265 RSW Gibson L1 Major Surgery Again Part 1
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ม.ค. 2019
- Here is yet another early L model Gibson. This one is in need of some major surgery. But you will have to wait for part 2 to get the whole picture.
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I like the jig you made and the Monday morning quarterbacks talking about cross-clamping are wrong. Your jig puts even clamping force and only takes mins to make. I'm a 65 yr old retired carpenter and love to watch real craftsmanship. Thanks again.
Perfect pronunciation of Snohomish, from someone here in Washington State.
In the photographic world, your "inspection mirror" is called a lupe. Love your videos!
I am not a master of finishes, but you are dealing with nitro cellulose lacquer on most Gibsons. Your cracks are called crazing, very common with age, and somewhat desirable, but... as I think you noticed, you can melt new nitro back into old and, heat from rubbing can also melt in a finish. I guess the lighter fluid helps, but heat from rubbing lots would gloss it up too. I have seen some work done with tiny drops of lacquer on Gibson finishes to fill in scratches and then with a light sand and hot buffing make it disappear. You are totally on the right track here. Personally, I would keep on rubbing and some other guitar snob would hate how I destroyed it. :p
Jerry - you pronounced Snohomish perfectly, congrats..... it's a charming town with 1st St. being a river walk that is excellent with many nice shops and bars/restaurants
I love his videos, because you get a sense of satisfaction of doing something, for doing nothing!
Starbond (among others) do a black CA glue,which would make those fretboard repairs even more invisible
The braces were placed according to the specific tonal qualities of each individual top. No kidding!The old gibson luthiers were just on another level of mastery.
To bad the new Gibson luthiers aren't on that level huh?
Well done thanks, love your humour !
I just repaired a lower bout crack in a Seagull S6 with a cedar top. Following your example I was able to sucessfully repair it. I had to use a clamp on the top to pull it into alignment, didn't take a lot of pressure, but it held the two pieces in alignment. Thanks. You also show me where the limits of my skills are - popping a top, resetting a neck, I'm not there quite yet. Thanks.
This vintage Gibson is great looking, after your care, she'll be stunning 👍
Jerry you crack me up!! At the beginning you said let’s just make it play and by the end you’re buffing and buffing and on the verge of a full on showroom shine! Hahahaa don’t worry it happens to me too!! I’m currently working on my uncle’s mid 70’s Gibson a-12 mandolin. Wanted to replace some of those teeny tiny frets due to severe dents and of course I’ve already found myself lightly buffing some scratches in the finish and repairing a crack in the back, lubing the old timers and so on and so on. The fun never ends!! Love your videos as your knowledge and skill has been a great help in my repair work.
What about saving some of that fret dust and using it with the super glue to mask some of those cracks. See that done before but you probably already know that :) Great looking guitar and tasteful repair imo. Love your show!
Done it thousands of times
The other old Gibson had the same hole in it I enjoy your work.
I can see the glue on the inside. It's great.
I remember in Chicago where I played out in the day an old blues player who complained "they took my fret grooves out and now it don't play the same". He eventually got them back, blues guys like to bend the strings of course and that is what makes those grooves. I have seen scalloped fretboards made with those grooves by the Luthier, personally, I don't like them but I don't bend the strings that much...
Really enjoy your videos. No profanity. Expertly done with class.
no profanity, but I did hear a "pecker" thrown in there once in a while. lol. believe me, I'd be throwing a lot more then that around.
waiting for part two thanks for shairing
Looking really good
cant wait for part 2 thanks for the vids
Nice job Doc!! Awaiting part 2 of bringing that old Gibson back to life! Thx
Well done!
Another great fix, can't wait to see the hidden troubles poping up and how smartly you'll get fixed. Happy New Year Jerry and a great health for 2019
Cant wait for the next video on this guitar...Coming along nicely...
Friend keep up the great videos! I am learning so very much from you!
turning out very nice.
Jerry Rosa, you are the BEST! Happy and PROSPEROUS New Year to y'all.
The lighter fluid will get off all the years of accumulated gunk and it just may be enough of the right kind of solvent to soften the finish without cutting it too much...kind of like a french polish on shellac. Liquid finish "restorers" are supposed to work the same way but are often too aggressive as solvents and quickly become strippers. It depends on they type of original finish. Some finishes are impervious to some solvents. Having said all that, I'm surprised lighter fluid would work like that. :)
Great video Jerry love watching your videos. Hope you have a great 2019 God bless you.
Anxiously awaiting part 2. Enjoyed #1 very much. Love the sound of these old Gibson's. Also, 18K subs -- a new high and climbing. Excellent! Carry on, friend. Happy New Year -- this'll be the one where you hit 20K, and early on I hope. Entertaining, informative, and inspirational -- the complete package.
There ain't nothin' in the world to motivate me to go out and do somethin' in my workshop than see'n someone do somethin' in their workshop different than the way I would. Thanks for being who you are dude! And sharing it too.
heya my friend I am happy to see another awesome video ... lol who knew necessity is the mother of invention .. now you have another bullet in your considerable arsenal of restoring old beauties like this one ... have a great 2019
Wow! Hell of a job!
Great job Jerry! I'm going to try the paper towel & lighter fluid. We live & learn.
Great video Jerry!!!!!)))🎸🎸🎸👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼😊
Looking really good, another great video. I would love to see more of a restoration type video sometime if the opportunity arises. And, so far at least, another video with 419 likes and no dislikes, that is really something.
As someone from Washington, you got Snohomish right. Good job! No one can pronounce place names from around here most of the time. Hahaha
You pronounced it right.lots of towns in Washington State have Indian names..
The ring ferruls are actually eyelets for use in fabrics only not formed up when installed in fabric.
The amount of patience that you have with the ca glue and the fret board... Wowza..
Jerry, I, too, begin a project with great hope of simplicity.... However, it's so easy to want to weave a blanket to keep you warm & wind up researching a particular period, in a particular pattern, ending up w a museum quality item!
Oh, well, it's all in the joy.
Hi Jerry. I found your experiment with alcohol to dissolve the glue interesting. If you try that again, try using methanol. It's the most polar of the over-the-counter alcohols that you generally can buy at home improvement and hardware stores. Best of luck.
I use denatured alcohol for a very long time and it didn't have any effect either.
@@RosaStringWorks, denatured alcohol is usually a mix of methanol and ethanol, with chemicals added to make it terribly bitter so that no one can stand to drink it. The methanol, aka "wood alcohol", is what makes you blind if ingested. For cleaning and solvent use, you might prefer pure methanol. Pure ethyl and pure isopropyl alcohol might be worth trying as well....
Ding! Ding! I am am from Washington, you pronounced it perfectly.
Rick G. from Massachusetts- there is a product called Formby's that does a similar job as the zippo fluid. It's basically toulene and your right in that it melts the finish and you can rub out the micro cracks.
Here is something I found on the Web...
1. Identify: Select a small, 2" square area that’s as inconspicuous as possible and clean that area with a rag lightly soaked in turpentine. Now that it’s clean, take a good look at the test area. If you can see open pores of wood under the finish and the finish is not glossy, odds are that an oil and wax finish has been applied. If that’s not the case, test for shellac. Take a fresh rag, soak it in denatured alcohol and wring out the excess before rubbing the test area gently. If the finish starts to dissolve right away or becomes sticky and darkens the rag, the finish is indeed shellac. If that doesn’t do anything to the finish, clean the test area again with turpentine and, once dry, start your test for lacquer. Do the same as before, only this time use lacquer thinner. If the finish comes off, it was likely lacquer. If nothing so far has affected the finish, it’s most likely a modern, vanish-based finish.
2. Reviving a Lacquer Finish. Start first by lightly abrading the finish with #220 sandpaper. Follow the #1 rule of working with sandpaper - rub only with the grain so that any scratches will appear to be grain marks. Vacuum off the piece to clean it and then fill a clean jar half way with lacquer thinner. The idea here is to brush on a thin coat of lacquer thinner, causing the old lacquer to reactivate and be spread, just as it did when it was first applied long ago. Any scratches or blemishes should disappear before your eyes. Keep your brush wet at all times and move from wetted to non-wetted areas until all areas of that section and all other areas have been renewed. Proceed to Step 5.
3. Reviving a Shellac Finish. Shellac, like lacquer, is prepared for revival by a light sanding, followed by a thorough vacuuming. Mix four parts of denatured alcohol with one part of shellac in a clean jar and mix completely. Brush this concoction onto the finish, working only one area at a time. This should dissolve the old finish somewhat and cause it to be revived. Wait at least a few hours to see how well things are coming along. If it appears that the finish is not yet revived, or if the old finish was crackled, odds are that you’ll need to do a second and perhaps third application.
Another great video Jerry. I've used WD40 to soften up old adhesive on aircraft windshields. Spray it on and let it soak to soften the old junk. Not sure how it would be on the woods. Looking forward to the second episode. Happy late New Years to ya!
Can tell early Gibson should have put a cross brace on the top. A humidifier for a week may shrink some cracks too.
To read the label when it is like you showed. Take a lightly damp cloth with water. As I said lightly damp. Just pat it on the label. It will bring the writing out so you can read it. I have done this with old 78rpm records when they was not able to be read. It won’t damage the label.
Nice video Jerry. The 400 grit and paste did actually make a better finish. You can see it on camera. I suspect the lighter fluid would also help, but what a lot of work that would be. The neck needs a good clean. I would think getting rid of gunk should be the first step of getting a better finish, but I guess you are doing that by softening and then changing the area of the paper towel. It's second nature to you. Your client will be well pleased. Your camera setup is working a treat now.
Looking good Jerry. I like the air pressure for pushing glue in when there is any problem with penetration. I'm sure if you had known how much CA might run through that fretboard you would have pushed some sanding dust in with it. But it's impossible to know at the start. Overall it's looking very good.
Jerry, you got the pronunciation on Snohomish just right. I happen to know because I misspent my youth on skydiving, and there is an inflight door for a Cessna called the Snohomish door that is on pretty much every small jump plane. The door was developed at the Snohomish airport and drop zone.
Nice repair work. Thanks for the videos.
1 table spoon kero 10 table spoons turpentine and shaved bees wax in a jar let it dissolve for 3 weeks - under the sink - and try that with a great cloth - my old jaguar car wood was sun damaged and i heard of this = great show thank you !
Ronnie Boucher used basically the same homemade stuff, minus the kerosene. Requires actual *turpentine* (distilled from pine trees), modern "mineral spirits" or "paint thinner" is not the same thing.
I've read a few historical novels that mention "turpentine camps"; I suppose a bunch of guys lived in the woods for months chopping down pine trees and distilling the essential oils. Probably distilling some horrid-tasting hooch as well, getting blind drunk, and fighting amongst each other !
great videos, Really enjoy your content. I think you've got an L3 there though. L-1's were flat top.. I have a very nice shape L-3 here at home and it looks the same as yours there. But mine has the Brown lacquer on the top as on the sides and back.. My friend and Luthier Paul Unkert from the old Kramer factory re-built mine from rough shape. He did a great Job. He operates as The Guitar Guy in NJ. I've been following you for some time. Really enjoy your repairs !!
Absolutely fantastic repair job and song! I wonder what would happen to that front (lacquer checking?) by the sides of the tailpiece (previous crack repairs) if it was buffed with the lighter fluid and polished out? The headstock was definately improved by the lighter fluid polish. Love your videos!
Hi Jerry
Hope u and yours had a great New Year!!
I would estimate it at roughly 1909 in year...by the colour!!
Take it easy, Lad!!
Best
J;-)
You got the pronunciation of Snohomish correct, good job. I have family from up in that area in Washington.
Why can't *I* ever find things like this for $10.00? Nice find, I love those old Gibsons. I have to consider doing some repair work on my 1917 A1 that I got from my Grandfather. The back wood has decided to shrink and separate, and it's full up the back. If the binding weren't in such good shape it would be easier to decide how to go about this one. I may just see about shimming it and regluing it without removing the back. The joints beside that all seem to be in great shape, another reason I don't want to take it apart. Decisions, decisions...
Can't wait to see how this L1 turns out. If this one is old enough, a 1 piece bridge would be more original, like my A1 has. Depends on when they started using the adjustables on everything. This one actually looks a lot easier than some of the other things you've tackled, I'm sure she'll turn out just fine.
It kind of goes down hill in part 2. But we win in the end
Will, you beat me to it. Yes the pronunciation of Snohomish is correct. I, too, live in the area, about 20 minutes away going over 228th and up highway 9.
Why can’t I ever find an early 1900s Gibson laying in a pile or rubbish? Very cool guitar. I love watching your remastering videos on these old beauties. I feel like I’d be tempted to remove the back on a classic guitar this old, but know it would make the job much bigger and more expensive. Great stuff, Jerry!
Ligfhter fluid is a naptha usually, it softens the old nitro finish, hence the eggshell look gets buffed out. Great work.
That's some trick with the lighter fluid. Don't be lighting any matches for awhile. Will be looking forward to part 2.
Utah is very dry. (I grew up in western Colo. same climate) It might be that the wood has shrunk from lack of moisture. I had a Martin that broke like that. The top was just too small after it acclimatized. I brought it out to Virginia and the problem vanished.
Already looks way better than how you got it.
Harbor Freight has an air brush sized grit blaster they call an 'Air Eraser". Load it with baking soda and tweak the pressure/mixture to knock the gloss off of a finish. Also great for removing paint and rust from tuners, etc. Their hanging motor flex-shaft wood carver beats a flex Dremel. Foot pedal speed control and more oomph at low speeds. I think HF or maybe a craft store had a cheap pack of thin foam sticky-backed sheets I use on clamp faces and jigs for protection and to even out the clamping pressure. Not a salesman - just some items I found very handy in my shop.
I'm a repairman and hobby metal mangler so if you need an oddball tool, clamp, or something hit me up. I like what you do and hate to see you struggle so much on these repairs.
ETG
Thank you. The camera probably makes it seem more Dramatical. I don't really feel like I'm struggling. In fact I'm actually very fast compared to most repairment. I have a flexible shaft router. I just prefer using the hand-held Dremel. The flexible shaft bugs me.
Love these vids... Though there is still no T in across Jerry. ,-) keep up the good work.
There is also no "h" at the end of "height" :)
I'm looking forward to seeing how this turns out! I'm guessing it must be the naptha in the lighter fluid that cleans up the finish.
You got pronunciation correct on snohomish. I'm in Snohomish wa.
That is a french polishing technique he found out by accident. With the right kind of solvent, and enough time, he could make that entire instrument have a mirrorlike finish. There are easier ways to do it. Applying the solvent directly to a rag is not a good idea because it can burn the finish. A better technique is to take a lint free cloth, fold it up tightly and completely saturate it like a sponge. Then wrap that with another layer of a dry cloth. The inner part acts like a reservoir and keeps the surface wet longer. Doing it a tiny spot at a time makes it pretty hard to have a consistent finish. It needs to be a lint free cloth because the tiny particles of dust embed themselves into the surface of the finish and are there permanently. Naptha (lighter fluid) is great at cleaning the dark gunk off the surface. Most lacquer finishes polish up really well with denatured alcohol. If I was to do this instrument, I would go over the surface with a high grit wet sandpaper to remove the outer layer of oxidation, and the bubbled up shellac or lacquer. That leaves a smooth virgin surface to polish. Once it turns black and bubbles up and gets a crusty look, it is too broken down to get a nice polish out of. As far as sandpaper grits are concerned, 400 is usually way too rough. I would start out at at least 1000, and work up to around 2000 before the polishing. Naptha is great to clean off the sanding dust, dirt and oils with because it does not aggressively dissolve the finish like alcohol. With alcohol, you need to work pretty fast because the cloth can actually stick to the work. You could also take it a step further and spray it down with a few thin coats of a good clear instrument lacquer like Behlen to make it practically look like a new guitar.
If Wikipedia is correct about the production years I'd wager this is probably a second run of the L1 which should date it between 1926-37. The L1 was apparently not produced again until 1991 and has been in and out of production since then.
Thanks for the videos. I have learned a lot and enjoy your style. Oh by the way Snow-Home-ish is right.
yes you said it right Washington state very near BC border
WOW! That headstock has more holes in it than the rabbit I shot with #7 birdshot! LOL.
Hey Jerry, nice video... love the channel, I’m an armature luthier from Brisbane Australia, and I sure learn a lot for you. At about 51:10 or so you use lighter fluid to remove a sticker. I do a similar process, except here in Australia I use eucalyptus oil instead. It’s really good for removing all sorts of stickyness associated with labels decals ect ect, even if it’s dried and brittle. It doesn’t mar most finishes and has the added benefit of smelling really nice. I also use it as a fingerboard conditioner... but I really like the smell, and it’s quite strong.
Once again thanks for a great show.
Thanks I'll look into that.
I’m working on a Gibson L4. Funny thing on that it says B4 on the sticker.
Has two cracks on the body on either side of the neck. There are two loose braces in that area that caused those cracks. I took the back off because it was pretty much coming off anyway. and discovered the long brace were loose too near the bottom as well as all the other “rungs” of the ladder. There are three rungs below the hole and two above near the neck. The kerfing is messed up as well so will replace all that.
You oughta write a little theme music for this line of repair seeing as its trending now. May I suggest "L1 Rehabilitation Rag? Happy New Year.
Hi Jerry, Hope 2019 turns out to be a very good year for you. Most of the cracks I've worked with in the old Gibsons (one of the hardest to repair was a Gibson Harp guitar) or even violins, are a result of tops that shrink. Because the glue has held tight to the ribs pulling the crack back together with clamps just moves the stress to another spot and like you said can crack again somewhere else. Usually I cut a very thin kerf right down the length of the crack. This give me a crack that is a little more open and with the sides of the crack square to one-another. I then make a thin wedge shaped strip of wood that I press into the crack. To glue the wedge in, I use a hot hide glue that I make waterproof so it can't be easily reversed. You could also use the yellow glue that so many people use. I like the hide glue because it is a thinner film in the crack, is somewhat absorbed into the wood and as it dries & cures it pulls the parts closer together instead of a film that pushes the parts apart. That is why clamps a more loose after hot hide glue cures and the clamps get tighter when yellow glue is used. I'm not condemning yellow glue or those who use it. I use it for several repairs also. I do enjoy your videos and look forward to each new one. Ralph in Appleton, WI.
I've used the strip fill method myself. Thanks for taking a look.
The key to polish away them cracks in the finnish i to make heat! The cloth should be like a small and hard ball and you shall rubb hard on very areas to get that
heat to soften the laquer. I am a carsprayer and have polished many, many squaremeters of cars bodies. (not good in english thoug :)
I use nail polish to touch up nitro and had good success.
"...a couple of sets of tuning keys".....the year is but new but I reckon you may already have just won understatement of the year 2019...
wow!!!!love the guitar and love what you did to it !!!those tuners are much later than the guitar they look like black diamonds which are from 80s maybe late 70s have the same on 2 of mine thier not very good and dont match whatsoever I day I will replace the buttons
,I also reglued the old case case alone was 10 hours easilly but Know the guy and had to do it didnt charge him much ,but im trying to get customers so I do not get alot for my time doing cases,alot of pictures being taken so I can show my work nope not gonna do the you tube thing lol I am not a luthier like you but have a Great passion on restoration and thats really anything old just love doing it,I have a very simular guitar its a 1939 stella that is stenciled luckily it has no issues as of yet but its tuned to C6 but it was designed to play C6,country swing type stuff it was it was designed for and is made alot stronger than your usual gutar has a L shaped neck for slide guitar love it!!!
After watching your previous L1 video, and your own comment about it, I'm inclined to recommend that you try out Enchroma indoor colorblind glasses. You may find it much easier to match finishes, and will also have the added benefit of using them as needed in your daily life. There are lots of videos on TH-cam about them.
I've got the enchroma outdoor glasses. While they do work to some degree they're not a real magic bullet.
I've seen people use brown shoe polish to add a yellowish look to plastic. There's a difference in where you buy it even with the same brand. Some have more reds than others.
You pronounced Snohomish correctly! I live about a mile from there.
Jerry, I think you might have accidentally wicked a lot of CA glue into the neck pocket when that fingerboard crack at about fret number 14 kept drinking.
WD40 Works pretty good on removing the gummed stickers too .
Nice work. You can learn something new everyday....lol
Man the headstock looks like swiss cheese, WOW !
That CA glue was probably wicking into the fret slots on the fingerboard.
C'mon Part 2!!! Come on... come on... come on... *waits impatiently*
that looks very much like an old Gibson I worked on from Utah several years ago! dunno if it's the same one but sure looks like it.
From what I understand, the braces are made specific for each guitar.
I think you should put at the end of this video when completed the video will self destruct in 5 seconds another mission in possible well done
Ay im by Snohomish (you said it right)
I have found naphtha works the same as lighter fluid and is cheaper to buy in quart cans. It works in cigarette lighters too.
Any OTT lights in the shop? If not, check them out for deep true color. I have six in the room where I build toys for kids in the hospital and bad circumstances. I was Rescue and now home bound. My 3 in one with a large light bar, magnifying lens on a second arm and a compression clip on the third arm. Second is a new light, yellow-white-blue light selection with four levels of brightness and a shelf for an iPad or similar. Really helps my eyes and brings out a lot by choosing the light value for maximum contrast. I hope this helps.
Great work on pronouncing Snohomish, I grew up in western washington and there are a bunch of odd names, just be glad it didn't come from Puallyup or Sequim
And don't even get me started on how they pronounce "Buena"!
Another Washingtonian here. Good job on Snohomish, Name of a city and the county it is in. Could have been from Queets or Quillayute or even Humptulips, Washington!!! All Native and Tribal names.
I think that tiny hole under the tailpiece may have been for some kind of a bumper to stop the tailpiece from damaging the top?
I’d be interested to hear “why” you think these cracks occurred. In other words what caused them? It would likely be a well educated SWAG (scientific wild-ass guess), but it could change the way you repair and reinforce them.
I’ve a civil engineer (P.E.), with 35 years of experience and I’ve done a lot of analysis on cracked concrete pavement. While concrete and wood are very different, they tend to crack for the same reasons, shrinkage or stress. Concrete cracks are repaired differently, depending on the cause. If stress is the cause, simply repairing the crack with low viscosity epoxy, typically result with a new crack, right next to the one you repaired. You mentioned there is evidence of a previously repaired crack, right next to the long one you’re working on, so that basically proves my point.
The fact that the cracks in the lower bout are parallel and long, does make me think they were “pulled” apart. I guess this could be from either shrinkage or stress, but they are also on either side of the bridge, so the downward force on fr9n the strings pulling 9ver the bridge, could be a root cause. Either way, I feel like it would be important to add cross bracing (which you may do, later in this video), not just cleats, to carry the load, after you’ve glued the cracks back together. Just my $0.02.
Love your videos! Keep doing what your doing. Thanks!
im from the uk, to my knowledge utah gets rather hot and dry in the sumer, so a humidity controller in the case would of helped.. but Jerry's gona wrestle that crack back where it came from
Hi Jerry
Really enjoying your vid's, I was just wondering if it would be prudent to brush a small amount of black (ebony) spirit or water based stain in to the crack before glueing so that the whiteness of the spruce is masked?
Cheers from England :)
Regarding the lighter fluid trick, it's just Naptha. Save some money and buy a can of it.
It’s not dejá vue - it’s Ground hog day😈
Hi Jerry. Happy New Year to you and yours. I sure do miss the old camera/video system you used before this. The old system made me feel like I was right across the bench from you. There was so much depth--so dimensional. This looks like too much contrast. I enjoy watching you work on these instruments so much, but this image seems so distant and cold. Anyway, if you're taking a viewer opinion survey (lol) on the new video technology, put me in the "no" column.
Sorry to disappoint. It saves me hours of editing on the stupid audio though.
@@RosaStringWorks Not to worry. I'll cope. You still da man--awesome to watch you work--amazing and multi-talented skills. Thanks for sharing.