There was a joke in the Soviet Navy : "How can you tell a Northern Fleet sailor? He glows in the dark". Like most jokes like this, it had more than a few grains of truth
In the summer of 1989, we detected 2 Echo II Soviet subs "out-chopping" the Mediterranean Sea, on an intercept course for our carrier battle group. I was an aircrew AW onboard the SH-3H Sea King helicopter off of the USS Coral Sea. These subs concerned us for 2 reasons: first, they both carried anti-carrier SS-N-3a "Shaddock" missiles; the second reason was that they were operating on diesel engines (normally auxiliary engines to their nuclear reactors), using much quieter batteries when submerged. They may have been having problems with their nuclear reactors at the time, but we never found out why they were running diesels. We could hear them when snorkeling or on the surface; but when under battery power only, they were extremely difficult to detect, and extremely dangerous.
This was published in March 2020, all Sub Brief lectures, research notes, and thousands of photos can be found at patreon.com/subbrief Also, forgive my dyslexia. On some of the slides, I transpose numbers verbally. When in doubt, go with the value on the screen, not what I say.
I get that Russian seems counter-intuitive for an english-speaking person, but "kasatka" is pronounced like "cah-sat-cah" and means "orca". Kudos for the video! Edit: oh and Razboinik (Robber) bay is actually Strelok bay around Putjatin island
Jive, I was wondering if I could join the crew. I’m a Patreon member, 10-year veteran of the U.S. Air Force on active duty, a Bachelors Degree in Aircraft Technology and served as a Quality Assurance Supervisor as a civilian for the USAF for several more years. I love the channel and would be honored to be welcomed aboard!
Nuclear historians say that corium has been made 5 times outside of a lab, 3 Mile Island, Chernobyl and the 3 times at Fukishima. After watching this sub brief something tells me the soviet military made it at least that many times and perhaps even earlier than the indecent at 3 mile island.
Ha! And the irony is not lost when you need the sub to provide pier-side power to the hospital that is caring for all the dying sailors from the sub...
@40:15/re: K-22 I was one of the pilots of a Sigonella, Sicily based P-3C on station when this collision occurred. We were working with the USS Voge (pronounced Vogee) and another frigate conducting coordinated ASW operations on (read between the lines). I remember it like it was today. There were side stories to this that were truly bizarre but that is for another conversation. Here is the paraphrased reporting by the Voge radio operator as best as I remember: "A submarine has partially surfaced and we are in the process of ID'ing it"..."Its sail is partially awash and has been identified as the Echo II"...."The Echo II is turning about and seems to be on a collision course"...."Mayday, mayday, mayday, the Echo II has rammed our port aft." By the time we arrived on scene utilizing military power to give us the best speed, the Echo had pulled its plug and was no longer visible but its telltale swirl still visible. The Voge by this time was turning in counter clockwise circles having had its rudder & port screw taken out and leaving a trail of diesel fuel. We were ate the very end of our on-station time and had to depart at this time. But our relieving P-3 apparently got some photos after the CO of the soviet sub decided that being submerged for one reason or another was not a good idea. But getting back to those photos, we were never able to see them because they became highly classified...for some reason...and as how classification works, its a combination of level of classification and "need to know". Although all of the officers on the crew had the requisite Top Secret clearance, I guess there was "no need to know" by the only flight crew that was on-station during this incident.
Thanks Aaron! I binge watched the entire briefing and thoroughly enjoyed every second. Thanks for all the hard work that went into creating this episode.
Fell off the blocks😂😂😂🤔. Massive respect for all submariners, but especially the Russians. After the enemy sub failed to kill them they could always count on their own sub to have a go as well. May all those lost rest in peace. 🌹
Interesting to think that my brother may actually have heard many of these boats with his own ears, he was a sonar technician on the Nautilus, Patrick Henry and George Washington during the 70's & 80's.
very common for Kruschev era and early Brezhnev era equipment. Quality and safety were considered far less important than were (paper) capabilities and sheer size and numbers. The same pattern can be seen in pretty much every major piece of Soviet hardware from the era. Combined with the tendency of the Soviet system as a whole to cover up problems by everyone up and down society because nobody wanted to be the person carrying bad news and ending up being blamed for the bad news and sent to the Gulag, and you've a lot of accidents waiting to happen. Which is how so many accidents started happening due to hardware failure in the late 1970s onward. Maintenance was shabby, lack of training and low morale were common, machinery was failing left and right because of all that and lack of spare parts. To a degree we're seeing the same for the last several years in the US armed forces, though there it's mostly because they're so overextended they're incapable of performing the maintenance and training required to operate safely.
The attitudes of the Russian military and government has always "not given a damn" about their people. Always a shitty country with regards to their citizens. Never changes...
@@nahyeahwhatsahandle They were in some fields, mainly because we'd become complacent and stopped funding research into many things in order to fund more "social programs". As a result western tech pretty much lingered at mid-1970s levels until the mid-1990s while Soviet and Chinese tech kept improving. The main things communists have always been superior in are propaganda and mass murder, and they still are. Everything else they were "superior" in they mostly were because they managed to steal western technology and adapt in in new and unexpected ways.
Many people get that scared look when I talk of being on one of the 41 for Freedom boats in the early 70s. Most of them ask how many accidents did you have and were you scared to go on deployment. My standard reply was, "Hey, I wasn't on a Russian boat!"
Im not particularly familiar with "freedom boats" , what exactly are they and what would cause people to have grave concern for their crew? Figured someone who says they served on one would be a good person to ask. Lol
After a hurricane ravaged the Hawaiian island of Kauai, a Pearl Harbor based 688 sub was used to jump start the primary power plant for the island after repairs. It needed to have power for pumps and instrumentation, and the sub provided it. Tax dollars at work!! Mahalo, USN.
1:33:55 So the K-10 hits and sinks some Chinese sub but the K-10 didn't detect them on sonar at all? Color me biased but I wouldn't think a Chinese 80's period submarine would be some super slooth stealthboy but maybe I am wrong. Or maybe the sonarman was tapping into the vodka ration a little early that day.
Could the Chinese boat have been a diesel boat on batteries. Even a Chinesium one should be less noisy than an Echo transiting on nuke power, and well, as he said early on, the Echo II had an archaic sonar system, even for when they were commissioned, let alone the 80s
I absolutely love these Subbriefs of yours. I´m more into German WW2 U-Boats, especially the late war versions like the VII-C/41, IX-D2 etc that were deployed submerged the entire trip with their new snorkels and homing torpedoes and a truly massive leap forward in Hydrophone design (the hydrophone was literally a huge ´balcony´ sticking out by 1945, and they called it the ´Balkongerät´ which means Balcony Machine hehe) and these early nuclear boats nicely fill the gap between 1945 and the later all-nuclear, teardrop hulled boats we know today. Keep this up! Regards, Thomas
I watched your video to see if you addressed the collision with the USS Voge. You did. Thank you, since I had squadron-mates on the helo-detachment aboard. However, I want to correct something that the Soviets claimed - that the Voge didn't get out of the way of K-22. The international treaty known as the "COLLREGS" - which is designed to prevent collisions between ships on the high-seas - clearly puts the burden on an over-taking vessel to avoid the other vessel. So, it was the sub commander's responsibility to keep from colliding. In fact, the law actually states that the "stand-on vessel" - the American ship - is required to keep to a constant course & speed during this maneuver. So, as usual, the Russians lied. Kind of normal for them.
I bet one Echo 2 captain actually said the following: We will hide off their Atlantic coast and listen to their "rock n roll" while we conduct missile drills. Then we will go to Cuba, where the weather is warm, and the company warmer."
Extra pay. Plus you might get lucky and be on one of the "not exciting" deployments. There's a reason so many Russians have a fatalistic view of the world.
Thank you Capt Jive! I was a naval contractor for Tri-star engineering 03 to 06 out of Bremerton Washington naval shipyard. Worked on the USS Sacramento AOE , USS Rainier AOE, USS Roosevelt and the USS Seawolf etc. We Installed the I.P.D.S system. The system would detect a chemical missile attack on the ship and protect navy personnel below deck.
Let's keep what seems to be a large amount of mercury in a glass bottle and keep it unsecured while underway on a nuclear submarine then tell no one that you broke it. Logic -100
Not sure if its been discussed but the mercury incident might have been cause by a large high amp rectifier rupturing. Its basically a giant resistor made of a glass vessel filled with mercury. I mean pound of mercury. Its the only thing i could think that would cause that ammount of contamination
Jive, you really threw me off with this video. You started saying tur-bine instead of tur-bin and I felt like a child losing their innocence. 😂♥️ Love your work man, thanks for these!
Wow, imagine poisoning a sub's crew from incompetence while hiding the initial spill. If they had just cleaned it up and put everything into a sealed container, they'd have zero cases of poisoning.
Good Lord Aaron! The Echo II class seems like a 50 year long fever dream of a nightmare. Sounds like the only response to being stationed on or fixing an Echo II is "Blyat".
Cannot express how much I love these videos. Literally the best thing to sit back and listen to while driving and always love to learn something new. Keep up the good work man!
Same here. They also help me fall asleep. I've always have a hard time falling asleep ever since I was a baby. It's been actual years since I've slept more than 5 and a half hours. It's like clock work. I need to do a sleep study and should be analyzed by doctors bc no matter how long I stay up no matter how long I was at work no matter my exhaustion level my body physically can't sleep long than 5hrs and 30 min. I wish I could post screenshots of the sleep tracker on my phone to really put things into perspective but I usually only get 4 hours of sleep 5 and 1/2 is maximum.
@@followthegrow108 I'm similar. I use tramadol and it balances me out amazingly. Super addictive but it's changed my life, I still don't get huge amounts of sleep but the quality of life has dramatically improved.
@@snigie1 buy odsmt which is a slightly stronger analog of tramadol which is legal in all 50 states. Don't need a prescription or anything. I use it on days my back is really really hurting from work bc contrary to what you believe tamadol and it's analogs are greatly less addictive than other opioids i.e. oxycodone Roxycodone opana morphine fentynal codeine and heroin. All of which for the exception of Fent are pro drugs of morphine to begin with. Meaning once you take them your bodies enzymes convert them into morphine between 1 to 20 minutes. Kinda like how psilocybin is to psilocyin which is The actual chemical compound that makes you hallucinate. Look up odsmt. Very affordable and I know legal vendors/research pharmaceutical labs if youre interested. If not just read up on it!
Sevmash, highest quality shipyard in Russia, producing echo IIs with every problem possible. Amur; "this shipyard's quality of work is a lot lower than sevmash" Oh my.
Started watching for what I was thinking was 10 mins, but I had watched for over an hour! Very interesting and well presented. Will deff be watching more 👍
The long term storage location can be found by searching on google maps for Bukhta Razboynik. You can also see a floating drydock with a sagophaged submarine.
"Price! Are you there? The silo doors are opening on the sub! I repeat, the silo doors are opening on the sub!! Price come in! They're opening the silo doors on the sub!! Price, do you copy!? The silo doors are open! I repeat, the silo doors are open!! Wait....wait....wait.....Price! Noooo!!!"
49:40 Yeah K116. My father was in charge of Вч5. That's why I can call Kamchatka my home for the next ten years. And for the rest of my life, I was there in 2022 last time.
Great lecture as usual, thanks! I’ve been saving it till I had some proper time to sit down + watch ... has answered lots of questions I had about different bulges appearing on different subs. Fascinating... authoritative + entertaining as ever captain! Cheers
My favorite part was the non poisonous, working sub. Keep up the good work. Currently working through a Soviet sub addiction. Treating it with 1/350 kits
Seeing all those Sub-Briefs, I think I know what qualifies a soviet sub as Successful: Not trying to kill its crew on the job! @Sub Brief Are you aware of a russian counterpart of yours who covers the US Subs in Sub Briefs?
400km range, swarm missiles communicating with each other - looks good for me even for 21st. I wrote some software for a similar system in 90ths, but I did not know it existed so long ago. You know, nobody told me.
Didn't all the HENs Hotel, Echo, and November class subs all have a history of severe problems? Of course, the use used one reactor for a long time, and in both SSBNs and SSNs. If the P-6 only had a top speed of Mach.9 and flew at 7000 m it would be a pretty good target even in the mid-1960s. It would be an interesting battle if you think about it. Which would be more likely to fail? The P-6 or the AIM-7s, the AIM-9s the Tarter, Terrier, or Talos?. Now the P-500 was something to worry about.
I have a few questions. 1 what does the k stand for? 2 was the US or royal navy submarine force safer during this time with accidents especially nuclear accidents?
These subs are a good example why Soviets submariners were often awarded wartime medals just for operating their subs ;-) There were really risking their lives.
I'm not superstitious, but would their bad luck be attributed to the fact that the vessels "names" are just a number designations and not actual names?
I am so glad that my dad and I served on USN submarine service. I had no idea how bad the Russian submarines were, because I always thought that they were the cream of the crop. Be safe and be 😎
My country has just released a new submarine called S-81, I heard that the 80 had design flaws, could you make a video about this submarine? Yes, I know it is a lot to ask, but I would appreciate it even if you only mention some superficial details. Keep it up boss.
K-48 doctor reminded me old joke about definition of nothing: "0.5 litre of vodka for two men". But with high chances of it being "cleaning" or "medical" high proof alcohol, they may think that they have "just right for them".
Now I wanna know how many submarine nuclear accidents we've TRULY had. Was our stuff just simply better overall or are we perhaps better at hiding our failures?
robber would roughly be equal to razboinik bay, as razboinik would mean something like an outlaw, bandit or such. so im guessing its the same bay, just translated on one to english.
Hey Jive.. massive respect for ua hardwork..as I have seen almost all your videos..and I understand that you have encountered and heard lot of Soviet/russian subs..can pls make a video wherein you have encountered and Indian subs or seen or heard them while you wherein still commissioned! Plsssss!?
The number of unfunded trips to the drydock is staggering and as a result boats hang on for sometimes decades before defueling and becoming a three-compartment unit. At some point russian submarine and powerplant design will evolve to a reactor compartment that one can plugin a submarine into. Create a reactor compartment, crew it, and plug and play submarines for a few decades. Embrace what is and lean into it.
@Sub Brief Really interesting Video, thank you. I'm interested in your opinion on the requirement for surface attack. As far as I'm aware, NATO didn't have an anti shipping weapon with anywhere near the 300 mile range, so whilst the Echo's radar would be detected, it would have to be an jet aircraft to attack within even the 30 mins window, so if it wasn't a carrier group under attack, I think it would have been relatively safe, as the Helos carried by a Surface group wouldn't be able to prosecute an ASW search effectively that far out.
The CVBG had S3 Vikings onboard just in case there was an ESM hit from an Echo II. We had pretty good intel about what was operating in the Med and we always had Vikings airborne to conduct surface surveillance around the BG loaded with buoys so the chances were pretty good we would find him before he launched. Seeing how it had to surface to launch it made detection much easier.
Don’t forget about the one hull that had a different GR:R 10.89 vs. 10.98…I believe the “HEEN” class were the only DC boats ever produced. A function of how far ( little) Soviet nuclear propulsion programs had advanced when developed. These boats were notorious amongst the Soviet force for their rather sketchy reactor safety. That being said, the Soviet Navy was very innovative with many of their designs. I only recently learned that the “Tango” had an auto loader for their torps. Personally, I don’t think that the Echo II would have been very successful in its attacks. They might get a boat or two close enough to fire it’s missiles. But, they’d really be “telegraphing” their attacks with other assets like the Bear-D and surface ships. Interesting how their “Kotlin-class” DDs had SS-N-3 “Styx” launchers facing aft! They were often used as”tattle-trailers” on CVBGs…Always interesting to learn what our old adversaries did during the Cold War. Certainly would enjoy having beer and pizza with those guys some day! Former AW here SH-2F/SH-60F
It's amazing to listen to this - the soviets had so many nuclear issues with their submarines. They only got better because experience taught them better techniques in ship building and ship maintenance. How many Russian Nuclear submarines rest on the bottom of the seas spewing nuclear components into the sea and now China (of all country's) is going to build up their fleet. Does anyone else see the death of the oceans because of this third-world-nation's ambitions?
No, but we in Russia know that the first 2 accidents on nuclear submarines were in the United States and 2 times all the sailors on the boats were killed. Then these accidents also affected the USSR.
Can you imagine how boring would those videos be? "The sub was commissioned, it did x number of patrols, then it was decommissioned." No explosions, no melt-downs, no drunk sailors cpr-kissing, no surprise freon-asphyxiation, no rags inside the reactor loop...! The Russian fleet and ship yards did a terrible job, but it makes for a hell of a youtube video later on! :))
@@purpleldv966, Given what we know about the USN and their submarine force in particular, we can probably expect them to have a much better track record, but for the same reasons we can't discount the possibility that they have a much shorter but still extensive list of accidents that is still classified.
@@fluffly3606 So you think that all this info from the freaking USSR is available, but somehow the info on the US side is classified??!!! You're kidding me! Let's not gratify Russia with this tipe of brain-numb propaganda!
Very good. Thank You. Question? Is the soviet/russian nuclear surface navy as screwed up as the their submarine service was/still is? Poor workmanship in their construction, lousy quality control, poorly trained crews with lax attitudes, reactor failures etc... Any documentaries on them? That would be very interesting.
You followed the story of Admiral Kuznetsov? That carrier has been one disaster after another, the soviet nuclear powered ice breakers have had a bunch of accidents.
This is really incredible the number of nuclear "incidents" that occur on these soviet boats. I honestly had no idea it was this bad.
There was a joke in the Soviet Navy : "How can you tell a Northern Fleet sailor? He glows in the dark". Like most jokes like this, it had more than a few grains of truth
In the summer of 1989, we detected 2 Echo II Soviet subs "out-chopping" the Mediterranean Sea, on an intercept course for our carrier battle group. I was an aircrew AW onboard the SH-3H Sea King helicopter off of the USS Coral Sea. These subs concerned us for 2 reasons: first, they both carried anti-carrier SS-N-3a "Shaddock" missiles; the second reason was that they were operating on diesel engines (normally auxiliary engines to their nuclear reactors), using much quieter batteries when submerged. They may have been having problems with their nuclear reactors at the time, but we never found out why they were running diesels. We could hear them when snorkeling or on the surface; but when under battery power only, they were extremely difficult to detect, and extremely dangerous.
Sounds like some smart captain's. "Just shut down the reactors. Were safer running on the backup batteries."
@@navyreviewer also probably did not want some rare type of cancer in a few decades
@@testaccount4191 makes sense to me.
Sounds like they just wanted us to know they were there.
@@testaccount4191 "cancer is a capitalist myth" - soviet navy
This was published in March 2020, all Sub Brief lectures, research notes, and thousands of photos can be found at patreon.com/subbrief Also, forgive my dyslexia. On some of the slides, I transpose numbers verbally. When in doubt, go with the value on the screen, not what I say.
Cheers, mate! And thanks for the Aussie Future Gen Sub program and exposing the corruption. God, I hate Christopher Pyne.
I get that Russian seems counter-intuitive for an english-speaking person, but "kasatka" is pronounced like "cah-sat-cah" and means "orca".
Kudos for the video!
Edit: oh and Razboinik (Robber) bay is actually Strelok bay around Putjatin island
Master Chief, I'd be willing to do some proofing of your text stuff.
That shore-side electrical generation would have been very handy earlier this year in Texas
Jive, I was wondering if I could join the crew. I’m a Patreon member, 10-year veteran of the U.S. Air Force on active duty, a Bachelors Degree in Aircraft Technology and served as a Quality Assurance Supervisor as a civilian for the USAF for several more years. I love the channel and would be honored to be welcomed aboard!
Nuclear historians say that corium has been made 5 times outside of a lab, 3 Mile Island, Chernobyl and the 3 times at Fukishima. After watching this sub brief something tells me the soviet military made it at least that many times and perhaps even earlier than the indecent at 3 mile island.
The Soviets prolly made the stuff a couple of times a week...
@@jaanlepnurm😂😂😂
is ⁷
Soaking up Mercury with hand rags! Was the Dr on board called Leroy-ski?
I lol'd at the drunk doctor saving the drunk engineer.
So Russian!
I was expecting the sailors to have pored vodka on the reactor, blowing it up, or to have drank mercury in sted of vodka! :D
Ha! And the irony is not lost when you need the sub to provide pier-side power to the hospital that is caring for all the dying sailors from the sub...
@@widescreennavel 😁 yup indeed not lost.
@40:15/re: K-22 I was one of the pilots of a Sigonella, Sicily based P-3C on station when this collision occurred. We were working with the USS Voge (pronounced Vogee) and another frigate conducting coordinated ASW operations on (read between the lines).
I remember it like it was today. There were side stories to this that were truly bizarre but that is for another conversation.
Here is the paraphrased reporting by the Voge radio operator as best as I remember: "A submarine has partially surfaced and we are in the process of ID'ing it"..."Its sail is partially awash and has been identified as the Echo II"...."The Echo II is turning about and seems to be on a collision course"...."Mayday, mayday, mayday, the Echo II has rammed our port aft."
By the time we arrived on scene utilizing military power to give us the best speed, the Echo had pulled its plug and was no longer visible but its telltale swirl still visible. The Voge by this time was turning in counter clockwise circles having had its rudder & port screw taken out and leaving a trail of diesel fuel.
We were ate the very end of our on-station time and had to depart at this time. But our relieving P-3 apparently got some photos after the CO of the soviet sub decided that being submerged for one reason or another was not a good idea. But getting back to those photos, we were never able to see them because they became highly classified...for some reason...and as how classification works, its a combination of level of classification and "need to know". Although all of the officers on the crew had the requisite Top Secret clearance, I guess there was "no need to know" by the only flight crew that was on-station during this incident.
Thanks Aaron! I binge watched the entire briefing and thoroughly enjoyed every second. Thanks for all the hard work that went into creating this episode.
Fell off the blocks😂😂😂🤔. Massive respect for all submariners, but especially the Russians. After the enemy sub failed to kill them they could always count on their own sub to have a go as well. May all those lost rest in peace. 🌹
😂😂
Interesting to think that my brother may actually have heard many of these boats with his own ears, he was a sonar technician on the Nautilus, Patrick Henry and George Washington during the 70's & 80's.
The history of nuclear incidents with these subs is truly frightening.
very common for Kruschev era and early Brezhnev era equipment.
Quality and safety were considered far less important than were (paper) capabilities and sheer size and numbers.
The same pattern can be seen in pretty much every major piece of Soviet hardware from the era.
Combined with the tendency of the Soviet system as a whole to cover up problems by everyone up and down society because nobody wanted to be the person carrying bad news and ending up being blamed for the bad news and sent to the Gulag, and you've a lot of accidents waiting to happen.
Which is how so many accidents started happening due to hardware failure in the late 1970s onward. Maintenance was shabby, lack of training and low morale were common, machinery was failing left and right because of all that and lack of spare parts.
To a degree we're seeing the same for the last several years in the US armed forces, though there it's mostly because they're so overextended they're incapable of performing the maintenance and training required to operate safely.
The attitudes of the Russian military and government has always "not given a damn" about their people. Always a shitty country with regards to their citizens. Never changes...
"She's literally razor blades"... Radioactive razor blades!
@@nahyeahwhatsahandle They were in some fields, mainly because we'd become complacent and stopped funding research into many things in order to fund more "social programs".
As a result western tech pretty much lingered at mid-1970s levels until the mid-1990s while Soviet and Chinese tech kept improving.
The main things communists have always been superior in are propaganda and mass murder, and they still are.
Everything else they were "superior" in they mostly were because they managed to steal western technology and adapt in in new and unexpected ways.
@@jwenting that's bullshit lol
It's amazing that the pacific shipyard managed to put out a ship that didn't have a major system failure.
Many people get that scared look when I talk of being on one of the 41 for Freedom boats in the early 70s. Most of them ask how many accidents did you have and were you scared to go on deployment. My standard reply was, "Hey, I wasn't on a Russian boat!"
Im not particularly familiar with "freedom boats" , what exactly are they and what would cause people to have grave concern for their crew? Figured someone who says they served on one would be a good person to ask. Lol
After a hurricane ravaged the Hawaiian island of Kauai, a Pearl Harbor based 688 sub was used to jump start the primary power plant for the island after repairs. It needed to have power for pumps and instrumentation, and the sub provided it. Tax dollars at work!! Mahalo, USN.
Nearly two hours of pure enjoyment . More please.
10:46 "In 1969 she has her 1st nuclear incident..." - sounds like a milestone achived 😎
1:33:55 So the K-10 hits and sinks some Chinese sub but the K-10 didn't detect them on sonar at all? Color me biased but I wouldn't think a Chinese 80's period submarine would be some super slooth stealthboy but maybe I am wrong. Or maybe the sonarman was tapping into the vodka ration a little early that day.
Chinese Subs from 1970 where ducking orchestras underwater
Could the Chinese boat have been a diesel boat on batteries. Even a Chinesium one should be less noisy than an Echo transiting on nuke power, and well, as he said early on, the Echo II had an archaic sonar system, even for when they were commissioned, let alone the 80s
The Class Moto of the Echo 2:
“Wha hat happ’n waz!”
Always learn something new and fascinating. Your lectures are some of the most informative on TH-cam. Keep up the good work!
I absolutely love these Subbriefs of yours. I´m more into German WW2 U-Boats, especially the late war versions like the VII-C/41, IX-D2 etc that were deployed submerged the entire trip with their new snorkels and homing torpedoes and a truly massive leap forward in Hydrophone design (the hydrophone was literally a huge ´balcony´ sticking out by 1945, and they called it the ´Balkongerät´ which means Balcony Machine hehe) and these early nuclear boats nicely fill the gap between 1945 and the later all-nuclear, teardrop hulled boats we know today.
Keep this up!
Regards,
Thomas
Thank you so much for all of the hours you have entertained me.
Almost 2 hours of sub brief?!
Day, made.
I watched your video to see if you addressed the collision with the USS Voge. You did. Thank you, since I had squadron-mates on the helo-detachment aboard. However, I want to correct something that the Soviets claimed - that the Voge didn't get out of the way of K-22. The international treaty known as the "COLLREGS" - which is designed to prevent collisions between ships on the high-seas - clearly puts the burden on an over-taking vessel to avoid the other vessel. So, it was the sub commander's responsibility to keep from colliding. In fact, the law actually states that the "stand-on vessel" - the American ship - is required to keep to a constant course & speed during this maneuver. So, as usual, the Russians lied. Kind of normal for them.
I bet one Echo 2 captain actually said the following: We will hide off their Atlantic coast and listen to their "rock n roll" while we conduct missile drills. Then we will go to Cuba, where the weather is warm, and the company warmer."
Wrong type of missile
Love how these videos are on the patreon but I just keep forget to not be lazy and go there and watch them early.
Roll over, roll over, come on... ok roll over and i will give you some vodka! GOOD SUBMARINE!
On second thought, I don't want to be a Soviet Submariner in the 60s or 70s
First thought was driven by the vodka?
Extra pay. Plus you might get lucky and be on one of the "not exciting" deployments.
There's a reason so many Russians have a fatalistic view of the world.
well researched and perfectly narrated, thank you for this sub briefing!
Thank you Capt Jive! I was a naval contractor for Tri-star engineering 03 to 06 out of Bremerton Washington naval shipyard. Worked on the USS Sacramento AOE , USS Rainier AOE, USS Roosevelt and the USS Seawolf etc. We Installed the I.P.D.S system. The system would detect a chemical missile attack on the ship and protect navy personnel below deck.
What were you doing on AOE 7 (or TAOE 7)? I served from 2000-2003 in RASE Div and always considered Rainier to be the best ship of its class.
Installing I.P.D.S system on the ships. It was a system that protected navy personnel below deck from a chemical missile attack. AOEs are awesome!
@@mrouncervideos2905 Right on, thanks for your work!
Let's keep what seems to be a large amount of mercury in a glass bottle and keep it unsecured while underway on a nuclear submarine then tell no one that you broke it. Logic -100
Just as breakable, but mercury is usually stored in ceramic jugs. Most metals dissolve over time in mercury.
You'd think a doctor would know better. If it was him.
K189: "Can you hear me now?" 📞
K10: "你現在能聽到我說話嗎?" ☎️
I enjoy so much this series.
The histories, missions and miskates during their duty times makes it all more envolving.
Not sure if its been discussed but the mercury incident might have been cause by a large high amp rectifier rupturing. Its basically a giant resistor made of a glass vessel filled with mercury. I mean pound of mercury. Its the only thing i could think that would cause that ammount of contamination
Ah yes, two drunk sailors caught "doing CPR” is a phenomena as old as sailing itself...
Don’t ask-y, don’t tell-sky.....
Jive, you really threw me off with this video. You started saying tur-bine instead of tur-bin and I felt like a child losing their innocence. 😂♥️ Love your work man, thanks for these!
Wow, imagine poisoning a sub's crew from incompetence while hiding the initial spill.
If they had just cleaned it up and put everything into a sealed container, they'd have zero cases of poisoning.
welcome to russia
Really comprehensive, thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Good Lord Aaron! The Echo II class seems like a 50 year long fever dream of a nightmare. Sounds like the only response to being stationed on or fixing an Echo II is "Blyat".
Cannot express how much I love these videos. Literally the best thing to sit back and listen to while driving and always love to learn something new. Keep up the good work man!
I do the same! Also, I sit it next to the bed and listen and fall asleep to it but more often than not finish it because its always so fascinating!
“...and woke up the electrician.”
* laughs and laughs drifts toward oncoming..SWERVE whew *
Drive safe. ⚓️
Same here. They also help me fall asleep. I've always have a hard time falling asleep ever since I was a baby. It's been actual years since I've slept more than 5 and a half hours. It's like clock work. I need to do a sleep study and should be analyzed by doctors bc no matter how long I stay up no matter how long I was at work no matter my exhaustion level my body physically can't sleep long than 5hrs and 30 min. I wish I could post screenshots of the sleep tracker on my phone to really put things into perspective but I usually only get 4 hours of sleep 5 and 1/2 is maximum.
@@followthegrow108 I'm similar. I use tramadol and it balances me out amazingly. Super addictive but it's changed my life, I still don't get huge amounts of sleep but the quality of life has dramatically improved.
@@snigie1 buy odsmt which is a slightly stronger analog of tramadol which is legal in all 50 states. Don't need a prescription or anything. I use it on days my back is really really hurting from work bc contrary to what you believe tamadol and it's analogs are greatly less addictive than other opioids i.e. oxycodone Roxycodone opana morphine fentynal codeine and heroin. All of which for the exception of Fent are pro drugs of morphine to begin with. Meaning once you take them your bodies enzymes convert them into morphine between 1 to 20 minutes. Kinda like how psilocybin is to psilocyin which is The actual chemical compound that makes you hallucinate. Look up odsmt. Very affordable and I know legal vendors/research pharmaceutical labs if youre interested. If not just read up on it!
Sevmash, highest quality shipyard in Russia, producing echo IIs with every problem possible.
Amur; "this shipyard's quality of work is a lot lower than sevmash"
Oh my.
Amur is more likely to extort money from you than produce your submarine. Very corrupt shipyard.
This is great. My new favorite channel. I'd love to have you on my show sometime talk about modern submarine warfare.
Started watching for what I was thinking was 10 mins, but I had watched for over an hour! Very interesting and well presented. Will deff be watching more 👍
The long term storage location can be found by searching on google maps for Bukhta Razboynik. You can also see a floating drydock with a sagophaged submarine.
Always great to sit in on the latest videos on this channel. Thanks for putting this together.
1:36:27 K-108 So THIS is the echo I just read about on Blind Man's Bluff!! The book is great, and so are your lectures, mr Aaron.
Black Lila. always loved that name.
Just picked up the book "Blind Man's Bluff", super stoked to get into reading it!
enjoy! its a great book. also check out the video on youtube of the same name
Epic book. I bet you cant put it down😂. Cold war submarines by Norman Polmar is also excellent.
@@johnking1381 yeah im stoked to dig into it, I had no idea just how much the silent service did during the cold war!
Great book, you will be amazed at what sub crews on both sides of the cold war did.
"Price! Are you there? The silo doors are opening on the sub! I repeat, the silo doors are opening on the sub!! Price come in! They're opening the silo doors on the sub!! Price, do you copy!? The silo doors are open! I repeat, the silo doors are open!! Wait....wait....wait.....Price! Noooo!!!"
I love these sub briefs. Please never stop!👍👍
"Its a mess" seem to be a consistent description of the soviet millitary
49:40 Yeah K116. My father was in charge of Вч5. That's why I can call Kamchatka my home for the next ten years. And for the rest of my life, I was there in 2022 last time.
How to get honorary name for your ship in the Russian navy: exist for 1 year without incident
I think there's a Kilo class currently holding the honor of "longest service without reactor incident" XD
LOL
@@thundercactus The kilos dont have reactors theyre diesel-electric
@@jonasnorden8916 Think that might've been the joke.
@@jonasnorden8916 that was sarcasm!
Great lecture as usual, thanks! I’ve been saving it till I had some proper time to sit down + watch ... has answered lots of questions I had about different bulges appearing on different subs. Fascinating... authoritative + entertaining as ever captain! Cheers
Its like its engines troubles echo'ed true its whole history. Great video
Apparently Russian battlegroups putting to sea with a tug in case of emergency goes back to the Echoes going to Cuba. who knew.
Will you ever do a sub brief on the foxtrot? Or have I missed seeing it somewhere?
Absolutely brilliant as usual - thanks v much!
My favorite part was the non poisonous, working sub. Keep up the good work. Currently working through a Soviet sub addiction. Treating it with 1/350 kits
Navigator and Chief were... dealt with...
Minute 12:00 Do we know on which anchorage was the crippled submarine moored, while repairs were underway?
Oh!
Great one, by the way! Thx!
Whoa. I'm a Patreon'er but this is still cool to see over here. Thanks Aaron!
Seeing all those Sub-Briefs, I think I know what qualifies a soviet sub as Successful:
Not trying to kill its crew on the job!
@Sub Brief
Are you aware of a russian counterpart of yours who covers the US Subs in Sub Briefs?
400km range, swarm missiles communicating with each other - looks good for me even for 21st. I wrote some software for a similar system in 90ths, but I did not know it existed so long ago. You know, nobody told me.
Didn't all the HENs Hotel, Echo, and November class subs all have a history of severe problems? Of course, the use used one reactor for a long time, and in both SSBNs and SSNs.
If the P-6 only had a top speed of Mach.9 and flew at 7000 m it would be a pretty good target even in the mid-1960s. It would be an interesting battle if you think about it. Which would be more likely to fail? The P-6 or the AIM-7s, the AIM-9s the Tarter, Terrier, or Talos?. Now the P-500 was something to worry about.
"K-xxx is a mess..." Seems like a theme or ship class, possibly.
When searching for "Robber Bay" I get references to Cape Kapchik in the Crimea.
The wingspan of that missile is the same as the f 35s wingspan. That is a big missile.
Good morning Captain!
F*ck yeah, coming home from Work and Capt.Jive has a hot documentary for me 👍😉
I have a few questions. 1 what does the k stand for? 2 was the US or royal navy submarine force safer during this time with accidents especially nuclear accidents?
the K-431 incident of august 1985 kinda reminds me of the Chernobyl nuclear incident, which even happened less than a year later...
These subs are a good example why Soviets submariners were often awarded wartime medals just for operating their subs ;-) There were really risking their lives.
I'm not superstitious, but would their bad luck be attributed to the fact that the vessels "names" are just a number designations and not actual names?
I am so glad that my dad and I served on USN submarine service. I had no idea how bad the Russian submarines were, because I always thought that they were the cream of the crop.
Be safe and be 😎
Your knowledge and voice is so impressive.. I feel like you are the real Jack Ryan from Hunt for Red October as he briefs the pentagon….
Holy Cow!...Kramer from Seinfeld is on the periscope of the K7/127 at 1:40:23
My country has just released a new submarine called S-81, I heard that the 80 had design flaws, could you make a video about this submarine? Yes, I know it is a lot to ask, but I would appreciate it even if you only mention some superficial details. Keep it up boss.
I wonder if the k170 was the one used inside Swedish waters, delivering frogman.
K-48 doctor reminded me old joke about definition of nothing: "0.5 litre of vodka for two men". But with high chances of it being "cleaning" or "medical" high proof alcohol, they may think that they have "just right for them".
Great video!!!! You give so much interesting information! Obviously Russia and safety don't go together!
Now I wanna know how many submarine nuclear accidents we've TRULY had. Was our stuff just simply better overall or are we perhaps better at hiding our failures?
I bet the answer is: Rickover
robber would roughly be equal to razboinik bay, as razboinik would mean something like an outlaw, bandit or such. so im guessing its the same bay, just translated on one to english.
The one Doctor who is so badass that they broke the lore to bring him back. And this is what they do?
"Kasataka"?! Damn japanese infiltrating the Soviet Navy! XD
Its "Ka-sat-ka", that means "Orca" (Killer whale).
I was wondering if someone is going to correct Jive's Russian :D
Even though he is trying very hard with the pronunciation.
Hey Jive.. massive respect for ua hardwork..as I have seen almost all your videos..and I understand that you have encountered and heard lot of Soviet/russian subs..can pls make a video wherein you have encountered and Indian subs or seen or heard them while you wherein still commissioned! Plsssss!?
The number of unfunded trips to the drydock is staggering and as a result boats hang on for sometimes decades before defueling and becoming a three-compartment unit. At some point russian submarine and powerplant design will evolve to a reactor compartment that one can plugin a submarine into. Create a reactor compartment, crew it, and plug and play submarines for a few decades.
Embrace what is and lean into it.
Hi Sub, 2nd time i heard you say Rustkies Subs carry ManPAD's, apparently as standard issue? Do American Subs do that as well?
P.s. my security clearance is Level Cracker Barrel , so if you can't tell me, i understand. 🥞
@Sub Brief Really interesting Video, thank you. I'm interested in your opinion on the requirement for surface attack. As far as I'm aware, NATO didn't have an anti shipping weapon with anywhere near the 300 mile range, so whilst the Echo's radar would be detected, it would have to be an jet aircraft to attack within even the 30 mins window, so if it wasn't a carrier group under attack, I think it would have been relatively safe, as the Helos carried by a Surface group wouldn't be able to prosecute an ASW search effectively that far out.
The CVBG had S3 Vikings onboard just in case there was an ESM hit from an Echo II. We had pretty good intel about what was operating in the Med and we always had Vikings airborne to conduct surface surveillance around the BG loaded with buoys so the chances were pretty good we would find him before he launched. Seeing how it had to surface to launch it made detection much easier.
Wow, that list of failures. Was this type of sub kept in service so they'd have a place to send sailors as punishment?
No, that pretty much was the entire soviet fleet. Turns out communists cut way more corners then capitalist companies.
Aron why dont you include your contacts that are supplying information/data in the above addresses?????
is there not a Sources page at the beginning of the video?
K-48 1967 two guys 5 (FIVE) liter of alcohol, and one is still able to pull up a CPR! Thats epic galore!
With Tu-95s or IL-38 Mays doing recon, the Bazalt and P-1000 Vulcan missiles launched by Echo IIs would’ve been deadly.
Don’t forget about the one hull that had a different GR:R 10.89 vs. 10.98…I believe the “HEEN” class were the only DC boats ever produced. A function of how far ( little) Soviet nuclear propulsion programs had advanced when developed. These boats were notorious amongst the Soviet force for their rather sketchy reactor safety. That being said, the Soviet Navy was very innovative with many of their designs. I only recently learned that the “Tango” had an auto loader for their torps. Personally, I don’t think that the Echo II would have been very successful in its attacks. They might get a boat or two close enough to fire it’s missiles. But, they’d really be “telegraphing” their attacks with other assets like the Bear-D and surface ships. Interesting how their “Kotlin-class” DDs had SS-N-3 “Styx” launchers facing aft! They were often used as”tattle-trailers” on CVBGs…Always interesting to learn what our old adversaries did during the Cold War. Certainly would enjoy having beer and pizza with those guys some day! Former AW here SH-2F/SH-60F
Do the Tango sub next
At what point did Soviets switch to their version of 'Albacore' hull pioneered with SSK USS Albacore and SSN Skipjack class.
You might say that actually started with the November class, at least part way. The forward part of the hull was quite hydrodynamic for the time.
1:26 this is the most russian story my eyes have ever observed this is insane
I think you mean 1:26:00 jackass
It's amazing to listen to this - the soviets had so many nuclear issues with their submarines. They only got better because experience taught them better techniques in ship building and ship maintenance. How many Russian Nuclear submarines rest on the bottom of the seas spewing nuclear components into the sea and now China (of all country's) is going to build up their fleet. Does anyone else see the death of the oceans because of this third-world-nation's ambitions?
I wonder if there is some guy in Russia making equivalent videos about American subs
No, but we in Russia know that the first 2 accidents on nuclear submarines were in the United States and 2 times all the sailors on the boats were killed. Then these accidents also affected the USSR.
Can you imagine how boring would those videos be? "The sub was commissioned, it did x number of patrols, then it was decommissioned." No explosions, no melt-downs, no drunk sailors cpr-kissing, no surprise freon-asphyxiation, no rags inside the reactor loop...!
The Russian fleet and ship yards did a terrible job, but it makes for a hell of a youtube video later on! :))
@@purpleldv966,
Given what we know about the USN and their submarine force in particular, we can probably expect them to have a much better track record, but for the same reasons we can't discount the possibility that they have a much shorter but still extensive list of accidents that is still classified.
@@fluffly3606 So you think that all this info from the freaking USSR is available, but somehow the info on the US side is classified??!!! You're kidding me! Let's not gratify Russia with this tipe of brain-numb propaganda!
@@purpleldv966,
The USSR collapsed. The US didn't.
Very good. Thank You. Question? Is the soviet/russian nuclear surface navy as screwed up as the their submarine service was/still is? Poor workmanship in their construction, lousy quality control, poorly trained crews with lax attitudes, reactor failures etc... Any documentaries on them? That would be very interesting.
You followed the story of Admiral Kuznetsov? That carrier has been one disaster after another, the soviet nuclear powered ice breakers have had a bunch of accidents.
1:45:099 THE FIRE GOD DEMANDS BLOOOOD