15:15 is the icing on the cake. The enemy Delaware is full HP and has clearly done nothing but hide at the back of the map and use his aircraft to strike like a CV. Great ship design War Gaming. Aircraft really do reduce camping!
well not quite sure how long the reload for the strike planes is on the Delaware, but if he is not shooting in between the strikes... well it's gonna be a very low damage game. On the other hand, BB camping at back doing nothing and still having their HP at the end of the game is nothing limited to hybrids, just a typical BB player. Always getting a good laugh out of German BBs sniping from the backline...
well to be fair.. its most down to the player, if I play my Nebraska i do it like a bb and use my planes whenever they are rdy, but not only. Fact the Nebraska is very good if u are top tier, but soon u face TIX u suffer, cause u only have 6 very inconistent guns and u have a very huge 32mm superstructure to get farmed at. Also what did u expected giving ur average BB snail one more task.. or on the other hand a cv main firepower on his ship.. they are to stupid to handle it
5:57 Actually Jingles, if you roll the footage back, the Benson only spoke up because one of the BBs loitering at max range bitched about him not capping A fast enough, while he was in fact hiding in the edge of A blocking the cap; to which he (correctly) pointed out that they were all *also* capable of moving to the cap and then requested support. Which he did not receive, resulting in his death when the Flint charged him down and everything capable of stopping it was still driving in circles accomplishing nothing in the back of the map.
Half the enemy team was _also_ in A, so the BBs obviously didn't push. The logical choice for the Benson is telling the BB to go fly a kite and instead contesting the area _south_ of A, and then _nobody_ has to die.
A dd cannot win this argument: If she does not cap, she's "not doing her job", and if she caps and dies, she "threw it". There's a lesson to learn: Play as best as you can and not play as any random other player expects you to act. Don't get teased to make dumb decissions.
No ... Because they would have *HAD* to give russian battleships a disadvantage as well. Or the submarines. Or the Hybrid Battleships. The Wargaming Matchmakers are way below fairness since ages memorial. It is ever so slightly less shit in Word of Tanks, though. Mainly because there are far more tanks in WoT in less categories than there are ships in WoWs (Wheely Bois, Light, medium, heavy, TD, Arty vs 2 main variants of DD, multiple variants of BB, Submarine, 2+ Variants of Carrier(soviet carriers are "special"), Hybrid BB/Carrier plus the "only 4" main variants of cruisers). Meaning the WoT Matchmaker has less opportunities to fuck s**t up.
Is it malicious or lazy programming? To balance the matchmaking would take a massive amount of code and variables relative to just tier number and type. My money is on the fact they Cant be bothered and reckon that if they went to the effort the player base would moan anyway. It underlines the fact they see this as a business and don’t really care about the game.
@@JesusKreist Although esp. in the TD category there are wide differences. Like you have the stealthy almost unarmoured ones on one end and the heavily armoured glaciers on the other end.
@@kaltaron1284 Not keeping track of how many tanks there are in WoT. I feel per month there is a dozen or more being added. With the TD's you are right. Somewhat. But I'm talking about for instance a british light cruiser and a US heavy supercruiser/battlecruiser/whateveryouwanttocallit. The matchmaker views both as equal. The TD's you mentioned have way more in common than those two cruiser types.
@@JesusKreist Can you really compare let's say a Waffentraeger auf Panzer IV and a Doom Turtle? But I guess the gimmicks in WoWs like radar, hydro, hybrids etc. matter a bit more than the differences is WoT.
You didn't mention that based upon the Drach episode, the design this ship is based on should have over double the 5 inch secondary guns with an even bigger secondary broadside (some guns mounted on the centerline), and a much smaller superstructure. It sure seems that wargamming took the cheap and easy way when it comes to the model and balancing rather than creating a unique and interesting ship. Instead of modifying the Iowa to have the correct rate of fire, number of secondaries and new superstructure, and then balancing it around HP pool and consumables. It just slapped some new turrets on the model and called it good.
WG has been doing that with literally every new ship these days. With the Pan American line they only created a couple of new ships; the rest are rearranged Worcesters and other ships already in the game. They're doing the same with the new European destroyer line as well, IIRC.
In fairness, each of these ships did cost many thousands of dollars to model as they are unusually detailed with internal structures being relevant in ways most games don't need to know. For sure, they are cheaping out on some aspects, but for a Free-to-Play game, it is not entirely surprising. What really should worry us is that Wargaming's archive-divers, people who spent time looking through the archives for information on real ships and tanks to inform new or old vehicles, are spending less time at said archives. This suggests Wargaming is more or less convinced that they have all the real-world information they want out of the archives, meaning more fantasy tanks and ships will be coming with less and less attachment to reality.
As soon as Jingles mentioned the Illinois had "improved AA over the Iowa", I thought so that means it *might* shoot down one of the attacking planes, rather than none like is usual. Then I watched the rest of the video. Aaaaand BAPs' AA managed to shoot down about 1 plane per 2 attacks.
Doesn't matter with hybrids, regardless. Losing planes means nothing on a Hybrid, since the planes are a cool down, consumable. Planes fully resurrect every time the cooldown ends.
the thing is, its not particularly good as a battleship and if you charge in, you cant really use the planes because you are just a sitting duck. its just how it is with the ship.
Had a similar battle today, three hybrid BBs and two carriers per team. Like this replay, my Baltimore didn't stand a chance even though it has a very good AA capability. At this time I'm not convinced that hybrid BBs are a positive for the game, especially when match making recognises them as a BB only.
Baltimore is a very good heavy cruiser, made near unplayable by the higher-tier foolishness. There are indications that WG is vaguely aware of the problem. However, if they get the one functional brain among that Confederacy of Dunces out of the deep-freeze they left it in, will it actually still work when surgically implanted in one of their vacant heads? Time will only tell, not optimistic.
Cry yourselves a river not like anyone is listening , just play subs if you can't deal with it .. go and play warthunder they've battleships if you can't deal with it
@@LordEmperorHyperion I paid good money to play a game I liked. Then they changed it. Years ago they said they would never add subs. Look what happened. Guess what? My wallet has snapped shut and these clowns are never seeing another dime of my money
I think the issue with the matchmaker is it has absolutely no functionality for checking ship capabilities, much less balancing them. The only things it has functionality to check are ship type and ship tier and it attempts to balance according to only those two factors. They would basically have to tear down the existing matchmaker and rebuild it more-or-less from scratch to add the functionality we want. So they don't.
Except...if some of those players achieved their win rates in predominantly different ship types than the one they are currently playing....? Because, complicated, but a nice try... :)
I love it how Jingles is desperately trying to find some logic ("let's think, why do these guns reload slower?") in a game where radar and hydro can see through islands, and where diesel-electric subs go at 20 knots under water and maneuvre better than a destroyer.
I get the feeling, that even if, by some miracle, guided missile air defence ships, like the Ticonderoga-class were added to the game, AA still wouldn't work, because reasons..... 🙂
Now we just need the USS Abraham Lincoln to come up in the Nuclear Ships patch of 2030 and we can have this episode named along side Jingles’ episode ‘Lincoln Park’ in which the USS Abraham Lincoln is featured doing what most carriers do best and parking in one spot on the map for the duration of the match!
5:39 acshually, jingles, the trb is on cooldown. Our Star took one torp, and two more sets were seen passing that gap sevonds later. And Yūgumo has only two sets.
World of Warshits Matchmaking: The team that wins has the highest average team win percentage, the highest number of battles played, the highest average team damage and highest average team ships destroyed per battle. Those team averages are never close and the team with the higher percentages always wins.
I swear planes have separate armor values for before and after they do their runs, I've noticed that more tend to go down after the run than before and during it.
@@tallleprechaun1318 What do you mean dumb reason? Diving directly towards the guns actively trying to shoot you down is the moment when you're the least exposed /s
I've seen matchmakers, I did not worked on it myself but my colleagues did (not for WG, other company I won't name). While matchmaking is a rather simple operation for a human if there are few people to handle, it's an absolute nightmare to come with an algorithm that will do the same for thousands of player coming in and out of the queue every second and that will do all of the following: 1. be fast so the queue won't grow too big and player won't wait too long 2. be fair in regard to all the input parameters it has to consider (here, type of ship, ship ability, player rank…) I can assure you of two things: 1. developers have to find a compromise between the two needs, and it always comes at a cost 2. the more parameters there are, the harder it is to have a fair matchmaker, even without the time constraint. So, while I agree that wows matchmaking could be better, I'm not going to blame them too much for it, I've seen several projects where matchmaking was a recurring issue and coming with a good solution has never been easy and rarely achieved when the matchmaking was more complex than just "team people with similar level".
it was proven already that WG just simply wait to filll a room and put them whatever with only two or three rules like "same numbers of DD's", even the position is just garbage, ships that thrive close to islands are just throw in the middle of nowhere, etc
This matchmaker doesn't consider player rank, though. To make it more insulting, this battle had all of the ingredients in the room to be balanced. Two hybrids? Easy, one per team. Two radar cruisers? Easy, one per team. What did it do? Both hybrids and both radars on the same team.
Has anyone also considered that WG is also balancing high spenders versus cheap skates or the number of games each player is in ? I do better when I have just bought a ship or played my 1st game after a weeks absence. YES I am saying they are deliberate in their MM.
7:57 I personally like to think of Illinois more as a fat buffalo since they get the same amount of guns and roughly the same reload just in a different disposition (yes, Buffalo gets the same guns as Des Moines, Des Moines just gets the reload as well)
Indeed. The only difference (like you stated), is the turret design and loading mechanisms. I haven't played against the Illinois yet, but I will soon lol
For AA to actually be useful you need a ship with minimum 400 AA dps, the AA consumable the AA captain perk that improves sector reinforcement by 25% since that gets multiplied by the consumable. Without the AA consumable AA is just decoration unless you are super lucky and hit with flak and without 400 AA dps all the consumable does is decrease the planes accuracy without shooting any down.
The Illinois isnt similar to the Iowa, it was supposed to be an Iowa class, but was canceled in '45. Also, she was supposed to have 16" guns, not thes autoloading shenanigans that WoW gave us
The MM does match super ships against each other, but other than CVs it is happy to put a Tier X BB opposite a supership BB and a supership DD opposite a Tier X DD. Both teams will have the same number of superships. As to radar, WG did address that once, stating that they did not see a win rate effect from radar being on one team and not the other. Anecdotally, I have seen the radar having team lose many times so they might have been telling the truth. I find the Large Cruiser and hybrid BB issue to be more significant. One team gets Alaska and the other gets Ibuki is not really fair. Hybrids I am not thrill with, but given how many hybrid BB players seem to think they are playing CVs with really big last ditch self defense guns the effect on win rates may not be there.
@@Swordphobic problem is we can't prove either or and when ppl ask to see the code that determines this they suspiciously block/avoid it just as they do with RNG code, I can only conclude there is something in the code, they don't want us to see, next step would be to offer lots of money and an agreement that will not show the hidden code but would be allowed to report to the player base if MM and RNG is actually 50/50 fair, till then the game is rigged in my eye
My grandfather served in US Navy during WWII. He developed the auto loading mechanism for the Eight Inch guns. He served on the USS Oklahoma which was sunk during the attack on Pearl Harbor. He thankfully went on shore leave the day before the attack.
FYI - Jingles...since you challenged us to prove you wrong... The purpose of AA guns in World War 2 was NOT to provide ship defense against air attack. It was to make air attack expensive for the attacker. No ship, not even US Navy late war AA, was capable of PREVENTING a determined strike by a flight of enemy planes. Ship defense against air attack was ALWAYS provided by the air patrol from a carrier or land base. THAT would DEFEND an enemy air attack. You can even see this in the carrier doctrines of the USN and RN as the war went on...taking on more and more fighters to provide this protection. Is the way World of Warships balances AA guns shit? Absolutely. Is the expectation of how air defense actually works by both the game developer and most of the player base completely wrong? Yes, indeed.
It is simply not comprehensible why they do not do one simple calculation: 24 players load into the lobby, now calculate the average winrate of both sides and re-sort a handful of players in such a way, that the winrates of both sides are very close. That would balance this game in a really really really nice way, especially when you have a unicum division on one side...
ok, you have a unicum duvision of 3 DDs and when 24 players load into the loby there are only potatos dds... how do you balance that? It's not that simple... Not defending WG here, they have no matchmaking in this game, just that it's complicated and wg is lazy af
It's interesting to watch this with my recent experience with my first Hybrid in the WOW Blitz game. High Tier Aircraft Carriers still feel pretty powerful in Blitz but Aircraft losses at low tier can lead to you losing your entire wing over the course of a battle. My first experience with the Hybrid Battleships in the Nebraska has been less than great. The aircraft replenishment takes somewhere between 60-90 seconds and in a games that last 7 minutes max it's generally more of a gimmick so far, but down the line you get more aircraft so I'll have to see. Because of that despite losing part or whole squadrons I've never run out of aircraft simply because I can't cycle through them fast enough. The Nebraska also only has 6 guns, so how things go can depend largely on if those guns hit well. As far as survivability I feel you are still citadel vulnerable, but it not you are EXTREMELY AP vulnerable. Basically that flight deck increases your hitbox massively and you take so much AP and HE damage simply because there is more of you to hit.
Wait, that captain did not have any of the AA build stuff? I cant see the icons going off. Maybe I am confusing it, but don't the AA skills (captain ones) get a white icon going off, when they are going active? So this one does not have the extended AA build. Or is the complaint that there are 2 captain skills, and nobody is supposed to select them, and the AA should be dominating anyway?
The improved AA doesnt work against hybrid and soviet carriers because they only have the one attak flight to worry about, this should change with the upcoming AA changes
as Mountbatten put it in a recent vid about a triple Illinois division: The New Definition of Evil. 3 Illinois in a div in an arms race battle on Sleeping Giant, roflstomp their way through the battle. 36 8 inch guns working together melts ships. Specially when 1 of the div has reload buff built in and another has secondary build.
Wargaming continues to shock me by having amazing instinct in identifying the most harmful things to add to the game, yet having the worst judges of effect of those things and implementing them anyway. First amazingly weird (stats such as armor, dpm or guns in general) russian ships, later some weird torpedo spammers and stuff, then aircraft carriers, then once again as rework, subs, tier 11, hybrids. And these are only main fails of balancing, you really could struggle hard to find something they did and worked well for the game...
you know, I think it is fair to say that once your are below 10k and all your heals are gone in a battleship, most of your AA has been destroyed, unless you are speced for AA specifically. I do agree AA is laughable, but I wouldnt expect to be taking down any planes when my superstructure is damage saturated from HE
Well I never got into WoW, but just a little question after some years of watching Jingles... why dont they make AA on ships make count? It seems to me that Aircrafts are just an easy way to win or did I miss something?
They did count a bit way back before the carrier rework, when carrier players controlled multiple squadrons in a rts-like view. Back in those days they could even deplane carriers, rendering them useless, if the carrier player wasn't careful. Hell, even def AA was useful by increasing the spread of torpedoes and bombs dropped by those planes. Now ? Let's just say they adressed the perceived "problem" of deplaning by making AA useless.
originally you could shoot them down - but cv players are the soft, coddled, cancerous a$$ of WoWs - can't have them lose their planes - wouldn't want that!
@@mudman619 I was a carrier enjoyer back in those days, only because you had to think a lot before commiting to a strike "what is my target ? does he have any support ? did he took enough hits from other ships to soften his AA enough for my planes to survive the approach and return flight ? Which trajectory will I choose for the return flight to prevent the enemy carrier and dds to pinpoint my location ?" but that was the problem in WG's eyes, you had to think, plan, and be careful, and they can't have that in one of their games obviously.
Yeah, what Akredi said. When carriers were in the RTS version of the game, where the tier 10 Hakuryuu could have like 7 squadrons out at once, AA guns mattered. I don't know if you can still do it, but back then you could prioritise a squadron to deal damage to kind of like you can with secondaries. Defensive AA increased AA damage as well as "panicked" the squadrons making their drops spread out wildly (increasing the chance that there would be a gap big enough to fit your ship through and avoid the attacks). On top of that, with certain captain skills, players could get their AA cruisers to have AA ranges of upwards of 10km or more. Carriers had limited planes so a group of three or four ships, especially if one or more was an American cruiser, could wipe out entire squadrons, meaning carriers had to pick their battles and couldn't just suicide their planes in over and over again. Unfortunately once the carrier "rework" happened and players were limited to one manually controlled squadron at a time, all of that was done away with. No more long range AA. No more prioritisation of squadrons. DFAA no longer panics squadrons. Carriers now effectively have unlimited planes. And grouping up doesn't matter as much because WarGaming have made it so it only counts 2 or 3 (I forget which exactly) ships' AA defenses. And AA damage itself? Originally it was basically a dice roll, with your AA guns' damage being how many rolls of the dice per second or something to roll a "kill" on a plane in a squadron. 500 damage listed? 500 chances per second or whatever to shoot down planes. And that was per AA type (so if a ship had single 20mm mounts, twin 20mm mounts, twin 40mm mounts, and 127mm dual purpose guns, there would be 4 simultaneous dice rolls based on each type's damage value to down planes). Nowadays it's all grouped into short, mid, and long range AA, and given a base damage over time value per range. Sounds nice, but short range is useless (it only deals damage when a squadron has already dropped it's payload on you), long range is situational at best (low raw DoT, and flak bursts may deal lots of damage but are fairly easy to avoid), and not many ships have good mid range AA where the damage is most important (against flights that are actively dropping on you, to mitigate or destroy them before they drop). The kicker? AA now has accuracy, effectively reducing your DoT by how much below 100% it is (100 damage with 70% accuracy is effectively 70 damage). WarGaming babies it's carriers, and has enacted so many buffs and mechanics "enhancements" over the years to increase player count of CVs (which is all they care about to determine if a ship is balanced, NO JOKE), to the point that they are impossible to properly play against except for the tone-deaf and out-of-touch nonsensical advice that WeeGee gave, that is, to "just dodge."
thank you another great video and I enjoy all that you put out , I first found you when you did some elite dangerous videos , how about doing some more seeing you do some on foot missions would be nice
Fully agree that the matchmaker should try to balance the individual capabilities of each ship, or at least very key capabilities like radar, planes, etc. However, I don't think this battle was any poster child for the so-called "fun police". Not just because they lost, but… • The Illinois was able to kill 1/5 planes pre-drop, using the priority sector, when he wasn't hugging an island. It's a bit hard to tell because the island isn't that tall, but it seemed the AA wasn't engaging as quickly while he was hugging the B island, so otherwise he was able to cut the impact by 20%. • When he wasn't hiding, he cut it a lot further by giving broadside to the planes with a vertical crosshair. (And lucky for him, the Delaware came in from the stupidest angle while he *was* hiding, but you can't count on that.) • The whole point of the AA mechanic is to group ships together and combine their AA, which actually worked rather well for everyone behind the Illinois. • The Illinois has improved AA, but US aircraft have improved health (at the cost of speed). The Delaware gets to hit at least *some* bombs nearly every time, but wastes a lot of time doing so. • And waste time Delaware did, clearly, given that it was *literally* full-health by the end of a lost game. It was not a BB and a CV that game - it was half of a CV at best, and thanks to the captain's incompetence it was never even half of a BB.
As someone from Illinois, I was surprised at Jingles correct pronunciation. A lot of people from out of state add the "S" at the end, but it is in fact a silent letter.
One of the things as well with the cruiser matchmaking is that it doesn't account for light/heavy/super cruisers. I once had a game with an Alaska, Des Moines, and a Minotaur on one team.. Where the other team was left with two Minotaurs and a Worcester.
I find the new pan Asian cruisers to be a bit weird. The high tier ones have no secondaries but have AA with ranges exceeding 6km. Short range on the main guns. The tier 9 has 4 turrets of 3 guns each only able to fire AP like British lights and all 4 turrets rotate 360 degrees. it has torpedoes, Hydro and Radar as well as a improved heal. The tier 9 is pretty fun to play, was lucky to get it in one of those 350 gold bundles the first one gave me the ship I had the gold from a super container, so I got it.
Jingles I have a question, I live in America and I got an add for a TV show "Holding" from what I gathered it's a show kn the OK. Are taking the Micky???
I'm beginning to observe serious flaws in the software updates coming from WOW. The loss of the Russian IT people is becoming noticeable. Running CHECK AND REPAIR after every update and addition is absolutely a necessity now. Something in update 12.1 scrambled the C++ element of my programing and I didn't even know what C++ was until then. I do now.
Sorry jingles but I dont agree with you. He was attacked by aa after being on low health so most likely some of it was destroyed. Then there is the fact that ships did not shoot down intire squadrons in ww2 either (I know wows is not based on realism but still) and the last point iam trying to make is you are just complaining about aircraft but you are not giving us a solution either (you are basically a polition). I know cvs are not perfect but they are a part of Naval warfare and so wows as well. Nobody would play them if all the aircraft would get shot down all the time. I understand the point you are making but at least give a solution or something because i love to listen to you but the negativety ain't making it better. Still have been a subscriber since you started your war thunder video's so still love you. Just giving my opinion👌🏽
So basically Jingles, what you're saying is that WOWS is irreparably stuffed, to use a more polite word than I'd like. Yeah, that's what I thought too.
Jingles i have another aprouch on the topic of AA, in WOWS you have AA for you ship to look impressive and good on the port for a screenshot, and only that
Little bit like world of tanks. Both teams get a heavy tanks. One gets team gets a maus and type 5 heavy acompanied by t57 heavy. Other team 279e and chieftain with a vz55.
Recently played in a double CV per team game BUT the enemy also had 2 of the Bull5hit Hybrid BB's as well... That's right - the enemy had 4 CV's and we only had 2. Guess how that game went???
Okay, I just got the Nebraska today, and I've played a few battles in her. First, yes she gets Dive Bombers, but only one flight of 5. Plus there is a reload, like your main guns. So as an Aircraft Carrier, she kind of falls short. Now yes, you can use the planes to spot the enemy, and drop a few bombs. As for her guns, not bad, 10 twin turrets with the 127mm guns. Not a brawler, but can hold her own. So don't get so bent out of shape.
BelowAverage_Potato here, thanks again for the feature Jingles! Absolutely loving the 2023 Des Moines! errr... I mean Illinois lol
Great battle 👑
What a name
What do you do under this average potato of yours...? 😀 Nice game against the odds
Congrats on a great game :)
Amazing battle, held your nerve on that island corner so well despite getting bent over by the fun police.
Legend has it, that Jingles is still waiting to tell us about those guns...
😂
hahah hahaah hahahahah hahahahahahahahaha
He knows what he did🤣
It’s true that he’s still waiting.
15:15 is the icing on the cake. The enemy Delaware is full HP and has clearly done nothing but hide at the back of the map and use his aircraft to strike like a CV. Great ship design War Gaming. Aircraft really do reduce camping!
This is our only consolation: that the morons who normally play CV's are now attracted to these hybrids and play them like CV's.
actually if delaware is your enemy, its a good thing. shelling those armor layout is harder than its look
well not quite sure how long the reload for the strike planes is on the Delaware, but if he is not shooting in between the strikes... well it's gonna be a very low damage game. On the other hand, BB camping at back doing nothing and still having their HP at the end of the game is nothing limited to hybrids, just a typical BB player. Always getting a good laugh out of German BBs sniping from the backline...
well to be fair.. its most down to the player, if I play my Nebraska i do it like a bb and use my planes whenever they are rdy, but not only. Fact the Nebraska is very good if u are top tier, but soon u face TIX u suffer, cause u only have 6 very inconistent guns and u have a very huge 32mm superstructure to get farmed at. Also what did u expected giving ur average BB snail one more task.. or on the other hand a cv main firepower on his ship.. they are to stupid to handle it
5:57 Actually Jingles, if you roll the footage back, the Benson only spoke up because one of the BBs loitering at max range bitched about him not capping A fast enough, while he was in fact hiding in the edge of A blocking the cap; to which he (correctly) pointed out that they were all *also* capable of moving to the cap and then requested support. Which he did not receive, resulting in his death when the Flint charged him down and everything capable of stopping it was still driving in circles accomplishing nothing in the back of the map.
true but does not fit the narrative or help the entertainment value of the vid....
@@mynameiswritinwater Facts don't fit the narrative so let's just ignore them, huh? Wonder where I've heard that before.
Half the enemy team was _also_ in A, so the BBs obviously didn't push. The logical choice for the Benson is telling the BB to go fly a kite and instead contesting the area _south_ of A, and then _nobody_ has to die.
@@brendanrisney2449 every populist since the Roman Republic ?
A dd cannot win this argument: If she does not cap, she's "not doing her job", and if she caps and dies, she "threw it". There's a lesson to learn: Play as best as you can and not play as any random other player expects you to act. Don't get teased to make dumb decissions.
They're probably called super ships because if they were called tier 11, WG would have HAD to change the match making system to factor them in.
No ...
Because they would have *HAD* to give russian battleships a disadvantage as well.
Or the submarines.
Or the Hybrid Battleships.
The Wargaming Matchmakers are way below fairness since ages memorial.
It is ever so slightly less shit in Word of Tanks, though.
Mainly because there are far more tanks in WoT in less categories than there are ships in WoWs (Wheely Bois, Light, medium, heavy, TD, Arty vs 2 main variants of DD, multiple variants of BB, Submarine, 2+ Variants of Carrier(soviet carriers are "special"), Hybrid BB/Carrier plus the "only 4" main variants of cruisers).
Meaning the WoT Matchmaker has less opportunities to fuck s**t up.
Is it malicious or lazy programming? To balance the matchmaking would take a massive amount of code and variables relative to just tier number and type. My money is on the fact they Cant be bothered and reckon that if they went to the effort the player base would moan anyway. It underlines the fact they see this as a business and don’t really care about the game.
@@JesusKreist Although esp. in the TD category there are wide differences. Like you have the stealthy almost unarmoured ones on one end and the heavily armoured glaciers on the other end.
@@kaltaron1284
Not keeping track of how many tanks there are in WoT.
I feel per month there is a dozen or more being added.
With the TD's you are right.
Somewhat.
But I'm talking about for instance a british light cruiser and a US heavy supercruiser/battlecruiser/whateveryouwanttocallit.
The matchmaker views both as equal.
The TD's you mentioned have way more in common than those two cruiser types.
@@JesusKreist Can you really compare let's say a Waffentraeger auf Panzer IV and a Doom Turtle?
But I guess the gimmicks in WoWs like radar, hydro, hybrids etc. matter a bit more than the differences is WoT.
Considering just how many advantages the reds had, this might as well have been a Game of Throws.
Truly they snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory
You didn't mention that based upon the Drach episode, the design this ship is based on should have over double the 5 inch secondary guns with an even bigger secondary broadside (some guns mounted on the centerline), and a much smaller superstructure.
It sure seems that wargamming took the cheap and easy way when it comes to the model and balancing rather than creating a unique and interesting ship. Instead of modifying the Iowa to have the correct rate of fire, number of secondaries and new superstructure, and then balancing it around HP pool and consumables. It just slapped some new turrets on the model and called it good.
WG has been doing that with literally every new ship these days. With the Pan American line they only created a couple of new ships; the rest are rearranged Worcesters and other ships already in the game. They're doing the same with the new European destroyer line as well, IIRC.
In fairness, each of these ships did cost many thousands of dollars to model as they are unusually detailed with internal structures being relevant in ways most games don't need to know. For sure, they are cheaping out on some aspects, but for a Free-to-Play game, it is not entirely surprising.
What really should worry us is that Wargaming's archive-divers, people who spent time looking through the archives for information on real ships and tanks to inform new or old vehicles, are spending less time at said archives. This suggests Wargaming is more or less convinced that they have all the real-world information they want out of the archives, meaning more fantasy tanks and ships will be coming with less and less attachment to reality.
As soon as Jingles mentioned the Illinois had "improved AA over the Iowa", I thought so that means it *might* shoot down one of the attacking planes, rather than none like is usual. Then I watched the rest of the video. Aaaaand BAPs' AA managed to shoot down about 1 plane per 2 attacks.
Doesn't matter with hybrids, regardless. Losing planes means nothing on a Hybrid, since the planes are a cool down, consumable. Planes fully resurrect every time the cooldown ends.
AA is just a placebo.
@@RedXlV Whenever I read a WG statement about a ship having "decent AA", my brain instantly replaces "decent" with "decorative".
Petition to call CV-hybrid cruisers/battleships "undercover fun polices"
Ghost Graphic Fun Police
Glowie fun police
Seeing that full HP Delaware at the end .... Loss of words
It’s because hybrid BBs mainly attract two of the worst types of players, CV mains and max-range BB “snipers”.
the thing is, its not particularly good as a battleship and if you charge in, you cant really use the planes because you are just a sitting duck. its just how it is with the ship.
@@jebes909090 Which is why adding hybrid BBs was such a bad idea.
Had a similar battle today, three hybrid BBs and two carriers per team. Like this replay, my Baltimore didn't stand a chance even though it has a very good AA capability. At this time I'm not convinced that hybrid BBs are a positive for the game, especially when match making recognises them as a BB only.
CV's are a negative for the game. Why would hybrids be any different?
Baltimore is a very good heavy cruiser, made near unplayable by the higher-tier foolishness. There are indications that WG is vaguely aware of the problem. However, if they get the one functional brain among that Confederacy of Dunces out of the deep-freeze they left it in, will it actually still work when surgically implanted in one of their vacant heads? Time will only tell, not optimistic.
Cry yourselves a river not like anyone is listening , just play subs if you can't deal with it .. go and play warthunder they've battleships if you can't deal with it
@@LordEmperorHyperion I paid good money to play a game I liked. Then they changed it. Years ago they said they would never add subs. Look what happened. Guess what? My wallet has snapped shut and these clowns are never seeing another dime of my money
you're not convinced? I am utterly convinced that they have a negative impact on the game
can't believe that Potato managed to live on _500_ health... for almost a minute. that was hilarious
I think the issue with the matchmaker is it has absolutely no functionality for checking ship capabilities, much less balancing them. The only things it has functionality to check are ship type and ship tier and it attempts to balance according to only those two factors. They would basically have to tear down the existing matchmaker and rebuild it more-or-less from scratch to add the functionality we want. So they don't.
Except...if some of those players achieved their win rates in predominantly different ship types than the one they are currently playing....? Because, complicated, but a nice try... :)
I love it how Jingles is desperately trying to find some logic ("let's think, why do these guns reload slower?") in a game where radar and hydro can see through islands, and where diesel-electric subs go at 20 knots under water and maneuvre better than a destroyer.
Had an amazing game with a CV, 2 hybrid BBs, and 2 tones.
The other team had none. So awesome. Not so much for the other team.
I get the feeling, that even if, by some miracle, guided missile air defence ships, like the Ticonderoga-class were added to the game, AA still wouldn't work, because reasons..... 🙂
Now we just need the USS Abraham Lincoln to come up in the Nuclear Ships patch of 2030 and we can have this episode named along side Jingles’ episode ‘Lincoln Park’ in which the USS Abraham Lincoln is featured doing what most carriers do best and parking in one spot on the map for the duration of the match!
5:39 acshually, jingles, the trb is on cooldown. Our Star took one torp, and two more sets were seen passing that gap sevonds later. And Yūgumo has only two sets.
Shotgun racking a round.mp3
The ineffectiveness of increased AA defense drives me insane.
This has been a problem since the cv rework, which incidentally is when I stopped playing.
The new USS IL is my new favorite toy. An amazing ship and glad to see her featured this early. Great vid Jingles and great job BelowAverage_Potato!
World of Warshits Matchmaking:
The team that wins has the highest average team win percentage, the highest number of battles played, the highest average team damage and highest average team ships destroyed per battle.
Those team averages are never close and the team with the higher percentages always wins.
I swear planes have separate armor values for before and after they do their runs, I've noticed that more tend to go down after the run than before and during it.
I believe that they get a damage reduction while in an attack run for some dumb reason
@@tallleprechaun1318 What do you mean dumb reason? Diving directly towards the guns actively trying to shoot you down is the moment when you're the least exposed /s
I've seen matchmakers, I did not worked on it myself but my colleagues did (not for WG, other company I won't name). While matchmaking is a rather simple operation for a human if there are few people to handle, it's an absolute nightmare to come with an algorithm that will do the same for thousands of player coming in and out of the queue every second and that will do all of the following:
1. be fast so the queue won't grow too big and player won't wait too long
2. be fair in regard to all the input parameters it has to consider (here, type of ship, ship ability, player rank…)
I can assure you of two things:
1. developers have to find a compromise between the two needs, and it always comes at a cost
2. the more parameters there are, the harder it is to have a fair matchmaker, even without the time constraint.
So, while I agree that wows matchmaking could be better, I'm not going to blame them too much for it, I've seen several projects where matchmaking was a recurring issue and coming with a good solution has never been easy and rarely achieved when the matchmaking was more complex than just "team people with similar level".
it was proven already that WG just simply wait to filll a room and put them whatever with only two or three rules like "same numbers of DD's", even the position is just garbage, ships that thrive close to islands are just throw in the middle of nowhere, etc
This matchmaker doesn't consider player rank, though. To make it more insulting, this battle had all of the ingredients in the room to be balanced. Two hybrids? Easy, one per team. Two radar cruisers? Easy, one per team. What did it do? Both hybrids and both radars on the same team.
Has anyone also considered that WG is also balancing high spenders versus cheap skates or the number of games each player is in ? I do better when I have just bought a ship or played my 1st game after a weeks absence. YES I am saying they are deliberate in their MM.
WG couldn't create a balanced match maker if it sat on their face and spun!
Wow my jingles sense jingled and I refreshed youtube at the exact moment this video went up.
beat the subscriber notification too!
7:57
I personally like to think of Illinois more as a fat buffalo since they get the same amount of guns and roughly the same reload just in a different disposition (yes, Buffalo gets the same guns as Des Moines, Des Moines just gets the reload as well)
Indeed. The only difference (like you stated), is the turret design and loading mechanisms. I haven't played against the Illinois yet, but I will soon lol
Phew, i was afraid that Jingles joined the dark side and this would be a hybrid battleship game...
Same.
For AA to actually be useful you need a ship with minimum 400 AA dps, the AA consumable the AA captain perk that improves sector reinforcement by 25% since that gets multiplied by the consumable. Without the AA consumable AA is just decoration unless you are super lucky and hit with flak and without 400 AA dps all the consumable does is decrease the planes accuracy without shooting any down.
The Illinois isnt similar to the Iowa, it was supposed to be an Iowa class, but was canceled in '45. Also, she was supposed to have 16" guns, not thes autoloading shenanigans that WoW gave us
The MM does match super ships against each other, but other than CVs it is happy to put a Tier X BB opposite a supership BB and a supership DD opposite a Tier X DD. Both teams will have the same number of superships.
As to radar, WG did address that once, stating that they did not see a win rate effect from radar being on one team and not the other. Anecdotally, I have seen the radar having team lose many times so they might have been telling the truth.
I find the Large Cruiser and hybrid BB issue to be more significant. One team gets Alaska and the other gets Ibuki is not really fair. Hybrids I am not thrill with, but given how many hybrid BB players seem to think they are playing CVs with really big last ditch self defense guns the effect on win rates may not be there.
AAs? What are you talking about, Jingles? They're pew-pew guns that WG added for immersion
being an Illinois native, i am impressed and pleasantly surprised with Jingles correct pronunciation of my home state
Hello There and good morning chaps, hope you all have a wonderful day
I once had a game where the MM gave the enemy team a hybrid and 4 radar cruisers and we only had 1 radar cruiser and no hybrid.
A nice game and I love the Des Moine. The idea of a Des Moine with armor is amazing.
Ahh yes an Iowa hull with Des Moines guns
what could possibly go wrong
maybe if AA was GOOD
wow finally caught a jingles release just as it came out :)
Morning Mighty Jangles. Thanks for the content.
"Dumb" matchmaking could also be used as a tool for WG to balance win ratio of players by putting them in weaker/stronger lineup.
It could, but it doesn't.
@@Swordphobic problem is we can't prove either or and when ppl ask to see the code that determines this they suspiciously block/avoid it just as they do with RNG code, I can only conclude there is something in the code, they don't want us to see, next step would be to offer lots of money and an agreement that will not show the hidden code but would be allowed to report to the player base if MM and RNG is actually 50/50 fair, till then the game is rigged in my eye
My grandfather served in US Navy during WWII. He developed the auto loading mechanism for the Eight Inch guns. He served on the USS Oklahoma which was sunk during the attack on Pearl Harbor. He thankfully went on shore leave the day before the attack.
For a second I though Jingles was going to be singing some Linkin Park :)
AA isnt for the ships defending themselves, the AA exists to enhance the experience of the CV players as they make strikes.
FYI - Jingles...since you challenged us to prove you wrong...
The purpose of AA guns in World War 2 was NOT to provide ship defense against air attack. It was to make air attack expensive for the attacker. No ship, not even US Navy late war AA, was capable of PREVENTING a determined strike by a flight of enemy planes.
Ship defense against air attack was ALWAYS provided by the air patrol from a carrier or land base. THAT would DEFEND an enemy air attack.
You can even see this in the carrier doctrines of the USN and RN as the war went on...taking on more and more fighters to provide this protection.
Is the way World of Warships balances AA guns shit? Absolutely.
Is the expectation of how air defense actually works by both the game developer and most of the player base completely wrong? Yes, indeed.
Thanks for the video Jingles
It is simply not comprehensible why they do not do one simple calculation: 24 players load into the lobby, now calculate the average winrate of both sides and re-sort a handful of players in such a way, that the winrates of both sides are very close. That would balance this game in a really really really nice way, especially when you have a unicum division on one side...
ok, you have a unicum duvision of 3 DDs and when 24 players load into the loby there are only potatos dds... how do you balance that? It's not that simple... Not defending WG here, they have no matchmaking in this game, just that it's complicated and wg is lazy af
Try being a BB in a battle with 2 CV's and 4 hybrids (Dutch and US) - being focused sees your game come in at sub 3 mins.
Talk to Flambass. He's the Head of the Matchmaking Department.
That Mainz deserves a medal
Agreed. That Nebraska kill at the end brought them close enough on points that the Delaware couldn't do anything useful with its AC.
It's interesting to watch this with my recent experience with my first Hybrid in the WOW Blitz game. High Tier Aircraft Carriers still feel pretty powerful in Blitz but Aircraft losses at low tier can lead to you losing your entire wing over the course of a battle. My first experience with the Hybrid Battleships in the Nebraska has been less than great. The aircraft replenishment takes somewhere between 60-90 seconds and in a games that last 7 minutes max it's generally more of a gimmick so far, but down the line you get more aircraft so I'll have to see. Because of that despite losing part or whole squadrons I've never run out of aircraft simply because I can't cycle through them fast enough. The Nebraska also only has 6 guns, so how things go can depend largely on if those guns hit well. As far as survivability I feel you are still citadel vulnerable, but it not you are EXTREMELY AP vulnerable. Basically that flight deck increases your hitbox massively and you take so much AP and HE damage simply because there is more of you to hit.
Happy Friday my Fellow Salt Miners
Wait, that captain did not have any of the AA build stuff? I cant see the icons going off. Maybe I am confusing it, but don't the AA skills (captain ones) get a white icon going off, when they are going active? So this one does not have the extended AA build.
Or is the complaint that there are 2 captain skills, and nobody is supposed to select them, and the AA should be dominating anyway?
The improved AA doesnt work against hybrid and soviet carriers because they only have the one attak flight to worry about, this should change with the upcoming AA changes
Hybrids are "Force Multipliers" and MM SHOULD balance them on each side.
Hybrid Theory? I thought this would be linkin park-related.
"I'm not going to say it's a bad ship, but it's not really a great ship either." - Every Jingles World of Warships video. Ever.
as Mountbatten put it in a recent vid about a triple Illinois division: The New Definition of Evil.
3 Illinois in a div in an arms race battle on Sleeping Giant, roflstomp their way through the battle.
36 8 inch guns working together melts ships. Specially when 1 of the div has reload buff built in and another has secondary build.
Thanks for the video, Jingles.
I'm kind of tempted to install the game and go full Carrier...Then just fly around the back of the map...
@1:36... couldnt relate any further jingles... 2 radar cruisers on the enemy team should be a crime against humanity.
I figured AA was something for secondaries to do (appear useful) while waiting to get close enough enemy ships to be useful.
Wargaming continues to shock me by having amazing instinct in identifying the most harmful things to add to the game, yet having the worst judges of effect of those things and implementing them anyway. First amazingly weird (stats such as armor, dpm or guns in general) russian ships, later some weird torpedo spammers and stuff, then aircraft carriers, then once again as rework, subs, tier 11, hybrids. And these are only main fails of balancing, you really could struggle hard to find something they did and worked well for the game...
doesn't really matter how many planes he shoots down. they will always have more.
you know, I think it is fair to say that once your are below 10k and all your heals are gone in a battleship, most of your AA has been destroyed, unless you are speced for AA specifically. I do agree AA is laughable, but I wouldnt expect to be taking down any planes when my superstructure is damage saturated from HE
YaY for daily dose of jingles!
11:24 "SHITTY DEATH" - I laughed out loud!
Once again,
Great video Jingles
Thanks 😁
@6:46 jingles says a piece of wisdom that describes the post Covid world to a T
The Illinois is the hybrid child of an Iowa and a Des Moines
And she is a lovely hybrid child!
Finally, someone who knows how to say Illinois without adding the S at the end.
Well I never got into WoW, but just a little question after some years of watching Jingles... why dont they make AA on ships make count? It seems to me that Aircrafts are just an easy way to win or did I miss something?
Nope, you've missed nothing.
They did count a bit way back before the carrier rework, when carrier players controlled multiple squadrons in a rts-like view. Back in those days they could even deplane carriers, rendering them useless, if the carrier player wasn't careful. Hell, even def AA was useful by increasing the spread of torpedoes and bombs dropped by those planes. Now ? Let's just say they adressed the perceived "problem" of deplaning by making AA useless.
originally you could shoot them down - but cv players are the soft, coddled, cancerous a$$ of WoWs - can't have them lose their planes - wouldn't want that!
@@mudman619 I was a carrier enjoyer back in those days, only because you had to think a lot before commiting to a strike "what is my target ? does he have any support ? did he took enough hits from other ships to soften his AA enough for my planes to survive the approach and return flight ? Which trajectory will I choose for the return flight to prevent the enemy carrier and dds to pinpoint my location ?" but that was the problem in WG's eyes, you had to think, plan, and be careful, and they can't have that in one of their games obviously.
Yeah, what Akredi said. When carriers were in the RTS version of the game, where the tier 10 Hakuryuu could have like 7 squadrons out at once, AA guns mattered. I don't know if you can still do it, but back then you could prioritise a squadron to deal damage to kind of like you can with secondaries. Defensive AA increased AA damage as well as "panicked" the squadrons making their drops spread out wildly (increasing the chance that there would be a gap big enough to fit your ship through and avoid the attacks). On top of that, with certain captain skills, players could get their AA cruisers to have AA ranges of upwards of 10km or more. Carriers had limited planes so a group of three or four ships, especially if one or more was an American cruiser, could wipe out entire squadrons, meaning carriers had to pick their battles and couldn't just suicide their planes in over and over again.
Unfortunately once the carrier "rework" happened and players were limited to one manually controlled squadron at a time, all of that was done away with. No more long range AA. No more prioritisation of squadrons. DFAA no longer panics squadrons. Carriers now effectively have unlimited planes. And grouping up doesn't matter as much because WarGaming have made it so it only counts 2 or 3 (I forget which exactly) ships' AA defenses.
And AA damage itself? Originally it was basically a dice roll, with your AA guns' damage being how many rolls of the dice per second or something to roll a "kill" on a plane in a squadron. 500 damage listed? 500 chances per second or whatever to shoot down planes. And that was per AA type (so if a ship had single 20mm mounts, twin 20mm mounts, twin 40mm mounts, and 127mm dual purpose guns, there would be 4 simultaneous dice rolls based on each type's damage value to down planes).
Nowadays it's all grouped into short, mid, and long range AA, and given a base damage over time value per range. Sounds nice, but short range is useless (it only deals damage when a squadron has already dropped it's payload on you), long range is situational at best (low raw DoT, and flak bursts may deal lots of damage but are fairly easy to avoid), and not many ships have good mid range AA where the damage is most important (against flights that are actively dropping on you, to mitigate or destroy them before they drop). The kicker? AA now has accuracy, effectively reducing your DoT by how much below 100% it is (100 damage with 70% accuracy is effectively 70 damage).
WarGaming babies it's carriers, and has enacted so many buffs and mechanics "enhancements" over the years to increase player count of CVs (which is all they care about to determine if a ship is balanced, NO JOKE), to the point that they are impossible to properly play against except for the tone-deaf and out-of-touch nonsensical advice that WeeGee gave, that is, to "just dodge."
almost thought it was going to turn into a game of throws at the end there!
thank you another great video and I enjoy all that you put out , I first found you when you did some elite dangerous videos , how about doing some more seeing you do some on foot missions would be nice
Jingles mentioned during one of his Mingles that the current state of that game doesn't warrant any attention, in his opinion.
WG: It's fine
Jingles: Are you stupid?
Watching title of the video - did'n peg you for Linkin park fan Jingles
this vid let me realise, they mostly need to drastically nerf the rate at which planes regenerate (or even disable it outright tbh)
I was very tense during the first ten mins, to see if Jingles would call the Illinois the 'Iowa' for the whole game...
Fully agree that the matchmaker should try to balance the individual capabilities of each ship, or at least very key capabilities like radar, planes, etc. However, I don't think this battle was any poster child for the so-called "fun police". Not just because they lost, but…
• The Illinois was able to kill 1/5 planes pre-drop, using the priority sector, when he wasn't hugging an island. It's a bit hard to tell because the island isn't that tall, but it seemed the AA wasn't engaging as quickly while he was hugging the B island, so otherwise he was able to cut the impact by 20%.
• When he wasn't hiding, he cut it a lot further by giving broadside to the planes with a vertical crosshair. (And lucky for him, the Delaware came in from the stupidest angle while he *was* hiding, but you can't count on that.)
• The whole point of the AA mechanic is to group ships together and combine their AA, which actually worked rather well for everyone behind the Illinois.
• The Illinois has improved AA, but US aircraft have improved health (at the cost of speed). The Delaware gets to hit at least *some* bombs nearly every time, but wastes a lot of time doing so.
• And waste time Delaware did, clearly, given that it was *literally* full-health by the end of a lost game. It was not a BB and a CV that game - it was half of a CV at best, and thanks to the captain's incompetence it was never even half of a BB.
If it had faster firing gun's like the DM and Anna. it be op af.
As someone from Illinois, I was surprised at Jingles correct pronunciation. A lot of people from out of state add the "S" at the end, but it is in fact a silent letter.
He is close to France which has many silent letters. Usually when I say I live in Illinois, they pronounce the s just to see if it annoys me
One of the things as well with the cruiser matchmaking is that it doesn't account for light/heavy/super cruisers. I once had a game with an Alaska, Des Moines, and a Minotaur on one team.. Where the other team was left with two Minotaurs and a Worcester.
I find the new pan Asian cruisers to be a bit weird. The high tier ones have no secondaries but have AA with ranges exceeding 6km. Short range on the main guns. The tier 9 has 4 turrets of 3 guns each only able to fire AP like British lights and all 4 turrets rotate 360 degrees. it has torpedoes, Hydro and Radar as well as a improved heal. The tier 9 is pretty fun to play, was lucky to get it in one of those 350 gold bundles the first one gave me the ship I had the gold from a super container, so I got it.
Jingles I have a question, I live in America and I got an add for a TV show "Holding" from what I gathered it's a show kn the OK. Are taking the Micky???
I'm beginning to observe serious flaws in the software updates coming from WOW. The loss of the Russian IT people is becoming noticeable. Running CHECK AND REPAIR after every update and addition is absolutely a necessity now. Something in update 12.1 scrambled the C++ element of my programing and I didn't even know what C++ was until then. I do now.
Can't believe this vid is 12 min up and has already so many likes and comments ^^ Jingles magic ;)
Question. If there is a dockyard assignment where u need X amount of main battery hits with a BB. Wouldnt this ship be verry broken ?
Hybrid Theory by Linkin Park. I miss Chester. Good video Jingles!
Sorry jingles but I dont agree with you. He was attacked by aa after being on low health so most likely some of it was destroyed. Then there is the fact that ships did not shoot down intire squadrons in ww2 either (I know wows is not based on realism but still) and the last point iam trying to make is you are just complaining about aircraft but you are not giving us a solution either (you are basically a polition). I know cvs are not perfect but they are a part of Naval warfare and so wows as well. Nobody would play them if all the aircraft would get shot down all the time. I understand the point you are making but at least give a solution or something because i love to listen to you but the negativety ain't making it better. Still have been a subscriber since you started your war thunder video's so still love you. Just giving my opinion👌🏽
So basically Jingles, what you're saying is that WOWS is irreparably stuffed, to use a more polite word than I'd like. Yeah, that's what I thought too.
Jingles i have another aprouch on the topic of AA, in WOWS you have AA for you ship to look impressive and good on the port for a screenshot, and only that
Little bit like world of tanks. Both teams get a heavy tanks. One gets team gets a maus and type 5 heavy acompanied by t57 heavy. Other team 279e and chieftain with a vz55.
The Musashi player should have gotten a shoutout too. He got 5 kills!
Recently played in a double CV per team game BUT the enemy also had 2 of the Bull5hit Hybrid BB's as well...
That's right - the enemy had 4 CV's and we only had 2.
Guess how that game went???
I'd LOVE a way to get CV's removed or choose if you want to play against them...
@@Onyx99au playerbase: can I have fun
Weegee: no
My money is on: up the smelly creek without paddles 🙂
I have to admit ... I was waiting for a "Game of Throws" type ending.
hybrid theory my first thought was linkin park lol
Yeeep......you know....jingles is soo Dumb....sorry, numb....is soo numb.....🤣
Jingles, will you be going to Tankfest this year, and if so, what dates
On the other had, AA on ships in WW2, how effective were they really?
American AA had radar fused warheads. It was absolutely lethal.
there is a version of Wyoming as an AA training battleship i wish we can see that in game
Okay, I just got the Nebraska today, and I've played a few battles in her. First, yes she gets Dive Bombers, but only one flight of 5. Plus there is a reload, like your main guns. So as an Aircraft Carrier, she kind of falls short. Now yes, you can use the planes to spot the enemy, and drop a few bombs. As for her guns, not bad, 10 twin turrets with the 127mm guns. Not a brawler, but can hold her own. So don't get so bent out of shape.
How do you get the Illinois, is it doublons ?
Welcome all
Hybrid Theory - best album ever
It is great indeed