I’m not a helicopter pilot, I fly fixed wing, but looking at the wind sock, it seems to me like it would be safer to point the thing into the wind for the initial tests at least.
👌 yes the machine was capable of getting off the ground at this point. There were plenty of things to sort out which I wasn't aware of at the time. It will be fun in years to come rewatching the journey and remembering the events. 🙂
Just my $.02 You need to hang it from the rotor head, block the controls in the neutral setting and sit in the seat. Have someone ballast it until it hangs straight and level. Then you will have a good chance to hover it.
Thank you, the CG during the hang test before this flight was 0.25 degrees to the rear, I moved the seat forward as it was 3 degrees to the rear after the addition of the radiator. So no, it needs some improvement but shouldn't be too much work to sort. I think you can see the rotor is tilted slightly forward to lift evenly. Surprising how much rotor tilt is needed to compensate for 0.25 degrees.
Thanks, it's an outboard engine, Johnson 60hp 2 stroke 2 cylinder. I had to make the exhaust expansion chambers to make it produce the power necessary.
Hi, yes I have and I think it does help but it's still going to take many hours of practise I think. At some point I hope to feel confident enough to ditch the tethers and go to extended landing gear.
How much experience flying helicopters did you have before this flight...thank you. Asking for a friend...his dial up is broken and AOL isn't working so good for him. Merry Christmas for you and yours. Godspeed and Blessings. Stay Dangerous
Stay dangerous 😆 My total experience in flying helicopters at this point was 1/2hr's dual instruction on an R22. I had flown RC helicopters though. I went on to have another 1/2hr's dual instruction but most of the learning to hover was done with my helicopter. I wouldn't recommend what I did but with long poles it can be done with some degree of safety. Tethers aren't safe above 8" long as they can cause an accident.
Hi. No plans are available for this helicopter. The nearest you will find is the Bensen B9. There are plans for non coaxial helicopters such as the AW95 and Furia.
It all needs to be thoroughly endurance tested before I would consider selling any plans. You don't want to be making the same mistakes I might have made.
Definitely get some training first. I'm curious about your gear box and the contra-rotating rotors. I like the approach because it cancels out the torque effect. What are some of the challenges it creates?
Well coaxial in the conventional sense with collective and cyclic control creates some challenges like yaw reversal in auto rotation for example but with mine having fixed pitch there's not much to it and it's simple. The blades get closer together in forward flight due to the dis-symmetry of lift which can be a concern and the machine is slightly heavier having two sets of rotors this is offset by not having a power robbing tail rotor. I really don't like tail rotors and don't know why so many manufactures have gone down this route.
Part 2 will expand on this but the balance issue hasn't been investigated yet. Could be downwash pushing more on the tail could be the balance of the drive assembly. th-cam.com/video/4JNiHFk0qdg/w-d-xo.html
@@Ben-Dixey I’m no engineer however with a counter rotating rotor I would think it has to be balanced with someone in it pretty close otherwise you would run out of controls to fly
Hi, this machine does not have collective pitch blades, to keep things simple the blades are fixed pitch and altitude is controlled by rotor rpm/throttle. Happy to do more videos explaining more details.
I helped my brother to learn how to fly his Safari by sliding it on a firm grassy surface to help learn the inputs required and then gradually increasing collective while still sliding forward to lift off and run on again. Once you can repeat that, gradually slow down each time before setting down and eventually you will be in a hover before landing. Ditch the teather, that will only roll you over when it becomes tight. I have been flying helicopters for fourty years and 15,000 hrs and im still here. Find a smooth surface!!!
@@Ben-Dixey they were normal skids and the idea was to learn to control the lift just enough to allow you maneuver without lift off very incremental. Hovering is more difficult than forward liftoff and touchdown. The skill to hover is attained slowly with repetition. His was a two place with only enough power for one. He had no previous flying experience and was soon hovering with no further instruction. Be careful! Good luck and well done.
I can see the logic in this, there is however one big difference between your brother in his safari and my coaxial and that is the blades being fixed pitch. There seems to be quite a delayed response in the control of altitude with mine so things get worse before they get better. I've only had a small go in an R22 and that seemed to respond pretty quick to lowering the collective. I need to dial in my reactions to changes in altitude on the tethers as they have already saved me lots of times. Once I've got that under control I will then think about your suggestion, definitely food for thought. 👍
Lots of missing essential info. The blades appear to be fixed pitch, The center of gravity appears to be excessively aft. The key thing is that this machine cannot registered or legally flown almost anywhere.
Great video, and what a crazy personal pioneering project. Scary as scary can be . Looks good though. My only main quarrel is how everyone is so comfortable being so close to the blades while you test! Sheesh I couldn't stand near a manufactured helicopter yet alone a homemade one
@@Ben-Dixey sorry I hope my comment didnt come off as a complaint, just more of a wide eyed observation, with a large grin on my face as I watch the helicopter. Love the project tho
Thanks, you are absolutely right though I didn't choose to have that many spectators it just happened and I didn't react responsibly. Glad you enjoyed the video.
So you have no previous rotary wing time? Sikorsky had to teach himself but there aren’t any good reasons not to find someone to teach you the basics in an R22 or something similar.
I think you could be right. I'm going to proceed for now in trying to teach myself as lessons could cost more than what I spent building this machine. However I have no intention of risking myself or the machine in any dangerous trials, there's just too much at risk. I will find a safe way or go with lessons as you suggest.
Cool. So did you buy it pre built, build it yourself, design it yourself, or what? You've got me curious. If self built and there's a video, I'd love to see it.
Hi, I have designed it from scratch but its loosely based on the Bensen B9. There are videos on my channel with more info but here is the build picture montage th-cam.com/video/UgowB_HUVJc/w-d-xo.html
You've built it well, and you won't need to worry about losing your tail rotor in this design. Take your time. I hope to see you progress to unrestricted and safe flight.
Great Coaxial Chooper , I like your metal & Spruce Rotors
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Damn... gimbaled fixed pitch coax... That damn thing is 90° offset everything :p It'd be a nightmare to fly if you're used with the regular cyclic/collective...
DUDE. that looks so cool. I thought at first it was a Gyrocopter. But was then super surprised when I saw both rotors whipping up immediately. So cool. Good luck.
2 main issues. 1) too small of a motor to get any sustainable results. 2) the center of gravity is too far to the back which is why you leaned back when you actually had enough power to lift off.
@@Ben-Dixey the CG on helicopters should be right under the shaft of the rotor so what happened in this video doesnt happen as far as i can tell. and with how the engine was sounding, i think you were pretty close to max power even though the throttle might have some or a lot of play left in it. for the next test. i would make something simple to indicate how much power you are adding. i dont know of what that would resist the wind coming down from the blades but even without the motor running, that should give a good indication on what is left.
The CG in my hang test was 0.25 degrees to the rear so I knew it wasn't perfect but the field sloped backwards as well. I'll sort it and find a more level piece of ground next test. I have a vacuum gauge to install which will measure inlet manifold pressure, this will tell you the throttle position and power being used. The maximum take off weight with 60hp is around 275kg, my total weight is currently 240kg
@@Ben-Dixey overall its looks like you did a great job as its hard to build a helicopter let alone a homemade design and counter-rotating blades but as you know you have a lot of work still left ahead of you. one thing i dont thing i saw or see in this is a way to move forward or backward all i am seeing is a way to rotate left and right.
Thanks, the tilting mast can move in any direction 4 degrees of maximum tilt. I was pulling too far back to start with which is why it lifted the front so violently. Pushing forward it was then starting to lift more level but the CG is still off. The field also sloped backwards which didn't help either. Yes still work to do. 👍
Beautiful work. This is a dream of mine. Maybe one day. There appears to be a lot of people nearby. I would recommend that no one is near it (no less than 50 or 75 meters). Also, point it into the wind. It'll make your life a bit easier. Additionally, your control stick looks like it's really close to the ground. A hard landing that causes the gear to bend could make you lose control and be disastrous. Stay safe because we are all looking forward to the next videos.
Thank you, there won't be anymore spectators from now on. 👍 I'll reduce the length of the cyclic stick below and test in calm conditions. Thanks Part 2 if you haven't yet seen it th-cam.com/video/4JNiHFk0qdg/w-d-xo.html
@@Ben-Dixey I gave up the tethers as soon as I knew it would lift me. The ground was dead flat and smooth being a rugby paddock, which made sliding around on the skids reasonably safe. Keep up the great work. 🙂
Someone else commented the same sliding on the skids is the way. The only difference is the slow response to changes in altitude in my case. I'll take my time and decide how to best to proceed.
That is the coolest thing I've seen today. If it were me I'd be worried about the blade flap problem, i.e. counter-rotating blades having a catastrophic collision.
Just a few constructive comments, if you plan not to use an extended landing gear it it critical that you don’t bury a skid. Long grass can be a killer and a good mow in the flying area is much easier. I noticed that the helicopter is lifting front first. That means it is tail heavy. In Microlight aircraft we hang it from a strong rafter with the pilot in to check the c of g. I suggest it is a lot more heavier at the back than you expected. Please do that prior to continuing for your safety. Hopefully you have plenty of power remaining or was that near full throttle? Hope all goes well, but as you have no collective pitch as I could see, relying on the engine perhaps a safety bar at the front in case of rollover, going through a fence or blade strike will at least afford you more protection. All the best from Australia.
Hi thanks very much for the comment. Take a look at part 2 th-cam.com/video/4JNiHFk0qdg/w-d-xo.html I think it's the downwash creating the apparent aft heavy issue but would like your thoughts.
Thanks for the prompt reply. If you have already done a balance check and still have the pitch up moment, I agree that the airflow over the tail may have some impact. To isolate this is difficult, unless there was a way to change the rudder angle temporarily to vertical, so there is no aerodynamic drag with the airflow. Of course it would prevent you being able to yaw the helicopter but I would assume you would only do this to confirm whether or not it is the cause of the pitch up action during a tied down test. I still think that if it is true you would either have to add weight to the front or shift mass forward still to correct the moment as the downward pressure from the rotors remain a constant whilst in flight.
It certainly looks that way in the video, I'm a bit confused at the moment because I hung the helicopter from the centre of the mast again and it was only 0.15 degrees heavy to the rear. I hung a 5.5kg weight in the front and that tilted the machine 1.8 degrees nose heavy, I tried to fly again and there didn't seem to be a big difference from the pilots perspective. I should have filmed side on so I could see the tilt of the rotor discs. I'll do that next I think.
@@Ben-Dixey If it's not your CG then I suspect that the rotor down wash simply hits a combined larger area of the frame etc. on the rear half and this changes the apparent weight and CG.
Congratulations! You've done an excellent job so far. Don't play it all for nothing in the final stretch. Be patient and correct errors: 1- The CG is far behind. Forward cyclic will not correct the CG, it will just make the helicopter move forward. Position the seat further forward until the helicopter balances itself supported by the mast; 2- Fixed pitch does not allow to enter autorotation in case of motor failure. If your engine dies in flight, you will fall like a stone. Think in a variable pitch at least for collective control; 3- Try to gain more experience in helicopter piloting, or ask an experienced pilot to do the test for you. Helicopters are very difficult to fly; 4- Do the tests with calm wind and with the helicopter facing the wind; 5- On the day of the tests have few expectors and keep them safe in place.
@@Ben-Dixey I have no doubt this is going to fly beautifully when you get all the adjustments done and have taught yourself how to fly. I appreciate your step by step self-training - it will help me when I have to do it.
@@rodciferri9626 Good point about the free wheel... I didn't notice if it is present in the project. She is also essential. But I was referring to the collective pitch of the rotor blades in case an autorotation was needed. The rotor will only maintain 100% RPM in autorotation if the blade pitch is zero or negative, which is not possible in the case of fixed pitch.
Amazing, well done. I would recommend trial hovers on a smooth surface, not grass. This reduces the risk of dynamic rollover. I also agree with others about practising into wind. Good luck!
Thanks, I have done quite a few videos since this one. I'm up to 3ft high and can hover for nearly a minute but that's it so far. Totally agree about the smooth surface being the best finding one is not so simple.
I can feel the joy of a smooth running build on your behalf 😄...I love your simple instruments panel seems am overthinking by trying to buy an electronic EFIS from talcos aviation... question is, is that sitting position comfortable? Can you do a 1hour straight sit in that config?
Thanks, engine temperature and rotor rpm are a must gauges wise, the others are not so important to begin with. No point spending lots of money on gauges until you know everything else is going to be ok was my opinion. The seat position seems ok but I've only sat in it for a couple minutes. Perhaps I'll eat my lunch sat in the seat today and find out how comfortable it is. 😀
I just bought £10 digital rpm readouts, they come with a sensor triggered by a stuck on magnet. The same sort of thing as a bicycle speedometer. The refresh is a little slow which means it takes a second for the gauge to catch up with actual rpm but it seems to be accurate otherwise. Certainly good enough for testing purposes.
It seems the CG is a bit aft. That is bad. A bit forward is ok, aft is always problematic - you've got to eat more and it will be balanced! 😁. in other matters, It looks very nice. Strongly built, no vibrations or lack of balancing in the rotor system. just needs a little tuning and a bit of practicing. keep it up!
I have been working on a custom helicopter for couple of years now and I want to share my experience with you... the main problem I see with his design is stability in the air... make sure that all of your connecting connections and rods are pretty good fit and not loose at all... also do not allow your friends and family to be near because anything throwing from the helicopter can kill anyone... then I suggest you another thing that is complicated but again I think is necessary to make this concept fly well... and here it is: I think you need to connect your control stick to a fly controller like pixhawk or anything that can do the job then you need servo motors to move the controling arms... an autopilot must take the control of the heli by pid control and you just tell the autopilot where to go... Unestly I think you can not controll all of that by your self... seems complicated but again... I suggest at least talk to a nice person that you know... best of luck
If you were going to use a flight controller would you make it all fly by wire or still have mechanical controls for the pilot? Seems a bit complicated to mix the two approaches without there being a conflict.
@@floridacoder Right but I just imagined that the goal of this project is carrying a man into the air... that way the man can control by his stick... but yea you can just control it by your rc transmitter... for just the test or for the final test with him self in it...
@@hots2215 ah, that makes sense. I was thinking about using the flight controller in normal flight also - once all the testing is done. A poor man's auto pilot and an "oh crap button" to get you back in level flight. You don't necessarily need the receiver or RF if the pilot is on-board. I like to fly my RC aircraft FPV (video displayed on goggles) and that is probably how I would prefer to test these larger human sized aircraft also to start. Why put your body in any danger when there is a simple way not to. But, my hobby grade servos are also much smaller. Not sure what sort of torque is required on servos to control an aircraft like this. But you definitely wouldn't want to be under-powered. Curious how much human input (muscle strength) is required on the controls.
@@floridacoder well.... there are proper servos for the job... but what matters the most is how even do you find the right pid setting for a thing that is near completely new....
Apparently you didn't put on enough weight on. I thought that radiator placement was sis. Good for flow, bad for CG. Looks like you will just about get it off the ground on the next try but I don't think you will have much power to spare for manoeuvring safely. Stills beautiful job for 100% DIY.
Yes I need to put on more weight ha! The plan with the radiator was to have it placed to that ultimately I could run a belt driven fan from the pulley I machined on the centrifugal clutch. For now I'll just stick on an electric fan so I could have mounted it vertical helping the CG. I'm not at full throttle at any point and estimate I have 10-15% reserved power.
I hope you got good life and medical insurance. I’ve built cars and owned many modified sports cars/muscle cars and as much as they break down at least I can pull off to the side of road. In something like this you have a mechanical problem your dead.
Hi Ai, you are correct, no autorotation is possible. It's intended use is for hovering around a field close to the ground. Did you get your mosquito back flying ?
@@GeneralElecTR0N According Yandex translation RICCI said : " I follow your progress, you will succeed!" Which word , in this 7 word sentence , triggered your brain to drag the Ukrainian war in this as a reply ?
Fixed-pitch so you have no way to autorotate...no thank you. I'd rather fly a gyro as it's a safer rotorcraft than a fixed-pitch coaxial. Cool concept, but I'd not fly it any higher than I'd willing to fall....2 maybe 3 feet for me. :-)
First: hat off. This takes cojones. Now: I am not quite sure how you achieve cyclic control. The Bensen invention (tilting rotor head) raises questions regarding the "pendulum rocket fallacy" (see TH-cam video of 21/4/2020 and others). Cold comfort: if you fell for it, you are in good company. But the fallacy might explain why your ship does not do what you expect. I don't think there is a way around aerodynamic cyclic control. Looking at videos of counter-rotating and Flettner designs, they should be really easy to fly, in contrast to tail rotors. I did a few hours in R22 and that was much like balancing a broomstick while using both feet to keep the thing steady - a lot of work which needs to become second nature. You'll need more than 10 hours to solo. Fixed wing was easier. However, helicopter is more dreamlike. PS Your video looks like Lake District. Could you not find any wetter and windier place?
Hi, interesting comments, I'll have a look at the pendulum rocket fallacy and the flettner helicopter. I'm believe the Bensen B9 did fly but the concept is very well demonstrated in the Nolan and airscooter 2 helicopters. The only difference is the way the rotors are driven which has been a concern from the start but if the B9 did fly then it's possible to control. Testing in Devon
@@Ben-Dixey The Kaman K Max uses a Flettner rotor system. But since Flettner was German and there was this war - how could they let him keep the honours? Hang gliders can be controlled by shifting the centre of gravity. However, they do not normally hover. What the fallacy shows is that one cannot really control a rocket in this way. Robert Goddard was its most famous victim. A rotor is just like a rocket engine - it pushes where you point it at. And that is where the trouble starts. There must be a reason why none of the tilting rotor head designs found mass adoption. They were simpler and cheaper to make - maybe the fallacy is the missing piece here.
@@peterf2451 It will be interesting to discover what the disadvantages are of the tilting mast. My guess is something to do with the response time but having seen the Nolan Helicopter fly so well I know it's possible. The people at Airscooter spent an awful lot of money developing their machine using the same principle it didn't get to market but they got as far as running an advertisement campaign. The SCH 1A was another flown with a tilting head, now converted to standard cyclic feathering. I haven't been able to find the answer to the question but hope to discover it for myself soon.
@@Ben-Dixey You'll have to overcome a lot of gyroscopic inertia when tilting the rotor (=response time) and you'll never have a stable equilibrium (said fallacy). Still - not impossible.
Awesome job but I would have made the spectators move well away in case of the blades let go. Someone could be cut in half. Be safe thank u for sharing
Yes. The spectators were not planned I didn't know the landowner invited them and I should have cancelled the test. I had run the blades probably 50-100 times by this stage though and was confident they wouldn't come off. However I wouldn't do this again just in case.
I’m not a helicopter pilot, I fly fixed wing, but looking at the wind sock, it seems to me like it would be safer to point the thing into the wind for the initial tests at least.
I think you're right it would have been easier without a cross wind
Good first lesson - take off and land into the wind.
You are correct sir. In fact I believe it’s more dangerous in a helicopter than a fixed wing
I enjoy watching this particular video because the elder knew you could've flown the craft for the first time.
👌 yes the machine was capable of getting off the ground at this point. There were plenty of things to sort out which I wasn't aware of at the time. It will be fun in years to come rewatching the journey and remembering the events. 🙂
Just my $.02 You need to hang it from the rotor head, block the controls in the neutral setting and sit in the seat. Have someone ballast it until it hangs straight and level. Then you will have a good chance to hover it.
will do thanks 👍👍
Try nil wind or at least into wind for initially getting light on the skids.
Here's a more up to date video.
th-cam.com/video/4wNnU3swb94/w-d-xo.html
Good job, nice work too, are you happy with the C of G location?
Thank you, the CG during the hang test before this flight was 0.25 degrees to the rear, I moved the seat forward as it was 3 degrees to the rear after the addition of the radiator. So no, it needs some improvement but shouldn't be too much work to sort. I think you can see the rotor is tilted slightly forward to lift evenly. Surprising how much rotor tilt is needed to compensate for 0.25 degrees.
Horizontal air sock at 3 m from the ground; a ‘tad windy’ ? The most frightening bit was thankfully your shoe laces. Well done.
Thanks Andrew, Perhaps more than a tad windy 😀 I'll wait for calmer conditions next time and get Lisa to tie my shoelaces properly.
Cool project. What kind of engine does it have?
Thanks, it's an outboard engine, Johnson 60hp 2 stroke 2 cylinder. I had to make the exhaust expansion chambers to make it produce the power necessary.
Please give us specification engine ..horse power ..blade diameter .. and how to make blade
Hi. Engine j60elcia 60hp. Rotor diameter 4.3m. I have done a couple videos on making blades on my channel.
Have you flown rc helicopters before? Maybe that could help the transition a bit.
Hi, yes I have and I think it does help but it's still going to take many hours of practise I think. At some point I hope to feel confident enough to ditch the tethers and go to extended landing gear.
How much experience flying helicopters did you have before this flight...thank you.
Asking for a friend...his dial up is broken and AOL isn't working so good for him.
Merry Christmas for you and yours. Godspeed and Blessings.
Stay Dangerous
Stay dangerous 😆
My total experience in flying helicopters at this point was 1/2hr's dual instruction on an R22. I had flown RC helicopters though. I went on to have another 1/2hr's dual instruction but most of the learning to hover was done with my helicopter. I wouldn't recommend what I did but with long poles it can be done with some degree of safety. Tethers aren't safe above 8" long as they can cause an accident.
Hello! How can I buy plans for this helicopter?
Hi. No plans are available for this helicopter. The nearest you will find is the Bensen B9. There are plans for non coaxial helicopters such as the AW95 and Furia.
@@Ben-Dixey at least please sell me main rotor system plans/blueprints
It all needs to be thoroughly endurance tested before I would consider selling any plans. You don't want to be making the same mistakes I might have made.
Is there anyone out there that knows anything about this fully tilting rotor head arrangement ???
Definitely get some training first.
I'm curious about your gear box and the contra-rotating rotors. I like the approach because it cancels out the torque effect. What are some of the challenges it creates?
Well coaxial in the conventional sense with collective and cyclic control creates some challenges like yaw reversal in auto rotation for example but with mine having fixed pitch there's not much to it and it's simple. The blades get closer together in forward flight due to the dis-symmetry of lift which can be a concern and the machine is slightly heavier having two sets of rotors this is offset by not having a power robbing tail rotor. I really don't like tail rotors and don't know why so many manufactures have gone down this route.
The incredibly dangerous machine actually seems to produce enough lift to get off the ground. Well done!
The blade angle doesn't changed?
That's correct, they are fixed pitch rotors. Works but it has limitations.
@@Ben-Dixey yeah. I don't know if it can perform suitable autorotation for safe landing. What do you think.
No it can't autorotate, it was built just for hovering and slow forward flight.
Looks like the helicopter tilts back!? Shouldn't a helicopter tilt slightly forward at take off?
yes I was tilting the rotor back and the CG is slightly to the rear
Homemade experimental aircraft? What could go wrong?
Cool design! Is that an old Johnson/Evinrude outboard motor powering that thing?
Yes 60HP 2 stroke Johnson with twin expansion chambers
Good evening, do you have the construction project for this coaxial helicopter for sale?
Hello, are you asking about any construction plans for sale?
It appears to be out of balance. Perhaps this is why no one has flown one. The cockpit looks like maybe it should be a few inches forward than it is
Part 2 will expand on this but the balance issue hasn't been investigated yet. Could be downwash pushing more on the tail could be the balance of the drive assembly. th-cam.com/video/4JNiHFk0qdg/w-d-xo.html
@@Ben-Dixey I’m no engineer however with a counter rotating rotor I would think it has to be balanced with someone in it pretty close otherwise you would run out of controls to fly
@@toddw6716 you could well be right.
this vehicle doesn't have adjustable blades angle ?
No, it doesn't. The blades are fixed pitch and altitude is controlled with throttle.
I wish you would do a video showing how the collective works
Hi, this machine does not have collective pitch blades, to keep things simple the blades are fixed pitch and altitude is controlled by rotor rpm/throttle. Happy to do more videos explaining more details.
incredible , getting a feel for where the cyclic likes to be at takeoff will be the big hurdle.
Looks tail heavy to me. Suggest you double check the balance with you in it.
Check out part 2 will explain more. cheers
th-cam.com/video/4JNiHFk0qdg/w-d-xo.html
Looking promising Ben, you've come a long way from machining mini inlet manifolds at IBL.
Thanks Birdy, I remember everything you taught me. 😀
I helped my brother to learn how to fly his Safari by sliding it on a firm grassy surface to help learn the inputs required and then gradually increasing collective while still sliding forward to lift off and run on again. Once you can repeat that, gradually slow down each time before setting down and eventually you will be in a hover before landing. Ditch the teather, that will only roll you over when it becomes tight. I have been flying helicopters for fourty years and 15,000 hrs and im still here. Find a smooth surface!!!
Thanks for this, very interesting comment, did you have extended landing gear or just the normal skids?
@@Ben-Dixey they were normal skids and the idea was to learn to control the lift just enough to allow you maneuver without lift off very incremental. Hovering is more difficult than forward liftoff and touchdown. The skill to hover is attained slowly with repetition. His was a two place with only enough power for one. He had no previous flying experience and was soon hovering with no further instruction. Be careful! Good luck and well done.
I can see the logic in this, there is however one big difference between your brother in his safari and my coaxial and that is the blades being fixed pitch. There seems to be quite a delayed response in the control of altitude with mine so things get worse before they get better. I've only had a small go in an R22 and that seemed to respond pretty quick to lowering the collective. I need to dial in my reactions to changes in altitude on the tethers as they have already saved me lots of times. Once I've got that under control I will then think about your suggestion, definitely food for thought. 👍
Lots of missing essential info. The blades appear to be fixed pitch, The center of gravity appears to be excessively aft. The key thing is that this machine cannot registered or legally flown almost anywhere.
There's more Information on my channel. You are right it cannot be legally flown or registered. It's a hovering machine only.
Great video, and what a crazy personal pioneering project. Scary as scary can be . Looks good though.
My only main quarrel is how everyone is so comfortable being so close to the blades while you test! Sheesh I couldn't stand near a manufactured helicopter yet alone a homemade one
Thanks for the input and I understand the concern. Next test will be more responsible.
@@Ben-Dixey sorry I hope my comment didnt come off as a complaint, just more of a wide eyed observation, with a large grin on my face as I watch the helicopter. Love the project tho
Thanks, you are absolutely right though I didn't choose to have that many spectators it just happened and I didn't react responsibly. Glad you enjoyed the video.
So you have no previous rotary wing time? Sikorsky had to teach himself but there aren’t any good reasons not to find someone to teach you the basics in an R22 or something similar.
I've had some lessons in a Robinson but maybe need more
@@Ben-Dixey If you can hover, take off, and land in a Robinson you may actually have a future keeping the spinning side up in your homebuilt.
I think you could be right. I'm going to proceed for now in trying to teach myself as lessons could cost more than what I spent building this machine. However I have no intention of risking myself or the machine in any dangerous trials, there's just too much at risk. I will find a safe way or go with lessons as you suggest.
Cool. So did you buy it pre built, build it yourself, design it yourself, or what? You've got me curious.
If self built and there's a video, I'd love to see it.
Hi, I have designed it from scratch but its loosely based on the Bensen B9. There are videos on my channel with more info but here is the build picture montage th-cam.com/video/UgowB_HUVJc/w-d-xo.html
Great video which was randomly suggested to me by youtube!
Rotax engine type?
It's a Johnson j60elcia
Awesome little helicopter, to be able to build and fly your own design is what many of us dream of. You just lived it! Congratulations...
Thanks very much Adam, your website was very inspiring and helpful. 👍👍
You've built it well, and you won't need to worry about losing your tail rotor in this design. Take your time. I hope to see you progress to unrestricted and safe flight.
Thanks 👍
Great Coaxial Chooper , I like your metal & Spruce Rotors
Damn... gimbaled fixed pitch coax...
That damn thing is 90° offset everything :p
It'd be a nightmare to fly if you're used with the regular cyclic/collective...
good point, I will change the throttle/collective lever position to conventional.
I don't think is what you say........what do you mean.
DUDE. that looks so cool. I thought at first it was a Gyrocopter. But was then super surprised when I saw both rotors whipping up immediately. So cool. Good luck.
Thanks Joseph, a lot of people who see it for the first time think is a gyro. 👍
We want sound heli no music
I understand, I have done other videos with no music and I'm happy not to add music to new videos if that's what people prefer.
Merhaba kolay gelsin kaç hp motor kullandınız teşekkür ederim
60hp
@@Ben-Dixey bunun daha ufağına insansız olanına 30 hp motor yeterli olurmu
It is possible to lift a man with 30hp. The GenH4 can hover with 30hp, for an unmanned helicopter 30hp will be loads.
@@Ben-Dixey toplam ağırlık 70 kilogram gibi olursa
Yes. 30hp can lift around 160kg
Very nice. Don't give up
Where are you from
2 main issues. 1) too small of a motor to get any sustainable results. 2) the center of gravity is too far to the back which is why you leaned back when you actually had enough power to lift off.
Correct, I need to improve the CG, I think the engine is ok for now, I haven't used full throttle yet.
@@Ben-Dixey the CG on helicopters should be right under the shaft of the rotor so what happened in this video doesnt happen as far as i can tell. and with how the engine was sounding, i think you were pretty close to max power even though the throttle might have some or a lot of play left in it.
for the next test. i would make something simple to indicate how much power you are adding. i dont know of what that would resist the wind coming down from the blades but even without the motor running, that should give a good indication on what is left.
The CG in my hang test was 0.25 degrees to the rear so I knew it wasn't perfect but the field sloped backwards as well. I'll sort it and find a more level piece of ground next test.
I have a vacuum gauge to install which will measure inlet manifold pressure, this will tell you the throttle position and power being used. The maximum take off weight with 60hp is around 275kg, my total weight is currently 240kg
@@Ben-Dixey overall its looks like you did a great job as its hard to build a helicopter let alone a homemade design and counter-rotating blades but as you know you have a lot of work still left ahead of you. one thing i dont thing i saw or see in this is a way to move forward or backward all i am seeing is a way to rotate left and right.
Thanks, the tilting mast can move in any direction 4 degrees of maximum tilt. I was pulling too far back to start with which is why it lifted the front so violently. Pushing forward it was then starting to lift more level but the CG is still off. The field also sloped backwards which didn't help either. Yes still work to do. 👍
Beautiful work. This is a dream of mine. Maybe one day. There appears to be a lot of people nearby. I would recommend that no one is near it (no less than 50 or 75 meters). Also, point it into the wind. It'll make your life a bit easier. Additionally, your control stick looks like it's really close to the ground. A hard landing that causes the gear to bend could make you lose control and be disastrous.
Stay safe because we are all looking forward to the next videos.
Thank you, there won't be anymore spectators from now on. 👍 I'll reduce the length of the cyclic stick below and test in calm conditions. Thanks
Part 2 if you haven't yet seen it
th-cam.com/video/4JNiHFk0qdg/w-d-xo.html
Wow, go Ben. Getting exciting now. Small steps.
Thanks Cam, I've had a full day today of testing to try and get a feel for it. I know you started with a simulator but did you use tethers at all?
@@Ben-Dixey I gave up the tethers as soon as I knew it would lift me. The ground was dead flat and smooth being a rugby paddock, which made sliding around on the skids reasonably safe. Keep up the great work. 🙂
Someone else commented the same sliding on the skids is the way. The only difference is the slow response to changes in altitude in my case. I'll take my time and decide how to best to proceed.
That is the coolest thing I've seen today. If it were me I'd be worried about the blade flap problem, i.e. counter-rotating blades having a catastrophic collision.
I was worried about that too in the windy conditions but looking at the video the blades stayed nice and separated.
@@Ben-Dixey You're braver than me...or more foolish.To be clear, I want to see you succeed, not die in a horrific crash...but I subscribed.
Just a few constructive comments, if you plan not to use an extended landing gear it it critical that you don’t bury a skid. Long grass can be a killer and a good mow in the flying area is much easier. I noticed that the helicopter is lifting front first. That means it is tail heavy. In Microlight aircraft we hang it from a strong rafter with the pilot in to check the c of g. I suggest it is a lot more heavier at the back than you expected. Please do that prior to continuing for your safety. Hopefully you have plenty of power remaining or was that near full throttle? Hope all goes well, but as you have no collective pitch as I could see, relying on the engine perhaps a safety bar at the front in case of rollover, going through a fence or blade strike will at least afford you more protection. All the best from Australia.
Hi thanks very much for the comment. Take a look at part 2
th-cam.com/video/4JNiHFk0qdg/w-d-xo.html
I think it's the downwash creating the apparent aft heavy issue but would like your thoughts.
Thanks for the prompt reply. If you have already done a balance check and still have the pitch up moment, I agree that the airflow over the tail may have some impact. To isolate this is difficult, unless there was a way to change the rudder angle temporarily to vertical, so there is no aerodynamic drag with the airflow. Of course it would prevent you being able to yaw the helicopter but I would assume you would only do this to confirm whether or not it is the cause of the pitch up action during a tied down test. I still think that if it is true you would either have to add weight to the front or shift mass forward still to correct the moment as the downward pressure from the rotors remain a constant whilst in flight.
@@kimkeam2094 Thanks for this. Great thoughts 👍👍
Your CG is way off, should be at the mast but seems to be behind it. Looking at engine and pilot placement makes sense. Move the pilot forward.
It certainly looks that way in the video, I'm a bit confused at the moment because I hung the helicopter from the centre of the mast again and it was only 0.15 degrees heavy to the rear. I hung a 5.5kg weight in the front and that tilted the machine 1.8 degrees nose heavy, I tried to fly again and there didn't seem to be a big difference from the pilots perspective. I should have filmed side on so I could see the tilt of the rotor discs. I'll do that next I think.
@@Ben-Dixey If it's not your CG then I suspect that the rotor down wash simply hits a combined larger area of the frame etc. on the rear half and this changes the apparent weight and CG.
You maybe on to something there, very good point. Thank you 👍
Congratulations! You've done an excellent job so far. Don't play it all for nothing in the final stretch. Be patient and correct errors:
1- The CG is far behind. Forward cyclic will not correct the CG, it will just make the helicopter move forward. Position the seat further forward until the helicopter balances itself supported by the mast;
2- Fixed pitch does not allow to enter autorotation in case of motor failure. If your engine dies in flight, you will fall like a stone. Think in a variable pitch at least for collective control;
3- Try to gain more experience in helicopter piloting, or ask an experienced pilot to do the test for you. Helicopters are very difficult to fly;
4- Do the tests with calm wind and with the helicopter facing the wind;
5- On the day of the tests have few expectors and keep them safe in place.
Good points - but, instead of collective control - couldn't he put in a clutch that disengages the drive to allow the rotors to auto-rotate?
Thanks for this insight, good points i have taken note. Cheers
@@Ben-Dixey I have no doubt this is going to fly beautifully when you get all the adjustments done and have taught yourself how to fly. I appreciate your step by step self-training - it will help me when I have to do it.
@@rodciferri9626 Good point about the free wheel... I didn't notice if it is present in the project. She is also essential.
But I was referring to the collective pitch of the rotor blades in case an autorotation was needed. The rotor will only maintain 100% RPM in autorotation if the blade pitch is zero or negative, which is not possible in the case of fixed pitch.
@@joneispetri I didn't realize that - so collective control is needed - or, perhaps a ballistic parachute is possible.
Amazing, well done. I would recommend trial hovers on a smooth surface, not grass. This reduces the risk of dynamic rollover. I also agree with others about practising into wind. Good luck!
Thanks, I have done quite a few videos since this one. I'm up to 3ft high and can hover for nearly a minute but that's it so far. Totally agree about the smooth surface being the best finding one is not so simple.
It seems to me that the C of G is wrong
It's more complicated than that but I explain how I resolved it in later videos.
I can feel the joy of a smooth running build on your behalf 😄...I love your simple instruments panel seems am overthinking by trying to buy an electronic EFIS from talcos aviation... question is, is that sitting position comfortable? Can you do a 1hour straight sit in that config?
Thanks, engine temperature and rotor rpm are a must gauges wise, the others are not so important to begin with. No point spending lots of money on gauges until you know everything else is going to be ok was my opinion. The seat position seems ok but I've only sat in it for a couple minutes. Perhaps I'll eat my lunch sat in the seat today and find out how comfortable it is. 😀
@@Ben-Dixey how are you taking the rotor rpm measurements? Is there an easy simple instruments out there
I just bought £10 digital rpm readouts, they come with a sensor triggered by a stuck on magnet. The same sort of thing as a bicycle speedometer. The refresh is a little slow which means it takes a second for the gauge to catch up with actual rpm but it seems to be accurate otherwise. Certainly good enough for testing purposes.
@@Ben-Dixey I see, will definitely add it up to list of instruments to purchase.
Hey friend can you share more details of that rotor rpm instrument or a link on where to buy it, need to ship in one...plus those ground hooks
It seems the CG is a bit aft. That is bad. A bit forward is ok, aft is always problematic - you've got to eat more and it will be balanced! 😁. in other matters, It looks very nice. Strongly built, no vibrations or lack of balancing in the rotor system. just needs a little tuning and a bit of practicing. keep it up!
Thanks for the comment, I will adjust the CG and try again. 👍
CG.must be forward +1 inch or more..
When this video and channel blow up on the platform, remember this comment.
I have been working on a custom helicopter for couple of years now and I want to share my experience with you...
the main problem I see with his design is stability in the air...
make sure that all of your connecting connections and rods are pretty good fit and not loose at all...
also do not allow your friends and family to be near because anything throwing from the helicopter can kill anyone...
then I suggest you another thing that is complicated but again I think is necessary to make this concept fly well...
and here it is:
I think you need to connect your control stick to a fly controller like pixhawk or anything that can do the job then you need servo motors to move the controling arms...
an autopilot must take the control of the heli by pid control and you just tell the autopilot where to go...
Unestly I think you can not controll all of that by your self...
seems complicated but again... I suggest at least talk to a nice person that you know...
best of luck
Thanks for the interesting comment I will bare it in mind. cheers
If you were going to use a flight controller would you make it all fly by wire or still have mechanical controls for the pilot? Seems a bit complicated to mix the two approaches without there being a conflict.
@@floridacoder Right but I just imagined that the goal of this project is carrying a man into the air...
that way the man can control by his stick...
but yea you can just control it by your rc transmitter... for just the test or for the final test with him self in it...
@@hots2215 ah, that makes sense. I was thinking about using the flight controller in normal flight also - once all the testing is done. A poor man's auto pilot and an "oh crap button" to get you back in level flight. You don't necessarily need the receiver or RF if the pilot is on-board. I like to fly my RC aircraft FPV (video displayed on goggles) and that is probably how I would prefer to test these larger human sized aircraft also to start. Why put your body in any danger when there is a simple way not to.
But, my hobby grade servos are also much smaller. Not sure what sort of torque is required on servos to control an aircraft like this. But you definitely wouldn't want to be under-powered. Curious how much human input (muscle strength) is required on the controls.
@@floridacoder well.... there are proper servos for the job... but what matters the most is how even do you find the right pid setting for a thing that is near completely new....
Well I’m up for it. Looking forward to the next video
What a beautiful coaxial machine, I love It, greetings from México
Thank you 😊
Gracias amigo por su video muy ilustrativo aunque no entiendo ni papa su idioma...
Does the translate with subtitles work ? I know the translation isn't accurate sometimes.
Apparently you didn't put on enough weight on. I thought that radiator placement was sis. Good for flow, bad for CG. Looks like you will just about get it off the ground on the next try but I don't think you will have much power to spare for manoeuvring safely. Stills beautiful job for 100% DIY.
Yes I need to put on more weight ha! The plan with the radiator was to have it placed to that ultimately I could run a belt driven fan from the pulley I machined on the centrifugal clutch. For now I'll just stick on an electric fan so I could have mounted it vertical helping the CG. I'm not at full throttle at any point and estimate I have 10-15% reserved power.
Привет! Поздравляем с первыми запусками в поле!
У нас проект чуть затягивается, потому что некоторая разваливающаяся империя решила поиграть в войну.
Thanks and sorry for your situation
Skip forward to 3:55 to see the aircraft unable to leave the ground.
trust me, it can leave the ground, it's me that's stopping it.
@@Ben-Dixey Well, at least you are honest!
It was a great video by the way. But be careful with that thing!
center of gravity is behind center of lift.
There was more to it. Part 3 and 4 shows the solution.
Man that’s really cool! Excellent work!
Love from India... ❤️❤️❤️
I hope you got good life and medical insurance. I’ve built cars and owned many modified sports cars/muscle cars and as much as they break down at least I can pull off to the side of road. In something like this you have a mechanical problem your dead.
That's true
Awe, c'mon! What could possibly go wrong? This could be bleeding edge DIY aviation, right?
You are an inspiration. Thank you for posting your work for others to see.
Thank you 👍
can't believe your first flight was in a gale force wind
yes point taken
the spectators ,, seemed kinda close…
So great to see you do that! Wonderful! So daring to build and fly your own machine. BRAVO!!!
Nice design...Q would b proud.
Do you remember little Nellie from the bond film? Flown by the legend Ken Wallis .
The rotors are too short
How long should they be ?
Looks like there's no way to autorotate with this machine, or did I miss something.
Great work otherwise. Have fun and stay safe. 👍
Hi Ai, you are correct, no autorotation is possible. It's intended use is for hovering around a field close to the ground. Did you get your mosquito back flying ?
Amazing, great work 👏👏👏
Thank you 👍
Mankind has wanted to fly for thousands of years and your also there ,
Great job, take it slow and easy.
Thanks and good advice, I need to learn to be more gentle with the controls.
Congratulations 🎉. I’ve been following your progress. And wish you would get some ground school first before taking to the sky’s Be safe
good advice Bruce. thanks
Слежу за вашими успехами, у вас получится!
Remember your flying ka52 Which has been shoot down by Ukraine force eh 😆
Very true 😀
@@GeneralElecTR0N According Yandex translation RICCI said :
" I follow your progress, you will succeed!"
Which word , in this 7 word sentence , triggered your brain to drag the Ukrainian war in this as a reply ?
@@leemnav that helicopter is suck so hard in the term of price to performance ratio 😆
Fixed-pitch so you have no way to autorotate...no thank you. I'd rather fly a gyro as it's a safer rotorcraft than a fixed-pitch coaxial. Cool concept, but I'd not fly it any higher than I'd willing to fall....2 maybe 3 feet for me. :-)
Not near enough rotor inertia either.
I agree in this configuration I won't be going higher than a few feet. Two engines or collective pitch then maybe.👍
This contraption is reminding me of a gokart I had as a kid….except when the chain fell off, or something else broke, I didn’t fall out of the sky.
true
Looks fun
Center gravitcion
Good job👍
Hello
Dear friend, your center of gravity is behind
You add a little weight to the nose
Yes you are correct, I will add weight to the front 👍
More balls than brains. I love it. Way to go Brit.
Find an empty field with obstacles, spectators and wires a few hundred metres away.
Pick a day with NO WIND.
+1 on getting proper lessons.
Thanks, Part 2 and 3 are addressing some of these suggestions. I have had a lesson in an R22.
Yes.sir.baling.baling.kipas.heli.harus.teliti.
Skip to 3:15 to avoid the BS.
👏👏👏👏👍👍👍
Not a helicopter, a counter-rotating 2 rotor, helicopter with non-rigid drive train.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicopter
First: hat off. This takes cojones.
Now: I am not quite sure how you achieve cyclic control. The Bensen invention (tilting rotor head) raises questions regarding the "pendulum rocket fallacy" (see TH-cam video of 21/4/2020 and others).
Cold comfort: if you fell for it, you are in good company.
But the fallacy might explain why your ship does not do what you expect. I don't think there is a way around aerodynamic cyclic control.
Looking at videos of counter-rotating and Flettner designs, they should be really easy to fly, in contrast to tail rotors.
I did a few hours in R22 and that was much like balancing a broomstick while using both feet to keep the thing steady - a lot of work which needs to become second nature.
You'll need more than 10 hours to solo. Fixed wing was easier. However, helicopter is more dreamlike.
PS Your video looks like Lake District. Could you not find any wetter and windier place?
Hi, interesting comments, I'll have a look at the pendulum rocket fallacy and the flettner helicopter. I'm believe the Bensen B9 did fly but the concept is very well demonstrated in the Nolan and airscooter 2 helicopters. The only difference is the way the rotors are driven which has been a concern from the start but if the B9 did fly then it's possible to control. Testing in Devon
@@Ben-Dixey The Kaman K Max uses a Flettner rotor system. But since Flettner was German and there was this war - how could they let him keep the honours?
Hang gliders can be controlled by shifting the centre of gravity. However, they do not normally hover. What the fallacy shows is that one cannot really control a rocket in this way.
Robert Goddard was its most famous victim. A rotor is just like a rocket engine - it pushes where you point it at. And that is where the trouble starts.
There must be a reason why none of the tilting rotor head designs found mass adoption. They were simpler and cheaper to make - maybe the fallacy is the missing piece here.
@@peterf2451 It will be interesting to discover what the disadvantages are of the tilting mast. My guess is something to do with the response time but having seen the Nolan Helicopter fly so well I know it's possible. The people at Airscooter spent an awful lot of money developing their machine using the same principle it didn't get to market but they got as far as running an advertisement campaign. The SCH 1A was another flown with a tilting head, now converted to standard cyclic feathering. I haven't been able to find the answer to the question but hope to discover it for myself soon.
@@Ben-Dixey You'll have to overcome a lot of gyroscopic inertia when tilting the rotor (=response time) and you'll never have a stable equilibrium (said fallacy). Still - not impossible.
There isn't any gyroscopic inertia in a coaxial, it's cancelled out by the counter rotation.
Brave and brilliant!
Impressive!
That's amazing.
Nice
looks like cg is too far aft.
Yes, I will correct it for the next test. 👍
Corrija o CG
th-cam.com/video/4wNnU3swb94/w-d-xo.html
there's also the airscooter th-cam.com/video/V8zqG4LRnrE/w-d-xo.html
Yep a great machine that flew well, very similar but different in how it drives the rotors.
Brilliant but I'm afraid the engine and rotors cannot create enough lift to make those gonads fly of yours. Lol JK Carry on my good sir
😆👍
Christ, watch yourself with this one!!
Awesome job but I would have made the spectators move well away in case of the blades let go. Someone could be cut in half. Be safe thank u for sharing
Yes. The spectators were not planned I didn't know the landowner invited them and I should have cancelled the test. I had run the blades probably 50-100 times by this stage though and was confident they wouldn't come off. However I wouldn't do this again just in case.
Сумасшедший, очень важно соблюдать технику безопасности, а вокруг люди стоят, испытание вертолета надо проводить с мерами предостороженности.
Yes, agreed. I put a stop to the spectators after this video.