I am annoyed by the trend of closed-off 2020 extrusions on a lot of these newer printers, I guess it's for aesthetic reasons, at the expense of never being able to attach anything to them if you have a need to... I suppose it doesn't matter *as* much for Z where the carriage blocks all sides of it, but even then it bums me out a bit for future reuse potential
Also limits modding potential in the future, especially when looking to attach linear rails. I wish they just used regular extrusions with those filler strips if they want to create a clean look.
Can always drill and tap the rails. I have done it and it works. Can also replace thr 2020 rails all together but that's a bit of work to pretty much rebuild the frame. I do agree that it's annoying none the less.
What's the benefit of having a bed slinger vs CoreXY? I can think of perhaps Ease of assembly, and you've already disproven the cost argument with the Rook.
CoreXY are still more complex to build and maintain that is why most OEM companies come out with bed slinger printers. I hope that changes and I am trying to make CoreXY more accessible but there is still a market for i3 / ender 3 style printers. Unfortunately a printer like the Rook is hard to scale up to the size of a Ender 3
@@Rolohaun I spend more time fixing my MK3S+ than printing. I’m waiting for you to release a heated bed version before I take the plunge into your design. PLA has too much creep on most of the stuff I build that’s under constant load unfortunately.
I havent had good luck with strain gauge style abl. They seem to degrade over time. Might be fine for a lot of people but with the sort of heavy use i put them through they just dont seem to last.
@@Rolohaun Ive only had experience with the creality style and It was a while ago so hopefully theyve gotten better since then. On those printers it seemed to fatigue over time and I couldnt get repeatable or usable results from it after a few months of use.
CR-6 SE already did all this, and let me tell you, that goddamn strain gauge is not fun when it's not working as intended! Is it also dual stepper drivers for Z or is it one + 2 motors?
I can't say i trust optical endstop. They tend to be sensitive to the amount of incident light, stray sunlight in particular! Not that the likes of us know anything about sunlight right? Still, there is a particular trigger threshold and the line width of the IR path isn't even that small, so the amount of ambient light can really determine where within this width the actual triggering happens. When optical endstops are used, they need to be shielded from light thoroughly, which here isn't the case at all. You should try, you can really mess up optical endstop just with light, it's not good, i have some of these for a project, also some nicer Vishay optical gates, all of them susceptible. I used to have a Halogen lamp near my printer, and this is just the PERFECT way to confuse an optical gate. A mechanical endstop can be practically perfect. There is a little bit of temperature sensitivity but not much. I think most important is just the design around it. Hitting a large lever with a wobbly screw: bad, absolutely bad, garbage! Hitting the lever with something stable: better. Removing lever and hitting the little button directly: awesome! But you get little overtravel so more probability to destroy the switch, but really, not by much! On the other hand a spare switch is only a few cents. About strain gauge probing, i don't trust it either. For one you have to ensure that you have no gunk on the nozzle, you have to clean it hot. But then you can't just probe hot, because you'll put dents into the bed covering plastic. It's safer to have a probing method which doesn't depend on the nozzle. One layer cooling fan - depends which! A Sunon 5015 can provide OODLES of air and a Delta 5015 can provide a SCARY amount of air. You don't need two of those. But cheap 5015 and especially 4010 that 3D printer companies use, they aren't all that, and i think they don't last long either. The whole cooling on these printers is kind of a joke, like, the cold end fan just leaks down in and does most of the part cooling duty, but doesn't do it well. How does the screen on these work? Is there bootloader or other upgrade method foreseen for Marlin? Have they published the sources? What board and is the board schematic published? Back in the day they were quite thoroughly and happily open-source but needs an eye.
optical sensor is fine for Z as it is only used to home it then it is ignored for the rest of the print, I can see in a situation where the endstop was used often there could be issues with light affecting it however for homing, its a very short time that its used.
@@Rolohaun Well someone else has a halogen/incandescent light source nearby, someone has a window. Your personal build should be whatever suits you; a product should be designed to be somewhat resilient to a range of normal conditions. I dread it if the printer manufacturers took upon your recommendation and just installed optical Z endstops. They haven't picked it for engineering quality reasons, they picked it for buzzword and fad reasons, and you took the bait. A good use for an optical switch is for a DIY Z probe, which can be shielded from light on basically all sides, that works superbly. It solves some mechanical issues that switch based probes suffer from, like you can put a huge overtravel into the design which helps retract it for example.
@@SianaGearz optical endstops can be shielded anywhere even on Z. I just prefer them as they are more accurate and have no moving parts. Not a buzz word or fad, delta printer basically need optical endstops for the accuracy.
I can't really see how these v-wheel machines are asking more than the Sovol SV06. After fighting with v-wheel printers for a couple of years, they have no room in 3d printing honestly. My ancient Monoprice Maker Select V2 had linear rods and bearings and it was $200 in 2016. V-Wheels just suck.
I really wish these companies would stop making these stupid i3 style printers. There is zero innovation, and the printers are very limited in their capabilities. $279 for an i3 style printer is way too much money these days.
I paid about as much for my ender 3 s1,which i still think was a great purchase as a first 3d printer. I still think i3 printers have a future just because how simple they are to design and produce, but the prices could come down a notch or two.
@@twanheijkoop6753 I don't really consider the S1 to be in the same category though. Direct drive and CR/BL Touch already puts them above all the copy of a copy of a copy type basic i3 designs. I had an i3 style with direct drive and auto bed leveling back in 2014/2015, but its still not the standard 9 years later? I own about 6 i3 style printers, and they are all in boxes for parts because they are a waste of money, and a waste of space at this point.
i think the rook was an really big succes... from building printers to getting printers. great work!
Like you said, there is no reason for these printers to still come with a single 4010 fan. Why not just a 5015 with a dual horn duct?
Never seen optical sensors used on the Z axis before. Its nice to see something different in an I3 Printer!
Great review, thanks!
awesome review as always they need employ duel y motor setup with a frame build like a tank direct drive klipper lol
I am annoyed by the trend of closed-off 2020 extrusions on a lot of these newer printers, I guess it's for aesthetic reasons, at the expense of never being able to attach anything to them if you have a need to... I suppose it doesn't matter *as* much for Z where the carriage blocks all sides of it, but even then it bums me out a bit for future reuse potential
Also limits modding potential in the future, especially when looking to attach linear rails. I wish they just used regular extrusions with those filler strips if they want to create a clean look.
Can always drill and tap the rails. I have done it and it works. Can also replace thr 2020 rails all together but that's a bit of work to pretty much rebuild the frame.
I do agree that it's annoying none the less.
What's the benefit of having a bed slinger vs CoreXY? I can think of perhaps Ease of assembly, and you've already disproven the cost argument with the Rook.
CoreXY are still more complex to build and maintain that is why most OEM companies come out with bed slinger printers. I hope that changes and I am trying to make CoreXY more accessible but there is still a market for i3 / ender 3 style printers. Unfortunately a printer like the Rook is hard to scale up to the size of a Ender 3
@@Rolohaun I spend more time fixing my MK3S+ than printing. I’m waiting for you to release a heated bed version before I take the plunge into your design. PLA has too much creep on most of the stuff I build that’s under constant load unfortunately.
@@demetriusmichael ya if your concerned about that you defiantly want to build out of ABS or ASA. I have a heated bed on order for my Rook 180
I havent had good luck with strain gauge style abl. They seem to degrade over time. Might be fine for a lot of people but with the sort of heavy use i put them through they just dont seem to last.
that is unfortunate hopefully they improve over time
@@Rolohaun Ive only had experience with the creality style and It was a while ago so hopefully theyve gotten better since then. On those printers it seemed to fatigue over time and I couldnt get repeatable or usable results from it after a few months of use.
WizMaker P1 has a strain gauge
CR-6 SE already did all this, and let me tell you, that goddamn strain gauge is not fun when it's not working as intended!
Is it also dual stepper drivers for Z or is it one + 2 motors?
I didn't know the cr6se used strain Guage. As fast as I know it's 2 stepper, 2 drivers for Z
@@Rolohaun Yeah, it makes it a PITA to mount hotends to, because you NEED the strain gauge to get any sort of leveling(fixed bed).
I can't say i trust optical endstop. They tend to be sensitive to the amount of incident light, stray sunlight in particular! Not that the likes of us know anything about sunlight right? Still, there is a particular trigger threshold and the line width of the IR path isn't even that small, so the amount of ambient light can really determine where within this width the actual triggering happens. When optical endstops are used, they need to be shielded from light thoroughly, which here isn't the case at all. You should try, you can really mess up optical endstop just with light, it's not good, i have some of these for a project, also some nicer Vishay optical gates, all of them susceptible. I used to have a Halogen lamp near my printer, and this is just the PERFECT way to confuse an optical gate.
A mechanical endstop can be practically perfect. There is a little bit of temperature sensitivity but not much. I think most important is just the design around it. Hitting a large lever with a wobbly screw: bad, absolutely bad, garbage! Hitting the lever with something stable: better. Removing lever and hitting the little button directly: awesome! But you get little overtravel so more probability to destroy the switch, but really, not by much! On the other hand a spare switch is only a few cents.
About strain gauge probing, i don't trust it either. For one you have to ensure that you have no gunk on the nozzle, you have to clean it hot. But then you can't just probe hot, because you'll put dents into the bed covering plastic. It's safer to have a probing method which doesn't depend on the nozzle.
One layer cooling fan - depends which! A Sunon 5015 can provide OODLES of air and a Delta 5015 can provide a SCARY amount of air. You don't need two of those. But cheap 5015 and especially 4010 that 3D printer companies use, they aren't all that, and i think they don't last long either. The whole cooling on these printers is kind of a joke, like, the cold end fan just leaks down in and does most of the part cooling duty, but doesn't do it well.
How does the screen on these work? Is there bootloader or other upgrade method foreseen for Marlin? Have they published the sources? What board and is the board schematic published? Back in the day they were quite thoroughly and happily open-source but needs an eye.
optical sensor is fine for Z as it is only used to home it then it is ignored for the rest of the print, I can see in a situation where the endstop was used often there could be issues with light affecting it however for homing, its a very short time that its used.
@@Rolohaun Yeah but you're not really always homing at the same time of day are you?
@@SianaGearz no but I never have printers in direct sunlight. I agree there could be a issue but I think the chances are small
@@Rolohaun Well someone else has a halogen/incandescent light source nearby, someone has a window. Your personal build should be whatever suits you; a product should be designed to be somewhat resilient to a range of normal conditions. I dread it if the printer manufacturers took upon your recommendation and just installed optical Z endstops. They haven't picked it for engineering quality reasons, they picked it for buzzword and fad reasons, and you took the bait.
A good use for an optical switch is for a DIY Z probe, which can be shielded from light on basically all sides, that works superbly. It solves some mechanical issues that switch based probes suffer from, like you can put a huge overtravel into the design which helps retract it for example.
@@SianaGearz optical endstops can be shielded anywhere even on Z. I just prefer them as they are more accurate and have no moving parts. Not a buzz word or fad, delta printer basically need optical endstops for the accuracy.
I can't really see how these v-wheel machines are asking more than the Sovol SV06. After fighting with v-wheel printers for a couple of years, they have no room in 3d printing honestly. My ancient Monoprice Maker Select V2 had linear rods and bearings and it was $200 in 2016. V-Wheels just suck.
I do agree v-wheels are annoying, some manufactures are at least change to linear rails and such
Now put klipper on it!
haha it would help the printer a lot
I really wish these companies would stop making these stupid i3 style printers. There is zero innovation, and the printers are very limited in their capabilities. $279 for an i3 style printer is way too much money these days.
I can see some companies make a like one or two of these but not 10+ Creality and these companies have way too many models.
I paid about as much for my ender 3 s1,which i still think was a great purchase as a first 3d printer.
I still think i3 printers have a future just because how simple they are to design and produce, but the prices could come down a notch or two.
@@twanheijkoop6753 I don't really consider the S1 to be in the same category though. Direct drive and CR/BL Touch already puts them above all the copy of a copy of a copy type basic i3 designs. I had an i3 style with direct drive and auto bed leveling back in 2014/2015, but its still not the standard 9 years later? I own about 6 i3 style printers, and they are all in boxes for parts because they are a waste of money, and a waste of space at this point.
First?
your discord invite link expired :(
I check it and it should be working