Millions of people love to be scared they even pay for it so a concept of a hell scares them and it gives them the motivation to live a better life they believe in hell because they want to not because they have to.
Valen Dreugh Again... Mocking Someones On What They Do.. Bullying Is It Not? Having Fun There? Mocking Me? Have Fun With That..When You Grow Up And Look Past Little Things Like That. And TRY To Understand ANYONE And Everyone Around You.. Talk To Me.
Valen Dreugh dude, you should read the stuff you post .... it will help you to not look like someone who doesn't know what a computer is. And yes, I am only referring to your caps lock being on :D
I don't believe in hell because: Many religions have something like or similar to hell. Most of those religions say that if you are not of that religion, so in theory, everyone would be in hell because you can't be of every religion
Not really. Muslim, Jewish and Christians all believe in the same God. Muslims and Jewish do not believe Jesus is the savior. Muslims believe Mohammed was and Jews are still waiting for their savior. But they all believe in the same God (called Allah if you're Muslim). If you believe in God you have eternal life.
+Shane Thorsteinson That is so incredibly wrong that I don't even know where to begin in answering that. But simply put, no, Muslims and Christians do NOT believe in the same God.
+The Sun Hell is not a field where they put everybody in. Everybody gets the version of hell it deserves. Because of Stalin millions of people died by being either tortured in Gulags or because of famine. If you or a member of your family lived in such conditions or died of such a horrible death you would not have said that.
Chasna M. oh yes i would, i do NOT let emotions cloud logic, ever. Just because some people are so weak as to let their emotions control their judgement calls and justic choices, does not mean that EVERYONE is the same.
The Sun It is not about emotions clouding logic. When you go through such experiences you get to understand the suffering some people go through better. It is true that we are not equal; some can be pursued to think about their deeds and they are capable of compassion, mercy and regret, but there are some that can't see the wrong they did until they go through the same thing, and sometimes not even then. How do you show such a person/make him or her understand the consequences of his/her evil deeds?
Chasna M. you are talking about infinite punishment for an finite crime, that is ridiculous if you actually even bother to try and think about infinity for a moment. "Understanding" i understand how much bad these people are, i really do and i know they deserve a punishment that is severe and long. But an infinite punishment literalky does not have a word for how overkill that is, imagine being tortured and brutally beaten, to the point where you are suffering the most unimagineable pain ever, for not a thousand years, not a billion years not a nonillion years, hell not even a googolplex years, but an infinite amount of years. It is absurd and awful to do such a thing, you should give out fair punishments instead of going absolutely overkill. To address your point about them "learning their lesson" do you think any human is as demented to say they have not done wrong after experiencing all the evil they have done to the world firsthand? In this case, killing and harming millions of lives? By the very off chance (near impossible) that these people still think they are in the right, just send them through again until they have learnt the lesson. An infinite punishment is unnecessary and cruel.
The Sun What I can say is that people get the amount of punishment and the kind of punishment according to their deeds. Nobody gets more or less than it deserves. I can't explain more without getting into details, and for that I have to mention my religion and what my religion states. And I do not know if you want to hear that (Usually if I start to explain things people get the impression I want to convert them).
Let's say there are two religions, religion A and religion B. Religion A is the 'correct' one and if you don't believe in it, then your going to hell. There are going to be people who have been brought up and raised by their parents to firmly believe in religion B and they had no way of knowing that religion A was the 'correct' one. Is it right to torture them indefinitely just because of something they had no control over? This is why I also don't believe in hell.
+Armok God Of Blood It is not about believing in religion A or B but about why you choose to believe in that religion. As long as you are alive you should have good intentions and search for the true God and strive for purity, goodness and a way of life that leads to that.
+Chasna M. That's a nice sentiment but that's not what the majority of religions preach. If being good was the only qualifier to get into heaven people wouldn't be so adverse to it. Most religions say, you have to be 'good' according to these guidelines and if you aren't either give your lives over to us or tough luck. There is no way to know who's guidelines are correct A or B as they will often differ greatly and be nearly impossible to follow.
Sean Peery I can't testify for all religions. But it is true that being 'good' it is not enough because every person has a definition of what being good means. And your being good can be very different from my being good. And how can you put a standard to it? How can we now the outcome of all our actions? Absolutes such as good, evil and justice do not exist outside God. It is true that striving for purity of mind, in love, way of life etc is one of the main objectives of us living on Earth. But the main one is searching for the One that put you here in the first place. So being humble (accepting that one is not all-knowing) and searching for God with a pure intention is a main objective.
Sean Peery Choosing religion should not be on the premise that it brings us honour, friends or it is easy to follow - as in we only make some incantations and chant some words and 'job done'. It should make us want to be better and brings us closer to God.
Which one will bring you closer to god? They both claim different paths, if you choose the wrong one then you only serve to travel further from a true god should there be one.
When I was a kid I use to ask my mom If Abused Women Would go to hell. She said if they don't believe in God then yes. Or What about people who never heard of it, What about people all over the world that did not know Jesus died on the cross. My mom never could answer my Questions.
@@itachy4K what about the people who didnt hear about it in time before you pass?..what about babies...what about people on islands or parts of the world that has no way of hearing this like stranded somewhere or who cant see or read or hear....but a all loving god doesnt give a fuck right or didnt think about its like 3 billion or more people in this world
@@kennethcooper6383 tbh every religion has a different way of answering to that, but the thing is that some only argument that God knows and judges every person individually
I do not believe in a Heaven nor in a Hell. Why? Heaven: We don't need a place to when we die, no matter Christian or not. We can make our own Heaven in our lives, to usually think positive, keep our heads up, and not to let any bullies get to us. Hell: Who in the world wants to go to a place with eternal suffering and torture? NOBODY. And if God truly created a Hell, then I don't know why people call him all-knowing, kind, and forgiving when in fact he abuses this power to scare people into believing in him, otherwise Sir Red Wings with the horns and tail and pitchfork will be waiting for us. What do I believe? Reincarnation. Reincarnation is basically being born into a new life in my book. Why do I believe in this? So we can fix the mistakes we've made. So we can live a life that we can make actually good if we try. I personally believe that you can have a choice on what you want to be born as. I want to be born as an Irish girl. It just seems awesome.
I believe in an afterlife, but not called heaven or hell. Life is too magical to just be a bunch of neurons, it must've come from somewhere, stay in a body, and go somewhere. Please no hate, I am not a science denier, just believe there is more to the universe(s).
exactly what i think. i think that there is a place where you go fix your problems which is hell and once you understand you go to spend an eternity with god in heaven.
Oscaror S thanks :) hope u learned from what i had to say. i honestly think i did from your comment. ^^ why i love being a floater in the case of religion
No where in the Bible is it said that Satan is in hell. It says that he roams the earth causing trouble. Yes, it is said that God gave him a separate domain to rule over with the 1/3 of angels that sided with him, but it says nothing about Satan ruling hell. Don't get me wrong, I hate Christianity, but this is a bad argument.
the thing is, I want to belive in a life beyond this, and I want to have some greater being to look to, but I just can’t live with the fact that many of my friends and some of my family will have their guts ripped out, burned, and suffering for all of existence. This is so contradicting to me. I always feel, in the middle.
4:09 THANK YOU. FUCKING THANK YOU. I've wanted to hear this from another human being for I don't know how long. ANYONE who creates life, forces them to suffer for happiness, IN ORDER to make them warship YOU isn't worthy of that worship. HERE I MADE YOU SO THAT YOU WILL WORSHIP ME... Wtf?
I'm going to make a person, and give them a broken leg. Then I am going to tell them that if they limp while walking in front of me, the will suffer for eternity in hell... Why would I worship that?
It is so simple but some humans like to think they are inferior to something, and religion gives some people a false sense of purpose. It makes you feel nice to be part of a grand scheme and be a "chosen people". Essentially religion is a mental crutch that allows people to keep functioning.
I personally believe in Purgatory rather than Hell. And for more than just not knowing about Jesus Christ or being homosexual. I believe that the more evil one is, the more time he will spend in there (sort of like a prison or rehabilitating a drug addict) before they will be sent to Heaven. This way, they'll have punishments for their wrong-doings, but not extreme punishments for extreme times. Hell just seems too... unjust.
blacksowa Really, it's just common sense. Would you rather ground your child/give him or her a spanking for doing something wrong? Or take him or her to the basement and light them on fire? So, I guess it would be in the "Personal Bull-Shit" category?
Excellent video. I never could wrap my mind around infinite punishment for a finite transgression. Heck, I don't understand sin, original or otherwise. As an abstract concept, why would Satan/Lucifer (Seth? Hades?) want to make hell a horrible place? Didn't the people sent there do bad deeds and should be rewarded for their evil behavior? If I was the dark lord, I would make it a paradise for sinners. Drinking, drugs, sex, and video games for eternity. Heaven, as in commonly accepted 'paradise' would probably be even worse. Who in their right mind would want to praise someone...forever. I am just glad when we are gone, that is it. I won't have to worry about it since my brain won't we working anymore and there is no soul.
What i ask myself: Can babies go to hell? Babies do not have a consciousness and cannot really think about anything, they cannot choose their faith on their own because they don´t understand anything and they are not responsible for their actions. But if all babies would go to heaven, it would be unfair for humans who haven´t died as babies, because the babies actually had the "luck" to die before they could even sin or choose the wrong faith and adults have the problem to have responsibility and to be judged. If babies only go to heaven when they are baptised, it is kind of a matter of luck. A baby of a Muslim woman who dies after birth, would go to hell although the baby itself could not choose its faith on its own. And if it matters whether a child is baptised, wouldn´t it actually be good to baptise children and immediately afterwards kill them, before they can sin or loose their faith?
So parents should massacre their own children, so it is sure they will go to heaven. That's the message the bible is indirectly giving. I mean, who cares about this life, if there's eternal heaven right.
Lol, I derived it from this post: "Oh no, it clearly states in the bible that children are absolutely not allowed to go to hell." Since, ppl either go to hell or heaven, children should automatically go to heaven. And why not? What's more innocent than a child.
Yes, it is sick to massacre children ofcourse, and I'm not implying anyone should. But technically you could draw the conclusion I just drew, which I found so ridiculous that it was amusing. I see it as yet another dent in certain religious beliefs. (You may have guessed I don't believe in any book or god). As for abortion, I agree you rob a person of it's future life. Unless you believe in reïncarnation, which is nonsense in my honest opinion.
Faith is subjective. Som1's personal truth is subjective. However faith is based upon books (Bible/Qu'ran etc). And the books are claimed to be based upon "absolute truth". However there are scores of books and websites I read, that make perfect sense proving the Bible/Qu'ran to be incorrect/impossible in so many ways. Unless you pull out the "God's miracle/Only god knows" argument all the time. In that case, it is again your own faith and truth. Imo "absolute truth" is something everyone must be able to agree on; science is able to show values and facts nobody can get around, hence providing a sort of "absolute truth". And imo, lines need to be drawn when lives of others, and the life of our entire planet, are threatened. I probably won't need to explain how religion has negatively influenced lives throughout history (exploiting populace all over Europe for money, inquisition slaughtering, jihads. crusades, extremists etc). As for our planet, I've heard religious people claim this life is but our earthly life, a paradise awaits us and apocolypse will come. Hence we need not take such good care of this planet, as it God will destroy it anyway. A serious line needs to be drawn when humans stop caring for earth, essentially bringing it's destruction closer themselves. This may sound paranoid, but alarm bells are going off everywhere, as hundreds of plant and animal species go extinct all around us. Not to mention the explosive growth in human population. We are currently using 50% more resources our earth can produce. i.e. we need 1.5 an earth to provide for us. We are exhausting it, and it won't be long before we will be in trouble, especially if we cling to aforementioned religious beliefs.
"Hell as a place of eternal suffering is illogical" You're right. Thats not taught in the Bible. The Bible says Hell is just our grave where we turn back to dirt and have no thoughts or pain.
I can't say I agree neither side has any proof. I choose to believe because its an emotion barrier. I can't say God is real I can't say hes not. But I choose to believe because I can.
I used to believe some sort of afterlife exists . But the angel I saw when I was 8, could've been an alien for all I know , or I'm mentally ill and not diagnosed. Either way , I have learned that I have some sort of sleep disorder ( undiagnosed) which is why I see shit when I wake up in the middle of the night ( sleep paralysis?) my brain is still in R.E.M. Mode so it's prob just in my head lol
I refuse to believe in the existence of either Heaven or Hell, and am satisfied to say 'if they do exist, they are neither of our own dimension nor somewhere humans may ever access. First, hell is just the country of the bogeymen; a scary place of villains to scare children into behaving and taken waaay too seriously. For Heaven, it's just a way of tricking people into thinking doing good things means they can be happy forever. Sometimes it's twisted so far as for them to claim your soul becomes an angel - which it could never do - or that you'll be in God's realm. Simple logic fail with heaven: why would the God who forsook all of humanity and eternally PUNISH them (multiple times) want to take these people and bring them into his own home? Yeah, doesn't make sense.
"it dosn't make any logical sense" thats becuase your logic is limited to what god really is. To all of us, of course even to the most hard core christian, if they were to use "logic" then by the norm of course it dosn't make any sense. As christians, we do not understand god one bit but only the fact that he is perfect. I mean religion really just comes down into if you believe it or not. And its also the peoples fault that the generalization of anyone going to christianity or a religion becomes a zombie and is void of logical thought becuase they think "magic" is all you need. But hey! People will believe what they want to believe. Unless you actually meet these individuals then you can pass their judgment on all of them, let alone the entire religion.
+Reuben Holland (RJH7) Actually that is not so complicated. “The Ethiops say that their gods are flat-nosed and black, While the Thracians say that theirs have blue eyes and red hair. Yet if cattle or horses or lions had hands and could draw, And could sculpt like men, then the horses would draw their gods Like horses, and cattle like cattle; and each they would shape Bodies of gods in the likeness, each kind, of their own.” - Xenophanes A religion that promotes a God that has a definite form (finite)of something from the universe, like some animal, human or a combination of things (it is made of atoms), that has a beginning (beginnings require a cause)- bound by time and space, then it is not the absolute or the true God so the religion is not true.
But *why* are we instantly "sinners"? Why do we have to feel such guilt over things that are completely natural to humanity? So a newborn, infant baby, a sweet little innocent thing, is automatically a sinner? Why don't we save the title of "sinner" to people who have actually done something wrong, like steal, rape, torture, murder, etc.?
You are a sinner. I am a sinner. We denied the all good God and chose ourselves. Our world is the way it is now as a result. Unless you repent and turn away from your sins, the punishment is still going to happen, regardless of what you think or believe. You have no excuses. Read the Bible, the Lord has given humanity a guideline on how to live and a brief history of our lives. The end is drawing near, repent, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand. God loves you all, do not ignore His love! Deny Jesus & He will deny you in front of the Father! Shallom!
+Wun No, YOU are misrepresenting my argument entirely. The fact that we are blank slates is exactly why we must if their were inherent goodness and badness in the world and they were born shackled under a negative light than we would NOT have to teach such concepts. At all. I also reccomend you watch his other videos "why I don't belive in heaven" and "why I lost my faith" in order to propperly understand his argument.
Kijiji I am not jewish, I am a Christian. But not only did the jews not believe in a hell, the early Christian gentiles during the time of the apostles no longer believed in their pagan under world they called hades. As a matter of fact, the apostle Paul taught us all what God wanted us to know (Acts 20:27), but no where will you find in his letters does he warn the gentile Christians about hell or hell fire, and the reason why both jew and gentile did not believe in hell, is because it does not exist.
"once your dead you shouldn't even be able to feel pain get sick or age cause your dead of course" Thats actually what the Bible says hell and death is, believe it or not.
Reminds me of several quotes. "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions." and "The devil is just one man with a plan, but evil, true evil is a collaboration of men."
I believe in a afterlife due to the fact that I don't want my life to just disappear and eventually be forgotten if I get hit by a car tomorrow that is why I believe in a afterlife.
The only time I've ever seen my father afraid, is when I tried to convince him that the afterlife and the soul are not real. He knows it, but he denies it because of his fear
You're right about "If you are only worshiping God because you don't want to be tortured, that's not love." But, we worship God, because he is good. We were created to worship. When I close my eyes and life my hands, I don't do it because I don't want to go to hell. I'm expressing my gratitude. God has shown me grace time after time. I worship God, because that's why I was created, but also because he's good. I could've died and went to hell, but he sent his son to die for me and you.
I fear death like nothing else. I fear not because of eternal torment in hell, but I fear it because of oblivion. I'd rather face hell, than have eternity pass by while I am unable to perceive it.
I think that Christianity and going to hell is a very similar concept to those chain messages that tell you to send it to 10 other people or you die at 3am. When you think about it, it's absolutely just as ridiculous of an idea.
***** That second sentence was amusing. Technically... technically you are right, but it doesn't matter. They are still equivalent. Let's see... Facts? So? Factual statements can be false. My shoes are blue -- that's a fact, but it's false. They are actually black. The message "Send this to 10 people or you will die at 3am" is a "fact." Also, the message "There is a sky daddy watching everything you do. If you don't worship him, he will send you to suffer for eternity" is also a "fact." Neither one is backed up by a shred of credibility, it's just that more people believe the second one. Haven't you ever noticed how Christians who are being honest say "faith" in Jesus? There is a very good reason for that. Reason? You could call any type of thinking at all "reason," so that really doesn't mean anything either. For example, many people use circular reasoning to convince themselves of something, but it's still invalid reasoning. People can jump through hoops of reason to justify literally anything. See? Both followers of the chain message and followers of Christianity can say their ideas are backed up by "facts" and "reason." They are still equivalent.
Mark 9:43 "unquenchable fires of hell" Hell is translated from the words Sheol and Hades which just mean the grave. So "Fires of hell" is just symbolic of eternal destruction in the grave. When you burn something with fire it doesn't burn forever. A fire can burn forever if you keep feeding it with something, but what you feed it "with" doesn't burn forever, and in hell's case (the grave), its dead bodies.
The Hebrew word for hell is Gehenna. "Gehenna refers to the "Valley of Hinnon", which was a garbage dump outside of Jerusalem. It was a place where people burned their garbage and thus there was always a fire burning there. Bodies of those deemed to have died in sin without hope of salvation (such as people who committed suicide) were thrown there to be destroyed. Gehenna is used in the New Testament as a metaphor for the final place of punishment for the wicked after the resurrection." --wikipedia
Plus Jesus was Jewish and the Jewish don't believe in hell. Not to mention it's not in the bible, that is if you are going by KJV but it was added in after the endoctrine was well seeded into Christianity. Hell, Tartarus, or Hades is a Roman/Greek thing. Most of all it came from the misconception of the verses in Matthews which actually refers to a place called "Gehenna." It's a place were criminals and the sick were thrown to die and most often burned. Other than the actual word was a odd mistranslation of the word "Sheol" which is "grave." The same thing goes for the devil too.
I wish I would have found you when I was little and struggling with leaving Christianity. My dad would have and did freak out anytime I brought logic or real questions in a convo, I was “going to hell” and “ugly inside.” I felt immense guilt after masterbating, I felt scared for my non-believer friends as the church said they’d suffer eternally, yk just fucked up shit. Felt really alone for awhile until someone showed me being knowledge hungry, learning all you can about deep rooted subjects is more fulfilling than any religion.
yes~ doing good is more of an outside benefit. you do good to others, without the thought of anything else, you are "deaf to everything but the song" in a way, it's much more pleasant to spread the "song" when you give it "for free" rather than making it hard for them the problem here is the misconception of that the core of the song is giving it for free but in fact, is a song that's meant for one's well-being that's sounds like "giving free stuff"
In Eastern Orthodoxy I was never taught that hell is a physical place, but rather Heaven and Hell are the divine presence experienced either pleasantly or unpleasantly, depending upon one's spiritual condition. I was Eastern Orthodox for decades and there is much about it I really love, there is a lot of the Church I appreciate but I don't know that I could consider myself a 'believer' right now. It's hard to describe where I'm at right now it's like even though I don't feel as if I can honestly say that I'm a believer right now and that there are some basic aspects of the faith that I struggle with right now.... I find a lot of beauty and truth in the services and writings and will on occasion still attend Liturgy. I guess it's a cultural or familial connection that I continue to appreciate and value. I have my share of issues as I used to go regularly so I don't know but I like feeling and knowing that I have the freedom to believe or not believe whatever I chose to explore as I experience my own spiritual journey. One thing is for sure hypocrites and bad people exist everywhere there is nobody got the market cornered on that!
Matthew 25:46 "eternal punishment" doesn't necessarily mean eternal "torture" There are many different types of punishment. This scripture contrasts "eternal punishment" with "everlasting life." The opposite of "life" is "death". The Bible says death is just no thoughts or pain and we turn back to dirt. Psalm 146:4; Ecclesiastes 9:5. Some Bibles translate that as "eternal cutting-off" from life.
The only way one could be safe would be to day in an out worship every god ever just to be sure. We can live of off fear but as the dear Andrew Ryan says "A man chooses, a slave obeys." I will never be a slave to a religion because someone wants to strike the fear of god in my heart. I will choose my life and do so at my own will. Thank you for being so calm and nice in this discussion, it brings my hope back to humanity when people can have a talk rather than have a heated argument.
Whether you're Christian or atheist, SO many people have no clue how hell actually works. Most people haven't studied scripture enough to understand it. A lot of people seem to reject the idea of hell because they think God willfully sends people there. That's NOT Christian teaching. Here's what no one seems to understand: God is completely holy, and cannot even be in the presence of anything that is impure / unholy. We see this all throughout the Old Testament. When you sin, you become impure and therefore cannot be in God's presence. That was the whole purpose of Jesus sacrificing himself, it was to SAVE people from hell, not send them there. If you don't believe me, John 3:17 literally states: "For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him." That's the whole reason Jesus died on the cross.
I think we can all agree Mary cheated on Joseph because she didn't wanna have sex with him and to prevent her from being seen as someone who committed adultery she just played dumb and said she was still a virgin. Somebody make a time machine and have Maury do a throw back episode to the old days. Joseph you are not the father
Atheists aren't changing theology at all. I've been told by many christians that you get into heaven by being good, some others say good and believe, others say just believe and be sorry. It's ridiculous and should only be for being good and being sorry for any bad acts. I don't believe in heaven or hell at all but that's what it should be if they existed.
I never grew up in the church,knew nothing about christianity up until 2009 when i met christians here on you tube,after a year and a half of being with them ,things started happening in the house.Over the past 3 years i have seen,heard and felt the supernatural.You have to be BORN AGAIN,by water and spirit.Going to church does not save you.I stay away from church,church is full of religion.
God pretty much willed him to be that way, though. In the show Supernatural, with a heavy God/Satan theme a number of it's seasons, it brings up a good point. All humans are monitored, their fates are chosen, their decisions and choices are generally chosen for them beforehand. Lucifer and Micheal go to battle during Armageddon, and Lucifer angrily states, "Why would you continue to serve him and punish me for what he did to me? He made me this way, and you want to kill me for it?" basically.
its not about religion. if you're a bad person and harm others, if you do something bad and you know its bad. you know you shouldn't have done that.. you will automatically suffer when you die. hell or heaven applies to you when you die. its something that automatically happens.
One other thing thats odd about hell is that Christians say that satan makes you do bad things, so if you did go to "hell" wouldn't he reward you for joining the darkness instead of being good?
What greater immorality is there than torturing (or even allowing, while being an omnipotent, omniscient being, the torture of) somebody forever? The notion that anybody could be legitimately judged as immoral & deserving of victimisation by the same entity who perpetuates the ultimate conceivable immorality is entirely nonsensical.
I already answered it for you - If someone came up to you and asked you that you were to be punished for not believing EXACTLY as they do, then you would be instantly repulsed by that notion, instantly. You certainly would not be convinced to convert to their religion or start believing as they do. This doesn't even have to be about religion - I just asked how you would feel if someone said you were going to be punished for not believing as they do, whatever it may be.
I do not believe hell exists as a destination after death. But i do believe that hell exists as the collection of regrets, mistakes, etc. that you can not forgive yourself for, which you will be dragging with you for the rest of your life.
As a Christian I want to say you are correct young man. God is a god of love and mercy not a dictator saying "I love you but if you don't love me back I'm going to throw you in hell for eternity." God is not Hitler.
Hell only should logically exist for two purposes: To deter future behavior, or to keep people in line. It can't deter future behavior because it's eternity, and if you want to keep people in line, just tell them that hell exists and then send everyone to heaven. There you go! No one sins, and no one is punished.
gosh, heaven seems like a painful place, yes, i mean heaven. knowing people are suffering for eternity, receiving awful torture, even if i am living in paradise, i still wouldnt like the idea that people are burning and rotting in hell.
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The main reason I don't believe in hell is because I don't believe in afterlife. When I was a kid both the concept of finitude and the concept of eternity were kind of scary. Finitude (no afterlife) is still scary but it does not make sense my mental process functioning without my physical brain, so uncomfortable as it be, there is no afterlife ergo there is no hell.
"Our faith should be expressed in working toward a better planet for our children and not the selfish, juvenile hope for a better afterlife for ourselves. I don't think anyone is going to Hell because it only exists in the minds of people who wish ill-will on others." - Dr Greg Graffin, singer and lyricist of Bad Religion, author and professor of life science at UCLA
FYI I am a catholic, but I still am open to knoledge outside the bible :) and I agree that people should think for themselves. In my opinion I think God is upset at people for making up the hell concept that cause many to fear him instead of loving him.
According to the bible, and MANY Christians I happen to know, if you aren't a Christian, but still do good deeds, You still go to hell, despite having been a good man, that cannot be right. It genuinely is 'Worship Me or It's Torture For You!', because if you don't believe in Jesus, God or any of that, you will not go to heaven, even if you have done good deeds all of your life. And I hardly think that's fair.
there's one thing i never got about hell too: say two people lived and did the exact same sinful things in their lives - they were both as bad as each other. but person a dies first, and person b dies 2 weeks later. and the two of them, if hell is real, would spend an eternity in hell. but that isn't really fair on person a - despite the fact that they were just as sinful as each other, no matter what, person a would always have experienced 2 more weeks of torture than person b had.
The concept of hell is what drew me away from religion. It's horrible and any person who can believe that other human beings deserve an eternity or torture just because they don't believe the same things are just either evil or haven't thought it through. A loving god would not have created such a horrible thing... that is sadistic.
Tons of Christians have uploaded videos claiming they had visions where they were shown hell. And some say they had outer body experiences where they were supposedly taken to hell, only for Jesus to eventually show up to tell them to believe in him or they'll end up there. They are 100% convinced this was real. I told Christians that people of other faiths and of no faith have had these sorts of experiences, and have said that they were met by beings that only showed them love and acceptance and never at all ever gave them the 'believe or else' ultimatum. In response, the Christians say that those people are being tricked by the devil to think there is no hell. I've asked Christians how then do they know they're not being deceived also. They say because they have this personal relationship with God and that their experience didn't conflict with the bible. They expect me to trust a deity that threatens me with violence if I don’t believe in it. They would rather trust a deity that approaches them with force and threats and then they call it love. And they say those who experienced love were deceived by Satan.
My biggest problem with these "visions" people have of Jesus and hell itself is that people have religious dreams almost all the time. It's natural to have a dream about your religion if you care about it enough. It's rather difficult to take seriously sometimes
I had the same bullshit dream when I was 6 years old of Jesus Telling me I'll never be worthy of him and Accepted into the gates. That's pretty traumatizing for a six year old and I questioned Christianity after that
@@JoshLocWitDaJokeZ About 20 years ago, I once had a dream where a handed Jesus a glass of water on a hot day, but when Jesus took the glass, he said to me aggressively, "Whats this? WHAT'S THIS?" Then he splashed all the water at me. I wonder if Christians would say this was a deserved rebuke from Jesus or if they'd say it was the devil disguised as Jesus. But perhaps the dream was a warning that this Jesus character is very bad man.
So, the problem I have with this "there was nothing but unconditional love" narrative is then what does this life even matter for? If a society believes this then morals have no value because none of our actions have consequences. Who is to say that, raping and murdering is wrong then? Surely you'll see the light of unconditional love even if you commit these things!!! It was just a prank bro!! 😉
The biggest mistake you made from the very beginning was basing your argument on Christian beliefs .. but Christians aren't the only ones who believe in hell and don't have a monopoly on doctrine surrounding the criteria of earning a ticket to hell either
Technically if a person is born, when they are baptized, regardless of what sin they did or did not commit, I don't necessarily see how they are a sinful person. There was a girl at my Catholic school who was one of the sweetest girls, but she was not baptized until around when I was in third or fourth grade. If she is a nice person, but not baptized, does that mean she is an evil, sinful person not worthy of God's forgiveness? No! God will still accept her, God is still forgiving. God is not commanding us to worship him, but I don't understand why people say that he is, um, HELLO PEOPLE!!!! He gave us choice! If God was commanding us to worship him, everyone on Earth would be Christian, but we're not as you can so plainly see. Look, I believe in God, and I will be tolerant of anyone who has a different religion, or is an athiest, but I do not appreciate ANYONE saying that God commands us to worship him and anyone who doesn't is an evil, awful person. He also gave us morality, someone could have a completely different religion, or be athiestic, but could be an extremely nice person, as I touched upon, God is forgiving, and you won't go to hell because you simply don't believe in God, or have a different religion. The way I see it, theistic, or athiestic, if you are a kind, loving person, you will enter the kingdom of God. God is forgiving, just saying. And don't come to me with that "If God was real, why does he let his people suffer?", because God is trying to test us, if nothing bad ever happened to anyone, how would we learn from bad things, we would just continue to do bad things. Another thing that I hear a lot of people say is "If God existed, why does he let good things happen to bad people?", first off, HE DOESN'T! Second off, in a movie I recently saw, a woman says that good things happen to bad people because the devil allows it to happen so people do not turn to forgiveness or morality, therefore allowing more people to enter the kingdom of heaven. I see your points, I tolerate them, and I pray for you.
If we submit a sinner (who is no more than a religious criminal) to endless, eternal suffering, absolutely no good will come of that. Even when he repents for his sins (and he eventually will), nothing will happen. He will still be suffering. That makes Hell essentially pointless aside from being a sadist's playground..
"Atheism (being a non theist) offers nothing?" I mean nothing after death and a hope for the future, so if you refuse to believe in that stuff, then have fun. Peace.
+Hannah Cooper the way i've heard it explained is that babies carry the sin of their parents and ancestors and to cleanse that person of their sins they need to be baptised
My main problem? Some people completely lack the ability to be decent people, often from birth. If there's a hell, than one of two things are true: there are innocent newborns out there who are already hell-bound, or we must take every word in the Bible, however inhumane, as absolute fact.
"his namesakes did better then anyone at invalidating ignoring and violating those words." I agree, I'm one of Jehovah's witnesses and we've have been trying to restore Christianity back to the way it was suppose to be. We refuse to go to war and kill any other human. We treat everyone equally and impartially. We have brothers and sisters in almost every country now, and not one of us will ever take up arms against another human or country or government.
Don't worry, he failed anyway. Although I'd say it was a good representation of a Christian. He failed to substantiate his ridiculous beliefs almost perfectly.
The grave or not it still talks about the people going there and burning eternally in fire. As for the destruction of Jerusalem again this doesn't matter it's still speaking of God taking people and having them tortured for eternity. I agree it was likely used as a scare tactic... it still teaches that. I mean for heavens sake the first verse I linked literally says eternal punishment. (note also that I only linked a short few of the verses saying this, I can gladly provide more).
along while ago i told my mom i dont really want to belive in god and she out right told me if i dont im going to hell and ive been scared ever since i have mixed feelings on what i should do.
Actually the whole context of looking at a woman lustfully was adultery. Meaning that if you look at a married woman lustfully then that's adultery. What Christians do is to take that whole verse out of context and change lust itself into a sin, creating all new sins in the process (their favorite pastime). When they do this they are changing the very definition of sin from something that god doesn’t like to something that they don’t like. BTW I made god with a lower case g on purpose.
"when I read scripture it always talks of life and death never eternal torture." So that should tell you that what you're being taught about Hell is wrong. I'm sure you've read these scriptures: Revelation 20:13-14 Death and Hell get thrown into the "lake of fire" showing they will be destroyed someday, so hell is not eternal. When anything is burn it doesn't burn forever. Hell is just our grave (Sheol and Hades) from which everyone will be brought back to life on earth. Psalm 37:29; Acts 24:15
andrew barrington that makes no sense, if he forgave people why would they get sent to hell in the bible? LOL so much contradiction from you religious types.
***** Why can't evil humans get enjoyment in hell torturing etc. other "sinner" people then? What is a demon? Why does nothing you believe make any sense?
Mikune Folf im not religious man,, but its true, aslong as you believe in god you can do what you wont and its cool, but if you dont believe and are a good person you go to hell, its all backwards,, atheist all the way,,
A lot of people are attached to the concept of Hell because that's what they want to have happen to others.
Youre right and thats absolutely sickening
@@Swiminator_08 immature sadism
Millions of people love to be scared they even pay for it so a concept of a hell scares them and it gives them the motivation to live a better life they believe in hell because they want to not because they have to.
good words cheeeers
There is Christianity without the common misconception of hell is called biblical universalism , apokastasis or ultimate reconciliation .
I will go to villages in Africa and bring the internet. They will then worship me as the prophet of the internet.
You Do Know There Is Internet In Africa?
Valen Dreugh And Thats 19 People. Keep The Subject....If You Have A Valid Statement Say It..My Point Is Not Null Just Cus I Dont Type Like You.
Valen Dreugh Again... Mocking Someones On What They Do.. Bullying Is It Not? Having Fun There? Mocking Me? Have Fun With That..When You Grow Up And Look Past Little Things Like That. And TRY To Understand ANYONE And Everyone Around You.. Talk To Me.
Valen Dreugh dude, you should read the stuff you post .... it will help you to not look like someone who doesn't know what a computer is.
And yes, I am only referring to your caps lock being on :D
Valen Dreugh oh my bad, I have real trouble reading that ... ^.^
I don't believe in hell because:
Many religions have something like or similar to hell. Most of those religions say that if you are not of that religion, so in theory, everyone would be in hell because you can't be of every religion
Not really. Muslim, Jewish and Christians all believe in the same God. Muslims and Jewish do not believe Jesus is the savior. Muslims believe Mohammed was and Jews are still waiting for their savior. But they all believe in the same God (called Allah if you're Muslim). If you believe in God you have eternal life.
+Shane Thorsteinson That is so incredibly wrong that I don't even know where to begin in answering that. But simply put, no, Muslims and Christians do NOT believe in the same God.
Really, not even horrible people like joseph stalin and adolph hitler deserve such a punishment, NO human deserves such a punishment.
+The Sun Hell is not a field where they put everybody in. Everybody gets the version of hell it deserves. Because of Stalin millions of people died by being either tortured in Gulags or because of famine. If you or a member of your family lived in such conditions or died of such a horrible death you would not have said that.
Chasna M. oh yes i would, i do NOT let emotions cloud logic, ever.
Just because some people are so weak as to let their emotions control their judgement calls and justic choices, does not mean that EVERYONE is the same.
The Sun It is not about emotions clouding logic. When you go through such experiences you get to understand the suffering some people go through better. It is true that we are not equal; some can be pursued to think about their deeds and they are capable of compassion, mercy and regret, but there are some that can't see the wrong they did until they go through the same thing, and sometimes not even then. How do you show such a person/make him or her understand the consequences of his/her evil deeds?
Chasna M. you are talking about infinite punishment for an finite crime, that is ridiculous if you actually even bother to try and think about infinity for a moment.
"Understanding" i understand how much bad these people are, i really do and i know they deserve a punishment that is severe and long.
But an infinite punishment literalky does not have a word for how overkill that is, imagine being tortured and brutally beaten, to the point where you are suffering the most unimagineable pain ever, for not a thousand years, not a billion years not a nonillion years, hell not even a googolplex years, but an infinite amount of years.
It is absurd and awful to do such a thing, you should give out fair punishments instead of going absolutely overkill.
To address your point about them "learning their lesson" do you think any human is as demented to say they have not done wrong after experiencing all the evil they have done to the world firsthand? In this case, killing and harming millions of lives? By the very off chance (near impossible) that these people still think they are in the right, just send them through again until they have learnt the lesson.
An infinite punishment is unnecessary and cruel.
The Sun What I can say is that people get the amount of punishment and the kind of punishment according to their deeds. Nobody gets more or less than it deserves.
I can't explain more without getting into details, and for that I have to mention my religion and what my religion states. And I do not know if you want to hear that (Usually if I start to explain things people get the impression I want to convert them).
Let's say there are two religions, religion A and religion B. Religion A is the 'correct' one and if you don't believe in it, then your going to hell. There are going to be people who have been brought up and raised by their parents to firmly believe in religion B and they had no way of knowing that religion A was the 'correct' one. Is it right to torture them indefinitely just because of something they had no control over? This is why I also don't believe in hell.
+Armok God Of Blood It is not about believing in religion A or B but about why you choose to believe in that religion. As long as you are alive you should have good intentions and search for the true God and strive for purity, goodness and a way of life that leads to that.
+Chasna M. That's a nice sentiment but that's not what the majority of religions preach. If being good was the only qualifier to get into heaven people wouldn't be so adverse to it. Most religions say, you have to be 'good' according to these guidelines and if you aren't either give your lives over to us or tough luck. There is no way to know who's guidelines are correct A or B as they will often differ greatly and be nearly impossible to follow.
Sean Peery
I can't testify for all religions. But it is true that being 'good' it is not enough because every person has a definition of what being good means. And your being good can be very different from my being good. And how can you put a standard to it? How can we now the outcome of all our actions?
Absolutes such as good, evil and justice do not exist outside God.
It is true that striving for purity of mind, in love, way of life etc is one of the main objectives of us living on Earth. But the main one is searching for the One that put you here in the first place.
So being humble (accepting that one is not all-knowing) and searching for God with a pure intention is a main objective.
Sean Peery
Choosing religion should not be on the premise that it brings us honour, friends or it is easy to follow - as in we only make some incantations and chant some words and 'job done'. It should make us want to be better and brings us closer to God.
Which one will bring you closer to god? They both claim different paths, if you choose the wrong one then you only serve to travel further from a true god should there be one.
If Hell exists, it must be a pretty rocking place with how many great people are actually down there!
Yeah if you like being tortured for eternity suffering pain you could not imagine but as long as you're with some "rocking people"
Sounds better than living forever with a bunch of bigots who would hate me for who I am. In hell I would be with so many late rock artists.
Why do people hate you?
Mostly for being gay. I can't help that either.
TASDisBACK plus, you get used to the pain in the end.
Yeah, I believe in hell: having to work a 6 hour shift at a job that stinks.
That's called real life.
When I was a kid I use to ask my mom If Abused Women Would go to hell. She said if they don't believe in God then yes.
Or What about people who never heard of it, What about people all over the world that did not know Jesus died on the cross.
My mom never could answer my Questions.
it addresses that in the bible xD! Google it btw plz don't get but hurt 4 me trying to help u out with this problem ;]
@@itachy4K what about the people who didnt hear about it in time before you pass?..what about babies...what about people on islands or parts of the world that has no way of hearing this like stranded somewhere or who cant see or read or hear....but a all loving god doesnt give a fuck right or didnt think about its like 3 billion or more people in this world
@@kennethcooper6383 tbh every religion has a different way of answering to that, but the thing is that some only argument that God knows and judges every person individually
My Mother told me that everyone at some point in their lives will be offered to hear the gospel and be given the choice.
If hell exists its probably full of legos in the floor
Exactly why is that so painful?
Lol
Lol I love legos
Spikes even.
I belive in hell, becuase we living in it.
That didn’t age well
Oh wow! I was such an edgy 15y/o! Holy shit.
This just a tip of the iceburg.
I do not believe in a Heaven nor in a Hell.
Why?
Heaven:
We don't need a place to when we die, no matter Christian or not. We can make our own Heaven in our lives, to usually think positive, keep our heads up, and not to let any bullies get to us.
Hell:
Who in the world wants to go to a place with eternal suffering and torture? NOBODY. And if God truly created a Hell, then I don't know why people call him all-knowing, kind, and forgiving when in fact he abuses this power to scare people into believing in him, otherwise Sir Red Wings with the horns and tail and pitchfork will be waiting for us.
What do I believe? Reincarnation.
Reincarnation is basically being born into a new life in my book. Why do I believe in this?
So we can fix the mistakes we've made. So we can live a life that we can make actually good if we try. I personally believe that you can have a choice on what you want to be born as. I want to be born as an Irish girl. It just seems awesome.
That’s an interesting thought. Do ya still believe in it?
There are so many scientists in hell that I'm sure it's air conditioned by now.
Hahaha
Dr.Gero
I believe in an afterlife, but not called heaven or hell. Life is too magical to just be a bunch of neurons, it must've come from somewhere, stay in a body, and go somewhere. Please no hate, I am not a science denier, just believe there is more to the universe(s).
exactly what i think. i think that there is a place where you go fix your problems which is hell and once you understand you go to spend an eternity with god in heaven.
Imabeatyouman That is also a good philosophy.
Oscaror S
thanks :) hope u learned from what i had to say. i honestly think i did from your comment.
^^ why i love being a floater in the case of religion
I think any eternal afterlife would suck ass tbh.. nonexistence is probably the least problematic solution, not like you're gonna miss life x3
Alexros Kalfanuc
just existing in a free state exploring the galaxy at 1 trillion miles per second
If satan want you to join him and fight against heaven, why would he torture his people? Pretty sure that's a contradiction,
Exactly my thoughts
No where in the Bible is it said that Satan is in hell. It says that he roams the earth causing trouble. Yes, it is said that God gave him a separate domain to rule over with the 1/3 of angels that sided with him, but it says nothing about Satan ruling hell. Don't get me wrong, I hate Christianity, but this is a bad argument.
yea i thought about that as well why would satan want to torture you since you are both against god you are kinda like nakama,allies
He tortures not for the reason that Satan has his followers rather Satan is torturing God's creation.
Like God cares in the first place. If you don't believe in him or praise him for the psychopath he is, you burn in hell.
the thing is, I want to belive in a life beyond this, and I want to have some greater being to look to, but I just can’t live with the fact that many of my friends and some of my family will have their guts ripped out, burned, and suffering for all of existence. This is so contradicting to me. I always feel, in the middle.
4:09 THANK YOU. FUCKING THANK YOU. I've wanted to hear this from another human being for I don't know how long. ANYONE who creates life, forces them to suffer for happiness, IN ORDER to make them warship YOU isn't worthy of that worship. HERE I MADE YOU SO THAT YOU WILL WORSHIP ME... Wtf?
I'm going to make a person, and give them a broken leg. Then I am going to tell them that if they limp while walking in front of me, the will suffer for eternity in hell... Why would I worship that?
One resolution god is a BABY
It is so simple but some humans like to think they are inferior to something, and religion gives some people a false sense of purpose. It makes you feel nice to be part of a grand scheme and be a "chosen people". Essentially religion is a mental crutch that allows people to keep functioning.
I personally believe in Purgatory rather than Hell. And for more than just not knowing about Jesus Christ or being homosexual. I believe that the more evil one is, the more time he will spend in there (sort of like a prison or rehabilitating a drug addict) before they will be sent to Heaven. This way, they'll have punishments for their wrong-doings, but not extreme punishments for extreme times. Hell just seems too... unjust.
***** Everyone has their opinions, and I respect yours. Have a nice day sir/ma'am.
I think that's a great idea. I don't personally think it exists, but it should.
And you place that believe on what? Fact? Or sentence examples from "holly book"? Or your own personal bull-shit?
blacksowa Really, it's just common sense. Would you rather ground your child/give him or her a spanking for doing something wrong? Or take him or her to the basement and light them on fire? So, I guess it would be in the "Personal Bull-Shit" category?
Trey Pehl No Heaven, no Hell, no Purgatory. Just death. Deal with it.
Excellent video. I never could wrap my mind around infinite punishment for a finite transgression. Heck, I don't understand sin, original or otherwise. As an abstract concept, why would Satan/Lucifer (Seth? Hades?) want to make hell a horrible place? Didn't the people sent there do bad deeds and should be rewarded for their evil behavior? If I was the dark lord, I would make it a paradise for sinners. Drinking, drugs, sex, and video games for eternity. Heaven, as in commonly accepted 'paradise' would probably be even worse. Who in their right mind would want to praise someone...forever. I am just glad when we are gone, that is it. I won't have to worry about it since my brain won't we working anymore and there is no soul.
You just described the Medranan hell. If you or whoever have / has no idea what I mean, than look up Hazbin Hotel Pilot.
What i ask myself: Can babies go to hell? Babies do not have a consciousness and cannot really think about anything, they cannot choose their faith on their own because they don´t understand anything and they are not responsible for their actions. But if all babies would go to heaven, it would be unfair for humans who haven´t died as babies, because the babies actually had the "luck" to die before they could even sin or choose the wrong faith and adults have the problem to have responsibility and to be judged.
If babies only go to heaven when they are baptised, it is kind of a matter of luck. A baby of a Muslim woman who dies after birth, would go to hell although the baby itself could not choose its faith on its own.
And if it matters whether a child is baptised, wouldn´t it actually be good to baptise children and immediately afterwards kill them, before they can sin or loose their faith?
Babies don't go to hell because hell doesn't exist, just like gods and eternal paradise and nirvana.
So parents should massacre their own children, so it is sure they will go to heaven. That's the message the bible is indirectly giving. I mean, who cares about this life, if there's eternal heaven right.
Lol, I derived it from this post: "Oh no, it clearly states in the bible that children are absolutely not allowed to go to hell."
Since, ppl either go to hell or heaven, children should automatically go to heaven. And why not? What's more innocent than a child.
Yes, it is sick to massacre children ofcourse, and I'm not implying anyone should. But technically you could draw the conclusion I just drew, which I found so ridiculous that it was amusing. I see it as yet another dent in certain religious beliefs. (You may have guessed I don't believe in any book or god).
As for abortion, I agree you rob a person of it's future life. Unless you believe in reïncarnation, which is nonsense in my honest opinion.
Faith is subjective. Som1's personal truth is subjective. However faith is based upon books (Bible/Qu'ran etc). And the books are claimed to be based upon "absolute truth". However there are scores of books and websites I read, that make perfect sense proving the Bible/Qu'ran to be incorrect/impossible in so many ways. Unless you pull out the "God's miracle/Only god knows" argument all the time. In that case, it is again your own faith and truth.
Imo "absolute truth" is something everyone must be able to agree on; science is able to show values and facts nobody can get around, hence providing a sort of "absolute truth".
And imo, lines need to be drawn when lives of others, and the life of our entire planet, are threatened.
I probably won't need to explain how religion has negatively influenced lives throughout history (exploiting populace all over Europe for money, inquisition slaughtering, jihads. crusades, extremists etc).
As for our planet, I've heard religious people claim this life is but our earthly life, a paradise awaits us and apocolypse will come. Hence we need not take such good care of this planet, as it God will destroy it anyway.
A serious line needs to be drawn when humans stop caring for earth, essentially bringing it's destruction closer themselves.
This may sound paranoid, but alarm bells are going off everywhere, as hundreds of plant and animal species go extinct all around us. Not to mention the explosive growth in human population. We are currently using 50% more resources our earth can produce. i.e. we need 1.5 an earth to provide for us. We are exhausting it, and it won't be long before we will be in trouble, especially if we cling to aforementioned religious beliefs.
You know you have become an adult when spankings sound sexual
"Hell as a place of eternal suffering is illogical"
You're right. Thats not taught in the Bible. The Bible says Hell is just our grave where we turn back to dirt and have no thoughts or pain.
There's no heaven; there's no shell; there's no God. Simple as that. (IMO)
I can't say I agree neither side has any proof. I choose to believe because its an emotion barrier. I can't say God is real I can't say hes not. But I choose to believe because I can.
Agreed. But "No Shell"? XD
Wozinak Im a turtle...that was very offencive young man.
***** Well duh i'm an idiot,i'm turtle dumbass. -.-
There is shell, I seen it with me own eyes.
I used to believe some sort of afterlife exists . But the angel I saw when I was 8, could've been an alien for all I know , or I'm mentally ill and not diagnosed.
Either way , I have learned that I have some sort of sleep disorder ( undiagnosed) which is why I see shit when I wake up in the middle of the night ( sleep paralysis?) my brain is still in R.E.M. Mode so it's prob just in my head lol
literally if you believe in god you're wasting your time
I refuse to believe in the existence of either Heaven or Hell, and am satisfied to say 'if they do exist, they are neither of our own dimension nor somewhere humans may ever access.
First, hell is just the country of the bogeymen; a scary place of villains to scare children into behaving and taken waaay too seriously.
For Heaven, it's just a way of tricking people into thinking doing good things means they can be happy forever. Sometimes it's twisted so far as for them to claim your soul becomes an angel - which it could never do - or that you'll be in God's realm.
Simple logic fail with heaven: why would the God who forsook all of humanity and eternally PUNISH them (multiple times) want to take these people and bring them into his own home?
Yeah, doesn't make sense.
Aperture Science = Hell
"Lets dive into the topic of hell,
Audible.com is a website hosted by Amazon"
"it dosn't make any logical sense" thats becuase your logic is limited to what god really is. To all of us, of course even to the most hard core christian, if they were to use "logic" then by the norm of course it dosn't make any sense. As christians, we do not understand god one bit but only the fact that he is perfect.
I mean religion really just comes down into if you believe it or not. And its also the peoples fault that the generalization of anyone going to christianity or a religion becomes a zombie and is void of logical thought becuase they think "magic" is all you need. But hey! People will believe what they want to believe. Unless you actually meet these individuals then you can pass their judgment on all of them, let alone the entire religion.
finally a decent comment here
Even if one of the thousands of religons is true good luck trying to find out which one it is
+Reuben Holland (RJH7) Actually that is not so complicated.
“The Ethiops say that their gods are flat-nosed and black,
While the Thracians say that theirs have blue eyes and red hair.
Yet if cattle or horses or lions had hands and could draw,
And could sculpt like men, then the horses would draw their gods
Like horses, and cattle like cattle; and each they would shape
Bodies of gods in the likeness, each kind, of their own.” - Xenophanes
A religion that promotes a God that has a definite form (finite)of something from the universe, like some animal, human or a combination of things (it is made of atoms), that has a beginning (beginnings require a cause)- bound by time and space, then it is not the absolute or the true God so the religion is not true.
Lol yea
+Danko9889 Like little kids arguing about which game is better lol
+Sir _ Jose xD so true
Islam duh
But *why* are we instantly "sinners"? Why do we have to feel such guilt over things that are completely natural to humanity? So a newborn, infant baby, a sweet little innocent thing, is automatically a sinner? Why don't we save the title of "sinner" to people who have actually done something wrong, like steal, rape, torture, murder, etc.?
RELIGIOUS INDOCTRINATION!!!
You are a sinner. I am a sinner. We denied the all good God and chose ourselves. Our world is the way it is now as a result. Unless you repent and turn away from your sins, the punishment is still going to happen, regardless of what you think or believe. You have no excuses. Read the Bible, the Lord has given humanity a guideline on how to live and a brief history of our lives. The end is drawing near, repent, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand. God loves you all, do not ignore His love! Deny Jesus & He will deny you in front of the Father! Shallom!
Troll or stupid? I guess if you're a Troll I can't trust your answer 😂
But psycopaths dont have That.
Bullshit, I was born a blank slate, as was everyone else. No infant is sinful. You have no evidence for your mortally repugnant claim.
Sara3346 If that were the case, we wouldn't have to teach children.
+Wun No, YOU are misrepresenting my argument entirely. The fact that we are blank slates is exactly why we must if their were inherent goodness and badness in the world and they were born shackled under a negative light than we would NOT have to teach such concepts. At all.
I also reccomend you watch his other videos "why I don't belive in heaven" and "why I lost my faith" in order to propperly understand his argument.
"All will be forgiven" So there must be no one in hell.
The reason I believe in hell is because where else would GAYSTATION users go when they die?
Skyguy Films Shots fucking fired...
+Deadlocked PlayStation. replace the play with gay
XBONER
WARNING Hell is real!
Prove it
I hope not lol
Dude how do you know outside the holy bible
Fact
I believe in hell and heaven simply to hold on to hope that i can meet my Papa and cousin Raven.
(yes i know this is flawed in many aspects)
I feel you dude I hate the fact we all die
I believe in heaven, but hell is a church made myth.
tobysoter Maybe not according to your bible but it does to mine.
SwordofManticorE
Are you Jewish? I heard Jews don't believe in hell but I'm not as familiar with it
Kijiji I am not jewish, I am a Christian. But not only did the jews not believe in a hell, the early Christian gentiles during the time of the apostles no longer believed in their pagan under world they called hades. As a matter of fact, the apostle Paul taught us all what God wanted us to know (Acts 20:27), but no where will you find in his letters does he warn the gentile Christians about hell or hell fire, and the reason why both jew and gentile did not believe in hell, is because it does not exist.
Ah ok, thanks for the info!
Kijiji You're welcome, now go spread the real good news.
"once your dead you shouldn't even be able to feel pain get sick or age cause your dead of course"
Thats actually what the Bible says hell and death is, believe it or not.
Reminds me of several quotes.
"The road to Hell is paved with good intentions." and "The devil is just one man with a plan, but evil, true evil is a collaboration of men."
I believe in a afterlife due to the fact that I don't want my life to just disappear and eventually be forgotten if I get hit by a car tomorrow that is why I believe in a afterlife.
The only time I've ever seen my father afraid, is when I tried to convince him that the afterlife and the soul are not real. He knows it, but he denies it because of his fear
You're right about "If you are only worshiping God because you don't want to be tortured, that's not love." But, we worship God, because he is good. We were created to worship. When I close my eyes and life my hands, I don't do it because I don't want to go to hell. I'm expressing my gratitude. God has shown me grace time after time. I worship God, because that's why I was created, but also because he's good. I could've died and went to hell, but he sent his son to die for me and you.
Christianity really fucked the whole concept up...
I fear death like nothing else. I fear not because of eternal torment in hell, but I fear it because of oblivion. I'd rather face hell, than have eternity pass by while I am unable to perceive it.
Dude don't fear the reaper just live life
I think that Christianity and going to hell is a very similar concept to those chain messages that tell you to send it to 10 other people or you die at 3am. When you think about it, it's absolutely just as ridiculous of an idea.
***** That second sentence was amusing. Technically... technically you are right, but it doesn't matter. They are still equivalent. Let's see...
Facts? So? Factual statements can be false. My shoes are blue -- that's a fact, but it's false. They are actually black. The message "Send this to 10 people or you will die at 3am" is a "fact." Also, the message "There is a sky daddy watching everything you do. If you don't worship him, he will send you to suffer for eternity" is also a "fact." Neither one is backed up by a shred of credibility, it's just that more people believe the second one. Haven't you ever noticed how Christians who are being honest say "faith" in Jesus? There is a very good reason for that.
Reason? You could call any type of thinking at all "reason," so that really doesn't mean anything either. For example, many people use circular reasoning to convince themselves of something, but it's still invalid reasoning. People can jump through hoops of reason to justify literally anything.
See? Both followers of the chain message and followers of Christianity can say their ideas are backed up by "facts" and "reason." They are still equivalent.
Mark 9:43 "unquenchable fires of hell"
Hell is translated from the words Sheol and Hades which just mean the grave.
So "Fires of hell" is just symbolic of eternal destruction in the grave.
When you burn something with fire it doesn't burn forever.
A fire can burn forever if you keep feeding it with something,
but what you feed it "with" doesn't burn forever, and in hell's case (the grave), its dead bodies.
I think if hell exists, it's not a "hell", just a better place than that stupid place called "heaven"
The Hebrew word for hell is Gehenna.
"Gehenna refers to the "Valley of Hinnon", which was a garbage dump outside of Jerusalem. It was a place where people burned their garbage and thus there was always a fire burning there. Bodies of those deemed to have died in sin without hope of salvation (such as people who committed suicide) were thrown there to be destroyed.
Gehenna is used in the New Testament as a metaphor for the final place of punishment for the wicked after the resurrection."
--wikipedia
Plus Jesus was Jewish and the Jewish don't believe in hell. Not to mention it's not in the bible, that is if you are going by KJV but it was added in after the endoctrine was well seeded into Christianity. Hell, Tartarus, or Hades is a Roman/Greek thing. Most of all it came from the misconception of the verses in Matthews which actually refers to a place called "Gehenna." It's a place were criminals and the sick were thrown to die and most often burned. Other than the actual word was a odd mistranslation of the word "Sheol" which is "grave." The same thing goes for the devil too.
I wish I would have found you when I was little and struggling with leaving Christianity. My dad would have and did freak out anytime I brought logic or real questions in a convo, I was “going to hell” and “ugly inside.” I felt immense guilt after masterbating, I felt scared for my non-believer friends as the church said they’d suffer eternally, yk just fucked up shit. Felt really alone for awhile until someone showed me being knowledge hungry, learning all you can about deep rooted subjects is more fulfilling than any religion.
yes~ doing good is more of an outside benefit.
you do good to others, without the thought of anything else, you are "deaf to everything but the song"
in a way, it's much more pleasant to spread the "song" when you give it "for free" rather than making it hard for them
the problem here is the misconception of that the core of the song is giving it for free
but in fact, is a song that's meant for one's well-being that's sounds like "giving free stuff"
In Eastern Orthodoxy I was never taught that hell is a physical place, but rather Heaven and Hell are the divine presence experienced either pleasantly or unpleasantly, depending upon one's spiritual condition. I was Eastern Orthodox for decades and there is much about it I really love, there is a lot of the Church I appreciate but I don't know that I could consider myself a 'believer' right now. It's hard to describe where I'm at right now it's like even though I don't feel as if I can honestly say that I'm a believer right now and that there are some basic aspects of the faith that I struggle with right now.... I find a lot of beauty and truth in the services and writings and will on occasion still attend Liturgy. I guess it's a cultural or familial connection that I continue to appreciate and value. I have my share of issues as I used to go regularly so I don't know but I like feeling and knowing that I have the freedom to believe or not believe whatever I chose to explore as I experience my own spiritual journey. One thing is for sure hypocrites and bad people exist everywhere there is nobody got the market cornered on that!
Matthew 25:46 "eternal punishment" doesn't necessarily mean eternal "torture"
There are many different types of punishment. This scripture contrasts "eternal punishment" with "everlasting life." The opposite of "life" is "death".
The Bible says death is just no thoughts or pain and we turn back to dirt.
Psalm 146:4; Ecclesiastes 9:5.
Some Bibles translate that as "eternal cutting-off" from life.
The only way one could be safe would be to day in an out worship every god ever just to be sure. We can live of off fear but as the dear Andrew Ryan says "A man chooses, a slave obeys." I will never be a slave to a religion because someone wants to strike the fear of god in my heart. I will choose my life and do so at my own will. Thank you for being so calm and nice in this discussion, it brings my hope back to humanity when people can have a talk rather than have a heated argument.
Whether you're Christian or atheist, SO many people have no clue how hell actually works. Most people haven't studied scripture enough to understand it.
A lot of people seem to reject the idea of hell because they think God willfully sends people there. That's NOT Christian teaching. Here's what no one seems to understand: God is completely holy, and cannot even be in the presence of anything that is impure / unholy. We see this all throughout the Old Testament. When you sin, you become impure and therefore cannot be in God's presence. That was the whole purpose of Jesus sacrificing himself, it was to SAVE people from hell, not send them there.
If you don't believe me, John 3:17 literally states: "For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him." That's the whole reason Jesus died on the cross.
I think we can all agree Mary cheated on Joseph because she didn't wanna have sex with him and to prevent her from being seen as someone who committed adultery she just played dumb and said she was still a virgin. Somebody make a time machine and have Maury do a throw back episode to the old days.
Joseph you are not the father
Well, this brings back nostalgia.
Atheists aren't changing theology at all. I've been told by many christians that you get into heaven by being good, some others say good and believe, others say just believe and be sorry.
It's ridiculous and should only be for being good and being sorry for any bad acts. I don't believe in heaven or hell at all but that's what it should be if they existed.
I never grew up in the church,knew nothing about christianity up until 2009 when i met christians here on you tube,after a year and a half of being with them ,things started happening in the house.Over the past 3 years i have seen,heard and felt the supernatural.You have to be BORN AGAIN,by water and spirit.Going to church does not save you.I stay away from church,church is full of religion.
Non believers: should not be tortured forever
Sinners: STILL SHOULD NOT BE TORTURED FOREVER
God pretty much willed him to be that way, though. In the show Supernatural, with a heavy God/Satan theme a number of it's seasons, it brings up a good point. All humans are monitored, their fates are chosen, their decisions and choices are generally chosen for them beforehand. Lucifer and Micheal go to battle during Armageddon, and Lucifer angrily states, "Why would you continue to serve him and punish me for what he did to me? He made me this way, and you want to kill me for it?" basically.
Another disgusting thing is that as far as i'm aware if a baby dies before being baptized he goes to hell too.
its not about religion. if you're a bad person and harm others, if you do something bad and you know its bad. you know you shouldn't have done that.. you will automatically suffer when you die. hell or heaven applies to you when you die. its something that automatically happens.
One other thing thats odd about hell is that Christians say that satan makes you do bad things, so if you did go to "hell" wouldn't he reward you for joining the darkness instead of being good?
What greater immorality is there than torturing (or even allowing, while being an omnipotent, omniscient being, the torture of) somebody forever?
The notion that anybody could be legitimately judged as immoral & deserving of victimisation by the same entity who perpetuates the ultimate conceivable immorality is entirely nonsensical.
I already answered it for you - If someone came up to you and asked you that you were to be punished for not believing EXACTLY as they do, then you would be instantly repulsed by that notion, instantly. You certainly would not be convinced to convert to their religion or start believing as they do.
This doesn't even have to be about religion - I just asked how you would feel if someone said you were going to be punished for not believing as they do, whatever it may be.
I do not believe hell exists as a destination after death. But i do believe that hell exists as the collection of regrets, mistakes, etc. that you can not forgive yourself for, which you will be dragging with you for the rest of your life.
As a Christian I want to say you are correct young man. God is a god of love and mercy not a dictator saying "I love you but if you don't love me back I'm going to throw you in hell for eternity." God is not Hitler.
Hell only should logically exist for two purposes: To deter future behavior, or to keep people in line. It can't deter future behavior because it's eternity, and if you want to keep people in line, just tell them that hell exists and then send everyone to heaven. There you go! No one sins, and no one is punished.
gosh, heaven seems like a painful place, yes, i mean heaven. knowing people are suffering for eternity, receiving awful torture, even if i am living in paradise, i still wouldnt like the idea that people are burning and rotting in hell.
The main reason I don't believe in hell is because I don't believe in afterlife. When I was a kid both the concept of finitude and the concept of eternity were kind of scary. Finitude (no afterlife) is still scary but it does not make sense my mental process functioning without my physical brain, so uncomfortable as it be, there is no afterlife ergo there is no hell.
"Our faith should be expressed in working toward a better planet for our children and not the selfish, juvenile hope for a better afterlife for ourselves. I don't think anyone is going to Hell because it only exists in the minds of people who wish ill-will on others." - Dr Greg Graffin, singer and lyricist of Bad Religion, author and professor of life science at UCLA
FYI I am a catholic, but I still am open to knoledge outside the bible :) and I agree that people should think for themselves. In my opinion I think God is upset at people for making up the hell concept that cause many to fear him instead of loving him.
According to the bible, and MANY Christians I happen to know, if you aren't a Christian, but still do good deeds, You still go to hell, despite having been a good man, that cannot be right.
It genuinely is 'Worship Me or It's Torture For You!', because if you don't believe in Jesus, God or any of that, you will not go to heaven, even if you have done good deeds all of your life.
And I hardly think that's fair.
there's one thing i never got about hell too: say two people lived and did the exact same sinful things in their lives - they were both as bad as each other. but person a dies first, and person b dies 2 weeks later. and the two of them, if hell is real, would spend an eternity in hell. but that isn't really fair on person a - despite the fact that they were just as sinful as each other, no matter what, person a would always have experienced 2 more weeks of torture than person b had.
The concept of hell is what drew me away from religion. It's horrible and any person who can believe that other human beings deserve an eternity or torture just because they don't believe the same things are just either evil or haven't thought it through. A loving god would not have created such a horrible thing... that is sadistic.
Tons of Christians have uploaded videos claiming they had visions where they were shown hell. And some say they had outer body experiences where they were supposedly taken to hell, only for Jesus to eventually show up to tell them to believe in him or they'll end up there. They are 100% convinced this was real. I told Christians that people of other faiths and of no faith have had these sorts of experiences, and have said that they were met by beings that only showed them love and acceptance and never at all ever gave them the 'believe or else' ultimatum. In response, the Christians say that those people are being tricked by the devil to think there is no hell. I've asked Christians how then do they know they're not being deceived also. They say because they have this personal relationship with God and that their experience didn't conflict with the bible. They expect me to trust a deity that threatens me with violence if I don’t believe in it. They would rather trust a deity that approaches them with force and threats and then they call it love. And they say those who experienced love were deceived by Satan.
My biggest problem with these "visions" people have of Jesus and hell itself is that people have religious dreams almost all the time. It's natural to have a dream about your religion if you care about it enough. It's rather difficult to take seriously sometimes
I had the same bullshit dream when I was 6 years old of Jesus Telling me I'll never be worthy of him and Accepted into the gates. That's pretty traumatizing for a six year old and I questioned Christianity after that
@@JoshLocWitDaJokeZ About 20 years ago, I once had a dream where a handed Jesus a glass of water on a hot day, but when Jesus took the glass, he said to me aggressively, "Whats this? WHAT'S THIS?" Then he splashed all the water at me. I wonder if Christians would say this was a deserved rebuke from Jesus or if they'd say it was the devil disguised as Jesus. But perhaps the dream was a warning that this Jesus character is very bad man.
So, the problem I have with this "there was nothing but unconditional love" narrative is then what does this life even matter for? If a society believes this then morals have no value because none of our actions have consequences. Who is to say that, raping and murdering is wrong then? Surely you'll see the light of unconditional love even if you commit these things!!! It was just a prank bro!! 😉
You are insanely intelligent. Your vocabulary , you mind, your thoughts.
The biggest mistake you made from the very beginning was basing your argument on Christian beliefs .. but Christians aren't the only ones who believe in hell and don't have a monopoly on doctrine surrounding the criteria of earning a ticket to hell either
to a dead man, who can no longer process any information any further
the last state he's in, is called "infinite".
doesn’t make sense like, if our soul goes to hell, then why are we going to “feel pain” if it’s our soul and not our nervous system
Technically if a person is born, when they are baptized, regardless of what sin they did or did not commit, I don't necessarily see how they are a sinful person. There was a girl at my Catholic school who was one of the sweetest girls, but she was not baptized until around when I was in third or fourth grade. If she is a nice person, but not baptized, does that mean she is an evil, sinful person not worthy of God's forgiveness? No! God will still accept her, God is still forgiving. God is not commanding us to worship him, but I don't understand why people say that he is, um, HELLO PEOPLE!!!! He gave us choice! If God was commanding us to worship him, everyone on Earth would be Christian, but we're not as you can so plainly see. Look, I believe in God, and I will be tolerant of anyone who has a different religion, or is an athiest, but I do not appreciate ANYONE saying that God commands us to worship him and anyone who doesn't is an evil, awful person. He also gave us morality, someone could have a completely different religion, or be athiestic, but could be an extremely nice person, as I touched upon, God is forgiving, and you won't go to hell because you simply don't believe in God, or have a different religion. The way I see it, theistic, or athiestic, if you are a kind, loving person, you will enter the kingdom of God. God is forgiving, just saying. And don't come to me with that "If God was real, why does he let his people suffer?", because God is trying to test us, if nothing bad ever happened to anyone, how would we learn from bad things, we would just continue to do bad things. Another thing that I hear a lot of people say is "If God existed, why does he let good things happen to bad people?", first off, HE DOESN'T! Second off, in a movie I recently saw, a woman says that good things happen to bad people because the devil allows it to happen so people do not turn to forgiveness or morality, therefore allowing more people to enter the kingdom of heaven. I see your points, I tolerate them, and I pray for you.
the only hell that exists , is real life
If we submit a sinner (who is no more than a religious criminal) to endless, eternal suffering, absolutely no good will come of that. Even when he repents for his sins (and he eventually will), nothing will happen. He will still be suffering. That makes Hell essentially pointless aside from being a sadist's playground..
"Atheism (being a non theist) offers nothing?"
I mean nothing after death and a hope for the future,
so if you refuse to believe in that stuff, then have fun.
Peace.
Have fun waiting. Make sure you packed lots of food and oil for that 200 year old lamp.
I agree with you. There are three anime's that have demons Supernatural, Black Butler, and Devil May Cry.
+Hannah Cooper
the way i've heard it explained is that babies carry the sin of their parents and ancestors and to cleanse that person of their sins they need to be baptised
My main problem? Some people completely lack the ability to be decent people, often from birth. If there's a hell, than one of two things are true: there are innocent newborns out there who are already hell-bound, or we must take every word in the Bible, however inhumane, as absolute fact.
"his namesakes did better then anyone at invalidating ignoring and violating those words."
I agree, I'm one of Jehovah's witnesses and we've have been trying to restore Christianity back to the way it was suppose to be.
We refuse to go to war and kill any other human. We treat everyone equally and impartially. We have brothers and sisters in almost every country now, and not one of us will ever take up arms against another human or country or government.
Don't worry, he failed anyway. Although I'd say it was a good representation of a Christian. He failed to substantiate his ridiculous beliefs almost perfectly.
"If anyone thinks he is religious and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his heart, this person's religion is worthless." James 1:26
I believe in Heaven. I was treated by my friend to eat all the sushi and rolls that I can eat. I went to hell right after because I got constipated.
Ok, you earn a like
The grave or not it still talks about the people going there and burning eternally in fire. As for the destruction of Jerusalem again this doesn't matter it's still speaking of God taking people and having them tortured for eternity.
I agree it was likely used as a scare tactic... it still teaches that. I mean for heavens sake the first verse I linked literally says eternal punishment. (note also that I only linked a short few of the verses saying this, I can gladly provide more).
while punching someone in the face to teach them "life's lesson" can only be half as effective.
along while ago i told my mom i dont really want to belive in god and she out right told me if i dont im going to hell and ive been scared ever since i have mixed feelings on what i should do.
Zidabrine Don't believe her
Convert to Islam, see if she can back it up.
That's like saying "I created my children, I can do whatever I want to them. They deserve to be abused."
Actually the whole context of looking at a woman lustfully was adultery. Meaning that if you look at a married woman lustfully then that's adultery. What Christians do is to take that whole verse out of context and change lust itself into a sin, creating all new sins in the process (their favorite pastime). When they do this they are changing the very definition of sin from something that god doesn’t like to something that they don’t like.
BTW I made god with a lower case g on purpose.
"when I read scripture it always talks of life and death never eternal torture."
So that should tell you that what you're being taught about Hell is wrong.
I'm sure you've read these scriptures: Revelation 20:13-14
Death and Hell get thrown into the "lake of fire" showing they will be destroyed someday, so hell is not eternal. When anything is burn it doesn't burn forever. Hell is just our grave (Sheol and Hades) from which everyone will be brought back to life on earth. Psalm 37:29; Acts 24:15
god forgives people,, the devil punishes bad people,, who is the good guy??
andrew barrington that makes no sense, if he forgave people why would they get sent to hell in the bible? LOL so much contradiction from you religious types.
*****
Why can't evil humans get enjoyment in hell torturing etc. other "sinner" people then? What is a demon? Why does nothing you believe make any sense?
*****
Oh, fair enough. Same as me, continue :P
Mikune Folf im not religious man,, but its true, aslong as you believe in god you can do what you wont and its cool, but if you dont believe and are a good person you go to hell, its all backwards,, atheist all the way,,