Let's Talk About Love Triangles in YA Fantasy | book rant and review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ต.ค. 2020
- Hi everyone, after a YA fantasy series seriously messed with my emotions, I want to chat with you about the love triangle trope. I'm not going to be super critical (but with some of these perhaps we should be...) so pls don't take this too seriously. Just some guilty pleasure fun. Sending you love!
Mentioned:
3:16 - 7:16, 16:07 - 17:22 The Black Witch - tidd.ly/3oCcq1K
7:16 - 9:11 Throne of Glass - tidd.ly/2HMH1ZA
9:12 - 11:00 The Mortal Instruments - tidd.ly/328ZoPJ
9:12 - 12:48 The Infernal Devices - tidd.ly/3ecS5Lt
12:55 - 13:09 The Hunger Games - tidd.ly/35E3hwO
13:09 - 13:57 A Court of Thorns and Roses - tidd.ly/34AGnqM
13:57 - 14:08 Twilight - tidd.ly/2HJMW1r
14:08 - 16:07 Red Queen - tidd.ly/2TBg5yt
Funny Goodreads review (major The Black Withc Spoilers!!!) bit.ly/3mzrOds
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Let's Talk About Love Triangles in YA Fantasy | book rant and review
** just posted a shadowhunters-inspired music playlist for your listening pleasure lol**
th-cam.com/video/WH_Z5KEWbCw/w-d-xo.html
*This is the Infernal Devices Spoiler Section. Open at your own risk!*
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So, how would you end it? Did you like the epilogue/glimpse of the future we got? What should have happened to Jem?
I’ve never cried more in my life then when tessa describes that she slowly forgot the exact blue of will's eyes....so hum i wouldn’t change it, it’s literally the only perfect ending ever
ughhh , honestly those books broke my young heart I don't even think adult me can reread it , the end was just meh I personally found it lazy of her to give us such a vanilla ending were "everyone got a happy ending" when she made us suffer so much through those books !! like Tessa just pick one you can't get everyone. I'll take care of Will thanks
@@ninna12tw lmao right? i'll take one of them off your hands!!
@@MariaNeves-pw9lb even just reading this comment my heart is like NO :''''(
I loved the way it ended. Perfect for the story and OCEAN OF TEARS AT THE EPILOGUE
The only love triangle I will ever accept is will Tessa and jem
amen
yep, I hate love triangles but this one... gosh it touches my heart
I second this. I finished the series.
i was into the story for a month after finishing TID
Which book is that? :)
I didn’t even realize there was a love triangle in the hunger games until other people said there was cause Gale was just never an option???? Honestly to Katniss Peeta wasn’t even an option half the time 😂 the movies really played that up lol
lmao right?!
Katniss was so obvious to the effect she had on others. She did say to Gale that when they were free things might be different for them but then she was in the next hunger games with Peeta trying to save him. He died...and she completely lost her mind and almost shot Finnick with an arrow. When he started breathing again and she hugged him my heart fluttered not gunna lie like...I know he almost died but her reaction was so filled with relatable love
Katnip was too focused on surviving. Strong independent woman ain’t need no man.
HAHAH FR
Because its not, it must be some weird you need in ya a love triangle as selling point, and play that up, when she never wanted, and nevr really di, just a good friend with a crush on her. At least i like to think that.
Yeah Infernal Devices hit different because of the parabatai stuff; makes Will and Jem also loves and want the best of eachother and UGH even Cassandra Clare herself can't recreate that kind of SUFFERING ever again
lmao she really hurt us in all the ways hahaha
“ Cassandra Clare can’t recreate that kind of suffering ever again” * *the last hours looms over, clothed in darkness* * * *cue menacing laughter* *
@@solorespira7880 lol...so true 🤣
i know i cryed for like the last 10 chapters of clockwork princess
@@ninaclaire370 same 😭 i also cried on reading about will's death i refuse to believe he died 😭
my only problem with love triangles in books is that the whole time im just asking myself why dont they all just date eachother. like live the polyamory life babe.
I think that too.
Cassie Clare delivered that in the dark artifices... 😊😊😊
Because most people don’t want to share their SO with anyone else and want an exclusive relationship.
I like to think that the infernal devices is a polyamory story
But the love triangle includes brothers...
Sooooo...
SWeAt hOmE AlAbAmA
the whole “love triangle” trope is wrong because apparently people don’t know what a triangle looks like. it has three sides so there is a connection between all three points. so a love triangle would mean that there are three people who all at some point like each other. what most people are talking about isn’t a triangle, it’s just an angle. one point is connected to two others, that aren’t necessarily connected to each other.
Alsio to steal from crazy ex girlriend, it has multiple center.
Exactly. Basically, love triangles are inherently LGBT, lol. If there is no LGBT element, that ain't no triangle. Just an angle. Or an arrow.
Most “live triangles” are just female protagonists backed into a live corner
@@jessicaprice6565 I disagree slightly with this, because I believe there are a few exceptions to this "rule". For ex, The Infernal Devices by Cassandra Clare, the love triangle is a triangle, but the two male love interests don't love each other in a romantic way, they love each other in a brotherly way because they are bonded for life so they have a bigger conexion and love than the two of them with the girl that they are both in-love with. The two men loving each other is not romantic (because since they are bonded for life by a magical rune they can't fall for each other), but it is love nonetheless and it is a love triangle because the three parts involved are connected.
i dont think its that deep also the connection to two points of a triangle doesnt need to be romantic necessarily its still a connection
Throne of Glass was more like a love conveyor belt TBH. Sam, wait I want Dorian, never mind gimme Chaol. Oh my gosh, is that a Rowan I see coming this way!
This is completely true.
It was basically “Male character introduced = love interest!” There was one moment where I was genuinely concerned that Maas was setting Celaena/Aelin up with her own cousin
Bahahaha i did get the whole... that was caelena the assasin and then caelena trying to be a normal girl with chaol and then her finding herself and her true mate rowan through big struggle
Honestly I thought that ToG subverted a lot of common and in my opinion, kind of boring YA romance tropes. In hunger games, Katniss marries a guy she started dating when she was a teenager. In infernal devices and mortal instruments the protagonist marries a man she started dating as a teenager. So many YA protagonists marry men they started dating when they were children. I don’t know about any of you but I did not marry the first guy I kissed. Aelin was with Sam, the only true friend she’s ever had, when she was forced to pretend to be someone else in order to survive. His death marks when Celaena must die too. She is struck by how hot Dorian is but never has romantic feelings for him and that’s pretty realistic for a teenager exploring her sexuality. Chaol is who she’s with when she’s still clinging to the ghost of Celaena and denying who she really is. Through her friendship with Rowen, Aelin is for the first time in her life able to properly mourn the deaths of her parents, Sam, Nehemia, and the death of Celaena. When she has accepted the woman she must become she loves the man who has always seen her as as the person she has always been and helped her accept that. And it’s not until she’s a mature adult that she begins a relationship with the man she was meant to be with. I find that representation of romance preferable to insta-love that lasts forever. Plus, there are plenty of male characters that are never love interests- Wren, Nox, Aedion, Rolph, the entire Cadre, and her relationship with Fenrys in particular is purely platonic but so meaningful. Nah it’s not a conveyer belt, it’s the only series I’ve read that even remotely resembles my love life.
@@missanthropy6174 wow I didn’t realize how truly I felt seen in that aspect through aelin until I read this, thank you for expressing it! ❤
When i was younger i used to think that Will, Jem and Tessa was a well done love triangle, but now that i am older for me they're not a love triangle at all. First there's no dispute between them to see who will end up with tessa. Second Tessa wasn't unsure of who she loved, she loved both of them in different moments of her life. Third most of authors put a rivalry between the two male characters or make them in different sides or friends betraying friends to get the girl, but Will and Jem loved each other more than they loved Tessa.
See, my thing is that, that’s how a love triangle is supposed to be. For it to be a love triangle, really the main character should like both of them and want to be with both of them. In Twilight, Bella only ever truly wanted Jacob. In The Hunger Games, Katniss didn’t really like either of the boys. She’s kind of with Peeta at the end because he’s the last guy standing. Not saying this was a good one, because some of the events are a little iffy for me, but it is more of a proper love triangle than most others.
@@samkathryn4825 same! agree100% After TID all other triangles didn't compare because they were never really triangles. We always knew who the heroine would choose there is never a debate or doubt. Basically the other guys is just around as a nuisance and in some poor cases as a way to show the reader how a boy you like should behave vs the boy who give you nothing but headaches but you should love him anyways cause your invested😵 (sorry I've had a couple really bad heroes lately).
For me now a love triangle has to make me believe that both boys have a shot to the point that I would rather see one of them did instead of suffer alone in life. if not there are other conflicts that can be written into a story where the hero doesn't have to become a douche at any point in the relationship
@@samkathryn4825 You really didnt understand katniss. She loved Peter but its only coz she is an independent person & didnt like relying on guys. Also she had a mission & boys were really the last thing she thought about.
I tell you if she didn't love Peter, she would never have chosen him or ended up with him at all.
@@loustat4037 I understood her; the point I was trying to make (though, I admit, I didn’t do a great job doing so) is that it wasn’t a love triangle. For one, Katniss wasn’t super invested. Until the end, she just went along with Gale and kind of used Peeta (which, granted, she has to). The romance wasn’t the point of the story, but a lot of people hold it up like it’s this great love triangle with Team Peeta and Team Gale. Honestly, it wasn’t the point of the story, and Katniss wasn’t invested enough to make it engaging (for me, at least).
Of course, we can respectfully disagree as to how the execution worked out, but I feel I understand Katniss; I just wasn’t a huge fan of the story and her passiveness in the supposed triangle.
They actually loved Tessa more, but their brotherLy bond was too strong to break for love
The love triangle trope is frustrating. However, I don't think it's the trope itself, it's just down to how well done it is. (And it rarely is done well). I personally love the triangle in the infernal devices. Both potential love interests are well developed and it isn't super obvious who the author prefers. The plot is super interesting on its own and the yearning from the love triangle just elevate it. Also I adore how everyone in that triangle cares deeply about the other two people and just makes it so much more a n g s t y✨ and I love it.
Exactly 😭🙏🙏🙏
True 😭
dude I heard the Hunger Games and went "wait when was there ever a love triangle in that lmao" and *that's* how much Gale means to me
I never considered Throne of Glass a love triangle series. the first book is love triangel-ish with Dorian and Chaol but once Rowan enters the scene there are no options. I liked the realism of having multiple loves and finding the person that's right for you at different stages of your life. Honestly (though i ADORE Rowan and Aelin) I believe a lot of people, including myself, believe ToG is better than ACoTaR because it has a more well rounded, action packed plot, where as ACoTaR is more focused on the romance side of things.
infernal devices' love triangle still haunts me and it's been like 6 years since i've read it. i also picked sides and felt bad about it because i liked both boys, but because of the side i picked, i was able to live happily with the ending lmaooo
*INFERNAL DEVICES SPOILERS*
lmao i'm really really satisfied with the ending but the only other ending i would've wanted is for the three of them to be in a poly relationship (wanted that at age 14 and still at age 24 lmao)
i don't think i picked a side but i was always more jem leaning (i re-read the series last month and will was awful to her for two whole books and didn't talk to her for the first half of the last book) and i'm glad for the additional material we got about jem/tessa's life (after the bridge, ghosts of the shadow market) post-TID.
but i think the ending was perfect for the story. i loved tessa's life with will was very different to her life with jem in a way that kind of mirrored how she loved them both but it was never a competition between the two. i also love how she contrasted jem not wanting to be a shadowhunter without will and will needing to be a shadowhunter to cope with losing jem. will was tessa's firsts in a lot of ways (two kids figuring it out) whereas her relationship with jem feels very adult (with maturity that comes from both of them being over a century old) and beautifully captures the ebb and flow of feelings over a long period of time.
i feel CC wrote TID to be quite will leaning in that will was perfect for the 1800s tessa but jem's perfect for the 2000s tessa (the tessa that came into her own after the death of her first husband).
i love how you explained this omggg
OMG, I COULDN'T AGREE MORE
You put it really well, i also loved the ending :)) it was rlly nice
you wrote this perfectly and the last bit is correct, CC said herself that will fit younger tessa more whereas jem fits older tessa more as they've both lived through so many things that only the other could understand. she said she wrote will to be tessa's first love because she always knew jem would be tessa's last. and that fucking kills me honestly but reading about jem and tessa's life in cirenworth with the happiness they always deserved and suffered so long for softens the blow of how much they've lost. ugh tid will always be the most special to me !!!
I totally agree with you,they should’ve been polyamorous
I honestly really loved the Red Queen series, it got me back into reading more often after a long time of not really reading for fun (but a lot for university). It's an easy read and got a lot of plot twists and characters and a constantly expanding world and I love a well-built world. I actually liked Mare in the beginning and liked her less and less as the series progressed, but you do get to meet a lot of other cool characters who you can love or hate.
Normally I am all for character-driven stories but this is just not one of those. I think the strong world-building got me hooked, I loved getting lost in this world, even if it has mostly one-dimensional characters, so this is something to keep in mind. It has a lot of twists and characters you are yet to meet and maybe love more.
yeah i think thats what is hard for me is i really wanted to love Mare and as the series progressed i was just so tired of her :( i need a book only about Shade :'(
I really disliked the entire red queen series. Mare was awful.
I loved the series, but nearly everyone was more likable than Mare lol. She got better in like, the 4th book, but I loved all of the other characters more. Evangeline was my personal favorite followed by Shade and Farley. I was also hoping there would be more to Iris, but there wasn’t. And Cal? I wanted to punch him more than half the time. The world itself was really well-built and cool though. Some plot points seemed like THG and Divergent. But, all in all, the series was quite good.
i agree!! i disliked her the further i read, but i loved cal and was invested in shade and farley as well as evangeline so i kept going
SPOILER
What I love most about this love triangle it's how it ended. How it should be. Everyone alone. I just love Maven, and I really love the decision of made him beyond redemption, she would ruin him if he could be saved. I think Cal would end up well with Mare because they're both kind of boring, but I think she did the best choice, and I've never read anything YA that the protagonist decided to be by herself just because she wanted.
The infernal devices is the BEST love triangle ever. Both the love interests are so well developed. And I’m in love with both of them 😭
YES
ME TOO
Same bahahah
I love Peeta too, but upon rewatching The Hunger Games now that I'm in my 20s, I realized that Peeta felt like a one-dimensional character whose whole world became Katniss. Still, he's a better character than Gale. Hahaha
LOL!
Yes! Lol I actually read the series in my early 20s before the movies came out but I remember feeling just the same. The author built up Peeta to have these great qualities that could contrast and support Katniss's strengths/weakness.. his artistry, likeability, empathy, ability to speak to a crowd and inspire others.. yet all of that was completely wasted. (Same with Gale to a smaller extent but Peeta was my favorite so we're sticking with him lol). The whole time I thought Suzanne Collins was eventually going to use him as a mouthpiece for the movement, challenging the opinions of Capitol citizens, and even more so after he got captured, I was hoping to see his talents become slowly corrupted. But no, he just goes crazy and becomes an inconvenient ball and chain for the rest of the book until the happy resolution.
Oh, and he cake decorates himself into a tree once. Yay, payoff. -_-
I think that’s what put Katniss off. He’s really nice and there is a sense of like “Peeta earned it” he’s nice enough he’s a good person he loves her. But like Katniss was not emotionally developed enough to reciprocate any of that she couldn’t rush that part of herself and the problem of the series is that she just never overcame it. She’s still in this like arrested developement romantically. She acts more aromantic pressured into a romance to side step a romance trope. Idk it’s trying to be like deterministic about romance while also criticizing it but never comes up with a happy resolution. I think it’s trying to reflect like survivors of war relationships where people are together out of survival and social expectation it’s deeply trauma based and not like the freedom of love.
I never liked him because he was so flat.. his entire focus was Katniss and I never felt she could reciprocate that
Both Peeta and Gale are pretty dull compared to Katniss. She was too busy trying to stay alive to worry about boys. It would've been great to see more of Peeta, let him be a complex person too, not just the pretty blonde boy who is obsessed with Katniss. He really only exists to say a couple shocking lines and pine.
Honestly, YA novels tend to depend entirely too much on a character making one person their entire identity. Take a deep breath, female lead. You don't have to choose the love of your life at 16. Calm down.
The Infernal Devices does not feel like a love triangle, which is why I love it 😭😭😭
just my personal opinion but i HATE love triangles😭just let my OTP go through OTHER obstacles, anything but wavering love interest when you know who the winner (and better person) will be, i cant do with it😾but i will say... some love triangles can be more interesting for me when the main character is less "can't decide who i love" and more "fk it ill do what i want and see who treats me better"
bahahahahhahahhahah
literally sameeeee
I think SoC got me into the fantasy genre simply because there wasn't any relationship drama, just solid friendship, loyalty, and bravery.
Yesssssss!!!
What’s SoC?? I wanna read it!!👀👀
@@aureliegedeon1551 Six of Crows duology by Leigh Bardugo!
yes, omg! those are my favorite books. I like the relationships and I'm glad they were there, but they didn't drown out the other (better) parts of the story
There was actually a lot of relationship drama in there.
But hey that's just my opinion.
the infernal devices was so wonderfully written i’m still not over it. i wholeheartedly believe in herongreystairs. it was never a competition to win tessa’s affection and she was never forced to choose. the three had so much love for each other i lose it. james and mina exemplify that.
When I saw the thumbnail I screamed because I read all 3 of the series in the picture lol. I hope you can see now why a handful of us were so passionately recommending the Infernal Devices trilogy. Will Herondale forever.
Amen 😭🙏
Finally someone who don't really liked Katniss! This was the exactly reason why I couldn't be so into this triangle.
Yeah 😞😞😞
@@caricanread why don't you like katniss
Honestly, I got so done with Love Triangles that I started reading Reverse Harem, where this is not an issue because it's perfectly fine for the girl to end up with multiple guys at the end. And you know what?
I regret nothing. I've never been as happy reading.
Giving k-dramas as an example is the most perfect way to make me understand the frustration :D
I really hate the Red Queen series. The first book was good but the other books just got worse and worse, I couldn’t even read the whole thing.
Also #teampeeta
yeah im struggling to get through the second one rn now >:(
I read the wiki page to know what happens in the end and I am glad to not waste any time reading it. Sorry, if there are any fans who reads this comment. It's not my jam.
I dont remember reading the last one, but I did so I kind of re read the end and I just shut the book and im trying to forget it again hahahahha
LOL, I couldn't get past book one. As soon as the pacing slowed down, around 70%, I dropped it. Read spoilers and, honestly, not worth my time. Still annoyed about it to this day...
Pfffft there is only team Peeta. Gale doesn't get a team. XD (I mean personally I think Liam Hemsworth was better looking but looks aren't all you should base a relationship on).
This was fun but I need a spoiler version so I can grab some popcorn and hear all the tea with your unfiltered opinion!
I literally cried my eyes out while reading infernal devices cause I LOOOOOOVEEE Jem, but I also love Will and it's just the worst and best love triangle of all time. I think Cassandra Clare did a good job with the ending cause we all would have been devastated if one guy got the girl and the other was just alone (and he also would have to see his best friend with the love of his life every day). That does not mean however that I'm 100% happy with the ending. I guess I feel the same way you do, I kinda don't know how to feel about it....
right?! i think she chose a good ending but i wish there was another way :')
Infernal Devices!!! yeassssss the first ever book that I literally cried T_T
Literally heart wrenching
"But still makes your heart BABOOM" so relatable
💯🤯
****TOG SPOILERS AHEAD: i lovelovelove the throne of glass series but i know it's definitely a lotttt haha. celaena/aelin is supposed to be kind of a serial dater. she doesn't give a shit and she basically does whatever she wants until she meets rowan (swoon) and he literally steals her whole heart and soul. but yeah the first couple books are very busy with the romatic drama! also side note, i love that you love the black witch series as much as i do!!! such a good series and the first book did NOT deserve all of the hate it got!
i was so wary of rowan because i figured he was another guy she'd just drop so i felt like i couldnt trust him/their feelings hahaha the book gave me trust issues!!!
Oh, you can DEF trust the romance with Rowan once it starts.
hi as a person who loves the red queen series, i appreciate your insight but of course i have my own thoughts about it as well. in my opinion, the love triangle shows the delineation between healthy and toxic relationships, and the impact of their choices. mare could've easily joined maven, because both of them knew what it was like to not be good enough. but she didn't - why? well because she values her wellbeing. if she embraced the darkness like maven did, she would also turn into a monster and shut out the people who loved her (glass sword gives a glimpse of this). maven emotionally traps mare by disguising his faults for how much he understands her. honestly i'm tired of the media portraying toxic and abusive relationships where the girl has to sacrifice her wellbeing just to be with a guy who supposedly loves and understands her. and then there's cal, the contrast of maven and his relationship with mare. cal actually respects mare's choices, views her as an equal and offers help only when she truly needs it - there are explicit parts in the books that pay attention to his treatment towards mare. idk if this changes how you feel towards these books (honestly it doesn't matter 'cause we should all respect the opinions of others), but i just wanted to offer my perspective.
@HAFSA NASEER Shade deserved better. Like, way better.
I didn’t like Cal or Maven much, mainly because Maven was toxic, and Cal was incapable of making a choice. But, I really loved the ending because Mare decided to take some time off for herself, which is not very common in novels. I honestly ship Mare with no one (except maybe therapy) lol.
@@luuuuux_ who's shade again long time since I've read the series. Bdw i loved Mave in the beginning she was really just trying her best and thought that everything she did was genuinely good and with her circumstances she did great but as the serie went on you or at least I really saw her losing the meaning between good and evil.
@@iamtired3527 mare was very likable at the starting but got very insufferable and filled with a sense of her own self-importance in the second book. Shade was Mare’s brother. The one who was told as dead but then was actually alive and then who actually died while saving Mare from Ptolemus in the 2nd book.
"All of you who said its better than ACOTAR"
YESSSSS IM GLAD SOME OF YALL LIKE TOG BETTER (aelin is my baby🥺) that story, for me, as messy as it can be... the adventure in it fills my heart way more and i love all my babies in it🥺
i really enjoyed the first two books but then there was too much going on and i got so lost bahaha
what are y'alls fav book in the series? ...heir of fire right?😎😼
@@madehdeh7385 queen of shadowsssss
I think I slightly lean towards ACOTAR because I'm trash for Rhys buttttt TOG is still STUNNING and I will never ever be over Kingdom of Ash 😭😭😭
@@madehdeh7385 nothing can beat heir of fire
I just finished the Red Queen series, I personally liked it and I agree Mare was not my favorite but I did like Cal.
please i love shade when “it” happened to him i literally threw the book across my bed and cried at 3 am
Idk I kinda liked Mare because she was such a flawed character I found it amusing. And Cal was a bit annoying at times but yeah he's a favorite.
I really love your sheer enthusiasm for books and their characters! Really makes me want to read all of that!
I love Will, Jem and Tessa so much. Like usually, I end-up feeling irritated in one or two characters in a love triangle, but TID never had that effect on me. I just love them all so much, enough to feel so heartbroken in literally every chapter since the clockwork prince. But also yes, if I have the power to change the ending, I would. I love everything about TID except maybe the ending. It’s just too much of a stretch i think for cassie to not make readers choose a side hahahaha idk. Aside from TID just being the most unproblematic LT i’ve read, she just made “friendship/parabatai” so beautiful. I think i really understood the true essence of what a parabatai should be in Will and Jem 🥺
Robert Sheehan has the power to change anyones mind about a "love triangle" it becomes a "love line" at that point.
Amen!!!
I literally LOVE how you describe each book in every video without even giving out spoilers. I mean you are always so clean about it. Seriously thank you. Whenever I see a books exclusive channel most of the times the youtuber gives out spoiler and I hate it. Your descriptions and attitude towards every book has made me read so many of them.
thank you so much!!!
@@caricanread Oh my god you replied!!
I can't believe it. Thank youu
The love triangle in The Red Queen just made me angry by the end to be honest. I didn’t find the characters had any depth and I ended up giving up on the second one and looking up the synopsis 🤷♀️ Mare was really one dimensional
Right?!!! I’m still going to finish it but i had such high hopes in the middle of the first one and then it just went downhill :(
literally me toooo. i stopped in the middle of the second or third, i was just... i don't even know what i felt, it just wasn't it for me, it kept going downhill. mare frustrated me, all the characters were dry or annoying.
I originally dropped it on the second book too because of how boring it got, but the 3rd and ESPECIALLY the 4th was so good that I'm glad I finished the series
When I first saw you IG story asking about love triangles I didn't have any clue why you asked for this recs 😂. Such an incredible video! It was like you were describing all my feelings about love-triangles in a way I can't do myself. Also you really conviced me about The Black Witch, definetely I will check it out!
omg i apologize for the pain you might endure from that book hahhaha
I've been crying over the whole tess will jem dynamic since I've read TID and I don't think I'll be stopping anytime soon
i honestly loved red queen from the beginning do idk :/ but maybe you’ll like the third book, because i know it’s my personal favorite.
As is mine, I think the first and third books are the best in my opinion.
the infernal devices is the only love triangle ever in my mind. for a true love triangle there must be love between all three. in herongraystairs each of them loves the other two more than their own self - it never felt like a competition, it was just three people loving each other throughout horrible circumstances and tragedy.
to me, the ending doesn't feel satisfying because of how big their love was....even the happiest mortal outcome feels tragic because they loved each other SO much. but i'm happy with it. cc said she wrote will to be tessa's first love because she always knew jem would be tessa's last and that destroys me but also sums it up perfectly, i think. it's just so intricate and emotional and devastating because of how well done it was and how clearly they all loved each other.
book-wise i unashamedly preferred jem for most of them because (though he's forgiven and had obvious reasons for it which no one blames him for and in fact was done out of selflessness) will was objectively awful to tessa for most of the book timeline. also bec jem is unusual in a YA romance - he didn't try to be edgy or mysterious or dark, wasn't rude, wasn't push or pull, he was just honest, kind and selfless from the start despite having arguably the most horrifying backstory in the tsc universe and yeah. jem owns my heart. but i digress. tid's love triangle is the only one for me.
I'm so excited for this video 😍😍 thank you so much
thanks for watching!!!
Omg was so exited for this video and it did not disappoint! Also for Red Queen most people tend to stop reading during the third book because it gets a little slow but I would recommend finishing the series if you enjoy the second book.
i will definitely try to finish! i just want to know the outcome of the Reds hahah
YOUR KDRAMA REFERENCE AND THE SCENE FROM LOVE ALARM WITH THE HAND HOLDING HAD ME DYING OF LAUGHTER BECAUSE OMG I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOU MEAN
Will, Jem and Tessa's story was soooo beautifully written ... I never got over them! Also I'm with you on that K-Drama example. All the emotions we invest, the time we spend waiting just to witness at least a single sweet interaction between the characters. Like OMG! The happiness we all feel for that "moment".
Love Triangles are garbage, often make me uncomfortable because of the tension and disrespect that arises from them, and they ultimately contribute very little to most narratives.
For example, in the Hunger Games, it would’ve made sense for Katniss to deny her feelings for Peeta because of her emotional detachment and trauma. What doesn’t make sense is her cozying up to Gale at the same time, as if these problems don’t exist and as if Peeta is the problem. All for the sake of “Hot Muscle Edgelord Guy Choice”.
And characters like Gale, who are usually side-lined horrendously or are just plain jerks to others in these stories, don’t usually add much to the story at all. They’re usually there just to challenge an endgame ship or to make the Main Character seem emotionally unfaithful or unable to make a coherent decision.
I adored the Red Queen series by Victoria Aveyard. However, I feel like if you are not into the first book you will probably not be into Glass Sword or King's Cage. I don't know! I think the series is worth a shot but I wouldn't say it gets better after the first book.
im not loving glass sword but i've heard good things about the third book so we'll see! im willing to see it through to the end!
I lovee red queen, glass sword had good moments as much as the others at least for me, but all and all love itt
I'm definitely of the opinion that the TID protagonists should've formed a poly relationship. Certain lines like "the three of you, falling over yourself to love one another each more than the other" (Midnight Heir), and Will saying that Jem was the good left in him while Tessa was his heart (I don't remember the exact quote) highlights the sheer depth of the connection *everyone* had.
Bro finish the red queen series
Kings cage ( third book ) literally a master piece
I just love to listen you rant about books
💗🦢
LOL
Oml maven was my fave in the red Queen series! And also, I am reading tog right now and love it lol! I read acotar and it has become my fave series ever! You should read shatter me because that's a frustrating love triangle lol
I toootaally understand your frustration with TOG since there are so many POV's and different love interests and it gets a liiittle bit confusing (read a LOT confusing), but I really really love the series in a whole and the I love the plot so much. It broke my heart in so many ways but it was also was so fun to read. I would actually recommend to continue reading because for me the story kinda starts to pick up and pieces starts to fall in place the more you read and the world grows a lot! I also tried to read it with the attention for the story more than the love interests, (like I know it's hard since it's like half of the books haha) when I started realizing more and more characters were being introduced. Also I would also like to recommend Sarah J Maas new book, House of Earth and Blood!
Another series I'd like to recommend (if you haven't already) is the series Graceling Realm by Kristin Cashore, in the second book there is kiiiinda a "love triangle" that is veeery interesting! The author is also releasing a new book to the series in the beginning of 2021 and I'm so excited! Sorry for the long comment haha, but I'd just like to say I'm so happy and excited you started this channel! It's so fun to watch you read so many of the books I've read and loved and not loved and I love to watch people be so interested in books in general! So thank you!
I just wanna say... YES to the whole Peta over Gale. You took my thoughts from my head and my feelings from my heart and I 100% agree. That is all :P
I have never read any of those books (except for twilight of course) but you are so delicate and expressive that I could watch any of your videos for hours and hours, you are captivating!
Thank u for your videos, they make my day better and my wallet empty (gosh I can't buy any books anymore literally broke)
Sorry if I wrote something wrong, love from brazil♡
oh my goodness thank you so much!!
I have read the Red Queen series, and I too had mixed emotions reading it, especially the concluding book War Storm. BUT I would recommend reading the prequel, Cruel Crown. I actually enjoyed the read. :)
I personally loved red queen. I loved the main series: red queen, glass sword, kings cage, war storm AND ALSO BROKEN THRONE. The characters get less annoying over time because you start to understand them. lowkey farley and evangaline have back issues from carrying the series and julian and sarah are the most underrated characters ever. I also think if we got more from coriane and tibe (when he was good), the series would be 1000 times better
LMAO @ the farley comment hahahha
My fav character is Julian
Cruel Crown, prequel to series
YES OMG Coriane is my favorite and she deserves the world !
Her little story is SO good that it made me like so many characters that most people hate like Tibe and Anabel
@@manuba_ YESYES finally someone who agrees with me on cori and tibe. she was the true calore queen. they were the true tragedy of red queen. i also think the reason he disliked mare so much was because she was so much like coriane and he was so broken after her death, even that long after. we stan anabel in this house.
Omg what a throwback to hear about the Mortal Instruments/Infernal Devices! Those books defined my middle school experience haha I definitely highly preferred the Infernal Devices because I feel like the relationships were much more thought out and the setting made it more atmospheric in my opinion.
I love this video idea! (although I generally am not a romance person anymore) I feel like I should start reading some YA again
yes!! i loved it so much more than mortal instruments!
I liked Will enough, but Jem was my favourite. For middle school little me, I was happy for Will and Tessa to get together if they did, and I wanted Jem for myself. Besides me, I thought Will and Jem should ditch Tessa and ride off into the the rainbow on a unicorn to their happily ever after.
Honestly the the way Celeana was moving from one interest to another i was just like ughhh stop it ,i completely hated it.It didnt make sense
Oooh ok so since the Hunger Games (and Twilight I guess) I've been a bit allergic to love triangles and have a defence mechanism kick in where I basically just ignore them and focus on the rest of the plot. I think that's why I had the opposite to you with TOG series because I just concentrated on everything else that was happening!! I'd think I'd recommend picking it up again because by the last book I was really sold on the final love interest (having been a bit ambivalent towards it for a few books idk I took a while to warm to it) and there are some other characters and plots which are just STUNNING. Like I ugly cried. 😅😅 great vid as ever Cari - your book tube is giving me life rn 🥰
bahahah perhaps i should try again!
I read the infernal devices 8 years ago and he wound is still fresh...
UPDATE: "if someone could tell me a time when I'm supposed to like Gale..." honestly same
Tessa, Will and Jem shuld end up in a poliamorous relatioship.
I love Throne of Glass but i do agree with u, it's not a love triangle cuz every man she meets always shows the possibility of attraction. I love the story but I still prefer Sam or Dorian than Rowan (her mate)
No way maybe Sam over Rowan but not Dorian
Chaol and dorian got their happy endings tho. Sam not so much but like yeah.
omg i love you even more now that you mentioned korean drama
I haven't read the third ACOTAR book (3/4 through ACOMAF atm) so I can't really speak on what happens in the third book, but the only thing that bothered me about Rhysand and Feyre was that I felt Maas kind of kept hitting you with 'Rhysand is a feminist' 'Rhysand is actually the good guy' 'Tamlin is trash' (which tbf, I can somewhat agree with anyway lol) and I just felt it was a bit shoe horned in? I don't know whether the 'bad guy is actually good' trope has just been ruined for me and I'm being a bit unfair to her though 😅
exactly hahahah inventor of feminist, Rhys.
Haha take a shot everytime Rhysand says 'it's your choice' 🍻
You see, I have this issue with Maas. She introduces a relationship and it's all good, then the next book, there's another love interest and the previous one is suddenly complete trash (ACOTAR) or they hate each other for no reason (ToG)... I feel like Maas sort of pushes the reader to the new ship by transforming the old love interest into a dick, and I don't like that... It's abrupt and unfair to the character. I sometimes think that she changes her mind midway through the story and that's why things seem so pushy.
@@evewithwonder yeah honestly I can see that. I kind of wondered if perhaps she suddenly took a liking to Rhysand and decided to basically retcon his character 😂
@@evewithwonder I only read the first one in the ACOTAR series and I decided not to continue on because of how badly handled the love triangle was: it felt incredibly disingenuous as a reader to be told I basically wasted my time getting invested into a relationship just because the author had gotten tired of it and wanted to introduce a hotter love interest. Just like you said, and given how it was marketed (the whole Beauty and the Beast retelling thing), it felt like Tamlin was going to be endgame BUT SUDDENLY she remembered that with a love triangle you can make books and sagas longer and she was like "um, actually, there's this OTHER guy...".
Also, the whole "making the og love interest bad" you mentioned is a cheap tactic so the main girl can avoid be called out on her cheating. If there was no conflict and she just randomly went out with another dude, it wouldn't look good, but because they had a fight, she can do whatever she wants with no remorsement! Ugh....
I was able to be very happy with the out come of TID because of where she takes those characters in other series. The Last Hours and The Dark Artifices.
Lol I hadn’t even thought of how messy Throne of Glass’ love story is. It’s really interesting to hear your thoughts on romance in books at all because I don’t read for it at all (and in no way am I saying it’s bad to pay attention to it just in case my words get misconstrued haha). I really liked those books up until like book 6 or 7 which kinda traumatized me and I decided I didn’t trust where it was all going. Anyways, this video is like good advice for me because I’ve written a novel I’m currently rewriting and although there are two love interests I really want to make it clear there’s not a love triangle. I want my character to very clearly show that while she loves both of them it’s in different ways and she’s always loved one in a more passionate manner that she’ll pursue. I don’t want there to be a “who will she decide on” sentiment which kinda drives me nuts since in most books it seems quite clear who the Mc will choose. So thanks!
Omg you’re so funny!! btw love ur videos :)
The Selection is really good and it has a really good plot twist at the end of the third book, they are easy reads, highly recommend
About the Throne of Glass series, I really like the way she actually uses her beauty and seduction as a weapon as well as I love the fact that the whole serie is not building in the first love plot. For me looks a realistic way to show that not all people have only one true love for the lifetime.
I'm not a fan of the "soulmate" thing. Not that a fantasy story must show realistic relationships, but it feels good to change this "rule" sometimes. I think Thron of Glass do that well.
I actually really loved the ending of The Infernal Devices and just in general, in the entire world how Tessa's love life was handled. I would change stuff about the series, but not this. That was one of the things I actually genuinely liked. On the other hand, I don't normally enjoy love triangles at all, so maybe this ending appeals to people who don't like love triangles 😂
**TID SPOILERS**
So I just finished Clockwork Princess last night, I’d never read anything by Cassandra Clare before. I LOVED the love triangle, but was annoyed at the ending. I was team Tessa and Will, I feel like Tessa’s inner thoughts make it obvious who she will end up with. But I was overall annoyed that she didn’t really *choose* Will or Jem. She sort of just ends up with Will because Jem was forced to join that creepy brotherhood in order to live and was no longer an option?? 🤨 And then like 100 years later after Will is long dead, you’re really telling me Jem finds a cure and him and Tessa end up together again??? 🧐
Like don’t get me wrong, I also cried at that end scene with Tessa and Jem reigniting their love in front of the bridge LOL. But then I got super irritated by it ahaha 😂 I just don’t know what I feel at this point LOL
How jem cured was explained in the mortal instruments
If a love triangle is written well, I’m a sucker for it! I’ll admit it! Just look at the infernal devices, that’s a beautiful one…
Also you HAVE to finish throne of glass. It gets so good. All the extra little pieces come together at the end
I never finished the red queen series because I think it's really overrated, I like the first book the best but I think the last books were just bad, especially the second one annoyed me because we learn nothing about the side characters so I felt nothing about them tbh
The second one is so hard to get through, I’m trying my best 😞
I know! I stopped reading the second halfway through because I got so bored. It was really unfortunate because I absolutely adored the first one.
I bought the second book biggest regret I read it like 5years ago and while back was like ok gonna force myself to finish only got thru the third but it was equally as useless now I’m not sure what to do
The second one honestly sucks. The third one was better compared to it because we got more POVs, even though it was just a few chapters. The fourth books, however was actually quite nice.
Lakshita Yellanki good to hear I guess I keep going back and forth hated the second book the third one was decent but I wasn’t sure if it’d be a waste of time to read the next one but at the same time I want to know how it ends
i will be starting clockwork princess tomorrow and am really torn right now, my heart is in shreds, and this love triangle is so painful,i just, i love those three, i just, this love triangle is a beautiful masterpiece, i LOVE TID!
I don't actually like love triangles and seeing your opinions always opens my eyes I think. we disagree on a lot of book tropes but watching your videos helps me see the appeal to other people haha
I totally get what you mean about the throne of glass series. I did a reread last year for the first time since I initially read them in ,,, middle school,,, and the romance between aelin and chaol/Dorian was so ridiculous it was basically “he loved her she loved him she was so beautiful” etc so shallow and surface level HOWEVER I thought her love for Sam in assassin’s blade was so good and pure and I also love Rowan and how they didn’t immediately fall for each other. Basically, although there’s a million different love interests, I kind of appreciate it because realistically, the first person you fall in love with isn’t gonna stick around and I think kinda meeting all these people as these crazy events happen and realizing oh maybe they aren’t THE one for me after this situation is really valuable and I also think the different guys represent what Aelin needed at that time in her life. With Sam she needed a friend in the assassin’s keep, Dorian/chaol she needed friendship and security after being a literal slave, with Rowan she LITERALLY became a new person from celaena to aelin and I just like the symbolism of their relationship :)
THRONE OF GLASS SPOILERS/ Cari, I usually agree so much with your feels on books but I was so surprised with what you said about throne of glass. I actually felt that it was so refreshing the way the relationships happen in the first few books because I think it's so rare that a female character is simply allowed to be attracted and crush and even kinda fall in love with someone and try it out, and then decide it's not for them and peacefully move on (or not so peacefully in Chaol's case). I do understand what you said about getting attatched to the characters but I hope if you revisit the series one day you give a try at looking at it from a different perspective. I really like the friendship between Celaena, Dorian and Chaol (although the author made horrible decisions in the second half of the series and did not take full advantage of the wonderful friendship she had created), and the fact that in the first 2/3 books she had something romantic with both and then it didn't work out but they managed to eventually go back to being friends with a new kind of bond; that's not a dynamic I find in YAs often. I know sometimes we read to forget our real-life worries and we might want a fluffy ending to all relationships we get invested on, but particularly I like reading these other kinds of representation as well - the kind where there's still a happy ending, but it's not the obvious one you'd expect. I find it comforting to see there can still be love, friendship and a strong bond between people that care so much about each other even if at some point they dated, or had feelings for each other, or had a huge misunderstanding, or even broke each other's hearts. In life, sometimes we have these huge fights with people we love and we feel like things will never be the same, and that hurts so bad; and you know what, it really won't be the same, but that doesnt mean you cant get past the bad stuff and arrive at a good place again - a different kind of good. In life, I find the idea of a relationship having the "FAIL" stamp once you break-up to be stupid, because it didnt necessarily fail, maybe it was a success for however long it lasted. If you spend a decade dating someone and you break up, wouldnt it be frustrating that all that was reduced to a failure? Thats kinda the moral and the feels I got from Celaena/Dorian/Chaol in the first books. Maybe the romantic side failed for them, but their bond is supposed to be more than that. I loooove Dorian, how faithful he stayed to his friendship with Celaena. That was way better for me than if she had just ended up dating him.
Sorry for the huge comment but I just wanted to share a different perspective I guess? But I truly understood why you felt the way you did. I think you did a good job by stopping the series in the middle because I personally hate the direction it went in the last few books - for the exact reason that I think some soulmate stuff the author introduced into the plot completely negated the validity I saw in the first two relationships and that was a huge turn off. It just sent the message that the protagonist never really liked Chaol or Dorian, not for real, because she was always meant for this other guy, like, biologically or magically 🙄
Oh boy, I'm such a sucker for Cassie's drama and I love that she has a whole lot of stories co written by other cool authors 🙈 it's been like 15 years and I still read all of the books. ‼️Spoiler:‼️I wouldn't change anything about the ending of infernal devices, because if it wasn't for that, we wouldn't have the drama that is Jem & Tessa being both immortal and NOT together for like a century still, until getting the cure for Jem and having a literal freaking dream wedding 🙈 reading Ghosts of the shadow market I was crying my little heart out, it was so emotional.
so many people hate red queen 😩 it’s soo good i personally LOVE it
Thank you so much for recommending "The black witch". I'm astonished by the amount of hate this book is getting, so many people misunderstood this book. I'm glad you recommended it. It is truly worth it
I know this video is old but I'm rewatching it and had to comment on throne of glasses' love octagon thing. I read these when I was in high school so I personally liked how it showed a more realistic side of romance where you don't just fall in love and have endgame with the first man you're introduced to or even the second. I think dorian and chaol brought out a lot of different qualities in her, to where when Rowan came along we could tell how it was different and how they were true true endgame. I could see how it is confusing and frustrating for people as well though but those were just my thoughts.
Throne of Glass is probably my favourite series. Love all the characters and how they change over stories and all their relationships - both friendly and romantic. You might not find THE one straight away, but when you do it's magical. But I understand what you mean about Celaena loving a lot of people. But I love where she ends up - that's all I can say without spoiling for anyone who haven't read it.
Yes! And I liked that the early love interests aren't villainized or forgotten about (*cough*ACOTAR*cough*) instead we get to explore how their relationships with Celaena change and how they move on romantically and as friends and allies. One of my favorite series for sure.
cari i love this so much 😭😭😭 will u do a separate video for infernal devices in the future?
Infernal Devices spoilers....
I think that it was okay for Tessa to end up with Will...and Jem!!!!
After reading Chain of Gold, I think that Will and Tessa made such great parents are they're the ones who carried on the Herondale line. All of the modern Herondale characters wouldn't exist without them...which is incredible.
But...in the end...Will passes...which was inevitable. And I'm glad that Jem also had the chance to be with his love, Tessa.
This love triangle will always be everyone's favourite because of the fact that ALL three of them loved each other. Will, Jem and Tessa never truly hated each other. They all just loved. And that's what makes it so special...
I wouldn’t change a thing about the ending of clockwork princess. I remember I loved it so much. When I first read them I was definitely rooting for only Will, but now as an adult re-reading the books, I love both the boys. I think the ending is very unexpected and gives everyone a happy ending. I still have never cried so much over the ending of a book than that one though 😅
The modern Will, Tessa & Jem is Kieran, Mark & Cristina from The Dark Artifices. Cassie made them into a polyamorous relationship!!! The best series so far from TSC is TDA and I stand by that!!! Its really well done!!!
I will never ever be able to get over the freaking infernal devices love triangle drama OH MY GOD I can't even remember how much of my teenage tears spent to that I can still cry over it for hours..in fact now im thinking to reread the whole series just to mess myself up again after years
I just read the Red Queen series, I personally really liked it. I will say as the books progressed I didn't like Mare as much, but honestly even in the last book (war storm) I still loved Maven.
I will have to read the Black witch!! I plan on reading TOG I love , love triangles!
For me, it's not a good love triangle if I can't scream "polyamory exists people! King-sized beds exists people! just do a three-way it's so easy it's right there!" at the characters in question every three pages. (I can also settle for Main Couple lives a quiet life in the coutryside, leftover side piece goes on to become benevolent emperor of the world. Because honestly, if you can't have love at least you can have the next best thing)
ooh did cari take a creative writing/screenwriting class??? that rant about love triangles and conflict etc at the beginningf was spot on ( i know its also just considered a basic storytelling skill before ppl point it out)
noooo I SO love Throne of Glass 😭😭😭 you do have a point about the octagon tho 😅 but one of the three main guys stays for the last 6 books!!
listening to u while doing my stupid homework calms me down :'>
I often get attached and want the first couple to be successful, but I honestly like the way throne of glass handles romances (maybe just bc I love Rowan so much). It’s definitely not a line triangle, but I like that different relationships have different depths and the reasons each of them ended made sense to me. I like that your first love may not always be your last
i love how things went in the Infernal Devices. As much as I could as someone who doesn´t enjoy romance much and thought it would be better with less romance altogether in the series.
It's so interesting to me how you interpreted the love interests situation in Throne of Glass! I see your point, but I don't really agree? I've only read all the books once, so I might not remember everything correctly but as far as I'm aware, Celaena only has a love triangle in book 1? Or two? Because that's when there's both Chaol and the prince (I forget his name). In book one she's with the prince but they're not in love that much is very clear. The prince is quite smitten I believe, but Celaena is just having some fun. And Chaol also likes Calaena but Calaena isn't there with Chaol. In book 2 however, Calaena falls in love with Chaol. Genuinely, but they break up by the end of it, I believe because she's leaving the continent. And in book 3 she's not with anyone but she's missing Chaol. Then book 4 is when she realizes she's in love with the bird guy, I forget his name too, oops. But then she's in love with bird guy for the rest of the books. And while Chaol still has romantic feelings for Celaena, she shares none for Chaol anymore, only friendly ones. And the prince has long moved on from her too. I think he falls in love with someone else in book 3? And then that woman dies which is why the Manon thing becomes a thing later on.
Anyway, my point is that there really isn't a love triangle aside from maybe the first one or two books, and I don't see how it can somehow became a quadruple or quintuple or something, that just doesn't make sense as I remember it at least.
I do see your point about how the changing of love interests can be grating for a reader, especially someone who latches on to the first as I'm sure many do. So yeah, just felt like expanding on TOG a bit ❤
I kind of liked the ending because I adored both Will and Jem, but the fact that Will died broke my heart. I still think about it a lot.
Red queen series is honestly probably in my top 3 book series ever. I think you should continue it because it is absolutely amazing and I love the writing style and character (I understand not liking them though because they are all really flawed beside kilorn)