As someone has wisely said - "Destiny knocking at the door" may well be a misattribution! My books have let me down ;) but in all seriousness, you must always fact check me. I do these videos because I want to get other people 'into' classical music --- I want to share that passion! But sometimes I get details wrong - hopefully not critical details, but small things like that. I am not a post doctoral expert! Just a music lover who wants to share - and I hope you enjoy and learn something!!
I definitely share your desire to get people into classical music. It's one of those things like Shakespeare, or Dickens, that has been undermined by the perceived stereotype of upper class stuffy Brits. I used to think this way. Classical music was just for old posh people. But then I heard the Jurassic Park theme and loved what I heard. I later on bought the LOTR soundtracks, and I was listening to a form of classical music without even really knowing it. Once I realised that, I decided to buy a compilation of music to try it out. And now I own the complete works of Mozart and Beethoven, and I love opera. Film music is the gateway drug for classical.
OK dude, you missed it. The unifying element between *all four movements* is a simple rhythmic pattern. Dit-dit-dit-da, or "V" in Morse code (something the BBC made a big deal of -- "V" for victory, and victory of the Allies who were the real heirs of the Western tradition, even the German parts.) Anyway, the tension in almost every phrase of this piece is three quick elements, and the release comes in the form of a single element. Sometimes these phrases stack upon each other, where three sub-phrases (consisting of three shorts and a long) resolve in a single long element. It's almost fractal in its structure. Of course Beethoven doesn't absolutely hold himself to this pattern, he plays with it as needed to make the piece sound good. The third symphony uses Morse "C" (da, dit-da, dit) as a "striding" motif rather than the "knocking" motif, and the seventh uses Morse "X" (Da, dit-dit-da), although again Beethoven doesn't let a pattern get in the way of a piece sounding good.
Jay The intense working and development of motifs is something that is very common in Haydn and something Beethoven learnt from him. It’s a very different way of working from Mozart, and one of the big differences you can listen for when listening to Haydn/Beethoven, and Mozart.
I never thought that I could love my favourite symphony of all time any more than I do now...I was wrong! I love this quick guide so much, so well analyzed! I would definitely share with anyone who wants to learn more about this amazing work!
The first movement is one of those iconic pieces of music that has transcended its genre. Nearly everyone knows the first four notes. It is a truly fantastic piece of music. And the symphony just gets better from there.
John Salter I get your point, but I actually think most people DON’T know correctly the opening motif. Most people if asked to sing, or tap out the famous ‘Fate’ knocking at the door opening rhythm, tap out a triplet followed by a minim: ‘dur-dur-dur-Duuuuur’ (ie one bar in 3/4 time). In fact, it begins on an upbeat and therefore actually a silence: ‘Rest-dur-dur-dur-Duuuuur’ (correctly two bars of 2/4 time). Just saying!
@@elaineblackhurst1509 I think you'll find that most people, myself included, have no idea what you're talking about, and are unable to actually tell the difference.
@@elaineblackhurst1509 You're welcome 🙂 I'm not even certain what the difference is. If it starts with a rest. How can you tell that rest is not included?
@@JRCSalter I’ve had several goes at trying to explain this again in words, and deleted them all - it’s almost impossible! The difference is subtle but hugely significant; I suggest you show this discussion to someone who understands musical notation, then ask them to explain it to you. The most important thing is that Beethoven wrote it in 2 beats per bar - beginning on an upbeat. The point I was making that non-musicians asked to tap out the famous rhythm turn it into 3 beats per bar, beginning on a downbeat, turning the quavers into triplets - hence my point that in fact, they do not know the motif at all. In short, it’s about getting the pulse in the right place. If you revisit my original reply and look at the musical image at the top of the video, the clouds may part. My point remains, that perhaps this simplest, and most famous and iconic motif in the whole of music, is actually, one that is listened to and repeated, the most carelessly and inaccurately.
The transition from the powerful middle of the finale into bringing back the theme from the 3rd movement is one of the most brilliant moments in all of music.
Great video! Such a shame that, even though everyone knows this piece, most people basically only know the exposition of the first movement and think all the genious is in creating it all out of that one motif that is really striking while the genious really is in the transformation. I don't think I'll ever forget hearing Riccardo Chailly conducting this piece a year ago, live, you could just feel the tension and excitement in the air during the last two movements, absolutely exhilarating.
Interesting note: Beethoven finishes the 9th with a wild accelerando like the 5th. It's the real climax of the piece, but the only thing people really remember -- as if it's the most exciting and forceful thing ever -- is the simple figure that precedes it. (The four notes in the 5th, and the 15 notes in the 9th.) Here's the thing -- in each of those cases, the simple figure is something you can jump straight into, from a silent start. The accelerando absolutely has more of an impact, but it is something people have to be emotionally prepared for, it has to be worked up to, you can't just jump straight in. Do you have a video on, "How to build a crescendo"? You could include those accelerandos, and the climax of Mercury (although that kinda comes out of nowhere, you have that deceptively simple motif that gets passed around the orchestra before it launches you into the stratosphere.)
This is the very first classical piece that I liked. I think I heard it first when I was like 8 or 9, in full. My dad bought me the album. That got me hooked. Every time I listen to this it’s like going back in time. I’m 50 now and I still love it. I always find something new in it. This analysis really reinvigorates this symphony for me. Thank you!
The first partial piece I remember really liking was Wagner’s Ring Cycle which was featured in my favorite Bugs Bunny cartoon. They also featured Barber of Seville and Hungarian Rhapsody. Those are why I was drawn to the 5th. So my love of classical is because of Beethoven and Bugs Bunny. Go figure.
I was about to play Beethoven’s 5th on the day the first confirmed coronavirus case was on campus and my university was closed. I was walking from the parking lot with my suit and clarinet in hand when suddenly I noticed a peculiarly large amount of students heading back towards the lot, phones in hand. Then I was told the news. Thank you for your video! Hopefully will get to perform in a month or a year or two. I feel as if I am in a perpetual state of being at the end of the third movement and yearn for the arrival of the fourth.
Carlos Kleiber’s recording for DG is also a must hear, truly astonishing understanding of the music and weight of the instruments especially in the first and fourth movements
Great video on this iconic masterpiece! A dense and intense run through, as this symphony demands. A quick note: the motif of the opening appears, slightly changed, in all the other movements, also hidden in the second at the end of the "afterthought" of the first theme and in the second theme of the finale, transformed into a bright and positive element. Also, I would mention Kleiber and Gardiner as great recordings in addition to your recommandations, very different but incredible!
Inside the Score, my opinion of the first movement is not "Destiny knocking at the door". (Plz reply and love if you like this) It is more like a doorbell. The notes I heard in the doorbell "Ding Dong" for my opinion is likely G then E- flat. When u say * "Destiny knocking at the door" *, it more like a drum instead of a symphony. You know that I am bad at critics I love your guides. Someone of the parts I heard sounds familiar. The first movement is usually secretly based on Mozart' Sonata for Two Piano in D but in the minor mood. 1:03 The second movement is beautiful and one of the parts chuckle me is this part,4:32. It sounds like La Folia. The third movement is on Mannheim rocket in a hint of the last movement of Mozart's 40th Symphony. Listen to this 4:58 At last but not least, this is not something nor other works. It is the coda of the last movement. This part is humorous for my opinion. I keep saying C G C G C C C C C C C C C!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Haha. Nice guide. I hope you like this comment.
Still waiting for your thoughts on Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto No.2 in C Minor, Op 18 And Beethoven 7th Symphony (especially mov. II on how Beethoven who's not a great on melody can turn a simple melody into a masterpiece) Anyway, great video! Love it!
I always compare this symphony with a war: First movement is when a father has to leave his family to go to the war. Second movement is the sadness that feels the father when he remembers his family Third movement is the Battle field whith the father about to lose his Life And the heroic fourth movement is the victory and returning home with his family
Thank you for the awesome content! I Highly recommend John Elliot Gardiner's version of this piece with original instruments and arguably original tempos, it will send chills down your spine!
this was Beethoven in hell with his thoughts. he knew he was in/ going into full swing deafness. but that last c major mvt is beyond us. he took the most darkest thing of going deaf as a musician and brought it to the most joyous of thought in this. showing even in the darkness there is light and hope!
I know it may be a controversial choice, but nothing matches Fritz Reiner and the Chicago Symphony on RCA Living Stereo. This is the very recording that I listened to as a teenager and inspired my life-long love of Beethoven and classical music. They nailed it!
Franz Liszt transcribed to the piano all of Beethoven’s symphonies. I totally suggest listening to them. Preferably Konstantin Scherbakov’s performances
I have a probably dumb question - The first movement of this symphony is written in C-minor - but it seems to me it is often played in C#-minor. Is there any reason for that half-step shift?
I have never heard it in C# minor, but it probably has to do with tuning. If you tune your A to 465 Hertz instead of the more standard 440, it is almost a half tone higher. Which recordings have you heard?
Yep, like in the 2nd subject of the 1sr movement the horn is still in Eb and it doesn't look right when compared to the concert pitch stuff within the same clip of music
There may be few obscure pieces - But it is the first piece with trombones in the "symphonic repertoire", which is what I said :) also the number of trombones...!
@@sveinungnygaard1505 Swedish composer Joachim Nicolas Eggert used trombones in his Eb major symphony in 1807, 1 year before Beethoven's 5th was finished.
This music is so powerful and immersive, particularly this recording by Karajan: th-cam.com/video/OV6Lp7cnX7s/w-d-xo.html That every single time I listen to it, my nose starts bleeding before the end of the first movement... Seriously, no joke!
As someone has wisely said - "Destiny knocking at the door" may well be a misattribution! My books have let me down ;) but in all seriousness, you must always fact check me. I do these videos because I want to get other people 'into' classical music --- I want to share that passion! But sometimes I get details wrong - hopefully not critical details, but small things like that. I am not a post doctoral expert! Just a music lover who wants to share - and I hope you enjoy and learn something!!
nevertheless..., your point of view is always relevant!
I definitely share your desire to get people into classical music. It's one of those things like Shakespeare, or Dickens, that has been undermined by the perceived stereotype of upper class stuffy Brits. I used to think this way. Classical music was just for old posh people. But then I heard the Jurassic Park theme and loved what I heard. I later on bought the LOTR soundtracks, and I was listening to a form of classical music without even really knowing it. Once I realised that, I decided to buy a compilation of music to try it out.
And now I own the complete works of Mozart and Beethoven, and I love opera.
Film music is the gateway drug for classical.
OK dude, you missed it. The unifying element between *all four movements* is a simple rhythmic pattern. Dit-dit-dit-da, or "V" in Morse code (something the BBC made a big deal of -- "V" for victory, and victory of the Allies who were the real heirs of the Western tradition, even the German parts.)
Anyway, the tension in almost every phrase of this piece is three quick elements, and the release comes in the form of a single element. Sometimes these phrases stack upon each other, where three sub-phrases (consisting of three shorts and a long) resolve in a single long element. It's almost fractal in its structure.
Of course Beethoven doesn't absolutely hold himself to this pattern, he plays with it as needed to make the piece sound good.
The third symphony uses Morse "C" (da, dit-da, dit) as a "striding" motif rather than the "knocking" motif, and the seventh uses Morse "X" (Da, dit-dit-da), although again Beethoven doesn't let a pattern get in the way of a piece sounding good.
That could be a misattribution, but I do have an LP of the Fifth where It's quoted, and presumably many of us have seen it written in good resources.
Beethoven: *looks at the 4 note motif*
Beethoven: How much can I milk this?
Enough to create a symphony out of it.
Jay
The intense working and development of motifs is something that is very common in Haydn and something Beethoven learnt from him.
It’s a very different way of working from Mozart, and one of the big differences you can listen for when listening to Haydn/Beethoven, and Mozart.
Brilliently.
I like how you so passionately explains something, it's really invigorating
Tru
Thanks sir for your guidance to the classical music.
You’re welcome
I never thought that I could love my favourite symphony of all time any more than I do now...I was wrong! I love this quick guide so much, so well analyzed! I would definitely share with anyone who wants to learn more about this amazing work!
The first movement is one of those iconic pieces of music that has transcended its genre. Nearly everyone knows the first four notes. It is a truly fantastic piece of music. And the symphony just gets better from there.
John Salter
I get your point, but I actually think most people DON’T know correctly the opening motif.
Most people if asked to sing, or tap out the famous ‘Fate’ knocking at the door opening rhythm, tap out a triplet followed by a minim:
‘dur-dur-dur-Duuuuur’ (ie one bar in 3/4 time).
In fact, it begins on an upbeat and therefore actually a silence:
‘Rest-dur-dur-dur-Duuuuur’ (correctly two bars of 2/4 time).
Just saying!
@@elaineblackhurst1509 I think you'll find that most people, myself included, have no idea what you're talking about, and are unable to actually tell the difference.
@@JRCSalter
You’ve just confirmed the point I made - thank you.
@@elaineblackhurst1509 You're welcome 🙂
I'm not even certain what the difference is. If it starts with a rest. How can you tell that rest is not included?
@@JRCSalter
I’ve had several goes at trying to explain this again in words, and deleted them all - it’s almost impossible!
The difference is subtle but hugely significant; I suggest you show this discussion to someone who understands musical notation, then ask them to explain it to you.
The most important thing is that Beethoven wrote it in 2 beats per bar - beginning on an upbeat.
The point I was making that non-musicians asked to tap out the famous rhythm turn it into 3 beats per bar, beginning on a downbeat, turning the quavers into triplets - hence my point that in fact, they do not know the motif at all.
In short, it’s about getting the pulse in the right place.
If you revisit my original reply and look at the musical image at the top of the video, the clouds may part.
My point remains, that perhaps this simplest, and most famous and iconic motif in the whole of music, is actually, one that is listened to and repeated, the most carelessly and inaccurately.
i always think this is one of those overplayed pieces i am sick of until i hear it and am completely amazed all over again!
The transition from the powerful middle of the finale into bringing back the theme from the 3rd movement is one of the most brilliant moments in all of music.
Great video! Such a shame that, even though everyone knows this piece, most people basically only know the exposition of the first movement and think all the genious is in creating it all out of that one motif that is really striking while the genious really is in the transformation. I don't think I'll ever forget hearing Riccardo Chailly conducting this piece a year ago, live, you could just feel the tension and excitement in the air during the last two movements, absolutely exhilarating.
I agree
The transition from the 3rd to the 4th movement is some of the most uplifting music I've ever heard. I was floored the first time i heard it
This is one of the bestest Musical explanations I have ever Seen
I love this! 😍 Forever one of the best symphonies. Thank you for this small analysis!
You’re welcome
@@sammywestenberger9303 I'm sorry, but who are you? Why did you reply that? 😅
It’s Not Alright
@@sammywestenberger9303 Errrm, do you have anything to do with Inside the Score or is this a troll?
Thank you from Australia. You are doing great things to let more people know about great music. Congrats.
Interesting note: Beethoven finishes the 9th with a wild accelerando like the 5th. It's the real climax of the piece, but the only thing people really remember -- as if it's the most exciting and forceful thing ever -- is the simple figure that precedes it. (The four notes in the 5th, and the 15 notes in the 9th.)
Here's the thing -- in each of those cases, the simple figure is something you can jump straight into, from a silent start. The accelerando absolutely has more of an impact, but it is something people have to be emotionally prepared for, it has to be worked up to, you can't just jump straight in.
Do you have a video on, "How to build a crescendo"? You could include those accelerandos, and the climax of Mercury (although that kinda comes out of nowhere, you have that deceptively simple motif that gets passed around the orchestra before it launches you into the stratosphere.)
This is the very first classical piece that I liked. I think I heard it first when I was like 8 or 9, in full. My dad bought me the album. That got me hooked. Every time I listen to this it’s like going back in time. I’m 50 now and I still love it. I always find something new in it. This analysis really reinvigorates this symphony for me. Thank you!
The first partial piece I remember really liking was Wagner’s Ring Cycle which was featured in my favorite Bugs Bunny cartoon. They also featured Barber of Seville and Hungarian Rhapsody. Those are why I was drawn to the 5th. So my love of classical is because of Beethoven and Bugs Bunny. Go figure.
I was about to play Beethoven’s 5th on the day the first confirmed coronavirus case was on campus and my university was closed. I was walking from the parking lot with my suit and clarinet in hand when suddenly I noticed a peculiarly large amount of students heading back towards the lot, phones in hand. Then I was told the news. Thank you for your video! Hopefully will get to perform in a month or a year or two. I feel as if I am in a perpetual state of being at the end of the third movement and yearn for the arrival of the fourth.
That's a great metaphor!
Carlos Kleiber’s recording for DG is also a must hear, truly astonishing understanding of the music and weight of the instruments especially in the first and fourth movements
I generally think Karajan should be the Standard Beethoven Symphony Recording, but Kleiber's 5th really stands above the rest.
Great video on this iconic masterpiece! A dense and intense run through, as this symphony demands.
A quick note: the motif of the opening appears, slightly changed, in all the other movements, also hidden in the second at the end of the "afterthought" of the first theme and in the second theme of the finale, transformed into a bright and positive element.
Also, I would mention Kleiber and Gardiner as great recordings in addition to your recommandations, very different but incredible!
Yes, I've been waiting for a new episode of quick guides!
I always loved the Fifth but I didn't know why. Now I know. Kudos for the brilliant video.
Fantastic explanation. I love this music. Now I understand it.
BTW, I would highly recommend the Sports Cast breakdown of the 1st movement by the hilarious Peter Shickele (aka PDQ Bach).
Can you pleaseeeee do a Discovering Classical Music Podcast for Mahler's 3rd
I’ve played a couple of the movements of this in my school orchestra
I love these quick guides! do you take requests? Bach Orchestral Suite 2 perhaps? 😬
Inside the Score, my opinion of the first movement is not "Destiny knocking at the door". (Plz reply and love if you like this)
It is more like a doorbell. The notes I heard in the doorbell "Ding Dong" for my opinion is likely G then E- flat.
When u say * "Destiny knocking at the door" *, it more like a drum instead of a symphony.
You know that I am bad at critics I love your guides. Someone of the parts I heard sounds familiar.
The first movement is usually secretly based on Mozart' Sonata for Two Piano in D but in the minor mood.
1:03
The second movement is beautiful and one of the parts chuckle me is this part,4:32. It sounds like La Folia.
The third movement is on Mannheim rocket in a hint of the last movement of Mozart's 40th Symphony. Listen to this
4:58
At last but not least, this is not something nor other works. It is the coda of the last movement. This part is humorous for my opinion. I keep saying C G C G C C C C C C C C
C!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Haha.
Nice guide.
I hope you like this comment.
Still waiting for your thoughts on Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto No.2 in C Minor, Op 18
And Beethoven 7th Symphony (especially mov. II on how Beethoven who's not a great on melody can turn a simple melody into a masterpiece)
Anyway, great video! Love it!
I am so touched
what an excellent series!!!
I always compare this symphony with a war:
First movement is when a father has to leave his family to go to the war.
Second movement is the sadness that feels the father when he remembers his family
Third movement is the Battle field whith the father about to lose his Life
And the heroic fourth movement is the victory and returning home with his family
Thank you for the awesome content! I Highly recommend John Elliot Gardiner's version of this piece with original instruments and arguably original tempos, it will send chills down your spine!
this was Beethoven in hell with his thoughts. he knew he was in/ going into full swing deafness. but that last c major mvt is beyond us. he took the most darkest thing of going deaf as a musician and brought it to the most joyous of thought in this. showing even in the darkness there is light and hope!
Thank you sooooo much for the explanation 😊👍👍
I've been waiting for this
How about a video on Mozart's Requiem?
0:00 *Everybody has joined the chat*
Gotta say that you missed on the recommendations "Furtwangler" should never be left out.
I know it may be a controversial choice, but nothing matches Fritz Reiner and the Chicago Symphony on RCA Living Stereo. This is the very recording that I listened to as a teenager and inspired my life-long love of Beethoven and classical music. They nailed it!
Can't wait for A Chopin video
Finally! Thank you
I can’t wait for the pastorale analysis
New subscriber!
I want Bruckner symphonies analysis. Thank you!
thanks for the very clear explanation. may I know please which orchestra playing, very nice recording!
No mention of that gorgeous piccolo solo from the 4th movement?
5:05 need to mention that Beethoven is quoting the last movement’s opening notes of Mozart symphony no. 40.
Com clareza. Pontual, didático. Gostei muito.
I have no idea what your saying but I like it
thank you ☕
Wait.. there is more than just the first 4 notes?
Beethoven: * slaps roof of symphony * This bad boy can fit so many motifs in it
Thoughts on Benjamin Zander's fast pace interpretation?
I would also reccomend anyone Carlos Kleiber version of this symphony. It is glorious
This was cool video
Franz Liszt transcribed to the piano all of Beethoven’s symphonies. I totally suggest listening to them. Preferably Konstantin Scherbakov’s performances
THANK YOU
YOU’RE WELCOME
what does it mean when a subject is "more lyrical"?
I like it
Can you make these for other symphonies? (Not Beethoven? Maybe a Mahler or Shostakovich?)
"So, which ending do you want to use for this symphony?"
Beethoven: *JA.*
i really applicate your channel
Well done, thank you very much but what do you think about Wim Winters' opinion about the tempo of the symphony?
He probably hasn't heard of it. If he has, he probably dislikes it as it is very different from his recommended recordings.
can you also talk about other composers. ravel for example
I have a probably dumb question - The first movement of this symphony is written in C-minor - but it seems to me it is often played in C#-minor. Is there any reason for that half-step shift?
I have never heard it in C# minor, but it probably has to do with tuning. If you tune your A to 465 Hertz instead of the more standard 440, it is almost a half tone higher. Which recordings have you heard?
Should really show the sheet music examples in transposed form. Otherwise people may get confused why it goes from c to Eb to F within 10 bars ;)
Yep, like in the 2nd subject of the 1sr movement the horn is still in Eb and it doesn't look right when compared to the concert pitch stuff within the same clip of music
Could you do a video On Ennio Morricone. I’m interested how you would analyse his music or how you would describe him
👏
Was the 5th written after he lost his hearing?
He had started to lose his hearing but he wasn’t fully deaf until a little while after.
I feel like I alaways knew this, only not in words,
For anyone looking for an amazing recording, Please check Teodor Currentzis’ recording with MusicAeterna
Great video, horrible recommendations (except Barenboim's recording).
Beethoven's 5th was not the first symphony featuring trombone. It's a common misconception.
What was the first?
There may be few obscure pieces - But it is the first piece with trombones in the "symphonic repertoire", which is what I said :) also the number of trombones...!
Inside the Score Ahh ok
@@sveinungnygaard1505 Swedish composer Joachim Nicolas Eggert used trombones in his Eb major symphony in 1807, 1 year before Beethoven's 5th was finished.
@@InsidetheScore The Eggert symphony uses 3 trombones in all of its movements!
Merci beaucoup. An Al Gore Rhythm Comment.
I'm so dumb to understand music, I'm unable to get even the basic stuff right...
You are not alone my friend.
Symphony No. 5 > Symphony No. 9
This music is so powerful and immersive, particularly this recording by Karajan: th-cam.com/video/OV6Lp7cnX7s/w-d-xo.html
That every single time I listen to it, my nose starts bleeding before the end of the first movement...
Seriously, no joke!
Ommmm hahaha ha