a budget entry might be something that interests you and others, including myself .
@@TheStudioRats not a bad shout… I would lend you mine but I use it to often to part with at the moment. Great live stream last night by the way. I’ll reach out to Bugera 👍
Brilliant video about an essential thing for valve amps Paul - just one thing though, I appreciate what you mean about ‘more dynamics’ (clean tone) when you turn the master down, but go back and listen to your clean tone at 4:43 (power amp turned up), it is nothing short of glorious!
Love this videos! Could not be at the show last week so was not able to ask about the riffs and licks on the vids. Which I love. Now, how much gain is too much gain? I think I have the tendency to oversaturate my tone. I get note separation but somehow is too “roaring” or saturated… but then im turning it down and it gets weak with no punch… always end up with too much gain or too little but never the right amount 😅
Just recently found your channel - been looking at the Marshall Studio line of amps and one of your videos popped up. Now that i've delved further down the rabbithole i think i'm gonna invest in a decent attenuator before looking at another amp. Thanks for the informative videos - really like how you keep them short and to the point, too many channels fill their videos with fluff/filler content for no good reason and it's annoying. Liked and Subscribed!
This is why I loved my Orange OR50, and the design of the AD30. Both are made to run the power section hot. My OR50 sounded great from bedroom to stage volume.
Great video…I have a Fryette PS-100…Couldn’t live without it or some kind of load box…….I was wondering what your thoughts were on an amp thru a load box into interface,VS a Quad Cortex,Helix,AxeFXIII,etc????
Fantastic video as always. What do you do to never have any hum or noise when you use a gainy tone? Do you run a gate in front of your amp? In the effects loop?
The problem is that when you drive your power amp hard much of that good tone is due to how the cabinet is being driven. When you use an attenuator you lose that. Its simply not driving the cab the same way. To put it plainly there is no true substitute for a loud hard driven guitar speaker cabinet. Isolation rooms are used in pro studios for this. Isolation boxes even impede on the proper speaker movement and natural sound usually in a bad way. I use an attenuator, drive my power amp hard and run the amps line out to a cabinet IR in my daw where i can tweak eq and simulated gain to the cab and that gets me very close as i can to the natural sound of a hard driven cab without needing the isolation. Good video, too many people overlook the importance of the poweramp section.
Hey! Great video! Thanks for making informative videos like this! :) I just don't agree with some things about the attenuators here, but that's just an opinion :) I've used in the past a WEBER MiniMASS 50w Attenuator. This is a special type attenuator with real speaker coil inside. On all my amps that I tested it, they didn't sounded any better at low volume, even they sounded worse with the attenuator switched ON, but not because of the attenuator itself. I'll explain why in my opinion is that... First, the interaction between the transformer and the speaker, this loop is very important for the sound of your amp, that's why I bought an attenuator with a real speaker coil in the first place, but that's not all... The Bass is a physical phenomena and if the speaker don't move the air in front or lets say at the back, then the bass frequencies doesn't come as loud as if you push the speaker hard. I think, that this is the main reason for a thin sounding amp...The dynamics are another thing, but the bass response is just a physical thing in my opinion :) Finally I ended up selling my WEBER MiniMASS 50w Attenuator, because I didn't liked the sound with it... In my opinion, a loud box or attenuator with a Line OUT is useful, but just for recording purposes. Now I have 100W Marshall JVM 410H and I run it with just two of the four tubes on 50W power. This amp is amazing and at any volume sounds awesome, even at very low power. I think that another reason for the thin sounding amp is the design of the amp itself, because in the past all of the amps had to be turned up to very high volumes in order to produce an good overdriven sound, but not in nowadays... :) Cheers! :)
Really cool and informative video, thanks alot for this! I absolutely LOVE the sound of a cranked Marshall, bought one for myself (JCM800 20W) and play it alot (with a loadbox) but l'm kinda worried that the lifespan of it will be demolished, if i only run it at it's almost maximum. Would that be problematic? Cheers!
@@0megalul309 thanks for the reply! Will keep that in mind for sure. Feels kinda weird though. Would‘nt you think that, whatever it is, is capable of doing what its designed to do, without „damaging“ itself? Feels a bit strange ^^
Hey Paul, great videos on these 20 watt Marshall amps!! What in your opinion would you go for as a 1x12 cab for one of these that gets the tones that the Torpedo is putting through into your DAW? - I'm considering one of the designated cabs Marshall make, but was curious on your thoughts. Best wishes, Sammy
Hey Sammy, I haven’t tried the Marshall cabs although I’m pretty sure they’ll be top notch. I’ve got a 1x12 victory creamback cab that works really well.
You gotta cook those power amp tubes to get the right sounds of those classic Marshall amps. Only downside is high volume level but that is where attenuator comes in.
I have a Fryete Power Station and its a fantastic tool. I also use a Captor X which has a great sounding attenuator but is very limited in output volume choice!
@@TheStudioRats best for attenuating amps. Pete thorn always uses it with his Marshalls despite having everything under the sun. I currently use a Suhr RL IR but would love to have a fryette ps
I'm trying to build a home studio in my spare bedroom. It's only 10x12 with a carpet floors and cedar wood walls. What? What do you think I should soundproof it with? That won't cost me an arm and a leg?
I have that problem with my AC30 it sounded thin with the master volume set low and I got a cap mod done but probably didn’t need to should have got an attenuator a captor x would be the go
Great video! I've been going down this wormhole for ages, but with an extremely limited budget. I really wanted to get away from the "optional paralysis" I tend to get from digital amp sims, and go for a more traditional all analog feel of a tube amp. Alas? I only had $500 to invest. I ultimately went with a Victory V4 all valve preamp (The Jack), which clocks in at $100 less than a Two Notes Captor X on it's own without an amp head. I still have a bit of RF noise to suss out, but I'm basically running my "front of amp" effects board straight to the V4, and then direct to interface where all my poweramp, post gain mod/time fx, and cab IR's digitally reside. I control all of that via a MelloAudio Midicommander, and I must say? It's pretty much accomplished what I've been after in spades. For mobile gigging I use an iOS device with an Orange OMEC Teleport pedal interface, but that's where some of my RF noise is currently poking thru, but I have ran the Victory V4 into a BOSS Katana 100 using the 4CM, and the result sounded ace! I'll credit BOSS's choice of class A/B on the power section, but having the Katana's FX on the back end post fx loop was a brilliant design IMO. Think I'll be getting the MkII Katana 100 2x12 soon enough. I can't imagine needing more than that for stage and studio. Cheers to Martin Kid & Yoshi Ikegami I suppose? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Hey Paul, Do you have any similar comments/advice for solid-state amps - specifically the Katana? I have a 212 100W and a PRS Custom 24 and I am trying to use your 'modded marshall' sound - but it always sounds thin and fizzy (not like the sound you get in the video you posted). When practicing with the band (i.e. not bedroom volume) I use the 50W setting and I find that if I have the master volume on anything more than about 10 o'clock I just get masses of feedback - so turning the master volume up any higher doesn't seem to be an option. Any ideas or suggestions...? Thanks a lot!
Hi Dave, maybe your PRS has high output pickups, turn down the gain on the drive to stop it feedbacking. If it’s fizzy try turning down the presence and or the treble.
Works with a small tube amp combo (like a Blues Junior) as well. Set the master to 9-10 (of 12) and the preamp to 2-3 - if you then drive the input a bit with a rather cleanish overdrive pedal you get quite decent clean sound that will nicely break up a little when you turn the guitar's volume knob on full. Even with single coils and no "Fat" switch engaged on the BJ. Plenty loud enough with drums and bass in the rehearsal room and smaller gig venues. As there is almost no preamp distortion with this setting you will have to use some decent pedal(s) for more grit or downright overdrive/distortion, though. Anyway, the amp sounds way fuller and feels much more "solid" and dynamic to the touch than with the preamp cranked and the master relatively low (as most of us have been starting with, I guess).
I drive my wife nuts, I have a Marshall 40w tube amp and run it at 2/3’s master when she’s in and 3/4’s when she’s out. It’s way too loud but I’m old, I’ve always played loud music since I bought my house twenty years back so the locals never complain. Helps having a hundred year old house though to soak up some of the sound from the world. Couldn’t do it with a new build paper house lol
After going down this path I realized one I wasn't listening to the actual speaker (key fact we don't listen with our knees or our feet we listen to ears, so speakers at knee level are misleading). And secondly you have a treble knob. Some amps sound great with treble on 1. You can't expect to use someone else's settings in your room your guitar your volume level etc.
Thanks Paul! That was indeed great. I do own the Marshall DSL40CR and I have following controls: channel Gain and Volume and Master Volume. Is that any different in this case with regards to Master one?
Not if you are introducing poweramp saturation by cranking up the master. The Boss TAE is an amazing attenuator and has an fx loop built in that won’t be affected but the saturation from your amp.
A load box is used instead of a speaker, it doesn’t attenuate. An attenuator lowers the volume. I did a video on these some time back if you want to watch.
Ofc it's gonna sound bad it's a marshall what do you expect when you pay for a logo. There are 100w amps that sound amazing at bedroom volume if you don't like your tone sell your amp and get something completley different
@@RG-yz8ov a tube or hybrid randall amp for example. They always have amazing distortion and they have suprising clean for gain amps. It's cuz Don Randall worked for fender before he started randall amps and you know how sweet fenders and clean
@@pavlepopovic4996 ok cool I'll look into them, and no i actually only have a marshall dsl and a small vox ac4 so the fender clean is something I'd like to hear!
It's ok if Marshall is not your sound. Marshall does fantastic amps in every price tag. And they are amps for musicians, they are not boutique even though they could cause of their heritage
Dude that goldtop is absolutely stunning
Man I had no idea they had such different roles and this thing about the power amp changing the way you produce dynamics (volume vs timbre) is really interesting.
Just got a reactive load attenuator for my Silver Jubilee Combo and now life is wonderful at low volumes. I finally got that rich and full sounding lead tone that I struggled so long to get to.
It really is the combination of edge of breakup preamp gain plus the well opened up poweramp section that gets me what I wanted.
Brilliant help I sorely needed. I've always focused on a very clean tone in the one amp I owned for decades, a Roland JC77. I never understood how to get proper tube sounds in sims until I got a spark go and found your series on the spark 40, and now this.
I know the universe is saturated with spark amp videos but I would love one more, in which you focus directly on the theory side as it applies to the amp series. You covered a lot while dialing in tones or doing overviews of the effects categories, but I suspect there is a lot more in your head we could learn from.
Regardless,
Thank you!
Great video. Took me years to figure this out and then I sold all my amps.
I am currently going back, looking at older videos, and let me jsut say: I really like how you are doing them. Thx!
Awesome, thank you!
Another great video. Any chance of a more in depth look at the difference between pre and power distortion, how you blend them together and also whether the basic amp sims (e.g. ampire) do a decent job of modelling the differences?
Hey Paul, awesome content as always. Going forward, any chance you would consider doing a video using a Bugera PS1 powersoak? Seen as you own the high end and mid range attenuators/ load boxes , maybe covering the PS1 as a budget entry might be something that interests you and others, including myself .
Hi Biggz id love to but Bugera would have to send me one to review. If you want to contact them and suggest it I’d be happy to oblige.
@@TheStudioRats not a bad shout… I would lend you mine but I use it to often to part with at the moment. Great live stream last night by the way.
I’ll reach out to Bugera 👍
Brilliant video about an essential thing for valve amps Paul - just one thing though, I appreciate what you mean about ‘more dynamics’ (clean tone) when you turn the master down, but go back and listen to your clean tone at 4:43 (power amp turned up), it is nothing short of glorious!
Love this videos! Could not be at the show last week so was not able to ask about the riffs and licks on the vids. Which I love. Now, how much gain is too much gain? I think I have the tendency to oversaturate my tone. I get note separation but somehow is too “roaring” or saturated… but then im turning it down and it gets weak with no punch… always end up with too much gain or too little but never the right amount 😅
Just recently found your channel - been looking at the Marshall Studio line of amps and one of your videos popped up. Now that i've delved further down the rabbithole i think i'm gonna invest in a decent attenuator before looking at another amp. Thanks for the informative videos - really like how you keep them short and to the point, too many channels fill their videos with fluff/filler content for no good reason and it's annoying. Liked and Subscribed!
Very nice demo. Thank you very much for sharing Paul!
Love the captor X. Changed the game for me.
Excellent video! Cheers Paul
Great video! It is about time that somebody make a video like this one. Thanks!
This is the exact problem I’m having. I’m not driving my power amp section hard enough. Thank you.
This is why I loved my Orange OR50, and the design of the AD30. Both are made to run the power section hot. My OR50 sounded great from bedroom to stage volume.
Great tones, as always! 🤘
Great video…I have a Fryette PS-100…Couldn’t live without it or some kind of load box…….I was wondering what your thoughts were on an amp thru a load box into interface,VS a Quad Cortex,Helix,AxeFXIII,etc????
Fantastic video as always. What do you do to never have any hum or noise when you use a gainy tone? Do you run a gate in front of your amp? In the effects loop?
The problem is that when you drive your power amp hard much of that good tone is due to how the cabinet is being driven. When you use an attenuator you lose that. Its simply not driving the cab the same way. To put it plainly there is no true substitute for a loud hard driven guitar speaker cabinet. Isolation rooms are used in pro studios for this. Isolation boxes even impede on the proper speaker movement and natural sound usually in a bad way.
I use an attenuator, drive my power amp hard and run the amps line out to a cabinet IR in my daw where i can tweak eq and simulated gain to the cab and that gets me very close as i can to the natural sound of a hard driven cab without needing the isolation. Good video, too many people overlook the importance of the poweramp section.
All true, but you can still drive the cab. I mean it can be loud for live use, just not crazy loud.
Dude you are a tone master
Cheers
Your insight and tips are priceless.. thanks for what you do
Thanks for the video , have the same thin sound when you use the 5 watt mode ?
Hey! Great video! Thanks for making informative videos like this! :)
I just don't agree with some things about the attenuators here, but that's just an opinion :)
I've used in the past a WEBER MiniMASS 50w Attenuator. This is a special type attenuator with real speaker coil inside. On all my amps that I tested it, they didn't sounded any better at low volume, even they sounded worse with the attenuator switched ON, but not because of the attenuator itself. I'll explain why in my opinion is that... First, the interaction between the transformer and the speaker, this loop is very important for the sound of your amp, that's why I bought an attenuator with a real speaker coil in the first place, but that's not all... The Bass is a physical phenomena and if the speaker don't move the air in front or lets say at the back, then the bass frequencies doesn't come as loud as if you push the speaker hard. I think, that this is the main reason for a thin sounding amp...The dynamics are another thing, but the bass response is just a physical thing in my opinion :)
Finally I ended up selling my WEBER MiniMASS 50w Attenuator, because I didn't liked the sound with it...
In my opinion, a loud box or attenuator with a Line OUT is useful, but just for recording purposes.
Now I have 100W Marshall JVM 410H and I run it with just two of the four tubes on 50W power. This amp is amazing and at any volume sounds awesome, even at very low power. I think that another reason for the thin sounding amp is the design of the amp itself, because in the past all of the amps had to be turned up to very high volumes in order to produce an good overdriven sound, but not in nowadays... :)
Cheers! :)
Another great attenuator fir home use is the Rivera Rockcrusher. I love mine. I can crank my tube amps and get that piwer amp distortion.
Love it thanks :)
What is the guutar signal path in this recording video ?
Really cool and informative video, thanks alot for this!
I absolutely LOVE the sound of a cranked Marshall, bought one for myself (JCM800 20W) and play it alot (with a loadbox) but l'm kinda worried that the lifespan of it will be demolished, if i only run it at it's almost maximum. Would that be problematic?
Cheers!
Lifespan of tubes and transformers take a hit. I never crank my amps. My 79 jmp only lives at half volume at max..
@@0megalul309 thanks for the reply! Will keep that in mind for sure. Feels kinda weird though. Would‘nt you think that, whatever it is, is capable of doing what its designed to do, without „damaging“ itself? Feels a bit strange ^^
Thanks, I would love to see a video about gainstaging in S-Gear amps. :-) Also when / if to insert drive pedals (VST or real) before the amp.
Hey Paul, great videos on these 20 watt Marshall amps!! What in your opinion would you go for as a 1x12 cab for one of these that gets the tones that the Torpedo is putting through into your DAW? - I'm considering one of the designated cabs Marshall make, but was curious on your thoughts. Best wishes, Sammy
Hey Sammy, I haven’t tried the Marshall cabs although I’m pretty sure they’ll be top notch. I’ve got a 1x12 victory creamback cab that works really well.
You gotta cook those power amp tubes to get the right sounds of those classic Marshall amps. Only downside is high volume level but that is where attenuator comes in.
I have a Fryete Power Station and its a fantastic tool. I also use a Captor X which has a great sounding attenuator but is very limited in output volume choice!
I’m hearing great things about those Fryette’s
@@TheStudioRats would love to hear you review one Paul.
@@TheStudioRats best for attenuating amps. Pete thorn always uses it with his Marshalls despite having everything under the sun. I currently use a Suhr RL IR but would love to have a fryette ps
I'm trying to build a home studio in my spare bedroom. It's only 10x12 with a carpet floors and cedar wood walls. What? What do you think I should soundproof it with? That won't cost me an arm and a leg?
Yeah its going to cost im afraid David. I would find a way to work with the noise Loadboxes etc
Do you think I can get vintage JTM style tone on a JTM modded to Friedman DS40/2204 spec as well as the great drives of the 2204/JCM800?
I have that problem with my AC30 it sounded thin with the master volume set low and I got a cap mod done but probably didn’t need to should have got an attenuator a captor x would be the go
Great video! I've been going down this wormhole for ages, but with an extremely limited budget. I really wanted to get away from the "optional paralysis" I tend to get from digital amp sims, and go for a more traditional all analog feel of a tube amp. Alas? I only had $500 to invest. I ultimately went with a Victory V4 all valve preamp (The Jack), which clocks in at $100 less than a Two Notes Captor X on it's own without an amp head.
I still have a bit of RF noise to suss out, but I'm basically running my "front of amp" effects board straight to the V4, and then direct to interface where all my poweramp, post gain mod/time fx, and cab IR's digitally reside. I control all of that via a MelloAudio Midicommander, and I must say? It's pretty much accomplished what I've been after in spades. For mobile gigging I use an iOS device with an Orange OMEC Teleport pedal interface, but that's where some of my RF noise is currently poking thru, but I have ran the Victory V4 into a BOSS Katana 100 using the 4CM, and the result sounded ace! I'll credit BOSS's choice of class A/B on the power section, but having the Katana's FX on the back end post fx loop was a brilliant design IMO. Think I'll be getting the MkII Katana 100 2x12 soon enough. I can't imagine needing more than that for stage and studio.
Cheers to Martin Kid & Yoshi Ikegami I suppose?
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
any advice on getting a 'warm' or pushed clean on a digital amp?
Hey Paul, Do you have any similar comments/advice for solid-state amps - specifically the Katana? I have a 212 100W and a PRS Custom 24 and I am trying to use your 'modded marshall' sound - but it always sounds thin and fizzy (not like the sound you get in the video you posted). When practicing with the band (i.e. not bedroom volume) I use the 50W setting and I find that if I have the master volume on anything more than about 10 o'clock I just get masses of feedback - so turning the master volume up any higher doesn't seem to be an option. Any ideas or suggestions...? Thanks a lot!
Hi Dave, maybe your PRS has high output pickups, turn down the gain on the drive to stop it feedbacking. If it’s fizzy try turning down the presence and or the treble.
Solid state power sections don't react the same way. An eq pedal would be the best to help
This is probably why I'm not satisfied with the tone of my Silver Jubilee yet. Big thanks 👍🏻
Works with a small tube amp combo (like a Blues Junior) as well. Set the master to 9-10 (of 12) and the preamp to 2-3 - if you then drive the input a bit with a rather cleanish overdrive pedal you get quite decent clean sound that will nicely break up a little when you turn the guitar's volume knob on full. Even with single coils and no "Fat" switch engaged on the BJ. Plenty loud enough with drums and bass in the rehearsal room and smaller gig venues.
As there is almost no preamp distortion with this setting you will have to use some decent pedal(s) for more grit or downright overdrive/distortion, though. Anyway, the amp sounds way fuller and feels much more "solid" and dynamic to the touch than with the preamp cranked and the master relatively low (as most of us have been starting with, I guess).
What you call thin and fizzy here is still quite musical to me, sir.
I just got a Bugera PS1 Power Soak with Torpedo C.A.B. M+ DI and IR
I drive my wife nuts, I have a Marshall 40w tube amp and run it at 2/3’s master when she’s in and 3/4’s when she’s out.
It’s way too loud but I’m old, I’ve always played loud music since I bought my house twenty years back so the locals never complain. Helps having a hundred year old house though to soak up some of the sound from the world. Couldn’t do it with a new build paper house lol
Wife’s wouldn’t be happy if they weren’t being driven nuts!
After going down this path I realized one I wasn't listening to the actual speaker (key fact we don't listen with our knees or our feet we listen to ears, so speakers at knee level are misleading). And secondly you have a treble knob. Some amps sound great with treble on 1. You can't expect to use someone else's settings in your room your guitar your volume level etc.
We can build an attenuator with or without line out for under $60 US, not counting the cost of soldering gear and materials.
Thanks Paul! That was indeed great. I do own the Marshall DSL40CR and I have following controls: channel Gain and Volume and Master Volume. Is that any different in this case with regards to Master one?
Problem I have with my attenuator is it was distorting my looper pedal which I use a lot. Is there any way around this?
Not if you are introducing poweramp saturation by cranking up the master. The Boss TAE is an amazing attenuator and has an fx loop built in that won’t be affected but the saturation from your amp.
My Bugera does the job
Switch it to the clean channel and buy a bunch of pedals. That's how I fixed my amp disappointment.
Paul !! You should sell all those Marshall’s and buy that bogner gold finger sl . That amp sounded amazing with your Lester
I've got a peavey classic 50 2x12 as my bedroom amp, not sure I'd be popular with the wife if I sat the master at 3/4 lol
Still unclear on the difference between a loadbox and an attenuator
A load box is used instead of a speaker, it doesn’t attenuate. An attenuator lowers the volume. I did a video on these some time back if you want to watch.
@@TheStudioRats Got it. Cheers
I recommend a Friedman BE100 Deluxe if you're not happy with your amp's sound. You'll never have any amp issues again.
Was way to compressed and squishy for me, made all my guitars sound the same. Needed something less processed.
Means nothing, same tone same same, only volume change.
Ofc it's gonna sound bad it's a marshall what do you expect when you pay for a logo. There are 100w amps that sound amazing at bedroom volume if you don't like your tone sell your amp and get something completley different
What do you recommend that has nice cleans but good distortion also?
@@RG-yz8ov a tube or hybrid randall amp for example. They always have amazing distortion and they have suprising clean for gain amps. It's cuz Don Randall worked for fender before he started randall amps and you know how sweet fenders and clean
@@pavlepopovic4996 ok cool I'll look into them, and no i actually only have a marshall dsl and a small vox ac4 so the fender clean is something I'd like to hear!
@@RG-yz8ov gain has a lot more low end and it sounds thicker. And the clean is literarly cleaner than most amps...shortly said...
It's ok if Marshall is not your sound. Marshall does fantastic amps in every price tag. And they are amps for musicians, they are not boutique even though they could cause of their heritage