For those not familiar with Westminster parliamentary conventions a request for a Cabinet member to "consider your position" is the language used when demanding their resignation.
This is one of the greatest of all British comedies by two brilliant writers, who wrote scripts that are extremely funny and yet treat the audience like adults. It is sad to think that Paul Eddington, Nigel Hawthorne and Derek Fowlds who give such brilliant performances are all dead.
This episode was adapted from the shouting match between Thatcher and Heseltine during the middle of her reign, about whether the British Westland helicopter firm should be swallowed by Sikorsky or should be absorbed into a European consortium of aerospace manufacturers, as proposed by Heseltine.
@@mattevans4377 This was the 1980s. The narrative of the time was that British industry was dying and American corporations were wonderful, fantastic and could do no wrong.
@@mattevans4377 As opposed to having it go out of business? Yes, I can see that. Chrysler corporation was absorbed by Daimler Benz back in the 1990s, and was then sold to Fiat. It kept them in business.
If somebody could help me, in the British system, what is the difference between the secretary of state for a given department, and the minister for that same department?
Two big differences. One is political: A secretary serves on the whims of President and can't remove him and become President. The President is the boss. A Prime minister is a first among equals, and with enough political manoeuvering oust the incumbent and take his place. Eg. Margaret Thatcher's removal. The second one is how they function. A secretary chooses his top officials and directly rules. The top officials are his people and loyal to him, and will get replaced once the terms end. The minister has no such power. He gets a secretary from the permanent civil services to whom he dictates his policies, which the secretary then implements. The secretary is loyal not to the minister, but to the crown. It's Her Majesty's Civil Services and their loyalty is to her. The Minister's job is to do the ruling on her behalf, which the civil services then implement.
@@domoncar6782 Thanks but you misunderstood my question. In the British system, there are both ministers and secretaries of state for different departments. In this scene, it is clearly established that the prime minister is meeting with secretaries of state. I'm trying to understand these two different roles in the British system.
@@odysseusrex5908 Oh that, so you misunderstood the Secretary thing. There aren't any Secretary of State. What are, however, Principal Secretary for that Department, a senior carrier Civil Services bureaucrat , in charge of the department and head of all in the department. Next is the Secretary to the Minister for that department, also a Civil Services veteran. He is, quite literally, the Private Secretary to the Minister and has no other powers. These three, the Minister, the Principal Secretary and Private Secretary work together to run the department. So Earlier, Sir Humphrey was the Principal Secretary, Bernard Private Secretary, and titular Minister.
@@domoncar6782 If you will listen to the video, at 00.01, hacker addresses the one guy as, "Secretary of State for Employment". At 00.11, he addresses the other as, "Secretary of State for Defense". Now, I have seen these terms, Secretary of State for such and such, used with regard to British government in other contexts. Maybe there was a script error here and they meant for these guys to be the respective ministers. Certainly they were not meant to be the Principle Secretaries of the respective ministries, because they do not make policy and would not be representing their ministries in a cabinet meeting. I do know that much. Ah ha! Wikipedia to the rescue. The post of Minister of Defence was abolished in 1964 and replaced with the Secretary of State for Defence. Apparently other cabinet ministries saw a similar change to the title of the senior official. I don't now why, but now I understand the difference. Thank you for trying to answer my question, and spurring me to research it.
In short; The Secretary of State and The Minister is the same person. In the British Cabinet no one is called "Minister" apart from the Prime Minister himself. The Secretary of State for Employment, as mentioned in this video, is one such example. He is simply "The Minister of Employment", but by another name. Two other examples are the "Minister of Finance", or the Chancellor of the Exchequer - and "Minister of Justice" (or Attorney General as Americans call it) who is called the Lord Chancellor.
For those not familiar with Westminster parliamentary conventions a request for a Cabinet member to "consider your position" is the language used when demanding their resignation.
"...recorded in the minutes and it isn't so it wasn't". Pure poetry, Sir Nigel.
Sir Humphrey.
@@odysseusrex5908 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Hawthorne
A clip that sums up the validity of the National Archives, as minutes only record what was Meant to be said, not what was.
Or as Humphrey stated: Minutes are not to record events, it's to protect people. Lol.
This is one of the greatest of all British comedies by two brilliant writers, who wrote scripts that are extremely funny and yet treat the audience like adults. It is sad to think that Paul Eddington, Nigel Hawthorne and Derek Fowlds who give such brilliant performances are all dead.
Nigel Hawthorn is the only actor to have been awarded a noble prize in literature owing to his extraordinary ability to learn script.
I love this show!! Brittish Comedy is fantastic!! Looks like I'm binging today!!! Stay Healthy UK!! 🙏🌎🕊️💙
This episode was adapted from the shouting match between Thatcher and Heseltine during the middle of her reign, about whether the British Westland helicopter firm should be swallowed by Sikorsky or should be absorbed into a European consortium of aerospace manufacturers, as proposed by Heseltine.
And neither thought handing a British company to a foreign owner, might be a bad idea?
@@mattevans4377
This was the 1980s. The narrative of the time was that British industry was dying and American corporations were wonderful, fantastic and could do no wrong.
@@mattevans4377 As opposed to having it go out of business? Yes, I can see that. Chrysler corporation was absorbed by Daimler Benz back in the 1990s, and was then sold to Fiat. It kept them in business.
@@odysseusrex5908 If you can only see two options, you aren't thinking hard enough.
@@mattevans4377 If there are only two options, then that is the case. Was there a third?
Oh my! This is exactly the conversation Sajid Javid, Boris Johnson and Cummings has a few months ago.
Sharpest written show ever.
This is amongst my favorite comedies of all time
Insoluble opportunities, good one.
“If voting changed anything, they would have abolished it.”
Ah, good old Twain
0:06 UP! UP! HE SAID IT!
Told you so !
If somebody could help me, in the British system, what is the difference between the secretary of state for a given department, and the minister for that same department?
Two big differences. One is political: A secretary serves on the whims of President and can't remove him and become President. The President is the boss. A Prime minister is a first among equals, and with enough political manoeuvering oust the incumbent and take his place. Eg. Margaret Thatcher's removal.
The second one is how they function. A secretary chooses his top officials and directly rules. The top officials are his people and loyal to him, and will get replaced once the terms end.
The minister has no such power. He gets a secretary from the permanent civil services to whom he dictates his policies, which the secretary then implements. The secretary is loyal not to the minister, but to the crown. It's Her Majesty's Civil Services and their loyalty is to her. The Minister's job is to do the ruling on her behalf, which the civil services then implement.
@@domoncar6782 Thanks but you misunderstood my question. In the British system, there are both ministers and secretaries of state for different departments. In this scene, it is clearly established that the prime minister is meeting with secretaries of state. I'm trying to understand these two different roles in the British system.
@@odysseusrex5908 Oh that, so you misunderstood the Secretary thing. There aren't any Secretary of State.
What are, however, Principal Secretary for that Department, a senior carrier Civil Services bureaucrat , in charge of the department and head of all in the department. Next is the Secretary to the Minister for that department, also a Civil Services veteran. He is, quite literally, the Private Secretary to the Minister and has no other powers. These three, the Minister, the Principal Secretary and Private Secretary work together to run the department.
So Earlier, Sir Humphrey was the Principal Secretary, Bernard Private Secretary, and titular Minister.
@@domoncar6782 If you will listen to the video, at 00.01, hacker addresses the one guy as, "Secretary of State for Employment". At 00.11, he addresses the other as, "Secretary of State for Defense". Now, I have seen these terms, Secretary of State for such and such, used with regard to British government in other contexts. Maybe there was a script error here and they meant for these guys to be the respective ministers. Certainly they were not meant to be the Principle Secretaries of the respective ministries, because they do not make policy and would not be representing their ministries in a cabinet meeting. I do know that much.
Ah ha! Wikipedia to the rescue. The post of Minister of Defence was abolished in 1964 and replaced with the Secretary of State for Defence. Apparently other cabinet ministries saw a similar change to the title of the senior official. I don't now why, but now I understand the difference. Thank you for trying to answer my question, and spurring me to research it.
In short; The Secretary of State and The Minister is the same person.
In the British Cabinet no one is called "Minister" apart from the Prime Minister himself. The Secretary of State for Employment, as mentioned in this video, is one such example. He is simply "The Minister of Employment", but by another name. Two other examples are the "Minister of Finance", or the Chancellor of the Exchequer - and "Minister of Justice" (or Attorney General as Americans call it) who is called the Lord Chancellor.
2:27 comedic masterclass
Sadly this is how government works. Why things only get more expensive, complicated, and nothing gets better.
I love a level politics
Which episode is this?
Fillebuster pjatt.
And it isn't so it wasn't. :))
"...recorded in the minutes and it isn't so it wasn't". Pure poetry, Sir Nigel. Bring back British brilliance, (bp)ronto.
bullshit is still bullshit no matter what Humph
rey says