why i dropped CS at UIUC.
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 ก.ค. 2024
- count how many times i say "cry" in this video
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idk how I ended up on this but it helped me procrastinate for 16 more minutes 🧠
Fr
I'm so sorry you had such a shitty experience in 125 :( I'm a CS major at uiuc, and I definitely feel you on the initial imposter syndrome and the feeling that everyone knows so much more than you. (I also hate how mean your bf was. I saw that another comment was defending him because "he was a busy CS senior"... I'm also a busy CS senior, but I'm not rude for no reason and would do my best to support my loved ones if they needed my help :) ... And same for all my other CS senior friends. There's no excuse at all for calling someone stupid. He was probably just insecure, just like a lot of other CS students who feel the need to assert their intelligence just because of their own superiority complexes.)
I took 125 the semester before Geoff started teaching, so take this with a grain of salt, but I often wonder if the course's contents have become overcomplicated after hearing how he's changed the class. I honestly did not see as many complaints of how difficult the course was when I took it as I did when he took over. I'm sure he's a great professor, but sometimes I wonder if the content that he's teaching is too much for a beginner course. I think he has good intentions with wanting to expand the horizons of people taking 125 and learning to code for the first time, but I worry how much it pushes people like you away.
Anyway, that tangent aside, I also really disagree with the idea that people are simply "wired" to understand logic. Is it a skill, just like any other? For sure. Will some people be better at it than others? Absolutely. But, I also think, like your advertising prof said, it can definitely be learned and improved on. People have such an elitist attitude when it comes to CS, but it's literally just like any other major.
You mentioned that you worried how you'd perform in 400 level classes if you were struggling in 125, but honestly, 125 *is* the hard class. As you said, programming is a language, and putting in the effort to build a strong foundation is the most vital part. I struggled far more in my Spanish 1 class than I did in my Spanish 4 class, even though I probably learned more concepts in Spanish 4. Likewise, I struggled a lot my first two years (125, 173, 225, 233), but, after that, a lot of my foundation was built, and the 400s I've taken since then have been moderately challenging rather than tear inducing.
If you still want to learn more CS, I think this major is absolutely one of the most accessible ones to learn outside of college, since you can really learn most concepts online for free. If you have the free time and want to learn, it's definitely possible to self teach at your own pace :) Especially now that you got through the hard part!
Nice reply Alvina!!! God bless you
First video of you I've seen - I really thought you expressed your frustrations and situation you went through well, I found it very compelling to listen to your thoughts and feelings about everything you've been through. Thanks for this content.
I’m struggling with my (hopefully) final semester of Computer Engineering at UIUC and just bombed my senior requirement midterm. This made me feel better, it’s a skill that just takes time but it’s sooo hard during this semester especially with all the pressure of getting through to move on to the next step (post college life). Thank you making this video! As a woman in STEM I’ve experienced so much of what you mention, including imposter syndromes, creepy classmates, and “dating” people who made me feel dumb/not as good as coding. I appreciate the vulnerability and the cute editing especially at the end :)
thank you for kind comment! wishing you best of luck on your last semester, you got this 🤩
Don't get discouraged if anyone tells you you're not good enough to code. There are people who have been doing it for years and got better. A good way to learn a concept or topic is by reading multiple articles in conjunction with watching videos on it. A lot of people tend to lose patience very quickly when learning how to code. Consistency + code everyday + patience are key :).
GIRL I relate sooo hard to everything you said in this video. I actually started as a CS Engineering major at UIUC and ended up switching to Graphic Design. I really wanted to be an engineering major because I love math but PROGRAMMING was a completely brand new thing to me. I could never even ask questions in class because I felt dumb that everyone knew everything already. I guess that’s why I was told to take CS105(?)because it was more basic but I wanted to graduate on time 😤 (still didn’t), but UGH I totally feel you. I really lost a lot of self esteem that semester.
we went through the same struggle 😭i hope you're enjoying graphic design much more tho!!
i want to note that while it was hard for me to find good help for CS, my brother alan would always drop everything at anytime to tutor me over facetime
plus he taught patiently, intelligibly, and allowed me to come to my own conclusions rather than just telling me the answer
so shoutout to my 哥哥 you’re da best 💫
sorry all those hours of tutoring went to waste HAHA 💀
Your brother was everything your bf was not. Probably cause he was confident in himself and didn't have to cheat his way. The people who know the content are able to explain complex topics to a 5yr old.
I am a high school CS teacher in Chicago. I am so sorry you encountered so much bias in your 1st CS class in college. I was not good at math either, but I had a successful career as a programmer and software consultant before I became a teacher. I switched to teaching because I want to make CS careers accessible to a more diverse population. Don't give up, it's likely your programming experience will prove useful at some point in your career!
I like your video. It reminds me of my personal experience in UIUC. I was the worst when I got into the school. I live in a miserable life. Study, Pain, Cry. Though at last, I strived to become the best and my work is still displaying in the front page of UIUC architecture. I quit to be an architect. You did much better than me. Good job. I wish I saw your video earlier so I would know I wasn't alone.
Man, I loved the raw emotion that you were able to put into this video. Stumbled into it in almost 3 years later, but I could've probably used this at the time lol. I really empathized with you and your CS classmates as they probably did not have the capacity to be normal around a woman 💀but CS is definitely one of those majors where you can easily fall behind and question your sense of worth. Looking to return and complete my degree soon.
But it sucks so much that people discouraged you from learning a skill that you were truly enthusiastic about learning and applying in your work. :(
125 was made hard by geoff. But it’s hard for a good reason imo. It only gets harder so it’s good to know what ur walking into early on.
u have the best work ethic out of anyone ik 🧠💓
ily 🥺💗
CS major, recently transferred in last semester during COVID. Didn’t take 125 but took 126 which was incredibly difficult for me. I fell into deep depression pretty quickly. In my second semester now and not much has changed. Thank you for sharing your perspective it means a lot.
i'm sorry to hear that :( don't forget you are worth more than your grades and academics aren't everything! hope you can get past this soon 🙂
hey, how was the experience of transferring into CS?
@@officialconanobrien Difficult, I transferred from a CC so I already knew it was going to be difficult. But, even more so transferring during COVID. Didn’t get to meet many people in my classes via zoom and spending the amount of time in front of a computer coding by myself did a toll on me.
@@antonsebastian6484 thats fair, seems ike a very isolating environment
@@antonsebastian6484 hi, I’m thinking of transferring too in a couple semesters. Was there anything you did outside of academics/grades that you thought got you in? Thanks!
Also hope you were able to overcome your struggles!
I’m a junior and a cs+econ student right now. I remember how depressed during my freshman year where I studied cs125. Yes, the first semester I dropped it since I can’t understand and follow the concept with such aggressive speed
and limited easier problems to solve and help beginners to understand cs. It was bad, like everybody else I knew of were successful with the course but only me was left behind. However, I didn’t give up and instead taking programming academy during winter for like 20 days in China. It helped me a lot since they were actually trying to teach you coding and not speed running. So, I tried cs125 again next semester and end up with A. I was lucky to have a friend who carried me throughout the entire semester. I have to say it is hard, but I think if you actually get decent help from the resources you had, you would have succeeded easier. Also, it is great to learn about the cs stereotypes and I think it is hilarious because all people surrounded me most of them are acting weirdly and awkwardly including myself. People want attention and likes, they want to show off so to make up for the time where they were neglected. After 2 years of learning in cs, I guess one of the biggest gain for me is to admit and accept that I am a weird nerd and I am starting to let go of the past and focus on future. 😂
im thinking about enrolling for cs+econ at uiuc but was concerned about the fewer amount of courses in cs, and how well it would prepare you compared to pure cs. Was this a problem you came across, and did it affect your career placement? thanks
Well one good thing came out of this, it exposed that your relationship wont work out. If anything, this is a precursor to what would happen in the future if some challenge came up in your relationship.
Programming is a very difficult career. It is highly stressful, extremely demanding in time, and you have to also keep up with the trend in the industry. So good for you that you found out about it sooner in college that it is not right for you.
i love ur videos, this story especially makes me feel less afraid of failure. thanks for sharing!!💕
thank you for watching!! 💗
That mug mic is quite intriguing.
I graduated from UIUC in 1992 with a degree in CS/Statistics. I had a lot of experience in computer programming because I studied the Radio Shack TRS-80 computers as a kid. The problem I had with the UIUC CS major was that it had math or statistics requirements along with it. In the 21st Century, the CS major has many other options, such as music and linguistics. I could have breezed through music because I could already play piano, and linguistics would have been fun for me because I was fascinated with computerized speech in video games, the Speak & Spell, and the Radio Shack TRS-80 Voice Synthesizer. Unfortunately, I had to bumble through the statistics major to get my CS degree, but I got it. Now I am alive and well as a computer telephony developer and voicemail provider.
Don't let this or anything get you down. In the end, you'll be the last one standing.
I think your bf was jealous and insecure abt you taking his precious subject, because there can only be one or something
What you said about the other people in the cs program really made me feel ashamed of myself. Tbh I don’t know how I would come off if you met me while taking that class. I feel like I’d probably come up to you thinking I was helping only to come off looking like a total creep. Honestly looking like a creep is my biggest nightmare. My whole life has been built around trying to gain attention for myself that I actually deserve. But sometimes in trying to get this attention I end up looking like a show off.
Your story made me sad, most if all because it was describing the community that I grew up in. I went to a high school that heavily emphasized STEM subjects. It was a well known fact that we liked to be exclusive, that we built our self worth around our grades. I guess when I heard people complain about this, I always dismissed their criticism as just being (as hurtful and damming to my character as this is to admit in writing) “sore losers”.
Listening to you was a good reminder that that is usually not the case. I can tell from hearing you talk that you took this class very seriously. I can tell you put as much effort as you possibly could into it. How could I not relate to failing a test I thought I had prepared for? I as a an NPRE major at the same university have felt that countless times. I too can remember so many homework assignments and tests where I felt there was no one I could turn to for help. What makes me feel so sad about your story is hearing your ex boyfriend perpetuate the horrible lie that “some people just aren’t meant to do certain things”. All throught your story I saw so many instances where I felt that if someone had believed in you you could’ve done just as well as any of the people who we’re putting you down.
Sorry in advance for the rant, and sorry in advance for any condescension I sprinkled in by accident. As much as I try to divorce arrogance from my personal character, i fear it will always find a way to reappear.
girl you don't even understand how much i relate to you in this video rn. i am thinking about switching to cs + advertising rn and i get so intimidated by the guys bc they have literally been doing this since they were 12. i took a csp class in hs my sophomore year and i remember semi liking it when i understood what was happening. other than that i am really interested in advertising and public relations. currently i am in LAS and i might start making the switch next year. is there any way i can contact you to ask you some questions about the major and what you plan on doing in the future?
yes!! sorry i didn't see this but you can dm me on instagram anytime if you have questions @kellyktang :)
College memories will soon fade and you will move on to your next step. I think you are ready. Best years are coming. How exciting, you ain't seen nothing yet.
STEM majors have such a high skill cap to enter but once you pass through that barrier of stupid things become doable.
I hate hearing people say girls don’t learn stem well
They're insecure, so they have to bring someone down and most of the time it's minorities they will target.
The main problem with intro programming classes is that they don't teach you how to use a debugger.
If you know how to use a debugger you can teach yourself much faster. You can go through your logic one step at a time and figure out why it does not work properly...
I'm in my first programming course for CS and to tell you the truth it's stressing me out rn 🤦🏾♂
I'm doing a CS minor at UIUC rn, taking CS 225. It sucks to hear that there were so many guys like that in CS 125.
I think maybe part of the issue might have been that you took it in the fall, when basically ALL incoming CS majors take it, which meant that population was much more likely to have been coding for years beforehand and had the ability to be haughty to others less experienced. The spring semester has a much greater diversity of majors, so the spring semester was great because many people were new to programming like me, so it was kind of like we were all in the same boat. In my experience, though, I never had a single unhelpful TA or CA, but maybe that's just my luck.
Other than the subset of CS majors that are condescending, I would say the biggest barrier to CS classes at UIUC is just the sheer amount of time they require. I did well in CS 125 with few issues, but that's because I had few other commitments. I couldn't IMAGINE taking it with all the other obligations you listed. It's just the choice to make. Do you want to do well in classes like CS that require so much time, or do you want to use that time to be successful in other things? And you have to be able to make that choice knowing that you will meet other students that somehow manage to do both and just accept that you are doing the best you can possibly do.
And Geoff is by far one of my favorite teachers at UIUC so far!
ooh i didn’t know the class looks so different in the spring 😯 if only i had decided to minor earlier lol, but i’m glad you’re having a more positive experience! and yeah like you said, it ultimately comes down to your priorities and i just didn’t have the time or patience for programming but that’s okay :)
I’m in my first semester studying in Belgium and I’m also studying computer science and it’s too much burden already : My subject are : problem solving , web development (html,CSS,JavaScript) , programming fundamentals, HDOS (linux), E-bussiness , Cybersecurity fundamentals and databases . Too much Course in first semester
I saw on the UIUC website that if you do a CS minor with any undergraduate degree you’re guaranteed admission to the CS Masters with a 3.2 gpa of better. Is this easy to do or difficult? I plan to do a double major of Cognitive Psychology and Chemical & Biomorlcular engineering. Is doing a CS minor difficult and is it possible to achieve a 3.2 gpa in CS courses?
Love your video! So you are saying it’s actually relatively easy to minor in CS? I’m asking cos everyone is saying there is no way to get into CS if you are not direct-admit to CS.
if you mean to get accepted into the minor, there is no barrier to entry besides getting a form signed! if you mean actually passing all the classes, i obv could not hahahhah
i needed this :'(
Kelly, I keep telling my 13 year old daughter she needs to watch your videos. Her world is TikTok unfortunately, but I think I'm going to start assigning some of your videos to her as they are very relevant to some future planning she needs to do. Anyway, it wasn't until I came across your videos that I learned that one could get a BS in advertising, and from UIUC which is our state school. I always assumed that if my daughter wanted a career in business sales (which she does), one would get a marketing degree. I'm assuming you possibly went back and forth on this? Curious what led you to choose the BS in advertising. Thank you!
hi wayne! when I chose advertising, I actually didn't consider marketing since I was more interested in media & art back then - but if I could go back, I probably would choose marketing to gain those business skills that are more applicable after college. good luck and thank you for supporting!! 😊
@@kellyktang Interesting. So, as I see it, one of the hottest careers out there is that of digital advertising. Someone that knows how to place and run ads Google/Facebook/Instagram, ect. My thinking is combining the B.S Advertising with something like the Google Analytics/Search/Display/Video certification would be a pretty solid career setup, and would easily provide a way to start a consulting business. Checking if type of thing is discussed or talked about within the Advertising department in the College of Media at UIUC?
@@WayneChapin yea all those are things you'll learn in detail in your advertising classes! getting the free Google certifications are sometimes even required or just a good idea to have when applying for internships and jobs
i am inspired ty
oh god not me wanting to major in cs & advertising and coming across this video
lmaooo do it!! i really wanted to do try that program instead of minoring but it didn't come out until my junior year
when prairielearn hits you with them red marks :(
pain
Honestly, programming is a completely way of thinking that you need your brain to get used to. I took a little bit of html, css and javascript when I was 13 (mandatory school curriculum and I know those aren't programming languages) and I failed while the rest of my class scored As. When I was 17, I tried again, but it didn't work out, I couldn't understand what was going on. I tried it again when I was 19 and it finally clicked. So yeah, I guess you shouldn't be so harsh on urself for not getting programming, its just a different way of thinking that you need to get used to. With time, you probably will be able to get good at it. XDDDD
also, ur bf was being a dick for saying that ur questions were dumb. there are no dumb questions anywhere and any place. just ask away and after you get your questions answered, you can learn from them
Watch at 0.75x. For a second I thought the video was at 1.5x 😂
yeah its damn fast
what is it like to live in champaign il
You made a good decision. Even I think Im good at CS and got good grades “on campus”. I still got a big blow on job hunting. In the modern market of cs They give you coding questions that’s harder than ANYTHING you have done in school. You just have to grind Leetcode like a no-life nerd. I love CS a lot before and right now I just think majoring in CS is the worst decision I’ve ever made.
The small to medium sized companies don't all use Leetcode.
I dropped out of U of I's CS program and got myself a Creative Writing degree instead. My killer was all the discrete math classes though they way they taught programming didn't work for me either. Especially since [BaCk iN mY dAy] U of I only wanted to teach desktop programming skills and I wanted to be a web developer.
The way U of I teaches, especially CS, is utter crap. The people who succeed are generally the people who would have succeeded anyway. Shit was way better at Parkland, not gonna lie. U of I (the organization) just doesn't seem all that invested in teaching skills. Some teachers do, but they're usually the "visiting" professors who don't make a living wage.
Now I've been in tech for 12+ years post-graduation. No career path closes for you because you don't get a minor or even a major. Shit, not a single one of the tech companies that I've worked for even cared about my degrees. And it's not like I'm a programming genius - I know enough to kinda get by right now.
The key is to find the engineering adjacent jobs (Support, Marketing, UX, Sales, Customer Success, Product Design, Product Management, QA, Project Management, Program Management [etc etc etc]) and dip your toes into engineering when you want to. You'll be surprised at how much better you do by having a well-rounded skillset that includes Communication, Writing, and Working Well with Others than if you just went hard-core in Engineering. :|
Also, your exboyfriend sounds like a dick. That's no way to treat anyone, like, ever. What the actual f*ck? Also also, why ARE men?
are you a women?
The one thing I dislike about the whole GPA system is that, it ends up being less about getting educated and more about chasing points. As such, it is safer to do something you already know just to get a high GPA than to learn something new and get a lower GPA. Kind of messed up. Paying an arm and a leg just to "learn" something that you are already good at while neglecting a new skill because it could hurt your GPA. At this point, it is better to educate yourself outside of school (which is free or many times cheaper) and go to school NOT to educate yourself but to get that paper ASAP and get out of there. It is basically a paper mill at this point in time.
elif kelly == charming
print( "Kelly loves Kelloggs")
else:
print(Thats NOT OK")
Sounds like it's time to pickup some Adafruit projects and leave the egocentric mega-classes for a while.
It makes me upset how inaccessible CS can seem to people who aren’t STEM, or haven’t been doing it since middle school, or don’t have a more aggressive personality. Like you said, it’s a language, and CS can be so creative and interesting and fun, for any field. Anyone should feel like they belong to that, no matter who they are or how late to the game they are. The CS dude bros are god awful, there’s too much prestige and gate keeping around it, and it’s so hostile towards women which is ridiculous being that CS was originally a women-pioneered field.
I think most STEM Major have a certain bias. like literature student wont gonna pass heavy math in univ..
And now there is GPT and Copilot, and all these other free online resources to carry CS students throughout their programs
It doesn't really work that way. It helps to an extent, but humans still need to troubleshoot the code cause the AI still makes mistakes or doesn't fully understand the context.
Why are you talking in 1.25x?
hi! really nice video, you are an intersting person( i suck in english sorry :) )
i come from italy and i started a bachelor in engineering and computer science and i really feel like you, people are not collaborative(?) , all people think to be the smasterst guy in the word, founding the new important buisness all arounf the word and if you wanna talk about something outide tecnolgy field a lot of us they totally don t know what to talk about.
i worked in a software indutry and it s disgusting.(at least in italy)
i really dont like the envoiroment, all focused on language,tecnologies,and ill not go ahead in this field, even if im able tocoding and ihave an engineering mindset.
istarted to study statistic , if you are able to understand it is really funny, u can talkabout eveything, from biologi to ecnomics,you don t study only algoritm and prgramming language(exept math obv).
everthing u can learn online now day and i think is better study also other subject like finance,art,science (that in computer science are forgotten).
Cya from italy ,florence :)
hope the best!
5:00 as a future cs major going to uiuc i swear to never date a cs major.
I'm not in UIUC but when I took first programming class it was in C++ language. (It's one of the more difficult language to start off with) The class went from 38 people to 6-7 people at the end of the semester. It started out with like 4-5 girls and only girl one made it. I'm asian but I would practice and study the material 3-6 hours a day except on weekends because I did 12 hour shifts at a warehouse. Some people are lucky and some people just need to put in effort. You could've done it if you were discipline and studious. I never went out while studying except for the end of the year for new years.
She ended up getting an A in her first CS class and graduating with her major and a different minor, along with all her multiple obligations. I think it’s really impressive what she was able to accomplish. I think she was disciplined and studious but was also aware of what she was willing to give up to maintain other priorities.
toxic boyfriend
Glad your boyfriend is now an ex. That’s so unfortunate that the person who was supposed to support you the most didn’t help. If it makes you feel better about women in cs, a lot of the developers at my IT company are women.
I personally love computer science and happened to stumble upon your video because I really wanted to go to U of I for graduate school for computer science but it’s not for everyone, and that doesn’t mean you’re dumb or don’t work hard
Kelly, thanks for sharing. You definitely do not have an IQ problem. The UCIC educational system failed you. It failed to provide you with the type of education that you were seeking. Your goal was to learn programming skills, something outside your major and comfort zone, that would be helpful to your future career. UCIC should have made it possible for you to achieve that. Isn't the core mission of all universities to help their students achieve those basic educational goals? However, UCIC has sadly failed in its educational mission. To me, it seems that the UCIC's teaching methodology does not make room for people to enter CS from ground level. UCIC should have an intro CS course for people with zero CS knowledge, like students majoring in humanities, and a separate intro CS course for those with all the Math prerequisites and some programming knowledge, like those hardcore CS majors who showed zero empathy for their less knowledgeable peers. Why would any educational organization fail to recognize that there are students with varying degrees of preparation for the CS major/minor programs? Why would an educational system throw all white belts, yellow belts and other more advanced belts into the same entry level course, and then teach it at the level that only the advanced belts can perform well enough to get top grades? UCIC's CS 125 as described is not meant for white belts who can only expect to be crushed or forced to drop the course. I am sure UCIC would agree that throwing people who have never learned to thread water or swim into the pool, and then telling them to do some demanding aquatic tasks without proper instruction or adequate support would be considered cruel and totally ridiculous, and yet that's exactly what they have done to students like yourself. Schools like UCIC should offer the option of a programming minor for humanities students who don't need all the heavy CS theory, but just wish to learn programming skills for their careers in the 21st century. I hope that you can get over this crappy and unnecessarily traumatic experience, and try again to learn programming skills online or elsewhere, outside UCIC. You can do it!
you speak damn fast
Don't worry. Most CS grads will get replaced by AI unless they're top 10%.
That's honestly not true if you've played with the most recent AI models. AI won't replace CS. There will be more complex positions created to work with AI.
CS is just not for anyone, and I bet your boyfriend is extremely busy as a CS senior.
If you're just not wise logically, it's hard to teach you how to wire from the question to the solution.
Btw, based on your speed of speaking, I bet you're smart in other ways and I believe you still outsmart a great many in other ways.
nahhh he cheated his way thru college LOL but thank you! ☺️
You missed the point. Previous experience is incredibly unfair when attempting to meet expectations. Expectations are set by students that already understand what others have never considered. It presents false appearances of intelligence or limitations. Similar in math - class of 1980.
Maybe you suck at communicating, but you just called her not wise logically.
@@kellyktangI met men who cheated in my classes too! And then bragged about their grades.
🧠 🧠 🧠
Ps: ur cute
Horrible place to comment this especially in a video where she describes how creepy guys helped drive her away from the field
why're you talking so quick
CS is easy
That's subjective to individuals.
I almost felt like I was watching your video at 2X speed. Talking speed is way too high.
Computer Science is not for everyone...just cheers and move on. Same like Shopping or Parties is not for everyone...just cheers and move on.
People really shitting themselves crying over CS
Simply girls are good at talking but not for coding.
nooooooo.. you shouldnt say that
Brooo 😂
Generalizing a whole group of people to make yourself feel better. How so very logical 🙄
import re
msg = transcribe(this_video)
print(len(re.findall(r'\bcry\b', msg)))