Dark and Darker - Damage Calculations Explained
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ต.ค. 2024
- If you want the formula written out, here it is:
(((Weapon Damage * Impact Zone Bonus * Combo Bonus * (1 + Power Bonus)) + Additional Physical Damage) * (1 + Hit Location Bonus) * (1 - Damage Reduction) * (1 - Projectile Reduction)) + True Damage
I forgot to include Impact Zone and Combo bonuses. Think of Impact Zone as your sweet/sourspots on your weapon, and Combo as the bonus damage your weapon gets for latter hits in the combo. These only multiply Weapon Damage, same as Power Bonus.
Formula is same for Magical Damage, just substitute the words "Weapon" and "Physical" with "Magical".
The only time Combo and Impact Zone apply to Magical Damage is if it's the Crystal Sword's special "Magical Weapon Damage".
(Not like you'd know your enemy's damage reduction until after one of you is already dead, but that's a topic for another time.)
Check out the Dark and Darker Wiki: darkanddarker....
You're an absolute hero to the community.
Dude, you're a legend. Totally gonna use this info for fair and balanced builds.
Says the guy who only has a wizard and rogue
Sincerely thank you for taking the time to do this. The information is in this game is very hard to find so it's great to see
Updates:
2023/08/23: Weakpoint Attack now functions differently, reducing AR instead of PDR%. This makes figuring out how much Weakpoint is affecting your damage very... weird and unintuitive. It won't affect the bonuses you get from PDR% on gear, Taunt, Holy Protection, Protection Shrines, and the AR to PDR curve is very variable and awkward to calculate.
We've also found that there may be more limb multipliers than merely 50%. For example, your arm takes more damage than your hand.
I've just tested a rogue that's going all in on magical damage, with a magic power bonus of 5% and 6 true magical damage and 15 additional magic damage. Training dummy test shows the stacks dealing 3-4 damage a tick with this. Scaled down that should be 1(base) +3 +7.5=11.5 a tick , but is not the case. There's three different explanations I have for this:
1) The attribute scaling modifier is actually more severe than 50% for poison weapon.
2) The 11.5 total is added to the 4, resulting in 15.5, resulting in the tick being 3.75, and training dummy rounds down.
3) Ironmace have hard-capped how much damage poison weapon can do.
Would be cool to hear your take on which it is.
@@Mitril47 It's option 2.
Need you to do one for clerics and healing. With will knowledge magical healing and magical power please
@@mathew4485 It's basically the same. The only stats that matter are Magical Healing (acts like +Weapon or +Magical) and Magic Power Bonus (which gets influenced by Magic Power and Will). Default Cleric Lesser Heal with Advanced Healer is (15 + 5) * 1.4, or 28.
@@clowdk is 1 will +1 magical power ?
This is amazing! Have you ever considered making a list of perks and for each one determining if it adds weapon damage, additional damage, true damage, %physicalpowerbonus, or physicalpower?
Amazing video on this!
That would be on the wiki. The descriptions there are changed to be more accurate compared to the in-game descriptions.
If anyone was curious, Crystal Swords will add your +Additional Magic Damage to their melee attacks. I tested it out on the target dummies in the goblin caves.
Weapom dmg stat is and was op and they instead nerfed attributes. Reddit is always wrong lmao
i was looking for a video like this yesterday to figure out how to optimally build my wizard. I'm pretty sure you are the first. like + Sub GOAT
Watched every single video of yours talking about dark and darker, and i've got to say... your content is amazing; short, sweet, and straight to the point. I've subscribed and I'll recommend you to my friends as well
So in general prioritize Strength and Weapon damage. Add magic damage for casters.
For low strength Rogues you can go for true and add phys damage to ignore your power penalty.
%Damage probably isn't as good unless you have ridiculous gear and stats, in which case you're going to kill quick anyway.
Would like to see some practical builds for each class. Say you limit yourself to a base class with 4 perks and then see how you can max out your damage using roughly the same stat increases in different positions.
would be interested to know the scaling for all things healing & protection spell
ambush rogues prio str+wdmg. got it. thanks cutie
why he sound like ☝🤓
Awesome Video, always come back here to refresh my memory. I’m still confused about Additional Damage and True Damage. Based on the calculations, aren’t they the same thing but with True Damage being a little Better?
No, they are calculated differently. Additional is added earlier on in the formula, and so is affected by things like damage reduction and headshot/limb multipliers. True is added at the end of everything, meaning that it cannot benefit from head/limb multipliers, but it also cannot be reduced by damage reduction.
I'm unsure of the current enchantment balance (I haven't played in some time), but at some point, Additional was more plentiful than True as well. You could get +3 Additional, but only +2 True. I don't know if that's the case now, be sure to check the wiki. If the available amounts ARE different in current version, then that is another factor to consider.
What stat should i pump for the biggest damage benefits from bard's "piercing shrill" flute song?
Additional Physical/True Physical. Probably True Physical, because a lot of teams are running Physical Damage Reduction lately.
Hey @clowed I managed to get curse of pain to do 2 damage dot but I can’t get it to go higher. Any tips ?
Any increase is valuable, because the game keeps track of decimal HP. You might be dealing 2.1 or 2.2 per tick and it won't show up on the dummy, but it will help against players and enemies.
Did some testing with Rouge's Rupture
It seems that "+weapon dmg stats" doesn't need to be divided by 2 (as the example you said with Achilles strike at 4:12)
As long as your physical power is over 0%, +5 weapon dmg gear made my dot dmg go from 4 to 5
I have recorded the test on YT (uploaded on private though) if you want to examine it.
Anyone know if barbarian Armor pen strike and Alkalies strike stack? Like does the dot ticks benefit from the 75% armor pen, also does the dot benefit from the 1,5/1,6 headshot multiplyer?
The DoT does not benefit from headshots, and only the initial attack benefits from Armor Penetration, as I understand it.
Thank you@@clowdk
it would be so cool if there was some kind of excel sheet you could add in the numbers and see your damage output. thanks for the explanations
@clowdk
Hello, i'm maybe wrong but i don't understand.
I hit with my crossbow Headshot 110 on dummy when mathematic say i hit 164.285
(((62 * (1 + 4.7%)) + o) * (1 + 150%) * (1 - 0) * (1 - O)) + 2 = 164.285
Where 62 is Weapon Damage + Add Weapon Damage
4.7% is Power Bonus
o is 0 Additional damage
150% is headshot multiplier
0 is 0 damage reduction
O is 0 projectile reduction
2 is true damage
I really don't get the 54 drop damage
Why barb ( in defaule gear,axe) Got more damage with AXE SPECIALIZATION then SAVAGE ( if both inc phys dmg bonus by 10)
47.5(axe spec) and 45.6( savege) dmg by 1 attack with default axe
These videos are just entertaining to watch, you could talk about anything and id listen
Are spell like curse of pain, fireball, zap, helfire, or chain lightning subject to headshot and body shot multipliers?
Some are, some aren't. It mostly seems to boil down to whether the hit is considered a "projectile". Zap, Chain Lightning, Hellfire, and Curse of Pain aren't considered projectiles, so they don't benefit. Fireball's Direct Hit portion is, as are Ice Bolt and Magic Missile, so they do benefit.
instant sub. looking forward to future videos.
I want to say, hellfire will only give me the damage info in the warm up room if I hit a arrow type target. The dummies give me zero damage information
Please make class specific videos that spoon feed me info on what stats are ideal because I'm dumb ( im speaking for the majority of the DaD community myself mainly).
so much calculation while u get get one shooted by every crossbow when u play wizard
Bruh.. I was waiting for him to hit a dummy for like 200 kinda sad that didn't happen
Never cared for your politics much but ngl this is some solid work Mr Shapiro
Wouldn't Rogue's base poison damage's power bonus at 3:55 be 0.75x not 0.5x since it has 50% scaling? So 0.675 damage a second.
Correct, minor error on my part
great maths, always clutch 🍺🍺 10 / 10 @clowd
If you want the formula written out, here it is:
(((Weapon Damage * Impact Zone Bonus * Combo Bonus * (1 + Power Bonus)) + Additional Physical Damage) * (1 + Hit Location Bonus) * (1 - Damage Reduction) * (1 - Projectile Reduction)) + True Damage
I forgot to include Impact Zone and Combo bonuses. Think of Impact Zone as your sweet/sourspots on your weapon, and Combo as the bonus damage your weapon gets for latter hits in the combo. These only multiply Weapon Damage, same as Power Bonus.
Formula is same for Magical Damage, just substitute the words "Weapon" and "Physical" with "Magical".
The only time Combo and Impact Zone apply to Magical Damage is if it's the Crystal Sword's special "Magical Weapon Damage".
Goated Video For Math Nerds like myself. This confirmed a lot of my assumption which I was pretty certain on, but I still got to learn a bit due to the projectile segment and the Various Discrepancies.
Your videos are always great. I also see you contributing on the wiki. Good man. Thank you for your service
You should make an excel where you can put in stats and it gives you dps and max hits.
Appreciate the video, thanks for sharing!
So basically whats the best and the worst damage/power stats on wizard?
"babe, how does DND even work, how do i play?"
Me:
Does True Physical Damage increase damage on Rupture or is that only for Additional Damage? Same with Poisson Weapon, does True Magic Damage increase the damage?
Yes they do! (Both scale at .5 thought meaning they would need +2 to get an actual extra damage on the poison or rupture)
A question I’ve been wondering about is whether or not Physical/Magical Bonus affects skills like Judgement, and this answered that. I did run into something tho, while I was in goblin caves I hit the target dummy with a War Maul as Cleric, in the body, and it did 49 damage. I then hit the dummy in the head, and it did about 89 damage, which made me think the headshot bonus was 80%. I didn’t have any buffs active at the time, just Blunt Weapon mastery. What might have caused that?
Maybe it was limb
Could have been the weapon's impact zones. Hitting with the handle does less damage than hitting with the head of the Maul, for instance.
The poison torch would have me figuring out how to refund the game
Not all heroes wear capes, but someone ought to trade you one.
Super helpful, sent this one to my friends so we can all make our builds even better. Thank you
ahhh so that's why every rogue 3 shots me, the scaling is just better for them
So how does % Damage Bonus work? Is it calculated where additional damage is calculated? And if so, is the percent bonus based off of base weapon damage, or is based on the percentage of (base + weapon/magical damage) * power bonus ?
Or is % Damage Bonus actually just % Power Bonus and poorly written within the game?
Nvm I just looked in game and I can see that "% Magical/Phsyical damage bonus" is actually just % Magical/Physical power bonus.
Yeah, most descriptions in this game are rough.
Okay, one stupid question: If I'm a Fighter that uses Weapon Mastery perk and uses a Rogue dagger with 10% physical damage bonus penalty, does this mean I can just nullify this penalty just by increasing the bonus by 10% or more?
Correct
@clowd what about weapons "combo" multipliers? For example castillion dagger has 150% damage on third attack. Is it only affect weapon damage or works like headshot/limbs multiplier?
I forgot it at the time, but it's in the description as well as the wiki's Damage Calculation Page:
darkanddarker.wiki.spellsandguns.com/Damage_Calculation
It only affects Weapon Damage, similar to Power Bonus.
So is it normal for the dot portion of Warlock spell to still do 1 dmg with a 2 magic dmg crystal ball and perks for will/dmg? What parts or dots of Warlocks spells benefit from crystal ball 2 dmg?
The dummy kind of lies to you, because it resets to full HP every time you hit it, and so you'll never see your decimal damage increases. By default, Curse of Pain is doing 1.25 damage per second without factoring in any Power Bonus or damage increases, but you'll never see that on a dummy. Any increase to your damage is affecting it, but in order to actually "turn over" the dummy's damage, you'd need enough bonuses to turn the DOT from 10 damage total to 16 damage total.
Also, Dark Enchancement does nothing currently, if that's the damage perk you're talking about. None of Warlock's spells care currently considered Dark Magic.
@@clowdk So is the 2 magic dmg from ball not bumping the dot to 2.25 dmg per tick? Which would make it over 16. Or only + 2 additional magic dmg stat/true dmg on gear makes the dot higher?
Thanks for the replies btw
@@ZK-nb3cq It adds to the total of the DoT, which is 10 by default, divided by 8 seconds. It doesn't add 2 per tick, it adds 2 to that total.
@@clowdk Ohhh so 2 impact dmg and 2 to total dot. So 2 magic dmg for Warlock curse = 4 total dmg increase?
And does blow of corruption magic portion get inc by Ball 2 magic dmg?
@@ZK-nb3cq The DoT gets half benefit, so 2 for impact and 1 for DoT = 3 total.
And yes, BoC does benefit from Ball damage.
Great video, do you have an idea of when +magical healing is placed in the healing equation? does it come before or after power bonus?
It should be before.
You sound like Jeff nippard and talk like him too 😂
1.5 multiplier is 50% increase not 150%
4:32 1.15/2 is not 1.075, im assuming your calculation is correct at the end and its just a small error writing out the formula.
Very good video tho ty
Yeah, it's meant to be 1 + (0.15/2). Minor mistake.
Just me or is this system 2 or 3 multipliers too complicated?
heya so just to understand since I'm a bit curious.
at what point does magic damage bonus/magic power, outscale 1 point of add magic. I see some crazy spellbooks but not sure if they do anything compared to add magic.
Depends on the spell's base damage, but usually each point of Magic Power/Will will increase your bonus by 3% before 25 Power, and 2% before 40 Power. Let's take Lightning Strike, for example, with 35 base damage, and something like a 5 damage Spellbook. Adding 3% damage to that 40 base would be 1.2 damage, but adding 2% damage would only be 0.8 damage. So in this very specific scenario, Power would be more impactful than Additional Magic, as long as your Power hasn't exceeded 25 yet. Of course, with smaller damage spells, you're rarely going to get over 1 point of damage from a 3% increase, so even if you have this very specific scenario, you might still not care about Power because it won't benefit things like Magic Missile, Zap, Ice Bolt, each section of Fireball, etc. as much as Lightning Strike/Chain Lightning.
@clowd what about stuff that gives like 4% physical power bonus? Is it better than lets say 2 weapon damage?
Depends, if your class is hurting for Power (let's say Rogue with default -17%) then Power might be a better idea. But 2 Weapon Damage is generally going to be better otherwise.
interested to know if this is still accurate to current patch
Followed everything except 4b. IMO, you glossed over the part about damage reduction quite a bit too quick. I don't know all the spells in the game and their text, so even deciphering the text made it a bit unclear.
Anyway, this was a great video. Liked and subbed.
So, ignite, blow of corruption, and smite all add instances of magical damage to physical attacks, but I don't think you explicitly said if additional magic damage as an enchantment on gear is added to physical attacks and vice versa if additional physical is added to spell damage. I think physical classes cannot benefit from additional magic damage or true magic damage, but I am really not sure; some clarification on this point would be sublime.
Yeah, Additional Physical won't be added to spells, and Magical stuff won't be added to your weapons. The only way to do so is with things like Ignite, Smite, etc. I remember hearing that in Korea, it was popular to use the Survival Bow with Ignite while the Ranger wore a lot of +Magic Damage gear.
The musik u used is great. cool vibe!
Hey just curious about true dmg. Lets say my sword does 10 dmg and has 2 true dmg and the your hitting dummy with no armor, would this do 10 dmg in the form of 8 + 2 true or would this do 10 + 2 true? thanks
10 + 2. It's adding new damage, not converting old.
is there a link to that damage calculator sheet?
If i understand this correctly, does this mean Will is ass on Wizard since the base magic weapon damage is super low on weapons so the magic power bonus is relatively un useful? Or does it scale off base values for spells?
It scales on base spell + book/staff/ball damage. So Zap's MBP-scaleable value is 20 + 5 on default Wiz.
amazing imput...but quick question...wehat about smite? what adds to it damage best? if additional magic and true magic dmg works for it .. im sure that would.. but ffrom what im seeing im not sure they do. i may be wrong and bad at math but who knows.
They do add to Smite. True Magical is probably best, because Smite can't benefit from headshots.
On Ranger is there a point of stacking weapon damage and additional damage that at some point Strength/Physical Power would be beneficial in replacement of weapon damage since its multiplied off of your physical power and most likely you're either be negative or very low on the bonus such as 4%. Also how much physical power do you get per point of strength? And how much physical power = 1 weapon damage for ranger?
Can you please explain the difference between Physical damage add and weapon damage add?
I am having a hard time finding information on this
Weapon Damage: Only applies to attacks from your weapon, not to abilities like Rupture. Benefits from Power Bonus.
Additional Damage: Applies to attacks and to abilities. Does not benefit from Power Bonus.
darkanddarker.wiki.spellsandguns.com/Damage_Calculation#Weapon_Damage
I literally cant tell you how many times ive been hit once and gotten taken down to 1 hp, Its like so frustrating but i gotta know why!
There's a lot of damage stacking in this game. With +10 Weapon Damage on gear, with something like a blue Falchion, plus headshot bonus, you're looking at 72 damage. And that's no Power Bonus. There's much higher damage potential, but that's a modest build you'd see a well-geared Fighter using.
So now that achilles strike only does 1 dmg on each step, would true magical damage add to that or does true magic not work on achilles strike?
Achilles does physical damage, so magic damage modifiers do not work on it.
Is there any good source on how much total damage spells do? I can't seem to find the actual damage numbers on spells anywhere
Check out the wiki, link in description
Are decimals accounted for and just don't display, or is there rounding?
Decimals are accounted for and don't display. Your HP is displayed rounded up (99.1 HP shows as 100 HP). The dummy doesn't keep track of decimal HP, which is why minor increases in damage on DoTs won't be immediately obvious. You can't tell the difference between 1.5 and 1.7 DPS on a DoT using the dummy, but it WILL affect players and enemies.
Is there a dropoff in dmg if you hit people with range weapons from far off or dont channel your arrow for max duration in your longbow for example?
Yes! I believe it's just distance, though. I don't think holding the arrow for longer does anything.
so for a wizard ,mana surge fireball mastery and arcane mastery , are all useless? or just less value because they are based on power? is that correct?
They are all based on Power, yes.
Were these formulas released or did somebody calculate them? If somebody calc'd them, then bravo.
Forced Scaling: How does 1.15/2 = 1.075?
It was meant to be 1 + (0.15/2), formatting error on my part.
so does weapon damage do anything on wizard while using a spellbook or no? and is magic power better or additional magical
Physical Modifiers like Weapon Damage don't work on Magic Damage, and vice versa. Additional Magical is better, generally speaking.
Sounds like some bugs needs to be fixed.
so how and why should I build a wizard? I know that magical damage on books is great but what about the rest? how useful is strength or magical interaction speed on a book?
Outt dated calculations DaD updated on 8/22/2023 with a new DR calculation
The Armor Rating curve has been modified and slightly flattened at the very high range.
Physical Damage Reduction now has a hard cap of 85%.
DR still functions the exact same way in terms of multiplication, the difference is what their DR would be. Doesn't change the equation at all. What DID change is Weakpoint's functionality.
How does the new penetrating shot fit in to the calculations? Wondering if true shot is more powerful on a gray crossbow
my math aint mathing, do the dummies in the pre-game lobby have any damage reduction?
Currently they have -12% Physical Damage Reduction.
What is better. Magic power +1 or additional magic damage +1
Additional damage. Magic Power multiplies the base damage of spell + your staff/book/ball. Usually increasing that damage by like 1 or 2% isn't as impactful as adding another whole number of damage.
So ignites' DoT benefits from Additional magic damage? And if so, why doesn't any of the ignite wizards run fire mastery? If you had +20 add magic damage, wouldn't that mean the burn effect alone would burn for 60 damage (not taking resistance into account)?
No, because the DoT is all one flat damage number that gets calculated first, then divided by duration. You get damage over the total duration, not per-tick. If you added +20 to Fireball's afterburn, it'd go from 3 damage to 13 (because of the 50% scaling), then divided by 3 for 4.333 damage per tick. Same with Ignite, but Ignite doesn't even benefit from Fire Mastery's afterburn duration buff, so there's that.
i love kirby air ride music :^)
Damn, and here I was thinkning Axe specialization was giving me 5 more weapon damage which sounded insane to me. In reality, its giving 5 physical :(
Didn’t understand but good video
love these videos
How does magical power apply to rogue poison weapon if poison weapon does it's full damage on a dummy
So what would be better go realistically? Weap damage or additional physical damage ?
Weapon, unless you're specifically building for things like Rupture or your Power Bonus is super negative.
ok ty@@clowdk
Thanks, you should do a video on armor/weapon rarity and possible stat rolls, cuz i dont think theres any info on it :/
All mobs (except for the Giant Spider) have -22% Physical Damage Reduction.
So I heavily assume that value comes from mobs having 0 Armor Rating.
So a Bard’s Shriek of Weakness would easily hit the cap of -25% Physical Damage Reduction cap.
So I just wanted to double check. Does the -25% cap count only for players or for mobs aswell?
Aka. is my Bard trolling when casting Shriek of Weakness on mobs? :)
They most certainly are not trolling. Shriek's -30 turns mobs from -22% to -79%.
Also, where are you getting the idea that the Giant Spider doesn't have -22%, or that the cap is at -25%?
@@clowdk the cap was a misinformation i had, i thought i read it in the patch notes. I double checked, no mention of it lol.
In the wiki under /Monsters it lists the resistances for mobs. For the giant spider it says -10% Physical Resistance.
Thx for clarifying!
My brain still exploded
Wait, if the default dmg of rouges poison is only .45 per second how much dmg does it do against a cleric with perseverance? Nothing?
As I said in video, Perseverance doesn't seem to be able to reduce damage below 1. Since poison is already below 1, it doesn't seem to change.
@@clowdk I find that it hard to believe that perseverance does nothing against poison
will true magical damage be added to the damage of a regular weapon without any base magical damage
Impressive, I wonder how you found this out, thank you for your work
@clowdk - Im curious in relation to "damage scaling" - In previous patches spell scaling was reduced from 100% to 50% and then reverted. However Bard's shrill spell I think was left at 50%. Im curious where in the equation this scaling applies. I am assuming it occurs after (Base dmg x Bonus damage) - and only affects additonal/true. Is this correct?
It affects any bonus damage. So +Weapon, +Additional, +True, AND Power Bonus. If your Power Bonus is -10%, it becomes -5%, and if it's 40%, it becomes 20%, etc.
Full info on it is here: darkanddarker.wiki.spellsandguns.com/Damage_Calculation#Attribute_Bonus_Ratio
Clarification question: 3:55-4:25, does the negative default power bonus of Rogue not get cut in half by the forced scaling discussed right after this? So would a default stat rogue's -50% magic power bonus actually be effectively -25% for dots? Also small thing but the graphic at 4:25 seems to be simplifying the power bonus calculation, example (1.15/2 = 1.075) should be (1 + (0.15/2)) = 1.075.
Yeah, those were a few minor errors on my part. You're correct in both departments.
Amazing videos! keep it up, possibly with every patch! Unlimited videos! Unlimited entertainment for me ^^'
How does armor pen work into all this ? Is it worth stacking it or..
As shown in video, it multiplies their DR%. Probably worth using in the current DR meta, but that's getting changed apparently? We'll see what gets changed
time to make this into an excel spreadsheet cause I'm too dumb for math
Is that Kirby air ride music in the background?
Aye