About the "we knew the emperor would die" we saved Reyn, Sharla, Juju and Otharon after showing them dying, so its not that clear because most people will think he will be saved
Hkg 1 with Otharon in the vision you hear “Juju, Gadolt! This is for you!” compared to in the cutscene where you hear “Gadolt! This is for you” so dialogues can change too
Yeh idk how anyone could say that they knew for certain the emperor was gonna die the entire game up until that point was you getting visions of people dying and then saving them idk why people would assume the emperor would be any different
@Hkg 1 My guy, we get it, you're really big brain. But not everyone is as galaxy brain as you. In all seriousness, why can't you accept that this is a point that is subjective? In fact, if we're speaking objectively, way more people saw this future as something that could've/would've been changed than otherwise, meaning that statistically speaking it's way less set in stone than you believe it is. When something is "obvious" to you but not nearly as obvious to hundreds upon thousands of others, consider that your point of view isn't the objective or be all end all one.
@@itsyaboi1245 I don't know, maybe because the scene of Sorean dying was shown one too many times, not even just by Shulk either. Unlike every other scene of other's dying, which was shown up to 2 to 3 times, if that, where as for Sorean was like 5 and up. Like, is there any other reason to keep showing the same death scene one too many times, unless something else is up unlike the other times he's had visions?
I think the idea with Dickson is that after he betrays the party, he intentionally acts like the biggest asshole villain he can in order to suppress his conflicted feelings. That would be why his last words are praise for Shulk.
I wish Dickson can explain more of his true race's background story since he wasn't possessed like zanza and he still retained his original thoughts. It would be nice to know more about that instead of just focusing on the story plot.
@@nascour5991 from some context it seems he just wanted to be immortal. Potentially since his race was dying off. That would be my best guess. Over time he eventually grew to love shulk and he knew he would lose his immortality and likely die if he did not help zanza. But thats just my best theory on him.
I think the main reason people did not notice such obvious foreshadowing is because of the gameplay. You got dozens and dozens of sidequests. After finishing all that, you just kinda forgot about them. I know I do.
@@GURGLEGUY12345 I know who metal face is fairly early on. But I completely forgot Dickson will betray us. Even though the game pretty much tells us that he's a traitor right before Mechonis core, I spent DAYS trying to fill in the collectopeadia and stuff for colony 6, because item tracking isn't a thing in the Wii.
@@GURGLEGUY12345 yep. I kinda glosed over the intro scene, so not much expectations there. Then again I played on 3ds without headphones as the audio wasn't very good and voice was just muffle to me as the voice would have been a dead give away.
The one thing I disagree with is the "Two sides of me" thing is obvious foreshadowing. Simply because it's SO cliche for characters to say that whether they have an evil half or not. I was surprised by this line on my second playthrough.
Yea, honestly on a first playthrough you don't really get who Metal face is because you see Mumkhar for like a couple of minutes, he supposedly dies right away and no one ever mentions him so you really forget about him and don't notice the hints like the claws etc.
Yeah, I completely forgot about Mumkhar b/c he had barely been shown. So it was a surprise to me. I also strongly disagree w/ the idea that "a character isn't dead if you don't see them die on screen". It feels like a bs argument that's brought out anytime a character doesn't actually die, and is never brought up anytime someone actually is killed off-screen as a discretion shot or the like. A total bs, "yeah of course I knew" after-the-fact kind of claim.
@@Qwerty10254 Exactly. During my first playthrough of the game, I had about over 53 hours in the game before I reached the base of Valak Mountain. I will say though, watching the cutscenes in the gallery again is WAY more savage once you know who it is, because you know that he KNOWS what he's doing and who's watching him do it.
I mean, if the plot twists were completely impossible to guess, you could easily say they came out of nowhere, which isn't a good thing either. I don't mind predictability if everything make sense. It just mean the plot is well written.
Mylaur the foreshadowing is only noticeable if you know what happens in the story but still when I played though this game blind I was shocked at so many different parts of the story
It wouldn't be out of nowhere if everything made sense AFTER the reveal. But if you can tell something long before it is actually revealed it's not exactly well written. Especially if these reveals make it seem like it is supposed to surprise you. Both Fiora and Mumkhar didn't surprise me in the least. I kept expecting the game would try to lead me on to believe it is obvious only to revert my expectations. Well it didn't.
Yeah that’s what I got out of it when playing this game and there was plenty of great subtle foreshadowing I think for a person playing it for the first time with some foreshadowing even going as far back as chapter 1. Honestly the reviewer just sounded very jaded and idk how to put it nicely but a little butt hurt? I’m not sure if it is because he is very annoyed this game is held in high regard or something but whatever the case he did bring up some good criticism either way.
Thanks to youtubers like you and chuggaaconroy I actually know that this series exists and now it’s my favorite single player game ever. Thanks for keeping these games alive on TH-cam bro
I agree that they made Mumkhar quite obvious. especially on the English version. But I actually like this fact, since the developers intentionally used a highly recognizable Japanese voice actor(Norio Wakamoto) (Not sure about the English voice actor) for Mumkhar. They actually wanted to make people who were paying attention notice this. If they wanted to keep it hidden, they could have just used a different voice actor just like Fiora and Silver Face
Very good video. In terms of non-story criticisms, I widely agree. However, I feel like a lot of your story-related critiques are somewhat biased. Aside from a couple specific moments, I feel like the foreshadowing was very well done. (Dickson at the end of the marsh and Gadolt with Jade face are the only painfully obvious ones) 1. Munkhar being Metal Face? Not as obvious as you make it out to be. Lot of games have a habit of killing "filler" characters, so a lot of people don't even try to remember Mumkhar after dying 3 minutes in. By the time his voice is revealed, few remember him. As for the Face aspect of things, I personally always thought it was some kind of antibody or chemical way to counter the Monado. (Lorithia's antibodies, Apocrypha are the kind of thing I was thinking of) 2. Fiora being put in Nemesis is kinda obvious, but some people miss that one. Suppose people could think it's cyborgs controlling faces. 3. Dickson could have been much more subtle, but even so, you don't know when, why, or how he is "deceiving these kids." I don't think that takes away from his betrayal that much. 4. Shulk does change the future, that much is drilled into our heads, and he's saved lives before. So is it really crazy to think the Emporor might live? That one raises concern, but it's far from guaranteed like you make it sound. 5. The 2 voices in my head foreshadowing is actually very subtle. I don't understand how you think that's obvious. That's a common expression people say when they're conflicted. Just reflects the duality of the mind, the good angel and bad angel concept. 6. The Trinity isn't too obvious. Alvis is sketchy, and he and Lorithia clearly have something going on. But it could just be imperial corruption like with Yumea. And Dickson doesn't interact with either of them really until right before the Core. Aside from those minor gripes, amazing content as always Enel. Thanks for reading if you read all that. I'm a big XC2 fan too, (as you can guess lol) just wanted to hear your thoughts on why you think 2's story is better? it's good, no doubt, but it never left as strong an impression on me as 1. I know one of your biggest gripes with one is it's predictability, but I personally find 2 to be pretty predictable story-wise. Your thoughts?
@@aaronr.265 Yeah, but what I'm saying is most people will probably forget about him by that point. Cutscene outside the mine where you hear him is like 7-10 hours of gameplay at least.
I guess fiora coming back as playable character and mumkhar right away because I am used to how those JRPG structure their story so that is easy to guess. I don't know fiora was in the faces, I didn't know about the trinity, I didn't know about the dickson is on zanza side, didn't know who zanza was, didn't know all of those until the very end. So I would say the story is still well written, and it was not obvious to me. I think Enel played too much xenoblade games that he might've forgot he played xenoblade chronicles 1 already and of course he knew all of those all along. For us first timer it is well written, and I liked riki as a comical relief otherwise this story is very intense.
@@aaronr.265 most people don't remember the twat who runs away and dies in the prologue 10 hours of gameplay later, hence the majority of people don't immediately get it. If they were to rewatch the opening, maybe. But this game foreshadows almost everything somehow, and that's one of the things that makes the story feel so fluid.
I respect all the effort you put in to this but at times (like with dickson finding the monado during the story part) you mixed up dramatic irony and foreshadowing. Foreshadowing is where the audience and characters have a clue, that’s usually subtle, which tells us about an aspect of the story that’s gonna happen. Dramatic irony is where the audience knows something which the characters don’t. Like take for example if I was watching a play, character A says to character B “I love you” and then Character A says aside (only audience heres) “I can’t wait to steal his money”. This is: A) dramatic irony B) a bad play You get me?
I really don't agree about the plot twists being obvious. The game provides you with enough hints and foreshadowing that you can figure things out in advance, but that hardly makes it obvious, and there's plenty of minor misdirections used along the way. Like with how the Monado that doesn't cut people can't cut Faced Mechon - it really didn't stick out so much in mind at the time I first saw Metal Face, because NOTHING seemed to be harming him at that point. The whole Colony 9 attack sets up Metal Face as indestructible, with him tanking everything, including being shot in the face at point-blank range with a huge cannon. At that point I was thinking of the Faced Mechon as the next evolution of Mechon technology, bigger, stronger, faster and capable of even resisting the Monado, not that they had Homs stuffed into them. Or take the first Face Nemesis scene - sure, if you already suspect that Fiora isn't really dead (despite the infamously human-eating Mechon having swarmed her corpse, and a Colony 9 NPC even mentioning her being eaten), you'll probably think that the woman with her face covered is Fiora. Then again, the woman is explicitly identified as someone else (Meyneth), and once you finally see Face Nemesis in action, the character has a different voice and knows a bunch of things that Fiora has no way of knowing.
Enel really undermined a lot of the foreshadowing in this game. There's a lot that happens in this game that can distract from a few elements, but I prefer plot points that can be thought about and come to new conclusions rather than extremely convoluted plot points that make no sense.
@@They_are_Arthur I know Enel generally prefers 2's story more, but let's not pretend that game's story had it's own fair share of obvious foreshadowing moments.
@@FireFury190 Pretty sure Enel knows that, and doesn't hide that fact. But rather points out what people seem to forget about 1. Also when it comes to fanservice debacle, that was being brought up many times with these, while not as abundant as 2's, people again forget Sharla is a thing. And yes, pretty much everything she wears sexualizes her in some way, whether short shorts, cleavage, ass cheeks, or so on, there's no avoiding it with her. Made even worse in the original when her, along with Vanea (a literal living robot), have bouncing tiddies all day. So really, this is pointing out the hypocrisy the Xenoblade 1 fans seems to have, when bringing up these points on 1's story.
@@byronlyons3548 Hey I don't mind. I love Xenoblade 1, but I dislike the fans that have way too much blind love for this game. Especially when they shit on Xenoblade 2 for being awful despite it doing certain things better than 1 did. So I don't mind Xenoblade 1 getting bit more deserved criticism. Especially if it puts it on even ground with X and 2. As I personally feel all 3 games are equally great. Balancing each other out by excelling in certain areas the other games don't.
i think definitive edition kinda ruins the reveal because the scenes where Fiora is put into the mech were dark in the original making it harder to work out.
Personally, I agree with you about as often as I disagree with you in this video, but I can seriously respect the amount of time and effort it took to make this. While I do think that Xenoblade Chronicles 2 also has a really great story, I feel like it’s much more disjointed. Each individual arc of the story makes sense in its own context, but I feel like each arc has a stand alone pacing to it. XC2 is much more episodic than the original, with clear cut rising action, climax, and falling action per chapter which makes the pacing between chapters feel awkward at times. Additionally, while everything that happened in XC2 can be attributed to Amalthus, he feels very nebulous as a villain until the very end when he goes from being a malevolent force hiding behind a pretty face to being almost comically evil. By contrast, the story in XC1 feels much more cohesive. There are clear cut goals and objectives that the characters are trying to achieve and as they solve one problem, another arises which gives an organic feeling to the twists in the story. The threat goes from being the Mechon as a nebulous whole, to being the leader of Mechonis as an idea, to Egil as a person, to Zanza as the one manipulating everything from the beginning. While Zanza and Amalthus are both shadowy figures manipulating the party, and while both want to become the sole being in existence so they can reshape the world as they desire, Amalthus’s sudden switch from calm, collected, and gentle to manic, aggressive, and egotistical comes across as somewhat jarring, whereas from the moment we even start learning about Zanza, he seems like a manipulator working for his own benefit from the beginning, but he’s set things up in a way that the only feasible way for the party to move forward is by giving Zanza what he wants. From his introduction we’re constantly questioning him and his motives, why he was locked up in the first place, why are the Mechon so against him, what did he do to cause Egil to despise him so much? I didn’t mean to ramble on so much, I love both stories and the lore behind them so much, I just think the villain was done better in 1 than in 2, and the villain is what really drives the story, you know?
It's convenient that you didn't mention how Malos is a more interesting recurring villain than Metal Face. Heck, he is one of the main reasons why Enel prefers Xenoblade 2's story over 1's.
I'd like to know what you think of 3 based on your statement that the villain is what drives the story when personally I feel that the villains in 3 are the worst besides a select few
@@bobbobert7967 I haven’t finished 3 yet, I only just started chapter 4 because I keep getting sidetracked by side content, but I do think the Consuls are interesting thus far. However, having an evil organization rather than a single primary baddie has its pros and cons, and if you look at the consuls individually rather than as parts of a whole it does weaken their effect. I think as the story progresses if we learn more about their true identities I might be more invested in them.
In my opinion, Xenoblade 1 is a game you play once for start to end, then you get your friend to play for start to finish while you watch. You'll know every twist and turn but your friend will be clueless the entire run (save for the foreshadowing)
There's no way anybody heard shulk say that he had 2 voices in his head and immediately knew somebody else was in his body that's just too out there. You dont even know who zanza is when he says that. Fiora just "died" in front of him so him saying that a part of him wants revenge isnt "obvious foreshadowing " at all
This game is 70+ hours, or more, with like 12-14 hours of cutscenes that dont count on gameplay, people forget things between cutscenes. It happened to me.
Wow, even if I disagree with a lot that you said, I appreciate the amount of effort that went into making this video and I can at least understand your point of view. It's also really impressive how you manage to keep someones attention for one and a half hour although he disagrees with a lot you say. That only shows the quality of your content and that you actually care about it. For example, I wouldn't watch five minutes of someone just straight up trash talking this game
As I played through the Definitive Edition, I was playing XC2 alongside with it. And that the absolute best time I had with this series ever. Since I knew both games from before, it really helped me appreciating their strengths and noticing the weaknesses both games have. May just be my personal dumb opinion, but I like them equally, and no one will will tell me otherwise :)
This was an interesting video to watch. I'll give my own opinion on some points that I disagree with. *(This is long, I know, but please read this, I watched the whole video)*
*_Gameplay_* I can agree with how little customization there was in this game. The game doesn't give much aside from gems and different arts, but I'd say that's good enough, and keeping it simple allows it to be easily accessible. I played through Xenoblade X one time, and after seeing it's credits roll, I never replayed the game again because of how cluttered X's interface felt, and once I got into the rhythm of X's combat, I never felt much of a desire to keep playing once I was done. I've played Xenoblade 1 three different times, and even now I still feel like replaying it partly because of the battle system. There's a bit of a catharsis in hearing the characters yell out their catchphrases. Over and over.
*_Exploration_* To me, every location (except Ether Mines) is really good, mostly from a world building standpoint. I find the large locations to be fun to run around in, simply for the spectacle of how small you are in this world of a titan. Bionis Leg never dragged for me and I always find it fun to discover every landmark and quest that is present on this location every time I return to it in a subsequent playthrough. I find Makna Forest's huge lake and long river to be great just for the size of it. The game never tells you to go there, and if you really want to, you can swim across all of the water you can see, which is just really novel. Same with Eryth Sea. I found the fact that there was such a large body of water to be great for the fact that it's just there, majestically glowing at different times of day, and once again, you can swim in it if you want to. Alcamoth's size never bothered me because of the music, and seeing this highly advanced society is just amazing and makes the future events even more tragic once it's infested.
*_Story_* I almost punched my drywall sitting through this part. I have a lot to say but I'll choose specific points that I disagree with.
1. You constantly rant about how easy it is to predict certain plot elements, and the thing is, I think that was the point. Everything that is foreshadowed towards is extremely logical, stuff like how Dickson becomes evil, Muhmkar is Metal Face, and Fiora being a Mechon all make plenty of sense, and I don't think any of these are weak plot points simply for being predictable. I believe the intent about stuff like Dickson being evil was meant to be shown to the player as a bit of dramatic irony, since the main party doesn't know much his true allegiances. This is why they have entire scenes where he speaks to Lorithia and Alvis about their foreboding plans, because the intent was supposed to show us that Dickson was evil the whole time. What mattered most was the character's reactions to Dickson being evil, since they didn't get to see Dickson's evil side before. Shulk and the parties reaction to Dickson makes a lot of sense, and the shock is mostly supposed to be taken in seeing how the characters react to seeing Dickson act like this.
2. You complain about how Fiora only had about 10 minutes of screen time before being killed, but to me, screen time didn't matter that much. The game shows that it's been 1 year since the Battle of Sword Valley, and it's been shown that life has been very peaceful. We are even introduced to Fiora in a scene with Dunban, literally the character we saw in the Prologue. I think this does an excellent job at showing how much we should care about Fiora by immediately associating her with the first character we play as (Dunban), and then immediately afterwards with the next character that we play as (Shulk). And then when Fiora and Shulk see Reyn in the lab, we even get a little more character interaction with Reyn showing that he also cares for Fiora. Couple this with the fact that Fiora has a strong relationship with all of the playable characters so far, and she's even a fully playable and customizable character, and this makes her death feel very earned. This beginning part did not need to be 2 hours long (cough cough, Kingdom Hearts 2) or overly long to establish Fiora as an important character, as the shown and implied relationships with the other characters fills all of that in quite nicely.
3. I disagree wholeheartedly that the story starts to slow down to a crawl before Alcamoth. I think showing Shulk discover new Monado powers and showing him save different people with the visions was supposed to hammer the point that Shulk can change the future. When I first played the game blindly, I legitimately thought Reyn was going to die in Tephra Cave since I saw Fiora die before, so it came as a surprise to see a new Monado art come into play that saved Reyn. When Sharla and Juju are seen to possibly die, I knew Sharla wouldn't die, but the game now throws in an NPC that I think can actually die. And right after that, it shows Otharon, a much older character that already was working with Gadolt, a different character that actually died. After all of these successful saves in a row, this makes seeing the Emperor's death in the vision feel more reversible, as we've saved everyone up except for Fiora up to this point. Once the Emperor dies, we see that once again we failed to save someone from their fate, but in the same scene, Shulk discovers that Fiora is alive, hence giving new meaning to any supposed deaths we've seen or heard of up to this point. This stretch of the story is very important, and without it, I can't imagine how the story would've gone if the party just flawlessly ran up to Prison Island.
*_Characters_* This part aggravated me to no end. Not ONCE did you ever mention the Heart to Hearts which give more insight and character interaction with all 7 party members. You only looked at stuff the main story showed, which is a huge disservice to the fact that these Heart to Hearts are very well written, and there are about 65 of these Heart to Hearts. There's a reason Definitive Edition allows you to rewatch Heart to Hearts as well as the Main Events, because these Heart to Hearts give ALL of the much needed character interactions that you said was missing. If there was an ideal way to experience the story of Xenoblade 1, I think wedging in the Heart to Hearts between specific cutscenes would be the best way to get the most of both worlds.
*_Villains_* I found Xord to be a great first villain for the party to encounter. His over the top and dark sense of humor made him an excellent and formidable foe to face off against. By this point in the game, the player only met Metal Face, so to see another faced Mechon adds in some extra thought for exactly how many more of these faced Mechon exist. He is an excellent introductory villain that paints a small part of the larger picture of Xenoblade 1's world, which makes seeing Metal Face again with even more Xords a lot more intimidating, knowing that you would eventually have to fight more faced Mechon in the future.
To me, Lorithia is a great villain since she makes for a good foil to the much more innocent Melia, and really goes home in being a hate-able villain through and through. She's not the best in the game, but she does the job right, and as a villain for Melia, she's spectacular.
I agree, I love Egil.
Dickson I find to be the third best villain in my opinion (behind Egil and Zanza), as he in fact DOES have multiple moments of layers to him once he's shown as a full villain. Once in the scene in which he flies away from Colony 6, when he starts trembling to himself at the thought of Shulk being more powerful than him. This shows that he not only feels vulnerable, but also that he somewhat cares for Shulk. He's a disciple of a god, and he's lived for thousands upon thousands of years, and yet he still has feelings for this little Homs that he knew for only about 18 years of his life. This makes Dickson feel very human. He puts on a facade of villainy towards the party members in order to make them lose any sign of sympathy towards them, and in his dying moments, he doesn't want Shulk or the others to see him die, as he really didn't want Shulk to feel the pain of watching the closest being of a father figure lose his last breath.
And as for Zanza, I believe he's perfect. It is a standard for JRPGs to have a big God become the final boss, but to me, I feel like this God deserves all of the praise for being an exceptionally good villain. Throughout many cutscenes, we get small hints at Shulk not acting like himself. Seeing himself in his own dream, having two different sides of himself in his head, returning the soldiers in Tephra Cave to the Bionis, having such extreme hatred towards the Mechonis and the Mechon. All of these and more add to really excellent hints at Zanza pulling the strings from behind the whole time, and it makes perfect sense. I love Egil the best out of all the villains, but I think it was really good to have Egil's phase in the story transition to Zanza's phase in the story, as Egil constantly referred to himself as a God, and now there is a real God, and they're evil. This drives the point home that there should be no one as powerful as a God dictating the way others move through their lives, and to seize their own destinies. Zanza works very well as a villain, and he's a lot cooler than just having a spiffy outfit.
Anyways Enel, thank you for reading through all of this. I appreciate all of the work you do on this channel, as you really have made the Xenoblade community become a lot more noticeable on this platform. I appreciate the fact that you had an honest opinion, and I appreciate the fact that you didn't back down in making this video any shorter. I'm happy to be subscribed to you, and can't wait to see what the future of this channel holds.
while i dont particularly find the events of alcamoth interesting until High Entia Tomb, its far better than just "sure okay you can go to prison island". i agree with everything here so so much.
Watching the story section made me incredibly mad. Not because I can't handle critique of one of my favorite stories, but because the critique just didn't hold true for the most part. "The emperor's death was obvious, because they showed it to us so many times" is stupid if you understand that up to that point, we had seen visions of everyone's deaths and been able to prevent them. Otharon's vision wasn't unnecessary, it served to show that no matter how hopeless it may seem, the team still changed the future nonetheless. Etc. The in-depth gameplay guides and other videos are all great, but it really felt like he hadn't paid much attention to plot.
One thing I honestly really like about having autism is that I have a tendency to be more trusting than I probably should, so plot twists like dickson consistently work really well for me. Just a cool little thing about my neurodivergency that makes life more fun yknow?
@@sergiovarela8907 My first instinct is to completely object to your opinion, but I'll hear you out. What do you not like about the Nopon? Or do you hate comic relief, or what?
@@march.7561 from their speech pattern to the goofy looks, the fact that the only character that I don't dislike is tora (because i'ts a weeb and i'ts kinda funny). They seem like the pet race, and I don't usually like those kind of characters. I have to point out that Riki has his own good moments, but the bad still outweights the good.
As someone who was turned off from Xenoblade 2 at first, I’ve grown to love it a lot thanks to your content. Currently at the beginning of Chapter 5, btw. I think this video is great and addresses a lot of the things I do have problems with in XC1. However, I do think you left out a lot of the actual subtle foreshadowing throughout the whole game. For example, during Alvis’s introduction, him and Shulk both have their hands on the Monado when Alvis says the line “Both the material and the immaterial”. The camera focuses on Shulk during “material” and Alvis on “immaterial”. Also something I though was really cool is that on the back of Alvis’s coat is a symbol with the same shape as Seven’s chestplate, sort of hinting at his role.
I disagree with you about the open areas being boring. Exploring the areas is my favorite aspect of this game. I just love seeing the sheer scale of each area. For example, on the Wreckage beach, you have an amazing view of both the Bionis and Mechonis. Sometimes you get views that foreshadows future areas. An example being in Makna Forest you can see Eryth Sea right above you. I also loved that at one story point you can see the Mechonis moving, which I thought was pretty neat. There's even some moments where you can see the progress you made along your journey. A good example of world building in the gameplay was outside the Ether mines you can see Colony 9 far below from where you are. My point is that you can't achieve this with a smaller scale world. Being the first attempt that Monolith has made a big world, I think they did a pretty good job at it. Also, Valak mountain has fun ice physics and I'm a little disappointed that you didn't mention that. I have endless amounts of fun messing around with the ice physics to see how far I can jump over the mountain before the ramp. The side quests, I kind of agree with you. In a narrative way, they are boring for the most part. Only a handful has a memorable plot to them. However, they did give me an incentive to explore more of the world that this game presents which as I explained earlier is my favorite aspect of this game.
I also found the areas to be a lot of fun to explore. The music in each area is so much fun to listen to, and there's even special night time themes for most of the areas. If Xenoblade's locations weren't gigantic, I don't think this game would've been as memorable. I love how tiny and slow the main characters can feel when traversing this titanic world.
@Hkg 1 I view X in the same way you view 1. I think X has a lot of random spaces of large nothingness, and the movement is only fun until you get to the desert area (forgot what it was called). When the Skells are unlocked, it becomes a lot better imo.
@Hkg 1 I'm fine with earning skell. Even with the run button are too big to be fun. Xenoblade at least has the titan locations so it's fun looking around piecing together what body part you're on. And then there are the quick step gems which allow for faster movement.
I find your overall take on one very interesting, and to explain why I guess I'll need to give brief context to how I started playing Xenoblade. (brief as in an essay) I discovered Xenoblade by literally picking up 2 on a whim because the artstyle looked interesting and Pyra was hot (hehe). I soon surpassed my brainlet decision and found actual reasons for liking the game, and soon after beating Two I immediately watched a playthrough of One. I had been curious due to lurking among online discourse on 'if Two is actually good' and 'which game is better'. Sufficed to say, after watching a playthrough of One basically understanding every story beat (Rest in not having a Wii/Wii U or understanding how to emulate it correctly at the time) I came to the conclusion that I could understand why people saw Xenoblade 1 as a better game whilst I held Two in a higher regard (mostly because I had actually played it). I reacted very similarly to you in regards to DE's announcement. I had a higher interest in X due to how underrated it seemed and I also had tried (and failed) at reaching into the rest of the Metaseries like Xenosaga (One day I'll get a working emulation going). However, as DE approached to release, I had a lot more motivation to actually play One, especially with the announcement of Future Connected. Unfortunately in my undying quest to avoid spoilers due to a few close calls with 2, I avoided as much marketing for FC as possible. I knew two things: 1. I had seen they basically confirmed Alvis as Ontos, and 2. The name was Future fucking Connected. I was ecstatic because I found the similar ways 1 and 2's worlds experienced restoration a intriguing possibility to connect the games. What I failed to realize with my assumptions towards Future Connected, and something I found out about before playing the game and chose to sort of ignore was that Future Connected was mostly akin to cut content for 1. I realized this pretty soon while playing FC and started enjoying it for what it was. Soon enough I was at the final fight, and all of a sudden the Connection I made to the fog king (not having Saga on my mind since I've seen like an hour of the first game) wasn't to the Gnosis but that they used a Guldo model from 2 for the Fog King. 'Oh boy, we're fighting a Guldo type enemy with a giant rift in the sky to another dimension right beside us, I wonder what that means?'. In the end, obviously, that didn't matter. The only strong connection to Two aside from the real Experiment cutscene from 2 was Alvis and his space-time continuum bull honky. All that made me put a perspective on the discourse I had seen online towards 1 and I came to a lot of conclusions about the story you did in the video. However, despite all this I still enjoyed 1, immensely in fact. I agree with a lot of gripes you held, but--not to be rude--you sound extremely jaded in the video. While I concur that the only other Xeno game I've played, being Xenoblade 2, felt like it had a lot more character moments and writing, and even in my opinion a better plot, I still love 1 the most for the Grand Scale of its plot, setting, and themes. Everything is setup from the start of the first cutscene as big, then we get smaller, smaller, in scale, zooming in on where the beginning of the game starts. Now the goal of the developers was to start to build up back to that grand sense of scale throughout the story, and they did with the whole end of the game being 'Kill God and Decide your own Fate'. I feel the impact of this hypothetical quest the developers had In the large, open, and sometimes empty areas, thin or static characters with strong personality traits and little depth, and that previously mentioned escalation of story and themes. Does this forgive the game for lacking in certain areas? No. Did the sense of scale add some to my immersion in spite of those elements lacking? Yes, it did for me at least. At this point, I think most people who prefer one more so appreciate what is was trying to do in addition to it probably being their introduction to the current state of the Xeno series, but obviously there's probably more nuance to it than that. 2 by far (my favorite so far) is without a doubt flawed in addition, but like you I see so many improvements to it as a game and I take how many times I've replayed it as a sign that I like it more. 2 was my introduction as well, which probably adds onto my love for it. I guess I'll conclude with how I think DE panned out in light of my initial reaction to its development. Experiencing 1 for myself in such a heightened state has by far been a worthwhile experience especially during this pandemic. I didn't play the original through emulation to completion so I didn't have a handle on how DE could've improved the combat, all I knew was that I still held 2's in high regard. Do I think it was worthwhile that DE happened? Certainly, but I think the range of its influence will largely depend on what they do next with the series. DE serves as an actual reintroduction to the series standing just above the 3ds port, however with FC and time attack being underwhelming and the rest of the additions/improvements not doing too much to add to the base game, only making it a more complete experience, I feel a lot of fans are now wanting for that new experience we had hoped to have heard about instead. I'll be interested to even see if mainline Xenoblade (1 and 2's now sort of connected universe) goes further, if Saga or X get more attention, or if we get something new from Monolith in the future. I just hope that DE will justify its existence by providing a full view of 1 and 2 on the switch together to newer players in contrast to something new for us already interested. Keep up the Good Work Enel, with every new video I look forward to seeing your improve more and more, as well as showing me how outclassed I am when playing these games.
Xenoblade 1 was my introduction to the series and Xenoblade 2 is my favorite between the 3 games. Xenoblade 1 had a really high bar to pass for me because of how mesmerized I was by its presentation and world. Since playing it, I've been searching for another game that would immerse me into their world as much as that game did, and no game I played did that until Xenoblade 2. X succeeded in immersing me into its world but not its story or characters, but Xenoblade 2 was precisely what I yearned for since beating the first game. I had a hard time deciding which game I liked more since the stories were so different in their approach. While Xenoblade 1 was initially better, there was something about Xenoblade 2's story that kept pushing me towards it and dissect it, and after Torna released, the full story of Xenoblade 2 finally clicked. The themes used in Xenoblade 2 very much applies to our current reality. The theme of a corrupt power abusing military power while appearing as saints, individuals who have suffered due to the cycle of suffering created by the world itself and the humans who act in self interest. And with COVID happening around the world, it feels even more appropriate. But the story wasn't about how hopeless the world is, but rather despite how hopeless it feels, there are people who are still striving to help each other and make better lives for themselves and the people they are around. And that's the message that hit so hard for me. It's these characters who all felt like they've lost their purpose in life, but still trying to find hope to the future to find what their purpose to living is. And that made me think of what my purpose for existence is, and that thought helped me find a reason to keep moving forward in life. Because even if the world feels like it is beyond saving, there are people that are worth it to keep living for.
I largely agree with you on combat. I don't feel like it is as fun as X and 2, and chain attacks feel like a crapshoot for most of the game. Also XC1 has like 2 good sidequests. All the rest are "kill monster A, get thing E, kill this very specific unique monster in Makna Forest that only shows up during a rare weather with no way to change said weather besides adjusting the clock." That said, despite my gripes with the game, I still enjoyed it. Not my favorite game I ever played, but I enjoyed it
I loved the sidequests because I loved seeing how you shape the NPCs lives through your own actions. It felt rewarding for a really sentimental loser like me but looking back on it god was it tedious. That's why I am 100% never doing NG+
I played 2 before 1 and I personally think that 1’s sidequests are kinda garbage. I wouldn’t have been able to know that I can get anything outside of exp for them and the fact that you need to speak to named npcs has never been explained. It’s too cryptic and rather boring.
Its funny i liked the battle system then played 2 hate that one so fucking much until i started learning more about it and because i do some leveling in the definitive edition i come back for it sometimes But when i do it feels less dynamic then the second game
Enel, while I largely agree with your points, there are a few things you overlooked: 1. You argue that Shulk defeated Zanza due to the power of friendship, but this is incorrect. Zanza lost due to a MAJOR miscalculation. When he powered up the Monado, Meyneth was perplexed, asking why he would take such a risk. What she was getting at is that powering up the monado also added Zanza's full power to Shulk. This made Shulk more powerful than Zanza. Examples of this are: a. Shulk seeing the future without visions on Mechonis b. Shulk overpowering the Apocrypha throughout the journey on Mechonis (until being right next to it when he fights it) c. Shulk preventing Zanza from coming out of him before the final fight with Egil d. Shulk coming back to life after Zanza's soul left his body. Each of these events is the direct result of Zanza's decision to power up the monado, and they were NOT part of his plan. He turned Shulk from a normal human, into a god. This is what Alvis meant when he says at the end of the game "The old god was defeated by the new god he himself created". He was pointing out the irony of Zanza's mistake. Zanza made this mistake because he believed that Egil was more dangerous than Shulk, and that the best course of action was to power up the monado so Shulk could defeat Egil. After that, he believed he could easily kill Shulk and that would be the end of it. However, ever since Shulk came back to life, Zanza was afraid of him, and showed it from that point on. Shulk didn't die like he was supposed to, implying that things weren't going according to plan. This is the reason that Zanza offers to make Shulk his disciple. He didn't want to fight him. 2. Shulk decided to create a world without gods due to Meyneth's influence. She argued that the detiny of the people she created belonged to them alone. People will resist the passage of fate, and eventually, they will succeed in overcoming it. Therefore, there is no need for a god to rule over them. Alvis told Shulk about this, saying that the passage of fate would be overcome eventually, leading to the gods destruction. Meyneth accepted this and entrusted the future of the world to the beings of Bionis and Mechonis, while Zanza feared this. You completely ignored the nuance of Zanza and Meyneth's philosophies about how the world should be. I wouldn't say Zanza is a great villain, but he has more depth than you imply. While I do like Xenoblade's story more than its sequel, and I agree with those who claim it is exceptional, it certainly has its flaws. Here are a few examples of bad writing in the story you didn't bring up, that I think are worth mentioning: 1. The plotline of Fiora's body being damaged, allowing her to die at any time was stupid and made no sense. The other Face units had no such problems. The whole point of giving face units mechanical bodies was to make them stronger. Mahmkar talked about how much he loved the power of his new body. It gave him a strong sense of superiority over Dunban, and the other Homs. Even if Fiora was damaged in some way, once Vanea joins the team, she would have no trouble fixing her since she made the face units to begin with. The notion that Fiora needs a monado to power her body, while the other face units do not doesn't add up. It also doesn't fit the gameplay. Fiora shows no signs of weakness in battle at any point in the game. There is a major disconnect between the weakness she has in cutscenes, and her crazy DPS in battle. The way that she gets her body back at the end is also hilariously stupid. I was hoping that they would fix this plotline in Definitive Edition, but they didn't touch the script, probably because they wanted to save some money by using the old voicelines.
ik this is over a year later so im a bit late but whatever, i agree with u on a lot of things tho i do think it makes sense to why shulk wants to go to prison island bc in his vision he sees that he greatly damages metal face and the monado even looks like the monado 2 in the visions and he wants to be able to hurt metal face bc metal face is who killed fiora so he wants that vision to come true which is why he wants to go to prison island
My opinions on the game: If you’re going purely for cutscenes and story, then this game is absolutely phenomenal! The story has many twists some may not expect, and the writing with the music choices make so many cutscenes so memorable. However, when you mix gameplay into the mix, it definitely drags it down a bit. Gameplay can be a bit boring sometimes, especially when you can feel limited to a certain team due to poor AI or conditions (cough, Melia, cough). There are also a numerous amount of side quests which, although optional, can feel extremely boring or frustrating. The amount of time they take away from the main story can also drag down that aspect. Other mechanics such as Affinity and Gem Crafting can also make the player feel limited in their options (by the gem crafting, I’m referring to how you may need a specific attribute you just can’t find, or not getting the hoped results). There are also a lot of visual bugs that can be a big detracting if you focus to hard on those kinds of things. Overall, definitely would recommend to people if you know they’ll pay attention.
1:07:31 I think the reason why they’re different is because XC1 focuses on Klaus’ more insane psychopathic side and in in XC2 it focuses on Klaus’ more logical and understanding side
I have to disagree about how you thought a lot of the twists were obvious. On a repeat playthrough, it’s a lot easier to notice just how much foreshadowing there is, as so many seemingly throwaway lines are hinting at future events. Another thing I think this game does well is wait for acting upon certain kinds of foreshadowing. The time between Dickson saying he was going to betray us and him actually acting on that was so long, I had honestly forgotten about it. Another thing which you were annoyed by, but I thought was pretty clever, we’re all the prison island visions. I think this is extremely clever when you consider that Zanza is controlling Shulk’s visions and freeing the Monado is supposedly his win condition. There’s also a whole bunch of stuff you didn’t bring up, such as Shulk getting a vision for Lorithia when first seeing Melia, but if we wanted to talk about all the foreshadowing in this game, we’d be here all day. (Again, because there’s so many seemingly throwaway instances)
The only reason you wouldn't think the plot twists aren't obvious is if you hadn't played many games like this before or watched many animes. The subtle foreshadowing like "there's two voices in my head" or dickson calling dunban a beast are cool but the blatant showing exactly what happens next 5 times is very annoying.
I've talked to a lot of people on their first playthrough who've been able to pick up on this pretty easily so i guess it just depends a lot on how much you might be doing other things and forget some things that may not be super obvious if you only see it rarely. I still don't think the prison island vision was that great but I can somewhat see the point about zanza controlling the vision.
On the point of Shulk having two voices in his head, I don't think that was obvious foreshadowing either. Quite consistently it's a thing used in storytelling to just say the character has a conscience and is having conflicting thoughts. The metaphorical devil and angel on your shoulders kind of thing, so that's what I thought it was about.
@@gmaster2647 yeah I agree, that line is in the camp of the "ahh" moments you get when replaying which is good type for foreshadowing rather than lol this is what happens or lol this character is evil but the MCs don't know it yet. I guess it does give it a more theatrical feel like in Othello where the audience know iago is evil the whole time but the characters don't. That said you are privy to his schemes so it comes across as a bit of an awk middle ground in xc.
Disclaimer: I like Xenoblade 1 and 2 equally. I think you're extremely biased against xenoblade1 bc of the xc1 elitists. You're honestly really ignorant towards a lot of things. Especially a lot of cool things that are just good bc theyre... cool and its fun to see the characters do well sometimes. Xord isn't a bad villain because he's just "metalface but without motivation" he's good because hes scary. Alvis isn't obviously evil because he's helping Shulk all the time, and yes, while Dickson is also helping, its clear that Alvis actually wants Shulk to do well, which Dickson does not. The complaint that there is too little subtlety is valid but... are you really saying you expected Shulk to have Zanza inside of his body? I think you're mostly viewing the story too much from the perspective of someone who's already finished it. We don't know what's going to happen when we play it. The only things we know are: Mumkhar is def metalface, Dickson is probably evil, and Egil thinks Shulk is someone called Zanza, though we have literally no idea what that means. We don't know if the Emperors going to die, because the last bunch of visions have all lead to everyone being saved (Reyn, Juju, Sharla, Otharon). Otharons vision is shown like 3 times too but he still makes it out alive. We don't know anything about Zanza. And I mean anything. Even if you somehow expected Shulk to die, Zanza to take over the Bionis and kill everyone, you can't deny that it was handled really well. Zanza isn't some no one like the Fog King, he's a real threat that you genuinely want to destroy. Also one final thing, the things with Lorithia & the Telethia and Vanea & Fiora really doesn't make you go "oh so that's gonna happen". Even if you thought it was Fiora, Vanea calling her Lady Meyneth should definitely at least put you off a little. I like both games equally, I know you think 1 is good too but I think a lot of your disliking, especially in the story and characters (ESPECIALLY riki lmao) are because of your spite against xc1 elitists (which I understan dont get me wrong, but still). That and that you're thinking about it as if you know almost everything thats gonna happen. Sorry if I sound like an idot
Wait wait wait, I didn't get it. So is the game telling us that shulk can change the...uh...the...the thing...the... Future! Yeah. Took a while to remember, kind of not stressed a lot in the game.
Apparently Enel needed to hear it a few more times. He thinks it was obvious the Emperor was going to die after Shulk had "changed the future" for Reyn, Sharla, Juju, Otharon, etc...
I love Xenoblade, I love Monolithsoft, I love this channel and Enel. Thank you very much for all the effort you put into promoting this franchise on youtube.
Xenoblade is kind of a miracle when you look at Monolith (and even the own series’) history. I never would have believed the Xeno metaverse would have seven games way back when I finished Xenogears or even Xenosaga. So keen to see what Monolith has in store.
"Some might call the cutscene the changed everything. While I won't be making a 20 minute analysis on it..." Do I get points for knowing what video you're referring to? th-cam.com/video/5YdVtdGT5DQ/w-d-xo.html
Would you ever do a similar video for xc2? I know you did a one year anniversary vid, but would you ever want to do a video in this much detail for any other Xenoblade game?
haha I'd actually love to do this eventually about the other games. i feel like that vid about xc2 wasn't even that good at all. Problem is it's just a lot of effort to make something like this.
Tora just leave comment (Don't want to spoil story meh meh). It Tora's birthday on Saturday, which is when he receive game from Mamapon and Dadapon. Will watch more when Tora play game yes.
Playing Xenoblade Definitive Edition years later after the original made me realize just how much I love Xenoblade 2's combat. So many interesting elements were put in place to make combat more fun and strategic with wide variety of blades and abilities compared to XC1
@Tyler Davis Storywise, I can't blame you on X lol, it doesn't hold a candle to either of the other ones, regardless of which of the two you think is better xD
I feel like certain things like moments of foreshadowing become far less subtle when you're already used to games like this. The general playerbase isn't going to pick up on moments like the " two different versions of me" line. I know I didn't the first time.
The reason there are very little character moments in the main story is because of the heart to hearts. You don’t get that from watching only the cutscenes. I was genuinely surprised when I found out one of Riki and Sharla’s heart to hearts references Nene’s tree climbing incident mentioned in FC.
I was so disappointed that at no point Enel referenced the Heart to Hearts. All of his complaints about character interactions are bad because he forgot about such an easy to find part of the game.
@@They_are_Arthur He referenced it toward the end of the video. And his major complaint was that such character building was locked behind affinity levels which is reasonable. If heart to hearts worked like Quiet Moments in FC, I can see this being remedied. But to a non-completionist they would probably miss out on these heart to hearts.
On my first playthrough I skipped just about every heart to heart I came across simply because I didn't have enough affinity for them. Yes the game is trying to encourage me to change the party around and build party affinity, but that cuts into chain attacks and makes them feel even more difficult to get to more than three rounds. By the time I had the affinity for them, I had had my fill of the game and just blazed for the end instead.
This is not really an excuse for poor character writing given that XC2 has almost constant character building/exploration AND heart-to-hearts on top of that. Character development should drive a story, it should not be locked behind optional content that has frankly annoying perquisites to meet through affinity levels (I was only ever able to see very few heart to hearts in xc1 even on my third full playthrough). Never mind the fact that all heart to hearts in XC2 are fully accessible as soon as you come across them so long as you have the involved party members with you at the time.
I think your complaints toward the story and characters are perfectly sound, but the sarcasm felt a bit much. A good bit of the obvious foreshadowing you point out doesn't feel inherently obvious when you're not literally directly pointing it out and you're actually just playing the game for the first time, at least for me it wasn't. Still though, I do agree with a lot of your points in other places, and that this a very nice and organized overview of your thoughts on XC1 as a whole.
Enel: this video is very spoiler heavy Me: shit I wanted to watch the video, but haven't played the game YET, so I'll probably watch it later but it's already liked :-)
Second comment yahoo... But i have to comment on that when you said many times that the game is kinda bad at foreshadowing, i dont agree with it. Now after playing the game and knowing everything, characters lines etc are more obvious. My friend played Xenoblade 1 first time and he was blown away by some "now obvious" reveals. I on my first playtrough of this story, i was blown away too. First time playing the game, you dont maybe pay that much attention to some details but later they are obvious. Bad explanation but i had to comment on it. Thanks Enel for this video btw
I agree, Enel makes it seem like Fiora's reveal wasn't too big of a deal, when the game does a really good job at hiding her before seeing her true reveal.
I don't know, second time of showing that dream sequence of Shulk sinking into the ground, with the second one staring down at him, so far into the game after first showing it, just shows it being way too obvious. Same with Dickson on "hate to deceiving these kids", which again, is not being subtle with the foreshadows. And those who say they could forget this, but sorry, that seems more like a you problem, rather than the game, unless you purposely didn't bother continuing the game until months on end. Just really now, the whole thing of some of these twist, are pretty obvious, whether you found them as such or not, even for first playthroughs. If this was your first ever baby step into JRPG's as a whole, or anime I guess, then I can maybe see that. Otherwise not really, as these play pretty occasional used tropes of anime and story telling, even for the time. The only ones that were great twist, was for one being Alvis, as he remained mysterious until pretty much near the end or at the end, and obviously the whole High Entia Telethia reveal. For they weren't that obvious, and rarely talked about.
im not gonna lie, i actually fell for every plot twist in the game except for melia and the emperor dying when i played the first time lmao. made the experience so fun. xc2 still has a way better story and way better gameplay imo
I really enjoyed the plot twists the first time I played because I was so focused on what had happened in the past that I didn't see the foreshadowed events coming so it ended up being super satisfying.
This game is my favourite game of all time. They really fixed the problems that the original had. Combat never gets boring to me and it is really addicting. Story is just incredible even when i already knew what was going to happen. Music is perfect and i still listen to it almost daily. World looks beautiful and concept of two big titans is really interesting and clever. Characters are interesting and i can really relate to many of them. To me this game is the best in the series. Xenoblade 2 is in the second place but i think 1 does everything better than it does. X is just trash imo
Seeing people still trashing on XCX because it takes a different direction than XC1 hurts, since it is my 2nd favorite XC game after the first one. ;( Exploring Mira was incredible fascinating and I was surprised how much I liked the sidequests and the world building with all the alien races. Also XC2 has a better roster of towns than XC1.
@@black1blade74 I hate how grindy X gets. I hate how large but still rather empty the world is. World building and plot is driven through side quests and i much rather have story through an actual cutscenes and story, than side quest full of dialog reading. And the worst part imo endless story proggression bars like "get a skell" which itself is behind two way too long side quests
Personally I disagree with a lot of what you had to say about the story. I think Fiora’s death is one of the most emotional sections of the story along with Shulk’s, Kalian’s, and Dickson’s Deaths. I do agree that Dunban is a character with missed potential, especially when he says nothing about his relationship with Dickson during that fight. I actually don’t like Memory’s End. I appreciate the free party gauge, but fighting old enemies just felt hollow, especially since the Mechon could be hurt by normal weapons, the Telethia didn’t use Soul Read, and none of the enemies said a single word. Also you can skip the Gadolt relight because getting to the end of his area launches you into the cutscene before the final battle. I know it was obvious that Dickson wasn’t the type of guy we were led on to believe, but shooting Shulk I thought was completely unexpected and caught me off-guard. I actually do like most of the party thanks to the Heart-to-Hearts. I think they did enough to make me interested in each of the characters and while technically optional, those who want more out of the characters are incentivized to find the Heart-to-Hearts and complete them. I also think a lot of the little lines and the stuff in between each of the major story sections really helps make these characters feel like characters I should feel about. AND NYAPIKAPOW IS NOW MY FAVORITE WORD. I think the 2nd Prison Island adventure is an amazing buildup to Zanza. And the fight with Zanza himself feels really climatic especially with the background and the first phase music. I prefer this story over 2, even though that story was good, the highs didn’t really reach the same level as in the original. I still liked this video and I appreciate what you had to say and your viewpoints on certain things.
I think a lot of people can write off a lot of problems with the story solely because they'll likely be doing side quests often, so there's likely going to be massive breaks between these story moments for most players. I know in my case, the repetitive story didn't bother me much because it took me a month or so to get to Mechonis Field I believe (I'll often pick up a lot of games at once, so progress in some games suffers). The repetition was almost welcome in that playthrough because I forgot a lot of things (although I think it says a lot that it took so long to play it... if I was really invested, it wouldn't have taken me so long to finish the game. For example, I finished XB2 and XBX in about a week each).
It's really cool to hear the your thoughts on this game. As someone who got into the series though Xenoblade 2, it's really nice to hear how someone who's been into the series much longer, and has a different perspective on it. It's unfortunate there isn't a larger community for the series, and I'm glad there are people like you who are willing to put so much work into stuff like this.
I'm glad I'm not alone in feeling like most party members got the shaft when it comes to characterization. I truly do love Xenoblade 1, but I think it sometimes suffers from what I call "first draft syndrome", kind of like Megaman 1 or Kingdom Hearts 1. I think taking this game and splitting its focus into two sub series (Xenoblade X focusing more heavily on exploration and player expression, while Xenoblade 2 focused more on story telling and characterization) was a good call on Monolith's part. And while Xenoblade 2 remains my favorite in the overall Xeno series, I still love this game, and it still stands on its own as a fantastic RPG. I feel lucky to have a franchise like this where the debate comes down to "which amazing game did I find more amazing"
I agree that when Metal Face first showed up it was obvious it's Mumkar, but during the battle at Sword Valley, when Mumkar "died" i honestly thought he did die because i thought Nintendo wouldn't include a violent death scene
Fantastic video, Enel! Have you made a similar one for XC2? I went through your video list and didn't see one. If not, I urge you to consider it. I for one would definitely love to get your definitive breakdown of it (even though I already have a decent sense of your opinion of XC2 through your speedruns).
honestly you do make a good point but in my opinion i don’t agree with much of the things you said. but i really wish i knew you so i could have a friendly argument on our thoughts about the game
This was amazing. I love how you have everything split nicely in the video, but you don't do the money hungry path of putting it as different videos that some people would have done. I totally agree that the combat is very unbalanced which doesn't allow as much variety as I would like, so it starts slow, then just becomes repetitive. It has a great story, but not told as well as possible. It really makes me think of the comparison that I thought of and hold to this day. Xenoblade is playing an anime. Chronicles is world-building and single hero story mostly. Cross is mecha/sci-fi. 2 is harem hero story. Also, I had a funny parallel with 2 that I can't shake. Main story is Pokemon games with collecting all and getting most powerful. Torna is Pokemon anime with just a few that is mainly about friendship. I personally like all the games for different reasons. Chronicles is a great traditional RPG to me with a few nice additions. Cross tickles the fancy of giant mechs and the world is amazing. 2 is a great technical game with builds for different situations and character building even for the blades.
This was a really well put together video. Despite disagreeing quite a bit with a few of the points you made throughout, it was still nice to hear your perspective on this game as a whole. I was quite shocked when you defended Juju a bit during the character portion of the video since many people just bash on him all the time; though, I wouldn't say it's completely unjustified. Regarding Future Connected, I actually found myself agreeing with you on that more since I went in with those big expectations and I'm also not that big of Melia fan either. Overall, great video; and even though I don't share the same opinion with you on this game, I can agree that the Xenosaga series is by far a much better experience all the way through!
almost 2 years late but i DID have a good chuckle at you saying "you probably want to do quest so you arent underlevled" when a common complaint was that you are often OVERLEVELD if you do even just a few side quests to many
I just wanted to say that your content has been a major compliment to my experience with Xenoblade Chronicles. It's the first time I've ever played this series and without your guides, I don't think I would've enjoyed the game as much as I did. I'm gonna jump into XC2 in a few days, so I'll definitely be watching your older videos for help and I would love to watch another hour long video about XC2 hahaha Thanks again!
I disagree with a lot about what you said about the story and combat. XB2 100% starts off WAY slower than 1, not the other way around like you mention. Just because 2 is more complex later on, doesn't all of a sudden make 1 less complex. Sure, if you put 200+ hours into a game, it's gonna get old, but this game isn't a constantly updated MMO. it's a story driven single player game, and everything was designed around that. A Majority of side quests are completed while playing the main story, as they aren't meant as truly in-depth content (the main story has that covered). The side quests simply act as extra stuff to do while exploring the massive environments and completing the story
Something I never hear discussed is the character of Vanea. She is the real hero of the game, because she re-awakened Meyneth. If it were not for Vanea, the party would have been killed by face nemesis (controlled by Egil) at Galahad fortress. Vanea is also the sole reason the party survived Egil’s attack after the mechonis field/central factory portion (where gadolt sacrifices himself to buy Meyneth time). On top of that, Vanea had not only lost her people to Zanza thousands of years ago, but she also witnessed her once-noble brother turn into a revenge seeking monster, with absolutely no hope of changing his mind until thousands of years later when shulk and his friends come by. And to top it off, as soon as her goal is met (Egil’s mind is changed), he dies. Those thousands of years of Vanea trying to change Egil’s ways were all for nothing. All of these conditions resulted in a complex character with great motivations. However, in the game’s execution, Vanea was a ton of wasted potential. Given how her actions saved the party’s lives multiple times and her endless state of suffering, she should have had MUCH more interactions with the rest of the cast. She was so important to the plot, and yet the game chose to treat her like an irrelevant side character that the party hardly interacted with. It also would have been much better if Vanea because a party member after the events of Mechonis Core, as that would have created both more variety in combat and the 8-person party would have had representation of all the races of the xenoblade world. Main idea is this: Vanea did not get the treatment by the game and the rest of the characters that she deserved. Not by a long shot.
Dude, this is hands down one of your best videos, it impresses me every time to see the outstanding amount of passion and dedication that you have for this series. The hard work you have put in this video really makes for high quality content to appreciate, I'm looking forward to more videos like this one.
I was 16 at the time the original came out and this was my first j-rpg. At that time, I didn't really watch anime either (I sure do now) so I wasn't really aware of the tropes, which made a fair amount of this game not-so predictable for me. So I really do think this is really good as a first experience with j-rpgs, the story/combat/difficulty are all simple but not too simple which makes it really easy to digest in a way. Also, funny story, I bought this game at the same time as I did Super Paper Mario on the wii. I started playing this, got to the Ether Mines and got bored there (2nd worst area imo, 1st being Bionis's Interior), so I went and started SPM, beat the ENTIRE GAME, and only then came back to this game after like 2 weeks. And guess what cutscene we get after the Ether Mines ? Yup, we hear Metal Face talking for the first time, and at that point I had completely forgot the existence of Mumkhar, so needless to say that I didn't see that plot twist coming (I admit the Fiora one was pretty obvious though) :p Regarding Dickson, I remember being suspicious of him back then, but I think my suspicions had completely died down when he found us on the Fallen Arm and was like "btw I know Miqol and this whole place but I guess the cat's out of the bag now" and I didn't really think much of him after that. So yeah, my plot senses were kinda weak to say the least XD
-just wanna live in peace yet- -Egil's gonna keep us restless- -running just to own our own breaths- It's cool to see a more critical perspective from someone who is a superfan of the series. Great video as always!
Yeah not in total agreement, I think the thing I liked least about this video was the sarcastic tone through all of the story section, felt a bit tiresome to listen to instead of straight up criticism. Anyway I see so much effort in this and really appreciate it, great job!
Enel just has a massive bias against the entire story. Reyn and every other character is fantastic in someway. Remember. A character being irrelevant, if written well is still a good character.
It's funny to me how right after this video I get recommendations like why XC is a masterpiece or how excellent it's foreshadowing is. I appreciate that you talk about XC in a more harsh(?) way than praising everything and only mentioning some down-sides. Still, one of my fav. games of all time :)
Another thing that other comments missed about the foreshadowing is that XC1 does it in layers. It's very good at throwing obvious hints thrown in with subtle ones that can misdirect the first timers, and also several lines that make sense in context both during the first and later viewings of the game. And then there's everybody's favorite unnecessary line at sartorl.
Enel: this combat system gets repetitive after 300 hours. I won't come back to it for thousands of hours like I do Xenoblade 2 and X. Me: *looks at his 350 total hours across all 3 games*. But.. unique talent arts and distinct playstyles for each character!
haha i actually only have like 140 hours in the game total now and I don't really feel like I have any reason to play it anymore. Remember much of that wasn't post game either
@@EnelXC I'm at like 160 total between Definitive Edition and Wii. About to Mechonis core in DE. I have probably played as Shulk for less than a half hour of this whole playthrough cuz I used him so much in my first playthrough. I'm slowly coming around to 2 and X's battle systems being better and more customizable and interesting. If there's one thing I wish the next Xenoblade could take from DE though is giving each character unique talent arts that both dictate the theme of their playstyles and the overall theme of the character (Dunban being the focused samurai being the best example). Also, I know your combat videos have been pretty late game oriented, but I feel like Heat Haze + Soaring tempest Dunban needs to get talked about at some point for clearing mobs in mid-late game. The strat literally works better the more enemies you have aggroed. Can't beat a boss in the center of the room? Aggro all his minions and just use the combo to insta-build the party gauge. Who cares if Peerless isn't active when every hit is a crit and you're getting chain multipliers almost non stop.
I really appreciate this review and everything you talked about in depth. I do believe this game is amazing on a first playthrough when things are fresh and new but on NG+ and revisiting years later with DE the cracks are quite visible. Your issues with the game seemed to be very well thought out and I like how you tackle them in a more objective manner while still conceding this is pretty good as a base line for things to come. This is great content as always and I'm excited for what else comes after.
Great vid as always, it's nice to see your production quality steadily improves as you make more videos. I adore this game, it's at least in my top 3 games of all time. But the reasons that I love this game so much are (obviously) not objective. For example, I love the random chance for a chain link. I'm not blind to its faults however. The story is super generic, to the point where it gets worse the more JRPGs you have played. And while the dialogue isn't as stilted as in XC2, it is still pretty damn cringy at times (I cringed hard in DE when the party leaves the Fallen Arm and starts their little speech about fear). The world is far too large for your movement speed (Quick Step gems are not a good replacement for a sprint button, Monolith). We criticize what we love. And I could clearly see in this video that you also love this game.
After replaying this game for years and very recently beating Xenogears and Xenosaga trilogy, the imperfections of this game have become much more clear to me while I still love it. The story becomes less impressive, less original, and the characters don’t stand out as much. While I still believe the foreshadowing is more positive than negative, some of the foreshadowing, particularly Dickson, is way too obvious and visions go from overused to completely forgotten about. Outside of Egil, the villains don’t stand out too much and even Egil doesn’t get as much screen time as I would’ve preferred. Many villains in the other games get plenty more screen time. Presentation and world wise I believe it’s the strongest Xeno game. X is a close 2nd but I’m more attached to 1’s areas and DE is gorgeous. I absolutely love the environments for the most part. The soundtrack is also a masterpiece, however I still prefer 2’s over it and the battle theme variety is lacking which saga 3 and blade 2 surpass it in that regard (we don’t talk about saga 1’s variety). Unique battle themes help make important villains and fights more memorable and Egil deserves to have his own and Dickson as well. Side quests are a thing. At least you don’t have to constantly check the wiki anymore but it’s still mostly boring. Future connected was a disappointment but the shoulder is a really cool area. Time attack is a giant meme. After all of this time, I still love the simplicity of the gameplay, as flawed as it is. When I want complex Xenoblade gameplay, I can go play X or 2. 2 is definitely the best gameplay wise and, after experiencing all the Xeno games, 2 is possibly the best overall. But sometimes I just want to stick to simplicity, and 1 fills that role. DE fixed the slower performance rate and issues of the original along with QOL changes which decreased the total play time compared to the original, something I really appreciate as someone that has played the original several times. Overall I’m extremely happy DE exists, but some things they added they should’ve either not bothered with or done more with. My opinion of this game has evolved over time and it’s not just necessarily due to age, but also due to what already proceeded before it. I think it’s a good thing to recognize flaws in your favorites because it shows you’ve taken the time to dissect everything and acknowledge areas that can be improved upon in the future or what other games already do better. Xenoblade 1 elitists are some of my least favorite people because they’re stuck living in the world with rose-tinted glasses and refuse to have their views challenged. I still love 1 even after all of this and critically thinking about it for years. The strength of Xenoblade 1 is it’s simplicity. It’s easy to digest and understand. Perhaps this is where the rift forms for those that prefer 1 to the other games which are much more complex and have their own flaws. Another thing is that 1, and especially DE, didn’t have any obvious developmental restraints compared to most other Xeno games which left some unfinished traces of held them back. The Xeno games are a glorious series and DE is certainly the best starting point for any newcomer, but please also play the other games too. Especially to those that have only played the Xenoblades, there’s so much you can learn from playing the prior games and seeing where everything proceeded from and how we got to where we are now. Anyways great video Enel!
I have some problems with your plot critique. There are several, but the general theme can be well represented by one example: You state that you don't like the big plot visions and give the example that the post-Ether mine vision shows you that the Emperor dies. At that point in the story, you're like "The who?" Because the existence of an empire, let alone an emperor, has not come up. Basically, while you critique the plot twists in the game for being predictable, you frequently use information that requires spoilers in order to predict them. True, some of the plot twists aren't super hard to figure out (Mumkar, for instance), but several times you seem to call things obvious that definitely are not when they happen in the plot. I would say, for instance, where you say it's "super obvious" that Fiora is the lady being put in the Face mechon, the mysterious Meyneth character mentioned in those cutscenes would have been a better candidate. Almost seems like you read the TVTropes before playing and still decided to act like you were unspoiled.
Love your content. Your passion of the game and what you do shows in all of your videos. I disagree slightly on a few things, but over all thought this was great.
While I personally don't agree with a lot of your points I can understand your perspective. One part in particular I want to discuss is about FC. When we were getting info on it, I never expected it to be anything more than an epilogue to the story. Something that is overall more slow and just a short and sweet send off for the world of Xenoblade 1. I actually really like what the shoulder displayed and I really agree about the shoulder being one of the best areas in the game. I think the quiet moments in FC are very good and flesh out the characters very well moreso than the original. And I think FC was a way of them learning from alot of their earlier mistakes from the previous Xenoblade titles. Not in combat but more in spacing out content in an area. I wouldn't be surprised if the next xeno game we play thru will have a world that has progression similar to this. And one little thing to end it. I personally enjoy the characters in 1 and X more than in 2. But I'm now uncertain if it is due to the superior voice acting in 1 and X. Because I personally did not enjoy the voice acting in 2 both English and Japanese grated on my ears. After watching your videos I am understanding the combat of 2 more but still need more time to really understand things. But my first time thru 2 was a terrible experience from start to finish except music. I had no enjoyment throughout and I ended up predicting most of everything in 2 similar to how you predicted everything in this game. But I also do not think predictability is necessarily a bad thing. I want to thank you for perspective and it's your videos that convinced me to try 2 again for the combat after I swore I would never touch it again. Thank you for that as well. I hope I didn't come off as rude, I really do understand your points. And I hope your day is a good one.
it’s hard to make this or really listen to this because you have played this game and beaten the game before. therefore it’s hard to say that plot twists aren’t that good because you’ve played through these before. you kinda have to look at it through a new players eyes. cause that’s what makes the story so good.
When i was a new player I remember thinking similar things and the experiences of friends of mine this time around have also echoed much of this in a way
I mean, even with new players, it's kind of easy seeing some of this stuff coming from miles away. Especially that one off comment about Dickson at Satorl Marsh in my first playthrough, I knew he was coming off as a traitor. Still saw it coming, even when taking nearly a month to get to that part of the game on Mechonis Core, by playing it off and on, like maybe 2 to 4 hours a day, with not that much focus on progress for the story.
Wait so daddy Enel can predict a god living within Shulk and latterly every single plot twist except the genetic code of the high entia on his first time threw, ok.
I think the plot feels a lot more cliche when you play a lot of other similar RPGs first. When xenoblade is your introduction to the genre, the foreshadowing is a lot less obvious, plus there's a lot of time between cutscenes and you're distracted with gameplay. In hindsight, everything is obvious as fuck, and I honestly think that's by design. You won't really see it and remember it unless you're really keyed in and looking for it. It's part of why so much emphasis is placed on experiencing the games for yourself first and avoiding spoilers. The story hits different that first time you play. And then if you play a second time you have that "OHHHHHHH!" moment during a lot of cutscenes and it feels super cool. Sure, big moments have heavy foreshadowing and there are spoilery visions. But without the context of the scene, you can't really piece everything together. The end result is that it actually builds intrigue rather than detracting from the plot. Having hindsight makes it really easy to pick apart, but the reality is that during the average first playthrough, you either won't notice or will forget about foreshadowy bits before they become relevant. As for the characters, I agree they are largely ignored in favor of plot writing and shulk's character development. Everything revolves around shulk. The deuteragonist of the final 1/3-1/2 of the story, fiora, seems to have a one track mind all leading to shulk. I never really cared for any of the other characters that much and they don't seem that deep.
It's nice to see someone give this game some shit for once. It gets so tiring seeing everyone praise it like it does literally everything right, while bashing 2 like it's the worst sequel ever made.
I think of XC2 as a bad sequel because it did not match the expectations i had considering what xc1 did. However, on its own, it’s a fantastic game that i truly enjoyed nearly as much as xc1. (Reason is 1´s story is more grand and cohesive and most of 2´s characters (except rex/vandahm/malhos and a few torna members) are not as deep as i’d like them to be ). I’m just sick of people trying to rank them cause all 3 games are just too different to be compared, even if it keeps the same soul. Still got to play Torna and FC though, my opinion might change, can’t wait.
the only sort of plot hole i could see is Egil's reason for killing everything on Bionis. The living beings on the Bionis are the "food" of it after they die, so naturally you want to kill everything, thus giving the Bionis all of the "food"
this man really made a whole documentary about xenoblade 1
lol, never expected to see blunz in enel's comment section
Now we need one for Xenoblade 2
Let's not talk about that one 7h stream
"This is" Enel video when?
Thank goodness he did. I love hearing his stuff in my free time when I'm not playing 😆🤣
I agree, we need one for xc2+ torna!
About the "we knew the emperor would die" we saved Reyn, Sharla, Juju and Otharon after showing them dying, so its not that clear because most people will think he will be saved
I agree. By this point in the game it feels like we could save the Emperor after so many successes, that it makes it more tragic when we see him die.
Hkg 1 with Otharon in the vision you hear “Juju, Gadolt! This is for you!” compared to in the cutscene where you hear “Gadolt! This is for you” so dialogues can change too
Yeh idk how anyone could say that they knew for certain the emperor was gonna die the entire game up until that point was you getting visions of people dying and then saving them idk why people would assume the emperor would be any different
@Hkg 1 My guy, we get it, you're really big brain. But not everyone is as galaxy brain as you.
In all seriousness, why can't you accept that this is a point that is subjective? In fact, if we're speaking objectively, way more people saw this future as something that could've/would've been changed than otherwise, meaning that statistically speaking it's way less set in stone than you believe it is. When something is "obvious" to you but not nearly as obvious to hundreds upon thousands of others, consider that your point of view isn't the objective or be all end all one.
@@itsyaboi1245 I don't know, maybe because the scene of Sorean dying was shown one too many times, not even just by Shulk either. Unlike every other scene of other's dying, which was shown up to 2 to 3 times, if that, where as for Sorean was like 5 and up. Like, is there any other reason to keep showing the same death scene one too many times, unless something else is up unlike the other times he's had visions?
I think the idea with Dickson is that after he betrays the party, he intentionally acts like the biggest asshole villain he can in order to suppress his conflicted feelings. That would be why his last words are praise for Shulk.
I wish Dickson can explain more of his true race's background story since he wasn't possessed like zanza and he still retained his original thoughts. It would be nice to know more about that instead of just focusing on the story plot.
His death makes me cry every single time. "Shulk, his wounds..."
I didn't mind his betrayal but his motivation is very lazy and didn't really explain much or make sense :/
@@nascour5991 from some context it seems he just wanted to be immortal. Potentially since his race was dying off. That would be my best guess. Over time he eventually grew to love shulk and he knew he would lose his immortality and likely die if he did not help zanza. But thats just my best theory on him.
I think the main reason people did not notice such obvious foreshadowing is because of the gameplay. You got dozens and dozens of sidequests. After finishing all that, you just kinda forgot about them. I know I do.
This is actually a fair point I didn't consider
Im the only guy that left most side quests to lategame cause of how exciting the story was?
Might explain why Metal Face's identity came as a surprise to me.
@@GURGLEGUY12345 I know who metal face is fairly early on. But I completely forgot Dickson will betray us.
Even though the game pretty much tells us that he's a traitor right before Mechonis core, I spent DAYS trying to fill in the collectopeadia and stuff for colony 6, because item tracking isn't a thing in the Wii.
@@GURGLEGUY12345 yep. I kinda glosed over the intro scene, so not much expectations there. Then again I played on 3ds without headphones as the audio wasn't very good and voice was just muffle to me as the voice would have been a dead give away.
my favorite part of the story is when Alvis unlocks Monado Jump
Underated comment
Air Slash 2
Mine is smash
Yeah, the wind Monado art is so cool!
Mine is enchant but it’s called buster
Next week:
"Xenoblade Chronicles 2: Double Spinning Breakdown"
@CaptianDiscord "we'll win with the power of friendship" rex - every 5 minutes
The one thing I disagree with is the "Two sides of me" thing is obvious foreshadowing. Simply because it's SO cliche for characters to say that whether they have an evil half or not. I was surprised by this line on my second playthrough.
The foreshadowing in this game is like nothing I have ever seen. It’s absolutely mental.
Not gonna lie but, I completely forgot that mumkhar was a thing until he revealed himself.
Yea, honestly on a first playthrough you don't really get who Metal face is because you see Mumkhar for like a couple of minutes, he supposedly dies right away and no one ever mentions him so you really forget about him and don't notice the hints like the claws etc.
Lmao so true I was like “wait who is this guy”
Yeah, I completely forgot about Mumkhar b/c he had barely been shown. So it was a surprise to me. I also strongly disagree w/ the idea that "a character isn't dead if you don't see them die on screen". It feels like a bs argument that's brought out anytime a character doesn't actually die, and is never brought up anytime someone actually is killed off-screen as a discretion shot or the like. A total bs, "yeah of course I knew" after-the-fact kind of claim.
I only knew it was him because of the smash brothers spirit. Thanks Sakurai!
@@Qwerty10254 Exactly. During my first playthrough of the game, I had about over 53 hours in the game before I reached the base of Valak Mountain. I will say though, watching the cutscenes in the gallery again is WAY more savage once you know who it is, because you know that he KNOWS what he's doing and who's watching him do it.
I mean, if the plot twists were completely impossible to guess, you could easily say they came out of nowhere, which isn't a good thing either. I don't mind predictability if everything make sense. It just mean the plot is well written.
Foreshadowing is really damn good in this game, and the writing is still very solid.
Mylaur the foreshadowing is only noticeable if you know what happens in the story but still when I played though this game blind I was shocked at so many different parts of the story
It wouldn't be out of nowhere if everything made sense AFTER the reveal. But if you can tell something long before it is actually revealed it's not exactly well written. Especially if these reveals make it seem like it is supposed to surprise you. Both Fiora and Mumkhar didn't surprise me in the least. I kept expecting the game would try to lead me on to believe it is obvious only to revert my expectations. Well it didn't.
Apart from Gadolt that was really obvious
Yeah that’s what I got out of it when playing this game and there was plenty of great subtle foreshadowing I think for a person playing it for the first time with some foreshadowing even going as far back as chapter 1. Honestly the reviewer just sounded very jaded and idk how to put it nicely but a little butt hurt? I’m not sure if it is because he is very annoyed this game is held in high regard or something but whatever the case he did bring up some good criticism either way.
Thanks to youtubers like you and chuggaaconroy I actually know that this series exists and now it’s my favorite single player game ever. Thanks for keeping these games alive on TH-cam bro
Yeah
I also picked it up cause I saw emiles lp
I agree that they made Mumkhar quite obvious. especially on the English version. But I actually like this fact, since the developers intentionally used a highly recognizable Japanese voice actor(Norio Wakamoto) (Not sure about the English voice actor) for Mumkhar. They actually wanted to make people who were paying attention notice this.
If they wanted to keep it hidden, they could have just used a different voice actor just like Fiora and Silver Face
Technically it’s Face Nemesis but either way good point
@@EgotisticalAltruist no in japan it was silver face
@@EgotisticalAltruist in japan her title was white/silver face
@@ZeroAoAnimations shulk calls it silver faced mechon in english
Very good video. In terms of non-story criticisms, I widely agree. However, I feel like a lot of your story-related critiques are somewhat biased. Aside from a couple specific moments, I feel like the foreshadowing was very well done. (Dickson at the end of the marsh and Gadolt with Jade face are the only painfully obvious ones)
1. Munkhar being Metal Face? Not as obvious as you make it out to be. Lot of games have a habit of killing "filler" characters, so a lot of people don't even try to remember Mumkhar after dying 3 minutes in. By the time his voice is revealed, few remember him.
As for the Face aspect of things, I personally always thought it was some kind of antibody or chemical way to counter the Monado. (Lorithia's antibodies, Apocrypha are the kind of thing I was thinking of)
2. Fiora being put in Nemesis is kinda obvious, but some people miss that one. Suppose people could think it's cyborgs controlling faces.
3. Dickson could have been much more subtle, but even so, you don't know when, why, or how he is "deceiving these kids." I don't think that takes away from his betrayal that much.
4. Shulk does change the future, that much is drilled into our heads, and he's saved lives before. So is it really crazy to think the Emporor might live? That one raises concern, but it's far from guaranteed like you make it sound.
5. The 2 voices in my head foreshadowing is actually very subtle. I don't understand how you think that's obvious. That's a common expression people say when they're conflicted. Just reflects the duality of the mind, the good angel and bad angel concept.
6. The Trinity isn't too obvious. Alvis is sketchy, and he and Lorithia clearly have something going on. But it could just be imperial corruption like with Yumea. And Dickson doesn't interact with either of them really until right before the Core.
Aside from those minor gripes, amazing content as always Enel. Thanks for reading if you read all that. I'm a big XC2 fan too, (as you can guess lol) just wanted to hear your thoughts on why you think 2's story is better? it's good, no doubt, but it never left as strong an impression on me as 1.
I know one of your biggest gripes with one is it's predictability, but I personally find 2 to be pretty predictable story-wise. Your thoughts?
Mumkhar and Metal Face literally have the same weapons and voice
@@aaronr.265 Yeah, but what I'm saying is most people will probably forget about him by that point. Cutscene outside the mine where you hear him is like 7-10 hours of gameplay at least.
Jin If you have the memory of a goldfish I guess
I guess fiora coming back as playable character and mumkhar right away because I am used to how those JRPG structure their story so that is easy to guess. I don't know fiora was in the faces, I didn't know about the trinity, I didn't know about the dickson is on zanza side, didn't know who zanza was, didn't know all of those until the very end. So I would say the story is still well written, and it was not obvious to me. I think Enel played too much xenoblade games that he might've forgot he played xenoblade chronicles 1 already and of course he knew all of those all along. For us first timer it is well written, and I liked riki as a comical relief otherwise this story is very intense.
@@aaronr.265 most people don't remember the twat who runs away and dies in the prologue 10 hours of gameplay later, hence the majority of people don't immediately get it. If they were to rewatch the opening, maybe. But this game foreshadows almost everything somehow, and that's one of the things that makes the story feel so fluid.
I respect all the effort you put in to this but at times (like with dickson finding the monado during the story part) you mixed up dramatic irony and foreshadowing.
Foreshadowing is where the audience and characters have a clue, that’s usually subtle, which tells us about an aspect of the story that’s gonna happen.
Dramatic irony is where the audience knows something which the characters don’t. Like take for example if I was watching a play, character A says to character B “I love you” and then Character A says aside (only audience heres) “I can’t wait to steal his money”. This is:
A) dramatic irony
B) a bad play
You get me?
I really don't agree about the plot twists being obvious. The game provides you with enough hints and foreshadowing that you can figure things out in advance, but that hardly makes it obvious, and there's plenty of minor misdirections used along the way. Like with how the Monado that doesn't cut people can't cut Faced Mechon - it really didn't stick out so much in mind at the time I first saw Metal Face, because NOTHING seemed to be harming him at that point. The whole Colony 9 attack sets up Metal Face as indestructible, with him tanking everything, including being shot in the face at point-blank range with a huge cannon. At that point I was thinking of the Faced Mechon as the next evolution of Mechon technology, bigger, stronger, faster and capable of even resisting the Monado, not that they had Homs stuffed into them.
Or take the first Face Nemesis scene - sure, if you already suspect that Fiora isn't really dead (despite the infamously human-eating Mechon having swarmed her corpse, and a Colony 9 NPC even mentioning her being eaten), you'll probably think that the woman with her face covered is Fiora. Then again, the woman is explicitly identified as someone else (Meyneth), and once you finally see Face Nemesis in action, the character has a different voice and knows a bunch of things that Fiora has no way of knowing.
Enel really undermined a lot of the foreshadowing in this game. There's a lot that happens in this game that can distract from a few elements, but I prefer plot points that can be thought about and come to new conclusions rather than extremely convoluted plot points that make no sense.
@@They_are_Arthur I know Enel generally prefers 2's story more, but let's not pretend that game's story had it's own fair share of obvious foreshadowing moments.
@@FireFury190 Pretty sure Enel knows that, and doesn't hide that fact. But rather points out what people seem to forget about 1. Also when it comes to fanservice debacle, that was being brought up many times with these, while not as abundant as 2's, people again forget Sharla is a thing. And yes, pretty much everything she wears sexualizes her in some way, whether short shorts, cleavage, ass cheeks, or so on, there's no avoiding it with her. Made even worse in the original when her, along with Vanea (a literal living robot), have bouncing tiddies all day.
So really, this is pointing out the hypocrisy the Xenoblade 1 fans seems to have, when bringing up these points on 1's story.
@@byronlyons3548 Hey I don't mind. I love Xenoblade 1, but I dislike the fans that have way too much blind love for this game. Especially when they shit on Xenoblade 2 for being awful despite it doing certain things better than 1 did. So I don't mind Xenoblade 1 getting bit more deserved criticism. Especially if it puts it on even ground with X and 2. As I personally feel all 3 games are equally great. Balancing each other out by excelling in certain areas the other games don't.
i think definitive edition kinda ruins the reveal because the scenes where Fiora is put into the mech were dark in the original making it harder to work out.
Personally, I agree with you about as often as I disagree with you in this video, but I can seriously respect the amount of time and effort it took to make this. While I do think that Xenoblade Chronicles 2 also has a really great story, I feel like it’s much more disjointed. Each individual arc of the story makes sense in its own context, but I feel like each arc has a stand alone pacing to it. XC2 is much more episodic than the original, with clear cut rising action, climax, and falling action per chapter which makes the pacing between chapters feel awkward at times. Additionally, while everything that happened in XC2 can be attributed to Amalthus, he feels very nebulous as a villain until the very end when he goes from being a malevolent force hiding behind a pretty face to being almost comically evil. By contrast, the story in XC1 feels much more cohesive. There are clear cut goals and objectives that the characters are trying to achieve and as they solve one problem, another arises which gives an organic feeling to the twists in the story. The threat goes from being the Mechon as a nebulous whole, to being the leader of Mechonis as an idea, to Egil as a person, to Zanza as the one manipulating everything from the beginning. While Zanza and Amalthus are both shadowy figures manipulating the party, and while both want to become the sole being in existence so they can reshape the world as they desire, Amalthus’s sudden switch from calm, collected, and gentle to manic, aggressive, and egotistical comes across as somewhat jarring, whereas from the moment we even start learning about Zanza, he seems like a manipulator working for his own benefit from the beginning, but he’s set things up in a way that the only feasible way for the party to move forward is by giving Zanza what he wants. From his introduction we’re constantly questioning him and his motives, why he was locked up in the first place, why are the Mechon so against him, what did he do to cause Egil to despise him so much?
I didn’t mean to ramble on so much, I love both stories and the lore behind them so much, I just think the villain was done better in 1 than in 2, and the villain is what really drives the story, you know?
Dude use paragraph. I can't climb this wall.
tl;dr : Zanza feels like a more natural villain than amalthus, which is.. true?
It's convenient that you didn't mention how Malos is a more interesting recurring villain than Metal Face.
Heck, he is one of the main reasons why Enel prefers Xenoblade 2's story over 1's.
I'd like to know what you think of 3 based on your statement that the villain is what drives the story when personally I feel that the villains in 3 are the worst besides a select few
@@bobbobert7967 I haven’t finished 3 yet, I only just started chapter 4 because I keep getting sidetracked by side content, but I do think the Consuls are interesting thus far. However, having an evil organization rather than a single primary baddie has its pros and cons, and if you look at the consuls individually rather than as parts of a whole it does weaken their effect. I think as the story progresses if we learn more about their true identities I might be more invested in them.
In my opinion, Xenoblade 1 is a game you play once for start to end, then you get your friend to play for start to finish while you watch.
You'll know every twist and turn but your friend will be clueless the entire run (save for the foreshadowing)
There's no way anybody heard shulk say that he had 2 voices in his head and immediately knew somebody else was in his body that's just too out there. You dont even know who zanza is when he says that. Fiora just "died" in front of him so him saying that a part of him wants revenge isnt "obvious foreshadowing " at all
Agreed
This game is 70+ hours, or more, with like 12-14 hours of cutscenes that dont count on gameplay, people forget things between cutscenes. It happened to me.
Yeah, the game's pretty long, so it's easy to miss a plot point or two.
@@They_are_Arthur same thing happened to me on my first playthrough since it was spread out over a long period
@@kingarth0r Yeah, the game has some pretty long stretches between cutscenes.
i finished the story my first time playing in 45 hours lol
Wow, even if I disagree with a lot that you said, I appreciate the amount of effort that went into making this video and I can at least understand your point of view.
It's also really impressive how you manage to keep someones attention for one and a half hour although he disagrees with a lot you say. That only shows the quality of your content and that you actually care about it.
For example, I wouldn't watch five minutes of someone just straight up trash talking this game
As I played through the Definitive Edition, I was playing XC2 alongside with it. And that the absolute best time I had with this series ever. Since I knew both games from before, it really helped me appreciating their strengths and noticing the weaknesses both games have. May just be my personal dumb opinion, but I like them equally, and no one will will tell me otherwise :)
Can only imagine how much your hands hurt from typing a script this long wow
You know people write books, right?
Yeah, you dont write this in a day
lmao you think writing 4000 words is hard?
This was an interesting video to watch. I'll give my own opinion on some points that I disagree with. *(This is long, I know, but please read this, I watched the whole video)*
*_Gameplay_*
I can agree with how little customization there was in this game. The game doesn't give much aside from gems and different arts, but I'd say that's good enough, and keeping it simple allows it to be easily accessible. I played through Xenoblade X one time, and after seeing it's credits roll, I never replayed the game again because of how cluttered X's interface felt, and once I got into the rhythm of X's combat, I never felt much of a desire to keep playing once I was done.
I've played Xenoblade 1 three different times, and even now I still feel like replaying it partly because of the battle system. There's a bit of a catharsis in hearing the characters yell out their catchphrases. Over and over.
*_Exploration_*
To me, every location (except Ether Mines) is really good, mostly from a world building standpoint. I find the large locations to be fun to run around in, simply for the spectacle of how small you are in this world of a titan. Bionis Leg never dragged for me and I always find it fun to discover every landmark and quest that is present on this location every time I return to it in a subsequent playthrough. I find Makna Forest's huge lake and long river to be great just for the size of it. The game never tells you to go there, and if you really want to, you can swim across all of the water you can see, which is just really novel. Same with Eryth Sea. I found the fact that there was such a large body of water to be great for the fact that it's just there, majestically glowing at different times of day, and once again, you can swim in it if you want to. Alcamoth's size never bothered me because of the music, and seeing this highly advanced society is just amazing and makes the future events even more tragic once it's infested.
*_Story_*
I almost punched my drywall sitting through this part. I have a lot to say but I'll choose specific points that I disagree with.
1. You constantly rant about how easy it is to predict certain plot elements, and the thing is, I think that was the point. Everything that is foreshadowed towards is extremely logical, stuff like how Dickson becomes evil, Muhmkar is Metal Face, and Fiora being a Mechon all make plenty of sense, and I don't think any of these are weak plot points simply for being predictable. I believe the intent about stuff like Dickson being evil was meant to be shown to the player as a bit of dramatic irony, since the main party doesn't know much his true allegiances. This is why they have entire scenes where he speaks to Lorithia and Alvis about their foreboding plans, because the intent was supposed to show us that Dickson was evil the whole time. What mattered most was the character's reactions to Dickson being evil, since they didn't get to see Dickson's evil side before. Shulk and the parties reaction to Dickson makes a lot of sense, and the shock is mostly supposed to be taken in seeing how the characters react to seeing Dickson act like this.
2. You complain about how Fiora only had about 10 minutes of screen time before being killed, but to me, screen time didn't matter that much. The game shows that it's been 1 year since the Battle of Sword Valley, and it's been shown that life has been very peaceful. We are even introduced to Fiora in a scene with Dunban, literally the character we saw in the Prologue. I think this does an excellent job at showing how much we should care about Fiora by immediately associating her with the first character we play as (Dunban), and then immediately afterwards with the next character that we play as (Shulk). And then when Fiora and Shulk see Reyn in the lab, we even get a little more character interaction with Reyn showing that he also cares for Fiora. Couple this with the fact that Fiora has a strong relationship with all of the playable characters so far, and she's even a fully playable and customizable character, and this makes her death feel very earned. This beginning part did not need to be 2 hours long (cough cough, Kingdom Hearts 2) or overly long to establish Fiora as an important character, as the shown and implied relationships with the other characters fills all of that in quite nicely.
3. I disagree wholeheartedly that the story starts to slow down to a crawl before Alcamoth. I think showing Shulk discover new Monado powers and showing him save different people with the visions was supposed to hammer the point that Shulk can change the future. When I first played the game blindly, I legitimately thought Reyn was going to die in Tephra Cave since I saw Fiora die before, so it came as a surprise to see a new Monado art come into play that saved Reyn. When Sharla and Juju are seen to possibly die, I knew Sharla wouldn't die, but the game now throws in an NPC that I think can actually die. And right after that, it shows Otharon, a much older character that already was working with Gadolt, a different character that actually died. After all of these successful saves in a row, this makes seeing the Emperor's death in the vision feel more reversible, as we've saved everyone up except for Fiora up to this point. Once the Emperor dies, we see that once again we failed to save someone from their fate, but in the same scene, Shulk discovers that Fiora is alive, hence giving new meaning to any supposed deaths we've seen or heard of up to this point. This stretch of the story is very important, and without it, I can't imagine how the story would've gone if the party just flawlessly ran up to Prison Island.
*_Characters_*
This part aggravated me to no end. Not ONCE did you ever mention the Heart to Hearts which give more insight and character interaction with all 7 party members. You only looked at stuff the main story showed, which is a huge disservice to the fact that these Heart to Hearts are very well written, and there are about 65 of these Heart to Hearts. There's a reason Definitive Edition allows you to rewatch Heart to Hearts as well as the Main Events, because these Heart to Hearts give ALL of the much needed character interactions that you said was missing. If there was an ideal way to experience the story of Xenoblade 1, I think wedging in the Heart to Hearts between specific cutscenes would be the best way to get the most of both worlds.
*_Villains_*
I found Xord to be a great first villain for the party to encounter. His over the top and dark sense of humor made him an excellent and formidable foe to face off against. By this point in the game, the player only met Metal Face, so to see another faced Mechon adds in some extra thought for exactly how many more of these faced Mechon exist. He is an excellent introductory villain that paints a small part of the larger picture of Xenoblade 1's world, which makes seeing Metal Face again with even more Xords a lot more intimidating, knowing that you would eventually have to fight more faced Mechon in the future.
To me, Lorithia is a great villain since she makes for a good foil to the much more innocent Melia, and really goes home in being a hate-able villain through and through. She's not the best in the game, but she does the job right, and as a villain for Melia, she's spectacular.
I agree, I love Egil.
Dickson I find to be the third best villain in my opinion (behind Egil and Zanza), as he in fact DOES have multiple moments of layers to him once he's shown as a full villain. Once in the scene in which he flies away from Colony 6, when he starts trembling to himself at the thought of Shulk being more powerful than him. This shows that he not only feels vulnerable, but also that he somewhat cares for Shulk. He's a disciple of a god, and he's lived for thousands upon thousands of years, and yet he still has feelings for this little Homs that he knew for only about 18 years of his life. This makes Dickson feel very human. He puts on a facade of villainy towards the party members in order to make them lose any sign of sympathy towards them, and in his dying moments, he doesn't want Shulk or the others to see him die, as he really didn't want Shulk to feel the pain of watching the closest being of a father figure lose his last breath.
And as for Zanza, I believe he's perfect. It is a standard for JRPGs to have a big God become the final boss, but to me, I feel like this God deserves all of the praise for being an exceptionally good villain. Throughout many cutscenes, we get small hints at Shulk not acting like himself. Seeing himself in his own dream, having two different sides of himself in his head, returning the soldiers in Tephra Cave to the Bionis, having such extreme hatred towards the Mechonis and the Mechon. All of these and more add to really excellent hints at Zanza pulling the strings from behind the whole time, and it makes perfect sense. I love Egil the best out of all the villains, but I think it was really good to have Egil's phase in the story transition to Zanza's phase in the story, as Egil constantly referred to himself as a God, and now there is a real God, and they're evil. This drives the point home that there should be no one as powerful as a God dictating the way others move through their lives, and to seize their own destinies. Zanza works very well as a villain, and he's a lot cooler than just having a spiffy outfit.
Anyways Enel, thank you for reading through all of this. I appreciate all of the work you do on this channel, as you really have made the Xenoblade community become a lot more noticeable on this platform. I appreciate the fact that you had an honest opinion, and I appreciate the fact that you didn't back down in making this video any shorter. I'm happy to be subscribed to you, and can't wait to see what the future of this channel holds.
This about sums up my feelings on the video too!!
Preach it! Those were my thoughts as well!
while i dont particularly find the events of alcamoth interesting until High Entia Tomb, its far better than just "sure okay you can go to prison island". i agree with everything here so so much.
This comment really reflects my thoughts on this game!
Watching the story section made me incredibly mad. Not because I can't handle critique of one of my favorite stories, but because the critique just didn't hold true for the most part. "The emperor's death was obvious, because they showed it to us so many times" is stupid if you understand that up to that point, we had seen visions of everyone's deaths and been able to prevent them. Otharon's vision wasn't unnecessary, it served to show that no matter how hopeless it may seem, the team still changed the future nonetheless. Etc. The in-depth gameplay guides and other videos are all great, but it really felt like he hadn't paid much attention to plot.
One thing I honestly really like about having autism is that I have a tendency to be more trusting than I probably should, so plot twists like dickson consistently work really well for me. Just a cool little thing about my neurodivergency that makes life more fun yknow?
Oh my god. You've explained why I have trust issues with games now!
Wait there are people who don't like Riki?!?
hello there, i don't like neither riki nor the whole nopon race
Is this fictional racism
@@arsenicsauce this could be a tag group
@@sergiovarela8907 My first instinct is to completely object to your opinion, but I'll hear you out. What do you not like about the Nopon? Or do you hate comic relief, or what?
@@march.7561 from their speech pattern to the goofy looks, the fact that the only character that I don't dislike is tora (because i'ts a weeb and i'ts kinda funny). They seem like the pet race, and I don't usually like those kind of characters.
I have to point out that Riki has his own good moments, but the bad still outweights the good.
Mans made a whole ass college essay on Xenoblade, Enel is really on his grind
As someone who was turned off from Xenoblade 2 at first, I’ve grown to love it a lot thanks to your content. Currently at the beginning of Chapter 5, btw. I think this video is great and addresses a lot of the things I do have problems with in XC1. However, I do think you left out a lot of the actual subtle foreshadowing throughout the whole game. For example, during Alvis’s introduction, him and Shulk both have their hands on the Monado when Alvis says the line “Both the material and the immaterial”. The camera focuses on Shulk during “material” and Alvis on “immaterial”. Also something I though was really cool is that on the back of Alvis’s coat is a symbol with the same shape as Seven’s chestplate, sort of hinting at his role.
Damn. Now I understand why that script was so long.
i refused my boyfriend's marriage proposal because i'm already engaging with this content
Should've said you engaged the enemy
@@racer164 I've got some unfinished business with an enemy too
Ahhh, a Xc1 movie.
I disagree with you about the open areas being boring.
Exploring the areas is my favorite aspect of this game. I just love seeing the sheer scale of each area. For example, on the Wreckage beach, you have an amazing view of both the Bionis and Mechonis. Sometimes you get views that foreshadows future areas. An example being in Makna Forest you can see Eryth Sea right above you. I also loved that at one story point you can see the Mechonis moving, which I thought was pretty neat. There's even some moments where you can see the progress you made along your journey. A good example of world building in the gameplay was outside the Ether mines you can see Colony 9 far below from where you are. My point is that you can't achieve this with a smaller scale world. Being the first attempt that Monolith has made a big world, I think they did a pretty good job at it.
Also, Valak mountain has fun ice physics and I'm a little disappointed that you didn't mention that. I have endless amounts of fun messing around with the ice physics to see how far I can jump over the mountain before the ramp.
The side quests, I kind of agree with you.
In a narrative way, they are boring for the most part. Only a handful has a memorable plot to them. However, they did give me an incentive to explore more of the world that this game presents which as I explained earlier is my favorite aspect of this game.
I also found the areas to be a lot of fun to explore. The music in each area is so much fun to listen to, and there's even special night time themes for most of the areas. If Xenoblade's locations weren't gigantic, I don't think this game would've been as memorable. I love how tiny and slow the main characters can feel when traversing this titanic world.
@Hkg 1 I view X in the same way you view 1. I think X has a lot of random spaces of large nothingness, and the movement is only fun until you get to the desert area (forgot what it was called). When the Skells are unlocked, it becomes a lot better imo.
@Hkg 1 I'm fine with earning skell. Even with the run button are too big to be fun. Xenoblade at least has the titan locations so it's fun looking around piecing together what body part you're on. And then there are the quick step gems which allow for faster movement.
@Hkg 1 Okay buddy, you do you.
@Hkg 1 Enough, we're getting worked up over some game.
I find your overall take on one very interesting, and to explain why I guess I'll need to give brief context to how I started playing Xenoblade. (brief as in an essay)
I discovered Xenoblade by literally picking up 2 on a whim because the artstyle looked interesting and Pyra was hot (hehe). I soon surpassed my brainlet decision and found actual reasons for liking the game, and soon after beating Two I immediately watched a playthrough of One. I had been curious due to lurking among online discourse on 'if Two is actually good' and 'which game is better'. Sufficed to say, after watching a playthrough of One basically understanding every story beat (Rest in not having a Wii/Wii U or understanding how to emulate it correctly at the time) I came to the conclusion that I could understand why people saw Xenoblade 1 as a better game whilst I held Two in a higher regard (mostly because I had actually played it).
I reacted very similarly to you in regards to DE's announcement. I had a higher interest in X due to how underrated it seemed and I also had tried (and failed) at reaching into the rest of the Metaseries like Xenosaga (One day I'll get a working emulation going). However, as DE approached to release, I had a lot more motivation to actually play One, especially with the announcement of Future Connected. Unfortunately in my undying quest to avoid spoilers due to a few close calls with 2, I avoided as much marketing for FC as possible. I knew two things: 1. I had seen they basically confirmed Alvis as Ontos, and 2. The name was Future fucking Connected. I was ecstatic because I found the similar ways 1 and 2's worlds experienced restoration a intriguing possibility to connect the games.
What I failed to realize with my assumptions towards Future Connected, and something I found out about before playing the game and chose to sort of ignore was that Future Connected was mostly akin to cut content for 1. I realized this pretty soon while playing FC and started enjoying it for what it was. Soon enough I was at the final fight, and all of a sudden the Connection I made to the fog king (not having Saga on my mind since I've seen like an hour of the first game) wasn't to the Gnosis but that they used a Guldo model from 2 for the Fog King. 'Oh boy, we're fighting a Guldo type enemy with a giant rift in the sky to another dimension right beside us, I wonder what that means?'.
In the end, obviously, that didn't matter. The only strong connection to Two aside from the real Experiment cutscene from 2 was Alvis and his space-time continuum bull honky.
All that made me put a perspective on the discourse I had seen online towards 1 and I came to a lot of conclusions about the story you did in the video.
However, despite all this I still enjoyed 1, immensely in fact. I agree with a lot of gripes you held, but--not to be rude--you sound extremely jaded in the video. While I concur that the only other Xeno game I've played, being Xenoblade 2, felt like it had a lot more character moments and writing, and even in my opinion a better plot, I still love 1 the most for the Grand Scale of its plot, setting, and themes. Everything is setup from the start of the first cutscene as big, then we get smaller, smaller, in scale, zooming in on where the beginning of the game starts. Now the goal of the developers was to start to build up back to that grand sense of scale throughout the story, and they did with the whole end of the game being 'Kill God and Decide your own Fate'. I feel the impact of this hypothetical quest the developers had In the large, open, and sometimes empty areas, thin or static characters with strong personality traits and little depth, and that previously mentioned escalation of story and themes. Does this forgive the game for lacking in certain areas? No. Did the sense of scale add some to my immersion in spite of those elements lacking? Yes, it did for me at least.
At this point, I think most people who prefer one more so appreciate what is was trying to do in addition to it probably being their introduction to the current state of the Xeno series, but obviously there's probably more nuance to it than that. 2 by far (my favorite so far) is without a doubt flawed in addition, but like you I see so many improvements to it as a game and I take how many times I've replayed it as a sign that I like it more. 2 was my introduction as well, which probably adds onto my love for it.
I guess I'll conclude with how I think DE panned out in light of my initial reaction to its development. Experiencing 1 for myself in such a heightened state has by far been a worthwhile experience especially during this pandemic. I didn't play the original through emulation to completion so I didn't have a handle on how DE could've improved the combat, all I knew was that I still held 2's in high regard. Do I think it was worthwhile that DE happened? Certainly, but I think the range of its influence will largely depend on what they do next with the series. DE serves as an actual reintroduction to the series standing just above the 3ds port, however with FC and time attack being underwhelming and the rest of the additions/improvements not doing too much to add to the base game, only making it a more complete experience, I feel a lot of fans are now wanting for that new experience we had hoped to have heard about instead. I'll be interested to even see if mainline Xenoblade (1 and 2's now sort of connected universe) goes further, if Saga or X get more attention, or if we get something new from Monolith in the future. I just hope that DE will justify its existence by providing a full view of 1 and 2 on the switch together to newer players in contrast to something new for us already interested.
Keep up the Good Work Enel, with every new video I look forward to seeing your improve more and more, as well as showing me how outclassed I am when playing these games.
Xenoblade 1 was my introduction to the series and Xenoblade 2 is my favorite between the 3 games. Xenoblade 1 had a really high bar to pass for me because of how mesmerized I was by its presentation and world. Since playing it, I've been searching for another game that would immerse me into their world as much as that game did, and no game I played did that until Xenoblade 2. X succeeded in immersing me into its world but not its story or characters, but Xenoblade 2 was precisely what I yearned for since beating the first game. I had a hard time deciding which game I liked more since the stories were so different in their approach. While Xenoblade 1 was initially better, there was something about Xenoblade 2's story that kept pushing me towards it and dissect it, and after Torna released, the full story of Xenoblade 2 finally clicked.
The themes used in Xenoblade 2 very much applies to our current reality. The theme of a corrupt power abusing military power while appearing as saints, individuals who have suffered due to the cycle of suffering created by the world itself and the humans who act in self interest. And with COVID happening around the world, it feels even more appropriate. But the story wasn't about how hopeless the world is, but rather despite how hopeless it feels, there are people who are still striving to help each other and make better lives for themselves and the people they are around. And that's the message that hit so hard for me. It's these characters who all felt like they've lost their purpose in life, but still trying to find hope to the future to find what their purpose to living is. And that made me think of what my purpose for existence is, and that thought helped me find a reason to keep moving forward in life. Because even if the world feels like it is beyond saving, there are people that are worth it to keep living for.
I largely agree with you on combat. I don't feel like it is as fun as X and 2, and chain attacks feel like a crapshoot for most of the game.
Also XC1 has like 2 good sidequests. All the rest are "kill monster A, get thing E, kill this very specific unique monster in Makna Forest that only shows up during a rare weather with no way to change said weather besides adjusting the clock."
That said, despite my gripes with the game, I still enjoyed it. Not my favorite game I ever played, but I enjoyed it
I loved the sidequests because I loved seeing how you shape the NPCs lives through your own actions. It felt rewarding for a really sentimental loser like me but looking back on it god was it tedious. That's why I am 100% never doing NG+
Damn and removing the nostalgia goggles, you can't really argue vs this. Though I still like the battle system in the three games.
I liked the side quests of this game. It gave me more of an incentive to explore and see more of the open areas.
I played 2 before 1 and I personally think that 1’s sidequests are kinda garbage. I wouldn’t have been able to know that I can get anything outside of exp for them and the fact that you need to speak to named npcs has never been explained. It’s too cryptic and rather boring.
Its funny i liked the battle system then played 2 hate that one so fucking much until i started learning more about it and because i do some leveling in the definitive edition i come back for it sometimes
But when i do it feels less dynamic then the second game
Enel, while I largely agree with your points, there are a few things you overlooked:
1. You argue that Shulk defeated Zanza due to the power of friendship, but this is incorrect. Zanza lost due to a MAJOR miscalculation. When he powered up the Monado, Meyneth was perplexed, asking why he would take such a risk. What she was getting at is that powering up the monado also added Zanza's full power to Shulk. This made Shulk more powerful than Zanza. Examples of this are:
a. Shulk seeing the future without visions on Mechonis
b. Shulk overpowering the Apocrypha throughout the journey on Mechonis (until being right next to it when he fights it)
c. Shulk preventing Zanza from coming out of him before the final fight with Egil
d. Shulk coming back to life after Zanza's soul left his body.
Each of these events is the direct result of Zanza's decision to power up the monado, and they were NOT part of his plan. He turned Shulk from a normal human, into a god. This is what Alvis meant when he says at the end of the game "The old god was defeated by the new god he himself created". He was pointing out the irony of Zanza's mistake. Zanza made this mistake because he believed that Egil was more dangerous than Shulk, and that the best course of action was to power up the monado so Shulk could defeat Egil. After that, he believed he could easily kill Shulk and that would be the end of it. However, ever since Shulk came back to life, Zanza was afraid of him, and showed it from that point on. Shulk didn't die like he was supposed to, implying that things weren't going according to plan. This is the reason that Zanza offers to make Shulk his disciple. He didn't want to fight him.
2. Shulk decided to create a world without gods due to Meyneth's influence. She argued that the detiny of the people she created belonged to them alone. People will resist the passage of fate, and eventually, they will succeed in overcoming it. Therefore, there is no need for a god to rule over them. Alvis told Shulk about this, saying that the passage of fate would be overcome eventually, leading to the gods destruction. Meyneth accepted this and entrusted the future of the world to the beings of Bionis and Mechonis, while Zanza feared this. You completely ignored the nuance of Zanza and Meyneth's philosophies about how the world should be. I wouldn't say Zanza is a great villain, but he has more depth than you imply.
While I do like Xenoblade's story more than its sequel, and I agree with those who claim it is exceptional, it certainly has its flaws. Here are a few examples of bad writing in the story you didn't bring up, that I think are worth mentioning:
1. The plotline of Fiora's body being damaged, allowing her to die at any time was stupid and made no sense. The other Face units had no such problems. The whole point of giving face units mechanical bodies was to make them stronger. Mahmkar talked about how much he loved the power of his new body. It gave him a strong sense of superiority over Dunban, and the other Homs.
Even if Fiora was damaged in some way, once Vanea joins the team, she would have no trouble fixing her since she made the face units to begin with. The notion that Fiora needs a monado to power her body, while the other face units do not doesn't add up. It also doesn't fit the gameplay. Fiora shows no signs of weakness in battle at any point in the game. There is a major disconnect between the weakness she has in cutscenes, and her crazy DPS in battle. The way that she gets her body back at the end is also hilariously stupid. I was hoping that they would fix this plotline in Definitive Edition, but they didn't touch the script, probably because they wanted to save some money by using the old voicelines.
ik this is over a year later so im a bit late but whatever, i agree with u on a lot of things tho i do think it makes sense to why shulk wants to go to prison island bc in his vision he sees that he greatly damages metal face and the monado even looks like the monado 2 in the visions and he wants to be able to hurt metal face bc metal face is who killed fiora so he wants that vision to come true which is why he wants to go to prison island
My opinions on the game:
If you’re going purely for cutscenes and story, then this game is absolutely phenomenal! The story has many twists some may not expect, and the writing with the music choices make so many cutscenes so memorable. However, when you mix gameplay into the mix, it definitely drags it down a bit. Gameplay can be a bit boring sometimes, especially when you can feel limited to a certain team due to poor AI or conditions (cough, Melia, cough). There are also a numerous amount of side quests which, although optional, can feel extremely boring or frustrating. The amount of time they take away from the main story can also drag down that aspect. Other mechanics such as Affinity and Gem Crafting can also make the player feel limited in their options (by the gem crafting, I’m referring to how you may need a specific attribute you just can’t find, or not getting the hoped results). There are also a lot of visual bugs that can be a big detracting if you focus to hard on those kinds of things. Overall, definitely would recommend to people if you know they’ll pay attention.
So you preffer the side quest of XC2 where you need to go Between places a million times and are repetitive and super long for no reason?
Oh so this is why this took so long
1:07:31 I think the reason why they’re different is because XC1 focuses on Klaus’ more insane psychopathic side and in in XC2 it focuses on Klaus’ more logical and understanding side
I have to disagree about how you thought a lot of the twists were obvious. On a repeat playthrough, it’s a lot easier to notice just how much foreshadowing there is, as so many seemingly throwaway lines are hinting at future events. Another thing I think this game does well is wait for acting upon certain kinds of foreshadowing. The time between Dickson saying he was going to betray us and him actually acting on that was so long, I had honestly forgotten about it. Another thing which you were annoyed by, but I thought was pretty clever, we’re all the prison island visions. I think this is extremely clever when you consider that Zanza is controlling Shulk’s visions and freeing the Monado is supposedly his win condition. There’s also a whole bunch of stuff you didn’t bring up, such as Shulk getting a vision for Lorithia when first seeing Melia, but if we wanted to talk about all the foreshadowing in this game, we’d be here all day. (Again, because there’s so many seemingly throwaway instances)
The only reason you wouldn't think the plot twists aren't obvious is if you hadn't played many games like this before or watched many animes. The subtle foreshadowing like "there's two voices in my head" or dickson calling dunban a beast are cool but the blatant showing exactly what happens next 5 times is very annoying.
I've talked to a lot of people on their first playthrough who've been able to pick up on this pretty easily so i guess it just depends a lot on how much you might be doing other things and forget some things that may not be super obvious if you only see it rarely.
I still don't think the prison island vision was that great but I can somewhat see the point about zanza controlling the vision.
On the point of Shulk having two voices in his head, I don't think that was obvious foreshadowing either. Quite consistently it's a thing used in storytelling to just say the character has a conscience and is having conflicting thoughts. The metaphorical devil and angel on your shoulders kind of thing, so that's what I thought it was about.
@@gmaster2647 yeah I agree, that line is in the camp of the "ahh" moments you get when replaying which is good type for foreshadowing rather than lol this is what happens or lol this character is evil but the MCs don't know it yet. I guess it does give it a more theatrical feel like in Othello where the audience know iago is evil the whole time but the characters don't. That said you are privy to his schemes so it comes across as a bit of an awk middle ground in xc.
Disclaimer: I like Xenoblade 1 and 2 equally.
I think you're extremely biased against xenoblade1 bc of the xc1 elitists. You're honestly really ignorant towards a lot of things. Especially a lot of cool things that are just good bc theyre... cool and its fun to see the characters do well sometimes. Xord isn't a bad villain because he's just "metalface but without motivation" he's good because hes scary. Alvis isn't obviously evil because he's helping Shulk all the time, and yes, while Dickson is also helping, its clear that Alvis actually wants Shulk to do well, which Dickson does not. The complaint that there is too little subtlety is valid but... are you really saying you expected Shulk to have Zanza inside of his body?
I think you're mostly viewing the story too much from the perspective of someone who's already finished it. We don't know what's going to happen when we play it. The only things we know are: Mumkhar is def metalface, Dickson is probably evil, and Egil thinks Shulk is someone called Zanza, though we have literally no idea what that means. We don't know if the Emperors going to die, because the last bunch of visions have all lead to everyone being saved (Reyn, Juju, Sharla, Otharon). Otharons vision is shown like 3 times too but he still makes it out alive.
We don't know anything about Zanza. And I mean anything. Even if you somehow expected Shulk to die, Zanza to take over the Bionis and kill everyone, you can't deny that it was handled really well. Zanza isn't some no one like the Fog King, he's a real threat that you genuinely want to destroy.
Also one final thing, the things with Lorithia & the Telethia and Vanea & Fiora really doesn't make you go "oh so that's gonna happen". Even if you thought it was Fiora, Vanea calling her Lady Meyneth should definitely at least put you off a little.
I like both games equally, I know you think 1 is good too but I think a lot of your disliking, especially in the story and characters (ESPECIALLY riki lmao) are because of your spite against xc1 elitists (which I understan dont get me wrong, but still).
That and that you're thinking about it as if you know almost everything thats gonna happen.
Sorry if I sound like an idot
No, you're right. The bias and seething comes through in his tone quite clearly. It undercuts any good points he might actually be making.
Wait wait wait, I didn't get it. So is the game telling us that shulk can change the...uh...the...the thing...the...
Future! Yeah. Took a while to remember, kind of not stressed a lot in the game.
Apparently Enel needed to hear it a few more times.
He thinks it was obvious the Emperor was going to die after Shulk had "changed the future" for Reyn, Sharla, Juju, Otharon, etc...
I love Xenoblade, I love Monolithsoft, I love this channel and Enel. Thank you very much for all the effort you put into promoting this franchise on youtube.
Xenoblade is kind of a miracle when you look at Monolith (and even the own series’) history. I never would have believed the Xeno metaverse would have seven games way back when I finished Xenogears or even Xenosaga.
So keen to see what Monolith has in store.
"Some might call the cutscene the changed everything. While I won't be making a 20 minute analysis on it..."
Do I get points for knowing what video you're referring to?
th-cam.com/video/5YdVtdGT5DQ/w-d-xo.html
Would you ever do a similar video for xc2? I know you did a one year anniversary vid, but would you ever want to do a video in this much detail for any other Xenoblade game?
haha I'd actually love to do this eventually about the other games. i feel like that vid about xc2 wasn't even that good at all. Problem is it's just a lot of effort to make something like this.
@@EnelXC Time to have that juicy XCX content :D
don't you know that it's illegal to say anything negative about XB1?
now reddit will cancel you for criticizing the golden calf of secondaries
You forgot the worst part of the side quests
The fact that you have to see Juju’s face every time you bring up the quest log
Tora just leave comment (Don't want to spoil story meh meh). It Tora's birthday on Saturday, which is when he receive game from Mamapon and Dadapon. Will watch more when Tora play game yes.
Playing Xenoblade Definitive Edition years later after the original made me realize just how much I love Xenoblade 2's combat. So many interesting elements were put in place to make combat more fun and strategic with wide variety of blades and abilities compared to XC1
I don't agree with almost everything on this video but still enjoy your content Enel
Everyone has different tastes. My order is X > 2 > 1.
@Tyler Davis Storywise, I can't blame you on X lol, it doesn't hold a candle to either of the other ones, regardless of which of the two you think is better xD
My ranking 1=X>torna>2
I feel like certain things like moments of foreshadowing become far less subtle when you're already used to games like this. The general playerbase isn't going to pick up on moments like the " two different versions of me" line. I know I didn't the first time.
The reason there are very little character moments in the main story is because of the heart to hearts. You don’t get that from watching only the cutscenes. I was genuinely surprised when I found out one of Riki and Sharla’s heart to hearts references Nene’s tree climbing incident mentioned in FC.
I was so disappointed that at no point Enel referenced the Heart to Hearts. All of his complaints about character interactions are bad because he forgot about such an easy to find part of the game.
@@They_are_Arthur He referenced it toward the end of the video. And his major complaint was that such character building was locked behind affinity levels which is reasonable. If heart to hearts worked like Quiet Moments in FC, I can see this being remedied. But to a non-completionist they would probably miss out on these heart to hearts.
On my first playthrough I skipped just about every heart to heart I came across simply because I didn't have enough affinity for them. Yes the game is trying to encourage me to change the party around and build party affinity, but that cuts into chain attacks and makes them feel even more difficult to get to more than three rounds. By the time I had the affinity for them, I had had my fill of the game and just blazed for the end instead.
True I feel like this complaint wouldn’t really come up if heart to hearts were voice acted and actually easily accessible in Xenoblade 1
This is not really an excuse for poor character writing given that XC2 has almost constant character building/exploration AND heart-to-hearts on top of that. Character development should drive a story, it should not be locked behind optional content that has frankly annoying perquisites to meet through affinity levels (I was only ever able to see very few heart to hearts in xc1 even on my third full playthrough). Never mind the fact that all heart to hearts in XC2 are fully accessible as soon as you come across them so long as you have the involved party members with you at the time.
I can tell you put so much time and effort into making this video. You are one of the best Xenoblade creators out there. Thanks man for all you do.
I think your complaints toward the story and characters are perfectly sound, but the sarcasm felt a bit much. A good bit of the obvious foreshadowing you point out doesn't feel inherently obvious when you're not literally directly pointing it out and you're actually just playing the game for the first time, at least for me it wasn't. Still though, I do agree with a lot of your points in other places, and that this a very nice and organized overview of your thoughts on XC1 as a whole.
Enel: this video is very spoiler heavy
Me: shit I wanted to watch the video, but haven't played the game YET, so I'll probably watch it later but it's already liked :-)
Second comment yahoo...
But i have to comment on that when you said many times that the game is kinda bad at foreshadowing, i dont agree with it. Now after playing the game and knowing everything, characters lines etc are more obvious. My friend played Xenoblade 1 first time and he was blown away by some "now obvious" reveals. I on my first playtrough of this story, i was blown away too. First time playing the game, you dont maybe pay that much attention to some details but later they are obvious.
Bad explanation but i had to comment on it. Thanks Enel for this video btw
I agree, Enel makes it seem like Fiora's reveal wasn't too big of a deal, when the game does a really good job at hiding her before seeing her true reveal.
I don't know, second time of showing that dream sequence of Shulk sinking into the ground, with the second one staring down at him, so far into the game after first showing it, just shows it being way too obvious. Same with Dickson on "hate to deceiving these kids", which again, is not being subtle with the foreshadows. And those who say they could forget this, but sorry, that seems more like a you problem, rather than the game, unless you purposely didn't bother continuing the game until months on end.
Just really now, the whole thing of some of these twist, are pretty obvious, whether you found them as such or not, even for first playthroughs. If this was your first ever baby step into JRPG's as a whole, or anime I guess, then I can maybe see that. Otherwise not really, as these play pretty occasional used tropes of anime and story telling, even for the time. The only ones that were great twist, was for one being Alvis, as he remained mysterious until pretty much near the end or at the end, and obviously the whole High Entia Telethia reveal. For they weren't that obvious, and rarely talked about.
It's my favourite game of all time, and I love the remaster/remake!
im not gonna lie, i actually fell for every plot twist in the game except for melia and the emperor dying when i played the first time lmao. made the experience so fun. xc2 still has a way better story and way better gameplay imo
I can explain why Riki is so well-liked in one word: Tatsu.
I really enjoyed the plot twists the first time I played because I was so focused on what had happened in the past that I didn't see the foreshadowed events coming so it ended up being super satisfying.
This game is my favourite game of all time. They really fixed the problems that the original had. Combat never gets boring to me and it is really addicting. Story is just incredible even when i already knew what was going to happen. Music is perfect and i still listen to it almost daily. World looks beautiful and concept of two big titans is really interesting and clever. Characters are interesting and i can really relate to many of them.
To me this game is the best in the series. Xenoblade 2 is in the second place but i think 1 does everything better than it does. X is just trash imo
I finally found a person who loves 1 AND 2 lets go
@@finnabus633 I love both yes. XC2 helped me alot mentally so i owe alot to it. XC1 is a better game out of both imo
Seeing people still trashing on XCX because it takes a different direction than XC1 hurts, since it is my 2nd favorite XC game after the first one. ;( Exploring Mira was incredible fascinating and I was surprised how much I liked the sidequests and the world building with all the alien races.
Also XC2 has a better roster of towns than XC1.
X isn't trash it's literally worse in 1 aspect i.e not having a plot driven story- everything else about it is on par or superior to xc1 lol.
@@black1blade74 I hate how grindy X gets. I hate how large but still rather empty the world is. World building and plot is driven through side quests and i much rather have story through an actual cutscenes and story, than side quest full of dialog reading. And the worst part imo endless story proggression bars like "get a skell" which itself is behind two way too long side quests
Personally I disagree with a lot of what you had to say about the story. I think Fiora’s death is one of the most emotional sections of the story along with Shulk’s, Kalian’s, and Dickson’s Deaths. I do agree that Dunban is a character with missed potential, especially when he says nothing about his relationship with Dickson during that fight. I actually don’t like Memory’s End. I appreciate the free party gauge, but fighting old enemies just felt hollow, especially since the Mechon could be hurt by normal weapons, the Telethia didn’t use Soul Read, and none of the enemies said a single word. Also you can skip the Gadolt relight because getting to the end of his area launches you into the cutscene before the final battle. I know it was obvious that Dickson wasn’t the type of guy we were led on to believe, but shooting Shulk I thought was completely unexpected and caught me off-guard. I actually do like most of the party thanks to the Heart-to-Hearts. I think they did enough to make me interested in each of the characters and while technically optional, those who want more out of the characters are incentivized to find the Heart-to-Hearts and complete them. I also think a lot of the little lines and the stuff in between each of the major story sections really helps make these characters feel like characters I should feel about. AND NYAPIKAPOW IS NOW MY FAVORITE WORD. I think the 2nd Prison Island adventure is an amazing buildup to Zanza. And the fight with Zanza himself feels really climatic especially with the background and the first phase music. I prefer this story over 2, even though that story was good, the highs didn’t really reach the same level as in the original. I still liked this video and I appreciate what you had to say and your viewpoints on certain things.
I think a lot of people can write off a lot of problems with the story solely because they'll likely be doing side quests often, so there's likely going to be massive breaks between these story moments for most players. I know in my case, the repetitive story didn't bother me much because it took me a month or so to get to Mechonis Field I believe (I'll often pick up a lot of games at once, so progress in some games suffers). The repetition was almost welcome in that playthrough because I forgot a lot of things (although I think it says a lot that it took so long to play it... if I was really invested, it wouldn't have taken me so long to finish the game. For example, I finished XB2 and XBX in about a week each).
It's really cool to hear the your thoughts on this game. As someone who got into the series though Xenoblade 2, it's really nice to hear how someone who's been into the series much longer, and has a different perspective on it. It's unfortunate there isn't a larger community for the series, and I'm glad there are people like you who are willing to put so much work into stuff like this.
I'm glad I'm not alone in feeling like most party members got the shaft when it comes to characterization. I truly do love Xenoblade 1, but I think it sometimes suffers from what I call "first draft syndrome", kind of like Megaman 1 or Kingdom Hearts 1. I think taking this game and splitting its focus into two sub series (Xenoblade X focusing more heavily on exploration and player expression, while Xenoblade 2 focused more on story telling and characterization) was a good call on Monolith's part.
And while Xenoblade 2 remains my favorite in the overall Xeno series, I still love this game, and it still stands on its own as a fantastic RPG. I feel lucky to have a franchise like this where the debate comes down to "which amazing game did I find more amazing"
I agree that when Metal Face first showed up it was obvious it's Mumkar, but during the battle at Sword Valley, when Mumkar "died" i honestly thought he did die because i thought Nintendo wouldn't include a violent death scene
Fantastic video, Enel! Have you made a similar one for XC2? I went through your video list and didn't see one. If not, I urge you to consider it. I for one would definitely love to get your definitive breakdown of it (even though I already have a decent sense of your opinion of XC2 through your speedruns).
No real similar one for XC2 but it's something I'd like to make!
honestly you do make a good point but in my opinion i don’t agree with much of the things you said. but i really wish i knew you so i could have a friendly argument on our thoughts about the game
This was amazing. I love how you have everything split nicely in the video, but you don't do the money hungry path of putting it as different videos that some people would have done.
I totally agree that the combat is very unbalanced which doesn't allow as much variety as I would like, so it starts slow, then just becomes repetitive. It has a great story, but not told as well as possible. It really makes me think of the comparison that I thought of and hold to this day. Xenoblade is playing an anime. Chronicles is world-building and single hero story mostly. Cross is mecha/sci-fi. 2 is harem hero story. Also, I had a funny parallel with 2 that I can't shake. Main story is Pokemon games with collecting all and getting most powerful. Torna is Pokemon anime with just a few that is mainly about friendship.
I personally like all the games for different reasons. Chronicles is a great traditional RPG to me with a few nice additions. Cross tickles the fancy of giant mechs and the world is amazing. 2 is a great technical game with builds for different situations and character building even for the blades.
This was a really well put together video. Despite disagreeing quite a bit with a few of the points you made throughout, it was still nice to hear your perspective on this game as a whole. I was quite shocked when you defended Juju a bit during the character portion of the video since many people just bash on him all the time; though, I wouldn't say it's completely unjustified. Regarding Future Connected, I actually found myself agreeing with you on that more since I went in with those big expectations and I'm also not that big of Melia fan either. Overall, great video; and even though I don't share the same opinion with you on this game, I can agree that the Xenosaga series is by far a much better experience all the way through!
almost 2 years late but i DID have a good chuckle at you saying "you probably want to do quest so you arent underlevled" when a common complaint was that you are often OVERLEVELD if you do even just a few side quests to many
I just wanted to say that your content has been a major compliment to my experience with Xenoblade Chronicles. It's the first time I've ever played this series and without your guides, I don't think I would've enjoyed the game as much as I did. I'm gonna jump into XC2 in a few days, so I'll definitely be watching your older videos for help and I would love to watch another hour long video about XC2 hahaha
Thanks again!
I disagree with a lot about what you said about the story and combat. XB2 100% starts off WAY slower than 1, not the other way around like you mention. Just because 2 is more complex later on, doesn't all of a sudden make 1 less complex. Sure, if you put 200+ hours into a game, it's gonna get old, but this game isn't a constantly updated MMO. it's a story driven single player game, and everything was designed around that. A Majority of side quests are completed while playing the main story, as they aren't meant as truly in-depth content (the main story has that covered). The side quests simply act as extra stuff to do while exploring the massive environments and completing the story
Something I never hear discussed is the character of Vanea. She is the real hero of the game, because she re-awakened Meyneth. If it were not for Vanea, the party would have been killed by face nemesis (controlled by Egil) at Galahad fortress. Vanea is also the sole reason the party survived Egil’s attack after the mechonis field/central factory portion (where gadolt sacrifices himself to buy Meyneth time). On top of that, Vanea had not only lost her people to Zanza thousands of years ago, but she also witnessed her once-noble brother turn into a revenge seeking monster, with absolutely no hope of changing his mind until thousands of years later when shulk and his friends come by. And to top it off, as soon as her goal is met (Egil’s mind is changed), he dies. Those thousands of years of Vanea trying to change Egil’s ways were all for nothing.
All of these conditions resulted in a complex character with great motivations. However, in the game’s execution, Vanea was a ton of wasted potential. Given how her actions saved the party’s lives multiple times and her endless state of suffering, she should have had MUCH more interactions with the rest of the cast. She was so important to the plot, and yet the game chose to treat her like an irrelevant side character that the party hardly interacted with. It also would have been much better if Vanea because a party member after the events of Mechonis Core, as that would have created both more variety in combat and the 8-person party would have had representation of all the races of the xenoblade world.
Main idea is this: Vanea did not get the treatment by the game and the rest of the characters that she deserved. Not by a long shot.
I meant “became” a party member, not because
when i played the game, i fully expected her and alvis to become party members
but nope
Dude, this is hands down one of your best videos, it impresses me every time to see the outstanding amount of passion and dedication that you have for this series. The hard work you have put in this video really makes for high quality content to appreciate, I'm looking forward to more videos like this one.
I was 16 at the time the original came out and this was my first j-rpg. At that time, I didn't really watch anime either (I sure do now) so I wasn't really aware of the tropes, which made a fair amount of this game not-so predictable for me. So I really do think this is really good as a first experience with j-rpgs, the story/combat/difficulty are all simple but not too simple which makes it really easy to digest in a way.
Also, funny story, I bought this game at the same time as I did Super Paper Mario on the wii. I started playing this, got to the Ether Mines and got bored there (2nd worst area imo, 1st being Bionis's Interior), so I went and started SPM, beat the ENTIRE GAME, and only then came back to this game after like 2 weeks. And guess what cutscene we get after the Ether Mines ? Yup, we hear Metal Face talking for the first time, and at that point I had completely forgot the existence of Mumkhar, so needless to say that I didn't see that plot twist coming (I admit the Fiora one was pretty obvious though) :p
Regarding Dickson, I remember being suspicious of him back then, but I think my suspicions had completely died down when he found us on the Fallen Arm and was like "btw I know Miqol and this whole place but I guess the cat's out of the bag now" and I didn't really think much of him after that.
So yeah, my plot senses were kinda weak to say the least XD
-just wanna live in peace yet-
-Egil's gonna keep us restless-
-running just to own our own breaths-
It's cool to see a more critical perspective from someone who is a superfan of the series. Great video as always!
Hey Enel are you going to make speedruns of this game? I'm freaked out by yours in 2 and I would love to see you in DE
I can feel the amount of effort you put into this video and it’s a great video
Yeah not in total agreement, I think the thing I liked least about this video was the sarcastic tone through all of the story section, felt a bit tiresome to listen to instead of straight up criticism. Anyway I see so much effort in this and really appreciate it, great job!
Enel just has a massive bias against the entire story. Reyn and every other character is fantastic in someway. Remember. A character being irrelevant, if written well is still a good character.
33:04 "It introduces us to his two trustworthy and wonderful friends Dickson and Mumkhar". He said it so casually rofl
It's funny to me how right after this video I get recommendations like why XC is a masterpiece or how excellent it's foreshadowing is. I appreciate that you talk about XC in a more harsh(?) way than praising everything and only mentioning some down-sides. Still, one of my fav. games of all time :)
Another thing that other comments missed about the foreshadowing is that XC1 does it in layers. It's very good at throwing obvious hints thrown in with subtle ones that can misdirect the first timers, and also several lines that make sense in context both during the first and later viewings of the game.
And then there's everybody's favorite unnecessary line at sartorl.
Love your work Enel! Your series of videos really helped go from just finishing the game to getting close to 100% completion
Phew...you weren't kidding when you said this was gonna be loong! Time to get the popcorn :>
Enel: this combat system gets repetitive after 300 hours. I won't come back to it for thousands of hours like I do Xenoblade 2 and X.
Me: *looks at his 350 total hours across all 3 games*. But.. unique talent arts and distinct playstyles for each character!
haha i actually only have like 140 hours in the game total now and I don't really feel like I have any reason to play it anymore. Remember much of that wasn't post game either
@@EnelXC I'm at like 160 total between Definitive Edition and Wii. About to Mechonis core in DE. I have probably played as Shulk for less than a half hour of this whole playthrough cuz I used him so much in my first playthrough. I'm slowly coming around to 2 and X's battle systems being better and more customizable and interesting. If there's one thing I wish the next Xenoblade could take from DE though is giving each character unique talent arts that both dictate the theme of their playstyles and the overall theme of the character (Dunban being the focused samurai being the best example).
Also, I know your combat videos have been pretty late game oriented, but I feel like Heat Haze + Soaring tempest Dunban needs to get talked about at some point for clearing mobs in mid-late game. The strat literally works better the more enemies you have aggroed. Can't beat a boss in the center of the room? Aggro all his minions and just use the combo to insta-build the party gauge. Who cares if Peerless isn't active when every hit is a crit and you're getting chain multipliers almost non stop.
I really appreciate this review and everything you talked about in depth. I do believe this game is amazing on a first playthrough when things are fresh and new but on NG+ and revisiting years later with DE the cracks are quite visible. Your issues with the game seemed to be very well thought out and I like how you tackle them in a more objective manner while still conceding this is pretty good as a base line for things to come. This is great content as always and I'm excited for what else comes after.
This video was amazing. Well worth the wait. Obviously no rush but I would love to see a video like this on X and especially 2.
52:26 You called Yaoldaboath a Bakugan! Lmaooooooooo
Great vid as always, it's nice to see your production quality steadily improves as you make more videos.
I adore this game, it's at least in my top 3 games of all time. But the reasons that I love this game so much are (obviously) not objective. For example, I love the random chance for a chain link.
I'm not blind to its faults however. The story is super generic, to the point where it gets worse the more JRPGs you have played. And while the dialogue isn't as stilted as in XC2, it is still pretty damn cringy at times (I cringed hard in DE when the party leaves the Fallen Arm and starts their little speech about fear). The world is far too large for your movement speed (Quick Step gems are not a good replacement for a sprint button, Monolith).
We criticize what we love. And I could clearly see in this video that you also love this game.
After replaying this game for years and very recently beating Xenogears and Xenosaga trilogy, the imperfections of this game have become much more clear to me while I still love it. The story becomes less impressive, less original, and the characters don’t stand out as much. While I still believe the foreshadowing is more positive than negative, some of the foreshadowing, particularly Dickson, is way too obvious and visions go from overused to completely forgotten about. Outside of Egil, the villains don’t stand out too much and even Egil doesn’t get as much screen time as I would’ve preferred. Many villains in the other games get plenty more screen time.
Presentation and world wise I believe it’s the strongest Xeno game. X is a close 2nd but I’m more attached to 1’s areas and DE is gorgeous. I absolutely love the environments for the most part. The soundtrack is also a masterpiece, however I still prefer 2’s over it and the battle theme variety is lacking which saga 3 and blade 2 surpass it in that regard (we don’t talk about saga 1’s variety). Unique battle themes help make important villains and fights more memorable and Egil deserves to have his own and Dickson as well. Side quests are a thing. At least you don’t have to constantly check the wiki anymore but it’s still mostly boring. Future connected was a disappointment but the shoulder is a really cool area. Time attack is a giant meme.
After all of this time, I still love the simplicity of the gameplay, as flawed as it is. When I want complex Xenoblade gameplay, I can go play X or 2. 2 is definitely the best gameplay wise and, after experiencing all the Xeno games, 2 is possibly the best overall. But sometimes I just want to stick to simplicity, and 1 fills that role. DE fixed the slower performance rate and issues of the original along with QOL changes which decreased the total play time compared to the original, something I really appreciate as someone that has played the original several times. Overall I’m extremely happy DE exists, but some things they added they should’ve either not bothered with or done more with. My opinion of this game has evolved over time and it’s not just necessarily due to age, but also due to what already proceeded before it. I think it’s a good thing to recognize flaws in your favorites because it shows you’ve taken the time to dissect everything and acknowledge areas that can be improved upon in the future or what other games already do better. Xenoblade 1 elitists are some of my least favorite people because they’re stuck living in the world with rose-tinted glasses and refuse to have their views challenged. I still love 1 even after all of this and critically thinking about it for years.
The strength of Xenoblade 1 is it’s simplicity. It’s easy to digest and understand. Perhaps this is where the rift forms for those that prefer 1 to the other games which are much more complex and have their own flaws. Another thing is that 1, and especially DE, didn’t have any obvious developmental restraints compared to most other Xeno games which left some unfinished traces of held them back. The Xeno games are a glorious series and DE is certainly the best starting point for any newcomer, but please also play the other games too. Especially to those that have only played the Xenoblades, there’s so much you can learn from playing the prior games and seeing where everything proceeded from and how we got to where we are now.
Anyways great video Enel!
Thanks for this Enel, I didn't think I was in the same boat as you about this game. I can tell you put a lot of work into this. Well done
I have some problems with your plot critique. There are several, but the general theme can be well represented by one example: You state that you don't like the big plot visions and give the example that the post-Ether mine vision shows you that the Emperor dies. At that point in the story, you're like "The who?" Because the existence of an empire, let alone an emperor, has not come up.
Basically, while you critique the plot twists in the game for being predictable, you frequently use information that requires spoilers in order to predict them. True, some of the plot twists aren't super hard to figure out (Mumkar, for instance), but several times you seem to call things obvious that definitely are not when they happen in the plot. I would say, for instance, where you say it's "super obvious" that Fiora is the lady being put in the Face mechon, the mysterious Meyneth character mentioned in those cutscenes would have been a better candidate. Almost seems like you read the TVTropes before playing and still decided to act like you were unspoiled.
Love your content. Your passion of the game and what you do shows in all of your videos. I disagree slightly on a few things, but over all thought this was great.
While I personally don't agree with a lot of your points I can understand your perspective.
One part in particular I want to discuss is about FC. When we were getting info on it, I never expected it to be anything more than an epilogue to the story. Something that is overall more slow and just a short and sweet send off for the world of Xenoblade 1. I actually really like what the shoulder displayed and I really agree about the shoulder being one of the best areas in the game. I think the quiet moments in FC are very good and flesh out the characters very well moreso than the original. And I think FC was a way of them learning from alot of their earlier mistakes from the previous Xenoblade titles. Not in combat but more in spacing out content in an area.
I wouldn't be surprised if the next xeno game we play thru will have a world that has progression similar to this.
And one little thing to end it.
I personally enjoy the characters in 1 and X more than in 2. But I'm now uncertain if it is due to the superior voice acting in 1 and X. Because I personally did not enjoy the voice acting in 2 both English and Japanese grated on my ears.
After watching your videos I am understanding the combat of 2 more but still need more time to really understand things. But my first time thru 2 was a terrible experience from start to finish except music. I had no enjoyment throughout and I ended up predicting most of everything in 2 similar to how you predicted everything in this game. But I also do not think predictability is necessarily a bad thing.
I want to thank you for perspective and it's your videos that convinced me to try 2 again for the combat after I swore I would never touch it again. Thank you for that as well. I hope I didn't come off as rude, I really do understand your points. And I hope your day is a good one.
Totally agree on the voice acting part. Particularly with Rex and nia I cannot stand their voices.
it’s hard to make this or really listen to this because you have played this game and beaten the game before. therefore it’s hard to say that plot twists aren’t that good because you’ve played through these before. you kinda have to look at it through a new players eyes. cause that’s what makes the story so good.
When i was a new player I remember thinking similar things and the experiences of friends of mine this time around have also echoed much of this in a way
I mean, even with new players, it's kind of easy seeing some of this stuff coming from miles away. Especially that one off comment about Dickson at Satorl Marsh in my first playthrough, I knew he was coming off as a traitor. Still saw it coming, even when taking nearly a month to get to that part of the game on Mechonis Core, by playing it off and on, like maybe 2 to 4 hours a day, with not that much focus on progress for the story.
Wait so daddy Enel can predict a god living within Shulk and latterly every single plot twist except the genetic code of the high entia on his first time threw, ok.
I think the plot feels a lot more cliche when you play a lot of other similar RPGs first. When xenoblade is your introduction to the genre, the foreshadowing is a lot less obvious, plus there's a lot of time between cutscenes and you're distracted with gameplay.
In hindsight, everything is obvious as fuck, and I honestly think that's by design. You won't really see it and remember it unless you're really keyed in and looking for it. It's part of why so much emphasis is placed on experiencing the games for yourself first and avoiding spoilers. The story hits different that first time you play. And then if you play a second time you have that "OHHHHHHH!" moment during a lot of cutscenes and it feels super cool.
Sure, big moments have heavy foreshadowing and there are spoilery visions. But without the context of the scene, you can't really piece everything together. The end result is that it actually builds intrigue rather than detracting from the plot. Having hindsight makes it really easy to pick apart, but the reality is that during the average first playthrough, you either won't notice or will forget about foreshadowy bits before they become relevant.
As for the characters, I agree they are largely ignored in favor of plot writing and shulk's character development. Everything revolves around shulk. The deuteragonist of the final 1/3-1/2 of the story, fiora, seems to have a one track mind all leading to shulk. I never really cared for any of the other characters that much and they don't seem that deep.
It's nice to see someone give this game some shit for once. It gets so tiring seeing everyone praise it like it does literally everything right, while bashing 2 like it's the worst sequel ever made.
I think of XC2 as a bad sequel because it did not match the expectations i had considering what xc1 did. However, on its own, it’s a fantastic game that i truly enjoyed nearly as much as xc1. (Reason is 1´s story is more grand and cohesive and most of 2´s characters (except rex/vandahm/malhos and a few torna members) are not as deep as i’d like them to be ). I’m just sick of people trying to rank them cause all 3 games are just too different to be compared, even if it keeps the same soul.
Still got to play Torna and FC though, my opinion might change, can’t wait.
the only sort of plot hole i could see is Egil's reason for killing everything on Bionis. The living beings on the Bionis are the "food" of it after they die, so naturally you want to kill everything, thus giving the Bionis all of the "food"
Say what you want about dunban losing character after shulk gets the Monaco, but nothing beats the "we ordered room service an hour ago" line
I really like this type of content as well. I mostly agree about the points in the video. Keep it up and can't wait for a new xeno game to come out