Orthodox Christianity and the Female Diaconate - Dr. Edith Humphrey
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ต.ค. 2024
- In this episode, Dr. Edith Humphrey discusses the Orthodox Church and the female diaconate.
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I agree 100%. And I would go farther, in that I believe women already have a significant and unique role to play, as mothers. Motherhood is a path open to all of us, those with offspring and those without. A mother tenderly cares for and nourishes the young , the old, the hurting. She splints up faith, and sits in silence with the brokenhearted. She reaches out to young mothers, and lightens the load of the overwhelmed women. In her actions, she is a first line of defense against predatory false shepherds, and she eases the burden for church leadership. She builds strength and relationship through hospitality. This is all delineated in Holy Scripture, and sets a high bar for women's essential and needful participation in church life.
stephanie fehler what a fantastic comment! I am taking a screenshot of this and sharing it with men and women of our parish. Bravo.
Indeed...thanks for this...
Not to mention a unique wisdom ( Sophia) a woman posseses. Different from men.
@@gonegirl4690 Feminism could be the Prostitute mentioned in Revelation. What's more opposite to the Holy Virgin than the Principality of Prostitution? Feminism may just be a part of that principality. But it's sacrament has to do with the death of Motherhood so...
Beautifully articulated! Motherhood brings down God's grace upon women, healing and strengthening them to their full dignity as the Theotokos shows. Feminism on the other hand entices women to give into their Eve-ness which cuts off God's grace and harms everybody around them.
What an outstanding, intruging, concise video.
God Bless Sister, pray for me.
this was VERY well articulated. thank you.
Thanks to God...thanks for your note!
I was afraid of what she might say but glad I listened. Thank you Herman. Missed you last Tuesday 😉
Don't be afraid, Mary-Jo! :-) I missed y'all, too!
Why would you be afraid?
@@birdlynn417 Because the tentacles of the feminist infiltration are everywhere and plenty of soy priest are complicit.
We know they weren’t equivalent to deacons. It’s being pushed by feminists, which says it all.
Thanks for this thoughtful video.
Thanks to God...thanks for your note!
You use of the word "feminists" makes me very sad. You sound hateful.
@@janetm5523 I agree. This video and comments make my heart ache, as I see nothing wrong with feminists or PEOPLE in general asking to have the equality in a religious context.
Irina Popa thanks for the ummm- open hearted wisdom? I certainly have and will continue to do so. So simple indeed. Peace be with you. 🙏🏼
To O K, Arf, arf.
As a child being raised in the Protestant (Baptist) tradition, I can remember my beloved grandmother fulfilling her duties as a deaconness and what that basically entailed: operational support for the ongoing ministry of the church. As an adult I have come to see that so much of what I was exposed to back then was in error. I suppose that even the role of the deaconness was in error and by coming home to the Orthodox Church (I am currently Latin Rite Catholic to my own shame) I think that this whole "role of women in the Church" is a confusing distraction. I believe women should be active in the roles that God has ordained, just as men should fulfill their callings, but all of this clamoring is not of God, as He is adamantly not the author of confusion.
"clamoring"??? Is that what you think of women? Good grief.
The Theotokos is the most empowered woman in existence, to the point of being exalted above the angelic hierarchies. If you truly want to empower women, you would do well to lay them at Her feet and have them pray and emulate Her chastity, compassion, humility and obedience. By doing so you will provide a much better foundation for men to draw from.
That is the antithesis of power, you want to have women be something men can "draw from". The point is for not everything to revolve around what aspects of female existence men feel like exploiting this week.
Thank you for this video.
It was very interesting and we'll thoughtout.
Thanks to God...thanks for your note!
I like her and agree! Great video.
" What could a female deacon do that cannot be done by others?"
Well a female deacon can look after the female congregation members in a way " others" are unable to. ( depending on what you mean by "others"..of course.) I am not at all intrested in the ordination of women .
Or "womens rights" as presented in various movements. I am concerned that there is a need for women and girls to have a tonsured or ordained woman to aid them in very personal matters of their life in Christ. And much more! However as you say at this time it is a discussion that needs great discernment !!!
And Nuns ..well are as you say not available in Churches and in many cases the male clergy are in fact not welcoming to female monks. There are so many crisis in the Church..where do you start?!
And in this day in age of "me too" and sexual abuse by some priests who abuse their power and give other innocent priests a bad name, I think revivng the female diaconate may be a good protective measure for the women as well as for the men.
@@thegrandmasabrina WOmen cant be deacons or enter the sanctuary. period.
Nazi username is fitting, they hated women also. @@Herr_Flick_of_ze_Gestapo
We are not interested in your garbage feminist nonsense.
There is a lot of research ongoing into the nature of the diaconate in the early centuries of the Church from an academic standpoint. We have the next major conference on the diaconate in the 3rd and 4th centuries next year in Finland. There is also PHD research underway on the socio-political context of the Minor orders aspect of the diaconate.
The greatest barrier to understanding deacon of either gender is not the written sources but the lack of appropriate contextualisation of their role and the loss of the understanding of a distinct deaconal ecclesiology which is separate from that of the bishops (and by extension presbyters). The only way to understand a deacon is when we see the role for what it is and do not view it as a step to the presbyterate which it is not. Rather the deacon is intimately bound up with the liturgical understanding of the trinity like the bishop while presebyters are preliferal according to the images provided by the fathers of the church.
@@gonegirl4690
Not all research is looking to prove or disprove women deacons (I know of works which argue against their presence in parts of the ancient church). There is a field of research interested solely in what deacons were which contains scholars from many traditions, some of whom want the restoration of the diaconate in a patristic form some who research for the love of knowledge. As with any field there are a lot of viewpoints many of which contradict each other, and there is no such thing as an absolute proof in history (unless we are borrowing a peace of education our friends in archeology have found).
As for hoping to find evidence there is a lot in the Antiochian Patriarchate starting with the Didiascillia, the historical evidence is not the problem it is how that evidence is interpreted where the arguments lie. As is true on any aspect of history, and all interpretations are based on the standpoint of the scholar which is why it is best left to Church historians to navigate the minefield. Non historians tend to end up using methodology which is at best looked down on by specialists or fail to understand the complexities of historical realities which govern the interpretation of texts in context.
It is true external funding normally comes with strings attached as to what they hope will be found, however that is not normally the case for PHD students (especially self funded ones) who have chosen the topic as it interests them. Also most researchers do so alongside teaching where the requirement form the institution is to publish not what is published.
No research needed. The scripture is clear. Feminism is secular cancer and does not belong in the Patriarchal church.
A Deacon's wife, or Prebyter's wife, should be sufficient to assist in unexpected events requiring a woman's presence. See 1 Tim. 2:12; 3:11-12.
Also.look at the female priests in other churches. Taking down crosses, calling God Mother. Rejecting basic Christian theology that we all agree on.
Heretical demons .... I too have seen this idiocy, in fact at a Lutheran Church here in San Antonio they promote heavy metal Sunday lead by a reformed ( allegedly) heroin addict turned binary lesbian ( I kid you not ) ... Demons in the mist? Oh you betcha!!!
@@mdb60 I was ok with Heavy Metal. Bit no idea what a "binary lesbian" even is?
Demons ... sent to suck your soul into a black pit of nothingness !!!
""Rights" in not a Christian language". Spot on, this.
The reason we have many of the rights we do today is because of Christianity. A lot of earliest medieval texts in Europe on rights were inspired by Christ and written by and for Christians.
@@venus_envy If you find the word "right" in the Bible I will agree with you.
Imagine that, a church which supposedly honors Mary, Jesus mother above almost all else? She was FEMALE, guys, real flesh and blood too.
Yes and she was not a contentious feminist harlet. Maybe more "Christian" women should look to her as an example and abandon the feminist cancer.
A title or label is not needed to serve.
Indeed!
I can't help but see this video has attracted and even fueled some hateful comments. I also can't help but wonder about the psychological impact this exclusion is having on young girls and women in the church today? It will be interesting to see how things unfold as our world wakes up to it's imbalance of power structures in both religious and political settings.
Irina Popa You say “feminists” like it’s a bad thing 😂. I’ll speak freely to whom I want and where I want, thank you.🙏🏼
Irina Popa I sense you have a lot of hostility and anger. I pray you find peace and love in your heart.
@@staranallc1162 Feminism is self-idolatry. The antithesis of the humility of the Blessed Virgin.
@@msudoc 1. are you a man? 2. how is wanting men and women to be equal self-idolatry? women thinking they they shouldn't be under men but rather equal to them is idolizing oneself? 3. what are your thoughts of the feminism movements in the west that helped women get jobs, education, and independence? what that self-idolatry?
@@staranallc1162 Feminism is cancer.
As much of a feminist as I am outside of the Church in the secular world, I believe that does not belong in the Church world. I think it would be far too divisive, not in terms of people agreeing or disagreeing with it, but let’s say there are female deaconesses, some Churches would have them others wouldn’t, people would develop preferences for what type of organization they would prefer potentially and I believe women would potentially prefer going to Churches with female deaconesses and avoid those without. That can lead to divisions and tension in the Church. I’m sure there are many other reasons why it’s not a good idea to bring this back. As others have mentioned, there are plenty of equally important roles that women already play in the Church.
If you are a feminist outside the church you are one inside the church to. You should repent and abandon the cancer of feminism.
Thank you!
I wholeheartedly agree.
Canon 19 of Nicea: ...we mean by deaconesses such as have assumed the habit, but who, since they have no imposition of hands, are to be numbered only among the laity.
Please notice that in the history of The Church various heresies were attacking Body of Christ and it resisted and survived to our days just as Lord promised it to be. This issue is yet another attempt of the prince of this world to drive a wedge... Historical truth is that deaconesses did exist and faded away as The Church grew. It would be very strange to see adult person returning back to it's childhood appearance. Thus The Church should never do the same.
in the west veiling became less common. I wonder if this is then the same as the church having no need for it and growing up.
Correct the heresy of "deaconesses" was defeated and now it rearing its ugly head again. Satan has been busy.
Please straighten the heavily framed portrait on the right of the screen before filming (introduction)...most distracting! The B&W filming accentuates form and outline so it becomes more obvious.
There are many disconcering comments here in regards to women, being a woman does not make you a feminist, blaming female deacons for attempting to lead some kind of 'feminist revolt' into the church is not only misleading but its inaccurate. All the comments stating women dont possess these qualities vs those qualities is so lacking in human understanding, wherein both men and women have the ability both mentally and emotionally. If deacon women were allowed in anciet text, straightforward, they should be allowed now without squabble, women are actually and truly just as capable of men, and no we're not all here to made beautiful babies, God calls us to to be leaders God calls us to do and abide by His will just the same. And Ill further add in this thread and video that rips on women, women are more holy, more capable of self discipline, observe> almost all evils and crimes in the world are committed by men. Dr. Edith Humphreys arguement pooling all women into this evil cult of feminism, which is dispised by natural women, should also include the arguement against men being deacons based on the high pedofile rate the position that has statistically come to light esp over recent years.
Woman prattle. Maybe join a coven or something.
I am constantly dissapointed by the discourse in academia in this subject. It seems so disingenuous when it doesn't even mention half the counter evidences. It just gives half baked confusing borderline insulting reasons that hardly seem like "reasons" based on an understanding that can be taught but just obedience.
This demonstrates again why the Orthodox, beloved brother and sisters, need the Petrine ministry.
What used to be right has now become wrong
What used to be wrong turned right
Never before in a righteous world could day suddenly be night
To get along we must all acquiesce
Leave nothing to reason only a guess
Today it is the Church with a pre-designed pathos
Tomorrow the target will be Mt Athos
So from the mouth of Saint Waylon these words he did toss
“ Stop the world and let me off.”
Fully agree! And you can clearly such a push has nothing to do with faith - so it has nothing to do with God. In Orthodoxy, it is only pushed by a very small minority - I barely ever see anyone, online or otherwise, touching the issue of female diaconate in the Orthodox Church. So, if those few find their faith and the overwhelming majority of their fellow members of the Church so questionable, why not find another faith more aligned with their views ? It is clear to me that those people have no understanding or acceptance for the Orthodox view, so why stay in it ? Because they don't do it for the Church, they do it for themselves.
Is this similar to having a Presbytera in the church?
Well said!
The position of deaconess was never a sacramentally ordained one.
You almost always have sound or volume problems! Very difficult.
Can you please check your vids Before you post them Sir
Thanks for your forbearance...you'll be glad to know that I'm using a new mic, which should help things. I'll also work harder on post-production audio...I always tweak audio, but I need to run it through a proper EQ and filters...
Women were never given the Mystery of Holy Orders!
Creeping feminism:
Female diaconate today, female priests tomorrow, and eventually female bishops too.
Never in Orthodox Church will we accept female priests
Amen to that.
Catholic woman here. Total agreement with you.
Since its not an interview, only necessary to show Dr. Humphrey
It saddens me to hear women who will not do the decent Christian thing to support their sisters in Christ who have a calling that does not bow down to the anachronistic status quo of Patriarchal Christian Orthodoxy. Not all women are called to leadership and neither are all men. What man can be an obstacle to a divine calling like that of ministry. No it is not for all women, but the option should be there for all the future Saints who might make excellent Priests and superb Bishops. Who are we to sabotage these individuals based on their gender? Let us not forget that women who are the mothers of society , therefore the first teachers, suffer a lot of abuses and perhaps some of them do not want to be ministered by a male.
These women might not want to have confession with a man.
They might not feel comfortable or safe around men .
The Church is a place of healing not wehere we go to stay in our wounds. I have an abised past and my male Priest and deacon have helped me be open to the healing of this womb. Should I not be safe with Jesus because He came in the from of a man and not a woman? Where do you get that Mother's are the first teachers? The presence of the Father and his voice and be studidied to show that he also influences a reaction from the child in the Mother's womb. I have a spiritual mother in the Church as well, it that not a leadership role? The women I have met who have this desire to "lead" as a Deacon or Priest seem speak in a very covetus language.
Why can't women just obey God? Just look at the outcomes of single mothers to see what "the mothers of society" without husbands bring to society.