Neural DSP MESA Boogie 2C - They Did it Again [Literally]
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Good ol' Neural. Cast your mind way back to December 2021 when they released the Petrucci Archetype. Now over a year later, we have a reissue of those tones in the form of the Mesa Boogie 2C plugin (Petrucci's Mesa signature is based on the 2C circuit). Anyway. It does have some of the missing features like the Push/Pull pots, and a reverb on the back....
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I *think* if this had come out before the Petrucci plugin, this would have been the one to buy? Mark tones but with more tweakability than you get in the Petrucci?
Also - this is probably one of the most difficult Amps to dial in in real life, and I guess therefore you'd expect to have to spend some time with the Plugin too, not quite as plug and play as some of the more typical Neural stuff in my experience?
But once you dial it in...oh my god
for reaalll, I feel betrayed!!
Same here and probably would have been cheaper too. I don't have buyers remorse but, I don't use a lot of the settings on the Petrucci version.
I feel like this could still be a good plugin if you didn't already buy the Petrucci archetype. I might have chosen it over Petrucci, even. Being an owner of the Petrucci plugin, however, there's way too much sonic overlap for it to really be worthwhile owning both.
Absolutely love what happens between 1:00 & 1:23...that's the art of groovy, tasty looping! Well done, one more time!!👏👏
Yas man that really stands out!
Love your honesty and the gear grinding
This Mesa is BY FAR the best thing I’ve ever heard in my life. There’s not even any comparison between it any any previous modeller is there?! Have I downloaded a different plug-in to everyone else? There is no way this sound is coming out of my computer. It makes s Pettrucci sound like a pointless wall of echoey mud.
These mid 80's Mesa's were some of the Earliest Boutique style amps, Great sounds, someone else did the mesa mkIIc today. For one of the modeller pedals. Hoping these will find there way to the Tonex. That is one BAD ASS tube amp. Anyone who bought one of those prob. still has it.
I completely agree but at the same time... Real amps and pedals overlap a lot too so is kinda realistic in that sense. People can own 5 tubescreamers and swear they all sound different
Got the Amplitude version after trying both. Can't quite get the great tones you got here. But I'm looking for a video that'll give me a starting point Thanks mate.
I have several Neural plugins - Nolly, Rabea, SLO, Petrucci, Corey Wong - and Nolly and Rabea are my favorites. I just downloaded the trial of the Mesa Boogie 2C and already it's in the running for my new favorite. I haven't even scratched the surface, I've only checked out the presets. Rabea's presets are absolutely amazing and I would be happy using some of them with minimal tweaking. I haven't even tried created my own sounds yet, which is usually the first thing I do with these plugins. I'm definitely going to be buying it. The clarity of pick attack is very unique and far better than the other plugins I've tried. Not sure if that's something inherent in the Mesa that they've captured or it their emulations are just getting more accurate in general.
Dude, you make everything sound great!. I is a pleasure to hear you playing. I think I will buy a MB California Tweed because of you lol. I have the Petrucci plugin, I feel this new one is more versatil but i am wondering if is worth to buy it. I also have plini and SLO plugins... ohhh, if they make a dumble plug in.... I'll buy it immediately.
Your lead playing is so good! You should throw in some whammy bar flutters!
Man I wish they'd put the transpose function into the older plugins. I'd love to have it in parallaxe and tim henson in particular. I use the tim for all my stratty single coil tones, and being able to digitally drop tune at least for practicing would be amazing.
And Plini?
@@johnnathancordy Absolutely all of them. I just mentioned those 2 because they are two of my go to plugins for particular uses.
Yeh, I was messing with Cory Wong yday and Plini, strange they haven't got round to Plini yet?
Same boat here. Until they start treating their OG customers right I'm done. Otto IIII for me going forward
Those Otto cats asked me to do a demo a while back actually
I think it's a great plugin. I onw a real mark v, that I love, and I'm very excited to try this. Probably will make my workflow easier. Do you think UA is gonna launch anything like this in pedal format? It would be amazing as well!
Thanx John, I’m not sure what to think of Neural DSP. Lots of choices for sure, but I’m sticking with S-Gear for now. I spend too much time tweaking with too much stuff. Have a Good day.
The S-Gear stuff is lovely, I think lacking in effects and so on but some nice gaps filled vs the Neural DSP stuff. I wouldn't say this Plugin would be the one if you wanted to avoid tweaking?
I’m convinced the Marshall in S-Gear is better than anything else. AI or no AI.
If only they put as much effort into updating Quad Cortex as they put into pushing new plugins into the market :/
Well....Not sure that's gonna happen at this point it seems like Plugins are the cash cow?
@@johnnathancordy Yeah it seems that way. It would require some actual backbone, vision and respect for the customers to keep QC a priority when they're getting a lot of flak for their snail speed progress. They just don't seem to take it very seriously, but that's just my admittably negative impression :) Last update was nice, but now we have to wait for another year or whatever, and it's still not even at a level it was supposed to be at launch or "soon after" lol
@@johnnathancordy Can you put these on the QC?
Yeah, so the plugins get the IIc+ before the QC does... and it was supposed to be a launch day amp. Anyone want to trade their FM9 for my QC? :P
Well, for the most part they only needed to design new graphics for this one ;) Most of the software is the same.
Great you made the math of how much it costs to have all the current Neural DSP plugins which is ridiculous as they're more or less redundant between themselves as you also prove with the Petrucci plugin and this one, Neural DSP is starting to be greedy on this aspect, instead of producing a plugin with a combination of the best features of their other plugins they keep releasing signature models that offer no much difference, they're like Nembrini who releases the same plugin with minor tone tweaks and different names! I think Neural DSP should concentrate now on merging their QC with their plugins, they're fragmenting their own market!
Exactly! this! 👆🏻👆🏻
I think supporters might suggest that the actual 2C is quite different to the Petrucci JP2C but that's not what Mesa say lol.
Still, if you didn't already have Petrucci, this one does offer a potentially HUGE pallet of tones if you're willing to put in the time?
@@johnnathancordy Yes but I'll pass, it totally looks like another cash grabber, I already have enough tones to explore on PC with my Helix Native and ToneX plus other plugins, I wish though they could port one "best of" Neural DSP plugin to iOS as I also use the iPad for super portable gigs, on iOS there are not many options but newer iPads with M1 or M2 chips could run these plugins, IK Multimedia is already on iOS with ToneX and Overloud THU sound amazing too on iOS
@@johnnathancordy well, here's the truth: the JP2C is a real recreation of the IIC+. BUT, which one? It's an HRG, the 60/100, no simulclass, that's JP's favorite and the one the JP2C is based on. That's why people who compare the JP2C with a DRG simul feel they're different, it's because they ARE different IIC+, Both C+s, both legends. The N.DSP suite is based on the DRG. There u go ;)
They need to reléase the desktop editor for QC.... Someting like the arquetypes... And they destroy the market instead!!!
I haven't bought any plugins yet, but definitely looking at this over the Petrucci version for the price, but one big question - I have a EBMM JP6 equipped with piezo, can you still get those killer acoustic tones that the Petrucci plugin acoustic amp is known for?
Is this amp available on quad cortex? Thanks for your stuff
I didn't like the Petrucci at all but hearing you play this sim, it sounds amazing! Every preset or tweak sounded awesome.
this one sounds better than the archetype petrucci by far
its sounds authentic and very addictive when start playing
play with this plugin and you ll understand
You right. Even the ML sound fluff2c sound better then the Archetype Petrucci.
@@mesfigas I didnt download the demo yet but I definitely will…
@@mesfigas I totally disagree. I think they sound pretty much the same
@@user-of9ut1hd9q I have both, doing a side by side comparison even with the same IR and trying to dial them as close as possible they sound fairly different. Petrucci is a lot more modern sounding, ii c+ sounds a lot more vintagey and warm. The dynamic response is completely different too, for edge of breakup and low/mid gain tones, while you can do that with Petrucci, it's a lot easier and more dynamic in the mesa plugin. That's of course only talking about the amp. And if you put it in Class-A mode, then you can't even get close to that sound with Petrucci, it's a completely different character.
Hard to pass at that price which offers a ton of tones for the money. The accuracy of the model seems to be pretty good IMO, this seems like another home run!
I've never liked the gained tones of the Mark series (besides MoP), but those crunch and cleans are good. Don't know if it's work getting for mostly that, but I imagine they'll probably do the 50% sale during Easter.
There's a MOP preset called Metal Up Your Ass!
@@adam2178 I'd imagine it'd do the tone well though they did use a Marshall power section, and you could probably find IR's online elsewhere for it. Still only one tone though
Hey, I am ignorant on this, but would it be physically possible to run this software thru tone x and make a capture?
Yes I heard you can use tonex to copy any plugin (without the time based effects of course).
PHAT!!!
It certainly is on the thicker side of thick!
@@johnnathancordy thickety thick
You're my biggest inspiration for guitar besides my instructor! I was wondering if I join your 6 dollar Patreon if it would be possible to get tabs for one of your songs? I wanted to cover one. 😊🤟🤜🤛🎶🔥🎵🎸🎸🎸
what people forget with amp sims 80 percent of the tone is in the impulse response and the issue is if you dont have help with its a huge rabbit hole unless you get those new own hammer packs which make it simple
and/or +Bogren, Torpedo (BHG) et al....there is absolutely no shortage of IRs out there.
You can say the same thing about the actual speaker cab and it being 80% of the tone as well.
I got their Gojira plug-in at Black Friday prices and I think it’s great.
I’ve trialed a number of their other plugins and either didn’t feel them enough or they weren’t different enough to stuff I already have.
I probably wouldn’t buy any of them at full price as I think they are a bit expensive for what they are.
Even though it’s more expensive, I think Helix Native is much better value for money.
Completely agree. I downloaded Neural dsp Cory Wong and I thought, man it sounds sooo good compared to my Native plugin… until I dialed the same tone with the same quality / characteristics in Native. Native is a beast than can achieve much more than the whole Neural plugin collection.
I think the Neural stuff has more instant results than Helix native (obviously I'm a huge Line 6 fanboy, but I think it can take quite a bit of learning)
@@johnnathancordy I definitely agree with that. I think that’s why I like the Gojira one so much. I can immediately get tones I love to play with without messing around with settings at all.
@@johnnathancordy oh yes for sure. You really have to work for your tones in Helix. It’s a bit annoying that they’re presets are not as good as the Neural plugins. But I still prefer Native for the incredible effects and snapshots. What I do is I download the Neural plugins and copy the tones I need.
Man, that sounds so liquid. Gotta show us the settings!
I want all the amp sims 😂
Get saving Sir Darrel!
If you already have Amplitube 5, you can get the same tones with Amplitube Mesa Boogie Mk3.
What about the ML Sound Lab Mark 5 plugin they have for a while now? It has the V, IV and 2C+ modes plus all the other ones.
Petrucci is known for the 2C, I'm sure many players in bought that plugin for the 2C tones. I dunno that I'd call it a cash grab but it definitely feels like just, similar territory yet-again.
I think this one probably ends up being the most versatile plugin they've brought out, but I think it also is WAY more difficult to dial in than any of their other stuff?
@@johnnathancordy that's my experience with the mark series as well. The bass/mid/treble knobs feeling more of a before-amp boost and the graphic EQ being what it is just feels unintuitive at times.
I was ready to buy it, then you told me not to!!!!
Hahaha jk
I have Tone King and the Rabea, I wish they would do a Matchless plugin, which would you buy if you weren’t a TH-camr getting free copies?
Petrucci?
Mark II suite?
Neither?
Fun fact - I don't get free copies...
The Petrucci is much easier to dial in, but much less versatile? But has nice effects section? Not sure really...
Agreed a Matchless plugin would probably be lovely - hold out for that instead maybe lol
@@johnnathancordy what???? That’s kinda sucky you advertise for them and don’t get free plugin?
I’ll do the free trial, but yea I don’t wanna spend too much in a redundant plugin, but tell Neural DSP we want a Matchless…… give us what we want…. Matchless… Matchless…. 🤘🏼🫣😎🤪😜
I would buy a Matchless on release day. The Tone King is fantastic.
They definitely need to do a Matchless. Really, a bunch of those 90/early 00's boutique amps. + Dumble, 65 amps, etc.
It is astounding to me how the vast majority of what John does is Reviews not demos of stuff he BUYS, (used, after the hype of release day passes, or new if need be) or in the case of guitars or pedals that he doesn't buy and sell on or keep, borrows from friends he knows locally etc. I think it is the reason why it is so much easier to leave all the reality and frankly snarky hilarity in the video about the product where warranted.
In my memory of the past few years, it is explicitly stated when something was sent to him by a manufacturer.
do you still own any mesa amps these days?
Would love to see an ADA MP-1 plug in. Never gonna happen I know.
Entire 80s/90s rack collection with a rack as part of the GUI. MP-1, JMP-1, Triaxis, PSA 1, XPRa, etc. Plus all the classic FX units. That would be exciting to see.
Check out Nembrini audio. They released one recently.
@@JamesJLaRue that'd be awesome!
@@Badlander1994 I know, gotta try it!
I bought a Mark 2 C+ from the factory ages ago. Koa cabinet, 5 band EQ, EV speaker, and wicker grill. The worst amp ever. The controls were frustrating to use ... you'd find something you liked and then if something moved or you changed guitars, it sounded like crap. The pre-amp dirt was essentially a bees nest. It would start to sound good once the power tubes were working but at that point, it was deafening loud. Terrible reverb too. I have no idea why these amps became famous. The best day was when I got rid of it and bought a vintage 1965 Deluxe Reverb. That BFDR is worthy of the term "legendary".
Hey Lance! I have a Mark 3 - which was supposed to solve some of these Mark issues - it's still really kinda not an easy amp to get working and yes the Reverb is not exactly legendary lol
@@johnnathancordy Oh...and I forgot that you'd need to see a chiropractor after lifting it!
Couldn’t disagree with you more, but maybe I got a gem of a IIC+
I had a similar issue with a Road King II. I could pull some great tones out of it at home - but couldn't gig it. When I tried to tailor it to the new room, It became a never-ending tweak-fest. Not to mention that a re-tube on an RKII was crazy expensive.
I don''t use plug-ins but it seems like Neural still only catering for one type of player (dare I say fanboy?). No arguing that it sound good but not different enough to any of their other plug-ins to splash the cash - unless you love the Mark IIC sound but hate Dream Theater I guess 🤷♂
I do think this one is probably quite a bit more versatile than many of the others? But yeh. Still seems like a significant overlap? I guess that was to be expected at this point
$99 for a single amp capture is beyond ridiculous , sorry
indeed
😑
Sounds like you overdid the audio level for the intro dude.
No it's just PHAT
@@damonstewart70 I like it, but turn it down low, deffo distorted.
Neil I think it's the effect that the 5 way Slider V is having, ends up making things quite fuzzy with the humbuckers? Typically I think that's why folks keep the Bass pretty low on these amps in real life?
It sounded bad to me too. Not necessarily it the middle of notes - but during transitions, so somewhere in the attack and decay portions... Especially the decay.
@@neildeakin4454 rock n roll is not perfect. His tone sounds huge
Neural is souring me with every new plugin they produce and continue to forget we need a desktop editor for the damned QC. I can no longer be excited for their plugins (even if I do own 6 others).
FM9 lol
This sounds horrible. Is it just clipping? I thought it sounded bad on my TV so I just listened to it through my monitors and it's even worse.
It's not clipping...BASICALLY - much like a real Mark series amp, it's kinda not super quick and simple to dial in - I think there's probably much more chance of ending up with weird tones with this plugin than almost any of their others?
It sounds very sharp, not really something you hear in albums
there's no denying the quality of the plugins themselves, but neural as a company are just infuriating. no master suite to mix different plugins, the same recycled stuff every time with one or two new components sprinkled in sold as a whole new 130 bucks package, their complete half-assing of the quad cortex that is still so far behind its promised launch spec... i'm not buying anything from them. when you consider how much you'd have to spend on their plugins to do even half of what helix native can do, it's just doesn't make any sense. you're paying for the same OD, the same reverbs, the same delays, and even the same amps over and over again, and you can't even mix and match effects and amps between their plugins.
Yeah, it makes me even happier that I purchased an HX Stomp instead!
This was just a good reminder to never pay full price for a half finished product with promises for updates and completion.
@@shawns9316 Well said. 👍
@@shawns9316 Sold my QC for this reason. What it did - it did well ...but I moved on.