Climate "Science" | Dr. Richard Lindzen | EP 320
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 เม.ย. 2024
- Ep. 320
Dr Jordan B Peterson and Dr. Richard Lindzen dive into the facts of climate change, the models used to predict it, the dismal state of academia, and the politicized world of “professional” science.
Richard Lindzen is a dynamical meteorologist. He has contributed to the development of theories for the Hadley Circulation, hydrodynamic instability theory, internal gravity waves, atmospheric tides, and the quasi-biennial oscillation of the stratosphere. His current research is focused on climate sensitivity, the role of cirrus clouds in climate, and the determination of the tropics-to-pole temperature difference. He has attained multiple degrees from Harvard University, and won multiple awards in his field of study such as the Jule Charney award for “highly significant research in the atmospheric sciences”. Between 1983 and 2013, he was the Alfred P. Sloan Professor of Atmospheric Sciences at MIT where he earned emeritus status in July of 2013.
Dr Peterson's extensive catalog is available now on DailyWire+: utm.io/ueSXh
- Sponsors -
Exodus90: Is it time for your Exodus? Find resources to prepare at exodus90.com/jordan.
Black Rifle Coffee: Get 10% off your first order or Coffee Club subscription with code JORDAN: www.blackriflecoffee.com/
- Links -
For Dr. Richard Lindzen:
MIT Page: eapsweb.mit.edu/people/rlindzen
- Chapters -
(0:00) Coming Up
(1:19) Intro
(4:40) Why you should listen to Dr. Lindzen
(13:00) How Ivy league hirings work
(16:00) Harvard or MIT?
(18:00) Emphasis on racism in the sciences
(19:22) Administrators outnumber faculty and students
(20:00) Wasting time on a broken grant system
(22:00) There is no money for questioning mainstream science
(24:00) 1800’s science papers shock students
(25:30) Scientific journals are not endorsements of the science they publish
(27:40) 1970’s, they notice an increase in Co2
(30:10) Classism and religious warping
(33:40) Impoverishing ourselves for no reason
(38:00) Objections to the narrative
(40:00) Coriolis effect
(45:48) Jordan plays devils advocate
(50:05) Politicians base their policy on scientific summaries written by politicians
(53:20) Bjørn Lomborg: even if they’re right, it’s not a big deal
(54:22) Tipping points, how they actually work
(57:00) Averaging anomalies
(1:03:00) Climate threat still five thousand years away
(1:08:00) Computer models, limitations and benefits
(1:12:13) Fluid dynamics
(1:14:45) Models on top of models predicting nothing
(1:17:45) Where scientists actually agree
(1:21:10) Money corrupts, “Climate Scientist” did not exist in the 90’s
(1:25:10) Speaking for your values without asking you what they are
(1:28:00) Gatekeepers holding back the world of science
(1:32:20) Stoking terror, stifling science
(1:38:30) You’ll falsify your own psyche if you falsify your words
(1:43:00) Standing your ground, living toward truth
// SUPPORT THIS CHANNEL //
Newsletter: mailchi.mp/jordanbpeterson.co...
Donations: jordanbpeterson.com/donate
// COURSES //
Discovering Personality: jordanbpeterson.com/personality
Self Authoring Suite: selfauthoring.com
Understand Myself (personality test): understandmyself.com
// BOOKS //
Beyond Order: 12 More Rules for Life: jordanbpeterson.com/Beyond-Order
12 Rules for Life: An Antidote to Chaos: jordanbpeterson.com/12-rules-...
Maps of Meaning: The Architecture of Belief: jordanbpeterson.com/maps-of-m...
// LINKS //
Website: jordanbpeterson.com
Events: jordanbpeterson.com/events
Blog: jordanbpeterson.com/blog
// SOCIAL //
Twitter: / jordanbpeterson
Instagram: / jordan.b.peterson
Facebook: / drjordanpeterson
Telegram: t.me/DrJordanPeterson
All socials: linktr.ee/drjordanbpeterson
#JordanPeterson #JordanBPeterson #DrJordanPeterson #DrJordanBPeterson #DailyWirePlus #TheJordanBPetersonPodcast
Note the Climate Change propaganda that TH-cam insisted on posting at the header of this video. That shows you just exactly how widespread the collusion re the climate "apocalypse" truly reaches. Lindzen is an outstanding scientist and no "context" is necessary for his listeners to understand the meaning of his words. For shame, TH-cam.
Hero
But Jordan, don't you know that the UN has a monopoly on all human knowledge?
Thank you for getting annoyed in the youtube comments at the RIGHT TARGET this time Mr. Peterson.
Just wanted to acknowledge Jordan the level of energy you must have in bringing us these high quality conversations in such number. We are all lucky to benefit from your ongoing efforts, more power to you. As someone who has generally been a conservative, establishment type guy, being anti to the current narrative is not really a comfortable or familiar position for me. So this talk along with the Lomborg and Shellenberger talks have been very helpful.
TH-cam, like/is Google, is…doing evil. With no accountability…such is corporatism.
I just wanted to thank you Mr. Peterson for your work. I am an 18- year old form Germany. In my school we have a lot of woke-culture "propaganda" that has been adopted by the most of my teachers. Every time I tried to discuss with these people I've been accused of being a "Nazi" (in other words as an anti feminist, racist, conspiracy theorist) especially by my classmates to the point we're I nearly gave up on me and my personal opinion and just tried to fit in. Your inspired me to think critically again and to be myself, to say the truth and stand up for things in which I believe. To live my adventure :) Your a big gift for my generation and for humanity in general.
In addition I would like to thank Dr. Lindzen as well for his effort to show a different perspective on the debate surrounding the climate change and for his scientific research. I really enjoyed the video.
Guys I just woke up an I am overwhelmed by the positive feedback my post got. I really appreciate your support and I hope you and you're families are doing fine. You're all made my day. We need to stay strong in order to protect ourselves from this, let's say insane reality. I hope everyone from this community finds his warm and cosy place in this world ;)
Am also from Germany. If you study specific subjects in university like the humanities (Geisteswissenschaften), this will continue.
Look for friends who disagree with you and friends who agree with you. A friend won't call you Nazi because they know who you are.
Your indoctrination might be offensive to your spirit mind, body, and soul. Stay above the influence. Cheers
That’s funny seems like they are the nazis
Good luck man, it won't be easy.
@@M1and5M Eigentlich besuche ich die 12. Klasse eines ganz normalen Gymnasiums in Bayern, weshalb mich auch die Diskussionskultur sehr überrascht hat. Ich war davor auch auf der Realschule. Dort war es um einiges entspannter was solche Angelegenheiten betrifft. Anscheinend ist es ein akademisches Problem. Die Sache ist das nicht nur meine Mitschüler mich Aufgrund meiner Ansichten meiden, sondern auch die Lehrer zunehmend negativ mir gegenüber eingestellt sind, was meine ganze Schullaufbahn nicht gerade einfach macht.
I was teaching in the MBA program at MIU (Maharishi International University) when a campus-wide discussion was announced concerning "climate change." The announcement made it clear that they wanted to hear everyone's opinion on the subject. I went and expressed my opinion which is close to what we are hearing from Dr. Lindzen in this remarkable discussion. The discussion members were very unhappy with my comments and the end result was that I was fired from my position, and told that I could no longer speak on campus on any subject. At that time i was also speaking to computer program students about the early days of the computer game industry.
That’s not surprising. The Maharishi university is an offshoot of a cult.
that's so sad! I hope you are doing fine! I am as well a game engineer and a big fan of early 80ies games algorithms and game industry.
I’m doing just fine, busier than ever.
Lysenkoism is alive and well, indeed. Or is it Deutsche Physik?…..
Sounds like the campus-wide discussion was actually a covert way of exposing who they would persecute next , pretty scary shit !
Dr Lindzen is one of few that can be considered expert on this debate. Top of this field with many decades of knowledge, and courage to say the truth! Thank You Dr Lindzen!
Wrong. He avoids robust debate and avoids top leading working scientists like the plague. Lindzen is a washout who hasn't published any fresh research in climate science in over 30 years. Just like he used to lie for tobacco companies as a witness, he lies about the impacts and causes of global warming.
There is no courage in being indolent and a professional liar. He is not a current climate expert by any measure, He retired from science decades ago to become a public relations flack and liar for hire, but at least he is smart enough not to deny the enhanced greenhouse effect.
You seem to appeal to authority. Lindzen published 200 papers, which is irrelevant, he did only did three on his own; none were influential as climate change papers. Anyone in science or even those that follow “conservative” media knows Lindzen has perfected the gimmick of lending his name to the occasional paper. It gets his name in the refereed literature every few years.
It's telling when Cato hire folk like Lindzen. An institute that get most of their funding from fossil fuel investors. One only has to look at their events where they do not engage in robust debate because they are simply propagandists. Not surprising, as this Institute was founded explicitly as a political lobbying group; its purpose to shed doubt on mainstream climate science.
I hope Jordan interviews at least one person that agrees with the NOAA narrative. It feels very one-sided as it stands so far. Not that we will come to any conclusion from the discussion. It's a complex subject. But at least, it would be entertaining to see a qualified person who sides with NOAA/NASA/IPCC addressing the issues brought up here.
@@tedoymisojosBrings to ming that denialists claim NOAA adjusts the data to show cooler temps in the past to make it look like it is warmer now, which we all know is a lie, as NOAA doesn’t even publish a global temperature record.
I recall the Koch brother's lab and Roy Spencer's lab showed the same warming as NASA/NOAA.
What is interesting is NASA is one of the premiere scientific agencies in the world, and their findings do not differ from those of independent and international institutes studying the same climate data points.
All scientific agencies have to vet their data through competitive critical scrutiny from scholars all over the world. Those high-impact peer-reviewed journals that publish their research are all independent of the government.
The IPCC is a shoestring operation. Its trust fund funds its group of committees that assess and reports on science that's discovered and published worldwide. It is strange how so many denialists online claim IPCC makes approximations or assertions, which they don’t. IPCC isn't the originator of anything in its Assessment Reports.
@@tedoymisojosit never happens. Even Gavin Schmit from GISS refuses a debate, he states "I'm not here to make good t.v. That speaks volumes.
@@fckmunch That's just the way it is. Scientific debate happens in scientific journals, not on podcasts. That's exactly why Lindzen has stopped publishing papers and started appearing on blogs and podcasts. If he wants to criticize the science he has to do it in a scientific way.
A humble man, speaking carefully and methodically rather than rapid fire bs from wannabe scientists.
Agreed 💯
Which one are you commenting on?
I feel it would be a more rounded conversation if JP actually talked to a scientist he considers "alarmist", just to avoid straw-manning that position.
@@ProxyAuthenticationRequired 😂
@@s3tione no one is going to take on an opponent like his guest!
I had a friend who worked for NOAA in the late-90s. They had a 2-year long project on polar ice depths and Temps. When the findings of their project went against the narrative, NOAA buried the output and reassigned my friend and his team.
I have to echo James Lindsay on this:
We SHOULD trust the scientific method and empiricism. But every field has become so polluted by woke culture and neo-Marxist influence, it's impossible to know who's accurately reporting the facts.
Margaret Thatcher was the first major politician who came out with a commitment to stop global warming. The story I heard was that Marxists hijacked her statement and efforts with demands to abolish capitalism as the only way to address global warming, and probably the necessity of social equity too.
How buried is this information? I would love to get my eyeballs on that! Let me know…
The Cult needs a Doomsday prophesy.
The name of your friend?
@@Richard482
Your address and place of employment?
Thank you so much for talking to these serious scientists Dr. Peterson. It is LONG overdue.
This guy is a hack and the truth is he's not a serious scientists.
This guy has said that the link between smoking and lung cancer is "weak."
@@troofinadvertising Please show me that, because this guy is serious enough that it would surprise me if he wandered out of his expertise to such an extent.
@@justlina2769 Really. You want me to show you something you can just Google. Put his name in the search bar along with the terms.
Joke ? ?
This was really enlightening to hear. I must say I am afraid of "coming out" on this subject, the persecution is real and I'm still in the beginning of my career. Scientists shouldn't be afraid of pursuing "the truth", but despite being scared I'll do my part on this. Thank you for giving me courage, you're an inspiration!
This is straight up propaganda. CO2 being a greenhouse gas was discovered in 1856 by a scientist named Eunice Newton Foote. In 1896 Svante Arrhenius claimed that fossil fuel combustion would lead to a warming planet. In 1938 Guy Calendar proved the the planet was warming. Richard Lindzen in the meanwhile has been receiving money from fossil fuel companies. The 4th mass extinction was causes by excessive CO2 in the atmosphere which cause ocean acidification because when CO2 reacts with H2O it creates Carbonic Acid which lowers the PH of the Ocean which started killing of fish. He also claimed in 2016 that CO2 does not cause climate change. He made a prageru video which he straight up lied to viewers. He also claims that there has been little evidence in weather changes even though the NOAA clearly see this. In 1980s the US spent 204.9B in damages for 31 events. In the 2010s the US spent 936.3B for 128 events. The 4 biggest wildfires in human history happened this century with the the second biggest wildfire the Australian one being bigger than the next 8 combined. He is not pursuing the truth, just a truth that benefits him.
Check new comments!
Do not be afraid. The truth matters.
Science is for questioning! Don’t be afraid. The truth prevail. No reason for people to attack you!!!
Yeah especially when "the truth" is funded by fossil fuels companies like Linzden's is.
If Jordan Peterson was my teacher when I was younger, I would of showed up everyday! Love you JP also shout out to Dr Lindsay! I’ll be watching this video over and over again
For sure. I have listened to most of his older stuff multiple times on TH-cam. I have been successful in life however, I neglected to embrace my shadow self. Let people step on me until I blew my top. His biblical lectures have made the Bible real to me, rather than cherubims, angles and fables. Exodus was life changing
Greta, listen to the scientists!
@@ossanyberg "how dare you" 😂
@@ossanyberg Watch it Tate was arrested immediately. 😂
@@emil_rainbow Wow your lovely and why the hell would you think that. Ooooh. My comment about Greta offend you ?
I have been waiting for a long time for a rational blogger, such as Jordan Peterson, to start having discussions with the skeptics of dangerous CO2 induced climate change. I'm a geologist, and have been studying this topic from both sides about 15 years. It is refreshing that the "deniers" are finally getting a voice on the subject, much to the efforts and credit of Dr. Peterson.
I’m always amused at how the alarmists continue to moved the goalposts when their dire predictions never seem to happen. Biggest ruse ever IMO
All part of the agenda 21,30,50 plan
I've also followed both sides of this argument for many years. A marine Geologist called Bob Carter was someone I followed with much intrest back in the day.
I actually lost faith in the skeptical side when a major flaw in his argument turned out to be one of the biggest supporting factors of the hypothesis that C02 played a very important role in the Milankovitch Cycles.
Lindsen has been a vocal critic of the more mainstream narrative for some time and I've seen plenty of pushback on some of his ideas for mechanisms like the "Iris Effect" for example...
Lately I'm revisiting my original skepticism but with some difficulty as many of the skeptical arguments are much less sophisticated than the ones presented for the AGW hypothesis. That's my impression anyway.
I think that Iain McGillchrists work on the hemispheres of the brain are the key to unraveling the problems between the two trains of thought and why the so called "rational" side might be subject to a greater chance of delusion even though it holds the upper hand in the narrative arena.
I think it is incredibly important to understand what is happening to the sciences because if we don't we're doomed to make catastrophic mistakes.
I expect you might be rather critical of the "alarmist position" but it is a particularly sophisticated "narrative" for want of a better term.
If we are to address the weaknesses of it we need to address it with at least the same sophistication or greater than what is presented in the literature, and I see little sign of that.
Are you privy to Iain McGillchrists work?
@@grantfrith9589 The link between CO2 and the Milankovitch Cycles is simply that the oceans absorb CO2 when the climate is cold, and release it when the climate is warmer. At the depths of the last glacial period CO2 was about 180 ppm. At the height of the Holocene it was 300 ppm + or -. CO2 concentration was merely reacting to the change in climate, not causing or driving it.
A "narrative" that relies on canceling, blackballing and defunding qualified scientists so they can't challenge a narrative is NOT sophisticated. It is an intellectually brain dead "narrative".
Pretty much like the world is ending people. After all climate alarm is a cult/religion. I grew up in a cult, I know.
His comments on modeling fluid dynamics makes me think of the formula one rule change in 2022. All of the teams designed their cars and tested them with cfd programs and full scale models in the wind tunnel, but when they hit the track they all experienced porpoising. If all of those billion Dollar enterprises can figure out what a car will do in the real world because there are too many variables at play, then how the hell could we even hope to predict how the climate of the entire world will react to one unevenly distributed variable.
This is the first real scientific discussion I've heard about climate change. I appreciate the open discussion about the assumptions being made with the popular narrative.
In the Navy, part of my divisional responsibilities was an dropping expendable bathythermograph every 6 hours to measure the temperature of the top 1500 feet of water column. Our watch station was all the way forward, the room where we’d drop the XBT was all the way aft. Nobody wanted to make that walk. Half the time an XBT drop needed to be made, we’d just copy data from the previous XBT drop and call it the current one. Then we’d send that data straight to NOAA. More often than not, the times we fudged our numbers were in the evening because we were sleep deprived, meaning the warmer day temperatures were replacing ordinarily cooler night temperatures in our reporting. 3 years later I got attached to another ship and my new division was doing the exact same thing. I’ve always wondered how that affects our climate modeling. 😂
My com.disappearred? Thank you for the light of truth. Hope JP sees it and forwards it to Dr Lindzen. Maybe try to contact JP via mssging. I think it important he know.
Dude, you’re a shit bag for that. And I totally get it. But you really ought to do your job the right way coming from a 20 year retired vet.
Oof that's bad data for science. No wonder they can't make up their mind if it's global warming or global cooling. Lol 🤣
There are satellites measuring surface temperature all over the world. They unequivocally have been showing average temperature increases all over the globe.
Lies always hurts people. My ex and his co workers fudged soil samples so that bridge called the Berthoud bypass keeps cracking. Lazy and lies always equals destruction.
The fact TH-cam AUTOMATICALLY includes "context" under a video like this is 100% proof posivitive of everything discussed by these two brilliant people. There are dark forces that want utter destruction of humanity - and importantly, they want it at basically every cost. Not just any cost.
TH-cam puts that label under literally everything discussing climate issues from any angle, from any side.
@@Raccoon1400 Thank you!!!
German guy here. One day later. I don't see any context. Did they remove it?
@@Raccoon1400 yep, cause theyre establishment NPC robots, getting on their knees for their owner
The real question is why does TH-cam claim the United Nations is the authority?
Just like the medical industry, science has also been corrupted. Bravo, Dr Lindzen, for sticking to your guns, and doing real science. Thank you, Dr Peterson, for having this discussion with Dr Lindzen.
so, lindzen is corrupt too... and science is not an indistry
Too bad he’s a bit like Neil Degrass Tyson, where you know he’s an intelligent and accomplished man but he’s still a bit of a pompous ass (rude, is what I’m saying). Great talk for them though.
Oh yes. In particular the field of nutrition science is nearly junk science with its observational studies that show a weak correlation and are then repeated as fact
Almost all climate scientists know the earth is warming and they're the corrupt ones? Not the few ones who are either delusional or on Shell paychecks. Who has more influence, a monstrous oil corporation or the international body of climate scientists who never even met each other?
In the medical industry and I can confirm this is the case.
It's enlightening for me to hear intellectuals discussing issues facing humanity and listening to politicians' orations separately. Promotes critical thinking, which I desperately need.
Great conversation! Dr. Lindzen has a long record of being a careful and thoughtful researcher. At this stage in his career, he has no fear of speaking the truth. Thank you to both gentlemen!
The kind of man who built Science. Unfortunately Science doesn't exist in a vacuum and will gradually die out as his kind do. Back to the Dark Ages it is then, overseen by AI as opposed to a Medieval God this time.
No, he's not a careful researcher.
@@WebHubbleTelescope why?
@@gbolt111 Because he has a track record of being very wrong in his predictions and he keeps mis-representing the science.
@@nerdyali4154 can you provide examples?
So glad to see that Prof Lindzen is still with us and speaking out. It must be 15 years ago now that I first came across his highly reasoned and refreshingly sane take on what has become a most unpleasant business.
Listen to an interview with Professor Fedorov Valery Mikhailovich.
He is a professor at the Moscow State Institute. He claims:
1. The greenhouse effect is 76% produced by water vapor, 20% by oxygen, ozone and nitrogen, and 4% by carbon dioxide. Of these 4%, only 1% is of anthropogenic origin. Those. humanity is responsible for only 0.04% of the greenhouse effect. 0.04% This value is within the measurement error. This is also confirmed by Dr. Lindzen.
2. He developed a model based on the ideas of the Serbian scientist mentioned by Dr. Lindzen (forgot his last name). This model takes into account the amount of solar energy hitting the Earth. It depends on 4 factors: precession of the Earth's axis, changes in the axis of rotation, changes in the Earth's orbit, periods of solar activity. This model is 80% correlated with the history of temperature changes on Earth.
3. He criticizes the UN model, which takes into account only changes in carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, and the latest version added cycles of solar activity. In fact, the UN model is tuned to a ready-made idea.
As well as
I. The activity of underwater volcanoes, which stretch along the bottom of oceanic faults, and about which we know little, may be responsible for the remaining 20% of the correlation. But another scientist found a correlation of their activity with tectonic activity, which has recently intensified (UN data, which are in the public domain and a link to which he gives). This is also in line with what Dr. Lindzen. Because underwater volcanoes affect the heating of the bottom reverse cold ocean currents. And there is a correlation with a delay of 2 years between tectonic activity and the characteristics of these currents.
II. Mankind can change CO2 emissions by 10-15% for an incredible price. It's better to spend that money on a fixture. In addition, with an increase in CO2 and an increase in humidity and temperatures, landscaping occurs and plant yields increase. Those. the effect is rather positive.
I give you links (names). You can customize the translation and listen to everything yourself.
О причинах изменения климата. Валерий Фёдоров, автор солярной теории изменения климата
Солнце. Земля. Климат | Фёдоров Валерий Михайлович
Изменение климата: честное объяснение глобального потепления. Артур Витерито
Yes, it is all about 'scale'.
No
Around 59:00 where he talks about "averaging anomalies", I think he completely misses - or actually avoids - the true facts. Why? Well he says "they" i.e the British Met Office and NASA etc etc, take data from weather stations over a period of 30 years, for example, and distort the figures by taking an average of the extremes (anomalies). Whether or not that is correct is beside the point. Those weather stations - like the one in Abisko, North Sweden, do NOT average the anomalies to produce their data. They have recorded, accurately, rises of several degrees in the more northern and southern regions of our planet, around the polar circles. Lindzen obscures and ignores this with his pseudo data. The melting of permafrost, the serious and steady decline of glaciers and sea-ice over the last 2 decades cannot be denied. The data from weather stations ARE ALREADY alarming, whatever Met Office and NASA do with them!!
@@PeterOzanne yes you never hear the deniers talk of the melting ice. Also so much heat comes from engines, pavement, houses etc
An impactful discussion. Most would be hard pressed to think anyone more qualified to speak on the subject than Dr. Richard Lindzen. Thank you, Dr. Peterson.
Fascinating interview!
Needs primetime exposure.
See CLIMATE MISINFORMATION BY SOURCE: RICHARD LINDZEN, at the Skeptical Science website for a complete dismantling of his talking points.
1. Lindzen disputes the scientific consensus on climate change, even though it's confirmed by eleven separate studies. (Oreskes, 2004; Doran, 2009; Anderegg, 2010; Cook, 2013; Verheggan, 2014; Stenhouse, 2014: Carlton, 2015; Consensus on Consensus, 2016; Powell, 2018; Myers, 2021; Lynas/Houlton, 2021).
2. Lindzen maintains that recent warming is due mainly to natural variability, not human activity. In 2021, Cornell University surveyed the over 88000 climate studies published from 2012-2020 and tallied a 99.9% consensus that human activity, not natural variability, is warming the planet.
3. 22 of his fellow MIT atmospheric scientists publicly refute his views at CLIMATE CONTRARIAN GETS FACT-CHECKED BY MIT COLLEAGUES.
Wow, this guy is my new hero! I have bs in physics and applied math and Lindzen perfectly summarizes my views, much better than I have ever been ableto explain to people. I've never played around with climate modeling other than college (Lorenz and chaos/bifurcation), but have worked with aerodynamists from NASA and am well aware of the issues Lindzen adresses.
Major props to Peterson for at least appearing to understand what the real problems that Lindzen brings up. These are some of the things even people in the field don't quite grasp. Most impressive.
👏
Jordan Peterson chose to interview Richard Lindzen. Out of all of the world's climate scientists he happened to pick him. The one guy that doesn't believe in climate change. The one guy who's funded by Peabody Coal and other fossil fuel interests. For some reason Jordan Peterson also chose to interview fossil fuel lobbyists Alex Epstein and Bjorn Lomborg.
Tells you a lot that you haven't heard of Dr. Lindzen till now. The alarmists hate him and slander him by saying he is funded by big oil, which he's not.
@@michaelbabbitt3837 I'm just not interested in climate or pro or anti extiction hysteria. I suspect there are dozens, perhaps thousands of researchers in other fields that I have not heard of. I don't think I could name 6 (pro and anti combined) if I tried.
@@sdrc92126 Their all based on the basic sciences you learned in school combined and interacting. That's all a climate scientist is. Their not magicians.
@@destinymayberry6217 appears to me that the entire political policy making is made on totally inaccurate climate computer models.
Net zero in the UK for example will achieve absolutely nothing regarding lowering co2, but will impoverished us all, whilst giving our "leaders" more tax money to "fix" the climate.
You couldn't come up with a more absurd proposition.
Yet its being implemented!
Finally seeing Ricahrd Lindzen come to a bigger podcast after all these years is such a delight. Thank you for finding him. Such a pleasant speaker.
people are getting sick and tired of liberal madness. the pendulum is swinging back to correct.
I really like the guy-he reasonably tries to explain complicated matters straightforwardly-without simply omitting the complications! I think he is actually hated by other "experts" because he is both clever and objective.(hope he does not retire)
Dr Lindzen has been battling the cult of climate change for decades.
Love him as well and have been following for years. I hope Rogan has a chat with him too.
Thank you dr. Lindzen and dr. Peterson for having him on.
Clarity is such an uplifting experience.
I have followed Dr. Lindzen for over a decade. Brilliant man.
He's pretty smart
He's a moron. He's wrong. What he is predicting will not happen. Oh wait, he made no predictions here? Then he doesn't know jack shit.
Thank you Jordan. I am 80, educated University Physics, Maths, Chemistry, Geology then fully trained as Medical Doctor and became Physician specialist in Clinical Chemistry and Pharmacology and Psychiatry maintaining a life interest in the cutting edges of all pure sciences as a hobby along with the emergence of computers and the net.
Prof Lindzen and you did a beautiful job with a master of human dialogue drawing out authoritative expert witness on the society disrupting falsehood that due to human activity, life on earth is threatened with catastrophe.
Young men and women, this was truth.
I have one corrective to suggest further consideration. Paleoclimate studies clearly demonstrate that planetary oceanic temperature and atmospheric carbon dioxide move in synchrony, rising oceanic temperature is FOLLOWED by rising atmospheric carbon dioxide and vice versa in the absence of potent other changes like widespread vulcanism and meteorite falls.
Man you are smart. Wish I had a grandpa like you.
Exactly! Now look at many other theories in science. Even in medicine, cause and effect are mixed up. Leading to the opposite of what was intended. One reason that the average American is on like 4 prescriptions, yet we are a very unhealthy population. Also the life expectancy is slipping back rather than going up. Why?
So modern human activity can continue as such? Everyone can keep eating steak for dinner from cattle? And we should not take the drastic decline in biodiversity seriously?
@@eulldog yes, cattle is not a hazard to the world sir, that is just silly! you disrupt farmers at your peril, they literally provide life to society. if you personally, are so concerned with cows contributing to (cough) climate change, don't eat them. but go ask those living in India and Africa if they want steak/grain/vegetables, or your pretentious moral superiority, report back please!
@@MyUserTubeAccount Yes, cattle contribute to climate change through methane emissions but that isn't the concern here. Cattle are very inefficient means of meat, and most crops are grown to feed animals for human consumption. "Don't eat them" isn't a solution because that solves the problem for 1 single person.
The concern is the amount of land and energy dedicated to raise cattle, the deforestation to support the cattle, the monocrop culture, and most importantly the huge risk of creating super bacteria as these production facilities need to IRRADIATE the meat to hold things back. It's only a matter of time until these antibiotics won't work anymore due to our meat production needs.
This is a huge risk to us all - not just those who demand a burger or steak every night for dinner.
Very much enjoying this interview with Dr. Richard Lindzen. Would love to witness an interview that included Dr. Lindzen and Dr. Michio Kaku. Several years ago I was driving across country late at night listening to NBR radio and an interview between Dr. Kaku and another Guest with a PHD discussing Climate change. Finally I was invited to join and make my observatoions to the two parties. I stated that I was raised in Freano CA and visited Yosemite Valley and was told that it was carved by Glacierization as was the Great Lakes, Mount Rushmore,Yellowstone and so many other features of the Northern USA which Dr. Kaku acknowledged. Then I asked "when did the ice age end and the whole of the USA became habitable?" where upon Dr. Kaku said that it ended approximately 25,000 years ago. I then said, "well that certainly preceeded the white man in the Westeren Hemisphere and the Internal Combustion Engine didn't it?" whereupon there was a pronounced CLICK and I was off the conversation. Thought you might enjoy my perspective. Really enjoy the interviews and all that you contribute to the practical understanding of this erratic and diveres Cultural and Social direction that civilization is heading. Keep up the Great Work you are doing. John Keighley
Thanks Mr Peterson for giving the opportunity to enjoy a interesting discussion with a real scientist.
Greetings, comrade.
I will be starting the exodus 90 in 3 days, and the hardest is not the cold shower, nor the fasting on Wednesday and Friday but to stop listening to JBP podcast for 3 months. that's the real struggle here.
Catholic?
Just think of all the JP content you can binge in a few months.
@@ulysses_grant yes
@@eg2564 Hail Holy Queen brother.
Did you ever heard of "Our Lady of Tears Chaplet"? I gently suggest you add the recitation of this so beautiful and powerful prayer to your Exodus 90.
God bless you brother.
Was homeless but yesterday finally got somewhere to live now I get to enjoy your video's. I enjoy intellectual conversation
Hope you’re doing better brother. I’ll pray for you today.
On the up and up.
Congratulations I wish you well in your journey for stability.
Good to hear you're doing better, being homeless can be soul crushing! Enjoy the shelter, privacy and warmth
Been there
Totally Love & Respect Jordan Peterson's Intelligence and UNBIASED SCIENTIFIC QUERIES .... leading to what IS HONEST & REALISTIC.
I truly appreciate you making this public. Thank you so much!
As a young chemist in the 80s, I recall reading these studies he referenced, and to this day, when I argue against Climate change propaganda, the zombies disagree. They have no data to discuss solidly but will cancel my argument by wannabe, untrained science deniers. Thank you, Jordan, for these incredibly educational and informative dialogues, which someday will help those searching for truth gain knowledge. 🎉
Most of these zealots don't even understand Archimedes' principle. They are the kind of ignorants that believe an big iceberg melting down will increase the level of the seas. They panic at those images thrown at their face by those who benefit from inciting fear. And if you show them that an ice cube melting in a glass of water does not change anything to the level of water in the glass, they think it is a magic trick. Who would have believed that the 21 century would turn out to be a bastion of obscurantism. Who would have believed that scientists torn by perpetual doubt would be shadowed by charlatans claiming the ownership of absolute truth. Welcome to the 21 century, a century of lies by omission, a century without contradiction, a century where you can publish any curve you desire and just plot the points needed to validate your theories afterwards, as long as it feeds the allowed narratives.
Do the zombies really need any propaganda while almost each year is warmer than the previous one?
I've got this. Tomasz, uuuunnnghhh uunargh ugh. Hopefully this helps you understand.
@@tomaszgolba5077 Wasnt the 1930's the warmist decade on record until NASA "adjusted" the data.
I have no idea. I'm not that interested in conspiracy theories. Prefer widely confirmed data.
I'm an hour into this interview and still looking forwards to the next 50 minutes, big thumbs up.
Agreed, I was fully vested in this mans experience and knowledge. Admittedly I found myself having to slowy digest the science he spoke of. Awesome to listen, get a kick out of a subject matter expert refocus Dr Peterson
@@emil_rainbow I'm confused I cant work out what your trying to say but if you need a grown up to explain it to you just give me a shout : )
@@byronschroedel432 I want to hear all sides to a story ESPECIALLY the sides being "suppressed"
I was hooked 30 minutes in. It is an excellent interview
@@SupersaiyanChristian @Rob Walker Same here, it has to be bloody good content to keep my attention for close to 2 hours, Dr Lindzen didn't even seem to have an opinion that he wanted to push it had to be coaxed out of him by Peterson. 10/10
Thank you for all of this Jordan Peterson.
Others have commented on the system stability issue, which has always puzzled me about the “climate crisis” position. How could we have survived so far if the system is inherently unstable.
I particularly enjoyed the reference to the le Chatelier principal, which I last heard of nearly 60 years ago (at school.) Nobody I know seems to have heard of it.
Jordan, millions of people are starving to have their intellect challenged and sparked by the conversations you have and who you have them with. Dr. Lindzen, thank you for taking the time to educate the rest of us in such a simple, straightforward manner. I'm looking for to investigating more of your work.
"Climate is what you expect. Weather is what you get." Mark Twain
"climate change deniers in 2023 sure are dumb" - Mark Twain
@@deanfowles3707 lame
@@almightypal look up this Richard lintzen character and how corrupted by fossil fuel industry money he is. Rotten to the core, same as Jordan Peterson. Rather get rich quick than children have a future. What a sad excuse for a human being.
Yup weather is what you get. Forecast is a good quess, the closer to the moment the more accurate
So what?
I find it very impressive to listen to Dr. Lindzen as an Atmospheric Physicist. However, his statement that there is no physical basis to say that the changes in the greenhouse effect gets amplified in the pole regions got me startling. All recent polar expeditions reported a drastically melting of the pole ice shield, showing that the climate change is happening much faster and more drastically in the pole regions. That is alarming also because in Europe or North America, so in regions located between the poles and the equator, we don’t realize the climate change a lot, so we are talking about it as something that is going to happen in the future, but it’s rather happening right now. The climate dynamics Dr. Lindzen is talking about though are very interesting, and in fact I believe they are a good starting point to comprehend the changed weather phenomena we experience in our regions. Because it all starts with the pole regions becoming much warmer. Dr. Lindzen mentioned the coriolis force and that the wind system is mainly directed from west to east (except for the tropical belt). What he did not mention, however, is that the driving force behind it is again the strong temperature delta between the equator and the poles and the different thickness of the stratosphere layer, which is varying from about 15km and high atmospheric pressures at the equator to only about 8km and low atmospheric pressure in the pole regions. The wind force is mainly directed from high to low pressure, so straight north or south away from the equator, but only through the coriolis force of our rotating planet gets distracted sideways west to east. This so called jet stream is not straight, as it gets again deflected by any north to south orientated geographic obstacle, like the Rocky Mountains or the Ural in the northern hemisphere, or the Andes Mountains in the southern hemisphere, as well as all north to south oriented coast lines. However, these Jetstream waves use to be constantly changing, and this has changed drastically in the past years. As the pole regions warmed up much faster than the rest of the world, with a turbo effect, as there is less ice already to deflect sunlight and more solar energy gets absorbed now in these regions, our wind system is loosing it’s engine power. Less temperature difference between equator and pole regions and less delta in atmospheric pressure means that our wind system is drastically loosing it’s driving force. This is observed as the jet stream waves are no longer constantly moving. There is less force to overcome the geographic obstacles, as a result we see standing jet stream waves, which can cause singular concentrated weather catastrophes, mainly floodings as a standing wave can transport massive amounts of moisture in one spot in short time. There are many examples, one was the severe flooding in the Aar valley in Germany two years ago with hundreds of casualties. Again, I really like Dr. Lindzen‘s thoughts, but I really don’t see how climate dynamics can be seen as an alternative to greenhouse effects and man made climate change. I believe they are rather one of the many often overlooked consequences of climate changed, and should definitely be taking into account as part of a comprehensive system theory approach to climate change. Not sure if I can correct Dr. Lindzen here, but I understand climate dynamics are a result, not a cause of climate change.
I listened to Dr Richard some 3 years ago. And he is still holding his ground despite the overwhelming attack on him.
All attacks are made trying to vilify him.
None go into the material.
Only someone who challenges him on the material can have a valid point.
The same goes for Jordan, they are only villifying him, no factual discussions...
This guy and his research has been funded by big oil though, definitely a huge red flag.
@@user-ys2wc5od6r In the academia, you must be funded somehow. But the question is, is the research outcome rooted in facts or BS? You do the math.
@@joshuaminasu7733 If you fund me, I'll make a comment about how smart you are.
When all of the experts agree they very well could be wrong but that may not happen in your lifetime. Also, in every field, 3% do not belong whether you are speaking of Navy Seals or meteorologists. But that cannot happen to Dr Richard because he is discussing climatology and he is not a climatologist and he definitely belongs in his field of meteorology which is the prediction of weather tomorrow or next week. And if you listen to everything he said today it was all related to weather. I am sure he knows the difference but he just discounts it as being important.
What a beautiful conversation between two highly trained and intelligent men, and I am blown away by Prof Linzen's humility. Thank you !
Richard lintzen takes fossil fuel industry money by the truckload I'm sorry to say. He should really be tried for crimes against humanity
Listen to an interview with Professor Fedorov Valery Mikhailovich.
@@AlfredMorganAllen He is a professor at the Moscow State Institute. He claims:
1. The greenhouse effect is 76% produced by water vapor, 20% by oxygen, ozone and nitrogen, and 4% by carbon dioxide. Of these 4%, only 1% is of anthropogenic origin. Those. humanity is responsible for only 0.04% of the greenhouse effect. 0.04% This value is within the measurement error. This is also confirmed by Dr. Lindzen.
2. He developed a model based on the ideas of the Serbian scientist mentioned by Dr. Lindzen (forgot his last name). This model takes into account the amount of solar energy hitting the Earth. It depends on 4 factors: precession of the Earth's axis, changes in the axis of rotation, changes in the Earth's orbit, periods of solar activity. This model is 80% correlated with the history of temperature changes on Earth.
3. He criticizes the UN model, which takes into account only changes in carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, and the latest version added cycles of solar activity. In fact, the UN model is tuned to a ready-made idea.
As well as
I. The activity of underwater volcanoes, which stretch along the bottom of oceanic faults, and about which we know little, may be responsible for the remaining 20% of the correlation. But another scientist found a correlation of their activity with tectonic activity, which has recently intensified (UN data, which are in the public domain and a link to which he gives). This is also in line with what Dr. Lindzen. Because underwater volcanoes affect the heating of the bottom reverse cold ocean currents. And there is a correlation with a delay of 2 years between tectonic activity and the characteristics of these currents.
II. Mankind can change CO2 emissions by 10-15% for an incredible price. It's better to spend that money on a device. In addition, with an increase in CO2 and an increase in humidity and temperatures, landscaping occurs and plant yields increase. Those. the effect is rather positive.
I give you links (names). You can customize the translation and listen to everything yourself.
О причинах изменения климата. Валерий Фёдоров, автор солярной теории изменения климата
Солнце. Земля. Климат | Фёдоров Валерий Михайлович
Изменение климата: честное объяснение глобального потепления. Артур Витерито
@@AlfredMorganAllen Good luck! 🙂
Unzicker's real physics got some great videos on the bs that goes on and has been for a long time in string theory and qed
1:43:08 to 1:43:55 Dr Lindzen, Thank you. That did need to be said.
Thank you very much Dr. Richard Lindzen for the true knowledge and good heart.
"As Lindzen's colleagues at MIT in the Program in Atmopsheres, Oceans and Climate, all of whom are actively involved in understanding climate, we write to make it clear that this is not a view shared by us, or by the overwhelming majority of other scientists who have devoted their professional lives to careful study of climate science..."
"The risks to the Earth system associated with increasing levels of carbon dioxide are almost universally agreed by climate scientists to be real ones...These include, but are not limited to, sea level rise, ocean acidification, and increases in extreme flooding and droughts, all with serious consequences for mankind."
---public letter of protest against Richard Lindzen, signed by 22 of his MIT colleagues
Dear Dr.Peterson thank you very much to stand up for the Truth in many ways!! You are in my prayers🙏💙🙏 Please hold on & keep up your valuable work!!
You know we are looking for a new Prime Minister lol
What Truth is he standing up for?
@@s3tione The actual truth. The over abundance of cancelation if you oppose a view or narrative that at this point. Is harmful and out of place. The fact that many things being touted as truths are now just opinions and if you disagree. Well villafication for you.
@@destinymayberry6217 Any specific cases? I worry because in JP's circle of influence, it seems that if anything is discussed in mainstream media or culture, the instinct is to oppose it on that basis alone.
For example, if climate change is discussed by the Trudeau government, the UN and huge media empires, then the whole thing must be a crock of shit, since those institutions and people are viewed as shit by JP. Once that is established, JP's organization can find scientists that will tell him what he wants to hear and ignore those that he doesn't want to hear.
I doubt you watched the video tbh
JP is one of a small number of public intellectuals raising the quality and profile of intellectual inquiry. I wish him all the best.
He’s a smart dude for sure but from what I’ve seen too casually mixes words together to make various points and arguments. There’s another fellow Charlie Kirk who does this a lot and another young guy I forget his name another pseudo-conservative type. Smart guys and they talk very quickly and never take a pause to let someone else get a word in edgewise and so at the end it seems like they’ve made a very convincing argument, but all they’ve done is confuse. Ben Shapiro is the guys name I was thinking of.
Yes but he contradicts himself on free speech. He engages too much in sycophantic interviews when it comes to climate change. At 57:00 he gives water turning into ice as an example of only having one place to go. He does not appreciate that water contains a near infinite number of degrees of freedom.
In one litre of water you have approximately 33,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 molecules of water. At 32 F or 0C they decide suddenly to stop moving independently and form a solid. These molecules, previously, distributed energy in a godzillion different ways but then suddenly they decide to goosestep into ice. In a real discussion, a scientist would have asked the professor to be more precise: why cannot this happen with climate. Here the professors lets Peterson utter nonsense and continues.....
This is called a phase transition and it is well understood in particular how suddenly substances become magnetic at a critical temperature. Also take some metals, they suddenly become superconducting near absolue zero, etc.... Again the professor lied on "this has not been studied". Is he kidding us?
At this point, the prof should say: "no, wait a minute Dr. Petterson, what you said is wrong" Instead the conversation goes on. This would not have happened if he had other scientists there with a different point of view or an honest take.
PS I am a professional physicist, so I know what I am babbling about. Peterson is really ignorant about physics. By the way, I wrote in a book where Peterson is a co-author. So I am sympathetic with his fight against the woke left but he needs to be disciplined when it comes to stuff he does not understand.
Do you ever fact check him? He lies every day.
Jordan, you're killing it with these interviews.
👆let taik on telegram ..............
The world’s politicians need to listen to what Professor Lindzen and other scientists who are on the same hymn sheet and make them realise the need to stop this net zero madness , what an informative interview.
Forgive me for being cynical but what would be their incentive to do so? There is so much potential for power and control in the climate change racket.
They know. Have always known. To lie is being a politician
Dr. JBP please hold the line. We are here for you. I do not usually use "We" as a Man, but I know there is more than 1 Man standing behind you. Thank You Sir for expousing Your conviction.
Love You Man. We are not alone.
@@tomasschuman6576 Correct. For those of my age that require it.
You have been weighed in the balance and found wanting.
Dr Lindzen is not only a great scientist and wise individual, he is also one of the most personable and kind people you will ever meet. In 2007 this man took the time to begin to correspond with this nobody. He took the time to help me understand l!! I also consider him a friend. Great interview!!! Thanks Jordon and Richard!!
Course the fact that he gets paid heaps by the fossil fuel industry To lie about climate change probably makes him slightly less kind than he makes out, but OK.
Sounds like a caring person. If I might interject a point of concern on his quick summary of what to expect. Here is why to beware of crop killing frosts. There is clear evidence that a 207-year solar hibernation cycle exists. That gives the estimate that 2030 is the next center point, with about 12 years showing some effect before and after. The last solar hibernation centered on 1823 with many, many days in series with no sunspots which often leads to hard radiation as ionized hydrogen being ejected off its surface. Hypothetically, this emitted material can help reduce the amount of, and strength of, the cosmic rays reaching the Earth.
When a cosmic ray does, the Earth's upper atmosphere can act like a 'cloud chamber' that generates a stream of condensed water as a cosmic ray passes through it. That can help produce very high (and usually thin) clouds that can reduce the heat reaching the Earth's surface. The most concerning impact that solar hibernation has caused, has been to allow polar air to escape that region and break out far south and damage and kill crops. My understanding is that the jet streams tend to wander farther from the poles, and closer to the equator then; and that influences some of the mixing of the air as the 'stream' circles the Earth.
A video made about 4 years ago showing the process a Ukranian born lady Professor raised under the Russia's Soviet Union, now in England that had her come to understand the Sun's internal cycles enough that very predictive computer usable formulas that closely matched historic records say that after 2020 the temperatures will start dropping and the low will be in 2028 through 2032. [Jump to about 44 minutes in after finding
Professor Valentina Zharkova: The Solar Magnet Field and the Terrestrial Climate
on TH-cam.]
@@gregmellott5715 wow I hope you copied and pasted all that from some loonie website somewhere and not had to write it all yourself
@@deanfowles3707 Don't think it was intended as nonsense, bro.
I absolutely love the discussion and the way it is organized. This video articulates my beliefs in the entire climate change discussion. Every time I ask someone on the climate activist side of the discussion, how much of this climate change will actually affect the planet and humanity, they immediately go into the political talking points. Not a single person can point to any reliable scientific study or expert that has a verified data model or long terms study that can put their point into a measurable outcome. Kudos.
You need to hang out with a better-informed crowd, Garret. Sea level has risen 4 inches since 1993, according to NASA, NOAA, the U.S. Geological Survey and the World Meteorological Organization, and the rate of rise has doubled since then. Both satellite altimeter data from NASA and worldwide tide gauges agree on the numbers. Two different methodologies, same numbers. According to NOAA, high tide flooding along the American south and Gulf coasts has risen 400% and 1100% respectively since the year 2000. Even the northeast, which is uprising land from glacial rebound, is up 140%. It's why Houston, Louisiana and New York have a combined $100 billion in flood mitigation projects in the works.
Hurricane intensity has increased 8% per decade for the last forty years, according to NOAA. A Taiwanese study of typhoons shows the same increase. The cost directly attributable to climate change for Hurricane Harvey alone has been pegged at $67 billion.
Heatwaves have tripled since 1960, according to the EPA.
Marine heatwaves are up 20-fold, according to the University of Bern.
While CO2 can help plants grow, the warming that accompanies it has just the opposite effect, which is why farm productivity dropped 21% since the 1960s, according to Cornell University. (Luckily we made up for the loss with advanced farming techniques and better hybrids.)
Extreme precipitation events are increasing worldwide, according to the IPCC. Atmospheric rivers take away moisture from dry areas and make them more prone to drought, which is also invcreasing worldwide.
Wildfire seasons have expanded by over a month, according to the U.S. Forest Service, with burn acreage increasing year by year. (Note that wildfire graphs from early in the 20th century include intentional burns, making it appear as if there were more fires a century ago. 20th century and 21st century data can't be compared for that reason.)
Tick and mosquito-borne diseases have increased 60% worldwide, due solely to warming. Even flesh-eating bacteria has expanded its range, from its start in Florida to as far north as Massachusetts today.
According to a UN bulletin, the number of major environmental disasters from 2000-2020 nearly doubled from the previous 20-year span.
Are you gonna reply to the comment above? The earth will be fine, us….not so much.
Science is about questioning knowledge to see what might be the best approach to truth, not about conforming opinions.
In this sense, I am always happy to hear a different opinion on a subject, even if I would personally disagree on certain points or aspects.
In this sense, thank you very much for presenting a scientific opinion besides the ideologized climate mainstream.
As a retired science teacher I thank you both for this podcast. This needs to go to the masses misled by the politicians and the media.
We learned more accurate science in 1963 JR High School. 2. you should have low IQ kids in their own class. My God.
More people need to find out about the documentary The Dimming ! I've been saying for a decade the sun burns more then usual, there are no regular yearly periods, just winter and summer and both are "downpowered", we have massive fires for the past 15 years as well, increase of skin cancer and respiratory issues. More people need to find out about it ASAP!
Read about whi funds this guy
Why does Jordan Peterson only ever do interviews with fossil fuel industry representatives?
@Gary Sarela old ones too. This guy has been outed as a shill for oil almost 20 years ago. He even argued smoking didn't really cause lung cancer. Total clown
Lindzen is so modest and mild mannered. Always pleasant and thoughtful in every interview. I doubt he's ever experienced not being the smartest guy in the room.
Toss up between Dr Linzen and Dr Peterson as to who is the smartest, but who cares I could have listened to them both all night. The way Dr Peterson allowed Dr Lindzen to speak and held back himself to hear what Dr Lindzen had to say, is a piece of education that many should heed today.
@nick Shannon you need to productive to be proven wrong.
Peterson in increasingly building an echo chamber.
@@user-ys2wc5od6r this is his format and the contrarian product his audience wants. Might be other motivations rather than any purist "truth seeking".
I just re-watched this ep in order to share this with some alarmists. Thanks jp for giving this highly knowledgeable and experienced man a platform. 😊
Lindzen is completely debunked in the scientific literature, which you can see for yourself at CLIMATE MISINFORMATION BY SOURCE: RICHARD LINDZEN, at the Skeptical Science website. 22 of his own MIT colleagues publicly refute his views at CLIMATE CONTRARIAN GETS FACT-CHECKED BY MIT COLLEAGUES. Lindzen admitted in a Harper's magazine interview years agao that he took money from the fossil fuel industry. It is documented that he has taken payments from OPEC, Western Fuels and Peabody Energy.
Fascinating discussion. Thank you for hosting these dialogues. Please keep probing both sides of this debate to find our best understanding behind the nuance! Please can you get a climate change proponent on to debate this too. Also would love to learn more about how the Tropics and Not-Tropics (sorry missed the word) weather/climate patterns interact, and understand the water vapour dynamics and the orbit angle - essentially what are the major factors that affect temperature change, and the orders of magnitude between CO2 and orbit angle - was fascinating part I’d love to hear and understand more of. That will help society understand likely weather extremes and bg what we could do to prepare and protect ourselves from them.
Peterson presents only climate denialists, not anyone from the scientific consensus, which is confirmed by no less than ELEVEN different studies and publicly endorsed by 80 academies of science. He does the world no favors by barricading himself behind his fortress of confirmation bias and bowing to his very obvious tribal loyalties.
@thomwhiffen4867 There is no debate & this problem we face points to why Obvious Truths should never be debated. You should never let obvious truths be questioned. I'm not sure how old you are or how long you've paid attention to this topic but we have already went through several rounds of Predictions & Solutions that have been proven false & enough is enough. I hear al these people talking about "Virtue" while the real injustices that occur from the fear mongers policies go unnoticed.
I worked with this man for some years, but he was in a totally different league to anything I could offer. His research is so immense and in depth, to a point he is at a level that no scientist I have ever met could come close to matching. He is undoubtedly one of the greatest scientists of this era.
Can you tell us some more about your cooperation so that nobody thinks you are just a troll?
@@tomaszgolba5077 what do you want to know?
@@TheMarathonomahos what was the nature of your collaboration with Dr. Lindzen? What did you work on together?
What do you think about the hypothesis that the climate problem really comes from the reversal of terrestrial magnetism? And the possible fact that there will be a few years with zero magnetism, in which the earth will be subjected to the deadly solar winds... This is exposed in a book from French physicist Paul de Métairy.
@@tomaszgolba5077 Stop looking in the mirror.
“Average global temperature? I don’t even know how to calculate the average temperature of this room!”
- Freeman Dyson, Nobel Prize Laureate in Physics
I am absolutely fascinated by Dr Lindzen's brilliance, total lack of ego and his wonderful ability to gently laugh at the choosing of those to remain ignorant in order to not admit error, ergo their desire to preserve ego over truth. One of my favorite interviews.
Lindzen has been roundly debunked in the scientific literature and by his own fellow MIT professors. Always seek rebuttals before believing anyone.
@@swiftlytiltingplanet8481 since he's been "roundly debunked" it should be easy to cite some examples of this "debunking". Go ahead I'd like to read them, since I'm seeking rebuttals... And do do the "find it yourself" stunt. Don't hide!
Lindzen lies in Peterson face. At 56:40 Lindzen lies or reveals such an ignorance that I am amazed he got an undergraduate degree in physics. Lindzen claims that, in general, a system with a large number of degrees of freedom cannot behave, suddenly, like a system with few degrees of freedom. FALSE. It is called phase transitions. Then Peterson asks if these things have been studied. Lindzen lies again to cover his first lie. For me that is the end. It has nothing to do with climate change but with a scientist lying to a non-expert to win his point.
I am also a physicist. I know zero about climate change. But I know about phase transitions and their existence. You cannot get an undergraduate degree in physics or chemistry without knowing this.
I cannot stand a person who lies to a non-expert to convince him/her. He is clearly a BS-er of the worse kind.
Do not trust me. Please look at Ising Model for example. A magnet with nearly an infinite degrees of freedom can suddenly change its behavior at a critical temperature. At 57:35 about, Lindzen lets Peterson utter a falsehood and doubles down.
He is a liar. Period.
I have some swampland in florida for you. Never underestimate the lack of thinking skills of the american public.
@@barnespiper1133I looked for it quick, and found two articles. One was from a site called inside climate news which tells the story of some of his colleagues at MIT disagreeing with (not debunking) him. However, they did not give any evidence for their claims, rather just trotting out the usual party line. The other is a site called Skeptical science claiming Linzden is putting out misinformation and is a climate denier, again, no evidence provided to show why the climate emergency is real.
This intervew was inspiring. As a geography and climatology student myself, I can't express how well Dr Lindzen explained the main issues in the feild. Especially the misinterpretation of the data that we have. I have immense respect for him.
@@dh8834 Strange analogy: an amplifier is needed for a speaker to produce a sound - a volume dial is not needed at all, in fact it just enables to regulate the amplification down. Without a volume dial the speaker would blast as loud as the amplifier would allow it.
100%. He's a brilliant man.
@@dh8834 Forbes is not a scientific publication. It is a common newspaper, which typically means it is an outlet for propaganda. Journalists are typically underqualified to apply quality critical thinking to scientific subjects, even if they want to. So they just write what they are told to write.
They are coning after this guy simply for speaking the truth it's scary times that we are living in
@jaykanta4326 while attacking his credibility, you offer nothing to disprove him or argue for an opposing view
The matrix is making a move!!!
@jaykanta4326 ...more like you can‘t disprove him because you lack the skills to do so...
@@curiousfurious5877 you hit the nail on the head there. Lindzen would tear Jay a new one, and he/she knows it!
Jay is capable of producing hot air about Lindzen.... But that's about it.
@@jaykanta4326 You said "you sound violent" to this: "These forces are eternal, the tyrants are simply emboldened & are calling the good to arise and cut them down to size". True. So, what is your problem exactly? Lack of cognitive ability? Illiteracy? If you think those words sound "violent" you really do have my pity, you poor soul.
As someone who’s first language isn’t English, I appreciate the clarity Dr. Richard speaks with.
Thank you Jordan for such an informative and educational segment, I ecspecialy liked your commentary explaining dr. Richard.
It's been incredible to hear rational discourse about this incredibly complex topic. It did blow my mind how calm Dr. Linden was and the ease of explaining all of this. Thank you for this!!
i get what you're saying, however, regardless of complexity, NO ONE is going to control weather and climate or climate and weather on Earth. it's a waste of time issue. the issue is understanding our environment and adapting as need be in terms of infrastructure and where we live.
@@nickshannon7442 Harvard educated and MIT professor of atmospheric physics?
Yeah...i think it's fair. to say he's credible.
@@nickshannon7442 do you always put words in other people’s mouths?
And did you watch and LISTEN to this podcast. Yes, I would say he has MUCH MORE credibility. But you didn’t listen to the podcast and do your homework before spouting a weak straw man.
@@RobertMJohnson Richard lintzen takes fossil fuel industry money in exchange for lies. Look it up. He's like Jordan Peterson. Rotten to the core
@@BeautifuLakesStreamsBiologists Richard lintzen takes heaps of fossil fuel industry money but ok
Gotta love the respect and admiration he has for his guests. It is very wholesome and largely what makes these conversations so interesting
SOmehow after some of Jordan's idiot responses, I don't think the feeling is mutual. "Jordan "What do you think of my line of logic?" Prof Lindzen, "Not much".....😆"
Jordan is one of the best interviewers I've ever seen. He prepares thoroughly and works from notes, but also lets the conversation move into unplanned territory. Best of all, when he himself has an idea which he feels is important he may start to express it, but if the interviewee interrupts his line of thought, he just stops cold. He is very cautious to interrupt, but generous in being interrupted. Many prominent TV interviewers could learn from this.
@@stephenhosking7384 Did you just come?
Some online videos are better than others.
About climat or semantics ...
Thank You, a real breath of fresh air.
What an awesome, clear discussion. Dr lindzer is wonderful at explaining, and Dr Peterson is the perfect interviewer.
I used to program surface modeling software for the oil industry. Geologists often did not like the results the computer program produced because it only took into account mathematical information and did not incorporate any understanding of geology in building the models. I took it upon myself to prove them wrong and devised a methodology that would allow geologic information to be incorporated. In the process I learned that you can cook data with a computer program to produce any results that you like. Everything depends upon the amount and accuracy of the data you input and, most especially, the assumptions you impose on how the data is handled. Weather models are notoriously difficult to program successfully. We can project current weather data into, at most, only a few days into the future. I regard climate models as clever fantasies at best. The assumptions going in to the climate models have far more influence on the outcome than the data.
You may want to look into the IPCC raw temperature data for incorporating into the climate models. It’s an interesting process as the temp data is automatically rejected and replaced with a number more in line with the model program. Never is any mention of verification of the instrument that records the data.
In short order, I stopped being "busy" while listening to your conversation, gentlemen ... heartfelt thanks for the breath of fresh air, the education, and the insights ( shared on fb, hope others will, too)
I really appreciate that Dr Peterson was humble when he interrupted his guest. I really like what he has to say but I think interruption is so rude and unhelpful, so it is wonderful to see him do his best to catch himself when he talks over and to allow his guest to finish. Thank you for all your hard work on these difficult topics Dr Peterson and for being open to growth even at your level, it’s admirable.
Thank you integrity and honesty needs to be nurtured.
Lindzen was literally the 'guy who wrote the book' on the atmosphere when I was in graduate school.
Lindzen was literally the guy who took money from Tobacco industry and lie to public saying it is safe to smoke, he is doing the same on climate now.
@@Frozenkex 🤣
Hats of to Richard Lindzen! This is pure gold hitting a wide audience. Bless you!
And Kudos to Jordan for giving him room to explain.
What's pure gold is what the fossil fuel industry pays him to say all this garbage
@@deanfowles3707 How much are you paid to make stupid statements or do you do it from simple stupidity.
@@greglee4016 it's OK I'm not trying to win over sad old farts like yourself anyway. What would be the point? But people more my own age can look it up, Richard lintzen is funded by Peabody Energy, a coal Company. And Jordan Petersons daily wire is funded by the wilks brothers, fracking billionaires. All are corrupt and rotten to the core
@@deanfowles3707 Can you provide any evidence that the fossil fuel industry is paying him? Let's see it. You can't can you? You need to adjust your tin foil hat.
Peterson only talks to people that support his own narrative. An honest, unbiased conversation requires someone to push back on Peterson's view on the subject. There is no friction in this discussion, therefore it is itself bias and effectively Propaganda.
I could listen to Lindzen all day! Fascinating man... and I believe him.
Thanks for giving dr. Lindzen a platform to express himself. Keep up the good work!
It would have been the responsible thing for Jordan to tell us how egregiously debunked Lindzen is among climate scientists, including his own MIT colleagues in the atmospheric sciences.
@@swiftlytiltingplanet8481The fact that many scientists do not approve something, it doesn’t mean that the proponent of a particular theory is wrong, that is actually a not valid assessment. As the majority’s approval doesn’t mean one is right.
Thank you so much Jurdan for letting this man speak to the crowd. Been following him for years and he is a brilliant man ❤
❤
Dr Richard Lindzen ‘s explanation of the Corollas effect @ 48:00 is spot on, as a pilot I study weather and that is exactly how the system works..
Hes a meteorologist😂, if he got that wrong itd be horrendous
@T Bone But it's "coriolis", not corollas!!! 😂😂 How come you don't know how to spell what you purport to know something about? 🤔
yeah i love corona effect too. ive been a pilot for several years and really love how beer can change weather patterns. that's why i drink while i fly
@@IveGotAHondaFifty Lindzen got it all wrong.
@@WebHubbleTelescope explain how.
Wow, I didn’t realize George Costanza was so knowledgeable!! Lol
Great podcast btw. Incredible watching two brilliant minds!
What an intelligent and wise man! I wish Dr Lindzen would publish a book on climate science which is pitched at first year university level. In other words a book which the intelligent layman could read and those with a scientific training could by brought up to speed with what is really going on with the climate. Such texts are difficult to find.
The last person we need to publish a book on climate change is Richard Lindzen. He's part of the 0.1% who reject the 99.9% consenus and is profoundly debunked in the scientific literature.
This is one of the best and most informative videos that I’ve had the pleasure of seeing in a long time. It shows the importance of critical thinking and the detriment of very important issues due to intimidation, power and money. This kind of thinking is more or less lost on our current generations.
He's just a silly old man.
Pro tip: Jordan is a charlatan, and you're being had.
@@cluelessbeats Dr lindsen is a shill.
@@hulagu896 And what are you? A gamer? Burger flipper? No real skills at all? You won`t survive what`s directly ahead. You`ve probably never grown a vegetable, gathered eggs, hunted, camped, gathered wild foods, or fished, and I can almost guarantee you know nothing about what to buy to build an off grid solar power system. But you likely preach about it. We need a cleansing. Useless bigots like you are in real trouble. You don`t deserve what`s been handed to you by great men.
@@baneverything5580 haha, never assume. I'm a farmer and I was raised doing all the things you hold dear. I was born in 1948.
Ahh JP!! I'm sitting here on a heating pad with terrible kidney stones and this made my day better!❤️
Hoping for your speedy recovery.
I've had several kidney stones throughout my life the last 2 kidney stones my urologist. She said they will pass she was able to x-ray them to make sure they were small enough to pass. It took a month and a week for them to pass one the most excruciating months in my life far as pain. I was able to get them to pass by taking the shower nozzle off then turn on as much heat as I could bear that was the trick the pressure from the shower pulsating on my lower back with the hot water was successful. Just thought I would pass it along. Hope you start feeling better.
Hello! I suggest that you make some recherche on “Chanca Piedra” for this problème
why u got kidney stones?
get well soon
Thank you, Jordan, for your promotion of critical thinking and scientific method and your rejection of the denizens of misinformation.
What a breath of fresh air. And what a crazy world we live in.
What Mr. Peterson and Dr Lindzen both fail to mention are the ongoing climate engineering operations.
I encourage you to watch the documentary the Dimming on youtube. It exposes climate engineering operations, and what we are not being told from any side of the fence regarding our climate.
This is one of the best interviews I have ever seen and more of this needs to be on the internet to explain the world
Paul, I was thinking the same thing. Well said.
Thank you both for having this important discussion. I left science in the early 80's for the very reason you folks were talking about. The professor I was working under spent close to 70% of his time seeking money for his lab. This man was a leader in remote sensing who could get pretty much anything he wrote published, but his time was so taken up by "begging for money" as he called it that he thought he was doing well to publish once a year. Even this early, it was also relatively easy to see that the money would only come in if the topic of the research was something the publication wanted done. I was fortunate enough to have a marketing skill that transferred into technology from biology as I was working on ecosystem modeling and programming was something I had been doing since my early college days (in the 1970's).
Did you work for Steve Running?
And I was taking psychology some of the students had to tie in their psychological research with climate even if the research had nothing to do with what we where researching.
We still need people like you, though, in the field of biology. I wouldn’t dare fault you for the decision you made, please don’t take it as such. I’m sure you are a very healthy contributor to society in the tech realm. We need people with a conscience and strong moral compass in every field, especially where major controversies like this arise.
What do you do now?
After an hour of this oh so intellectual mental masturbation, I concluded skeptics of global warming and catastrophic climate change would be satisfied with the interview for questioning the theory as insufficiently proven, therefore unfounded. Humanity must certainly adapt to predictable disasters brought on by the changing climate, so perhaps the conversation should center around that fact.
Outstanding! Thank you.
Could listen to Richard talk all day. Well spoken and to the point.
Dr. Richard Lindzen is one smart and hilarious person!
I've been following Dr Lindzen for years and this is by far the best interview of him I have seen.
It's a shame that the master debunkers usually choose some random youtube demagogue as the face of the opposition instead of someone like him. It's much easier to ridicule people who are actually stupid than to engage with someone qualified. There are indeed many counterpoints to the arguments he makes, but it's bizarre that they're now accepted as received wisdom instead of a premises to be accepted or rejected. JP is doing a good job of picking people making rational arguments instead of hand-waving.
I love JBP for his ability to ask good questions. He is probably the best interviewer I have ever seen.
Yes, isn't this wonderful?
@@laststand6420
Intelligence + being relatively informed
Peterson's ability to recognize instantly that there's going to be a disconnect for people in understanding, like with how impressive a repertoire is or the implications brought up by theories, is so impressive to me and I wish I had that ability.
Sadly he doesn't notice Dr Lindzen's sleight of hand concerning "average temperatures". Nor did you, I guess.
@@PeterOzanne You dont understand how averages work is what you're saying then because Dr Lindzen explained it 🤣
@@PeterOzanne let's discuss it. What part do you believe is incorrect or misleading?
@@kevinkanzler495 Reminder on this Peter
@Peter Ozanne As per the previous post can you explain what the sleight of hand was
Excellent content.
This was incredibly interesting. Thank you to both men for sharing this conversation.
You’re such a good listener Jordan. You’re demonstrating such an amazing ability to gain knowledge and understanding of a subject which is not your primary discipline simply by concentrating on what is being described to you by a lifelong scholar. Surely it is impossible to gain knowledge without listening to a teacher. As long as current teaching practices at school persist there is zero chance of children gaining knowledge.
Dear god everyone in this comments section sounds like a YEC
@@tennicksalvarez9079 ? thats bad?
Kids learn at an extremely fast pace, right up until they enter the school system, where they are instructed, learn basic concepts and all of it is slowed down drastically.
@@tennicksalvarez9079 what’s a YEC please?
@@andykelly7367 "Young Entrepreneur Council" perhaps?
I hope this will be conveyed to Dr. Lindzen, as some hope regarding my generation. I am 27. As a part of my schooling I was once asked to sign a proto-DEI agreement regarding the use of the word "retard". I was 15 at the time. I objected on the grounds that while I felt for the mentally disabled, it was a hindrance to free speech and ultimately accomplished nothing to alleviate any hypothetical harm they were being caused. I later found out that I was the only student in the school of about 1200 who had not signed it. Since then, the knowledge of social tampering has become abundantly clear. Far from being alone, I have met several dozen other people over the years who similarly refuse to write what they don't believe. Of note is that most of them are in the armed forces. I hope this knowledge will give you some hope for future generations. I and many others aim to bear the weight of truth and civilization as you and billions before you have.
Are they southern, by chance?
@@roninkraut6873 Probably here in California. We are more backwards than one might assume.
You aren't alone, Michael
Lol...way to go retard...🤣
@@Mr196710
Refusing to play along with things you don’t believe is not “backwards.” Because I mentioned Southern is what made you think that, right? I ask because the south is where most of our warriors come from historically.
Amazing interview, all this change my mind. Thank you.
What Mr. Peterson and Dr Lindzen both fail to mention are the ongoing climate engineering operations.
I encourage you to watch the documentary the Dimming on youtube. It exposes climate engineering operations, and what we are not being told from any side of the fence regarding our climate.
I am just glad that the 100s videos showing the ice glaciers melting aren’t anything to worry about !!! Whew! Thank you for making me feel better!
Right? Sea level up four inches since 1992? No worries! Heatwaves tripled since the 1960s? No worries! Hurricane intensity up 8% per decade? No worries! The summer of 2023 the warmest in over 100,000 years? No worries!
There was a giant glacier over all of Canada and northern US, 2 miles thick 18,000.00 years ago. Where did all that ice go????
@@swiftlytiltingplanet8481can you tell me all those same conditions you mentioned in 1575, or 628 BC. You can’t. Proxies don’t make reality. 70 years of climate observations don’t predict the future!
DR. JP, I've waited almost a year to hear you speak next month in Ohio! You have no idea how excited I am. I signed up for a "meet and greet" and I'm so scared and nervous. It's so weird to finally meet your personal hero: a person who's been such a massive influence and source of direction in your life, who you genuinely admire.
I'll be wearing my lobster dress shirt from your website and my room will be clean (as always).
Happy New Year Dr. Peterson. I'm optimistic that 2023 is going to be great for all of us.
you are great! this comment made me have a smile. thanks for making my evening and happy new year.
@@emil_rainbow seems a bit personal even more so than the OP for some reason 🤔
@@emil_rainbow prob limitless paths but a fork in rbe road comes to mind … you can choose to let it define you or you can choose to brake that cycle .. it will be hard and damn near impossible and in no way fair in comparison but this is whwre your choice comes in …
@@emil_rainbow define child
@@emil_rainbow they don’t get to choose the root cause that brought on their calamity but at some point they will have the oppurtunity
This guy is one of the most humble academics I've ever heard speak. His response when JBP credits his volume of publications was unreasonably modest.
Absolutely excellent discussion by two intellectually accomplished individuals.
Here's a quote directly from an IPCC report which neatly compliments Lindzen's conclusions, "The climate system is a coupled non-linear chaotic system, and therefore the long-term prediction of future climate states is not possible."
Cheers.
Jordan knows nothing about climate science and Lindzen is roundly debunked in the scientific literature and publicly refuted by 22 of his fellow MIT professors.
@@swiftlytiltingplanet8481 How can a person be debunked?
Hello Dr. Peterson. I’m just a humble retired geologist.
When I question modern climate change scientists, I use the Phanerozoic climate change graphs.
I find it useful for putting the ‘hockey stick graph’ into perspective, for pointing out Earths average temperature, where most life evolved, and then for moving onto the natural process of species extinction (including us - and the benefit for the planet).
I’ve not had a single sensible answer from anyone yet.
What is the point of comparing the ancient Phanerozoic with the modern Phanerozoic? Natural forces were at work in the ancient past that aren't at work with us today. We are in a time period where rocks are absorbing CO2. Yet the hockey stick temperature rise from combusted fossil fuels is melting the icecaps, raising sea levels, elevating storm surges, intensifying hurricanes, reducing farm productivity (yes, reducing), and increasing heatwaves, marine heatwaves, ocean acidification, extreme precipitation events, droughts and wildfires.
"We are not here to fight for yesterday; we are here to fight for tomorrow!"