Kind of refreshing tbh. Normally I imagine keyboard reviewers to be using some insane set up with alll the craziest parts. However this is a HUGE reminder at the end of the day what mAkes you happy is the best choice ignore the noise from others.
It's a reminder that it's not a black or white situation. Picking what makes you happy or what's best suited for getting something done is a huge bunch of sacrifices either way, except for those rare situations where the universe just aligns. :)
it’s more like the start of a new cycle, since we came from mechanical switches to membrane and then to newer mechanical switches and then newer membrane
@@AidanRampair Rubber domes are still membranes, there is a membrane ontop of the circuit board, the domes are simply a different type of switch to regular membranes, the function is still very much the same, its like saying MX Blue aint mechanical but MX Red is. However not all rubber domes are membrane, some work without a membrane like Topre
I wouldn't say that its a membrane keyboard, it feels more like it's a hybrid, but also not like those garbarge "mecha-mechanical" "mechanical feel" rubber dome keyboards.
Yeh, this feels like a mechanical keyboard except they dont use a spring and different conductor. The setup itself is the same as a mechanical basically. Theres no need for every switch internally to work like an MX-cherry derivative. This could be some nice innovation, especially if they managed to fit this into a cherry-compatible shape.
Dome with slider, not something you see every day. They were popular back in the 90s, but have all but disappeared in favour of MX. They are quite good, especially these. Firstly, they are electro-capacitive, meaning they have quite a long life span on the sensing assembly. Secondly, they are a DWS design, meaning they have the increased tactility of rubber domes and the hard bottom out of traditional 'mechanical' switches. Overall they are an excellent choice.
Honestly, not every keyboard needs to be mechanical, there's definitely some good quality membranes out there, personally use a mech, but I can see the advantages of membrane or electrocapactive
People seem to have no idea that membranes and rubber domes aren't the same thing. Rubber domes are a switch mechanism. Membranes are just a medium for the sensing electronics. You can have rubber domes over a membrane: the typical office keyboard You can have rubber domes over PCB: topre and NIZ for example You can have mechanical switches over membranes: see the Model M And of course mechanical switches over PCB: standard definition of 'mechanical keyboard'
Your video on that Niz board was a big reason I decided to try Topre before building a custom mechanical and I've been using an HHKB Pro Hybrid Type-S for nine months now and love it. I'll still be building a custom or two, but I definitely like electrocapacitive. I will mention though, I remember you trying that FC660C on stream and being surprised that it was louder than the Niz, I think Niz boards come stock with silencing rings that you would have had to specify for the Topre board, so if that video is incoming I would make note of that or try one with silencing rings before comparing. I got the HHKB "Type-S" board which comes with silenced switches by default and it's great.
Just wanted to comment on your most recent videos to say that I received your keycap designs (IFK delight) today and they’re absolutely gorgeous and they feel great to the touch, bummer I couldn’t grab the novelties aswell as they were out of stock but I am more than satisfied with the purchase despite the shipping hurting my wallet real bad, much love, keep making great content !
As others have stated, "thock" came from Topre. And they're less represented, mainly due to their availability and price. Some Topre clones have been around for awhile, but the price is still a bit of barrier for more people to try it. The feel is also fairly polarizing for those people that do spend the extra money to acquire one. For me, I never bought one, but was able to try a few at a meet, and they're simply far too light for me. Their sound is unique, but while you can get close with some MX switches and a couple mods, it's not going to be quite the same without a rubber dome.
You can get domes that are much heavier than most mechanical keyboards if you like, standard weight for topre are 45-55g but you can go much higher with custom domes.
Topre is just the end goal for a good amount of people. Some might say mx switches were never good. Personally, I'm aiming for an alps board. It's going to take me a while to get the alps I really want. .. and alps keycaps
I used rubber dome switches happily for 17 years on my Happy Hacking keyboard... and from what I hear, the Niz switches are even better. If Niz keyboards ran QMK, I'd probably be pretty into them. But instead, I've found I can get a nice feel from switches like Boba U4 and Durock T1. Or the scissor switches on my notebook. Those feel really nice too. I never got the appeal of Cherry-style switches though... the blues, the browns, the linears... meh. They just don't have the right kind of response curve.
I’ve been using Niz keyboards since 2019. Unparalleled sound signature right out of the box. Sounds better than any of my more premium boards and feels more satisfying. It’s also best for gaming with light switches and their 1.8mm activation. I have 3 different Niz keebs, bought one each new year.
Honestly EC switches are massively under represented in modern mech videos, they are really nice and sound fucking good really hope more people make them/ talk about them
I tried a niz board and it broke almost immediately after getting it. Taking it apart was a giant pain (as you probably figured out), they support like no standard layouts, and it didn't feel that good to me.
Similarly my foray into the mech keyboard hobby pretty much ended when I got an HHKB and since then no MX design switch has felt interesting or worthwhile, and I lost any really desire to keep tinkering with a hobby that's overwhelmingly focused on different variations of MX copies. Stuff like keycaps and good stabilisers are still cool, and luckily boards like the Wooting or Apex Pro have genuinely good, worthwhile advancement for the hobby switches (despite Hall Effect switches being a venerable concept), and are still compatible with custom keycaps and you can fiddle with the stabs. With Alps style switches returning we could be entering the point at which the hobby gets genuinely interesting though, with more switch variety and moving away from that old Cherry MX inspired design that has such clear limitations and isn't amazing at any one thing no matter what combo of housing, slider, lube etc.
"Thock" originated as an onomatopoeia to describe capacitive dome switches, and is a more accurate description of those than any mechanical switch. I support this.
I've been using the Niz 87 for the last 5 years. And together with SA profile it's the endgame for me. I did however swap the domes for 55g. Which are the perfect weight and profile..
I used membrane keyboards for years then I read about mechanical keyboards being better for games especially I bought one (red switch) spent a lot of money and discovered that it doesn't do much better than a good membrane keyboard.
I've no idea what type of keyboard it was, but the very heavy and solid IBM keyboard for the first PC's they put out has always felt very natural to me.
@@jugostran Those are the best keyboards, still. The model F mechanism is the best, but the model M isn't far behind. I just got a Mac, though, and wanted a Bluetooth keyboard. I bit the bullet and ordered a K2 with brown switches (I forgot the brand, it's whatever they use). Now I'm nervous I'm gonna hate it, lol. My dad worked at a company with a big warehouse that used all IBM, and so when I was younger (im 42 now), we had an endless stream of IBM keyboards. I almost bought one on eBay, but I really wanted something with Mac keys and Bluetooth. Oh, and illumination so I could use it in the dark. There is a quieter variant of the model M that I used in college, and the brown switches were described as kinda like that one. I kinda feel like someone who used to drive stick and got lazy in old age or something, lulz. But a big part of it was just wanting an actual Mac keyboard, and the unicomp didn't impress me. The keys were ugly, and I don't think the build quality is quite like the originals from what I've read.
@@jugostran I am agonizing over this decision WAY more than I care to admit, haha. I loved using a keyboard that I could defend myself with. 😂 I'd love to hear more about which keyboard you have in particular, and how you interfaced it with a desktop computer (those twinax terminal keyboards aren't exactly compatible with any computer interface lulz)
@@bsadewitz I use the keyboard that shipped with the 3205 Color Display Console terminal. It is a Model F 122 key variant. Also, Unicomp has gotten way better. Their New Model M has Mac keys and is generally really nice.
I bought the niz atom 68 like 2 years ago and honestly I've never wanted anything different since they really are unique and comfy to use, for typing and games
you should consider working with either niz or someone else on making a custom case/plate to make the board less scuffed, and maybe even personalize if even more 😺
i bought a NiZ Plum KB75 bluetooth without keycaps for $60 and i’ll never ever use anything else again. i love the feeling of typing on it YEARS after first purchasing it.
I have been watching your videos, love them. Niz plum is also my daily driver, I have used leopold trope 45g way more expensive, and niz is just different can’t describe it.
Even I own two mechanical keyboards (the brand name one and my custom one) I completely agreed that sometimes the membrane or scissor switch from laptop work more comfortably.
We really need a better name than "mechanical" for keyboards. Technically every keyboard ever made is mechanical. So is your mouse. So is a lighter. So is your fridge.
actually no not every keyboard ever made is mechanical. Anything that has a hal effect sensor, resistive or capacitive switch, optical sensor of any kind, or a touch screen of any variety, is not in fact mechanical. they are electrical, period. there is no physical change or physical bridge to pass current between two pins to activate the key. Mechanical =/= electrical.
@@TheObsesedAnimeFreaks You should really look up the definition of mechanical. Every single keyboard is mechanical. Every single calculator is mechanical. Your monitor is mechanical. The chair you're sitting in is mechanical. EVERYTHING that isn't handmade is mechanical. It's an awful descriptor, because it actually describes nothing/everything.
@@kenfresno2125 I think you need to look into what mechanical means because you clearly don't know. Mechanical is by definition some physical change in state, when it comes to switches the only mechanical switch is the type that takes 2 electrical contacts and completes the circuit. Hall effect is not mechanical because a physical state change didn't happen, resistive switches are not mechanical because a physical state change did not happen, capacitive switches are not mechanical because a physical state change did not happen, optical same thing. With whether a switch is mechanical it has nothing to do with the mechanics of how the the switch is actuated, it has everything to do with the mechanics of how it signals that its been pressed. All other forms of switches require electronics to monitor each input to see if there's a change in a sensor. Mechanical keyboards are usually just a lattice of electrical connections that a chip on the other side takes an interrupt formed from the bridging of the contacts, in theory the actual keyboard mechanics require no electronics and no power to operate. This is why it's mechanical.
I got a mechanical keyboard to use in my office but at home I have been using the same Happy Hacking keyboard I bought at their linuxworld booth in like 1999. For the longest time it was hard to find something with a similar layout/size but now everyone’s using them.
Tbh, I think the whole definition of “mechanical” is muddled, but one I can agree on is that a switch allows partial travel activation. So, you haven’t given up on mech boards, you just started using another type.
mechanical is better explained by a switch that makes physical contact between 2 contacts and passes an electrical signal between the two. then there is hall effect switches, optical switches, capacitive switches, resistive switches and what ever that cheap laser keyboard is. each uses a different electrical principle to identify which key you have pressed and when it's let go. think there are plenty of membrane keyboards that are mechanical, but many optical and hall effect keyboards are labeled as mechanical when they really aren't.
@@TheObsesedAnimeFreaks most people would argue hall effect and optical are "mechanical". i think the term, at least as it's used, is more about the feel honestly.
I daily drive the niz x108 with the pimpmykeyboard g20 stealth keycaps And I love it so much Great sound, easy on my writer's fingers, and looks great Totally agree Electrocapacitive is the way to go!
G20s on domes, that's an idea. I have really mixed feelings about my G20 set.. It's very quality PBT from Signature Plastics, I'm just too used to cherry profile GMK sets I think for general typing. Really interested to see how their SA+P Snowcaps would sound on a Niz board though now...
There are several keys missing on that keyboard that I couldn't do with out. I need all the modifier keys on each side, I do have two hands after all, but I also need a sleep and wake key, which I use them both at least once per day, and I definitely need a print screen key. I use that one key at least 5 times per day. Often times I'll just hit it to bring up Spectacle, but sometimes I use it with the WinKeys and sometimes also Shift and Ctrl. It is incredibly useful to be able to capture just the focused window or the whole desktop and immediately write it to disk, but if I know I only want to capture a selected region, it's faster than bringing up Spectacle then hitting the button to capture a region. I know, I know, the Fn key allows you to still have the key through indirection, but if a shortcut takes more than three keys, it's too many.
@@maynardewm Okay, I admit it, I don't really *need* any of that, but I definitely *want* all of that. If we're going to be pedantic, though, we only really need enough to stay alive and no more. If one could even equate being alive with a need.
Now I don't feel so bad for using domes lol. Very low profile scissor switch keyboards are my jam, I wish there were more of them. There can actually be a big variety of sound and feel, though a quiet sound is a +++ quality on all of them. Only loud one I've ever heard was Apple's butterfly keyboard. God it was loud.
Honestly I find it hilarious that mechanical keyboards with electrocapacitive switches are seen as membrane keyboards cuz of the puritan culture that exists in the mechanical keyboard community, since any keyboard that uses a pcb (and usually some sort of spring mechanism) is a mechanical keyboard. Membrane isn’t synonymous with rubber domes, it’s actually an alternative to a pcb that happens to commonly be used with rubber domes (though it’s even more commonly used with butterfly switches and scissor switches).
I am tempted to buy a Niz but I already have a Realforce R2 with APC (Actuation Point Changer) which is great for gaming and a HHKB Pro 2 with 17 year old domes (FYI aged domes are the best! They are snappy and heavier). I'm afraid I might buy the Niz only to not be that impressed by it. Though I am curious about your thoughts regarding Niz and Topre switches. Perhaps a new video soon?
i'm gonna buy the parts for my own custom keyboard today i think. i don't have a big budget so it wont be the best, but itll be ok enough. I'm gonna get a fully assembled keychron k8 (for the aluminum frame), EG aqua king switches, and some budget keycaps that i will probably upgrade in a bit. im so excited because i currently have some crappy razer blackwidow v3 keyboard that hurts my ears if i dont have my (noise cancelling) headphones on
I never personally liked "Thocky" keyboard. I'm that one weirdo who loves metalic hollow sounding boards. BUT I respect your decisions and your move. And idc bout clickbait your vids are good.
i have used my topre realforce every day for 13 years now, so i understand :D its still feels like a cloud, but its getting closer to retirement. should i try niz switches? i cant find any new topres with swedish iso layout any longer it seems.
I'm new here but I subbed immediately because you're funny and your videos with your friends making keyboards was wow. They did such a good job I thought maybe you hit the jackpot with friends or maybe you just paid some actors to help you out. Either way, it seems like its going to be an adventure if I end up building my own keyboard someday. Maybe I could just buy one from your closet.
Some switch company needs to make a electro capacitive switch inside a cherry housing, imagine being able to make any keyboard electro capacitive (Because your a youtuber you could probably see if it's possible)
I just bought and "modded" an mechanical keyboard more out of necessaty. first I hated it becuase its heavy, has a battery and is expensive. I then added black keycaps and had to dremel two keys fit properly. then I played with the backlight and the mix of black and white keys I got and oh man I start to see why this so popular. Im already checking how I can build my own PCB. I actually have no time for this bc Im basically an old man but okay. unfortunately Im a iso user and there is is little to choose from in general. Im on a RK84 with corsair double shot caps now. its nice but right now as Im typing Im notcing that the space bar sound horrible and quite a bit louder than rest of the keys....god and in tab you can hear the spring when it comes up....jesus
You should look to get a custom CNCed PC plate. If you know someone with a CNC machine, it’s really cheap to go to like Home Depot to by like a thin sheet of PC and CAD a plate.
Aight custom keyboards finally got my interest. I was also hesitant cause I am basically married to my old ass ibs membrane keyboard with a ps/2 connection, have used it literally almost my entire life. Was waiting for the circling back or a company to be like 'but membrane tho' and it seems were thereeeee. Ty for the simping lol
Yeah i feel You im using a Leopold fc660c with silent topres... keycaps Are hard to find but i Got myself a treat some sa hipro from kbd very happy with it
This year I found an old Packard Bell keyboard I stored almost two decades ago in my basement. It was the keyboard of my first PC in 1995. Technically is a membrane keyboard but uses rubber domes with sliders and has a very nice feeling. I have three mechanical keyboards (full, 75% and 60%) but use it every now and then.
Hey, you mentioned a good software to set up your keyboard on Windows, in one of your videos. But I've watched so many of your videos lately, I have zero clue in which video you talked about it. Do you know what kind of software I'm looking for?
If I like a tactile feel but want a quiet keyboard as to not annoy my roommate, would something like this be a good idea or should I stick with some quieter mechanical caps?
I feel like a lot of the mech community would just be better off using membrane. Thock? Membrane. Soft bottom out? Membrane. Bouncy typing feel? Membrane. Rounded tactility? Membrane.
I have absolutely no interest whatsoever in custom keyboards, but I seem to be binge watching your posts. You owe me 8 hours and 47 minutes so far. Or a send me 61er. Actually, make that a 68er, as I've subscribed. Dammit.
I feel like most people don't understand why mechanical switches exist in the first place. They remove the issue of missed presses since they activate at a certain travel distance and don't have to go 100% all the way to the bottom. I noticed this problem years ago when playing games and your inputs just didn't work all the time. Mechanical switches are much more consistent on their activation which is the reason they exist and why they are better than membrane.
And most people watching this video don't understand that Topre isn't membrane in the first place. You are literally describing an issue that doesn't exist for this board. Topre are electro capacitive rubber domes with a PCB inside of them. They are properly mechanical keyboards lol.
Hello Hipyo, I'm a boy of 13 years old and I want to build my first custom keyboard, I have in mind the keycaps, the switches ( can you tell me if they are thocky?) and the keyboard bare bone but I don't know if the pieces are compatible
Trying out the hhkb was nice but the case was so light and cheap feeling I couldn't really get into it. So I got a pc heavy grail and that took it to the level I was looking for and has high priority on my rotation now.
After two mech keyboards I went back to using membrane. They felt terrible in terms of ergonomics, everyday usability, noise and especially the price. I get more wrist strain and make more typos with long travel distances and high profile keys of regular mech kbs. And an issue I had with red switches is, when I had my hand on WASD the actuation force was so little that the weight of my hand would press the keys. I never had such a problem with regular keyboards. I would like to get into the hobby and build/buy something to my taste but I can't afford it so $20 Logitech keyboard it is.
Do you know ANALOG keyboards? Like the Wooting 60HE which uses hall effect sensors where you can define the trigger travel for each key differently and make the release instant when travelling up.
![[UNCUT] The Loyal Pin ปิ่นภักดิ์ EP.4 (4/4)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/d3l5rxl5CVo/mqdefault.jpg)
Howdy hey, I'm not quitting watch the video and it will all make sense :)
Okay lmao
i can't believe you admitted to embezzling funds from the glarses company 2 minutes in!
niz keyboards > all
hey hipyo, you scared shit-ton of people lol
this is deep
Can't wait for everyone to start building membrane keyboards..
So that mechanical keyboard stuff would no longer be sold out so fast
Top comment, I agree
thh
Amen 🙏
nah magnetic keyboards will be the new shit
@@MinisBett idk what you talking about laser keyboards are the w (if you are a gambler)
Kind of refreshing tbh. Normally I imagine keyboard reviewers to be using some insane set up with alll the craziest parts. However this is a HUGE reminder at the end of the day what mAkes you happy is the best choice ignore the noise from others.
It's a reminder that it's not a black or white situation. Picking what makes you happy or what's best suited for getting something done is a huge bunch of sacrifices either way, except for those rare situations where the universe just aligns. :)
Ignore the noise!?
*furious typing noises from a dozen mechanical keyboards*
not crazy at all = girly key caps + circular saw + destroy two $150 boards to make one
yeah, right.
Those weren't regular and inexpensive keyboards he mashed into one.
Never Thought you would be using membrane keyboards. smh
It’s MIT membrane tho
@paper they are electro capacitive
Not membrane
It’s not membrane. Do you even know what the membrane is in keyboards?
@@BIxtz yeah he probably has a gataron blue switch keyboard
The keyboard enthusiast has gone full circle: membrane is now cool
it’s more like the start of a new cycle, since we came from mechanical switches to membrane and then to newer mechanical switches and then newer membrane
Not membrane. Rubber domes, but no membrane.
Hell no
@@AidanRampair
Rubber domes are still membranes, there is a membrane ontop of the circuit board, the domes are simply a different type of switch to regular membranes, the function is still very much the same, its like saying MX Blue aint mechanical but MX Red is.
However not all rubber domes are membrane, some work without a membrane like Topre
This is a special kind of rubber dome. It was always cool. : >
This one's not a cheap thing.
"I really like lubing things" I will never get that out of my brain lmao
stop it! please think about the engagement ;-;
I wouldn't say that its a membrane keyboard, it feels more like it's a hybrid, but also not like those garbarge "mecha-mechanical" "mechanical feel" rubber dome keyboards.
Yeh, this feels like a mechanical keyboard except they dont use a spring and different conductor. The setup itself is the same as a mechanical basically.
Theres no need for every switch internally to work like an MX-cherry derivative. This could be some nice innovation, especially if they managed to fit this into a cherry-compatible shape.
Dome with slider, not something you see every day.
They were popular back in the 90s, but have all but disappeared in favour of MX.
They are quite good, especially these. Firstly, they are electro-capacitive, meaning they have quite a long life span on the sensing assembly. Secondly, they are a DWS design, meaning they have the increased tactility of rubber domes and the hard bottom out of traditional 'mechanical' switches.
Overall they are an excellent choice.
Honestly, not every keyboard needs to be mechanical, there's definitely some good quality membranes out there, personally use a mech, but I can see the advantages of membrane or electrocapactive
I want to find a good 65% topre board some day when I’m willing to put up with the prices for topre 😮💨
Ngl, my endgame typing keyboard is a Topre. It just feels so satisfying to type on.
People seem to have no idea that membranes and rubber domes aren't the same thing.
Rubber domes are a switch mechanism.
Membranes are just a medium for the sensing electronics.
You can have rubber domes over a membrane: the typical office keyboard
You can have rubber domes over PCB: topre and NIZ for example
You can have mechanical switches over membranes: see the Model M
And of course mechanical switches over PCB: standard definition of 'mechanical keyboard'
Your video on that Niz board was a big reason I decided to try Topre before building a custom mechanical and I've been using an HHKB Pro Hybrid Type-S for nine months now and love it. I'll still be building a custom or two, but I definitely like electrocapacitive. I will mention though, I remember you trying that FC660C on stream and being surprised that it was louder than the Niz, I think Niz boards come stock with silencing rings that you would have had to specify for the Topre board, so if that video is incoming I would make note of that or try one with silencing rings before comparing. I got the HHKB "Type-S" board which comes with silenced switches by default and it's great.
Recommend you get a Leopold, Topre Hybrids have pretty mid domes
Just wanted to comment on your most recent videos to say that I received your keycap designs (IFK delight) today and they’re absolutely gorgeous and they feel great to the touch, bummer I couldn’t grab the novelties aswell as they were out of stock but I am more than satisfied with the purchase despite the shipping hurting my wallet real bad, much love, keep making great content !
This guy just chills me out. Stressful week started in a easier way listening to this.
As others have stated, "thock" came from Topre. And they're less represented, mainly due to their availability and price. Some Topre clones have been around for awhile, but the price is still a bit of barrier for more people to try it.
The feel is also fairly polarizing for those people that do spend the extra money to acquire one. For me, I never bought one, but was able to try a few at a meet, and they're simply far too light for me. Their sound is unique, but while you can get close with some MX switches and a couple mods, it's not going to be quite the same without a rubber dome.
You can get domes that are much heavier than most mechanical keyboards if you like, standard weight for topre are 45-55g but you can go much higher with custom domes.
man, i Just got into mechanical keyboards
Still mechanical, because switch may have a membrane, but still is a mechanism
Topre is just the end goal for a good amount of people.
Some might say mx switches were never good.
Personally, I'm aiming for an alps board. It's going to take me a while to get the alps I really want.
.. and alps keycaps
I used rubber dome switches happily for 17 years on my Happy Hacking keyboard... and from what I hear, the Niz switches are even better. If Niz keyboards ran QMK, I'd probably be pretty into them. But instead, I've found I can get a nice feel from switches like Boba U4 and Durock T1. Or the scissor switches on my notebook. Those feel really nice too. I never got the appeal of Cherry-style switches though... the blues, the browns, the linears... meh. They just don't have the right kind of response curve.
I’ve been using Niz keyboards since 2019. Unparalleled sound signature right out of the box. Sounds better than any of my more premium boards and feels more satisfying. It’s also best for gaming with light switches and their 1.8mm activation. I have 3 different Niz keebs, bought one each new year.
Let’s just hope their software & firmware are either open sourced or released for Linux or WebUSB.
I got scared he was quitting for a second almost scared me to death
Honestly EC switches are massively under represented in modern mech videos, they are really nice and sound fucking good really hope more people make them/ talk about them
I tried a niz board and it broke almost immediately after getting it. Taking it apart was a giant pain (as you probably figured out), they support like no standard layouts, and it didn't feel that good to me.
The layouts have improved somewhat. Atom68 and Micro82 are pretty standard 65% and 75% layouts that are compatible with lots of keycap sets.
Similarly my foray into the mech keyboard hobby pretty much ended when I got an HHKB and since then no MX design switch has felt interesting or worthwhile, and I lost any really desire to keep tinkering with a hobby that's overwhelmingly focused on different variations of MX copies. Stuff like keycaps and good stabilisers are still cool, and luckily boards like the Wooting or Apex Pro have genuinely good, worthwhile advancement for the hobby switches (despite Hall Effect switches being a venerable concept), and are still compatible with custom keycaps and you can fiddle with the stabs.
With Alps style switches returning we could be entering the point at which the hobby gets genuinely interesting though, with more switch variety and moving away from that old Cherry MX inspired design that has such clear limitations and isn't amazing at any one thing no matter what combo of housing, slider, lube etc.
"Thock" originated as an onomatopoeia to describe capacitive dome switches, and is a more accurate description of those than any mechanical switch. I support this.
topruh thocc??
I've been using the Niz 87 for the last 5 years. And together with SA profile it's the endgame for me. I did however swap the domes for 55g. Which are the perfect weight and profile..
I used membrane keyboards for years then I read about mechanical keyboards being better for games especially I bought one (red switch) spent a lot of money and discovered that it doesn't do much better than a good membrane keyboard.
and they all sounds like shit, very loud. the sound might be satisfying but god it's never worth the volume
I've no idea what type of keyboard it was, but the very heavy and solid IBM keyboard for the first PC's they put out has always felt very natural to me.
You mean the Model F (XT)?
Yeah, I have a terminal variant which has the same switches as my daily driver. Great keyboard. Capacitive as well.
@@jugostran Those are the best keyboards, still. The model F mechanism is the best, but the model M isn't far behind. I just got a Mac, though, and wanted a Bluetooth keyboard. I bit the bullet and ordered a K2 with brown switches (I forgot the brand, it's whatever they use). Now I'm nervous I'm gonna hate it, lol. My dad worked at a company with a big warehouse that used all IBM, and so when I was younger (im 42 now), we had an endless stream of IBM keyboards. I almost bought one on eBay, but I really wanted something with Mac keys and Bluetooth. Oh, and illumination so I could use it in the dark.
There is a quieter variant of the model M that I used in college, and the brown switches were described as kinda like that one.
I kinda feel like someone who used to drive stick and got lazy in old age or something, lulz. But a big part of it was just wanting an actual Mac keyboard, and the unicomp didn't impress me. The keys were ugly, and I don't think the build quality is quite like the originals from what I've read.
@@jugostran Which variant do you have? Is it from an InfoWindow terminal, or older? The ones from the terminals are the best, IMHO. 20 zillion keys.
@@jugostran I am agonizing over this decision WAY more than I care to admit, haha. I loved using a keyboard that I could defend myself with. 😂
I'd love to hear more about which keyboard you have in particular, and how you interfaced it with a desktop computer (those twinax terminal keyboards aren't exactly compatible with any computer interface lulz)
@@bsadewitz I use the keyboard that shipped with the 3205 Color Display Console terminal. It is a Model F 122 key variant.
Also, Unicomp has gotten way better. Their New Model M has Mac keys and is generally really nice.
I bought the niz atom 68 like 2 years ago and honestly I've never wanted anything different since they really are unique and comfy to use, for typing and games
I've been daily driving a Niz for two years now as my work keyboard.
I do love this board.
you should consider working with either niz or someone else on making a custom case/plate to make the board less scuffed, and maybe even personalize if even more 😺
Yeah a collab board would be sickkkkk
i bought a NiZ Plum KB75 bluetooth without keycaps for $60 and i’ll never ever use anything else again. i love the feeling of typing on it YEARS after first purchasing it.
bruh dont tell me your switching to the apple magic keyboard
*you're
i've had quite a few boards, and the only one i'll ever use is my NIZ full size. i love it, best feeling and sound.
I have been watching your videos, love them. Niz plum is also my daily driver, I have used leopold trope 45g way more expensive, and niz is just different can’t describe it.
Even I own two mechanical keyboards (the brand name one and my custom one) I completely agreed that sometimes the membrane or scissor switch from laptop work more comfortably.
We really need a better name than "mechanical" for keyboards. Technically every keyboard ever made is mechanical. So is your mouse. So is a lighter. So is your fridge.
actually no not every keyboard ever made is mechanical. Anything that has a hal effect sensor, resistive or capacitive switch, optical sensor of any kind, or a touch screen of any variety, is not in fact mechanical. they are electrical, period. there is no physical change or physical bridge to pass current between two pins to activate the key. Mechanical =/= electrical.
@@TheObsesedAnimeFreaks You should really look up the definition of mechanical. Every single keyboard is mechanical. Every single calculator is mechanical. Your monitor is mechanical. The chair you're sitting in is mechanical. EVERYTHING that isn't handmade is mechanical. It's an awful descriptor, because it actually describes nothing/everything.
@@kenfresno2125 I think you need to look into what mechanical means because you clearly don't know. Mechanical is by definition some physical change in state, when it comes to switches the only mechanical switch is the type that takes 2 electrical contacts and completes the circuit. Hall effect is not mechanical because a physical state change didn't happen, resistive switches are not mechanical because a physical state change did not happen, capacitive switches are not mechanical because a physical state change did not happen, optical same thing. With whether a switch is mechanical it has nothing to do with the mechanics of how the the switch is actuated, it has everything to do with the mechanics of how it signals that its been pressed. All other forms of switches require electronics to monitor each input to see if there's a change in a sensor. Mechanical keyboards are usually just a lattice of electrical connections that a chip on the other side takes an interrupt formed from the bridging of the contacts, in theory the actual keyboard mechanics require no electronics and no power to operate. This is why it's mechanical.
Would watch a video on the realforce R3. There's also 30g versions available if you like really light capacitive switches.
i love
NiZ
and ur videos :))
I got a mechanical keyboard to use in my office but at home I have been using the same Happy Hacking keyboard I bought at their linuxworld booth in like 1999. For the longest time it was hard to find something with a similar layout/size but now everyone’s using them.
Hey,Hipyo can you use the keychron q1 on the m2 MacBook air
Tbh, I think the whole definition of “mechanical” is muddled, but one I can agree on is that a switch allows partial travel activation. So, you haven’t given up on mech boards, you just started using another type.
mechanical is better explained by a switch that makes physical contact between 2 contacts and passes an electrical signal between the two. then there is hall effect switches, optical switches, capacitive switches, resistive switches and what ever that cheap laser keyboard is. each uses a different electrical principle to identify which key you have pressed and when it's let go. think there are plenty of membrane keyboards that are mechanical, but many optical and hall effect keyboards are labeled as mechanical when they really aren't.
@@TheObsesedAnimeFreaks most people would argue hall effect and optical are "mechanical". i think the term, at least as it's used, is more about the feel honestly.
Looking forward to seeing you do some other things and broaden your repertoire.
I daily drive the niz x108 with the pimpmykeyboard g20 stealth keycaps
And I love it so much
Great sound, easy on my writer's fingers, and looks great
Totally agree
Electrocapacitive is the way to go!
G20s on domes, that's an idea. I have really mixed feelings about my G20 set.. It's very quality PBT from Signature Plastics, I'm just too used to cherry profile GMK sets I think for general typing. Really interested to see how their SA+P Snowcaps would sound on a Niz board though now...
There are several keys missing on that keyboard that I couldn't do with out. I need all the modifier keys on each side, I do have two hands after all, but I also need a sleep and wake key, which I use them both at least once per day, and I definitely need a print screen key. I use that one key at least 5 times per day. Often times I'll just hit it to bring up Spectacle, but sometimes I use it with the WinKeys and sometimes also Shift and Ctrl. It is incredibly useful to be able to capture just the focused window or the whole desktop and immediately write it to disk, but if I know I only want to capture a selected region, it's faster than bringing up Spectacle then hitting the button to capture a region. I know, I know, the Fn key allows you to still have the key through indirection, but if a shortcut takes more than three keys, it's too many.
But, you don’t
@@maynardewm Okay, I admit it, I don't really *need* any of that, but I definitely *want* all of that. If we're going to be pedantic, though, we only really need enough to stay alive and no more. If one could even equate being alive with a need.
@8:33 just helped me realize who you remind me of, Sid from Ice Age.
Now I don't feel so bad for using domes lol. Very low profile scissor switch keyboards are my jam, I wish there were more of them. There can actually be a big variety of sound and feel, though a quiet sound is a +++ quality on all of them. Only loud one I've ever heard was Apple's butterfly keyboard. God it was loud.
I NEED A 1 HOUR TYPING ASMR VIDEO OF THIS BEAUTY NOW (please)!
Honestly I find it hilarious that mechanical keyboards with electrocapacitive switches are seen as membrane keyboards cuz of the puritan culture that exists in the mechanical keyboard community, since any keyboard that uses a pcb (and usually some sort of spring mechanism) is a mechanical keyboard. Membrane isn’t synonymous with rubber domes, it’s actually an alternative to a pcb that happens to commonly be used with rubber domes (though it’s even more commonly used with butterfly switches and scissor switches).
That high school sweethearts joke was brutal and I appreciated it
I am tempted to buy a Niz but I already have a Realforce R2 with APC (Actuation Point Changer) which is great for gaming and a HHKB Pro 2 with 17 year old domes (FYI aged domes are the best! They are snappy and heavier). I'm afraid I might buy the Niz only to not be that impressed by it. Though I am curious about your thoughts regarding Niz and Topre switches. Perhaps a new video soon?
Cameo of the OM10 made me finally subscribe after lurking for many months
i'm gonna buy the parts for my own custom keyboard today i think. i don't have a big budget so it wont be the best, but itll be ok enough. I'm gonna get a fully assembled keychron k8 (for the aluminum frame), EG aqua king switches, and some budget keycaps that i will probably upgrade in a bit. im so excited because i currently have some crappy razer blackwidow v3 keyboard that hurts my ears if i dont have my (noise cancelling) headphones on
As someone new to your channel over the last few days. I had to check the date of this video to see if it was uploaded on April Fools Day lol.
I never personally liked "Thocky" keyboard. I'm that one weirdo who loves metalic hollow sounding boards.
BUT I respect your decisions and your move. And idc bout clickbait your vids are good.
Hate thocky keyboards
You got to try Alps. TRUST ME! Preferably Amber Alps, Blue Alps, and white Alps if your on a budget.
ha how do you guys feel about the ducky 3 mini 75% Keyboard
i have used my topre realforce every day for 13 years now, so i understand :D its still feels like a cloud, but its getting closer to retirement. should i try niz switches? i cant find any new topres with swedish iso layout any longer it seems.
Hipyo, you could have just bought the regular Niz Micro 82 (not the one you showed). It's awesome. And 45g switches. There are even 55g options.
I'm new here but I subbed immediately because you're funny and your videos with your friends making keyboards was wow. They did such a good job I thought maybe you hit the jackpot with friends or maybe you just paid some actors to help you out. Either way, it seems like its going to be an adventure if I end up building my own keyboard someday. Maybe I could just buy one from your closet.
Some switch company needs to make a electro capacitive switch inside a cherry housing, imagine being able to make any keyboard electro capacitive
(Because your a youtuber you could probably see if it's possible)
I just bought and "modded" an mechanical keyboard more out of necessaty. first I hated it becuase its heavy, has a battery and is expensive. I then added black keycaps and had to dremel two keys fit properly. then I played with the backlight and the mix of black and white keys I got and oh man I start to see why this so popular. Im already checking how I can build my own PCB. I actually have no time for this bc Im basically an old man but okay. unfortunately Im a iso user and there is is little to choose from in general. Im on a RK84 with corsair double shot caps now. its nice but right now as Im typing Im notcing that the space bar sound horrible and quite a bit louder than rest of the keys....god and in tab you can hear the spring when it comes up....jesus
I’m a huge fan keep up the great work
the howdey hey after subscribing bit worked lol
Wait, I have that exact same wallpaper he has on my iPad. Good taste Hipyo, good taste.
The fact it has a spring makes it sorta mechanical. Just because it's rubber domes does not mean it's not a mechanical keyboard
1:55 wtf i thought some crazy guy was yelling in my living room
You should look to get a custom CNCed PC plate. If you know someone with a CNC machine, it’s really cheap to go to like Home Depot to by like a thin sheet of PC and CAD a plate.
5:31 Howdy Hey intensifies
Honestly keyboards are a thing you can do above average with just even a Del membrane keyboard. It's really just a product of personal preferance.
Aight custom keyboards finally got my interest. I was also hesitant cause I am basically married to my old ass ibs membrane keyboard with a ps/2 connection, have used it literally almost my entire life. Was waiting for the circling back or a company to be like 'but membrane tho' and it seems were thereeeee. Ty for the simping lol
welcome to team noppoo and our endless quest to fix the space bar
I changed from traditional mech switches to optical switches last year and I have no plans to use mech switches again
Did you make that Topre v Niz switches video you alluded to? Looking forward to it, if not yet. Thanks!
Yeah i feel You im using a Leopold fc660c with silent topres... keycaps Are hard to find but i Got myself a treat some sa hipro from kbd very happy with it
You really had to give me a heart attack with the title
Just curious on your thoughts about low profile keyboards?
The costar stabs sound great tho, albeit with the original keycaps..
Bro recorded the first few seconds as an apology video
bro it took my like 6 months to complete my 35$ dollar redragon k617 fizz mod with a 30-40$ budget and it sounds incredible
I have a NIZ keyboard with those switches and it does rock a ton
This year I found an old Packard Bell keyboard I stored almost two decades ago in my basement. It was the keyboard of my first PC in 1995. Technically is a membrane keyboard but uses rubber domes with sliders and has a very nice feeling. I have three mechanical keyboards (full, 75% and 60%) but use it every now and then.
Hey, you mentioned a good software to set up your keyboard on Windows, in one of your videos. But I've watched so many of your videos lately, I have zero clue in which video you talked about it. Do you know what kind of software I'm looking for?
Been daily driving a Niz Plum 87 for a year now myself & it's the best keyboard I've ever owned easily
If I like a tactile feel but want a quiet keyboard as to not annoy my roommate, would something like this be a good idea or should I stick with some quieter mechanical caps?
Either get one of these or invest in some silent tactile MX switches. Boba U4s are highly rated.
@@dakevinmg i ended up getting the brown switches and i honestly they are just a bit mushy but i love them
I feel like a lot of the mech community would just be better off using membrane. Thock? Membrane. Soft bottom out? Membrane. Bouncy typing feel? Membrane. Rounded tactility? Membrane.
Please can you give us a longer sound test, i didn't get enought time to experience the thock at the end. Love the content tho keep making cool vids.
Here before the premier. I bet he’s gone full Topre gang.
I have absolutely no interest whatsoever in custom keyboards, but I seem to be binge watching your posts. You owe me 8 hours and 47 minutes so far. Or a send me 61er. Actually, make that a 68er, as I've subscribed. Dammit.
I went to a niz topre clone and have never looked back
I feel like most people don't understand why mechanical switches exist in the first place. They remove the issue of missed presses since they activate at a certain travel distance and don't have to go 100% all the way to the bottom. I noticed this problem years ago when playing games and your inputs just didn't work all the time. Mechanical switches are much more consistent on their activation which is the reason they exist and why they are better than membrane.
And most people watching this video don't understand that Topre isn't membrane in the first place. You are literally describing an issue that doesn't exist for this board. Topre are electro capacitive rubber domes with a PCB inside of them. They are properly mechanical keyboards lol.
You have earned yourself this subscription good sir!
MAN, I remember the id80, the good ol' days!
I get it...I love typing on a 60% because it just feels so good, but i literally have to use a full-size as my daily driver.
Hello Hipyo, I'm a boy of 13 years old and I want to build my first custom keyboard, I have in mind the keycaps, the switches ( can you tell me if they are thocky?) and the keyboard bare bone but I don't know if the pieces are compatible
Trying out the hhkb was nice but the case was so light and cheap feeling I couldn't really get into it. So I got a pc heavy grail and that took it to the level I was looking for and has high priority on my rotation now.
you mentioned that you like these more than topre switches and i’d love to see what in your opinion is the advantage to these in comparison
That's a no for me boss. Hopefully this makes it easier to order custom caps if we can push some people down to membrane
Gosh dangit I’ve been looking for that exact color scheme for a key cap set
After two mech keyboards I went back to using membrane. They felt terrible in terms of ergonomics, everyday usability, noise and especially the price. I get more wrist strain and make more typos with long travel distances and high profile keys of regular mech kbs. And an issue I had with red switches is, when I had my hand on WASD the actuation force was so little that the weight of my hand would press the keys. I never had such a problem with regular keyboards.
I would like to get into the hobby and build/buy something to my taste but I can't afford it so $20 Logitech keyboard it is.
Do you know ANALOG keyboards? Like the Wooting 60HE which uses hall effect sensors where you can define the trigger travel for each key differently and make the release instant when travelling up.