Unpacking "Sins of Our Mother": Sam and Melissa React to Lori Vallow Daybell's Chilling Story
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 พ.ค. 2024
- Join Sam and Melissa as they dive deep into the gripping Netflix documentary, "Sins of Our Mother," which explores the shocking case of Lori Vallow and Chad Daybell. In this video, we react to the documentary's most intense moments, dissect the complex religious beliefs that influenced Vallow and Daybell, and offer our insights into the chilling events that led to a series of tragic deaths.
📺 About the Documentary:
"Sins of Our Mother" takes a deep look into the life of Lori Vallow, a mother whose radical beliefs and relationship with Chad Daybell culminated in a disturbing series of crimes, including the deaths of her two children. The documentary sheds light on the dark intersection of faith and manipulation.
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It was never proven that Joe Ryan SA the children. This was an allegation she made. She says a lot of things to get her way.
That’s what I was thinking, but I think at one time Colby was saying it too. I wonder what he says now.
She said a lot of things, yeah, like, “My children are Zombies,” so everything she has said to manipulate people or the system is sus.
I agree, I’m not so sure about the abuse allegations either, but Colby says it did happen so idk 🤷🏻♀️
I was never inclined to believe Lori that Joe SAd Tylee, but I don't doubt Colby. The psycho-legal investigation was centered on Tylee, not Colby. I think once Colby disclosed Joe's abuse to Lori, she falsely used that information to manipulate the courts in an attempt to alienate Joe from Tylee.
I believe that the court evaluated believed that Tylee’s testimony was coached by Lori. I believe that Lori was capable of that behavior.
Apparently Chad had tried his “we’ve been married before” tactic on other women before Lori. So it was not spontanneous. Also, if you followed the trial, Chad’s brother in law said he never called his accidents near death experiences until he started publishing Julie Rowe and saw what a following she amassed with her NDE books. He is a calculating liar. Period.
Absolutely!!! That is what I heard!!!
Exactly. I don't even believe Chad believes his own crap. I think he's a con who found a way to make money and achieve power since stupid people believed him. I see some parallels between Chad and L. Ron Hubbard.
Heather Daybell said the same thing in an interview with Hidden True Crime.
Being the 'religious' brother was Chad's way to be more important than his brothers who were successful in their business. I think 2 have masters degrees and are occupational therapists and the other is a lawyer. What's Chad doing? Writing and self-publishing books that have a very limited audience while his wife went out to work and support the family. Who had every heard of Chad Daybell before Tylee and JJ were missing? Unless you are LDS, I double anyone had heard of him.
@@jomc6734 Chad was a looser searching for ways to be important by copying someone else, he copied that other con man Joseph Smith, and Julie Rowe.
@@jomc6734 Very good points!
It was the book Visions of Glory, and Daybell collaborating with Julie Rowe, that inspired him to come up with near death experiences of his own.
Those initial embellishments which grew into full-blown fabrications gave Chad a way to impress people who believed in that much of the spiritual. I don't think he truly believed his own con, but enjoyed the power of others listening and following.
There is no evidence that he did have a NDE. Yes the incidents that he claims led ti his NDEs have been confirmed, but his NDE stories only happened after he published other's accounts of their experiences and they became popular.
Hidden True Crime, the hosts Lauren and John can share a lot of Daybell information. That would be a fun collaboration between your channel and theirs.
Watch the interview with his sister in law Heather daybell saying he's lying about his death experience because back then he never talked about it till he start publishing the books for Julie Rowe .So you guys are mistaking about Chad .
Well put!
And yes, I think he wanted power so he jumped on the near death experience bandwagon in order to gain prestige and power.
The context of Julie Rowe’s books doing well is very important, for sure
Yeah, he saw the success Julie Rowe had with her NDE books and then revised his past to claim authority and powers. Everyone who knew him back when these incidents actually happened said he never mentioned anything about it.
She thinks lds are truthful? He's a triple murderer and fraudster. Cognitive dissonance anyone?
The crazy making Charles experienced before he was murdered was so disturbing. Lori and Chad quickly morphed their beliefs to accommodate their affair, leading to multiple murders. Such a cautionary tale with so much heartbreak! The way they dehumanized others to meet their own ends was incredibly mean and caused so much anguish.
In the non LDS world we have a saying, “you can talk to god all you want, if god starts talking to you, GO TO THE DOCTOR”.
we are thinking beings, if a thought pops in your head that is not god talking to you.
It was never proven that joe was a p3d0. The counselors for the kids said it was the opposite, that lori coached and brainwashed colby. Colby lives with it either way. Tylee never made an outcry and denied it. i don't know, but please be careful when saying things as if they were fact. Family members might be watching and have enough pain on thier plate.
When you say something as fact others spread it as such. Too many victims in this case and enough pain inflicted.
Agree. His family members say he was physically and verbally abusive, but not SA.
Yes, I was shocked Melissa and Sam just spouted that off like it was truth. They obviously don't know much about this case. This "documentary" is from Colby's perspective. You would et a better understanding of the facts from watching all the witness testimony at trial.
I was raised Roman Catholic. I never heard about the New Jerusalem. We didn’t really spend much time talking about the Second Coming or end days either.
Confirmed! I’m as “recovering Catholic” and we never talked about the end of times or new Jerusalem-nothing like anything that the LDS religion professes-no prophets, no visions-that is all very strange to most and basically blasphemous.
Chad should be locked up for his blasphemy alone, says this Catholic.
He had an accident where he was seriously injured. People who knew him said yes that was something that he talked about, occasionally, not often; never said he died or nearly died. UNTIL…..he published Julie Rowe’s book and saw how much money and attention she got from talking about her near death experiences. Then suddenly he’d had one too
He jumped off the cliff that’s at Flaming Gorge and panicked. He never had a NDE. As his own brother in law stated under oath, his views added over time. One “NDE” had him in a car and driving aka day dreaming.
Joe Ryan per CPS and the courts was found not to have done anything and that Tylee appeared coached by Lori. I wonder if the same happened to Colby who now had false memories inserted for Lori.
Chad also was “married” in another probation to Julie Rowe and at least one other woman. Hilarious is how Chad plagiarized Saturday’s Warriors, “Circle of our Love” in his love letter to Lori. Every belief he espoused was lifted by others.
He didn't have an accident and he wasn't injured. He went cliff diving and never mentioned anything out of the ordinary when it happened. He started making the claims after he saw other people getting attention for their near death stories.
The allegations against Joe were never proven , in fact the court found the kids were coached
Been following the Daybell case for years. It actually led me to this channel. Because when you watch videos on that, TH-cam suggest other Mormon channels. And so here I am. 😊 and now I’ve been watching you two for about a year. Thanks for the great content on all the religions.
Same! It’s been a fascinating rabbit hole, the LDS/FLDS beliefs, history, culture. It’s so foreign to me, a Catholic from Michigan. It’s another world out there in Utah/Arizona/Idaho…
@@TiffinyHarrington exactly! Ohio here. Every time they do a video on Amish things, it doesn’t even phase me…as I see Amish every time I leave my house. But out there in the west, there are some crazy things going on 😂
In all seriousness though, I just find all the religions fascinating.
Chad's near death experiences started out as books of fiction. It was after he hooked up with Julie Rowe that he started speaking of them as real experiences.
his brother-in-law says his experiences became bigger and bigger. check out his brother-in-law's testimony (gwilliam).
There are lots of questions about if Lori was telling the truth about Joe abusing the kids. She dragged him in court for almost 10 years.
Also, one source has said that Lori had temple "cards" posted all over her home. We're not sure what exactly the source is referencing here, but maybe baptisms for the dead cards?
Could they be the family name cards for temple? This is how the temple ordinances are recorded.
@@MsCrazymomof3 Yes! This sounds correct. It was an LDS woman who was the source, so that would make sense. Anyhow, she went to Lori's place and they were literally taped everywhere, all over the house, and it freaked the woman out...
I was raised Catholic and never heard of a new Jerusalem.
I raised most of my kids in the 1980s and in the mainstream LDS church and I remember a conversation I had with another LDS woman and we both said how we wished we could have raised our children in the 50s and 60s because we just knew the end times were coming soon. That was more than 40 years ago and although I do think it’s OK to be prepared with some food for anything, I wish I hadn’t wasted so much time in fear.
Having personal revelation is dangerous and we see the results in all these crimes
Amen to that!! It really seems like the root of so much of all the problematic offshoots. Any crazy thoughts are suddenly god’s voice.
Chad blessings he gives sound Like Warren Jeff's. The soft spokeness.
That is the priesthood voice. VERY common and most blessings sound like that.
Joe Ryan ( Husband 3) didn’t SA the children. This went through the courts. He was verbally and physically abusive. Joe also joined the LDS church as she mentioned in her talk. This recorded talk was at one of her fringe groups- AVOW or Preparing A People or perhaps was on her “Feel the Fire” podcasts.
Colby to this day says he was SA by Joe Ryan.
I grew up hard-core Baptist, and I have no memory of them talking about a New Jerusalem
Hi Sam and Melissa! Couple of things. First I am Roman Catholic born and raised. We do believe Jesus will come again and there will be an end of the world. However, it will happen in God’s time and it is not for us to worry about. We do not have a new Jerusalem where we are all supposed to gather.
Second, to the point you were talking about at the end of the episode regarding the psych evaluation. I think Lori was cunning enough to keep it together for a few hours at a time but not much longer. Charles, who lived with her was seeing things that concerned him and so did Tylee. In one of the interviews at a police station Tylee says “they are going to put you in a padded room”. Once Lori was arrested and being watched in jail, she couldn’t act “normal” for long enough stretches and they sent her to the state hospital for treatment.
Thank you so much for your great insight on this case!
Raised LDS, my mother was obsessed with near death experiences. She read all the books and would find any information or interviews on the topic (80s and 90s) I would BET if she was to meet, in person (like Lori) someone with a near death experience she would hang on every word and possibly try to continue a friendship/relationship with said person because she would need to continue to hear and be validated that this is REAL.
Regardless of whether she was attracted or even liked that person's personality, I think she we do her best to continue getting information.
I believe this was what was going on, Chad ran with it for his personal gain.
Very good point.
The trial for Lori... was terribly sad. The trial for Chad, is devastating, because the prosecution brought all the evidence to the table. I've followed this case since the beginning. Definitely Lauren Mathias and Nate Eaton are the best for following the current information. Thank you both for touching on this case. Much love from Texas.
In mainstream Christianity the new Jerusalem refers to just that - Jerusalem. The second coming when Christ returns happens in the holy land where Christ will return to the Mount of Olives and will be seen from all corners of the earth. It’s foreign in Christian thought to believe that Christ will return to Missouri.
Thank you for your insight🙂
Christ returning to Missouri is so laughable to people who live outside of USA. Would never even cross our minds that it was a possibility 😂
I so agree with you! Completely ethnocentric!
Sometimes we overthink trying to explain/understand mental illness.
I was raised Finnish/Lutheran and never heard of New Jerusalem. Until I visited the actual Jerusalem that is. I wanted to see the city because of it's immense historical importance and was taken aback by the hoardes of super religious Christian tourists in the old town. That's when I looked into the meaning of Jerusalem for Christians and learned that many denominations believe that all the important events in the end times will take place in Jerusalem. And that's where New Jerusalem will be as well. I'd say that in christian groups that place great emphasis on the end times -many don't- New Jerusalem is a thing and is located in the city of Jerusalem or sometimes even more specifically on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem.
Yay! I get to watch a long video from Sam & Melissa while I do my household chores today!
How do you explain that at lori’s trial, after she was convicted, said she had had a near death experience when birthing Tylee, but she had never mentioned this to anyone before. The timing is too convenient.
Joe Ryan was not LDS. The speech where Lori talks about wanting to murder Joe was from a recorded fireside meeting. Hidden True Crime podcast with Lauren Mathias is a great source of info about the Vallow/Daybell case, rather than Netflix. Thanks for talking about it, good video.(I've been corrected: Joe Ryan did convert to the LDS church)
I thought Lori said in the recording that Joe did join and was respected because people didn’t know the “truth” about him
@@jcny11 So Joe converted to LDS for Lori, just like Charles Vallow? Or was he already LDS? I was under the impression that he never was LDS.
Joe converted
@@nana-belle Good to know! Did Joe stay LDS until his death?
@@jodinim6508He converted I believe
Chad used “married in a previous probation” as a pickup line with more than just Lori.
JR?
@@questiannaand others
I just finished watching the documentary! And this just popped up. I guess the predominant feelling Im left with is how sad it is that any extreme version of any religion usually leads to violence and sadly it is usually innocent children that suffer the most at the hands of adults involved. CC
Raised Irish/Roman Catholic, and I had never even heard of New Jeruselum. That's one of those concepts where growing up if someone started talking like that, that was a red flag that they're in some kind of religious cult. It wasn't until we met with a LDS family in Texas that I finally realized that's an actual belief religions have, and it's not necessarily cult-related talk. I know Catholicism gets flagged by some people as cultish as well, so when I actually started meeting LDS families, it changed my perception on how people talk about that kind of stuff, because they seemed no more strange in their beliefs than growing up in the Catholic church.
It is a cult
@rhondadearborn3265 LDS? I don't think I'm a qualified person to call it that, and as far as I am aware, it doesn't meet the standards for a cult. I'm not in the habit of tossing those terms around lightly. It diminishes the terms.
While I was never involved in the LDS, I had friends who were (and some still are) LDS and went out to a couple Sunday services. Didn't appear like a cult to my untrained knowledge on such things. It just really wasn't for me.
@@sarasynfox like anything else there is a spectrum, but thought control, limiting access or knowledge of truth, us v them, excommunicating apostates ….
Thank you 🙂
I might have to re-visit this doc since the trial is on now. I think you all might have Lauren and/or Dr. John on in your 4th episode for this, so I'm excited for that collab
FINALLY! I have been waiting for you all to get around to this crazy fringe group! So so glad you have!
Found your channel several months ago and love you guys! Learning about both of your backgrounds is fascinating. I've been following the Daybell case for a long time...from what family has said, Chad didn't talk about having NDE until he saw it was profitable for Julie Rowe and others.....and it gave him a certain status with his followers. Lori claimed in her statement at her sentencing that she had a NDE when she had Tylee, but none of her family had ever heard that before. I don't believe anything they say because they are both such manipulators! Look forward to new episodes from ya'll each week! 😊
Oh, I think he made it all up. None of his family said that he ever said anything about a near death experience before he met Julie Rowe and her books were selling. I think he wanted to be important and meeting Lori was a perfect storm. She fed his need for that importance.
I'm not religious at all and I technically died during a heart catheterization. I didn't see anything but was very aware of what was happening. I felt so calm, comfortable and absolutely no pain. (I have a chronic pain condition) It was a cool but also scary after the fact.
Man has been given free will.
When members know that people will believe them some will lie just to manipulate for power.
Love that you guys are doing this one!
In conclusion, I'm quite certain that LDS does not talk about mental illness. And you still reflected it too
I am certain mental illness is discussed in the LDS and people are more aware.
@@MsCrazymomof3I hope so. Maybe they should include some basic mental health screening questions in the temple recommend interview. It could be as simple as Can or have you ever externally heard gods voice?
They actually have an entire emotional resilience class.
And mental illnesses have been discussed many times in general conferences and other church wide conferences.
@@crazyaboutcards I wouldn't know, I am not a member. But focusing on spirituality without mention of, and it's not criticism, there's something lacking in the conversation.
I have not seen the program. But here is a comparison. I was the first born. My mother went through severe postpartum. She was going crazy if you can say as much. They were from Kansas but my dad was in the army so they were in Georgia. She was away from her mother. My dad took her to a psychiatrist on base. She appeared to be perfectly normal. She wasn't. They saw that afterwards and then she went into a psych ward for 6 months. I was sent to Kansas from my grandparents to take care of me. It's a mental disorder.
I'm a Christian, and I've barely heard pastors talk about the New Jerusalem. Only the brave ones ever venture into eschatology. 😅 What I think I remember...is that the New Jerusalem happens when God brings down the New Heavens and the New Earth. Without going back and doing a whole study on it, I'm thinking I remember the New Earth will have a New Jerusalem in the same geographical area as the original Jerusalem. We don't believe the USA has any special prophecy - except that we should want to be a friend to Israel, because of the Abrahamic covenant: "I will bless those who bless you and curse those who curse you."
This is so exciting with you guys with different theories... I can't wait for the next episode!
I was raised conservative Christian and we never thought the New Jerusalem would be located anywhere except in Israel. And technically, reading the dimensions, it would be far too big to even be in Israel.
But we rarely discussed it. The Bible itself says Jesus will return where he left, which is the Mount of Olives. We were content with that and didn't spend a lot of time trying to build a New Jerusalem (that descends from Heaven anyway, not something we would build) or place ourselves to be Leaders in that kingdom.
We definitely never have believed in people being some kind of special status leaders.
I love all of your videos but this one is next level. I've been following this story from the beginning but your knowledge is so valuable in helping me better understand the religious aspects of it. Thank you.
The conversation about where the manipulation started is so interesting to me.
I feel like it’s possible that when someone like Chad has one or more ‘actual’ spiritual experiences, and is wholeheartedly believed, they maybe test a boundary - add a part to the experience, or as you said ‘the fish got a little bigger’ and then at some point realises that there are people who will never challenge or question what they say
I’m with Sam on this one! Lori was manipulative from the get-go! She was a show-boat and Chad fed into her already huge ego!
I am definitely of the opinion that Joe Ryan was falsely accused
Love you guys! Glad your out of it! Whew! Glad to get ur view of this case!
Love that you are covering this! As many have mentioned Hidden True Crime on TH-cam has done LOTS of detailed coverage on this story. Interviews with family members, friends, neighbors, former cult members, etc. Hidden True Crime is a journalist and criminal psychologist couple who go deep into Lori & Chad! Also the wife (journalist) grew up ( & I believe she still attends) LDS. They have done collabs with Mormon Stories too which are GREAT for all things Chad and Lori, and Visions of Glory, Ruby Franke/Jodi Hildebrandt, Tim Ballard crossovers, it goes DEEP. They also did multiple interviews with Anna LeBaron and the overlap with Chad’s teachings and the LeBaron clan. Definitely think you all would find those interviews really interesting, and would be great to hear your reactions to those as well. A collab with Hidden True Crime and Growing up In Polygamy would be amazing!! HTC has also gone into how they are pretty sure that Chad wanted multiple wives, etc. ❤❤❤ sorry this is so long, I just find this case so interesting!! Thank you for the video!!
Well said.
@@valentinat3250 thank you!!
I'm really enjoying your channel GUIP and collaborations with other you tubers. I've studied religion and culture in my life and in academia. I've been aware of the growth of the LDS since the 80's. Your perspective and insight from the inside is enlightening and valuable at breaking down misinformation and misunderstanding. Peace and respect. 🌻
Wow so pleased your touching on this case. I’ve only recently heard of this case & have been watching Chads court case, so initially didn’t even know about Lori. Will watch this documentary for sure. First saw you guys on Mormon stories so started following you guys & a few others. I’m not LDS, I grew up Christian but it all leads to power & control. Love listening to your stories 💗
Fear comment was wise…at the beginning. Really appreciate you starting with that
Thanks for your videos/explanations. They have helped me understand the LDS religion
A couple of comments:
1. Joe Ryan was Lori's third husband.
2. There is an interview with Heather Daybell with Hidden True Crime, Chad's sister-in-law (she started dating Chad's brother when she was 14), Chad never mentioned 'near death experiences' and being able to 'see beyond the veil' and seeing his deceased grandfather until AFTER he hooked up with Julie Rowe and published her book which recounted her supposed near death experiences. He never mentioned any of his 'prophet' garbage (I apologize but that's what it was for Chad) to any member of his family when the supposed near death experiences happened. He had written and self-published books before meeting Julie and they were all fiction. After meeting Julie, they became biographies. Chad's brothers are successful in life. If you look at Chad, he really wasn't and he used religion as a way to become more important. He had found a way to become 'someone' and he started to form a cult.
3. I was raised Protestant. New Jerusalem wasn't ever mentioned in Church or Sunday School.
Thank you for sharing your views on this particular subject. You're very respectful in your videos when it comes to all beliefs in religion. I was babtized in the seventh day adventist church when I was younger and currently do not believe in organized religion at all due to many reasons. I have found the Mormon religion facinating to dive into as to why and how these folks think and act, and I appreciate your opinions when watching your videos. Also I have to say, I love watching how you both interact with one another as husband and wife. You both are great!!!!
Thank you, this was so interesting!
Was raised in the Baptist church and never heard about any kind of New Jerusalem or a certain town Jesus was going to come back to.
Visions of Glory was a huge part of it. Watched a multipart series on Jordan and McKay and they talked about it.
Saying "God told me" is always after the fact.
I appreciate you both!
I attended Church of God in Idaho Falls when I was a child. The pastors taught about New Jerusalem. I remember them talking about the end of time and the rapture and other related topics, mark of the beast etc. The house we moved into had barrels of food stored in the basement. The previous owners left them behind.
Interesting! Thanks for sharing 🙂
Hey! 👋 I'm nondenominational Christian and my family and Christians I know believe that the new Jeruselem will be a rebuilt temple IN Jerusem.
Just found your channel, I’m looking forward to watching more of your videos. I’m LDS and just wanted to weigh in a few things.
My LDS husband died when he was 11. He was brought back with CPR. His “veil” is not thin. He didn’t see a light. It was just nothingness. He’s a very normal person. I’m not trying to discount other NDE’s but they are not all the same. My husband doesn’t like to tell the story because he’s afraid of what people will think about him as a result.
The past lives concept actually does come from older leaders in the Church but their teachings have been denounced by the Church officially.
I agree that most LDS members aren’t making up their experiences, but I do think they are socially conditioned to process what they experienced into a context of revelations, visions, and visitations. Many religions use forms of meditations and process what thoughts come to their mind within the context of their religion. I think a lot of LDS social conditioning happens at fast and testimony meetings where we “learn” how to articulate our experiences from each other.
The Preparing a People conference happened in St George, not Rexburg when Chad and Lori met. I haven’t researched it but it seems like Rexburg would be an odd place for a conference because of weather, lack of venues, and far from airports. These conferences are huge money makers and they are incentivized to hold them in places where they can get lots of people.
Btw, Preparing a People and AVOW changed their name to Book of Mormon Evidence and they are meeting this October 2024 in SLC. They are having 65 speakers but none of them are named. No refunds are issued after March 14, 2024. So those wanting a ticket will have no idea whom they will hear from.
Raised Protestant Christian. There was no discussion of New Jerusalem
For years he told of the cliff diving and ocean experience without saying it was near death. After Julie Rowe made money on her near death stories,THEN he added to the story
Have you spoken to lauren from the hidden true crime podcast who covers this case extensively? It would be really interesting to see an interview where you compare Chad Daybell and Warren Jeffs in further detail.
They also live in Vegas fyi.
Chad’s far from the first Mormon fundamentalist to talk about multiple probations
Hi Sam and Melissa, I love your videos, thanks for all the work you both put into them.
I might be wrong but my understanding is that the allegations against Joe Ryan were never proven and that it was just a way for Lori to get what she wanted.
This is such a complex case and given I'm not LDS, theres some things that go over my head, so I really appreciate channels that explain these religious beliefs and how they can stray into extreme beliefs.
The line is very clear, you are the line. Whatever spiritual experience you have is for YOU and NO ONE else. Dead simple, Folks.
It started with the book Visions of Glory which is tied to Jodi hildebrandt and others.
I think the key point in Chad Daybell's revelations is that he used them to puff himself up in importance and authority, authority that was directly contrary to the teachings and organization of the church. It became totally selfish, everything for himself instead of truly helping others, which is what our spiritual gifts are for. It absolutely makes my skin crawl when anyone tries having spiritual authority over me who hasn't been set apart for it. Complete red flag.
When I was a kid I went to a Baptist church. They never talked about the new Jerusalem. I never heard of it until the Vallow/Daybell stuff.
Thank you both for helping me understand more about Mormanism and the fundamentalist off-shoots.
I was raised Catholic (and my family has always been Catholic for all known generations) and I attended Catholic schools, as did our children. I have never heard of “New Jerusalem” and nor have I ever heard any clergy or anyone in the Church ever talk about “end days” type things. I do recall back in 1999, lots of folks around my town in Michigan freaking out about Y2K and we even had a lady featured on the front page of the newspaper as she was believing doomsday was coming and we all needed to prep. She had hordes of food and supplies of all kinds. But nothing from our Catholic leaders about “New Jerusalem” or end days.
Thank you, Melissa for being so honest about your beliefs. And thank you both for educating us people not familiar to the LDS Church
It's great how unbiased you guys are. Personally it appears Joe was a silent victim of loris before people saw her true colors.
You believe chad is such a good guy, who wouldn't lie about near death experiences? I don't believe anything that triple murderer says.
New Jerusalem: nope, in New Zealand I’ve grew up in Anglican and Baptist churches and went to lots of different evangelical churches and I never heard talk about a new Jerusalem. None of the churches I went to were very apocalyptic like that. Maybe new Jerusalem might have been used as a type of heaven symbolism, but that’s it.
Thanks for sharing. Lori vallow Daybell, a very sad case.
So sad for all of the people she had a hand in murdering, especially her own children.
Chads near death experiences were stories that morphed from fiction to truth
I am catholic and I have never heard of the new Jerusalem. We believe Jesus will return but we do not focus on when that will be or where.
I was raised up Lutheran and I´ve never heard of New Jerusalem 🤔
Chad did not share having near death experiences until after he was publishing Julie Rowe’s books. I believe he made a lot of money from these books. He saw how much attention and money came from speaking about near death experiences. I don’t believe they happened at all to him.
I’m am practicing Catholic and we don’t talk about the New Jerusalem only ever heard it with you guys
Thank you
People have totally shared crazy things in testimony meeting😂
My core family is atheist but I grew up with close friends with Christian catholic or Christian protestant beliefs (mostly the grandparents, sometimes the parents, very rarely the children themselves) in Europe. On many occasions I accompanied them to church events, mass... There was never mention of a second coming or apocalyptic stuff.
But a classmate of mine back then was a member of the Jehovas Witnesses. They have a very strong and fearbased belief about the endtimes, she explained. I remember suddenly understanding why she didn't bother making friends with us, because she couldn't connect emotionally with us, as all of us would soon suffer and die when the end times would arrive. Just think about that, all your friends are on Satans side and evil and will therefore not go to heaven with you... I couldn't even try to categorize people like that in my head. I still can't. She couldn't value us as good hearted people, as we weren't believer in the right faith. That's so twisted.
Chad and Lori met at a Preparing a People conference in St George in Oct 2018...or so they said😮
I seem to recall that she’d already read all of his books by the time they first met in person in October of 2018. They could have been communicating well before october 2018, so actually really knew each other before that time.
Chad was bfound guilty today on all charges. The sentencing phase begins tomorrow. I'm not invested in either choice the jurors decide. He made his choices. He can never pay a full price for his acts, but he will pay a heavy life changing price.
raised in Presbyterianism (PCUSA) and Methodism (UMC). New Jerusalem was occasionally referenced, in two ways:
1) It is a metaphor for all states in which one is living in the presence of and in accordance with the will of God.
2) It is not a place currently on this earth; after this earth has been destroyed, a new earth will be created in heaven/the spiritual world, and the New Jerusalem will be there.
The idea that the new Jerusalem was a place on earth that we could visit was dubious, and if it was, the idea that any of us would be able to identify what that place was is considered preposterous.
Yeah grew up Roman Catholic same pretty much!!
That’s not weird at all. We have a crucifix on our wall. Also my husband was raised Buddhist so we have a Buddha alter on the window sill.
I really appreciate the explanation in the beginning about God telling people to do things and what that really means!!
Former Church of Christ. We talked a LOT about the New Jerusalem.
I grew up in a fundamentalist Pentecostal church and family. The New Jerusalem was talked about as a spiritual place connected with the new heaven. It was never referred to as a particular place (ie, Missouri etc). Everyone was talking about the End Times and the tribulation and Christ’s return but I was taught that the old will pass away and there would be a new creation. I’ve since deconstructed so I no longer think that way, thank God.
34:56 I have heard about that also, but in the terms of somebody seeing a beloved family pet or dead relative that you miss. it’s your brain trying to find comfort in a high stress time.
It seems Sam is thinking Chad had alternative motives right from the beginning and religion was his weapon. 😊
I don't have personal experience with this, however I am a big Eddie Izzard fan and I remember him mentioning a hymn sung in the Church of England about building New Jerusalem in England. I'd love to know if that was a popular conversation or if there was just a random hymn written about it.
I just wanted to say that, yes, LDS do believe in personal revelation and that you can get inspiration for your own life, but Chad and Lori went waaaaaay off the deep end with it.
For example:
-secretly “sealing” themselves together in the temple
-comprising an entire light/dark scale for others and condemning them to horrible fates
-receiving “revelation” that they are actually already exalted beings, and it doesn’t matter what sins they commit in this life, they supposedly already proved themselves in another life
Are all VERY uncommon and deeply troubling, even within the LDS community. A lot of time was spent emphasizing how normal their personal revelation was on this video and I just wanted to clarify the difference.