what if this was designed on purpose so the "only the passenger can open it" part was taken care of :o 200 iq move "lol everyone will think we made a mistake but we're 4 dimensions ahead of you"
"This case is illegal." "That's bad." "But it has a design flaw that renders it legal." "That's good." "But it also has another design flaw that renders it illegal." "I quit."
Hey, the law just says it has to be in a locked, hard case that only you have the key to. It doesn't say anything about it not being possible to physically dismantle the box in five seconds...
We know you want to have a look, but you're not allowed... It should be modified to have a switch activated by a counterclockwise turn playing a soundbite of LPL stating Title 49
@@Bobblyben1, approval is over the phone. LOCK COMPANY: "We have a new lock box for travel." TSA: "Did you put a TSA lock on it?" LOCK COMPANY: "Yep, sure did." 🤞😏👍 TSA: "Ok, good to go."
That's what I was thinking, actually. It seems like they wanted it to comply with the TSA while still being legal, so they made a TSA keyhole but the key doesn't work. The entire lock seems like it was perfectly designed to satisfy everyone's needs. Or it was just a massive design flaw. Idk.
I think the TSA fail is a deliberate 2 fingers to the TSA. They were told “it has to have a TSA key” and the manufacturer muttered “but you didn’t say it had to work” 😎
No. Firearm cases are required to NOT have any way for anyone except the owner to open it. They wouldn't have been told that it needs a TSA key, because if it had a (working) TSA key, it would not conform to TSA's requirements for firearms.
I thought so too but there is another possible explanation that just came to my mind. Maybe due to the weird laws of mass production, supply and demand, the combination lock with added TSA key was cheaper to procure than a standalone combination lock part and the engineers simply decided to "disable" the TSA bit by blocking counterclockwise rotation of the lock. Wouldn't be the first time in design that disabling or simply not using parts of a generalized design is cheaper than using a more specialized one.
@@littlejackalo5326 Not having a TSA key for firearms is a Federal law's requirement, not TSA's. Which is why at 1:42 LPL says the TSA's website muddies the issue.
Maybe this lock design is genius? Have a TSA lock so TSA agents don't throw a fit, but make the TSA lock inoperable so it still complies with Federal law. These guys found a loophole!
Gun safes aren't supposed to have a TSA lock. That's specifically for security - so you can't have a confederate on the inside who uses their TSA key to open your gun safe inside the security checkpoint and hands you your gun, thus enabling you to walk through security unarmed but board a plane armed. This is sometimes used by people traveling with expensive gear they don't want stolen - there's no regulation that a gun safe can't have other stuff in it as well. So they buy a gun safe designed for a long gun, put a flare gun or starter's pistol in one corner (which are considered guns for airline safety purposes but not under other laws), and then fill the safe with their expensive telescope or musical instrument or whatever.
Engineer: *designs gun case* Legal Department: "It's not legal for TSA to be able to unlock this. This needs to be completely redesigned." Engineer: *moves receiver slightly off-center* "Problem solved."
@@Attaxalotl only the owner can have a key. The case and contents gets inspected, locked, and sent with the checked baggage to be loaded in cargo (not carry on). Then it is retrieved by the owner at the destination, unlocked by the owner, inspected, and sent on with the owner.
Damn I never read his name as "a lawyer who lockpicks" but as "the lawyer of lockpicking" (so a metaphorical lawyer, he inspects lock to see if they're good or bad) I don't know what is real anymore
Never seen stack underflow before, what kind of nonsense would you need for that? Other than handwritten ASM or some crappy old redundant programming language, of course.
I don't know, that "design flaw" looks like it was intentional for the reasons you described. It's legally valid by federal law and the TSA can't fuck with it. The hinge pins OTOH are actually legitimately bad.
There is the distinct possibility that it isn't for monetary reasons but for financial ones. That lock with the TSA key is probably used in hundreds of other products and thus it was cheaper to simply disable the TSA key bit than to design an entirely new one. Even replacing the core with a non-TSA one or designing an entirely new knob would probably cut too much into the profit margins for such a cheap design.
You just dug your hole deeper, because now you look like a bad nonchalant lier as well as incompetent. The line is "It's not a bug, its an *undocumented* feature"
As someone who works in the plastics industry, this may have been the solution when the lawyers said we cannot have the tsa key working. Small shifts like that are many times the cheapest way to resolve the issue at hand.
There are several publicly viewable penetration tests done that show TSA is quite poor at their actual mission. They do however excel at giving me a hard time when I travel.
So let me get this straight, this item would have been designed and built tested, then sent to TSA offices for approval, and not a single person tested the lock to see if the key works? That's a multiple layer of incompetancy that is so crazy that it's actually quite impressive.
Reminds me of a time I was working on the floor with a quality control guy. He had to inspect and test every aspect of the product with a long list of defined controls. Except for one: a squeaky cover. Nothing in any of his documents had a control against a squeaky cover. So he had to pass the product, with the squeaky door.
I doubt it would have to be sent to the TSA to get approval just built to a set of specifications (which it failed to do), any lock can be TSA compliant as long as it is openable with one of the TSA keys and has which key opens it permanently marked on it
What I love about LPL, is that every sense of emotion and expression has to be perceived through his voice and hands. In this case, at 3:45 you can see in his hands the disappointment with the product, by the way he pulls them up and grabs the box. He marries his hand gestures with his statement "okay folks" and the inflection in his voice essentially says "There's really nothing more to say about this piece of junk"
It's in your luggage surrounded by your clothes. That should insult it enough to not crack the case. Even if it did, so now you have an unloaded gun in a cracked case in a checked bag, in the cargo hold. That's not a threat to a plane. This is not an everyday gun safe. It's meant for travel only. It only needs to meet the bare minimum requirements. Now the terrorist would need to get into the cargo hold. Find your gun that they don't know exists. Load it with the correct ammunition that they somehow snuck onto the plane. Then find a way into the locked cockpit, and past the pilots, who may have their own gun. They have to do all of this without anyone stopping them. If someone is capable of doing this, your gun case is not going to stop them. And if someone is capable of doing this, why hasn't it happened by now? It's practically impossible to hijack a plane since 911. Before 911, people would go along with plane hijacking plans, because they figure they will be safe. Plane goes somewhere, they get let go, back to their life. Traumatized but alive. But since 911, people now assume a hijacker wants to crash the plane. They are no longer willing to go along with the bad guy. People are now much braver and attack the bad guy. There will certainly be people brave enough on the plane to risk themselves if it means saving the entire plane and preventing an even bigger disaster. It's impossible to hijack a plane now. The most they could do is blow up the plane in the air. They'd need a bomb for that, not a gun. Or some way to fatally damage the plane, without being stopped. Not easy. Now the only way to hijack a plane to make it crash into a designated target is for the pilot to be in on it. Even then they need to do it in such a way as to not get intercepted by the military. If a plane starts acting suspicious, it's quickly intercepted by fighter jets. That plane will be shot down given the right conditions. So the terrorist needs a way past these jets if they want to cause larger damage. 9/11 changed things forever. This type of attack is now so difficult, no one can get away with it. Terrorists need a new plan. All a stronger travel gun case would do is make it slightly harder for someone to steal your gun. People stealing guns at the airport isn't really a huge problem. You're free to use a stronger, more expensive case if you like. This will be heavier. It pushes you closer to your baggage weight allowance. But don't think anyone is buying this case to use year round. They buy it because they don't want to take their real gun safe with them when traveling for some reason or other. Or, they don't even have a real gun safe. But the government has no incentive to make the laws stronger because it's just not necessary.
@@cbernier3 If the pilot is in on it take a flight past the key landmark. You'll look normal and by the time the jets get there you will have crashed it alresd6
@@jordanbomb32 Are you having a bad day? Boss yell at you? Mom keeps screaming down the basement stairs at you? Get your ass kicked playing your little games? Well guess what scooter, you are a fail as a troll as well!
@@tinknal6449 nah dude. He explicitly says what it is for multiple times. And you say what it's for. You wanted to be noticed for repeating the video. Maybe it's my autism and retardation... But I need to know why you had to repeat the video in the comments
The purpose of this gun 'safe' isn't a safe. It is just to make it so a random person (or kid) can't pick up the gun and start waving it around. It is a travel case. Still incompetently designed though.
@@travcollier Yup, it suits its purpose just fine. It's cheap and just barely conforms to federal guidelines so that you can travel with your weapon. It isn't legitimately meant to secure the firearm despite what the box says.
@@jong3122 Lets be honest, ANY case that isn't bolted to the floor isn't meant to keep your firearm secure. Its meant to make it inconvenient for quick access.
@@radordekeche947 would you rather have defenses that look so strong that nobody wants to mess with them, or defenses that are actually strong, but everybody messes with them
@@jettaeschroff6924 if I had to chose, the later. If it's not discouraging attacks, then it's likely very non-intrusive, while the useless theater would liky be.
@@radordekeche947 *likely, I know touch keyboards are bad but jeez completely missing a letter, unless you are using a chromebook that is over one hundred dollars and 3 gen like schools
My theory on how this got through: there was never any chance that it wouldn't. I once overheard a couple of contractors tlaking, and one said, "When they ask for feedback, they only want positive feedback, if you give them negative feedback they just don't hear it." So often true...
"If all it's meant for is compliance with TSA rules, and not actual security [...]" This one sentence really says everything you need to know about the "security" TSA rules provide.
@@matthewklahn7523 that's impossible to know, the TSA could very well act as a deterrent to prevent attacks, even if they couldn't do anything if someone actually tried
@@jonathantadlock-stein2023, Bullshit! They have never stopped an attack or hijacking ever! If they had we’d never hear the end of it. They have caught a few accidental forgotten prohibited items. And the ridicules items they prohibit! You can take your illegal and unconstitutional TSA and shove them up your ass! No weapon of mine has ever or will ever be used by me to commit a crime. If every passenger had a gun no plane would ever be hijacked! At least not for long, lol! With all due respect, go to hell sir!
@@evelbill1439 dude, calm down, I never said the TSA was worth the tax dollars, or that they actually do their job, all I’m saying is that there has to be at least one person who thought of hijacking a plane, but decided against it because of the TSA. Again, I’m not saying the TSA is the best thing ever to happen to mankind, I’m just playing devils advocate.
@@evelbill1439 I'm too poor to own a gun, but I earnestly want to believe that the crime rate would tank if even a significant percentage of citizens had a basic handgun and firearm safety training since any location with multiple people goes from "plentiful hostages" to "plentiful threats". That's "want to" believe because there is a concerning percentage of individuals who, through mental illness, entitlement, or whatever cognitive inhibitor, would feel perfectly justified shooting someone who mildly inconvenienced them.
I mean even if you literally obey the law and put your own padlocks on your gun case, the TSA just come along with bolt cutters and cut them off then replace them with TSA openable ones. Which it seems is not something the TSA should ever do. There's a long video on TH-cam where this actually happened to a guy and he deliberately missed his flight in order to a) film this entire interaction and b) complain to higher ups in the airport that what they did broke the law.
Who would of ever thought that after 60 years on planet earth in would love watching a lawyer picking locks! Damn it, the best part is my wife actually enjoys watching also! Go figure? Thank you and keep up the good work!
Actually that and secure are 2 different things. You could in theory have a secure box but tell everyone you know the combination or make them a key copy., it would still be secure as in the people authorized may get in, others not. But law says only you
theGhostWolfe, no, the CFR is very clear on who retains access to the contents to a locked firearms storage container. It ain't the TSA. I've had TSA cut both padlocks off of my rifle case. Even though my contact information was displayed in the case and a copy of the CFR is laminated and affixed to the case, they cut the locks and replaced them with two TSA approved padlocks, which I did find until I arrived at my destination. The problem was that I didn't have the keys. I filed a complaint to which TSA claimed that the information on their website was law. After that experience, I modified the case so that the padlocks went from a lock with a hasp to a Medeco puck lock enclosing a 17-7 stainless steel hasp.
Scott Kenny I couldn’t get the local police to even take a report. The TSA supervisor was as thick as a concrete block. I stated that the TSA website was wrong, that the CFR was the law and that they needed to understand that policy isn’t law. I contacted my Congressman that spoke with the TSA and allegedly it was being corrected. Nothing has changed. I’ve added a gps tracker and an audible alarm to the case, plus the new locks and custom fabricated hasps.
Yeah, I guess you’re right. A box that, even with the right permissions, can’t be opened. An agency that, even with the right permission, won’t listen to you even if it means violating federal law.
I also love how we gloss over the fact it's made of plastic. Some people would try to pick the tsa lock or crack the combo. Some might attack the hinge pins. But my first thought is "place on ground. Doom e1m1 plays. Pummel"
I love that this guy knows so much... but tells it all so well, he should make a second channel where he just talks about stuff other than locks, like I would listen to this man more than I would do for one of my teachers back when I was at school
@@garymitchell5899 He is a member of the bar, and also makes videos on lockpicking; thus he is a lawyer, and also a lockpicking enthusiast. Also in the video, he explains how it's almost illegal, with a citation to a US law code, making it not clickbait. He is a non-clickbaiting, lockpicking lawyer
@@garymitchell5899 I mean, you didn't really think the "lawyer" part of his channel name was just a joke or something, did you? Have you not heard how this guy speaks? Just imagine that voice in a court room - he was born for the work!
Who said he wasn't a lawyer? He claims that the design flaw makes it legal. The design flaw is the hinges - the law relates to the lock. It is total clickbait.
@@garymitchell5899 you forgot the design flaw that the TSA key wont work, thus making it compliant with the "and only the passengers retains the key/combination" part of the law
Thanks to your information from this video I kept an unsuspecting customer at my work from buying one of these and helped her find a better case! Thanks LPL
removing the hingepins is only so effective in accessing the contents within because of how flexible the case is. I don't think you could purposely create a worse design
I beg to differ. possibilities to make it worse: - use cardboard as a material. -leave a gunshaped, gunsized hole at the bottom. -do not connect the part the lock locks into with the body -ad a knob at the end of each hingepin to allow toolless removal.
Funny enough just started looking for my first firearm. Noticed this box on the shelf and picked it up. Something looked familiar about it. Searched youtube and I KNEW it was familiar hahah from THIS video I saw a year ago. Thank you so much for helping me avoid this mess.
@@PneumaticFrog The gun case bit of the law is not to protect against the gun's owner during flight. It is to protect against anyone else during the parts of travel where the gun/gun case has to be in the possession of someone who is not the gun's owner. The gun is certainly safe during flight on commercial aircraft whether in a case or not.
The MOMENT you turned the case over, I saw the hinge and, with great exasperation, tilted my head in disbelief and loudly said "oh my _god!"_ in time to you pointing at it. How can companies that manufacture security devices mess up so egregiously when it comes to actually making secure devices? Hahaha
Blocking the TSA key seems intentional to me. It lets TSA people "clear" it because it's "TSA compliant" on the surface, but it complies with the federal law because it's not actually openable by the TSA, i.e. it's a design feature because you don't have to explain the law to anyone when you're checking the bag
@@matthewklahn7523 THe question I have is if the law says "only the passenger" has access to the inside, how could the TSA approve the lock in the first place? Note the packaging states that it complies with TSA firearm guidelines.
@@Tahngarthor "TSA approved" does not mean that it was examined and tested by the TSA. It means "this case was designed to comply with TSA guidelines". Except in this case, it's obvious that somebody at the case company does not understand TSA guidelines.
Those hinges reminded me of how much of a pain in the *%$ I was as a teen lol. I kept picking locks for fun including the medicine box he kept my RX's in. Didn't take anything out, but unlocked it to show how useless it was. So my dad bought a big heavy duty tool box like box and a padlock and put all the Rx's in there instead. The box had stickers all over showing it being run over by a truck, so he was confident. The next day I see this box sitting in the kitchen. Took some pliers, took out the easily accessible hinges, and left the lid open in the opposite direction to find when he came home... He stopped locking the box after that. I think I could have gotten a lot of experience that led to a career if he was as dedicated as I was stubborn, but I think I had made my point xD
"I have no idea how something like this got through the testing process." I do. It wasn't tested. Who ever was handing it off said "It didn't fail testing" which is technically true.
Personally, I'm guessing it was tested, they found the flaws, and told people it would need to be re-designed. Then some higher up said "We already got TSA approval on this design though, and if we re-design, we'll need them to re-approve, which is too much trouble. Ship it."
@@jastur3645 I bet they designed it so the tsa lock would open, started producing them found out they weren't compliant with the feds and just changed the receiving slot to allow it to comply without much effort on their part.
Heard a story about Someone who was standing at the TSA booth with a compliant gun case locked with a secure padlock holding the keys waiting to hand them to the agent who proceeds to cut the lock off and berate the passenger for not using a TSA lock
I have never once had a TSA agent inspect one of my firearms. Ever time it's just been the airlines check in agent. And then I'm told IF the TSA wants to take a look they will.come get me. Never has happened.
@@im2geek4u Only time I had a TSA inspect one of my firearms was at the Denver airport and it was after they X-rayed the case and saw it was an MP5 that I had in the case. I think they just wanted to look at it more than anything.
Honestly, even though it's obvious they screwed up....if this actually was intentional, then it wouldn't be inexcusable, because it would be a genius case of malicious compliance. I mean it's got a TSA approved lock in it, yet it still complies with title 49 to not be illegal.
I'm honestly surprised fewer people aren't mentioning this. To me it seems that the way the title is written maybe most gunsafes aren't technically legal since not only the passenger has the key (all the TSA agents also have the key, therefore it is illegal?) It honestly sounds like it is in practice almost always illegal to travel with a firearm since you need the TSA to have a key, but you cannot travel if not only you possess it. So they let you travel with one if you're compliant, but it sounds like they basically reserve the right to either say you need a TSA master key to access this case or you can't fly, OR, since a TSA master key can access it, its technically illegal. They can tell you that you aren't complying with one or the other requirements that are almost mutually exclusive. This case however seems to have found a way around that as it is TSA compliant (says so right on the box) but only the passenger can access it with their own key or the code (making it comply with title 49). And to be honest when it comes to gun cases I really don't think people should be as concerned with how easy they are to unlock or bypass, the lock box isn't really to prevent theft but just to secure a firearm. And if someone is trying to get to your firearm by means of pliers or lockpicking equipment, the gun case isn't really designed to deal with that. More for keeping out toddlers or preventing misfires. All in all this gun case looks absolutely genius.
@@eewweeppkk Man, you could grab that firearm with a tooth pick and your hands, any pointy thing would do the job, after you move the pins you could grab it with your hands, literally awful design.
@@eewweeppkk AIUI the TSA lock isn't a legal requirement, they'll just break into any other luggage that is selected for inspection and won't pay for a replacement of any damaged locks or luggage.
@@jacobmartinez4031 Well that depends on the usage of the case. If you only use it for travelling by air in the US the gun mustn't be loaded or it's illegal. So even if someone steals the gun they couldn't kill anyone or at least they would have a harder time doing so...
"I've been talking for too long" 3 minutes into a video. I appreciate being short and to the point unlike most TH-camrs who won't post a video shorter than 10 minutes long.
Yeah padding the runtime for ads irritates me. I've watched a few videos lately that were 8 minutes of content and 2 minutes, 5 seconds of end-card just to get over the limit.
Michiel van Erven TH-cam allows the user to adjust playback speed, slowing down those that speak too fast (and speed up the vast majority that speak too slow).
I’ve heard of some airlines/airports that try to tell you that a tsa lock is required and you aren’t allowed to fly with any other lock. Maybe it’s designed to bypass that so it is secure from tsa without them knowing about it. Otherwise I’m at a loss.
I have to get this box and leave it out just so when people ask about it I can say, " Well do you know about Title 49 Code of the Federal Regulations sec 1540.11C2 ?... "
I like your videos - short and to the point. And your speech is clear and the sound quality is good making it very easy to understand what you are saying.
I bought this clips on AMZN once and they ad little "feet" that swiveled to achieve good contact with what you're clipping. They were flawed in that there was no stopper so the feet would flip around and fall off. Company solution was to include a bad of spare feet.... I'd be embarrassed to suggest such a poor "fix"
Is the key flaw actually designed as intended? What does TSA regulation require? Does the lock actually need to work or do they just need to "work". Seems like an ingenious way to fulfill both Federal and TSA requirements. Since the key "works", it operates the locking mechanism. But it doesn't actually work to unlock the box, hence fulfilling Federal requirement
That's what I was thinking. The flaw seems so obvious, it might actually be intended. If that's the case it's actually not a bad design, if you ignore the hinge of course
No, there shouldn't be a TSA lock on a hard case carrying a firearm, at all. A guy actually talked at a panel about how he uses that to transport everything he carries in locked steel cases to prevent theft. Since each case contains a firearm only he can open them, and there were occasions where he got through faster because he had firearms in there (separate line). He talked about a few things I don't remember exactly, some edge cases, what to say to idiots etc. Also to check the rules for where you fly and keep up to date with the federal laws.
And the the TSA agent can ask the passenger "oh looks like there is something wrong with the key can you open it up for me?" Which the passenger then opens it up with the combo...
Imperial Knight, you do realize that the Transportation Safety Administration is a Federal Agency under the Department of Homeland Security, right? Essentially, you said that this gun case fulfills both Federal and Federal requirements . . . .
@@tortex1 That sounds like Deviant Ollam. The only problem is that apparently the TSA keep breaking into his cases by cutting off his locks to inspect them and then "securing" them with TSA luggage locks or even zip ties!
this man never fail to amaze me with his ridiculously wide array of powerful resolves. A locking picking lawyer. _'Umm yes I am technically breaking into your property but do you know that we got a click out of number 4, and your lock does not comply with title 49 section 5040 1c. Now the cops are on their way to arrest you for your federal offense and I will fly away with my law expertise'_
Which is usually what they do anyway. If they want in your locked case, those damn hinges are right there. They aren't going to try opening the lock if they don't have the key
![[464] LPL Project: The Best Gun Lock Ever?](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/oImZsAI1L0Q/mqdefault.jpg)
![[464] LPL Project: The Best Gun Lock Ever?](/img/tr.png)
![[1453] VERY Clever “Loki” Puzzle Padlock Solved](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/OFvTzppfJnA/mqdefault.jpg)
![[1422] Did I Cheat On This Challenge? (Tamper-Sealed Abus)](/img/n.gif)
Hey look, we made a lock so secure even the right key cannot open it.
And it's also pick proof, because our hinges are exposed and you need not bother with anything else.
@@arletottens6349 Big brain energy.
what if this was designed on purpose so the "only the passenger can open it" part was taken care of :o
200 iq move "lol everyone will think we made a mistake but we're 4 dimensions ahead of you"
@@pvic6959 That would be great, but I think the unsecured hinge pins points to the opposite conclusion.
pvic Also TSA will break it open/seize it if they want to anyway.
The perfect synthesis of lawyer and lockpicker.
Finally that law degree pays off...
LPL: "I've been waiting my whole TH-cam career for this."
@@wewd like for real? he's an actual lawyer?
@@0cs025 He was a lawyer he is currently not practicing
haha
"This case is illegal."
"That's bad."
"But it has a design flaw that renders it legal."
"That's good."
"But it also has another design flaw that renders it illegal."
"I quit."
But it does contain potassium benzoate so that's something.
If this was a simpsons TOH reference, then well done!
But the case comes with a free frogurt
Hey, the law just says it has to be in a locked, hard case that only you have the key to. It doesn't say anything about it not being possible to physically dismantle the box in five seconds...
basically every law out there lol
Spend 10 minutes with my engineering classmates and it will be readily apparent how that box made it through design.
Hahaha true! It was probably a senior project /company coop and the company just said "fuck it, send it to market"
@@YourUncle8501 Exactly, I'll bet the $20 in my back pocket an intern was on the design team.
@@steele_heart77 fax😭
@@YourUncle8501 it wasn't a senior project, that would get a fail. I can definitely imagine a coop though.
As an engineering student... fair.
When you finally realise the lawyer part in his name
I don’t get it
RuffyRuf, He’s pointing out the fact that LPL dished out all this legality talk, just like a lawyer.
Donkey Fish lmao both are correct dude
@Donkey Fish when u finally figure out u are an idiot
@Donkey Fish UK spelling dude!
This is so bad it almost seems like it was intentionally designed to comply with the law and troll TSA in the process!
Malicious compliance
We know you want to have a look, but you're not allowed... It should be modified to have a switch activated by a counterclockwise turn playing a soundbite of LPL stating Title 49
Also, 0:28 “TSA Approved” so fk knows what their approval process is?!
@@Bobblyben1, approval is over the phone.
LOCK COMPANY: "We have a new lock box for travel."
TSA: "Did you put a TSA lock on it?"
LOCK COMPANY: "Yep, sure did." 🤞😏👍
TSA: "Ok, good to go."
That's what I was thinking, actually. It seems like they wanted it to comply with the TSA while still being legal, so they made a TSA keyhole but the key doesn't work. The entire lock seems like it was perfectly designed to satisfy everyone's needs.
Or it was just a massive design flaw. Idk.
"4 minutes on picking a lock, Must be a real tight loc-"
LPL: "title 49 of the code of federal regulations section 1540.111 c2"
well, he is a lawyer after all :D
This comment got me rolling
@@minidreschi2 Casually reminding us like a boss
I think the TSA fail is a deliberate 2 fingers to the TSA. They were told “it has to have a TSA key” and the manufacturer muttered “but you didn’t say it had to work” 😎
Agreed. That was my take too.
The TSA doesn't require these locks. It's just a gimmick created by some private company.
No. Firearm cases are required to NOT have any way for anyone except the owner to open it. They wouldn't have been told that it needs a TSA key, because if it had a (working) TSA key, it would not conform to TSA's requirements for firearms.
I thought so too but there is another possible explanation that just came to my mind.
Maybe due to the weird laws of mass production, supply and demand, the combination lock with added TSA key was cheaper to procure than a standalone combination lock part and the engineers simply decided to "disable" the TSA bit by blocking counterclockwise rotation of the lock.
Wouldn't be the first time in design that disabling or simply not using parts of a generalized design is cheaper than using a more specialized one.
@@littlejackalo5326 Not having a TSA key for firearms is a Federal law's requirement, not TSA's. Which is why at 1:42 LPL says the TSA's website muddies the issue.
TSA: "Your key looks suspiciously like a pair of pliers."
Yes, but only I have the pliers. That makes it legal.
Your guncase looks suspiciously like a childrens lunch box
@@ersetzbar. But I wrapped it with duct tape. LPL's mortal enemy.
Me in response to TSA: “Your pliers look suspiciously like keys”
That muffin is looking awfully like a hamster
Maybe this lock design is genius?
Have a TSA lock so TSA agents don't throw a fit, but make the TSA lock inoperable so it still complies with Federal law.
These guys found a loophole!
All of that is irrelevant when the real master key is a pair of pliers
Apophis checked baggage . . . Not carry-on.
Gun safes aren't supposed to have a TSA lock. That's specifically for security - so you can't have a confederate on the inside who uses their TSA key to open your gun safe inside the security checkpoint and hands you your gun, thus enabling you to walk through security unarmed but board a plane armed.
This is sometimes used by people traveling with expensive gear they don't want stolen - there's no regulation that a gun safe can't have other stuff in it as well. So they buy a gun safe designed for a long gun, put a flare gun or starter's pistol in one corner (which are considered guns for airline safety purposes but not under other laws), and then fill the safe with their expensive telescope or musical instrument or whatever.
@@muppetist um. what about having two keys to a single lock...
@@muppetist you don't need someone on the inside, tsa keys come with TSA locks
Engineer: *designs gun case*
Legal Department: "It's not legal for TSA to be able to unlock this. This needs to be completely redesigned."
Engineer: *moves receiver slightly off-center* "Problem solved."
So the TSA has to have a key, but only the owner can have the key?
@@Attaxalotl only the owner can have a key. The case and contents gets inspected, locked, and sent with the checked baggage to be loaded in cargo (not carry on). Then it is retrieved by the owner at the destination, unlocked by the owner, inspected, and sent on with the owner.
@@littlejackalo5326 Aye. then why did they put a TSA key on there?
@@Attaxalotl Because otherwise the TSA throws a fit since they like to feel like they have any power at all
@@Marcus_Aurelius42 makes sense.
Love seeing LPL throw the book at the designs he showcases. Incidentally, throwing a book at it is probably a valid technique to bypass this lock.
Wow, this is one instance when the Lock Picking Lawyer talks about the law!
@@jetstreamer374 What lawyer stories can you tell under 3 seconds?
I think this is the first time I actually noticed the background in law from LPL in one of his videos.
Damn I never read his name as "a lawyer who lockpicks" but as "the lawyer of lockpicking" (so a metaphorical lawyer, he inspects lock to see if they're good or bad)
I don't know what is real anymore
@@SillyMakesVids OBJECTION! CASE CLOSED!
@@RammusTheArmordillo I never thought of it that way, now you've got me confused
When your failure is so massive it stack underflows into a win.
Never seen stack underflow before, what kind of nonsense would you need for that? Other than handwritten ASM or some crappy old redundant programming language, of course.
Truly the Ghandi of lock boxes
@@berylliosis5250 when you deal with uCs, current production 40 year old architectures are not uncommon.
Yeah, but there's the part about the hinge.
@@deepspacelazarus7207 our words are backed with NUCLEAR WEAPONS
"So then with the TSA master key" *pulls out TSA master key*
Me: "Wait, that's illegal"
Anyone in the luggage industry more then 20 years had all those keys already. They took a keyring of existing keys and said "Use these ones or else."
You're telling a lawyer what's illegal?
@@Sillimant_ tf is the point of a key if u can 3d print it
@@AlexM-xj7qd sense of security
@@AlexM-xj7qd what’s the point in a key that can’t open its lock?
I don't know, that "design flaw" looks like it was intentional for the reasons you described. It's legally valid by federal law and the TSA can't fuck with it. The hinge pins OTOH are actually legitimately bad.
But the law doesn’t mention hinge pins so it’s legal but not secure. What a world we live in…
There is the distinct possibility that it isn't for monetary reasons but for financial ones. That lock with the TSA key is probably used in hundreds of other products and thus it was cheaper to simply disable the TSA key bit than to design an entirely new one. Even replacing the core with a non-TSA one or designing an entirely new knob would probably cut too much into the profit margins for such a cheap design.
If making sure the TSA can't fuck with it was their intention, couldn't they have just not put the TSA lock on there at all?
@@naphackDT no, the TSA lock would be more expensive than without it regardless of how many they manufacture.
@@matthewklahn7523 Sure, if the the TSA lock wasn't already built into, and partly used by, the combination lock.
“Uh... hey guys we screwed up. We can’t have a master key that’s illegal.”
“Nah man the master key doesn’t work.”
“Understandable have a great day.”
Why are you everywhere I go
Understandable have a great day
@@chsameer2794 username checks out
I mean if this was on purpose to make sure it cant be picked open thenn
and for some reason nobody at all: "then why put the lock on there?"
LPL: “a fatal flaw that makes it legal”
Software Developers: “it’s a feature not a bug”
I worked on a project where some bugs got out to the field, customers liked the thing and asked that it remain.
Dale Zapple
Are you able to share any about the project and the flaw?
Yes, please spill the beans if possible - this stuff is positively fascinating!
Bug is just undocumented feature ;) I've been developer for 36 years, so I know for sure...
*Bethesda
"It's not a bug, we call it an unintended feature"
"is it a bug or a feature?"
"Y E S"
Oh hello Bethesda, didn’t expect you to make locks!
It`s a surprise feature.
[Lockpick: 100]
You just dug your hole deeper, because now you look like a bad nonchalant lier as well as incompetent.
The line is "It's not a bug, its an *undocumented* feature"
Lawyer has been my inspiration to start lockpicking
Yesterday i screamed in exitement along with a family when i opened a door
A lock picker has been my inspiration for becomming a lawyer.
"A true comedy of errors and certainly not something that you should rely upon"
The TSA or this gun case?
Yes
Speaking of the TSA and comedy:
th-cam.com/video/YQJ7E140-SQ/w-d-xo.html
@@mvmlego1212 The sad part is how true it is
Both.
yes
"mission failed successfully"
Surely there's a classic video game reference for this - there MUST be
@@RyTrapp0 the original is "task failed successfully", an error box for some windows program
Fission Mailed
Mission successful, We’ll get em next time
mission failed | respect+
As someone who works in the plastics industry, this may have been the solution when the lawyers said we cannot have the tsa key working. Small shifts like that are many times the cheapest way to resolve the issue at hand.
that moment a lock case opens by the sheer volume of lawyering at it
It's a totally pick-proof design, didn't know that was even possible ha
I mean, yeah, it can't be picked
it can be easily taken apart, but not picked
S theking it can be picked too
@@cclphdfu I'm certain the code wheels are trivial to decode if not bypass..
@@WrightWorld Yeah. That's why he didn't even bother to do it. But that's bypassing, not picking.
imaging someone picking it for days xD
It's basically a Tupperware pan with a painted-on lock.
Have you ever tried opening some older tupperwares that have those clips? It's hard man, harder than this lock, for sure.
Soraya Imperial especially those airtight ones
"TSA approved" literally shows how good they are at their job...
There are several publicly viewable penetration tests done that show TSA is quite poor at their actual mission. They do however excel at giving me a hard time when I travel.
As soon as you flipped it over, and I saw the hinge, I actually groaned out loud.
Might as well use a ZipLoc bag with "Locked" written on it in sharpie.
You'll have to duct tape some solid pieces to fulfill the hard side requirement.
😂😂😂😂
I've always wondered how long you could get away with just putting a tsa lock on the outside that doesn't actually do anything
Allen Lark just for the jokes one time I put a lock on a rope and made the rope look like a bike lock, never got stolen lmfao
So let me get this straight, this item would have been designed and built tested, then sent to TSA offices for approval, and not a single person tested the lock to see if the key works? That's a multiple layer of incompetancy that is so crazy that it's actually quite impressive.
The flip side is that they were going to fail it, but then tried the lock and saw that it actually adhered to the regulations and passed it as jokes.
You misspelled corruption.
TSA doesn't actually approve the products. Having TSA approval means their master key will work on the lock.
Reminds me of a time I was working on the floor with a quality control guy. He had to inspect and test every aspect of the product with a long list of defined controls.
Except for one: a squeaky cover. Nothing in any of his documents had a control against a squeaky cover. So he had to pass the product, with the squeaky door.
I doubt it would have to be sent to the TSA to get approval just built to a set of specifications (which it failed to do), any lock can be TSA compliant as long as it is openable with one of the TSA keys and has which key opens it permanently marked on it
What I love about LPL, is that every sense of emotion and expression has to be perceived through his voice and hands. In this case, at 3:45 you can see in his hands the disappointment with the product, by the way he pulls them up and grabs the box. He marries his hand gestures with his statement "okay folks" and the inflection in his voice essentially says "There's really nothing more to say about this piece of junk"
This one is so horrible, if you dropped it your "safe" gun could fall out from the cheap plastic hinges breaking off.
It's in your luggage surrounded by your clothes. That should insult it enough to not crack the case. Even if it did, so now you have an unloaded gun in a cracked case in a checked bag, in the cargo hold. That's not a threat to a plane.
This is not an everyday gun safe. It's meant for travel only. It only needs to meet the bare minimum requirements.
Now the terrorist would need to get into the cargo hold. Find your gun that they don't know exists. Load it with the correct ammunition that they somehow snuck onto the plane. Then find a way into the locked cockpit, and past the pilots, who may have their own gun.
They have to do all of this without anyone stopping them. If someone is capable of doing this, your gun case is not going to stop them. And if someone is capable of doing this, why hasn't it happened by now?
It's practically impossible to hijack a plane since 911. Before 911, people would go along with plane hijacking plans, because they figure they will be safe. Plane goes somewhere, they get let go, back to their life. Traumatized but alive.
But since 911, people now assume a hijacker wants to crash the plane. They are no longer willing to go along with the bad guy. People are now much braver and attack the bad guy. There will certainly be people brave enough on the plane to risk themselves if it means saving the entire plane and preventing an even bigger disaster.
It's impossible to hijack a plane now. The most they could do is blow up the plane in the air. They'd need a bomb for that, not a gun. Or some way to fatally damage the plane, without being stopped. Not easy.
Now the only way to hijack a plane to make it crash into a designated target is for the pilot to be in on it. Even then they need to do it in such a way as to not get intercepted by the military.
If a plane starts acting suspicious, it's quickly intercepted by fighter jets. That plane will be shot down given the right conditions. So the terrorist needs a way past these jets if they want to cause larger damage.
9/11 changed things forever. This type of attack is now so difficult, no one can get away with it. Terrorists need a new plan.
All a stronger travel gun case would do is make it slightly harder for someone to steal your gun. People stealing guns at the airport isn't really a huge problem.
You're free to use a stronger, more expensive case if you like. This will be heavier. It pushes you closer to your baggage weight allowance.
But don't think anyone is buying this case to use year round. They buy it because they don't want to take their real gun safe with them when traveling for some reason or other. Or, they don't even have a real gun safe.
But the government has no incentive to make the laws stronger because it's just not necessary.
@@cbernier3 If the pilot is in on it take a flight past the key landmark. You'll look normal and by the time the jets get there you will have crashed it alresd6
Its actually genius. The fact that its stamped with the TSA logo but doesn't open with the TSA key keeps them from cutting the box open.
Damn, man really finna pull out the “Title 49 of the code of federal regulations section 1540.111 c2” on us.
Well he is a lawyer haha
Yeah, we got Captain America over here. Best of the best of the best, sir!
@@ShootLuckGaming Yasss. i was waiting for the Lawyer part of his name to come into play.
In the trade we just say and write 15 CFR 40.111 instead of that mouthful
You know if you say really you don’t gotta day finna right
To be fair this was not designed to deter theft, it was designed to comply with bureaucracy.
Are you hired by TH-cam to repeat what's said in the video in the comments? You deserve a raise.
@@jordanbomb32 Are you having a bad day? Boss yell at you? Mom keeps screaming down the basement stairs at you? Get your ass kicked playing your little games? Well guess what scooter, you are a fail as a troll as well!
@@tinknal6449 nah dude. He explicitly says what it is for multiple times. And you say what it's for. You wanted to be noticed for repeating the video. Maybe it's my autism and retardation... But I need to know why you had to repeat the video in the comments
@@jordanbomb32 Oh, so you're just pedantic. Got it!
@Valmora Ah look, another one! You couldn't trigger me with an atomic bomb sweetie but nice try!
Plot twist : The Master key was meant to detached the hinges .
TSA agents love this trick
Much like the TSA, this gun safe is pure "Security Theater".
As always.
The TSA isn't theater. It's a jobs program. That's all
The purpose of this gun 'safe' isn't a safe. It is just to make it so a random person (or kid) can't pick up the gun and start waving it around. It is a travel case.
Still incompetently designed though.
@@travcollier Yup, it suits its purpose just fine. It's cheap and just barely conforms to federal guidelines so that you can travel with your weapon. It isn't legitimately meant to secure the firearm despite what the box says.
@@jong3122 Lets be honest, ANY case that isn't bolted to the floor isn't meant to keep your firearm secure. Its meant to make it inconvenient for quick access.
This fits perfectly with the "security theater" of the TSA. It is only for show.
well, to be fair, the appearance of security is sometimes more valuable then actual security
@@jettaeschroff6924 Only because it's potentially cheaper.
@@radordekeche947 would you rather have defenses that look so strong that nobody wants to mess with them, or defenses that are actually strong, but everybody messes with them
@@jettaeschroff6924 if I had to chose, the later. If it's not discouraging attacks, then it's likely very non-intrusive, while the useless theater would liky be.
@@radordekeche947 *likely, I know touch keyboards are bad but jeez completely missing a letter, unless you are using a chromebook that is over one hundred dollars and 3 gen like schools
My theory on how this got through: there was never any chance that it wouldn't. I once overheard a couple of contractors tlaking, and one said, "When they ask for feedback, they only want positive feedback, if you give them negative feedback they just don't hear it." So often true...
"If all it's meant for is compliance with TSA rules, and not actual security [...]"
This one sentence really says everything you need to know about the "security" TSA rules provide.
TSA has never prevented any attack since it's inception.
@@matthewklahn7523 that's impossible to know, the TSA could very well act as a deterrent to prevent attacks, even if they couldn't do anything if someone actually tried
@@jonathantadlock-stein2023,
Bullshit! They have never stopped an attack or hijacking ever! If they had we’d never hear the end of it. They have caught a few accidental forgotten prohibited items. And the ridicules items they prohibit! You can take your illegal and unconstitutional TSA and shove them up your ass! No weapon of mine has ever or will ever be used by me to commit a crime. If every passenger had a gun no plane would ever be hijacked! At least not for long, lol! With all due respect, go to hell sir!
@@evelbill1439 dude, calm down, I never said the TSA was worth the tax dollars, or that they actually do their job, all I’m saying is that there has to be at least one person who thought of hijacking a plane, but decided against it because of the TSA. Again, I’m not saying the TSA is the best thing ever to happen to mankind, I’m just playing devils advocate.
@@evelbill1439 I'm too poor to own a gun, but I earnestly want to believe that the crime rate would tank if even a significant percentage of citizens had a basic handgun and firearm safety training since any location with multiple people goes from "plentiful hostages" to "plentiful threats". That's "want to" believe because there is a concerning percentage of individuals who, through mental illness, entitlement, or whatever cognitive inhibitor, would feel perfectly justified shooting someone who mildly inconvenienced them.
"made legal by a design flaw"
Never thought I would see the day...
"Compliance with TSA rules, and not for ACTUAL security"
Ouch :D
I mean even if you literally obey the law and put your own padlocks on your gun case, the TSA just come along with bolt cutters and cut them off then replace them with TSA openable ones. Which it seems is not something the TSA should ever do.
There's a long video on TH-cam where this actually happened to a guy and he deliberately missed his flight in order to a) film this entire interaction and b) complain to higher ups in the airport that what they did broke the law.
@@CoolSteve08 That was Deviant Ollam. An awesome dude.
Sounds like the definition if the TSA itself.
"Oh hey this video's pretty long. Must be a weird but good lock"
*picking lasts about 8 seconds, acheiveable by almost any tool *
oh.
I had a engineering test that had a question where the same thing happened with its solvability. This brings back a lot of good memories. Thank you!
They should use this as advertising: The SAFEST TSA approved lock!*
*(for the TSA)
This is officially less secure than my grandma's lunch box
Your grandma lunchbox had combination lock and keyhole ?
"This is officially less secure than my grandma's lunch box"
Does your grandma's lunch box get entered frequently then? ;)
Was that a euphemism?
@@walterjames9804 This lockbox effectively doesn't, which is their point
Ye
Who would of ever thought that after 60 years on planet earth in would love watching a lawyer picking locks! Damn it, the best part is my wife actually enjoys watching also! Go figure? Thank you and keep up the good work!
0:12
LPL: "Let that sink in."
Me: "The fuck does it want now?..."
damn bro never heard that one before 😒😒😒 real comedy legend over here
“Only the passenger has the key or combination.”
That’s a clever way of avoiding saying that the box needs to be secure.
If only the word "secure" was used, some smartass would probably argue about the definition
Actually that and secure are 2 different things. You could in theory have a secure box but tell everyone you know the combination or make them a key copy., it would still be secure as in the people authorized may get in, others not. But law says only you
theGhostWolfe, no, the CFR is very clear on who retains access to the contents to a locked firearms storage container. It ain't the TSA.
I've had TSA cut both padlocks off of my rifle case. Even though my contact information was displayed in the case and a copy of the CFR is laminated and affixed to the case, they cut the locks and replaced them with two TSA approved padlocks, which I did find until I arrived at my destination. The problem was that I didn't have the keys. I filed a complaint to which TSA claimed that the information on their website was law.
After that experience, I modified the case so that the padlocks went from a lock with a hasp to a Medeco puck lock enclosing a 17-7 stainless steel hasp.
@@gungadinn did you bring charges against the entire TSA staff at your departure airport?
Scott Kenny
I couldn’t get the local police to even take a report.
The TSA supervisor was as thick as a concrete block. I stated that the TSA website was wrong, that the CFR was the law and that they needed to understand that policy isn’t law.
I contacted my Congressman that spoke with the TSA and allegedly it was being corrected. Nothing has changed.
I’ve added a gps tracker and an audible alarm to the case, plus the new locks and custom fabricated hasps.
Hey! A “TSA compliant” device thats just as good at its job as the TSA itself!
Technically this case is better at its job than the TSA...which is just sad.
if this box was as good as the tsa it would just say “THIS BOX IS LOCKED” with no lock
@@thestarbran but this box doesn't creepily grope people and torture elderly folk with chemotherapy ports
Yeah, I guess you’re right. A box that, even with the right permissions, can’t be opened. An agency that, even with the right permission, won’t listen to you even if it means violating federal law.
@@thestarbran hahaha this comment made me laugh then you took it to the next level, well done my friend.
Just realized when he says “In any case” to sum up his videos it’s a subtle flex. He can get inside any case 😳
I wonder if the “TSA lock” is just a decoy type deal...
“Wow 4 minute video! This lock must be pretty good”....
The first 3 minutes is just LPL roasting the lock
LPL: "I've been talking for a little bit too long"
Dude, I will do anything to keep hearing that calming voice of yours.
Anything? Even you know...?
jose almeida... like buying a master lock to safe your money?
jose almeida no..please no !! Everything but not preparing peanut butter sandwiches for Masterlock CEO (´༎ຶོρ༎ຶོ`) !!!
The trick is to send him a lock that he can't get open in < 5 minutes
I also love how we gloss over the fact it's made of plastic. Some people would try to pick the tsa lock or crack the combo. Some might attack the hinge pins. But my first thought is "place on ground. Doom e1m1 plays. Pummel"
I love that this guy knows so much... but tells it all so well, he should make a second channel where he just talks about stuff other than locks, like I would listen to this man more than I would do for one of my teachers back when I was at school
Oh right he's an actual lawyer - the "illegal" is not bs clickbait
I don't think he's a lock lawyer, and it is clickbait.
@@garymitchell5899 He is a member of the bar, and also makes videos on lockpicking; thus he is a lawyer, and also a lockpicking enthusiast. Also in the video, he explains how it's almost illegal, with a citation to a US law code, making it not clickbait. He is a non-clickbaiting, lockpicking lawyer
@@garymitchell5899 I mean, you didn't really think the "lawyer" part of his channel name was just a joke or something, did you?
Have you not heard how this guy speaks? Just imagine that voice in a court room - he was born for the work!
Who said he wasn't a lawyer?
He claims that the design flaw makes it legal. The design flaw is the hinges - the law relates to the lock. It is total clickbait.
@@garymitchell5899 you forgot the design flaw that the TSA key wont work, thus making it compliant with the "and only the passengers retains the key/combination" part of the law
He didnt even have to pick a lock on this one lol
He said the lock doesn't work so the safe is essentially pickproof (but not bypass proof)
@@piotrnapora5810 it works with the user key, not the TSA key. So can be picked in the user direction, not the TSA direction.
the hinge-disassembling lawyer
Imagine making a safe that fails so spectacularly, it actually passes
Thanks to your information from this video I kept an unsuspecting customer at my work from buying one of these and helped her find a better case! Thanks LPL
I was first thinking that he did research a lot about law, then I remembered his name.
Lawyers do need research, especially in such countries as USA
@@mikoajp.5890 but Lawyers know where to search and thus have it easier. A non-professional would've taken more time to get valuable information.
@@rioghander2te Yep, one does not necessarily need to know everything about a subject, as long as one knows where to find everything about a subject..
This is information that anyone can find by googling something as simple and incoherent as "TSA gun," and clicking the very first link that pops up.
“Egregious” is the closest you’ll hear the LPL swear.
He says cock in one video
@@shrekonion8307 Dear god.
Watched a video with a plethora of baaadd words yesterday, i think it was an old video with him testing out 3 let locks lmao
The worst thing a lawyer could call you is a "reasonable person"
@@shrekonion8307 which one
I regularly forget that LPL is, in fact, an actual lawyer, and then I come across a video like this lmao
removing the hingepins is only so effective in accessing the contents within because of how flexible the case is. I don't think you could purposely create a worse design
I beg to differ.
possibilities to make it worse:
- use cardboard as a material.
-leave a gunshaped, gunsized hole at the bottom.
-do not connect the part the lock locks into with the body
-ad a knob at the end of each hingepin to allow toolless removal.
"Hey this is more secure because the master key doesn't work!" Designer: "it doesn't? Oh I mean yeah it doesn't... of course... Yeah."
It does allow the tsa to lock the box when it’s not locked and the correct code isn’t dialled, so isn’t that a feature?
@@Keneo1 Makes me wonder if the master key is to set the code. It would make sense that you should only be able to set the code while the box is open.
Why are you having an imaginary conversation with yourself?
Oh so that's what the "Lawyer" part means.. I get it now.
Funny enough just started looking for my first firearm. Noticed this box on the shelf and picked it up. Something looked familiar about it. Searched youtube and I KNEW it was familiar hahah from THIS video I saw a year ago. Thank you so much for helping me avoid this mess.
my favourite part of this video is when he says “probably legal”
"In any case..."
Hopefully not in this particular case.
Criminally underrated comment. :)
@@kirstinmorrell Do I need a lawyer? ;)
Pun unintended 🤣
@@kirstinmorrell For the criminals: hopefully in this case.
"compliance with TSA rules and not ACTUAL security."
Shots fired with no survivors.
Is that because they got into this unsecure gun case and killed everyone?
good luck getting to your checked in bags mid flight, next to impossible
@@PneumaticFrog The gun case bit of the law is not to protect against the gun's owner during flight. It is to protect against anyone else during the parts of travel where the gun/gun case has to be in the possession of someone who is not the gun's owner.
The gun is certainly safe during flight on commercial aircraft whether in a case or not.
The MOMENT you turned the case over, I saw the hinge and, with great exasperation, tilted my head in disbelief and loudly said "oh my _god!"_ in time to you pointing at it. How can companies that manufacture security devices mess up so egregiously when it comes to actually making secure devices? Hahaha
Blocking the TSA key seems intentional to me. It lets TSA people "clear" it because it's "TSA compliant" on the surface, but it complies with the federal law because it's not actually openable by the TSA, i.e. it's a design feature because you don't have to explain the law to anyone when you're checking the bag
That makes absolutely no sense, and believe me, they know the law when you check bags. It's not complicated.
@@matthewklahn7523 THe question I have is if the law says "only the passenger" has access to the inside, how could the TSA approve the lock in the first place? Note the packaging states that it complies with TSA firearm guidelines.
@@Tahngarthor "TSA approved" does not mean that it was examined and tested by the TSA. It means "this case was designed to comply with TSA guidelines". Except in this case, it's obvious that somebody at the case company does not understand TSA guidelines.
"TSA compliant" for a gun case would use a regular lock, NOT a TSA lock!
@@cymond which is exactly why this safe is still legal, because the TSA lock doesn't work.
LOL! So the TSA key lock serves no real security function and is only for "show," much like TSA "security theater" checkpoints.
Its all security theatre. All of it. Physical, Cyber, Police, it's all make believe. The world is DIY, everyone needs to get used to that.
I'm sure the actual TSA requirement is simply "it needs to not actually be secure".
@@dww34 u good bro
Me: Yeah that's pretty bad.
LPL flips it over
Me: Oh God...
"let that sink in"
Why would I? I don't know if that sink has committed acts of felony.
dude just let him in
Those hinges reminded me of how much of a pain in the *%$ I was as a teen lol. I kept picking locks for fun including the medicine box he kept my RX's in. Didn't take anything out, but unlocked it to show how useless it was. So my dad bought a big heavy duty tool box like box and a padlock and put all the Rx's in there instead. The box had stickers all over showing it being run over by a truck, so he was confident. The next day I see this box sitting in the kitchen. Took some pliers, took out the easily accessible hinges, and left the lid open in the opposite direction to find when he came home... He stopped locking the box after that. I think I could have gotten a lot of experience that led to a career if he was as dedicated as I was stubborn, but I think I had made my point xD
LOL: it’s would be illegal if it wasn’t for this flaw
The designer: happy accidents
When Bob Ross's descendants end up in the wrong field of work...
@@RyTrapp0 But really if it was made by A Bob Ross descendant....it would only be able to carry bushmaster brand guns😂
Oof.
"I have no idea how something like this got through the testing process."
I do. It wasn't tested. Who ever was handing it off said "It didn't fail testing" which is technically true.
Personally, I'm guessing it was tested, they found the flaws, and told people it would need to be re-designed. Then some higher up said "We already got TSA approval on this design though, and if we re-design, we'll need them to re-approve, which is too much trouble. Ship it."
_It can't fail a test if there wasn't any to begin with_
@@jastur3645 I bet they designed it so the tsa lock would open, started producing them found out they weren't compliant with the feds and just changed the receiving slot to allow it to comply without much effort on their part.
Watching this channel can really make a person feel stupid... this guy really has a analytic mind with talet for engineering.
Thank you very much appreciate your good work why do companies like that take our money thank you again FIFA up the good work
Heard a story about Someone who was standing at the TSA booth with a compliant gun case locked with a secure padlock holding the keys waiting to hand them to the agent who proceeds to cut the lock off and berate the passenger for not using a TSA lock
Anom Amos there are multiple TH-cam vids documenting exactly that type of TSA encounter.
Yeah I saw Deviants video too!
@@jpe1 One guy would travel for competitions with really expensive and safe locks on his cases, and started suing the TSA for replacement costs.
I have never once had a TSA agent inspect one of my firearms. Ever time it's just been the airlines check in agent. And then I'm told IF the TSA wants to take a look they will.come get me. Never has happened.
@@im2geek4u
Only time I had a TSA inspect one of my firearms was at the Denver airport and it was after they X-rayed the case and saw it was an MP5 that I had in the case. I think they just wanted to look at it more than anything.
Honestly, even though it's obvious they screwed up....if this actually was intentional, then it wouldn't be inexcusable, because it would be a genius case of malicious compliance. I mean it's got a TSA approved lock in it, yet it still complies with title 49 to not be illegal.
I'm honestly surprised fewer people aren't mentioning this. To me it seems that the way the title is written maybe most gunsafes aren't technically legal since not only the passenger has the key (all the TSA agents also have the key, therefore it is illegal?)
It honestly sounds like it is in practice almost always illegal to travel with a firearm since you need the TSA to have a key, but you cannot travel if not only you possess it. So they let you travel with one if you're compliant, but it sounds like they basically reserve the right to either say you need a TSA master key to access this case or you can't fly, OR, since a TSA master key can access it, its technically illegal. They can tell you that you aren't complying with one or the other requirements that are almost mutually exclusive.
This case however seems to have found a way around that as it is TSA compliant (says so right on the box) but only the passenger can access it with their own key or the code (making it comply with title 49). And to be honest when it comes to gun cases I really don't think people should be as concerned with how easy they are to unlock or bypass, the lock box isn't really to prevent theft but just to secure a firearm. And if someone is trying to get to your firearm by means of pliers or lockpicking equipment, the gun case isn't really designed to deal with that. More for keeping out toddlers or preventing misfires.
All in all this gun case looks absolutely genius.
@@eewweeppkk Man, you could grab that firearm with a tooth pick and your hands, any pointy thing would do the job, after you move the pins you could grab it with your hands, literally awful design.
@@eewweeppkk AIUI the TSA lock isn't a legal requirement, they'll just break into any other luggage that is selected for inspection and won't pay for a replacement of any damaged locks or luggage.
@@jacobmartinez4031 (stamps on plastic box) (takes out content of plastic box) no tooth pick needed.
@@jacobmartinez4031 Well that depends on the usage of the case. If you only use it for travelling by air in the US the gun mustn't be loaded or it's illegal. So even if someone steals the gun they couldn't kill anyone or at least they would have a harder time doing so...
He knows a whole lot of legal stuff, it is as if he was a... Oh
My guy lawyered more than he picked the lock 🤣
"I've been talking for too long" 3 minutes into a video. I appreciate being short and to the point unlike most TH-camrs who won't post a video shorter than 10 minutes long.
Not to mention some people like to set a speed record speaking so fast. For people outside the states it can be difficult.
Yeah padding the runtime for ads irritates me. I've watched a few videos lately that were 8 minutes of content and 2 minutes, 5 seconds of end-card just to get over the limit.
Michiel van Erven TH-cam allows the user to adjust playback speed, slowing down those that speak too fast (and speed up the vast majority that speak too slow).
New slogan, “Snap Case, the official lockbox for when you want plausible deniability for “unauthorized use” of your firearm”
The boating accident of the 21st century!
“Design and testing process “ lol good one LPL
I’ve heard of some airlines/airports that try to tell you that a tsa lock is required and you aren’t allowed to fly with any other lock. Maybe it’s designed to bypass that so it is secure from tsa without them knowing about it. Otherwise I’m at a loss.
Right kindergarten children, today we are designing a security box.....
I have to get this box and leave it out just so when people ask about it I can say, " Well do you know about Title 49 Code of the Federal Regulations sec 1540.11C2 ?... "
" I thought not. It's not a story the TSA would tell you. It's a legal legend."
@@GregDickinson75 "Is it possible to learn this lock?"
"Not from a TSA agent…."
I like your videos - short and to the point. And your speech is clear and the sound quality is good making it very easy to understand what you are saying.
As an engineer myself, it blows my mind how some products ever make it out of design never mind quality assurance.
I'm not even an engineer and I often wonder this.
I bought this clips on AMZN once and they ad little "feet" that swiveled to achieve good contact with what you're clipping. They were flawed in that there was no stopper so the feet would flip around and fall off. Company solution was to include a bad of spare feet.... I'd be embarrassed to suggest such a poor "fix"
Is the key flaw actually designed as intended? What does TSA regulation require? Does the lock actually need to work or do they just need to "work". Seems like an ingenious way to fulfill both Federal and TSA requirements. Since the key "works", it operates the locking mechanism. But it doesn't actually work to unlock the box, hence fulfilling Federal requirement
That's what I was thinking. The flaw seems so obvious, it might actually be intended. If that's the case it's actually not a bad design, if you ignore the hinge of course
No, there shouldn't be a TSA lock on a hard case carrying a firearm, at all. A guy actually talked at a panel about how he uses that to transport everything he carries in locked steel cases to prevent theft. Since each case contains a firearm only he can open them, and there were occasions where he got through faster because he had firearms in there (separate line). He talked about a few things I don't remember exactly, some edge cases, what to say to idiots etc. Also to check the rules for where you fly and keep up to date with the federal laws.
And the the TSA agent can ask the passenger "oh looks like there is something wrong with the key can you open it up for me?" Which the passenger then opens it up with the combo...
Imperial Knight, you do realize that the Transportation Safety Administration is a Federal Agency under the Department of Homeland Security, right? Essentially, you said that this gun case fulfills both Federal and Federal requirements . . . .
@@tortex1 That sounds like Deviant Ollam. The only problem is that apparently the TSA keep breaking into his cases by cutting off his locks to inspect them and then "securing" them with TSA luggage locks or even zip ties!
The Company who made this is like: WTF is a testing process?
That's when you Email Mark a picture of the product, and he texts back "looks good to me" TESTING COMPLETE!
China isn't very keen on spending money to test the products they make in their slave factories.
wow! thanks LPL, another interesting vid
this man never fail to amaze me with his ridiculously wide array of powerful resolves. A locking picking lawyer. _'Umm yes I am technically breaking into your property but do you know that we got a click out of number 4, and your lock does not comply with title 49 section 5040 1c. Now the cops are on their way to arrest you for your federal offense and I will fly away with my law expertise'_
even just a low power torch to the plastic hinges will make it give real quick..
this takes the expression "it's not a bug, it's a feature" to a while new level.
Our government is very efficient in writing loopholes in everything they govern.
@@allan-mccombs Same here.
I live in The Netherlands, and we *love* exceptions on exceptions... which leaves it very open for loopholes :)
"SnapSafe" - I guess the snap-part refers to the fact how easy it is to take the hinges off.
Which is usually what they do anyway. If they want in your locked case, those damn hinges are right there. They aren't going to try opening the lock if they don't have the key
Either that or what happens to the plastic when dropped.
SO glad I thought twice about getting this before an upcoming trip!
‘If all it’s used for is compliance with TSA rules and not ACTUAL security’ ouch.