The Outeniqua Choo Tjoe was closed in 2006 and this journey I made in 2004. Great views puffing up hills, passing lakes and hugging cliffs with a drop to the Indian Ocean.
Wonderful to watch. This was my last stamping grounds on SAR as a fireman. I started in Germiston then worked out of Kimberley for years on the big 25NCs and finally ended up working out of Voorbaai. After firing the fast mainlines I did find the George to Knysna line extremely easy to work. Even hand firing a GEA garratt up Montagu was easy work after Kimberley. Looking at your clip around Victoria Bay reminded me of a night we were working back to George on a class 24 when the ashpan fell off. I had to get under the engine and unbolt it to stop it dragging on the track. Once back at George I packed the drivers well polished kit into his bucket when he noticed his shifting spanner was missing. "Where's my spanner?" he asked. Of course I had left it down on the track near Victoria Bay. He knew this right away and said to me "well you best get yourself down there and go fetch it". I replied "no ways am I walking all that way for a spanner" and he replied "don't be bloody stupid, take the engine" and sure enough off I went on this class 24 alone back down the dark track. . Driving a big hissing steam loco alone along a dark forest track is extremely scary work and an experience I will never forget.
@@smacksman1 oh not sure I would manage a mighty hand fired 15F out on the mainlines nowadays ;-) Think my soft diesel hands would fall off. However things might change as I got big plans to be driving steam on the mainlines again very soon. Watch my clips on Adventurescot here on TH-cam. It might or might not happen but here's hoping.
We stayed by the line in 1982, and rode on it in 1984. The locos were all Class 24 Berkshires. I was told during the 1984 visit that one of them had derailed when going down the grade from George. When we came back from Knysna, at the foot of the climb back to George, it started to rain. The crew detached two goods cars from the train, and put them in a siding. Then, we had to make a request stop on the grade. You could tell the driver absolutely didn't want to come to a stop - but he had to. When he started back up the grade, the normally "slippery" 2-8-4 was guaranteed to slip!
I've heard that the train was also pulled by Class 24 steam locos before the 19D's took over the task in the late 90's. At the moment there are 2 steam groups running in the Western Cape, Atlantic Rail in Cape Town and Ceres Rail Company in Ceres. These groups have nrecently formed a partnership with each other and are now running as one business. Atlantic Rail have wooden coaches which are similar to the coaches of the Outeniqua Choo Tjoe in terms of design but unfortunately don't have a large seating capacity. The locosused are currently a 24 and a 19B from Ceres Rail. Ceres Rail are using the coaches from the Union Limited and their locos are 2 19D's built by North British Loco which have been converted to burn oil because of the invironment they run in and the 19Bmentioned earlier. I think Atlantic Rail could also benefit from a few coaches like the ones of the Outeniqua Choo Tjoe in terms of design, seating capacity and building materials as well as an NBL-built coal-fired 19D.
"RFP for the operation of the George-Knysna line In late 2021, Transnet Freight Rail (TFR), the owner of the George-Knysna line, put out a Request for Proposals (RFP) from the private sector for the restoration and operation of the Outeniqua Choo Tjoe on the line. This tender closed on 19 April 2022. Two companies submitted bids. As one of these bidders, The Outeniqua Choo Tjoe (Pty) Ltd assembled a team of track repair contractors, bridge engineers, hydrologists, steam and carriage restoration specialists, tourism specialists, and tourism journalists (amongst others). Most of the members of this team were also members of the recently-completed Kruger Shalati Train Hotel on the Bridge at Skukuza in the Kruger National Park."
It is a bit late to comment on this video's facts after 10 years but having just watched it now, I need to correct the author/producer when he states that 268 19Ds were built between 1937 and 1949. The actual number of 19Ds built was 235 in total. So it was not the most numerous class on the SAR - that distinction still goes to the 15F of which 255 engines were built between 1938 and 1946. Les Pivnic Retired Assistant Curator of the previous SA Railway Museum, Johannesburg.
Many thanks for that correction. As the design was English, I think the author of my source was referring to the numbers built world wide and not just SAR, but I may be wrong again! Do you have any news of the line opening again? There have been several rumours.
@@smacksman1 Sorry but wrong again! The SAR was blessed with a long string of competent Chief Mechanical Engineers who designed all the steam locomotives for the South African Railways - the design was NOT British but purely South African in concept. The SAR found it more economical to have the South African designs built by overseas builders in the UK and Europe but the designs themselves were (to repeat) South African. Les Pivnic
@@smacksman1 I need to add that the previous Rhodesia Railways ordered 20 locomotives known as their class 19 which were all built by Henschel in Germany to the South African Railway's class 19D design in 1951/2. One additional class 19 supplied by Henschel in 1953 was an experimental condensing locomotive which was also a copy of the experimental SAR condensing class 20. Les Pivnic.
For the "Rivet-Counters" I should have added that the SAR class 20 was a 2-10-2 locomotive and used to test experimental condensing equipment supplied by Henschel & Sohn in 1950/51.
@@lespivnic Thank you so much for putting me right. I remember looking at her in Knysna and seeing she was built in the UK so assumed she was designed there as well. I lived and worked in Northern Rhodesia and Rhodesia in the early sixties when steam was in regular use but admit I am not a 'steam buff', just an admirer of the engineering.
What I would like to see is that Transnet should give up ownership of this line, privatize it and let Ceres Rail approach Elon Musk to plough back a few of his millions to restore it. It was and could again be one of the greatest tourist attractions this country can offer.
@@smacksman1no hope. But luckily southern cape railway in hartenbos (30 minutes away from George) opened last year and now does trips with a 19d from hartenbos to Groot break station
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We traveled on it before 2006. All my children with us.2006 my youngest son died.
Think of the happy memories.
Wonderful to watch. This was my last stamping grounds on SAR as a fireman. I started in Germiston then worked out of Kimberley for years on the big 25NCs and finally ended up working out of Voorbaai. After firing the fast mainlines I did find the George to Knysna line extremely easy to work. Even hand firing a GEA garratt up Montagu was easy work after Kimberley. Looking at your clip around Victoria Bay reminded me of a night we were working back to George on a class 24 when the ashpan fell off. I had to get under the engine and unbolt it to stop it dragging on the track. Once back at George I packed the drivers well polished kit into his bucket when he noticed his shifting spanner was missing. "Where's my spanner?" he asked. Of course I had left it down on the track near Victoria Bay. He knew this right away and said to me "well you best get yourself down there and go fetch it". I replied "no ways am I walking all that way for a spanner" and he replied "don't be bloody stupid, take the engine" and sure enough off I went on this class 24 alone back down the dark track. . Driving a big hissing steam loco alone along a dark forest track is extremely scary work and an experience I will never forget.
What a wonderful story , thank you. I bet you still have the muscles of a fireman!
@@smacksman1 oh not sure I would manage a mighty hand fired 15F out on the mainlines nowadays ;-) Think my soft diesel hands would fall off. However things might change as I got big plans to be driving steam on the mainlines again very soon. Watch my clips on Adventurescot here on TH-cam. It might or might not happen but here's hoping.
We stayed by the line in 1982, and rode on it in 1984. The locos were all Class 24 Berkshires. I was told during the 1984 visit that one of them had derailed when going down the grade from George. When we came back from Knysna, at the foot of the climb back to George, it started to rain. The crew detached two goods cars from the train, and put them in a siding. Then, we had to make a request stop on the grade. You could tell the driver absolutely didn't want to come to a stop - but he had to. When he started back up the grade, the normally "slippery" 2-8-4 was guaranteed to slip!
Wow! If you had to stop on that climb it's a wonder you ever got to George! I visited Criccieth Castle a few years back. Great views.
I've heard that the train was also pulled by Class 24 steam locos before the 19D's took over the task in the late 90's. At the moment there are 2 steam groups running in the Western Cape, Atlantic Rail in Cape Town and Ceres Rail Company in Ceres. These groups have nrecently formed a partnership with each other and are now running as one business. Atlantic Rail have wooden coaches which are similar to the coaches of the Outeniqua Choo Tjoe in terms of design but unfortunately don't have a large seating capacity. The locosused are currently a 24 and a 19B from Ceres Rail. Ceres Rail are using the coaches from the Union Limited and their locos are 2 19D's built by North British Loco which have been converted to burn oil because of the invironment they run in and the 19Bmentioned earlier. I think Atlantic Rail could also benefit from a few coaches like the ones of the Outeniqua Choo Tjoe in terms of design, seating capacity and building materials as well as an NBL-built coal-fired 19D.
Wonderful video well presented and narrated. Thank you for sharing it.
Thank you Caroline, I'm glad you enjoyed it as much as I did. My memory of the journey is still fresh.
"RFP for the operation of the George-Knysna line
In late 2021, Transnet Freight Rail (TFR), the owner of the George-Knysna line, put out a Request for Proposals (RFP) from the private sector for the restoration and operation of the Outeniqua Choo Tjoe on the line. This tender closed on 19 April 2022. Two companies submitted bids. As one of these bidders, The Outeniqua Choo Tjoe (Pty) Ltd assembled a team of track repair contractors, bridge engineers, hydrologists, steam and carriage restoration specialists, tourism specialists, and tourism journalists (amongst others). Most of the members of this team were also members of the recently-completed Kruger Shalati Train Hotel on the Bridge at Skukuza in the Kruger National Park."
Thank you for the heads up. Wonderful news if it comes to fruition. That consortium seems to have a track record of getting a project done.
While I don't like the idea of the end of these magnificent machines, you did a good job of relaying the character of this particular line. Thanks.
I remember it in the 60's and 70's. The usual locos were Class 24 2-8-4's.
great video. Thanks for preserving and sharing the experience.
dolly did a good job getting up those steep hills
I so enjoyed your video. I am wondering if this old steam train is still running again.
Last I heard the line was still closed
It is a bit late to comment on this video's facts after 10 years but having just watched it now, I need to correct the author/producer when he states that 268 19Ds were built between 1937 and 1949. The actual number of 19Ds built was 235 in total. So it was not the most numerous class on the SAR - that distinction still goes to the 15F of which 255 engines were built between 1938 and 1946. Les Pivnic Retired Assistant Curator of the previous SA Railway Museum, Johannesburg.
Many thanks for that correction. As the design was English, I think the author of my source was referring to the numbers built world wide and not just SAR, but I may be wrong again! Do you have any news of the line opening again? There have been several rumours.
@@smacksman1 Sorry but wrong again! The SAR was blessed with a long string of competent Chief Mechanical Engineers who designed all the steam locomotives for the South African Railways - the design was NOT British but purely South African in concept. The SAR found it more economical to have the South African designs built by overseas builders in the UK and Europe but the designs themselves were (to repeat) South African. Les Pivnic
@@smacksman1 I need to add that the previous Rhodesia Railways ordered 20 locomotives known as their class 19 which were all built by Henschel in Germany to the South African Railway's class 19D design in 1951/2. One additional class 19 supplied by Henschel in 1953 was an experimental condensing locomotive which was also a copy of the experimental SAR condensing class 20. Les Pivnic.
For the "Rivet-Counters" I should have added that the SAR class 20 was a 2-10-2 locomotive and used to test experimental condensing equipment supplied by Henschel & Sohn in 1950/51.
@@lespivnic Thank you so much for putting me right. I remember looking at her in Knysna and seeing she was built in the UK so assumed she was designed there as well. I lived and worked in Northern Rhodesia and Rhodesia in the early sixties when steam was in regular use but admit I am not a 'steam buff', just an admirer of the engineering.
They are apparently starting restoration of the line, carriages and locomotives.
That would be good news. Last I heard there was a group of enthusiasts eager to get going but Transnet refused to let them.
Yes! We (Classic Rail) are bringing it back! www.outeniquachootjoe.com/
@@MartinHatchuel What is the latest news, Martin? All the best for 2022
Thy got know proud this government.
What I would like to see is that Transnet should give up ownership of this line, privatize it and let Ceres Rail approach Elon Musk to plough back a few of his millions to restore it. It was and could again be one of the greatest tourist attractions this country can offer.
@@joeneethling I go along with that, Joseph.
Do you know what the latest news is with the restoration of the line?
Communism... it is great at converting capitalist-built infrastructure to rot.
@@smacksman1no hope. But luckily southern cape railway in hartenbos (30 minutes away from George) opened last year and now does trips with a 19d from hartenbos to Groot break station