Creating Armylists is the best. Its the one Stage of the Game where all your Troops sweep Victorious through the Enemies Formations (ya know, before Reality happens)
As young kids we spend more time list building and setting up the game than actually playing haha. These were usually 3v3 type games. It was fun mixing in different units from 3 different armies.
It's great hearing your commentary on the Old World as information is being released. I look forward to your further coverage as we get closer to release (and post release of course!). Have a great Christmas and a very happy New Year.
They always allow Allies early in a game cycle to allow people to mix what they have and add what they like. Then when established, start making Allies more limited.
I think your take on allies and mercs is spot on. I am highly dubious that they should be allowed onto the majority of event tables however maybe an occasional tournament that allows them would be an interesting change up. However I find your concern about “grindhammer” a bit suspect seeing as you play Brets and choas warriors. Two elite hard hitting factions. I’m looking forward to a game where lines clash for more than a turn. It’s time for the footslogger infantry to have a go! .. why yes I am an empire man :P Keep up the great work! Look forward to your videos every time an article is posted
@@ellesse3862 I've read everything through to Johnny Alucard, and the rest is on my absurdly long 'to read' list. Great stuff. With or without the è, Geneviève Dieudonné is one of my all time favourite fictional heroines.
@@sydneycardew1923 Mine too. I've got Daikaiju sat staring at me, thats the only one I've yet to read. I dont know if you like comics but Newman also wrote a mini series, Anno Dracula 1895 : Seven Days in Mayhem.
Maybe the "equipment" of the hippogryph has armor penetration. "Wicked claws", "serrated maw". Weapon armor penetration is not displayed on the unit profile after all, but on the weapon rules.
I used to take a unit of dark elf crossbowmen, a de repeating bolt thrower and Shadowblade as allies for my Chaos army. Caused all sorts of extra, unexpected chaos.
Age of sigmar doesnt allow big faction armies or mixture of order/ chaos anymore It works as a simular construction to this. Each faction has a list of allies and how it works is you can take anything from that faction provided it doesnt exceed your limitis (ie 2 artillery) but also they dont count for minimum requirements. So in this case you could take a treeman in a bretonnian army but you still cant exceed the 25% limit on rare.
Another great one, thank you! I hope you have a merry Christmas, relaxed holidays and a good start into the new year - with lots of Warhammer on the horizon!
Completely agree with your take/desire for the inclusion of Bertrand and his men in the video and comments. I think it's a perfect addition to connect Brettonia to more of the English and French story roots without it being Arthurian in nature. Just something to add to the commoners end of the lists. Who doesn't love the idea of bandits doing good and skirmishing through the woods taking the unwary by surprise (bonus points if you have Kevin Costner not even trying to attempt an accent while doing so in your head).
Well, it would be somebody OTHER than those Merry Men we already know - unless they are some kind of immortal appearance, sent by the Lady? I think the idea of such a warband is generic enough to allow for a "regiment of reknown" type of unit entry. If GW does not provide I am sure some fan will sooner rather than later.
Good doctor, as a fan of 3rd edition's complexities, the rules analysis is awesome but please do a painting tutorial! I go back to your chaos army on a regular basis for inspiration!!
I've never had more fun making army lists than in Warhammer fantasy. It trumps other tabletop games both from GW and other companies that I've played (And I've put my thumb in many a tabletop gaming pie). Especially when my old group would run campaigns in the Border Princes. There was something special about the state of the war influencing decisions (For example, having lost a major supply center in your territory meaning you paid a points tax on war machines. We played using those kinds of rules). Choosing to field a terrible monster to counter something nasty I knew my upcoming opponent would likely field, or plotting ways to effectively counter their heavier magic power, etc. Even when I would go out to my local battle bunker / FLGS with a catch-all list built with the intent of trying to be efficient and capable against anyone I might be set up against.
Similar to our valiant host, I question the survivability of the monk, which would make it senseless to take him and his three panel religious art. In reality, we would want to put valuable relics in the hands of really tough guys so that these items aren’t grabbed by an enemy.
Allied units may work like Horus heresy 30k - normal allies may be effectively part of your army, your characters can join units, buff allied units, etc and they can score, suspicious may be like 30k distrusted allies or worse 'by the emperors/warmasters command'. Distrusted count as enemy units that cannot be targeted by your core army but cannot benefit in any way from buffs, charcters cannot join them etc, by command units if within 6" of one of your units at the start of a turn roll a D6 and on a 1 will just stand, no charges and no shooting. I'd expect some version of this to be in the allies rules for The Old World. Detachments for allies in 30k are set as - 1 HQ and 1 Troops choice as compulsory units, with the option to add on another 3 Troops, 2 Elite, 1 Fast Attack and 1 Heavy support choice
One good things about allies, is that we can use them to ‘patch in’ old unit entries that aren’t in the main list. For example; your old school Bret crossbow men could be represented by Empire crossbow men, Bret Outlaw skirmishers - how about using the rules for Empire Free Company?
@@DrBlaxill do you think it’s possible we will have generic monsters in the mercenary slots as well, similar to the ‘monster’ allocation of 4th/5th Ed, or bound monsters from 8th Ed Monstrous Arcanum/Storm of Magic?
@@PRAISE_HASHUT one senses there would be a 'monster' allowance if they were going to do that, but it's possible. A monster is unlikely to be a mercenary in the literal sense of the word - paid to fight in the battle (unless it's a rather smart and materialistic one!)
@@DrBlaxill Well there is a rather significant subset of monsters that by tradition would fit the bill, at least if they didn't consider such an arrangement to be beneath them.
@@DrBlaxill Me to my giant spider swarm: “So guys, as you know budgets are tight right now, we’re really grateful for you being here but we can’t afford to pay you atm, not in money at least, but this will look really really good on your CV. It’s great exposure. Ask the Jabberwocky, he’s not getting paid either but it’s opened so many doors for him’’.
If it means anything, Squires were introduced in Total War Warhammer aswell, were they represent elite peasant infantry, basically dismounted Yeomen, and carry great weapons.
I'm loving these videos Dr. Blaxill. I don't know if I'll get to play much of this game when it comes out. I live in Nowhere Montana,, so not much for a Warhammer scene.. not to mention I generally dislike most people. I'm a horrible grump. However, I am working on remodeling one of my spare bedrooms into a Warhammer game room. I will have my little slice of British heaven, with a custom display cabinet, and to top it off, an 8 x 5 gaming table. Merry Christmas,, and bah humbug!
Allies and Mercenary options is potentially interesting to my inner fluffy gamer, I'm looking forward to discovering who these might be in greater detail and what miniatures will become available as a direct result. Tiny crumbs here and there have me excited and curious, eager to tuck into the new rulebook in the new year. Glad for another entertaining transmission from the punkerbunker. Ceefax .. that made me laugh. I'm all for new old world novels, Ulrika from Kislev was a character I enjoyed reading about but nothing was ever quite as good as the Vampire Genevieve stories. As a sidenote, have you read any of Kim Newman's Anno Dracula novels? Best wishes to you and Chantel.
Warhammer with attitude from the Punker Bunker, coming over TH-cam and short-wave radio. You make my Saturday morning, Doc. (My family in the background: are you listening to that English dude talk Warhammer AGAIN?)
I hope they will explain whether the units you bring with allies shall also respect the other restrictions. For instance in a 2000 points game, if you already have 300 points as rare units, you cannot bring more than 200 points of rare units from your allies.
I think that the simulation of breaking unit with a charge will still hold in soem regards. Imagine you charge a unit, kill many enemys and they can't attack back. Now they will more likely fall back in good order, and therefore recibe a nee charge from the kinght at this point the unit is decimated and reciving a new charge and now they will no longer be unbreakable so they will be mos likely destroyed or flee for good. We will see.
Right, good suggestion. That a Falling back unit will not be able to fall back again- if it fails its modified leadership test next time it simply breaks. That would be intriguing.
Thanks for going over this. I have decidedly moved on since the dissolution of Fantasy Battle and I am very much into 40k now. However, I have still been curious about the new old game, so I appreciate it.
8th edition vampires, you say? Those were not really "strong" or "durable". Well in a way they were, but the whole army used to crumble if they went down, and they always did. When i used them and when I played against them, always. At least I do not recall a time that did not happen. There were so many things that targeted characters and assassinated them that having an army that just loses when the general is gone forced you to keep that general as safe as possible, which means not really using it to great effect.
It's a slow burner but I've part completed it. Hope to finish it in new Year. Hmmm.....the channel in question has a rather similar name to the most popular song by the band Ghost...
I am surprised they are still using the shield-polearm combination. I don't know of a historical example of this combination, probably due to physics. Trying to move a heavy bladed weapon one handed simply does not work.
Great synopsis mate. Having had the Bretonnians from the start I look forward to using my well OOP miniatures from previous decades with those later ones that were previously released alongside many others. Cheers 😄🍺🍻
Hmmm funky list building time! As per ally rules, big ol' block of Iron Breakers to hold the center, a Stank or Helblaster Volley gun and a treb for arty and 2-4 Knight Lances on the wings with a bret Duke and a Damsel (or a frantic raving Warrior Priest who just happends to be there)
The explanation of what these armies of composed of is invaluable. This is a key difference between the online Warhammer and the board games if you will. You give a very entertaining and extremely insightful commentary on everything to do with Warhammer games. I've learned a lot from what you have said. Much of what is listed above corresponds to other versions of Warhammer as well, so no matter which version you play you can still learn a lot from it. As usual Dr. Blaxill, thank you very much! And, where's part six to your history series on the British political history??? I'm looking forward to it! Cheers from America!
Thanks Dr ! I don't like the mount stacking stats with the rider. I'm sure it will go the AOS way, big charterers and some units to go around because you must. The Lich on dragon is thus explained. Merry Christmas !
I'd wager the latter. The Shaggoth also didn't have AP, although he did have Armour Bane 2. I would say AP2 generic for large stuff would be about right, with extra bonusses in some instances.
We’re getting close to release date now. My last fear is armies pdf lists should be balanced like in V6 and not v7 for example. Also choosing allies should be limited to « weak choices » to avoid un-fluffy lists. But i have to say this is a great news, i already imagine a Cult of Slaanesh coming back on the tables 😎
I'm not against having a few female characters since they would be, by definition, exceptional but I think it would be a mistake to make it common amongst the rank and file. For humans in particular at least. The historical inspirations for much of the old world are too recognisable to be bent and beaten into a shape more palatable for modern sensibilities without undermining verisimilitude of the setting.
@@Wooteq44 It's not what I'd go for either, but the thing is you don't have to field anything you don't like. Most people would probably stick to a more traditional line-up anyway so why shouldn't those who want to do something different have the choice?
@@ClydeMillerWynant It's an interesting question: 'why should it matter?' and I can see that point of view. Ultimately, if the game is good then it's unlikely to be a deal breaker for me. I do think what is canon and what isn't does matter though. The character of the world they are creating is altered by their creative decisions and it has implications not just for the Old World as a new property but also for all the lore that has made up Warhammer Fantasy up until now. I know that I could just choose to ignore it but we all have preferences and I'd rather be fully immersed than having to pick and choose. My other concern is a bit more practical: I may be penalised if the contents of a box are not so flexible as to allow them to be built however one chooses. Sorry for the long reply. Merry Christmas.
I didn't mention their lack of allusion to special characters in there, but I'm sure they'll be in (got to have the Green Knight!). If they are, then you might get Bertrand the Brigand and the merry men back- who exceptionally cool additions from the lower orders!
I haven't yet played Warhammer yet but The Old World is my jam. I played Warmachine/Hordes when it was first released but with not many others to play against, I ended up selling my models. My two friends didn't want to play against me. I grew up addicted to Ogre Battle in my preteen years. Can't wait for this & I hope it outsells 40K so we don't stop getting models once it starts
I'd assumed we were waiting for a copy of 3rd Ed original Warhammer Armies to arrive from Ebay and that you would be brandishing it at us, disappointing not to see it. (Only joking, always glad to see your videos and whenever they arrive is more than good enough for me). Can see the problem for tournaments posed by allies and mercenaries. Kind of think it is nice for non-competitive games with people who aren't necessarily your friends though (I would argue you don't really need army lists beyond points values to play with friends). Enables some nice things, first and foremost of course the possibility of fielding beastmen and minotaurs in a Chaos Army which of course is exactly where they belong. The odd demon or three if people must as well I suppose. There are lots of good non-abusive things that could be done with it, some that I'd like to do myself (some pretty basic local humans who live under the protection of my Dwarfs or whatever, five of them could even have horses perhaps) though I agree it's probably not what it will end up leading to. Can't get excited about 'Dogs of War', same thing as named Characters really - people should just make up their own so I would prefer generic mercenaries and do your own 'fluff'. If you were to consult the original Warhammer Armies you would find Allies lists separate from the main faction ones (I realise you're probably aware of this). They largely insisted on you shelling out for a character (even if you only bought one unit it still had to have a Champion who was a level whatever hero and quite expensive), something that these days would equate to core and then maybe something a bit more special which was what you perhaps really wanted. Maybe this time round they'll have to obey something like the category splits for the faction armies themselves to end up a bit similar, don't know. The stubborn peasants worry me as they're supposed to be crap so it feels like any unit with shields should also be unreasonably hard to shift if they are. Don't like the Brettonian Duke's profile especially in conjunction with the Hippogriff (I do like the idea of Hippogriffs though). Seems too powerful especially as there's apparently no step up (sorry, been dabbling in non-egalitarian internet bumf). Thought part of the character of the human armies was that they lacked Chaos Lord type super-characters and made up for it in other ways though more than prepared to admit I might be wrong about this. Don't really get that excited about the profiles of those very powerful characters in the armies that already had them if I'm being honest and wonder what their new profiles might be especially when they get their army books released!
Not sure why Carrion ought to be slow. They've got very exposed ribs and if the little dude on top digs his knees in they'll surely get on with it. I might be a bit out of date of course...
I suppose a unit of monk models could count as battle pilgrims- that particular unit of pilgrims just happen to belong to a religious order: the brothers of (fill in the blank). 👍Monks make pilgrimages after all, and their stat line would be the same as pilgrims who aren’t monks, presumably… fun!
I suspect that the trade off for having a combined stat is you have to use the armour of the monster which is why it has heavy armour. Ps, I swear predictive text is anti ADHD 😒
What happens when you get pushed off the board, or into another unit. As a chaos player I like the grindy idea as it was very annoying to take no wounds in combat and still run away after killing your enemy. I kill 3 of your h=guys you kill 0 of mine but I flee because you have a lot of guys and a banner ......
Merry Christmas and Geheimnistag doctor! "Grind-hammer" names my fear. If peasants are capable of ignoring their first failed break test and downgrading FBIGO results to Give Ground then it's difficult to think of what units are supposed to be fragile!
I agree with you on that score. I don't think this aspect has been fully released in the discussion- we are serving up an unbreakable unit here! I fear slightly, as I said, that the moment units break will seem a bit arbitrary and due to a dice spike, rather than a decisive combat. Because scale of defeat does not impact likeliness to break (so far as we know, anyway)
@@DrBlaxill my postulation would be that most gameplans will be to simply kill more enemy models, not unlike in 8th when where typically Steadfast and Stubborn resulted in units needing to be massacred to a man. TOW might be just like that but with a higher variety of units (non-Stubborn units, even small ones, are now effectively Stubborn) and the battlelines wobbles forward and back but it's the rate of attrition that decides it.
@@DrBlaxillI’m hoping that if a unit has given ground (or whatever the mini flee one is) and are immediately charged again that they get a modified to their LD in subsequent rounds of combat making them more likely to flee as their nerve is shaken by repeated pounding. Or something along those lines
@@DrBlaxillI'm hoping flank or rear charges make the unit flee instead of falling back. I would almost assume there's exceptions to those rules, because in any case, where are you falling back to of the enemy is also behind you?
I think that the moral value of the general will play minor role in TOW - rallying cry doesn't really sound like the old 12inch bubble from older versions
If a unit falls back in good order they can get charged again, so while your knights won't instant break units they can keep getting their charge bonuses
AoS on release allowed anything. Think you might be allowed generic Death or chaos still, as at one point they did introduce some generic faction rules. They were bad tho and most of the factions seem to be at lot more restrictive now. If you want to be competitive.
Great review as usual! I must say that allowing more than single exceptional women to become knights destroys one of the core elements of Warhammer which is it’s believability and historicity. Elf female warriors are obviously totally fine as they are fantastical, but the whole point of humans in Warhammer is to tell stories about how humans would act in a fantastical world and large scale female warriors in the age of melee combat is just silly on it’s face and would never happen in a society without our modern egalitarian values and with the technological level of the humans in Warhammer. It might seem like a small change, but it strikes at one of the pillars of Warhammer, which is one of the biggest reason I find the setting great. It’s also totally pointless, pandering to women with a couple of female models won’t make them any more likely to be interested in wargaming, that's just the way it is. It's great we have some in the hobby and everyone is obviously welcome, but leave your baggage at the door and enjoy Warhammer as it is. Hopefully this isn't a trend with the Old World, if it is, I'll stick with the older editions.
I might make a video expanding my thoughts on this one day (although its a sensitive topic when wargames slightly trespass onto political questions). For me, I would not wish old Bretonnia (of all places) to discover some sort of 21st century feminism and have regular women knights because it clearly isn't inkeeping with their patriarchal conception of chivalry. On the other hand though, I *do* think stories of particularly exceptional women who had to meet and beat challenges of a patrirchal martial structure are interesting precisely because they are exceptional and bring those gender dynamics into focus. We have one already- Repanse de Lyonesse. The lady knight would in fact the tale I might even reach for first- precisely because her exceptionality and struggle in fact showcased the ideals of the society she found herself in. Maybe some knights of this era would respect her skill at arms, but there would also be a large lobby of traditionalists who didn't approve of it at all.
@@DrBlaxill Thank you for the thoughtful answer, I'm used to receiving just condemnation for the view I expressed. There's certainly room for exceptional female human knight / warrior characters and that's also inline with the historical & believeability aspect, having them be special characters like Repanse is the right way to do it. I use the term believeability instead of realism as realism isn't quite what I'm referring to. In my view it would be a mistake to include female models in the standard knight kits, that's making it too commonplace and it also destroys those narrative potentials you mentioned, which could be very compelling even for someone like me if done correctly. In fact, with the new armies of infamy system they could even add a rare mixed unit of knights to fit with this theme of being outcasts and out of the norm and building a narrative around it, I think that would be an elegant way of doing it that wouldn't alienate either side. Maybe even a unit with just female knights, although that would be pushing it for me personally at least if it wasn't reflected in the rules somehow and I'm sure they don't want to open that can of worms! I understand your hesitation about discussing this in a video, but I would encourage you to do it as I think you have the capability to discuss this topic in a balanced and fair manner and I think we need more voices like that on this topic in the hobby. I think you could do it without straying too far into the political by leaning into the narrative and historical aspects of it. Anyway, I very much appreciate your takes on Warhammer, thank you.
@@Ethnarches Exactly. I think the key point here is that the regularisation of incidental women knights in Bretonnia would not, in my view, be the right way to do this. Stories of exceptionality (and struggle) would be undermined by making it everyday and unnoteworthy. I recall the Lioness Rampant books by Tamora Pierce, and Alanna's story would hardly be interesting - or able to explore gender dynamics - if women knights were normal in her society. Gender is a key prism through which historical and fictional worlds can be brought alive, and simply deemphaising in a knightly society it would to my mind be a mistake. On the political point- yes, I agree. I'm a historian of politics - and part of judging the political past beyond the superficial (whig) observation that we would not agree with them in the 21st century requires deliberately talking about controversial topics in a balanced way which tries not to push any auxiliary agenda. That interests me a great deal. Social media in general doesn't encourage that approach, but TH-cam - my favourite medium -gives you a lot more space to entertain nuance.
I dont think youre giving enough thought to how combat will work. It will result in much less swinging battles while still allowing more powerful units to dominate weaker ones
If there are going to be obviously female knights (in Bretonnian lore female knights doing fake low voices under helmets had always been a thing), I'll have to make a lore-accurate unit of knights sentenced to quest until they die as that's the lore punishment for a Bretonnian woman taking up arms, and the only explanation for a female knight showing her face without a big, fake beard... 😋
Female Knights in close combat +1 for boobies😏.. But misogyny aside, this part of the rules are very exciting for us more narrative and fun gaming oldsters who'll be scratching out of old box's in the attic to build lists with their old lead hordes. Almost forgot, A Merry Christmas and joyous Yuletidings and all that.
Gandalf in the Old World.... "The Chaos doesn't smell so strong down here"....LoL There's a good reason we don't allow women to become Knights these days!!
Creating Armylists is the best. Its the one Stage of the Game where all your Troops sweep Victorious through the Enemies Formations (ya know, before Reality happens)
A can of tea, paper and pencil, music in the background, and nothing else to do than writing lists - bliss. :D
As young kids we spend more time list building and setting up the game than actually playing haha. These were usually 3v3 type games. It was fun mixing in different units from 3 different armies.
@@johnalevetsovitis1775as an adult with kids I probably still spend more time list building 😂
@Knoffles I hear ya haha I got 2 young boys.
Your channel really does deserve more subscribers. I really enjoy your content and eccentric humour. 😊
We're slowly marching onwards :-)
@@DrBlaxillLike Dwarfs of a dour demeanor....
I agree! He's awesome!
Slowly is better than not at all! As long as you're moving that's all that counts!!!
@6Stevo
Rumour has it that Orcs & Goblins are next for the Old World. Would love it if you were to cover any releases for them. Afterall, Orc is Ork.
Id love to see you and Bard do a review of the core rule book when it comes out!
It's great hearing your commentary on the Old World as information is being released. I look forward to your further coverage as we get closer to release (and post release of course!). Have a great Christmas and a very happy New Year.
I'm a fan of allies as it makes getting an army together a bit easier and allows you to paint up something a bit different.
Yeah, all of a sudden instead of collecting 2 armies I'm collecting 5-6 in various amounts.
They always allow Allies early in a game cycle to allow people to mix what they have and add what they like. Then when established, start making Allies more limited.
I think your take on allies and mercs is spot on. I am highly dubious that they should be allowed onto the majority of event tables however maybe an occasional tournament that allows them would be an interesting change up.
However I find your concern about “grindhammer” a bit suspect seeing as you play Brets and choas warriors. Two elite hard hitting factions. I’m looking forward to a game where lines clash for more than a turn. It’s time for the footslogger infantry to have a go! .. why yes I am an empire man :P
Keep up the great work! Look forward to your videos every time an article is posted
The Genevieve Trilogy is literally too good for Black Library, it's wild.
If you have not read Anno Dracula, I highly recommend you jump down that rabbit hole.
@@ellesse3862 I've read everything through to Johnny Alucard, and the rest is on my absurdly long 'to read' list. Great stuff. With or without the è, Geneviève Dieudonné is one of my all time favourite fictional heroines.
@@sydneycardew1923 Mine too. I've got Daikaiju sat staring at me, thats the only one I've yet to read.
I dont know if you like comics but Newman also wrote a mini series, Anno Dracula 1895 : Seven Days in Mayhem.
Maybe the "equipment" of the hippogryph has armor penetration. "Wicked claws", "serrated maw". Weapon armor penetration is not displayed on the unit profile after all, but on the weapon rules.
I used to take a unit of dark elf crossbowmen, a de repeating bolt thrower and Shadowblade as allies for my Chaos army. Caused all sorts of extra, unexpected chaos.
Age of sigmar doesnt allow big faction armies or mixture of order/ chaos anymore
It works as a simular construction to this.
Each faction has a list of allies and how it works is you can take anything from that faction provided it doesnt exceed your limitis (ie 2 artillery) but also they dont count for minimum requirements.
So in this case you could take a treeman in a bretonnian army but you still cant exceed the 25% limit on rare.
Another great one, thank you! I hope you have a merry Christmas, relaxed holidays and a good start into the new year - with lots of Warhammer on the horizon!
You too!
Completely agree with your take/desire for the inclusion of Bertrand and his men in the video and comments.
I think it's a perfect addition to connect Brettonia to more of the English and French story roots without it being Arthurian in nature. Just something to add to the commoners end of the lists. Who doesn't love the idea of bandits doing good and skirmishing through the woods taking the unwary by surprise (bonus points if you have Kevin Costner not even trying to attempt an accent while doing so in your head).
Well, it would be somebody OTHER than those Merry Men we already know - unless they are some kind of immortal appearance, sent by the Lady? I think the idea of such a warband is generic enough to allow for a "regiment of reknown" type of unit entry. If GW does not provide I am sure some fan will sooner rather than later.
Good doctor, as a fan of 3rd edition's complexities, the rules analysis is awesome but please do a painting tutorial! I go back to your chaos army on a regular basis for inspiration!!
I've never had more fun making army lists than in Warhammer fantasy. It trumps other tabletop games both from GW and other companies that I've played (And I've put my thumb in many a tabletop gaming pie). Especially when my old group would run campaigns in the Border Princes. There was something special about the state of the war influencing decisions (For example, having lost a major supply center in your territory meaning you paid a points tax on war machines. We played using those kinds of rules). Choosing to field a terrible monster to counter something nasty I knew my upcoming opponent would likely field, or plotting ways to effectively counter their heavier magic power, etc. Even when I would go out to my local battle bunker / FLGS with a catch-all list built with the intent of trying to be efficient and capable against anyone I might be set up against.
Similar to our valiant host, I question the survivability of the monk, which would make it senseless to take him and his three panel religious art. In reality, we would want to put valuable relics in the hands of really tough guys so that these items aren’t grabbed by an enemy.
Allied units may work like Horus heresy 30k - normal allies may be effectively part of your army, your characters can join units, buff allied units, etc and they can score, suspicious may be like 30k distrusted allies or worse 'by the emperors/warmasters command'. Distrusted count as enemy units that cannot be targeted by your core army but cannot benefit in any way from buffs, charcters cannot join them etc, by command units if within 6" of one of your units at the start of a turn roll a D6 and on a 1 will just stand, no charges and no shooting. I'd expect some version of this to be in the allies rules for The Old World.
Detachments for allies in 30k are set as - 1 HQ and 1 Troops choice as compulsory units, with the option to add on another 3 Troops, 2 Elite, 1 Fast Attack and 1 Heavy support choice
Thanks for another great video, Doctor. Merry Christmas and a happy new year to you too!
One good things about allies, is that we can use them to ‘patch in’ old unit entries that aren’t in the main list. For example; your old school Bret crossbow men could be represented by Empire crossbow men, Bret Outlaw skirmishers - how about using the rules for Empire Free Company?
Yes. I prefer generic mercenaries for that reason rather than storied dogs of war regiments
@@DrBlaxill do you think it’s possible we will have generic monsters in the mercenary slots as well, similar to the ‘monster’ allocation of 4th/5th Ed, or bound monsters from 8th Ed Monstrous Arcanum/Storm of Magic?
@@PRAISE_HASHUT one senses there would be a 'monster' allowance if they were going to do that, but it's possible. A monster is unlikely to be a mercenary in the literal sense of the word - paid to fight in the battle (unless it's a rather smart and materialistic one!)
@@DrBlaxill Well there is a rather significant subset of monsters that by tradition would fit the bill, at least if they didn't consider such an arrangement to be beneath them.
@@DrBlaxill Me to my giant spider swarm: “So guys, as you know budgets are tight right now, we’re really grateful for you being here but we can’t afford to pay you atm, not in money at least, but this will look really really good on your CV. It’s great exposure. Ask the Jabberwocky, he’s not getting paid either but it’s opened so many doors for him’’.
Great stuff! All the best for christmas!
If it means anything, Squires were introduced in Total War Warhammer aswell, were they represent elite peasant infantry, basically dismounted Yeomen, and carry great weapons.
On the whole this seems really positive, the allies and mercenary rules are easy to exclude for competitive play if you want to.
I'm loving these videos Dr. Blaxill. I don't know if I'll get to play much of this game when it comes out. I live in Nowhere Montana,, so not much for a Warhammer scene.. not to mention I generally dislike most people. I'm a horrible grump. However, I am working on remodeling one of my spare bedrooms into a Warhammer game room. I will have my little slice of British heaven, with a custom display cabinet, and to top it off, an 8 x 5 gaming table.
Merry Christmas,, and bah humbug!
Allies and Mercenary options is potentially interesting to my inner fluffy gamer, I'm looking forward to discovering who these might be in greater detail and what miniatures will become available as a direct result. Tiny crumbs here and there have me excited and curious, eager to tuck into the new rulebook in the new year. Glad for another entertaining transmission from the punkerbunker. Ceefax .. that made me laugh.
I'm all for new old world novels, Ulrika from Kislev was a character I enjoyed reading about but nothing was ever quite as good as the Vampire Genevieve stories. As a sidenote, have you read any of Kim Newman's Anno Dracula novels? Best wishes to you and Chantel.
Oh yeah, and Merry Christmas! 🎄
Warhammer with attitude from the Punker Bunker, coming over TH-cam and short-wave radio. You make my Saturday morning, Doc. (My family in the background: are you listening to that English dude talk Warhammer AGAIN?)
Yes! Make them listen! Saturday morning special (not quite as good as my Saturday night special, but we won't mention that ;-))
Who did a video on the leaked book, I missed that.
I hope they will explain whether the units you bring with allies shall also respect the other restrictions. For instance in a 2000 points game, if you already have 300 points as rare units, you cannot bring more than 200 points of rare units from your allies.
16:02 the Bretonnian Duke sounds like a bit of a Hazard. Some good Ol’ Boys they are.
WELL WELL...we find ourselves in the bunker once again with our fearless leader...
I think that the simulation of breaking unit with a charge will still hold in soem regards. Imagine you charge a unit, kill many enemys and they can't attack back. Now they will more likely fall back in good order, and therefore recibe a nee charge from the kinght at this point the unit is decimated and reciving a new charge and now they will no longer be unbreakable so they will be mos likely destroyed or flee for good.
We will see.
Right, good suggestion. That a Falling back unit will not be able to fall back again- if it fails its modified leadership test next time it simply breaks. That would be intriguing.
I am also curious to see if the Brettonian lance formation might negate the bonus of a shield wall (wouldn't that be interesting! ).
Has anything been released for the Dwarves yet?
Thanks for going over this. I have decidedly moved on since the dissolution of Fantasy Battle and I am very much into 40k now. However, I have still been curious about the new old game, so I appreciate it.
8th edition vampires, you say? Those were not really "strong" or "durable". Well in a way they were, but the whole army used to crumble if they went down, and they always did. When i used them and when I played against them, always. At least I do not recall a time that did not happen. There were so many things that targeted characters and assassinated them that having an army that just loses when the general is gone forced you to keep that general as safe as possible, which means not really using it to great effect.
Hey Punk!
What happened to your impending battle report?
Can you also enlighten us with which TH-camr has the unreleased rule book.
It's a slow burner but I've part completed it. Hope to finish it in new Year.
Hmmm.....the channel in question has a rather similar name to the most popular song by the band Ghost...
I am surprised they are still using the shield-polearm combination. I don't know of a historical example of this combination, probably due to physics. Trying to move a heavy bladed weapon one handed simply does not work.
About time already! Loved it. Thanks Dr. 😉
Great synopsis mate. Having had the Bretonnians from the start I look forward to using my well OOP miniatures from previous decades with those later ones that were previously released alongside many others. Cheers 😄🍺🍻
Can't wait for the old world
Subed and I'll check out your other content. Ty
Hmmm funky list building time!
As per ally rules, big ol' block of Iron Breakers to hold the center, a Stank or Helblaster Volley gun and a treb for arty and 2-4 Knight Lances on the wings with a bret Duke and a Damsel (or a frantic raving Warrior Priest who just happends to be there)
Scratch them Ironbreakers! We take Phoenix Guard, the most bonkers infantry!
Best Warhammer content on this platform. Nobility with honor. For Zhe lady
Another awesome video. Keep up the good work
The explanation of what these armies of composed of is invaluable. This is a key difference between the online Warhammer and the board games if you will. You give a very entertaining and extremely insightful commentary on everything to do with Warhammer games. I've learned a lot from what you have said. Much of what is listed above corresponds to other versions of Warhammer as well, so no matter which version you play you can still learn a lot from it. As usual Dr. Blaxill, thank you very much! And, where's part six to your history series on the British political history??? I'm looking forward to it! Cheers from America!
I love creating army lists. Trying to make fun themed lists based on lore specific details of the old world is the best!
Im not worried if its crap I have at least 5 excellent editions to pick from
Tournaments always had to have house rules for WFB like you said. I don't think that's an issue.
Thanks Dr ! I don't like the mount stacking stats with the rider. I'm sure it will go the AOS way, big charterers and some units to go around because you must. The Lich on dragon is thus explained. Merry Christmas !
Maybe the mount takes on the AP of the rider? Or maybe Large Targets get a standard AP value…?
I'd wager the latter. The Shaggoth also didn't have AP, although he did have Armour Bane 2. I would say AP2 generic for large stuff would be about right, with extra bonusses in some instances.
We’re getting close to release date now. My last fear is armies pdf lists should be balanced like in V6 and not v7 for example.
Also choosing allies should be limited to « weak choices » to avoid un-fluffy lists. But i have to say this is a great news, i already imagine a Cult of Slaanesh coming back on the tables 😎
Broadcasting on shortwave from the Punker Bunker would be amazing!
Another cracking video!
I'm going to mainly collect Bretonnia, Tomb Kings, Warriors of Chaos & Beastmen. Glad to see this is the thing. I've been gone for a long time
Hopefully armies can be built online along the lines of Easy Army.
I'm not against having a few female characters since they would be, by definition, exceptional but I think it would be a mistake to make it common amongst the rank and file. For humans in particular at least.
The historical inspirations for much of the old world are too recognisable to be bent and beaten into a shape more palatable for modern sensibilities without undermining verisimilitude of the setting.
Games Wokeshop don't care about your historical inspirations, they only care about "the message".
@@Solitary_Scribe55 depressing!
@@Solitary_Scribe55 it does seem that way.
@@Wooteq44 It's not what I'd go for either, but the thing is you don't have to field anything you don't like. Most people would probably stick to a more traditional line-up anyway so why shouldn't those who want to do something different have the choice?
@@ClydeMillerWynant It's an interesting question: 'why should it matter?' and I can see that point of view. Ultimately, if the game is good then it's unlikely to be a deal breaker for me. I do think what is canon and what isn't does matter though. The character of the world they are creating is altered by their creative decisions and it has implications not just for the Old World as a new property but also for all the lore that has made up Warhammer Fantasy up until now. I know that I could just choose to ignore it but we all have preferences and I'd rather be fully immersed than having to pick and choose.
My other concern is a bit more practical: I may be penalised if the contents of a box are not so flexible as to allow them to be built however one chooses.
Sorry for the long reply. Merry Christmas.
Can't wait to find out what a Serjeant-at-Arms can do, I'll certainly be bringing plenty for my Peasant Army (regardless of how good they are)!
I didn't mention their lack of allusion to special characters in there, but I'm sure they'll be in (got to have the Green Knight!). If they are, then you might get Bertrand the Brigand and the merry men back- who exceptionally cool additions from the lower orders!
I haven't yet played Warhammer yet but The Old World is my jam. I played Warmachine/Hordes when it was first released but with not many others to play against, I ended up selling my models. My two friends didn't want to play against me. I grew up addicted to Ogre Battle in my preteen years. Can't wait for this & I hope it outsells 40K so we don't stop getting models once it starts
Awesome! I hope you get loads of games in.
….And I hope we get a new Ogre Battle game too!
Dr Blaxill, roaming the streets of mega-city one. Tracking down the legendary, Punk the Ripper...
Yes- I know M-C one well. Never been busted there- never want to be.
I'd assumed we were waiting for a copy of 3rd Ed original Warhammer Armies to arrive from Ebay and that you would be brandishing it at us, disappointing not to see it. (Only joking, always glad to see your videos and whenever they arrive is more than good enough for me).
Can see the problem for tournaments posed by allies and mercenaries. Kind of think it is nice for non-competitive games with people who aren't necessarily your friends though (I would argue you don't really need army lists beyond points values to play with friends). Enables some nice things, first and foremost of course the possibility of fielding beastmen and minotaurs in a Chaos Army which of course is exactly where they belong. The odd demon or three if people must as well I suppose. There are lots of good non-abusive things that could be done with it, some that I'd like to do myself (some pretty basic local humans who live under the protection of my Dwarfs or whatever, five of them could even have horses perhaps) though I agree it's probably not what it will end up leading to.
Can't get excited about 'Dogs of War', same thing as named Characters really - people should just make up their own so I would prefer generic mercenaries and do your own 'fluff'.
If you were to consult the original Warhammer Armies you would find Allies lists separate from the main faction ones (I realise you're probably aware of this). They largely insisted on you shelling out for a character (even if you only bought one unit it still had to have a Champion who was a level whatever hero and quite expensive), something that these days would equate to core and then maybe something a bit more special which was what you perhaps really wanted. Maybe this time round they'll have to obey something like the category splits for the faction armies themselves to end up a bit similar, don't know.
The stubborn peasants worry me as they're supposed to be crap so it feels like any unit with shields should also be unreasonably hard to shift if they are.
Don't like the Brettonian Duke's profile especially in conjunction with the Hippogriff (I do like the idea of Hippogriffs though). Seems too powerful especially as there's apparently no step up (sorry, been dabbling in non-egalitarian internet bumf). Thought part of the character of the human armies was that they lacked Chaos Lord type super-characters and made up for it in other ways though more than prepared to admit I might be wrong about this. Don't really get that excited about the profiles of those very powerful characters in the armies that already had them if I'm being honest and wonder what their new profiles might be especially when they get their army books released!
This is my favorite place to get upcoming fantasy information. Keep up the good entertainment
Not sure why Carrion ought to be slow. They've got very exposed ribs and if the little dude on top digs his knees in they'll surely get on with it. I might be a bit out of date of course...
Beast in Velvet is my favorite Warhammer book
The Army list looks very promising. I like the "official" sanction of Allies.
I suppose a unit of monk models could count as battle pilgrims- that particular unit of pilgrims just happen to belong to a religious order: the brothers of (fill in the blank). 👍Monks make pilgrimages after all, and their stat line would be the same as pilgrims who aren’t monks, presumably… fun!
Squires may be following the TWW unit which was a more elite peasant with 2h weapons
I suspect that the trade off for having a combined stat is you have to use the armour of the monster which is why it has heavy armour. Ps, I swear predictive text is anti ADHD 😒
What happens when you get pushed off the board, or into another unit. As a chaos player I like the grindy idea as it was very annoying to take no wounds in combat and still run away after killing your enemy. I kill 3 of your h=guys you kill 0 of mine but I flee because you have a lot of guys and a banner ......
Merry Christmas and Geheimnistag doctor!
"Grind-hammer" names my fear. If peasants are capable of ignoring their first failed break test and downgrading FBIGO results to Give Ground then it's difficult to think of what units are supposed to be fragile!
I agree with you on that score. I don't think this aspect has been fully released in the discussion- we are serving up an unbreakable unit here!
I fear slightly, as I said, that the moment units break will seem a bit arbitrary and due to a dice spike, rather than a decisive combat. Because scale of defeat does not impact likeliness to break (so far as we know, anyway)
@@DrBlaxill my postulation would be that most gameplans will be to simply kill more enemy models, not unlike in 8th when where typically Steadfast and Stubborn resulted in units needing to be massacred to a man. TOW might be just like that but with a higher variety of units (non-Stubborn units, even small ones, are now effectively Stubborn) and the battlelines wobbles forward and back but it's the rate of attrition that decides it.
@@DrBlaxillI’m hoping that if a unit has given ground (or whatever the mini flee one is) and are immediately charged again that they get a modified to their LD in subsequent rounds of combat making them more likely to flee as their nerve is shaken by repeated pounding. Or something along those lines
@@Knoffles Exactly- some sort of penalty for being hit a second time. Complex, but potentially really rich and an antidote to grindhammer.
@@DrBlaxillI'm hoping flank or rear charges make the unit flee instead of falling back. I would almost assume there's exceptions to those rules, because in any case, where are you falling back to of the enemy is also behind you?
I think that the moral value of the general will play minor role in TOW - rallying cry doesn't really sound like the old 12inch bubble from older versions
If a unit falls back in good order they can get charged again, so while your knights won't instant break units they can keep getting their charge bonuses
Dr Luke Blaxhill:
PhD in 1980's look.
AoS on release allowed anything. Think you might be allowed generic Death or chaos still, as at one point they did introduce some generic faction rules. They were bad tho and most of the factions seem to be at lot more restrictive now. If you want to be competitive.
Pa-la-din or the much preferred punk pronunciation: pa-laddin?
Ceefax channel now 🎉
Great review as usual! I must say that allowing more than single exceptional women to become knights destroys one of the core elements of Warhammer which is it’s believability and historicity. Elf female warriors are obviously totally fine as they are fantastical, but the whole point of humans in Warhammer is to tell stories about how humans would act in a fantastical world and large scale female warriors in the age of melee combat is just silly on it’s face and would never happen in a society without our modern egalitarian values and with the technological level of the humans in Warhammer.
It might seem like a small change, but it strikes at one of the pillars of Warhammer, which is one of the biggest reason I find the setting great. It’s also totally pointless, pandering to women with a couple of female models won’t make them any more likely to be interested in wargaming, that's just the way it is. It's great we have some in the hobby and everyone is obviously welcome, but leave your baggage at the door and enjoy Warhammer as it is. Hopefully this isn't a trend with the Old World, if it is, I'll stick with the older editions.
I might make a video expanding my thoughts on this one day (although its a sensitive topic when wargames slightly trespass onto political questions). For me, I would not wish old Bretonnia (of all places) to discover some sort of 21st century feminism and have regular women knights because it clearly isn't inkeeping with their patriarchal conception of chivalry. On the other hand though, I *do* think stories of particularly exceptional women who had to meet and beat challenges of a patrirchal martial structure are interesting precisely because they are exceptional and bring those gender dynamics into focus. We have one already- Repanse de Lyonesse. The lady knight would in fact the tale I might even reach for first- precisely because her exceptionality and struggle in fact showcased the ideals of the society she found herself in. Maybe some knights of this era would respect her skill at arms, but there would also be a large lobby of traditionalists who didn't approve of it at all.
@@DrBlaxill Thank you for the thoughtful answer, I'm used to receiving just condemnation for the view I expressed. There's certainly room for exceptional female human knight / warrior characters and that's also inline with the historical & believeability aspect, having them be special characters like Repanse is the right way to do it. I use the term believeability instead of realism as realism isn't quite what I'm referring to. In my view it would be a mistake to include female models in the standard knight kits, that's making it too commonplace and it also destroys those narrative potentials you mentioned, which could be very compelling even for someone like me if done correctly. In fact, with the new armies of infamy system they could even add a rare mixed unit of knights to fit with this theme of being outcasts and out of the norm and building a narrative around it, I think that would be an elegant way of doing it that wouldn't alienate either side. Maybe even a unit with just female knights, although that would be pushing it for me personally at least if it wasn't reflected in the rules somehow and I'm sure they don't want to open that can of worms!
I understand your hesitation about discussing this in a video, but I would encourage you to do it as I think you have the capability to discuss this topic in a balanced and fair manner and I think we need more voices like that on this topic in the hobby. I think you could do it without straying too far into the political by leaning into the narrative and historical aspects of it.
Anyway, I very much appreciate your takes on Warhammer, thank you.
@@Ethnarches Exactly. I think the key point here is that the regularisation of incidental women knights in Bretonnia would not, in my view, be the right way to do this. Stories of exceptionality (and struggle) would be undermined by making it everyday and unnoteworthy. I recall the Lioness Rampant books by Tamora Pierce, and Alanna's story would hardly be interesting - or able to explore gender dynamics - if women knights were normal in her society. Gender is a key prism through which historical and fictional worlds can be brought alive, and simply deemphaising in a knightly society it would to my mind be a mistake.
On the political point- yes, I agree. I'm a historian of politics - and part of judging the political past beyond the superficial (whig) observation that we would not agree with them in the 21st century requires deliberately talking about controversial topics in a balanced way which tries not to push any auxiliary agenda. That interests me a great deal. Social media in general doesn't encourage that approach, but TH-cam - my favourite medium -gives you a lot more space to entertain nuance.
I dont think youre giving enough thought to how combat will work.
It will result in much less swinging battles while still allowing more powerful units to dominate weaker ones
Pa-lad-in?
Maybe your army will lose all of its innate special rules if you choose to take allies…🤔
If there are going to be obviously female knights (in Bretonnian lore female knights doing fake low voices under helmets had always been a thing), I'll have to make a lore-accurate unit of knights sentenced to quest until they die as that's the lore punishment for a Bretonnian woman taking up arms, and the only explanation for a female knight showing her face without a big, fake beard... 😋
Punka-Bunker 😂😂
Female Knights in close combat +1 for boobies😏.. But misogyny aside, this part of the rules are very exciting for us more narrative and fun gaming oldsters who'll be scratching out of old box's in the attic to build lists with their old lead hordes. Almost forgot,
A Merry Christmas and joyous Yuletidings and all that.
I finally lost interest in this new game when magic was announced but not for your on point vid analysis. Keep them coming!
Gandalf in the Old World....
"The Chaos doesn't smell so strong down here"....LoL
There's a good reason we don't allow women to become Knights these days!!